@billmon1 @jaredbkeller Ombudsman and chief privacy officer
— Glenn Greenwald (@ggreenwald) October 16, 2013
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The Washington Post‘s Wonkblog has the full 35-page text of the bill to end the shutdown. “The measure also raises the debt limit, gives back pay to furloughed federal workers and just barely touches Obamacare.”
Elsewhere in the Post:
In an interview with the National Journal, Charles Boustany (R-La.) said those colleagues had “put the GOP majority at risk.”
“There are members with a different agenda,” Boustany said Wednesday in an interview in his office. “And I’m not sure they’re Republicans and I’m not sure they’re conservative.”
***********
Apart from crossing our fingers, what’s on the agenda this evening?
Jerzy Russian
Are those idiots going to vote for the bill or not? It is getting late…
Yatsuno
That’s about where I am, though if this goes late enough I won’t have to report until Friday.
@WereBear: The Senate hasn’t even voted yet. This doth not bode well for resolution today.
WereBear
Sigh of relief? Is it over yet?
The Sheriff's A Ni-
Things I Learned This Past Month:
– Republicans are not afraid of a government shutdown hurting their election chances
– Republicans are scared to death of a default hurting their election chances
Noted for the future. Now on to ‘How Obama Betrayed Us All Pt XVIII: The Second Debt Limit Crisis.’
Soonergrunt
So the one thing the Conservatives got out of this, tightened income verification for ACA subsidies, actually makes the government more intrusive in people’s lives?
Real winning plan they had there.
Last I saw, the House had scheduled the vote for 11:00 PM EST. Cutting it a little close, there.
Linnaeus
@Soonergrunt:
They’re all for government intrusion when it’s done to the “right” kind of people who deserve it.
WereBear
@Soonergrunt: Oh, but that messing up people’s lives thing… THAT has been a roaring success, hasn’t it?
scav
@Soonergrunt: Ah, but there’s red tape and there’s Red® Tape!
gussie
Is anyone looking for a small freelance website design project? I’ve got a friend who needs a pretty simple website made …
Gex
Well duh. They call themselves the Tea Party. Why’d you let them run as Republicans?
By the way, there’s nothing like listening to a “party” that is too lazy and entitled to do the work of becoming an actual party complain about lazy people.
Elsewhere in the blogs people were speculating on whether the Tea Party will form a new party or will RINOs get kicked out. I think the history of the Tea Party tells us they aren’t going to form a new party. That’s, like, work an stuff. They’re just there for Koch money.
Cermet
As I have been saying since day one of this fake crises – the vote will occur with all demorats and enough thugs in the house and the debt ceiling will be fixed; a clean CR was a nice bonus that could have failed. Still, I was hoping for a crash to put a real nail in the gooper coffin but knoooow – the damn thugs got some sense (or translation: the kock sucker brothers laid down the law.)
Villago Delenda Est
Well, they’re Bircher garbage. They’re racists. They’re jeebofascists. The problem is, the GOP for the past 33 years have counted on them for electoral support.
You’ve lied down with mangy dogs. Now you begin, at long last, to pay the price for doing so. Infested with very hungry fleas that will happily exsanguinate you.
As for them being “conservatives” they’re not. They’re reactionaries against everything from the Renaissance onward.
Luthe
Quoth the Post:
AHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA. Pull the other one, it has bells on.
The Other Chuck
@Soonergrunt:
Quite literally the eleventh hour.
(well 23’rd, but I didn’t coin the phrase)
srv
In other news:
chopper
@The Other Chuck:
a true fighter always takes the full count. it’s like when you can’t get your petulant kid to listen so you count to three. they always wait until three.
Jay C
@Jerzy Russian:
On the local news tonite, they said the House would be voting at about 11:00 – I guess they need the extra time to let all the
loudmouth assholesesteemed Representatives who want to make speeches spouting BS to do so.Or to give Speaker Boehner more time to get plastered…
lamh36
If all goes as the polls say, we will have our first voter-elected African American Senator since Barack Obama in 2004!
I’m excited about that even though some have issues about Booker.
MattF
The R’s big miscalculation was the assumption that Obama would fold. He didn’t. And next time, he won’t either. So, what are they going to do?
Mark S.
11pm? They got something else to do right now? And doesn’t the Senate have to vote on it afterward?
Baud
@srv:
LOL. After a stressful couple of weeks, that’s exactly what I needed. Don’t even care if it’s true.
BGinCHI
@gussie: Is your friend Yahoo, because they are teh suxxors.
dmsilev
@MattF: Scream and pout, of course. What else?
maximiliano furtive, formerly known as dr. bloor
They’re apocalyptic nihilists, made in your own image. Own them, fucker.
Trollhattan
@Mark S.:
Per the Beeb, Senate vote is to be between 8:00 and 10:00, and the House vote at 10:00. I don’t know either their source or the veracity, but generally trust them to check things first.
aimai
@Soonergrunt: The important distinction is that they only object to government intrusion into the lives of good, heartland, white people. Intrusion into the lives of urban moochers and women is a good thing.
Cermet
@Yatsuno: Well, looks to be a done deal:
“Boehner said on WLW that he would “absolutely” bring the Senate bill to the floor. “
PaulW
In other news, Vikings are going to Josh Freeman to be their starting QB for the Monday Night game.
If he leads the offense well enough, this is just one more reason to #FireSchiano. There’s already nine other reasons.
Schiano Delenda Est
eemom
@srv:
omg……debt schmet…….this is the big news.
Would Cole really sell us to Greenwald?
aimai
@MattF: I guess they will go back to complaining that he’s an evil dictator, instead of an evil metrosexual wimp. Its full employment.
Dee Loralei
@srv: wow even John Cole of Balloon Juice? That’s kinda amusing in a folks heads will explode kinda way. Wonder if they are talking to Digby, or Driftglass? He needs to be much more widely read.
Ripley
GWM seeks hostile, narcissistic, self-deluded second-tiers for three-way. No pets, I’m allergic. Fatties okay. Dry-drunks encouraged.
lamh36
Joseph Nobles
Erick of the house of Erick noticed McConnell got an “earmark” for the Olmsted Lock and Dam in his district included in the debt deal bill. It is but to bwa.
piratedan
@eemom: that would be greatly disappointing if true
jenn
@srv: Bless you, thank you – after a stressful week at work, I burst out laughing at this. In fact, I’m still laughing. (That last part may be more exhaustion, though!)
Phil Perspective
@eemom: You do remember that Cole considers Greenwald a good friend, right?
sacrablue
@gussie: Try Ruemara.
burnspbesq
It’s been interesting to read the self-proclaimed “rational conservatives.”
I don’t doubt that Sullivan, Barro, Larison, and Dreher are entirely sincere in their disgust for the Republican’s behavior and their determination to vote for the Dems in 2014.
The problem is that that’s a total of four votes, and (optimistically) a couple of thousand others that they influence.
As the Defeatist Caucus is fond of reminding us, that’s not enough to flip the House, and we do face some institutional obstacles.
I am ducking and running away as I write this, but do we need to go through this again next year as a reminder to the low-information, short-memory millions that the Republicans hate them and want them to suffer?
Elizabelle
@srv:
Hey, it’s as well sourced as most of what you see on the ‘net and — sadly — in the majors.
MattF
@burnspbesq: Well, remember that elections are decided at the margin, by people who, at this moment, haven’t make up their minds. I know, it’s hard to imagine who, at this point, hasn’t make up their minds about teapartiers in particular and Republicans in general, but those are the people whose votes matter right now.
dmsilev
Shorter Erick son of Erick: “Now that we, the conservative movement, have collectively stuck our dick into a sausage grinder, LET’S DO IT AGAIN! EXCELSIOR!”
LanceThruster
I like how the fiscally responsible (cough!) thought it was somehow a better deal to pay people but *not* have the work get done. They must be also partial to farmers paid to not grow crops.
Comrade Dread
@srv: I hope not. I don’t think I could give Greenwald traffic.
nancy darling
@Soonergrunt: Is that 11:00 PM today or tomorrow?
dmsilev
@nancy darling: Tonight.
Comrade Dread
@burnspbesq: Assuming the bill passes and is signed, we’ll probably go through this same damn thing again come Jan/Feb 2014.
Whether that will be close enough to the Nov. election for folks to remember is another question. But I have faith that come Jan/Feb, they’ll probably just kick it all out another 2-3 months.
Higgs Boson's Mate (Crystal Set)
Hurry: Only 91 shopping days left until the next government shutdown!
Steeplejack
Redacted.
lamh36
@dmsilev:
piratedan
@Comrade Dread: agreed, has any crime been exposed other than that of Snowden’s himself? I have a hard time watching people who betray their country being labelled as whistleblowers.
Cervantes
“There are members with a different agenda,” Boustany said Wednesday in an interview in his office. “And I’m not sure they’re Republicans and I’m not sure they’re conservative.”
So does that mean he’s going to campaign against them?
geg6
@Comrade Dread:
Me, too. In fact, I won’t. I love me some John Cole and his critters, but I draw the line at giving Griftwald traffic. As for Hamsher, they’ve been fellow grifters from way back. They deserve each other
Jose Arcadio Buendía
Before you all get into the Reid-sold-us-out-on-“verification”-buyers’-remorse panic, read this actual bill. It’s a whole lotta nuthin. This is a win, enjoy it.
Pyrrhic victories don’t exist in politics.
gussie
@sacrablue: Thanks! It’s just a small job, but I figured better to try to keep it in the left …
cathyx
@piratedan: Can a country do something wrong and have it be ok for someone to whistleblow?
El Cid
@dmsilev: Erickson is seriously thinking about a third helping.
MikeJ
@Jose Arcadio Buendía: If we can’t say Obamasoldusouthe’sworththanBushthrewusunderthebus what’s the point in living?
Joseph Nobles
A link on the McConnell carveout for the locks and dam:
senateconservatives.com/site/post/2312/mcconnell-deal-includes-kentucky-kickback
Totally awesome.
Ash Can
I figured right off the bat that srv was snarking. But hey, it could be pretty amusing if, say, there were some reciprocity in the deal and Greenwald wrote guest columns here once in a while… On second thought, never mind. He’d insist upon having the comments turned off on his posts.
piratedan
@cathyx: yes, absolutely…. see Mandela, Thoreau, Ghandi, King et al… the idea is to point out what is wrong, make your stand in court… not flee the country and stay as the guest of the two nations that are your biggest rivals…
and yet… please feel free to point out the actual wrongdoing that Snowden/Greenwald have “uncovered”… don’t get me wrong, I’m not saying that there can’t be abuse and that abuse hasn’t happened, but I’ve yet to see anything that points out that this administration has willfully done something illegal, as stated by the provisions in the Patriot Act, perpetrated by the NSA in the documents that Greenwald and Snowden have stolen/released.
edit: Hell there are even protocols and procedures to be followed internally, that government employees have used to call out co-workers that abuse their positions
Roger Moore
@eemom:
YHBT. YHL. HAND.
burnspbesq
@piratedan:
Agreed. But that’s a different conversation than “is the Patriot Act good policy.” If anything, Snowden and Greenie have made it harder to have the conversation we should be having.
ranchandsyrup
going to hang out with these ladies tonight.
cathyx
@piratedan: To repeat the same points one more time, we don’t know if what they have done is illegal because the government swears to state secrets so it won’t go to court to be tried. Good way to keep a cover on illegal activity.
The example of what Manning has gone through is a clear example of what will happen when a whistleblower stays in the country.
There is no one who can be trusted internally to expose wrongdoing of this nature. The entire NSA is involved in the wrongdoing.
WereBear
Two crazy kids that will go crazy together!
Hilarity ensues.
piratedan
@burnspbesq: not arguing that point Burnsie, I’ve agreed on that all the way through, I just find it ironic, that the administration that changed the blank check version of the Patriot Act into supporting one with some checks and balances into it is the one being called out onto the carpet of abusing our trust. Just like the debt monkeys only come out of the woodwork when there’s a D in charge. The changes that were made to the original act took place in that whilrwind of 2 years of productivity with a Dem controlled Congress, what the hell has anyone been expecting to take place over the last five years is beyond me. Perhaps if the NSA was being used to keep pregnant single mothers from abortion clinics we might have something.
Emma
@burnspbesq: Yes. That’s the hard part and the one we keep missing.
piratedan
@cathyx: you’re missing the point… Manning wasn’t a whistleblower either… what he did was a data dump of confidential materiel… You want to cite the attack perpetrated by NATO forces that “show” an armed response against “unarmed civilians”, then you have to show the entire clip, not just the one edited and presented by Wikileaks.
You guys keep thinking that Assange is some kind of benevolent force of good, I don’t see him that way. A force of change, perhaps.
cathyx
@piratedan: No, you miss the point. Would any sane person subject themselves to the treatment that Manning went through?
Keith G
@burnspbesq:
That conversation had ample time to get started pre Snowden. Very few wanted to start it since it involved so many inconvenient truths (Sorry Al).
piratedan
@cathyx: well for one thing, Manning didn’t turn themselves (sorry for the pronoun confusion, I’m not looking to judge based on the former Private’s gender issues) in…. doesn’t that essentially define what a whistle blower is? Someone they were confiding in, turned her (lets go with that for now) into the authorities.
Omnes Omnibus
@Keith G: The Snowden leaks did jumpstart interest in the issue. However, look at what happens on this blog during any discussion of surveillance. It inevitably descends into personalities. That is what burnsie meant, I think.
GHayduke (formerly lojasmo)
@srv:
-GG
This should be exciting.
A Humble Lurker
@cathyx:
Doesn’t make it okay, but wasn’t that the reason what happened to Manning happened to him and wouldn’t necessarily happen to say, Snowden?
GHayduke (formerly lojasmo)
@LanceThruster:
Eh. My sister works for the SSA, and she’s been working unpaid throughout the furlough.
White Trash Liberal
@Dee Loralei:
Lol @ Driftglass
He has been raking Greenwald over the coals for a couple months. There us no way Our Man Glenn would approach him.
cathyx
@A Humble Lurker: Would you be willing to test if if you were a whistleblower?
danielx
Floating in a river of schadenfreude…and yes, it’s ever so delightful. I’ve been wondering since 2010 when it was that B. Barry Bamz would learn that you cannot negotiate with people who do not regard your election as legitimate.
It would appear that he has finally figured it out.
Omnes Omnibus
@cathyx: Read this.
Keith G
@Omnes Omnibus:
Omnes Omnibus
@Keith G: As well it should. People should get cocker spaniels or Boston terriers. Perhaps a French bulldog or Newfie in a pinch.
AxelFoley
@geg6:
This here. If Cole teams up with Griftwald, I’m out. Not that I’ll be missed, but fuck it. I refuse to give that scum any traffic.
SiubhanDuinne
@Mark S.:
Dinner reservations at Tortilla Coast.
A Humble Lurker
@cathyx:
Sure. I don’t have the skills or someone to pay for my journey away from but not back home like Greenwald, though.
burnspbesq
@Omnes Omnibus:
Not quite sure I follow your argument here. Subsection (a)(2) pretty clearly takes Manning outside the scope of the protection provided by subsection (a)(1), since he violated at least a half dozen parts of Title 18 by grabbing the stuff he disclosed. Or is your point that if he had gone to Congress with the stuff he grabbed (and thereby, at least arguably, not violated some or all of those parts of Title 18), he would have been protected?
SiubhanDuinne
@Higgs Boson’s Mate (Crystal Set):
I’m just looking forward to the 2014 SOTU. Should be epic.
Omnes Omnibus
@burnspbesq: Manning could have gone to an anti-war Congressperson with info if he had evidence of, for example, a war crime. He would have been protected. He chose a different route.
SiubhanDuinne
@ranchandsyrup: Gorgeous ladies are gorgeous. Proud big sister is proud. Cute baby is cute.
Omnes Omnibus
@Omnes Omnibus: @burnspbesq: To clarify: Manning had routes by which he could have been a whistleblower and not violated any laws. He did not follow those routes. Also, FWIW, if had had pursued those routes and been rebuffed, I would have much more sympathy for his decision to publicly release the info. As a matter of fact, if had tried and been rebuffed and then chose to release evidence of a crime, waste, or fraud, I would applaud his actions.
gwangung
@cathyx: I’d be a lot smarter about it and not include extraneous material and stuff that was obviously legal.
As you yourself admit, you have no idea if what they did pointed to anything illegal. It’s not clear to me that you understand what the technical capabilities are and what they imply.
GHayduke (formerly lojasmo)
@cathyx:
This very matter has actually been litigated at the SCOTUS level. Fuck off.
Soonergrunt
@Omnes Omnibus: this.
AxelFoley
@danielx:
You still haven’t figured out you’re an asswipe.
Bill Arnold
Looking good so far for Booker/NJ: booker_vs_lonegan_county-by-county_voting_results_in_us_senate_election
PopeRatzo
@GHayduke (formerly lojasmo):
So has Citizens United. So was Plessy v Ferguson. So was Dred Scott and Bush v Gore.
So maybe you should also give some consideration to fucking off.
Paul in KY
@Ash Can: Glenn always had a very lively comments section when he wrote for Salon. Sometimes way crazier than a good BJ thread (and generally with 500 – 800 comments per story).
Paul in KY
@ranchandsyrup: Very photogenic family!
Paul in KY
@cathyx: I don’t think Pvt Manning thought that part of it through very well…