Usually when a party descends into hackish dirty tricks they make a minimal effort to hide their responsibility. Trials and investigative reporting eventually bring out the truth, but by then who cares? The vote is done.
Surprising maybe one person who never leaves RedState, the GOP has kicked off a massive campaign of automated calls meant to deceive voters into thinking that they come from the Democratic candidate. Everybody hates robocalls and the calls come in repeatedly during dinner or early hours in the morning and they often take several minutes to get the the part where you find out that the thing was paid for by the RNC. Voters who get these decide, understandably to stay home. Josh Marshall has the full story.
The GOP doesn’t care if you know. They don’t care that local GOP candidates think the tactic is disgusting. The calls are going out everywhere (NH, PA, KS, CT, NY, IL, more from the AP)and it violates significant campaign laws, which means that the FEC will eventually level some truly impressive fines. As if the GOP cared about that.
If you live in a contested district the odds are fairly good that you have more information than I do. When you get a call, do this:
* Record the call, making sure that you get the end where the RNC announces its sponsorship.
* Record the phone number.
* Make sure that Metro desks at your local newspaper, TV stations and radio stations hear about it. If you know anybody who has also received the calls, have them call in as well.
* Contact Josh Marshall with the details and the phone number, especially if you live in a state not listed above.
* Tell EVERYBODY you know. The only thing that will kill this is word of mouth. In fact, outrage about this behavior (interrupting people repeatedly during dinner, waking them up repeatedly at ridiculous hours) should spark a major backlash. But that will only happen if people know about it, so start calling around now.
Again, if you know anybody who woke up at 3 AM to take an irritating automated phone call make sure he or she knows that the call came straight from Ken Mehlman at the RNC. Let’s help revolting behavior get the reward it deserves.
***Update***
Much more about what you can do here. Also read this diary, which may have ID’d the perpetrator.
We now know that the bogus robocalls are a single coordinated campaign targeting fifteen races: CA-04, CA-50, CT-04, CT-05, FL-13, ID-01, IL-06, IL-08, KS-02, NC-11, NH-02, NY-19, PA-06, WA-05. If you know of any more please leave the information in the comments.
***Update 2***
A more thorough list of targeted races at TPM. The perp is definitely Conquest Communications of Richmond, Virginia.
***Update 3***
Kelleher did what any right-thinking person who was being driven half out of their minds by unsolicited phone calls would do. She called Farrell’s headquarters in Westport to ask them to stop.
The person who answered the phone said the calls weren’t coming from Farrell headquarters. A Farrell aide later told us they launched their first robo call Wednesday featuring Paul Newman saying all nice stuff about his old friend.
Farrell’s headquarters referred Kelleher to the opposition, the National Republican Campaign Committee (NRCC) in Washington, D.C., (202 479-7000, in case you want to call), where a spokesman said they were responsible for many of the calls.
“I called the number they gave me, but when I asked if they could take me off the call list they just laughed at me,” Kelleher said.
***Update 4***
The Economist‘s new blog equates Google bombing with saturation robocalling. The false equivalence fallacy strikes again.
The Asshole Formerly Known as GOP4Me
Still, this kinda fizzles as the November surprise. Or was that Saddam’a show trial?
Proud Liberal
Had enough America?
Tulkinghorn
If it is happening all over the country, and all at the same time, it appears to be a conspiracy at the highest levels of the Republican party. Some governors and state AGs may want to drag these assholes out of Washington and before some grand juries, because if it is against Federal law there must be some state law violations as well.
The Asshole Formerly Known as GOP4Me
“Saddam’s show trial.” My fingers have failed me yet again.
Depends on who you talk to. Some people really like pie, and wish they could have some more.
God, I hope so. If 20 or 30 of these bastards go to jail, there may actually be a disincentive for the rest of them to try these sorts of shenanigans in 2008.
Tim F.
If they lose Dems get subpoena power, so I bet that for many Republicans the choice is jail or jail.
Tulkinghorn
some might get prison rather than jail.
zzyzx
Eh, when they win again via these tactics, they can rewrite the laws to make it ok for them to do it. It’s not like there’s a Supreme Court that’s going to overturn it.
Yes, I am descending into cynical land. This is what the Republicans don’t understand. It’s not good for 49+% of the voting population to get absolutely nothing; hell with gerrmandering, it’s quite possible for the majority of the votes cast for the House to go to Democrats but the Republicans still hold a majority.
Our system operates on faith. If people stop believing in it, then we’re in a lot more trouble than what any Congress can do over a 2 year period.
Randy
Cry me a river. Remember all the dirty stuff Clinton did in 1996? This isn’t too different from that. Not saying it’s right, but turnabout…
Tulkinghorn
WTF?
The Other Steve
YEAH! The guy who replaced Haggard lives in my town! Everybody cheer!
The Asshole Formerly Known as GOP4Me
Yeah, but if they hold the House only their aides will go to jail. (Assuming the candidates themselves are smart enough to maintain some level of plausible deniability.)
So it’s not really a tough choice: my ass, or my subordinate’s?
The Asshole Formerly Known as GOP4Me
No, I don’t remember Clinton doing stuff like this. Could you please remind me what he did? Other than having a couple guys whacked, of course.
Walker
Does Randy ever make arguments? Or is it all just false analogies (like the above), unsubstantiated claims and ad hominem attacks?
Or is he a spoof? I swear I can no longer tell on this site who is real and who is a spoof.
The Practitioner
If you can’t stomach what has to be done to debride the putrid, festering wound that is the Bush administration, its okay to sit this one out.
I swear no allegiance to any political party; I am an American first, last and always.
ThymeZone
Back in the 1950’s, this practical joke was making the rounds:
Call your victim every 20 minutes starting at 2:00 am.
Ask for Frank.
After six or seven of these calls, call again and …
“Hi. This is Frank. Have there been any calls for me?”
Har har, good for a laugh.
Who dreamed that someday, very smart people would figure out how to hijack the government of the country using techniques like this?
I hand it to the GOP. Doing “whatever it takes” is the signature behavior of the true patriot. When keeping America Republican is the end, the means are justified. Any means at all. Voter suppression, vote counting irregularities, lies, smear campaigns, phony wedge issues, gerrymandering … nothing is off the table.
You have to respect that kind of passion and committment.
cleek
this is the kind of thing local news stations should be reporting on – telling voters what’s up with these calls.
anyone think it’ll happen?
ThymeZone
Pardon me for boasting, but I pride myself on having the most sensitive spoof-detector on the board, the Binford 3000 Turbo Spoofapalooza Detector.
The Binford tells me that Randy is definitely a spoof.
But take heart, the blog has moved from carrying about 30% spoof on a typical day, with peaks at 50% of all posting activity (earlier this year) to about 15-20% now, with peaks at around 30%.
One thing the Binford cannot do is identify the authors of spoof. Pretty much every non-spoof must be considered a suspect for spoof authorship. DougJ is an obvious default choice, but he’s only one of several dedicated spoofers here. And without proof to the contrary, you have to consider the proprietors to be spoof suspects too.
Spoof is just part of the blogosphere now, you just have to get used to it.
jcricket
So far the RNC has spent $6 million defending the people involved in the New Hampshire phone jamming scandal, resulting in a conviction of at least one person involved – James Tobin.
However, one might ask why the RNC would spend so much defending one guy, if they weren’t involved in, oh I dunno, a larger conspiracy to suppress Democratic votes that reaches all the way to the White House. This is why that case is ongoing.
Jail, jail or Prison. One suspects the Grand Old Docket is going to get mighty long in the next 2-4 years.
Again, I believe these are the “death throes” of a failed party we’re seeing here. Dead-enders and all that.
Steve
I heard from scs that all spoofers are DougJ. That includes you and me, of course, and probably scs too.
What’s unusual about the sleazy tactic in this post is that it comes straight from party headquarters, and they don’t even seem to be embarassed by it. So of course, we’ll hear lots of comparisions between this officially-sanctioned stunt and isolated episodes of tire-slashing and the like, because our trolls love nothing more than a false equivalence. Of course, that might be because they’re all DougJ.
jcricket
It’s not just Balloon Juice where that’s a problem. When Dick Cheney’s talking points and sites like Powerline and RedState are less believable than the Onion, you know the Republican party has “jumped the shark”. I think it’s hilarious that the spoofs can’t keep up any more. The real party does and says stuff so outrageous each day (i.e. Bush never said “stay the course”) that the spoofs pale in comparison.
ThymeZone
Not really. It’s relatively easy to prove non-spoofitude.
I’ve done it more than once. I have a real email address, a real name, even a real phone number that real posters here have called and used to carry on a real conversation with yours truly.
Ask scs to do that. Or Randy. Or ParR. You’ll discover a difference.
As for you …. heh. Let’s check the Binford. Hmm. So far you are in the green (nonspoof). So far, I say. Your Steve persona could be a cover for a spoof author with a different real name.
stickler
PpGaz has spoken to posters from this site on his home phone?
Yikes. I’d be talking to 911 immediately thereafter if it happened to me.
Or were the calls … coming from inside the house?!? (Cue scary music and shrieking violins)
The Other Steve
But you are saying it’s right. Why do you claim your not when you are?
How can you be honest with us when you aren’t even honest with yourself.
Randy
All right, everybody, it’s me, DougJ.
Just trying to get everyone amped for election day.
ThymeZone
Hilariously funny. Really, that’s Borat-level material. But, as it happens, they called me. So I guess they’d be calling 911 to report that I answered the phone.
Steve
This is no time to be getting randy. We have work to do.
Baby Jane
That’s very Abu Ghraib of you.
scarshapedstar
Why hasn’t the “liberal media” touched this story?
scarshapedstar
And why aren’t these guys simply banned from politics? They whine and cry about criminals being let loose on the streets, don’t they? Well, why is there a revolving door for election fraud?
ThymeZone
Now if John Cole would just come clean on that scs character ….
I’m torn between believing that it’s just him writing scs, or that it’s an ongoing class project that he runs at the school.
Either solution is plausible.
It’s much harder to believe that scs’ material is real and written by a sincere lunatic.
Zifnab
I’m still waiting for someone to point out that since Al Gore was the one who was really elected back in ’00, this is all technically his fault. That’s right, kids. The George W. Bush II Administration is all one big fabrication by the Democratic party to swing elections. Don’t believe it for a minute.
ThymeZone
I would not be surprised to find out that the GOP machine is so sophisticated that it can employ one trick to provide cover for other, even worse tricks. Trick A can be just a throwaway whose purpose is to distract from Tricks B, C and D.
I started to think this when I saw the guy who did the New Hampshire thing being so matter of fact about it when interviewed on tv. He acted as if it were no big deal.
Well, it’s not a big deal, if the whole purpose of it is to generate smoke to cover up an even bigger deal. I don’t trust these assholes any farther than I can see them.
Bob In Pacifica
Why am I waking up from nightmares where a “sudden late surge” of support for Republicans, not reflected in election-day polling, will give the Republicans a narrow win in the House?
Perry Como
Polls have a well known liberal bias.
Rick Taylor
As much as I’m willing to pile on the Republicans, I listened to one of the robocalls over at Talking Points Memo. It’s clear if you listen to more than the first brief sentence that it’s a call from a Republican Organizatin; it attacks the Democratic candidate and at the end says it’s paid for by the NRC. I would think most people who received the call wouldn’t be confused about where it came from, so I’m skeptical whether it’s the dirty trick people are saying.
–Rick Taylor
ThymeZone
It’s actually just a method of the Diebold VoterResponse object. Easily invoked by running a little program after the polls are closed. You just pass it an argument containing the desired “late surge” amount and it does the rest.
Zifnab
At the very least, it generates confusion and bad feelings. Smear calls like this are all about tainting the process and defaming the system. It’s just like when Bill O’Reily stands up and says, “I don’t like Republicans because they are politicians and you can’t trust politicians. So no matter who you vote for, you’re going to get a crook.”
I’m thinking that if the Republicans do try to rig the election, it won’t be record numbers of Republicans coming out of the woodwork, but a simple disappearance of Democratic support. As in, “Gee. We set up the polls, but we only have 500 ballots out of 10,000 registered voters. I guess people just weren’t interested in politics this election cycle. Ho-hum.”
scarshapedstar
Gee, you mean like apparently meaningless hanky-panky with the voting machines (first time they don’t register a Dem vote, second time they do, clearly it was an innocent mistake!) to cover up the fact that the real hoodwinking goes on by simply changing the results after the polls close?
Nah, that’d never happen.
Bruce
Rick,
The problem is if you only listen to the first few seconds of it and hang up before the message is complete it will call you back… several times. Many people will only listen to the first few seconds of it, realize its an automated election related call, and then hang up.
Those first few seconds are “I’m calling with information about “. That is about when most people hang up. Have that robocall call back six times and you hear that over and over again and many people get pissed off at the thinking its them. Given the fact the message and timing seems exactly the same among the dozens of districts being covered I’d say someone got creative.
I’m kinda surprised the law that requires them to tag their message with who paid for it isn’t at the front of the message.
Baby Jane
Hence, the dirty trick:
People hate robocalls.
People hang up…over and over and over and over.
People get pissed.
People are dirty-tricked.
Dirty-trickin’ people know this.
Steve
That doesn’t explain why Democratic candidates are getting hundreds upon hundreds of complaints about these calls.
Frankly, it’s patently obvious that the GOP is placing these deceptive calls at 6am and such to try and inspire a backlash against the Democratic candidate; so it’s pretty much a red herring to spend time wondering how effective the deception has been. It’s a sleazy, sleazy tactic and I hope they get fined into bankruptcy for it.
Demdude
Perhaps Conquest Communications should be reminded that when/if the Democrats take over the house, they will have subpoena power.
Maybe that will slow it down a bit.
ThymeZone
Me too. I want to see Dick Cheney have to sell off at least five percent of his Halliburton portfolio. That will serve the fat bastard right.
Larry
Give Conquest a call at 804-358-0560
Tell them what you think.
Very satisfying…..
DougL
I called my local (Republican) state representative to let him know that if this was supposed to get out the vote in favor of the Republican congressional candidate in my district, it was backfiring. I would have considered one call fair game, but the annoying nature of the calls (I received four calls over a period of seven days, all substantially identical) was increasing my resolve to vote against the Republican.
His response? (Wait for it…) “The Democrats are doing the same thing.”
To his credit, though, other than that, his tone was not noticeably dismissive. He did offer a sort of helpful suggstion that the calls were tied into a daily feed from the local election board of which voters had and had not already voted (we have an early voting option) and he suggested that I could get the calls stopped by simply voting early.
This brings up a second issue for me. I don’t believe it’s anyone’s business (other than the local election board’s to ensure that people only vote once) whether I’ve voted early or not and to get a daily update feed.
In discussion with some friends, it was suggested that this availability of data is intended so that local Dem organizations can call people up who haven’t voted in order to “offer them a ride to the polling site”. I don’t care what the original “good intentions” were for this kind of daily updated data. This practice should end and rolls of who has and hasn’t voted should no longer be available outside of the election board, at least not until polling has completed.
Zifnab
Yeah. That’ll put him… 5% closer… to poverty… out of his… millions of millions… *sigh*
Worst case senario, I’m betting Cheney goes out like Lay. Late night “heart attack” that renders him “dead” followed by a quicky cremation and some legal mumbo-jumbo resulting in him being aquitted of all charges.
norbizness
It was only rat-fucking when Donald Segretti and pals were doing in for Nixon in ’72; I think they’ve graduated to fucking much larger mammals… perhaps even the stately caribou.
Andrew
Quick, someone buy a robocall to keep dialing Conquest.
jcricket
While not commenting on the specific cases of vote-machine hanky-panky, I wonder why people are so incredulous that it would happen.
Non-electronic ballot-box stuffing, ballot destruction, etc. happened for years (and still happens all the time in developing countries). Why would “going electronic” get rid of the potential for people to try and alter results?
It wouldn’t.
I think the short-term fix that would solve most voting problems (that is if you’re interested in making a secure, reliable, trustworthy, usable voting system, not just disenfranchising your opponent’s voters) is to for everyone to vote by mail using optical scan ballots the way Oregon and Washington do. This has a large number of advantages:
Let’s combine this with some common sense election reforms:
Ideally I’d throw in the following:
This solves the primary problem with optical scan ballots – spoilage.
Some 10% of ballots are “spoiled” because people put stray marks, have to cross off a mistake, double vote or accidentally under-vote. Most states allow for a hand-rechecking of these ballots and sometimes duplicating them, but computer assisted ballot printing would probably drop the spoilage rate to 2% or less (some percent will always be unreadable due to machine calibration problems or issues with the ballot being folded or torn).
And if you want the “true” wishlist item we’d make it illegal to disenfranchise former felons. Once someone has served their sentence, keeping them from voting does not deter future felonies, it merely serves as another way felons are prevented from re-integrating with society, which is one way their chances of re-offending if increased.
Yes, down the road you might eventually eliminate the mailing in part, but for now this system would probably solve 90% of the real problems with our voting system (both the systemic problems and the dirty tricks parts).
Perry Como
Would an asterisk box sitting on an OC-3 and connected to a POTS system do it? If only I knew someone that had that…
ThymeZone
In my state, once sentence is served, felons can petition the court for restoration of their civil rights including voting, and will generally get it in the case of nonviolent crimes (which means, the great majority of cases can get it). The petitions are screened and vetted for any signs of trouble with the offender, and if there aren’t any, the rights are generally restored.
Pb
First, note that what they’re doing is illegal and deceptive–they’re required by law (under the TCPA) to identify themselves at the *beginning* of the call–instead, they mention their opponent. Their calls generally go something like this:
Hello, I’m calling with information about [Democratic candidate].
(pause)
[Candidate name] [lie]
(pause)
[Candidate name] [smear]
(pause)
[Candidate name] [baseless attack]
(pause)
[NRCC disclaimer]
And the typical caller experience might go something like this:
Now I imagine that a lot of people might not follow up past that, but if they did:
In my opinion, only should she sue for the monetary damages she’s entitled to by statute, she should sue for harrassment, and probably a few other things.
jcricket
I just don’t see why it shouldn’t be a condition of their release? Why do they have to petition the courts? In my state (WA) they used to have to do this, but the courts ruled it was unconstitutional (esp. the part about them having to pay all their fines).
If they re-offend, their rights get taken away again, simple.
I get the idea that if someone’s a criminal they lose their rights while incarcerated, but keeping them from voting afterwards, or requiring they jump through some hoops, serves no rational purpose (except to keep ex-felons from voting)
Andrew
We could all give you an alibi if something slipped and hit the button the triggered the script to auto-dial everyone associated with Conquest.
“But he was busy posting at BJ!”
ThymeZone
Well, because most of them are poor, black, Hispanic, or otherwise distant from the lily white fellowship groups that we want casting our votes.
As we know, keeping felons … well, felons … is the foundation of the family.
Steve
Does the TCPA even apply to political calls? I didn’t think regular telemarketers were allowed to use robocalls at all, any more.
jcricket
Right, that was sort of my point :-) With the exception of keeping many millions of potential Democrats from voting, and the whole “felons should be punished forever because it will keep future felons from offending” line of thinking, there’s no rational reason from keeping felons from automatically receiving their restored voting rights, once they’ve served their sentence.
Some states go so far as to allow felons to vote, even while in jail, but I can understand the argument against that better (part of your punishment, while in jail, includes not being able to participate in most things regular society allows for). But I don’t get bent out of shape for those states that allow it. I can see the argument in favor of it as well (keeps felons connected, at least a little, to the society they will eventually rejoin).
jcricket
As part of the regulations that set up the Do Not Call list, non-political telemarketers are not allowed were forbidden from using auto-dialers anymore (the kind where they often pre-dial + leave you hanging with multiple seconds of silence or more before they pick up), which would effectively preclude using pre-recorded messages too.
The whole political + charity exemption from the DoNotCall list thing strikes me as bad anyway. What part of “Do Not Call” do they not understand?
ThymeZone
k
I’m getting more and more convinced that this is the true basis for the GOP’s sudden interest in “immigration reform.”
Illegal or legal immigrants who gain citizenship and voting rights are likely to vote D. Why else would people like the disgusting JD Hayworth (R-AZ) talk incessantly in this campaign about his Dem opponent wanting to give “amnesty and a path to citizenship for illegal aliens?” The latter phrase is said by a voice dripping with contempt.
Only one reason I can think of: Votes from his base today, and suppression of votes from our base down the road.
Everything this assholes do is about power.
capelza
Vote by Mail, I’m telling you…no phony directions to polling booths, no “observers” to challenge your vote, no electronic voting machines to hack, none of that bullshit. My little family of three sat down on Friday evening and voted…we looked over the voter phamlets again and talked it through and each voted our minds (not all the votes were the same. They went into the mail on Saturday.
God, this stuff just pisses me off to no end.
Brian
You know… I always try to keep politics out of personal relationships, but I’m not sure I can stay friends with Republicans if they’re willing to tolerate these sorts of tactics. At what point do Republicans around the country say “enough is enough”?
jcricket
Fixed:
Pb
Steve,
Check the link; my understanding of it is that parts of it (such as the identitification requirement I mentioned) do apply, whereas other parts might be exempt.
Punchy
Oh, count on it. Santorum will win PA, Harris will lose FL….by only 3%, and Abramoff will somehow win the write-in in Delay’s old district. All counted “overnite”.
I predict a run Wednesday morning on razor blades, rope, and “How to Tie Knots” books…
Bender
What a whiny diaper-load of fake-victim nonsense. Please listen to the TPM-linked call from NY19. If you are dumb enough to think that it might come from the Democrat (when within three seconds it calls him “Liberal John Hall” and starts attacking his record on taxes), then you are already a Democrat.
That ad was not meant to deceive anyone — it’s just a negative ad on the phone. Should they be robo-calling? Not in my opinion, but it’s in no way suppression. I have personally received the same kind of automated, caller-ID suppressed calls from the Democrats for six months now about our local house race (starts out talking about the incumbent Republican, never mentions the Democrats until the very end — if you hung up after the first few seconds, you could possibly think it might be from the GOP… if you weren’t terribly bright). I never thought to cry about it. I just hung up.
It’s the standard “accuse the other side of doing what you are doing” bit. With the weekend’s chatter about the Dems’ Operation Infiltration in Ohio, it appears that the Dems are going to do their best AGAIN to suppress GOP votes. Add this to the list: indictments for fraud due to Claire McCaskill’s ACORN hijack (duping well-meaning citizens into breaking the law for her campaign, and then not paying them for their work!) last election’s slashing of GOP get-out-the-vote van tires, vandalizing GOP HQs, and paying ex-cons in crack cocaine to forge Democrat voter registrations… You can save your whining about a phone call.
Incidentally, John Marshall is a lying simpleton, as if you all didn’t already know that. One of his “few samples” (only to a math genius like Josh is two “a few”) of “GOP voter suppression” is actually nothing to do with the GOP at all.
Just like terrorists are trained to cry “torture” whether it’s true or not, the Democrats are trained to cry “intimidation” or “suppression” or “Diebold” or “disenfranchizement,” whether it happens or not. It takes the sting off of losing, I guess.
Punchy
One of my best friends is a die-hard Republican. Full-bore, “I’d raise Limbaugh’s kids if I was asked to” republican. We’ve agreed to disagree, and instead talk incessantly about sports and music. Works great.
Face
All you crying moonbats need to do is go pure cellular. They don’t call cells, only landlines, unless you specifically sign up for them to call. And if they do call late/early….ah…the beauty of the “vibrate” option…
Pb
Um, yeah. I link to an actual news account documenting the fraud and illegal activity, Bender links to a hoax. Get serious, man!
Perry Como
I’m surprised you don’t remember the lessons your gay scout leader taught you.
jcricket
They had a different book, it was “How to knot ties”, dontcha know? Fashion being all gay and what-not. Because gays like the clothing. And know how to tie a windsor knot.
Because they’re gay.
/joke-2.0
RSA
Typical necon hatred for the Supreme Court, though you’d think there would be some respect for the Chief Justice who established the concept of judicial review in our legal system.
Tim F.
Bender, it looks to me like you have a series of unsupported allegations. But knock yourself out, prove me wrong by pointing to which of those has been connected with the Democratic hierarchy by anybody other than the accusers.
…and they immediately called you back a half dozen times. At three in the morning. If not then you breezed past the point of the story.
ThymeZone
That’s a 6.2 on the Binford Spoof Scale.
jcricket
Fixed:
I will truly give the Republicans credit, in a sense, for their dirty trickery. Our party largely stopped the over-the-top dirty tricks (mass numbers of dead people voting, mainly) back in the 50s and 60s. Republicans have, since then, been perfecting the art form.
Punchy
No, they taught “How to untie knots”…and for some reason, my Gay Scoutmaster always had a rope for belt…
Pooh
John Marshall. The name Josh has a well known liberal bias.
Bender
Speaking of unsupported, I couldn’t find anything in your links to “half dozen” or “three in the morning.”
No, I think you’ve lost your own plot. Your point and TPMs wasn’t about annoying people with phone calls at night; it was ridiculous whining about “suppression” of their vote. The only way it could be vote suppression is if the GOP intentionally made people believe that the Democrat made the call to them, which would be such a retarded strategy on so many levels that I won’t even take the time to explain to you.
Like I said: Listen to that call from NY19, and if you think that “Liberal John Hall” is making that call to admit to you on the phone that he’s wrong on taxes, then you are a mental defective. If that call is “suppressing” votes, then the calls I received were trying to suppress mine. That allegation is silly on its face.
DougL
Nope. I’ve gotten quite a few of those robocalls on my cellphone.
At one point, cell phone numbers were given out in cellphone-specific prefixes. That went away in lots of US areacodes (all?) with the brouhaha that was number portability (de)regulation. It is no longer possible to determine ahead of time whether a given phone number rings to a cellphone or landline. That’s definitely the case in the Chicago area, and likely the case in areas that are served by what used to be Ameritech (IL, WI, MI, OH), and possibly the case elsewhere.
The Other Steve
Which was then followed by a whiny diaper-load of fake-victim nonsense.
Tom in Texas
Bender:
From the post:
The Other Steve
Leave it to Bender to excuse bad behavior.
It’s so typical of these assclowns. They don’t know the difference between right and wrong, they just know about how to stuff an election to win.
I don’t know why Democratic candidates hold themselves back so. We ought to do the same to them. Some robocalls reporting on their prediliction for pedophilia might be fun.
RSA
From Tim F.’s update:
Never let reality get in the way of ideology. I can’t see how anyone could be deceived, and thus no one is actually being deceived.
jcricket
Otherwise known as a textbook case of “argument from incredulity”
Good stuff, these lessons in logic.
chopper
when it comes to robocalls, i, like many americans, hang up after the first sentence.
of course, in this case, i would be led to believe that the call was from a dem candidate election committee. as i would continue to after they called me back 7 times.
at 3 in the morning.
this is why the FCC regulation that such calls must identify the party calling at the beginning of the call is so damned important when it comes to autodialed calls; it’s easy to use peoples’ impatience with recorded messages.
Tim in SF
Is Bender a nom de plume for Darrell? They have the same writing style and both personally insult those with whom they disagree at the same frequency (several times a post). If they are the same person, I can safely add “Bender” to my pie-hole list.
Tim in SF
I think voter suppression is treasonous. I don’t believe in the death penalty for anything other than treason, and I strongly think voter suppression should be counted right in there with stealing and selling state secrets.
Zifnab
I can almost already hear it.
Bender
Tom:
Tom, I didn’t say Tim never mentioned that the calls were annoying, just that it wasn’t his or Josh’s primary point, although it would be a fairer point, just not as sensational for the partisans as “Help, help, I’m being suppressed!” You’d have found Tim’s point if you wouldn’t have chopped his sentence where you did (although the rest is mostly unsubstantiated assertions, I’m still counting it as a point because I’m magnanimous like that).
If Josh and Tim want to change their point to “Those calls are annoying,” I’ll support them 100%. When they overreach to “suppression,” that’s the boy crying wolf.
Bender
What’s the bad behavior I’m excusing? I don’t think they should robocall, I certainly think they should follow Do Not Call lists, I don’t think they should call too late, or call back six times if you don’t answer (both unsubstantiated charges, AFAICT). It’s an annoying method, but it ain’t voter suppression, no matter how much you want to play the victim.
The Democrats make robocalls, too. But if you feel you guys are holding back, illegally hijack a voter registration drive like Claire McCaskill did! Forge some more voter registrations! Pay with crack cocaine! Slash some more tires! Out some more gays! Call the troops stupid! Don’t “hold back!” Then pull out the really big gun: More robocalls!
Perry Como
If I were a Democrat, let alone a Democratic operative, I would out Rove, Rove.
Take Ford in TN for example. They want to run some coded racist ads about him? Guess what? The “Concerned Conservatives of America” are going to mail out fliers with pictures of Ford where his skin tone has been noticeably darkened and he’s stalking white women. Let’s kick it into overt racism since the GOP is too afraid to say what they really mean.
Fuck the GOP.
Area Man
Of course its not suppression. Its common knowledge everyone loves automated unsolicited phone rants and depend on them to decide all of life’s important matters. What a brilliant idea.
Of course, I expected this – and much worse. This GOP has the sense of entitlement of an 8 year old spoiled brat.
Not that it will change anything. Republican insiders are scared shitless and rightfully so. This is shaping up to be a humiliating blow-out.
If RedState was smart, they’d start collecting the belts and shoelaces now.
Bender
Then you should realize that you have no idea what the call was about or who placed it, right?
Why? I repeat: Then you should realize that you have no idea what the call was about. I wouldn’t watch the first ten seconds of CSI and figure that I knew who’s the murderer!
Come on, no one is this naive: “Well, I heard the Democratic candidate’s name before I hung up — therefore, the call must be from him! After all, why would the other candidate ever mention his opponent’s name? Duuuuuuh!” Well, maybe that one short-busser cited is that naive. I have a feeling misattributing political ads is the least of her concerns.
Accepting for a second that you hang up after you sense the first period — man, a run-on sentence could keep you on phone for ages — after the second call, you’d want to know who to complain to. You would stay on for 3 whole seconds, at which time, the intent of the call would be obvious — it’s an opposition ad, and you’d have a general idea who to complain to. Or you could stay on for 20 seconds more and find out it was a RNCC ad, and you could complain to the exact proper channels. Hell, you could boycott all their candidates! Which is why the GOP would never intentionally call at (allegedly) 3 in the morning (allegedly) half a dozen times.
Short answer: It makes no sense to annoy the voters and then attach your name to the ad. It’s like heaving an autographed brick through someone’s window. The GOP doesn’t control both houses and the oval office because it tries to annoy voters. Remember, Rove is an evil genius! Not an evil moron! I suggest that the reason no one can come up with citations of late night repeating calls is that they don’t exist, because they would be massively counterproductive.
Pb
Bender, your ignorance alone doesn’t make anything ‘unsubstantiated‘–but as it is apparently wilful ignorance, I will simply conclude that you like pie.
chopper
i personally don’t give a crap. but i’m not most people. most people, based on the single sentence ‘hi, i’m calling about supporting bender for congress’ are likely going to assume that your campaign made the call.
and i assume they’d at least be able to figure out that the call was about a congressional campaign.
that has to be the dumbest comparison i’ve read this week. it’s a phone call.
uh, robocalls are required by law to state the source of the call at the beginning. when the call starts out ‘hi, i’m calling about supporting bender for congress’, what the hell do you think people will assume, that it’s the other guy calling?
you’re one of those people that replies to spam, aren’t you?
Bender
The next time you post anything useful will be the first time, but I’ll humor you this once. From now on you’re going to have to earn it.
What exactly do you think this puff-piece is substantiating? Well, let’s look at what I said was “unsubstantiated.”
Where exactly does it say she was called at 3 in the morning? Oh, it doesn’t.
When does it say she was redialed a half dozen times? Never?
When does it say it took several minutes for the GOP to ID itself? Never?
When did it say it was an RNC ad? Never?
Where did it say that this writer wouldn’t ever vote for a robocalling candidate? Weeeeeeell, she asserts that it’s an really effective strategy, to infuriate the voter so much that they don’t vote, but she never says she’s not voting, so she kind of defeats her own weak point. (On the contrary, I suspect she’d vote for any robocalling Democrat, even if they called at 3AM.)
So, that wasn’t really helpful in the least! Or to translate into words you BJ drones seem to understand, your post consisted of “pie, pie, pie, pie, pie, and pie.”
Mumon
It’s a bad analogy: google bombing & robocalling.
Spam is a much better analogy…Republican robocalls are the telephone equivalent of “ViAgRA” e-mails that pollute too many in-boxes.
Pb
Now that’s irony–and quit stealing my lines!
Don’t mind if I do…
Bullshit.
Uh-oh, we’ve found the culprit–Bender wrote the ad!
Unsubstantiated–got a recording?
Hoax.
and… projection, for the win!
Tulkinghorn
I like the sound of that. Imaging 100,000 small claims cases (can not be consolidated) filed steadily over the course of a couple years, all demanding the maximum $ 5,000… Filing fee for each case is something like $50, nobody needs an attorney… Name the individual directors for the company making the calls, serving a separate copy to each director… These guys will get murdered with legal fees, will have to default on them after a while… then sell the judgments to a hardass collection attorney…
You could bankrupt that business and scare the creeps from trying this again.
ThymeZone
Spoof alert?
The Asshole Formerly Known as GOP4Me
‘Fess up, DougJ, you’ve been writing several people around here.
BTW, I’m the one that called ThymeZone, so in regards to one another we’re pretty sure we really exist. I wish I could say the same for the rest of you, some of you I’m about 99.9% sure are real but there are one or two (Bender, scs) that I’m 99.9% sure of the opposite.
Bender
Pb,
You could’ve just posted: “OK, you got me. The article I linked was worthless and proved nothing. I’m an idiot for having posted it, and I apologize that I attempted to use it to insult you. I can’t answer any of your questions intelligently, so I’ll just drop it now, and pretend I never posted it. You needn’t respond to my drivel anymore.”
You didn’t have to do that embarrassing tap-dance back there. Yeeeesh! I hope you at least got some pie out of the deal. Hee-hee, I said “pie” again!
Pb
Bender,
Or, you could have tried reading it…
Baby Jane
Hello, I’m calling with information about Bender.
*click*
Hello, I’m calling with information about Bender.
*click*
Hello, I’m calling with information about Bender.
*click*
Hello, I’m calling with information about Bender.
*click*
Hello, I’m calling with information about Bender.
*click*
Hello, I’m calling with information about Bender.
*click*
Now, it doesn’t matter what the information might’ve been; negative info, positive info, makes no difference.
But you can be sure that as all the people pass you by on the street, less of them will be dropping quarters into your styrofoam cup.
Baby Jane
Hello, I’m calling with information about Bender.
*click*
Hello, I’m calling with information about Bender.
*click*
Hello, I’m calling with information about Bender.
*click*
Hello, I’m calling with information about Bender.
*click*
Hello, I’m calling with information about Bender.
*click*
Hello, I’m calling with information about Bender.
*click*
Now, it doesn’t matter what the information might’ve been; negative info, positive info, makes no difference.
But you can be sure that as all the people pass you by on the street, less of them will be dropping quarters into your styrofoam cup.
Zifnab
Please stop trying to convince Bender that robocalls are annoying. If the very term ‘robocall’ doesn’t scream harassment of an auditory nature at you from the get-go you’re lost. And I’ll bet a year’s salary that for all Bender’s shit talk about automated voice calling at all hours of the day and night being not so bad, he was still not above putting himself on the Do Not Call list.
Apparently, robocalling is just one of those Republican Values.
tBone
I’m starting to think that Bender is just Mac Buckets under a new handle. Constant arguments from incredulity? Check. Unwarranted arrogance? Check. Patronizing bullshit? Check.
Bender
Yeah, because Bender loves robocalls!
Please stop trying to convince me that Zifnab can read English.