If you buy DougJ’s theory that Northeastern politicians are too abrasive for general consumption, and I do, isn’t the New Jersey bridge closing the perfect torpedo to sink Chris Christie’s battleship? In case you missed it, one of his toadies shut down two of the three inbound lanes on the George Washington bridge to punish Fort Lee, NJ for voting Democratic:
Mr. Christie laughed off the idea that he had been involved in a matter as small as closing bridge lanes, and his chief appointee at the Port Authority of New York and New Jersey, which oversees the bridge, insisted that the lane closings were simply part of a traffic study.
But on Friday, the man who ordered the closings — a high school friend of the governor’s who was a small-town mayor and the founder of an anonymous political blog before Mr. Christie’s appointee created a job for him at the Port Authority — resigned, saying the issue had become “a distraction.”
And testifying under subpoena in Trenton on Monday, bridge workers described Mr. Christie’s associates’ ordering the closings, and called the different maneuvers “unprecedented,” “odd” and “wrong.” There was, they said, no study.
Steve Benen has more here. The obvious question, if anyone at the endless Republican debates has the kidney to ask it, is how Christie plans on punishing states that don’t vote for him for President.
Baud
Including New Jersey!
donnah
WTF? If this turns out to be true, and Christie orderd everyone downstream to close those lanes strictly as his idea of payback, then fuck him straight to hell. Emergency crews were delayed, people were stuck in traffic for hours, and the additional danger associated with that kind of backup is a risk no one should have taken.
This shit just burns me up. If it’s true, then this story should run on the national news. Christie should be facing criminal charges.
dedc79
I thought he was finished back when he turned down federal money to build another (much-needed) train tunnel between NYC and NJ just because shut up that’s why. Sadly, I don’t see this new story making much of a difference.
Zam
Why would they do that? Fucking over liberals is part of the GOP platform, he’d have a guaranteed victory if word got out on this.
Bobby Thomson
@Baud: Oh, that’s easy. He’ll stay there after he loses.
I wouldn’t put it past the Outlaw Jersey Whale (h/t TBogg) to be spiteful, but this story doesn’t make sense.
Ash Can
Ronald Reagan began the practice of punishing groups of American citizens for not voting for him, and the Republicans have been doing it ever since. The only difference here is that the people in charge of carrying out the punishment were too inept to successfully cover their tracks.
daveNYC
A lot of finance people come in over the GW too. Christie is managing to piss off both voters and mega-donors.
Bob
“Maybe it is just me, but why don’t more Democrats talk like that- forceful, in your face, etc.” John Cole on Gov. Christie
See, not abrasive, merely ‘in your face.”
MattF
There’s a nice delicacy factor here too, a fine difference between a millifuckyou and a microfuckyou. I guess the typical commuter was supposed to think “Now I’m stuck in traffic and it’s because I’m a Democrat.” Nixonian, in a way.
Davis X. Machina
@Bob:
Scott Walker, if he can stay out of jail, and/or keep his chief of staff out of jail, is the one to watch out for.
He’s got the whole ‘fightin’ general against America’s real enemies — public employees’ thing down.
All of those wonderful beggar-my-neighbor more, crab bucket politics, without the Jersey affect.
Patrick
Personally, I can’t understand why anyone would vote for him in the first place:
Mr. Christie, the governor of New Jersey, took a State Police helicopter to see his son play high school baseball on Tuesday. And whether that is important or trivial, it surely did not help the image of a conservative Republican who has won national notice for preaching belt-tightening and berating those who resist.
http://www.nytimes.com/2011/06/02/nyregion/christie-fields-criticism-for-state-helicopter-trip.html?_r=0
John Dillinger
Better yet, his opposition in the primaries can couch the accusations in terms of “we’ve had 8 years of this Chicago-style politics, governor, . . . “
JPL
@donnah: The news media is to busy reporting on things of national importance, such as the President’s hand shake.
Patrick
@JPL:
Don’t forget the even bigger scandal. Apparently the selfi-gate is the biggest scandal of any US President.
Omnes Omnibus
@Davis X. Machina: I may be being elitist here but I doubt that a Marquette University dropout who can’t break 50% approval in his own state is going to be a factor in the ’16 election.
Jamey
Yeah, because Christie and his team of ratfuckers can’t possibly reverse-engineer a sound-bite with only 36 months’ lead-time…
beth
How do you do a traffic study if you’ve closed most of the lanes? Don’t you need to actually have moving traffic in order to study it?
Biff Longbotham
“… if anyone at the endless Republican debates has the kidney to ask it,…”
Ha! You said ‘kidney’.
dmsilev
OT: Deep Thoughts from a Fox-bot:
Racism aside, it appears that Ms. Kelly’s parents are a couple of decades overdue in sitting their daughter down and having a little chat about where the presents under the tree actually come from.
Biff Longbotham
@Ash Can: Examples, please?
catclub
@Patrick: Christie also apparently took _substantial_ liberties on expense accounts when he was a US attorney. (Assistant US Atty?)
hildebrand
@dmsilev: Somebody needs to alert this clueless person that Jesus would have looked like a Palestinian, or anybody else from the Levant. Not, shockingly, like one of my ancestors from Northumbria or Cumbria.
Patricia Kayden
I can’t imagine Christie winning the Presidency as too many T’Baggers hate his guts and he wouldn’t get past the Republican primary.
Making traffic more difficult for a region that did not vote for him is so petty and thuggish that it shows that he is nowhere close to being Presidential. New Jersey can keep him.
Snarki, child of Loki
Oh, that’s easy. The states that vote for him? He’ll visit them and press the flesh.
The states that voted against him? He’ll go TWICE.
Cervantes
He did say that, more or less, as he consigned Christie to oblivion — but in the same breath his theory held out plenty of hope for Kirsten Gillibrand and Hillary Clinton, who are also, one supposes, Northeastern politicians.
Leaving aside Barney Frank, Howard Dean, Chuck Schumer, Andrew Cuomo, Rudy Giuliani, et al., I suppose one could still contemplate the abrasiveness and national potential of Scott Brown or Deval Patrick, but other than that …
Cacti
I think the closer we get to primary season, the more it’s going to dribble out that Christie fits the profile of a typical, sleazy New Jersey politician.
Davis X. Machina
@Omnes Omnibus: Your faith in your fellow man is touching. Walker’s not as big a dick as Dick. And we elected him twice.
(Old NatLampoon: Nixon’s the one! And in ’72 he’ll be an even bigger one!)
Cervantes
@dmsilev: Mit der Dummheit kämpfen Götter selbst vergebens.
handsmile
@Omnes Omnibus:
You have the audacity to cite Peter Weiss on a thread about musicals and you may be an elitist?
(only came across that bit of genius a short while ago. muchos kudos!)
Omnes Omnibus
@Cervantes:
Let us contemplate the number of presidential nominations in that bunch. Also, if you go back and read DougJ’s post, he did not say that all northeastern politicians are anathema elsewhere. Rather, he pointed out that a confrontational, “in your face” style plays better in the northeast than elsewhere. He also suggests that Christie has too much of it to go far nationally, while Gillibrand does not.
mike with a mic
I’m curious as to why what Christie did is wrong? Politics is war by other means, you have to weaponize it. In politics the winner gets to force their culture forwards and crush the others value system and call them all bigots/unpatriotic. You also get to raid the coffers, take money from other groups, and see to it that your people get paid.
Using your political office to pay off your supporters and hound your enemies is a time honored tradition, especially in major cities and NE areas. If you aren’t wielding political office as a weapon at your enemies and using it as a cash cow for your supporters you simply won’t last.
Paul in KY
That stunt (and others) might torpedo him being elected president, but that is red meat to the kinds of assholes who nominate Repubs for Pres.
Hal
How about the 4 million Christie spent on a commercial featuring him and his family? Forget about the people in need. Christie had a campaign to run, I mean, a state to save. Not like that money could have gone to hurricane victims anyway.
Amir Khalid
No. The other candidates will claim, “I will punish them Democrat voters worse than Christie would dare!!elebenty!!
AliceBlue
@Omnes Omnibus:
The fact that Scott Walker looks like Gomer Pyle’s long lost cousin isn’t going to help him either.
Cervantes
In case you missed it, the lane closings occurred in September whereas Christie’s re-election occurred in November.
(The actual accusation being made is that Christie and/or his cronies were punishing not the voters but the mayor of Fort Lee (a Democrat) for not endorsing Christie in his re-election bid. If true, exceedingly stupid.)
Cacti
@AliceBlue:
And of course, the commercials practically write themselves for Chris Christie. A morbidly obese man talking about the need for sacrifice and belt tightening.
Omnes Omnibus
@mike with a mic: He is supposed to be the running the administrative branch of the NJ government for the benefit of the people of NJ. There is a difference between politics and governing.
AdamK
I think northeastern Republicans fail nationally not because they’re abrasive, but because the base ain’t votin fer no Yankee.
Cervantes
@Omnes Omnibus:
Yes, hence the “more or less” in my response to the paraphrase by dpm.
Thanks.
handsmile
@Amir Khalid:
Precisely. Not only that, but the criminal-coddling Christie failed to instruct his state troopers to stop all vehicles on the one lane that remained open to check for illegal immigrants.
Scott Walker, Rand Paul and the other passengers in the 2016 klown kar kavalcade would never be so permissive. Nor would they hug the Kenyan.
Certified Mutant Enemy
@hildebrand:
Also, the historical Jesus was very different than the Christ of faith…
opiejeanne
@donnah: There is no traffic study that requires closing two lanes of a road, according to my Civil Engineer husband who has ordered many, many traffic studies in his 40 years as a professional engineer.
Paul in KY
@Omnes Omnibus: Scott Walker appears (to me) to be as smarmy as Rick Satanum. I think he’s much more cunning than Satanum, though.
aimai
@Cervantes: Hillary Clinton, famously, is midwestern in origin and sensibility.
rea
@beth: How do you do a traffic study if you’ve closed most of the lanes?
The linked article says that the traffic study was to find out what would happen to traffic if they closed most of the lanes.
Paul in KY
@dmsilev: Man! That is fucked up. If the real, historical Jesus showed up & said hello to Ms. Kelly, she’d shreik that a dirty Arab is in here & have him thrown out of the building.
catclub
@Paul in KY: He also won re-election. (in the most favorable possible situation, but still better than losing by a record margin in ones own state.)
GHayduke (formerly lojasmo)
@Cervantes:
Know how I know you’ve never met Howard Dean?
snoey
@mike with a mic:
Payback is supposed to have a point, or at least be related to the offense.
When Capuano was mayor of Somerville he had a problem getting a park funded, so when they were replanting street trees the wards of the problem councillors got skipped. Some angry phone calls later the park budget was approved and everybody got their trees.
Omnes Omnibus
@catclub: He did not win reelection. He survived a recall election. There is a difference.
Petorado
“Nice bridge you got there. It’d be a shame if something were to happen to it.”
Paul in KY
@catclub: Good point, Catclub. I Would like to know: Who is the last man to win the Presidency, yet lose their ‘claimed’ home state?
I say this because if Walker got GOP nod, there’s a damned good chance he’d lose Wisconsin. As Christie would probably lose NJ.
Cervantes
@GHayduke (formerly lojasmo):
Philosophically speaking, that’s not a thing you can know.
My first list (Barney Frank, et al.) was a list of Northeastern politicians whose abrasiveness and national potential we no longer need to contemplate because they are not going anywhere at this point. The second list (Brown and Patrick) was, well, you see it now, I am sure.
And yes, for what it’s worth: I like the good doctor.
dmsilev
@Paul in KY: Al Gore came within a hair’s breadth of managing that.
Mandalay
As an interesting aside, someone in the comments section of an NYT editorial on this issue claimed that the NYT blocks reader comments on Christie that refer to his weight, and that seems to be true.
Most (but not all) comments about Christie that reference his weight are likely worthless, but surely that is for the readers rather than the NYT to decide.
Mandalay
As an interesting aside, someone in the comments section of an NYT editorial on this issue claimed that the NYT blocks reader comments on Christie that refer to his weight, and that seems to be true.
Most (but not all) comments about Christie that reference his weight are likely worthless, but surely that is for the readers rather than the NYT to decide.
piratedan
@Mandalay: well my problems with him have little to do with his weight and more with the fact that he appears to be a vindictive asshole who has slight moderating tendencies of not being completely politically stupid.
Cervantes
@aimai: Hillary Clinton, famously, is midwestern in origin and sensibility.
Sure, if you don’t count the parts of her sensibility that were formed at Yale, in DC, in Little Rock, and then in DC again, then I agree.
But do people think of her as a Midwestern or a Northeastern politician? I suppose(d) the latter.
Paul in KY
@dmsilev: I know! Should’ve accomplished that honor. Has there been one? I bet there has, but might be a 19th century person.
Roxy
@Certified Mutant Enemy: As some christians seem to forget, Jesus was Jewish.
kindness
Why spend energy on Christie? He will NEVER get through the Republican primary process. He really serves more to instigate fighting among Republicans. Why not stand back and enjoy the show?
Really if Christie ever did get the nomination for president which he never will, there are too many things in his closet to keep him from being elected.
Aji
@Cervantes: Neither. Beltway.
Roger Moore
@dmsilev:
FTFY.
scav
@Paul in KY: And if he came with the historic Saint Nicholas, the Greek / Turkish Bishop?! horrors!
(wait til she stumbles on rumours of him being the child of a rich man and obeying that other jesus and giving all his money away to help the sick and poor! No wonder he ended up eventually depicted as wearing red after corporate scrubbing, the commie-socialist moocher-enabler!)
Aji
@Paul in KY: No, she’d have him held for Homeland Security, and when they decided the guy was basically a harmless social justice type and declined to Gitmo him, she’d start shrieking again for impeachment.
Belafon
OT: According to Newsmax, the EPA closed the last ammo maker. I’m not going to click on the link at work, but I wonder if the subtitle is something like “Civil War Reenactment gunpowder manufacturer required to use less lead in powder” or some crap like that.
aimai
@Cervantes: I’m not forgetting Yale and etc… but she always presented herself as a foursquare midwestern, episcopalian, square during her earlier presentations of self. No one thinks of her as Southern at all. And as for the Yale thing she comes out of a much earlier tradition in which upper class wonks went to North eastern schools without that disturbing their essential midwesternism. I doubt if anyone identifies her with New York at all despite the fact that she has lived there and served as a Senator. She represents a white bread view from nowhere. Only the collapse of the entire country into heartland vs everywhere else puts her in a specifically Northeastern/elitist category. But I think she still comes across as very dowdy and midwestern in affect and presentation.
Jim, Foolish Literalist
@Omnes Omnibus: I’m Scottie-skeptic on a national level, but I thought he was pretty solidly above 50% approval all through the recall, and won re-election pretty easily?
I think all these other candidates and their brewing scandals depend on how badly Ted Cruz wants the nomination and thinks he can win the general— Rand Paul I just can’t take seriously.
Belafon
@dmsilev: A diarist on DK made an good point: She wants Santa to be white because he’s based on some historical Greek figure and we must follow history, but when it comes to Jesus, not so much on the history. Yeah, yeah, the diarist and I both know about consistency, and how Fox doesn’t really need it.
BobbyThomson
@Cervantes: That makes a little more sense, but I still don’t see how it punishes the mayor. I realize this is the Chewbacca defense, but still, here we are.
Cervantes
@Paul in KY:
You don’t have to go back that far.
If you count candidates by where they officially lived at the time of their candidacy, then Nixon in 1968 did not carry his home state of New York; and Wilson in 1916 did not carry New Jersey. (They did both carry the states in which they were born — California and Virginia, respectively.)
And then there’s Al Gore, of course.
Jamey
@Omnes Omnibus: I think he was being all a-snark…
catclub
@Omnes Omnibus: I am sure Walker is careful to point this out every time he crows about beating back the union hordes.
Belafon
@Jim, Foolish Literalist: There were a number of Democrats that voted for Walker because they didn’t think the recall was valid. They didn’t support him, just the recall. His recall vote, in other words, should not be considered equal to his support.
beth
@Belafon: I actually read it when someone posted it on Facebook. The EPA made the last lead smelter for ammo close due to environmental concerns but ammo manufacturers have plenty of recycled lead they can use to make ammo. The person who posted it on Facebook didn’t even bother to read the article; just posted it with some comment like “Obama isn’t going to take our guns, he’ll just close all the ammo makers” which I think is exactly the response Newsmax wanted. I don’t think they actually want anyone to read their articles.
Mandalay
@Cervantes:
She can be whatever you want her to be. She is shameless.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_detailpage&v=YaDQ1vIuvZI
http://www.hark.com/clips/vfqtjptvpx-hillary-fake-southern-accent
Mandalay
@Cervantes:
She can be whatever you want her to be. She is shameless.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_detailpage&v=YaDQ1vIuvZI
http://www.hark.com/clips/vfqtjptvpx-hillary-fake-southern-accent
gogol's wife
@Omnes Omnibus: @handsmile:
I left him a message about that — I didn’t see it until this morning. I worked on props for a production of that very charming musical at a certain liberal-arts college in the frozen wastes that Omnes and I both have experience with. I would love to see it live on NBC, starring Christina Aguilera and Blake Shelton!
BobbyThomson
@BobbyThomson: OK. I guess I should have read the article. I read Doug’s post as saying that two lanes on the bridge were closed, which would just back up I-95 traffic. It’s actually entrance ramps that were closed.
Belafon
@beth: Thanks.
Roger Moore
@Belafon:
I’m at home and not afraid of clicking on NoiseMax posts. It’s actually a lead smelter that’s been shut down, and even NoiseMax is willing to quote people saying that it will have no effect on ammunition prices or availability.
Just Some Fuckhead, Thought Leader
America’s hatred of traffic is only surpassed by her love of Chris Christie. It takes a big man to create a massive traffic snarl that inconveniences drivers and endangers lives. It takes a bigger man to ferret out who is responsible for this travesty. Chris Christie is the bigger man! He will find out who to blame and make sure they are held accountable.
gogol's wife
@opiejeanne:
The explanation in the Times was hilarious. Something like, they wanted to see how much traffic there was per lane so they closed two lanes in order to calculate the difference.
Cervantes
@aimai:
Sure, I think her years at Wellesley and Yale were important — but I can see where you’re coming from. And Aji, too, who thinks of Clinton as neither Midwestern nor Northeastern but “Beltway” — after all, Clinton has spent an awful lot of time in DC, as far back as the Watergate era.
“A white bread view from nowhere.” Would that fit on a bumper-sticker? I wonder.
Cervantes
@BobbyThomson:
It punishes the mayor if that’s whom the locals blame for it. (The truth may eventually come out but by then the damage to the mayor is done.)
Or so the thinking would have gone.
scav
@Belafon: Supposedly this is an actual forensic archeaological reconstruction of Saint Nicholas, BBC2, Disco channel and all, so TeeVee certified for Miss Must not depart from uncomfortable historical fact Kelly. Luckily, as this is actual history, she can probably hold out for a different tomb of more Coca-Cola inspired pale relics if this isn’t a face she wants past immigration.
Paul in KY
@scav: Never thought of Santa being a Commie! It was right there in front of me: Red suit, beard, collectivist elves who he controls ‘Dictatorship of the elvetariat’.
Man, that is gonna blow her 3 amp mind when she figures it all out…
Paul in KY
@Aji: That would be bad if she did. Can you imagine having done a full body cavity search on Jesus on your soul?
Yea, I cameth before you and thou dideth stick thy fingers into my buttocks…
handsmile
@gogol’s wife:
Not to derail the momentum of this thread (because few topics are more alluring than potential 2016 GOP presidential candidates), but…
Lucky you! It is so very charming! Indeed, fun for the whole family!
I assume Ms. Aguilera in the role of Mlle. Cordray, but Mr. Shelton (no idea who he is other than what Wikipedia just told me and I still don’t know) portraying which title character? And whom for the other?
I imagine your semester must have or is about to be shuttered for the season, so I do hope you’ll consider forwarding this superb idea and casting suggestions to Roger Greenblatt and the other culture-merchants at NBC. Bonne chance!
ETA: Let me add, when I was a student at a certain school in Middletown, CT, I directed a production of Peter Handke’s “Insulting the Audience.” So I know about theatrical charm!
Paul in KY
@Cervantes: That is why I said ‘claimed’, as I know Nixon always claimed Calidornia as home state. Maybe Wilson ‘claimed’ New Jersey at time. Would have to read up on that.
Thank you for checking on that.
Paul in KY
@Belafon: We call those folks ‘stupid-ass Democrats’. The recall was happening. If you want that dick out of office (and anyone claiming to be a ‘Democrat’ would), then here’s your chance.
Gene108
@Paul in KY:
Christie only loses NJ to Hillary. He beats all other Democrats handily.
If Boehner et al can get the right-wing howler monkeys to STFU and Republican candidates do not have get embroiled WRT “legitimate rape” comments from their own party, you could have a stronger contender for the Presidency than many want to admit.
Obama’s wins were squeakers in comparison to Republican wins in 1980, 1984, and 1988, but the right set of circumstances and the right candidate got the Democrats the Presidency in 1992.
Aji
@Paul in KY: [Shudder] [Calls for brain bleach]
Surely that would get her, shall we say, an extra warm spot in a lower circle?
gogol's wife
@handsmile:
I was thinking of Shelton for Marat. It was a succès de scandale at our performances when he rose from the bath (back to the audience).
I’m in the middle of grading final papers. Hence my ubiquity on BJ.
I’m sorry I missed the Handke!
gogol's wife
@Gene108:
Sorry, I do not for a minute think that Christie is a strong contender for the presidency. Or even the nomination.
muricafukyea
Guess wr0ng way Cole is going to have to wait till this dies down before he posts another one of his fat bastard Christie love letters. Back to regurgitating Griftwald implanted thoughts for now.
KG
@dmsilev: she’s probably confusing Santa Claus for St. Nicholas, which is common. But she’s talking, so I’m guessing she’s confused, that seems to be her shtick. As for the race of Jesus and St. Nicholas – neither would probably fit the contemporary conservative American definition of “white”… Not that they’d care
schrodinger's cat
@gogol’s wife: I have to agree, he won’t make it past the crazies in the primaries.
GregB
@Gene108:
Please check your facts.
George H.W. vs. Clinton was 43.0% 37.5%.
Clinton vs. Dole was 49.2% 40.7%.
Obama vs. McCain in 2008 was 52.9% 45.7%.
George H.W. Bush vs. Dukakis was 53.4% 45.7%.
Please explain again which elections are squeakers and which ones are blowouts?
Belafon
The “contemporary conservative American definition of ‘white'” is another definition for mirror.
Cervantes
@Paul in KY:
In the 1968 election Nixon’s declared home state was New York. During the Republican primary season, he was not even on the ballot in California. (The Republican primaries were nicely complicated that year for Nixon: both Governor Reagan (California) and Governor Rockefeller (New York) were running.)
Elizabelle
Bridges, tunnels and Chris Christie’s prospects bore me.
Release the Gail Collins. Republicans Running in Reverse.
They gots a problem with the wimmens. Among others.
Paul in KY
@Gene108: I don’t think he ‘beats all other Democrats handily’. Certainly there are some he would beat. I don’t think he beats VP Biden, for example.
burnspbesq
I don’t see how this story doesn’t disappear down the memory hole long before the first debate among contenders for the Republican nomination.
If the District of NJ had a politically ambitious, Dem-leaning U.S. Attorney, the answer might be different, but Fishman doesn’t appear to be that guy.
Elizabelle
More Gail Collins, today:
I’m not sure “evolved” is the proper word here.
Paul in KY
@Cervantes: He actually said ‘I’m a New Yorker’? He was born in Cali, was a congressman & senator from Cali…
you see where I’m coming from here?
handsmile
@gogol’s wife:
Re Handke
Encourage one of your students to stage a new production. Such classics are evergreen for revival. And now! More than ever! (as the hucksters bark) What was once an avant-garde strategy has become, from my perspective, the Standard Operating Procedure of Hollywood’s (and Broadway’s) Kulturindustrie.
My sympathies on your current task which so often leads to profound questions on one’s choice of vocation.
Bill E Pilgrim
We’ve been engaged in “awesomely destructive austerity”, according to the shrill bearded Cassandra. (This guy, in panel four. )
Paul in KY
@burnspbesq: It is the Democratic nominee’s responsibility to dredge it up if Gov Cheesesteak gets the Repub nomination.
Paul in KY
@Elizabelle: Of course, Sen. Smith would be a Democrat today.
Cervantes
@Paul in KY:
I do see where you’re coming from. Not only was he born in CA and had been elected to DC repeatedly from there, he had also run for Governor there.
And yet, when he declared in ’68, it was from New York. Then when he filed for re-election in ’72, it was from CA again.
patrick II
I think Christie is a strong candidate for the republican nomonation because is the candidate that will have big money behind him. Not just the easternmoney, but the Koch money as well. They wanted him to run last time. In the end, money will decide the repub nomination. I also believe Iin political dialectics where people vote for a personality type different than the one they have grown tired od. The blustery Christie will stand his best chance, particularly with independents, after people have grown tired of the calm, analytical Obama.
Paul in KY
@Bill E Pilgrim: Thanks for the link, Bill. Hope you & your family have a great Holiday season!
Gene108
@gogol’s wife:
Might not be Christie per se, but if the pros in the Republican Party can rein in the base a bit by 2016, so the Republican nominee does not have any crazy statements from fellow Republicans like “legitimate rape” or “keep an aspirin between your knees” as a form of birth control to distance himself from or has to make crazy statements in the primaries beyond a “wink and nod” to states rights, ending big government, etc, I think a good many Obama voters who voted for him because of Palin and other RWNJ’s made him the lesser of two evils may give the Republican their vote.
I think Boehner telling right-wing groups to stuff it on the budget deal is a step in that direction.
Paul in KY
@Cervantes: He did win California in 68, right?
MattF
@GregB: I looked up Obama’s winning margins the other day and was surprised at how badly he beat both McCain and Romney. How did it happen that everyone’s either forgotten that or never knew it in the first place?
schrodinger's cat
@Elizabelle: They bore me too but Christie has many fans among the demographic that thinks NSA and the Snowden story is the most important thing evah.
Elizabelle
@Bill E Pilgrim:
Was cruising Politico (I know, I know) for an item. Saw Rich Lowry column — something about “the left’s reality problem” — illustrated with a pic of K Thug.
They have really lost it, no?
schrodinger's cat
BTW Austerity Cat has returned with the Budget Battles.
Cervantes
@Paul in KY: In the general, yes. But in the primary, Reagan won the state.
Elizabelle
@schrodinger’s cat:
Yeah. That bores the bejusus out of me too. Some days B Juice is a parody of itself. Quite a bit, lately.
(She says, as she checks in every 20 mins or so while online … readership capture. Like being addicted to sugar.)
schrodinger's cat
@Elizabelle: That has been Starburst Lowry’s problem for quite sometime.
Marc McKenzie
Baroni’s damned lucky that his stunt hasn’t resulted (so far) in a maddened crowd storming his house and hanging him from a tree.
Lex
Interesting what comes out when you start issuing subpoenas to everyone involved. Maybe we should do a little more of that.
aimai
@Gene108: Christie “Somethin’s goin’ down tonight honey but its not me…” is not above or below a massive, sexist gaffe.
gogol's wife
@handsmile:
Actually, some of them are restoring my faith in my profession. They’re good kids and so smart. They tend to really get it together for the last paper, which they can focus on without having classes going on. So I’m enjoying it — but I need to take frequent breaks!
GregB
@MattF:
The wrong people voted for him, their votes don’t really count.
Jim, Foolish Literalist
Um…. Can I get a resounding “ew” from the congregation?
I don’t know a lot about MC Smith, but I don’t think that “evolution” could have happened without the cooperative passivity of alleged and self-styled “maverick” Olympia Snowe
gogol's wife
@Jim, Foolish Literalist:
I have to tell my husband that Margaret Chase Smith got mentioned on BJ. She’s his idol.
burnspbesq
@schrodinger’s cat:
I’ve been willing to cut Rattner some slack, because he did a fairly amazing job overseeing the GM/Chrysler bailout, but my patience is wearing thin.
tybee
@Paul in KY:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=17gKw_j6Qq0
Jim, Foolish Literalist
The fact that he got away with that one is pretty depressing. No matter how cynical you get, you can’t keep up.
divF
@Elizabelle:
This isn’t as condescending as it sounds, given the age difference, and in some midwestern way a mark of respect. My SIL is a senior designer of semiconductor equipment, and typically has a bunch of younglings the same age as her son working for her. They know they have seriously screwed up in some way when, as they put it, “she starts using the ‘Mom’ voice”, and will immediately straighten things out.
handsmile
@Elizabelle:
Thanks for that link/excerpts. Since her epic “dog-on-roof” series on Romney, Gail Collins has established herself as a National Living Treasure. I know of no more trenchantly witty columnist at any other major (off-line) news publication.
As for the cowardly former Senator Olympia Snowe – who fled from an expected 2012 Tea Party primary challenge while bewailing Washington’s “incivility” – perhaps BJ Mainers like MomSense, RedShirt or DXM would know of her public statements on the issue of biological evolution.
schrodinger's cat
@burnspbesq: He has been a big cheerleader for austerity, for a while now.
ETA: I do agree with you about the GM turn around.
MattF
…and, on the rare occasion when your hopeful side thinks, “Well, maybe once in a blue moon, it’s not about race”, you get something like this:
http://talkingpointsmemo.com/livewire/columnist-blasts-obama-for-acting-like-hormone-ravaged-frat-boy-at-mandela-service
Danish cupcakes, anyone?
slippy
@beth:
I don’t think your typical Newsmax “reader” is actually “literate” in the sense that they have a high-school vocabulary and capability to actually read what’s put in front of them.
So, no, I don’t think Newsmax expects most of their runny shit to be read either, just the headlines to foment outrage.
schrodinger's cat
@MattF:
I get my dose of racist and misogynist bile from the Thinking Housewife, which I initially thought was a parody.
Jim, Foolish Literalist
@schrodinger’s cat: If it weren’t Rattner, it would be Ed Rendell, if it weren’t Ed Rendell, it would be Evan Bayh (refreshingly quiet since leaving office, even if that quiet probably covers nefarious lobbying), if it weren’t Bayh, it would be Blanche Lincoln, if it weren’t Lincoln, it would be Erskine Bowles… no shortage of Dems eager to flog austerity, unfortunately. More than a few currently holding office.
schrodinger's cat
@Jim, Foolish Literalist: Oh I know, its a lie that never dies. Yesterday’s Newshour they had 3 people to discuss the budget, and all three were promoters of austerity. They had Rattner, Holtz-Eakin and some chick from Heritage, who was clearly just there to recite the talking points.
MattF
@schrodinger’s cat: Oh, my. So, having a female CEO of General Motors is “an outrage against male authority and against female dignity.”
KG
@divF: yeah, I didnt think much of it either. But maybe I watch too much BBC where women in senior or supervisory positions are called “mum” rather than “sir”.
Villago Delenda Est
@muricafukyea:
derp
derp derp
derp derp DERP!
Villago Delenda Est
@KG:
“mum” being the Brit pronunciation of “ma’am”, which is the standard way that female officers in the US military are addressed in lieu of “sir”.
Jim, Foolish Literalist
Oh dear lord. Luke Russert referring to “the kids I went to school with… finance guys” while discussing Republican attitudes toward unemployment benefits.
ETA: in fairness, I should say he was criticizing their MOU 47% attitude, but the lack of self-awareness is hard to watch
Omnes Omnibus
@Jim, Foolish Literalist: The last polling I saw on Walker was from mid-November and put him at 49%.
Davis X. Machina
@handsmile: Snowe could have won a three-way race as an independent with over 50% of the vote. I don’t think she ran away from anything. The state GOP apparatus that’s actually pushing back against LePage is the creature of her and her husband, Jock McKernan, former GOP governor.
Cacti
@aimai:
Christie “Somethin’s goin’ down tonight honey but its not me…” is not above or below a massive, sexist gaffe.
Why I can’t take Christie seriously as presidential contender is remarks like that.
The GOP has a huge image problem with women voters, who just happen to be the single biggest demographic in the presidential election. Christie is as right wing as a Mississippi Congressman on reproductive choice issues, and he’s liable at any moment to pop off with comments like the above.
Also too, Mitt Romney got about as much of the white vote as humanly possible (59% total, 56% of white women) and still got drubbed. Which of the GOP-pariah demographics is going to cross over in sufficient numbers to put Christie in the White House?
The demographic shift has arrived, and the GOPers are in big trouble nationally for the foreseeable future.
Chris
@Gene108:
Heck, Boehner doesn’t even need to bring the trolls under control. The MSM will see to it that everyone understands that Chris Christie is a Very Serious Person, a Moderate, and a Reasonable Republican, not at all like those howler monkeys – in fact, the howler monkeys are central to his point, because what happens if you don’t vote for Christie? THEY might get in!
The only reason they couldn’t defend Romney is that he personally kept on committing the gaffes in such a way that even the MSM could hardly separate him from the Republican zeitgeist.
But yeah, anyway – I agree that he’s a stronger contender than some here seem to think.
Omnes Omnibus
@Gene108: What states that Obama won in 2012 does Christie put into play? It’s to soon to freak out about Christie or to rush to a conclusion that the only person who could beat him is Hillary. Right now polling is purely on name recognition.
Jim, Foolish Literalist
I’ve been very skeptical that the “Republican civil war” was anything more than posturing and pretending that the likes of Steve Schmidt are relevant, but who knows….
slippy
@MattF:
Matt, those margins don’t matter because those people aren’t real voters.
See also, every other asshole Republican’s attitude which is if we don’t vote for ’em we’re not real Americans.
Also, fuck Republicans.
slippy
@MattF:
Matt, those margins don’t matter because those people aren’t real voters.
See also, every other asshole Republican’s attitude which is if we don’t vote for ’em we’re not real Americans.
Also, fuck Republicans.
chopper
@Paul in KY:
sounds better the other way:
schrodinger's cat
@MattF: She is crazy, but her grammar and spelling are immaculate, unlike most crazy wing nut sites. She wrote a post defending apartheid when Mandela died, among other things.
ETA: Also too, she is more Catholic than the current Pope.
Chris
@patrick II:
This. Heck, they hated Romney more than they do Christie, spent the entire primary process trying on every possible alternative, even to the point of including a woman and a black man. Didn’t matter. Romney had the money, he had the establishment, so he managed to stay for the long haul and eventually win the nomination.
Republicans are sheep. They’ll vote for whatever the establishment hands them. They’ll kick and scream and bite in some cases, but they’ll take the medicine eventually.
@MattF:
Because the pundits say that America is a center-right nation, and the narrative must be preserved. Thus Obama “barely squeaked by” (and you know it was only affirmative action/white guilt that put him over the top, so does that really count?) while Bush’s 2004 election was hailed as the inauguration of a new Permanent Republican Majority that would last a generation at least.
schrodinger's cat
@Chris: Fortunately for the rest of us, MSM’s influence is waning.
chopper
@Chris:
the hardcore conservatives are going to scream and shout this time. the last two elections the GOP coughed up an establishment candidate, and both times the dude got whipped by the black guy. and both times the teabagger types yelled up and down about how the candidate ‘wasn’t conservative enough’.
of course if they were smart they’d just let it happen a third time, since clinton is going to beat whoever the GOP coughs up.
Elizabelle
@schrodinger’s cat:
Hunting for your thinking housewife, and found this link to Troll this Blog.
Which has possibilities.
http://trollthisblog.blogspot.com/2010/02/ttb-4-laura-at-thinking-housewife.html
I wonder if “Housewife” might indeed be a parody?
Rosalita
Jeez, no post since 8A? who’s feeling neglected?
Paul in KY
@tybee: Really funny! Thanks for link.
Paul in KY
@schrodinger’s cat: I think Stephen Colbert must lift ideas from that website.
jl
@KG:
” [Kelly’s] probably confusing Santa Claus for St. Nicholas, which is common. ”
Given the odd and confusing history of Santa Claus, wouldn’t be more accurate to say he’s mixed race? And Kelly was on Leno a few days ago saying she did straight news, fair and balanced. Research much, Kelly?
She probably is all in for Zwarte Piet, too.
RSR
Wow, what an angry, bitter, petty, vindictive man.
Anybody remember Christie get all up in the face of the teacher a few weeks back? Maybe we could add that picture to the post.
handsmile
@Davis X. Machina:
Appreciate your reply and will defer to your local expertise, but to run as an independent wouldn’t Snowe have had either to renounce her party affiliation or be defeated in a primary? Neither of which I think would have been appealing. Her ultimate victory in this counterfactual, however, would seem certain.
Happy to read that there is a “state GOP apparatus that’s actually pushing back against LePage.” The link you provided (from June so perhaps dated) states that Lepage is “considered very vulnerable.” Still true, in your estimation? I seem to recall from previous exchanges here on that topic that you believe Mike Michaud will prevail in next year’s gubernatorial contest, and that LePage will not triumph again because of a majority vote split between the Democratic candidate and independent Eliot Cutler.
Mnemosyne
@schrodinger’s cat:
There are quite a few Catholics who refused to accept Vatican II as the word of God and maintain that they’re the only “real” Catholics because they adhere to the pre-Vatican II teachings. The Society of St. Pius X are probably the biggest group and I wouldn’t be surprised if she belongs to a “traditionalist” church like that.
Cervantes
@aimai:
Stipulating that you know the following: It was a Romney campaign event in New Hampshire. Occupy protestors were shouting “Christie kills jobs!” (or some such) and Christie responded: “Really? You know, something may go down tonight, but it ain’t gonna be jobs, sweetheart.”
The Romneys were both there on the stage with him, as was Kelly Ayotte. Were they ever asked about the comment?
Paul in KY
@chopper: Now that’s just wrong…
jl
@RSR: I don’t see how anyone can be particularly surprised by this. I don’t think Christie can ‘maintain’ over the course of presidential primary and general election campaigns. Yes, he regularly goes off and blows up on people who annoy him or ask pesky questions.Seriously abusive personality issues with Christie.
Paul in KY
@schrodinger’s cat: She’s as Catholic as that guy who massacred all the Catherites (and non-Catherites) back in the Middle Ages.
catclub
@muricafukyea: ” fat bastard Christie love letters”
Baron Harkkonen for President!
Bobby Thomson
@schrodinger’s cat:
You mean Republicans masquerading as purity trolls? Yes, he certainly does.
scav
@Paul in KY: Cathars? That was indeed a gold-plated legitimate (eventually) Pope-Approved Internal Crusade although the reported quote at Béziers about letting God sort them out is right up there with Let them eat cake on the ubiquity of attribution scale if I remember correctly.
Bobby Thomson
@Cervantes: Yeah, I get that. I just misinterpreted Doug’s post because it sounded like Fat Boy was just backing up traffic on I-95.
schrodinger's cat
@Elizabelle: I don’t think she is a parody.
Cervantes
@Bobby Thomson: Yes, I suppose he could, without much help.
schrodinger's cat
@Paul in KY: Possibly! She does seem to have a finger on the pulse of the GOP base.
Patricia Kayden
@Elizabelle: And I can’t see how Hilary Clinton running on the Democratic Presidential ticket doesn’t only widen the gender gap to the detriment of the Republicans in 2016. I assume more than a few White women who normally vote Republican will be tempted to vote for Mrs. Clinton. Republicans are going to have a hard time damping down their anti-women rhetoric, which includes their support for anti-reproductive rights policies despite sensitivity crash courses.
Suffern ACE
@RSR: And really rather ineffective. Seriously, Fort Lee is next to the bridge and has bus service over the bridge. But its not like the bridge is open to fort lee residents only. Basically messing up the major traffic corridor into the city for three counties to get back at one little town.
schrodinger's cat
Where are all the frontpagers? Did Christie eat them?
Suffern ACE
@schrodinger’s cat: They are stuck in traffic. Worried about the GWB, they opted to try the Lincoln tunnel. Very bad choice. We won’t hear from them until 7:30.
Elizabelle
Fresh thread alert.
Betty Cracker put up a new one. Blissfully Chris Christie free.
ETA: My bad. Doug j rescued us.
schrodinger's cat
@Suffern ACE: Traffic in NYC can be a bear!
Joel
@mike with a mic: I’m glad that someone is citing Clausewitz approvingly.
LanceThruster
Take away his Hurricane Sandy money.
Fair is fair.
Jay C
@rea:
OK, I’m not a trained professional traffic engineer, but even I know the answer to that particular question!
But not being a trained professional traffic engineer, I guess I don’t have the requisite ability to produce a well-reasoned and thoroughly-documented empirical study to state in acceptable, professional terms the fundamental assertion that “It Gets Completely Fucked Up“.
Missed my calling…
Suffern ACE
@Jay C: Sure, said the engineers, we could just assume that by removing the carbon rods in our nuclear reactor we’d end up with a meltdown, but you don’t really know until you try.
Paul in KY
@scav: Yeah, that’s who I was talking about. Thanks for getting right name, the poor Cathars & the poor non-Cathars who were in wrong place at wrong time.
scav
@Paul in KY: Catherites were a little Doctor Whoish with the Carrionite echo, so led my mind to skitter in entirely the wrong, although interesting, direction.
Paul in KY
@scav: I never got into Dr. Who. Think when I first watched them as 17 – 18 year old back in 1978 or 9, I must have come in during middle of a season & couldn’t understand it & after watching Star Wars, was put off by cheezy/non-existent special effects.
My loss, I guess.
Bill Arnold
never mind out of context
Bill Arnold
@schrodinger’s cat:
Wow, the thinking housewife is amazing. I’m puzzling over a certain “Doren” commenter in this article about Mandela
What say you all? Parody? (If the whole thing is parody, it is decidedly not obvious.)
Omnes Omnibus
@Bill Arnold: No, I would say not parody. I don’t know whether the site itself is intended as parody, but those comments, those I believe are real. I shall now weep.
ruemara
@Bill Arnold: not parody. These people really do believe what they’re saying. Accept it.
schrodinger's cat
@Bill Arnold: Not parody, this woman just raised $7000 for her site recently. They call themselves traditionalists or something like that. The current Republican party is too left wing for them. They wish to live in the past.
mclaren
Scott Walker is such an infamous asshole that it’s hard to see anyone beyond the 27% dead-enders voting for him in 2016. If you thought Obama’s commercials slamming Romney were brutal, wait till you see what Hillary puts on the airwaves against Walker in 2016. She’ll beat his ass like a rented mule.
Rebecca
@Paul in KY: Al Gore.
DTOzone
@dedc79:
He was hailed as a hero for that, standing up to government waste and unions or whatever.
Paul in KY
@Rebecca: Unfortunately, VP Gore did not (in the end) ‘win’. So, before him who did it? Maybe Pres. Wilson (did he claim New Jersey as home or Virginia)?