Sometimes the silliness of our public dialog scares me more than it amuses me.
Steve Benen on reconciliation:
Scholars of propaganda could write an impressive paper on the Republican campaign on reconciliation in recent months. Partisan hacks have managed to convince an entire political world and a media establishment that use of a fairly routine Senate procedure is not only problematic, but genuinely scandalous. They’ve even convinced some Democrats to feel squeamish about a process Republicans have used repeatedly with no qualms at all.
I’m really not sure how we got from we don’t torture, to that torture stuff we do isn’t torture, to anyone who opposes torture hates America. Apparently that’s where we are.
I sort of understand how these things came to be, but there’s no getting around the fact that it’s all very strange. I know Tom Friedman thinks all our problems can be cured with a new tax credit for R&D and that the Village thinks a big bipartisan commission could clear all this up. But I think the problems here run deep.
On a similar theme, Tom Tomorrow says there’s too much crazy. I agree.
The “problem” isn’t just deep, it’s unsolvable because of two things—the general epidemic of dumbassery and greed amongst the populace .
I understand how we got here. Aside from the usual MSM won’t do it’s job/is largely conservative, etc. arguments, we got here because Democrats are pussies. Their lack of organized push-back against this kind of lying is beyond tragic. It actually hurts the country.
Lies like this don’t stick if they aren’t allowed to stick. If the Democrats had some balls and called out the Republicans for lying, the lies might not stick as often. Call a liar a liar, Democrats.
I was thinking this morning, if I wasn’t so damn old, I’d just get the hell out of here!
It is one of the symptoms of an empire in decline. Read about the Dreyfus affair, or the trial of Oscar Wilde sometime. Then reflect that those were societies on the brink of the 1st World War, collapse of European colonialism, decline into 2nd rank power status, etc., etc.
Or better yet, the closing years of the Ming or Qing dynasties in China. Yea gods but people are good at finding ways to lie to themselves and fight over everything except stuff that actually matters in the long run.
Friedman went outside to order his brown servant to go fetch his paper when he realized that America’s discourse is like a lawn’s sprinkler system.
if you keep using this kind of salty language then I’m gonna file a sexual harassment suit.
I remember when the most optimistic of us thought that there might…just MIGHT be a chance that the ’08 election might have given reason to stray away from the crazy.
Instead, everyone’s doubled down on it and we’re on a hard death spiral toward nutbaggery with the Teabaggers, Beck, and our ‘Principled Moderates’ leading the way. I’m firmly convinced that we’re all pretty well and fucked for at least the next couple of decades, because of the ludicrously powerful Right Wing Noise Machine, a complicit media, and jellyfish Dems who either have fucking Stockholm’s Syndrome or essentially agree with Republicans on everything anyways.
But of course, it’s all because we listened to those goddamned Hippies, I’m sure. Gimmie a boxing glove, I smell patchouli already.
(Christ, I’m not even 30 yet, I’m not old enough to be this bitter of a cynic)
File away! The High Court of The Interweb is now in session!
I just wanted to drop in and say that I Just Wasn’t Made for These Times isone of my most favoritist Beach Boys songs.
What, you expected a trial? Silly people, with their habeas and ‘innocent until proven guilty’. What year do you think this is?
The 1970’s were worse. Politically, morally, culturally – the whole decade was a fncking hangover. It sucked for everybody except hardcore Steelers fans.
If and only if we embrace the Village’s definition of ‘bipartisanship’ — the Republicans get their way 100% on everything, absolutely 100% of the time.
Burn the fucking Village!
FUCK. Doug, can you get me out of mod hell? All i did was quote TNC, who used the Ciali$ word.
Yeah, point. Nixon AND Disco?
Then again, we had Bush and L’il Jon’s producing legacy this decade, so….
If the MSM spoke against the Bush administration, they would be charged with Treason. If they don’t speak up against President Obama, they will be accused of treason. Nothing really has changed.
President Obama won because the politicos and Wall Street knew that McCain would bomb Iran and let us rot in a depression for decades.
It’s clearly The Year of The Teabagger. Anyone with skin darker than piece of paper goes directly to jail. Do not pass go. Do not collect $200.
Corporate power, vested in the RNC and MSM and Blue Dogs, will ensure we never escape the craziness.
We’ve now entered my favorite part of Empire: Grab what you can, while you can!
Disco, Farrah Fawcett’s hair-do, and bell-bottom jeans were a fucking travesty. Atleast punk came along.
@ThatLeftTurnInABQ: Yes, the ’70’s were massively bad.
And smack dab in the middle of it was the Bicenntennial, a real consumerism-gone-off-the rails event that lasted all year!
If R’s have true convictions, their actions say the opposite. Michael Gerson wrote a piece in Wapo a couple of days ago on suicide & not one mention, not one, of veteran/troop suicides. Suicides among celebrities was evidently more notable. So much for supporting the troops that have fought in that terrific war Bushco wanted.
Speaking of stuff that actually matters in the long run, it looks like the methane within the East Siberian Arctic Shelf is starting to destabilize, which would lead to a drastic acceleration of global warming.
But of course we still have winter, so algore made all that stuff up.
This is a misguided rant. The ONLY effective way to “push back against” this is to have the media call out the Republican liars. Absent that…Senators dont have their own cable stations. Dems dont have their own version of Fox News. A Senator can call out the lies in the middle of the Senate floor, and all 13 people watching CSPAN will see it. It all rests on the responsibility of the large media organizations to inform the people. And they refuse to.
Blame CBS News, not Senator Webb. He doesn’t own a TV station.
I don’t know how we got here, but as long as we have corporate funding of electoral campaigns, we will not be able to get out. Amirite?
You should just Smile. Perhaps a recording of Tunch making some Pet Sounds would help.
@Citizen_X: so algore made all that stuff up and he’s fat.
What about Tarkus?
At least we are doing better in the all important field of children’s literature. The 00’s had Harry Potter, etc., etc. The 70s had this.
I rest my case.
Yes, probably a tenth of the country are soft objectivists who want to dismantle everything in government, roll it back to the 18th century version and let corporations run wild, but still keep the military and pursue an Imperial foreign policy.
Another large vocal group wants the same, except they’d like to roll the government back to the 50’s instead.
Another group wants a progressive agenda and and active government that stays out of their private lives.
Another fair percentage wants to let corporations run wild, embrace an Imperial foreign policy and keep a safety net so the peasants don’t get too pissed off at the fact that they’re getting screwed.
And a larger group wonders why the hell nothing gets done year after year and problems keep getting worse. Then they consistently vote for the same people over and over again expecting different results, until the economy collapses.
I’m pretty sure we’re screwed by this point, but there’s other institutional failure like Senate rules, incumbency advantages, special interest money, etc.
You can tell I’m not an optimist.
Yes indeed, Kryptik. I’ve been a bitter cynic since my early 20s, which occurred in the mid-’70s, & the American people have never given me any reason to change my attitude in the ensuing 30+ yrs.
That may be the problem: There are just too many simple, trusting types out there in America. And they never learn.
Ya know, i know it’s been a long winter and everyone get down during this time period, but if I wanted doom & gloom and navel gazing I’d be bumming out with the pot smokers and self-cutters at GOS.
To quote Cher — “SNAP OUT OF IT!”
Watched “The Daily Show” last night, and the illustration of the way GOP memes are born and multiply was almost painful to watch. It scared me, in the way that it showed exactly how “disciplined” and on-message the wingnuts are.
Scarborough can’t get enough of the “they’re ramming HCR down your throats” brand of political meme posing as advice to the Democrats. MSNBC is not immune, and yes, everyone reading this blog already knows that about “Morning Joe”, but it’s important to note the cross-pollination.
They showed Breitbart’s truly stoopid “Obama hated reconciliation before he didn’t hate it” video on loop over three hours today. Breitbart. Misleading propaganda. And Mika just shakes her head and tsk-tsks. Next up? Barnicle hits Obama for being mean to bankers like his wife, and Halperin defends Bunning for being “principled.” Scarborough calls the President weak, and we all have a donut.
Fuck, I hate Morning Joe and yet, watch it daily. I sure am missing Today’s daily Olympics show.
I think some of our problems could be resolved with a complete overhaul of the education and media systems in the US. But in the end people are still going to believe what they want to believe for reasons that are almost, if not entirely, about their own self interest.
General Egali Tarian Stuck
Ya think. All anyone has to do to get the drift of how deep the rabbit hole of injustice and brutality goes in this country is to consider our ancestors traveled to a distant shore, stole other human beings and brought them home to be work mules and general farm animals and personal property. Though we didn’t invent institutionalized slavery, we didn’t give it up easy and the lower half of the country was willing to spill damn near all it’s blood and treasure to continue it.
And only did it end a mere 150 years ago, and even then these violent twits insisted on a violent apartheid for the next 100 plus years, that still hasn’t ended completely.
We live on top of a cultural and ideological volcano that is currently spewing ash into our body politic, increasing by the day. And there are no guarantees that it won’t fully erupt in the near or distant future. This is our country.
“In terms of financial wealth (total net worth minus the value of one’s home), the top 1% of households had an even greater share: 42.7%.”
General Egali Tarian Stuck
@Makewi: Hi Scarlett!
Some very good comments here, and the post brings home the point to me that the bloggers I follow are feeling the same thing I am.
The propoganda, dumbassery and craven politician problems we face are systemic and have been warned about since Plato’s Republic.
Frankly, I’m losing hope in our historic ability to pull out of it. I had thought that the Iraq (War Crime) debacle coupled with the bankster caused Financial Collapse of 2008-09 would motivate at least a plurality of our highly
educatedcredentialed Villagers to apply themselves once a week, but maybe we’re too far gone.
Bahgdad Bob‘s got nothing on our WaPo.
The timing for these comments could not have been better.
To repeat: MSNBC is not even close to a liberal version of Fox News. MSNBC is a news channel has some liberal hosts in the evening (and conservatives in the morning). Fox is a GOP propaganda channel all day long. There is a difference.
@Makewi: MSNBC. Good one, Mak.
What just happened there??
@General Egali Tarian Stuck:
Since you’ve passed the very high bar of proof by assertion, I have no choice but to believe you. It must suck horribly to be such a voiceless liberal in Obama’s America. How do you get by?
The country is controlled by organized wealth, using fear and hate to control others. It’s really simple. There is no conceivable end to this story except an authoritarian government ruling a populace that’s apathetic when times are good, and easy to lead to war when times are bad.
Torture of political opponents should be SOP by 2020.
MSNBC is an entertainment channel. The fact that they are aiming at a different demographic than Fox doesn’t make it news.
(and yes, I agree that calling MSNBC liberal *completely* misses that they are trying to be a less extreme Fox that skims off the rubes who Fox can’t capture)
General Egali Tarian Stuck
@Violet: And you’re in luck. It’s my turn to settle complaints about salty language.. And I’m a fair and balanced motherfucker.
then you’re an idiot.
you couldn’t get me to watch a second of Fixxed News or CNBC or any wingnut show.
I mean, why would I want to torment myself watching the dead-intern guy?
Hey General, have you ever read any of the editorials and letters to the editor that were written at the time of our founding and shortly thereafter? If so, would you say the volcano (as you put it) is a new phenomenal or more or less the status quo?
I dunno, let’s call up the Republican congressman during his daily program on MSNBC and see what he thinks.
Or read Kurtz complain how the Post’s news section has to balance out all those radical wild-eyed lefties in the Op-Ed section as justification for keeping Shalaigh Murray and Marc Theissen on contract.
I keep asking, and I will ask again:
When in the hell did we just stop teaching basic fucking civics in school?
The idea that homeschoolers are teaching the God in government model that the fundies have been pushing frankly terrifies me. These are the kids who go to small Bible colleges (which are the only ones that would accept many of them) and then on to internships with GOP congresscritters or Falwell’s law school.
We are watching the implosion of what was the educational system that was the envy of the world.
The problem is the media, and the solution is the new media.
(We’re soaking in it!)
I have been fairly well informed on wonkery subjects since being fullly radicalized in my mid-teens. Now it is truly easy to become informed, easier than at any previous time in history.
That reality hasn’t caught up with most people. But it will.
@Mike Kay: I’m no more an idiot than anyone who reads a blog or clicks on Drudge or watches a Daily Show round-up. I’m not about to listen to arias while whipping up egg whites in the morning, nor watch Fox-n-Friends, and I’m not sure what you’re expecting, but clicking between “Morning Joe,” Imus and the local traffic report while going about my daily business doesn’t make me an imbecile. I’m well aware of what I’m hearing and watching, and it’s interesting to talk about; what, you want me to plug my ears in the morning and sing “la-la-la-la-la?” So, screw off, TV Cop elitist.
I can’t think of anything you said that I can disagree with.
Well, it’s not going to stop until most working-class and poor people have just died off due to lack of adequate health care and/or starvation due to lack of employment by which one purchases food and shelter. They’ll keep a few scared immigrants around to do the lawns, drive their limos, clean their mansions n’stuff.
Brian Wilson ref. in post title = WIN.
General Egali Tarian Stuck
@Makewi: Haven’t read them but I imagine they were fairly squishy on equal rights, even in the north. Jefferson once said about giving women the vote, something like “over my dead body”. The founders were highly educated and probly liberal for their time, but not that enlightened individually. The genius of our liberal constitution came from the collective and committed efforts of these flawed men.
They agreed to end all slavery in the north, I believe, with the founding, but it was not a unanimous thing, especially amongst many rank and file northerners. The south however, would have none of it.
So yes, I think we have always lived on a volcano that has been mostly semi dormant in recent times, and I believe the founders knew this quite well and why they created a Constitutional Republic instead of a majoritarian democracy. And why they divided powers and put in place things like the Senate to slow things down, and help defuse the disputes from the great ideological divide that did and still exists in America.
And thanks for coming back and asking a decent question. hope it lasts.
I’m not sure our educational system was ever the envy of the world (at least below the university level–at the university level, it was and still is).
And I can’t go along with all this “world’s gone to hell” stuff. It was never any better.
@ThatLeftTurnInABQ: Funny that you mention the Dreyfus affair. Whoever it is who writes the Blood and Treasure blog was just going over the rapidly cycling rationales deployed by Dreyfus’ antagonists:
This right before the French government proceeded to fight a war that nearly wiped out a generation’s worth of her young men. And now the same craziness from the people who want to double down on the American Empire. I guess that should be no surprise.
Here’s a point to back up my comment @32
How hard would it be for any Villlager to call out this piece of shit and the piece of shit (Grandpa Walnuts) on the TeeVee every other Sunday who birthed her on to the national stage?
Nevermind, can we torture a hippy?
A Mom Anon
@celticdragonchick: it started when fundies got the idea to take over the school boards and local gov’t in the late 70’s. I had required gov’t and civics and was a 1978 grad. My brother graduated from the same school 5 yrs later and all that was gone,along with the requirements in history and science being halved. I have a 10th grade HS kid,there is one class,half the year,devoted to American History in 9th grade and that’s IT. That’s a big part of what the hell happened.
I watch a little Morning Joe most days. Gives me a pretty good idea what spins of the day are on the R menu.
Or to quote Grace Slick “(When) logic and proportion have fallen sloppy dead”.
Things just keep getting curiouser and curiouser, don’t they?
Even more important – Fox is a basic channel, it is essentially one of the big 4 broadcast networks. MSNBC is a niche cable channel. In all of the media markets I’ve lived in or spent much time visting, Fox is Channel 2 (i.e. the first thing you see when you turn a TV on) and MSNBC is somewhere up in the 30’s. I’ve heard some folks on this blog say that in their market MSNBC isn’t even part of the basic cable package in their area, or is under consideration for being dropped from it.
Go into any public place of business (bar, restaurant, car repair shop, gas station, etc.) that has a TV running for the customers to watch while they wait around and what channel is on – FOX. Why? Are small business owners mostly wingnuts, and large corporations are looking to push the propoganda? Or is it that wingnuts complain until their favorite channel is tuned in, and liberals don’t bother. Or is it that non-wingnuts are too fragmented in their tastes and preferences, so wingnuts end up being the plurality?
Who knows? I don’t. All I know is that FOX is everywhere – you can’t escape it even if you want to. In the last few years many gas stations in my area have installed a little TV in the gas pump which automatically turns on as soon as you start pumping gas (at least they have a mute button). Guess which TV station is locked in? It ain’t MSNBC.
I never click on drudge. period.
This is a really good, and important, question.
Back when I was in charge (such a meaningful job) of deciding what would be on the TVs at the restaurant bar, I always went with live sports, and CNN when live sporting events weren’t on. CNN seemed to satisfy most, which is always the goal in a public house. Whenever I’m in an establishment that has FNC on, I just ask them if they could put it on ESPN. But yes, I’ve noticed more and more that FNC is the go-to channel at pubs and hotels.
@Mike Kay: Well, good for you, but it doesn’t make those who do click on it, or watch Morning Joe, “idiots.” People click for all kinds of reasons, some of which involve keeping tabs and staying on top of politics. Both venues (Drudge and MJ) are inherently political, after all.
General Egali Tarian Stuck
Funny you should mention that. Back in 2000 when I bought my first computer and knew nothing about adware and the like, I was cruising the web, and clicked on Drudge Report. And my computer went crazy with pop up adds sprouting from every where. Luckily, I still had enough functionality to learn what was happening and download an anti- spyware remover. So I never click on Drudge either.
It’s George Orwell’s America, we just live in it.
I like the old man: “Someone tell a joke.”
And Led Zeppelin. Don’t forget that.
Treating previously routine practices as The Death of the Republic has been the wingnut M.O. for years. Obama hosting his favorite pizza chef. “Happy Holidays”. Pelosi’s airplane. Teleprompters. Dijon mustard.
I call it SWORS: Spasmodic Wingnut Outrage Syndrome.
Wow. Thanks for finding and placing that here, Mike. That is really something. More from Iowa Independent:
Note: Obama respected Culver’s plea, and did not visit.
Quaint little piece of Americana, huh, Sarah? My ass. Yet one more of the innumerable reasons I loathe Sarah Palin and John McCain.
Poor old sod would be horrified to see 1984 used as a manual.
Go into any public place of business (bar, restaurant, car repair shop, gas station, etc.) that has a TV running for the customers to watch while they wait around and what channel is on – FOX. Why? Are small business owners mostly wingnuts, and large corporations are looking to push the propoganda? Or is it that wingnuts complain until their favorite channel is tuned in, and liberals don’t bother.
Oh, I bother. If I’m in a business, bar, etc. and they have Fox on, I demand they switch the channel because “I’m not paying to be subjected to Republican propaganda.” If they don’t, I walk out loud and proud and take my money with me.
I’m not made for these times either. These misinformation campaigns are crazy-making.
My husband went to the opthalmologist today and the office was handing out a letter for patients to sign protesting that thanks to “Obamacare,” medicare would be cut 21% effective Monday.
He says most of the patients are older, needing cataract surgery. The message they’re getting from their DOCTORS is that the goverment’s taking away their medicare.
No mention of Bunning, needless to say.
As soon as I get laid off again, it’s France for me.
Seriously? I don’t recall people going Full Metal Freakout when the President talked to schoolchildren. Plus, we had this thing called the Fairness Doctrine, the thought being that allowing demagogues, disguised as journalists, to peddle vile bullshit on teh public airwaves might be unwise. I’ve been seriously into politics since the mid-60s; the current level of dementia is unprecedented.
@A Mom Anon:
You cannot believe how depressing that is, especially to someone like me who has a major in geology, a minor in American history and has thought about teaching at the high school level.
I was mostly referring to the way in which the opposing sides talked to and about each other, it wasn’t pretty. In fact, it so wasn’t pretty that it lead to one of the darker moments in American law in the Alien and Sedition acts.
Anyway, the point is that I think the idea that there was ever a time in which the 2 sides acted in a way that wasn’t horrible is largely a myth.
What I do find funny is that the if you take the arguments for and against reconciliation from now and from 2004-2005 you will find a whole lotta hypocrisy and double talkin’ going on.
I agree that Democrats have been, well, ridiculous wimps when it comes to rhetoric, and that they (and America) would be far better off if they kicked the Republicans’ asses on the lies.
That, however, isn’t enough. Democrats have got to frame their messages to appeal to voters so that they’re in positive territory before the lying liars know to begin lying.
And that means that Democrats have got to appeal to voters’ *emotions*. Appealing to their intellects is nice, but is basically ineffective. Most people decide most issues emotionally most of the time. The GOP knows this, which is why most of their rhetoric targets emotions.
And no, we can’t write off voters who think with their emotions just because they’re irrational to do so, or just because it feels good to denigrate them. Not only would that be self-defeating, it’d be, um, irrational.
I reiterate: engaging in behavior that knowing leads to aggravation is idiotic.
Ye shall know the truth and the truth shall set ye free.
DFH no. 6
Umm… I’ll go with you on the cultural inferiority of the 70s, but politically and morally? As one who came of age in the 60s and 70s, no, IMHO. For instance, music today (overall “rock” category, even if a lot of it now is “post-rock” or whatever) is far superior to the 70s. Not even close. Today is actually a golden age for that aspect of culture (not forgetting that there is plenty of crap).
And then there’s this whole intertube thing with the blogs and Google and all that. Miniskirts and hot pants were pretty cool back in the day, but bushy sideburns and short-shorts for guys, not so much (advantage, now). And disco? Good lord, even today’s Nashville country-pop dreck isn’t that bad.
But we are certainly in far worse straits today politically, and — largely because of that — morally, too (torture, for one, as mentioned). Bush/Cheney and today’s Republican party are orders of magnitude worse than Nixon/Agnew and the Republican Party of the 70s. Again, it’s not even close. Nixon resigned because he lost important Republicans in Congress, and for Watergate, a pale shadow of the evil that was (is) Bush/Cheney and their enablers. No such Republicans exist, or could exist, in today’s Congress.
Woodward helped bring down Nixon in the pages of Ben Bradlee’s Washington Post. Now he excuses and even fellates (metaphorically) Bush as a full-fledged member of the Mighty Wurlitzer, and the Washington Post editorials are presided over by Fred Hiatt. That’s a microcosm of today’s 4th Estate, fallen very, very far from the 70s.
Birchers and their ilk were embarrassing to the political establishment of the 70s. They are now in full control of the Republican Party, and are the default position for national debates on any topic. The 70s were the proximate start of our long political descent into madness. We are well and truly insane now.
General Egali Tarian Stuck
Well, yea. From both sides. But the facts are that out of 22 times reconciliation has been used, 16 were by goopers. And some pretty big legislation to boot, like on Medicare and Welfare Reform and unpaid for huge tax cuts for rich people that exploded the deficit.
So wingers have no room to complain that dems want to use it for small fixes to a larger bill already passed by the Senate by regular order. It’s dems turn to use this get around of the filibuster.
Reconciliation is used about as often in legislating as the onside kick is in football, and it deserves a bit of eye-rolling when it’s used.
But it’s still part of the rules.
@Mike Kay: It doesn’t lead to actual, real-life aggravation. It leads to the kind of aggravation we bitch about on anonymous internet boards which purport to be about politics and the discussion of politics and what-not.
Know ye the difference, he who believes himself to be wise. Or some such nonsense.
@General Egali Tarian Stuck:
More truth. The reconciliation trigger would have already been pulled had not a large enough part of the issue been that there are Dems who are outspoken against it’s use and Dems who are very cautious these days due to a growing fear of the coming election. The GOP is still pretty powerless in terms of the number of actual votes it has. It occurs to me that they wouldn’t have a whole lot to fear if the people whom they represented were actually behind the particular bills that have been put forth.
@Makewi: Before I realized that you were just a spoof, I used to try to reason with you.. not anymore. Go read Pat Robertson or World Net Daily. They make as much sense as you do.
If it helps you to believe that, then go for it. Who am I to stand between someone and their delusions?
General Egali Tarian Stuck
@Makewi: The polls are bullshit on this bill. People have been bombarded with so many lies and distortions from your side, they don’t know what’s in the bill. And when it’s passed and dems can go down the list of new insurance reforms with the public, they will love it and wave many plastic unicorns in appreciation to the MUP. Just wait and see.
@General Egali Tarian Stuck:
I disagree about the polls and the supposed bombardment of bullshit, as you would expect me to. I will await the many plastic unicorns.
I first entered the job market in the early 1970s, so I can attest that there was major suckage to be had at that point in time. On the other hand, that was also the decade when women, African-Americans, gays, even the disabled started a new wave of civic progress… words like “sexual harrassment” and “domestic violence” and “gay-bashing” entered the public vocabulary, because suddenly there was an argument being made that such acts weren’t as natural & invisible as water is to fish. Tragically, part of the The-Seventies-Were-Worse meme is the undercurrent that straight, white, healthy young men lost their implicit right to at least abuse chicks, colored, queers & crips during that turbulent decade. It’s a subsection (but, because of the inherent political weight of well-to-do straight white Boomer males in the current climate, an unduly important section) of the fReichtard/Talibangical/Robber-Baron “Everything was better before those people got the vote” trope.
@General Egali Tarian Stuck:
hey, haven’t you heard? the civil war wasn’t about slavery, it was about state’s rights, like the 2nd amendment!
@Tonal Crow: The real problem is that Americans, and particularly the demographic known as Baby Boomers, are self obsessed, and so short sighted that the term “enlightened self interest” has no meaning relative to their behavior.
Consequently, they are easily manipulated, and vote for whoever appeals to their prejudices or offers them cookies.
Yes, the Democrats are weak. Nonetheless, that does NOT excuse the continued electoral survival of a nihilist GOP, any more than the statement “Times were tough” excuses the Germans for electing Hitler in 1932.
Far from being the end of history, the self-immolation of the US may trigger the end of the Age of Democracies.
Pretty pathetic, when you think about it.
You may be interested to know that the Boomers vote considerably more Democratic than either the generation before or the generation after them. This has been consistently true since we started to vote in the ’60’s (OK, the technically the “generation after” part didn’t start until they started to vote in the ’80’s). The Millenials are trending even bluer than the Boomers, but it’s only a small sample so far.
So blame the Boomers for whatever else you want, but GOP dominance is NOT on our hands. We’ve been getting outvoted for most of our lives.
General Egali Tarian Stuck
Surely after all this whining it is time to punch the left who have been yelling about this for decades. But they simply gum up the works for the reasonable people – you know, the ones who got us here. Um, the left certainly didn’t vote for Reagan and etc…
DougL (frmrly: Conservatively Liberal)
So many boomers love to mouth phrases like ‘the government is leaving all of this debt to our children and their children’ or bullshit to that effect when the reality is that they really don’t give a shit about burdening future citizens of this country with their debt. All they really care about is what they can get out of the ‘system’ while they are alive, anything they can get to make their world a bit better and at no immediate cost themselves. Our winger vet uttered those words and I fired back ‘that horse left the barn a long time ago, we are now dumping our debt three or four generations out now’. I told him that those words have been said so many times now that they are little more than lip service to the future.
Everybody who doesn’t have everything they want is in search of ‘more’ but nobody wants to give a dime to help anyone who has less than them. Quite the conundrum but I figure that one day the top 1% will have 95% of the assets and maybe then the masses will demand a small tax increase for the bastards who robbed the system blind.
Since nearly half of our country is nuts now I don’t hold out much hope. Right now I’m just along for the ride since there is little I can do about it…lol
General Egali Tarian Stuck
@Chuck Butcher: What are you talking about?