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Fight them, without becoming them!

Some judge needs to shut this circus down soon.

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You are here: Home / Elections / Election 2016 / Voter Suppression Will and Must Ultimately Fail

Voter Suppression Will and Must Ultimately Fail

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That’s fucking obscene. And it sucks for right now and this election. But ultimately, this will fail in the long run.

Yes, “moderate” Republican John Kasich (who I still think would have really made this election hell had he won the nomination) may shave off a couple thousand votes with this blatant voter suppression. But in the long run, it will fail.

A lot of this line is from the Ohio “Souls to Polls,” and while the Republican party’s institutional memory is about 6 hours and only if that’s convenient for them, black churches have a long, long memory. In every line, there are younger voters mixed in with grandparents and great-grandparents who were around before the VRA’s and CRA’s of the sixties. Every congregation is filled with people who were beaten, had dogs sicced on them, shot with firehoses, intimidated, and so forth, and that institutional memory is alive and well. They remember Jim Crow, they remember poll taxes, and this is just one more insult and one more assault on the dignity of the African American community, and they will note it.

And they will remember. As will the Latino community, members of which have been under assault since the first day that Trump slowly descended down an escalator and let everyone know that he thought that the path to the White House was through the 1840’s. And tey’ll remember.

So maybe Kasich and others will skim a few votes off here and there, but in the long run, they are losing minority communities for generations. As I said elsewhere, they aren’t eating their seed corn, they’re throwing it on the ground and shitting on it before setting it on fire.

We have to win in 2016, we have to win in 2018, and we have to win in 2020 to really turn the corner.

And fuck you, John Roberts.

Reader Interactions

236Comments

  4. 4.

    Punchy

    Question: do polls stay open until “x” time, period, then ‘fuck you’ to the remainig line attendees, or do they allow everyone in line by “x” time to vote, regardless of how long it takes to move the line to its end?

  5. 5.

    wenchacha

    Frank Luntz on 60 Minutes with a focus group full of both-siderism. A room of people who have high negatives for both candidates, but how many people are waiting 6 hours to vote for (presumably) one of them?

    Every state that has throttled back the number of available polling places should be heavily pressured to undo that little bit of anti-democracy fuckery.

  7. 7.

    Corner Stone

    Fuck you Dan Rather. HRC does not “need” to be humble. She is going to win the fucking thing. And then face willful and full on obstructionist assholes. Being “humble” is the last god damned thing HRC has to worry about.

  8. 8.

    Bobby Thomson

    @Punchy: I think it can depend on the state, but at least in some states if you made it into the line before close you get to stay.

  9. 9.

    Mary G

    I suggested to Kay that we should campaign to get John Husted out the next time he runs. This is the kind of office the Koch brothers and their ilk have been quietly buying for peanuts the last few decades and we need to take them back. Change from the bottom up is more efficient and long-lasting. Kasich too, of course.

  10. 10.

    donnah

    We’re in SW Ohio and hopeful that Hillary can pull Ohio, but it’s a mess of gerrymandered snaky districts and the polling indicates a win for Trump.

    My husband canvassed in a very poor area in town yesterday. He said the poverty is heartbreaking, but the people he spoke with seemed ready to vote for Hillary. As a canvasser, he gave them information about where and when to vote, and volunteer services available for them to get rides to polling places if necessary. He felt like he did some good, but he’s worried that the numbers of voters just won’t make it.

    Ohio held for Obama, something I’ll always be proud of. I’m afraid we’re going to lose this time.

  12. 12.

    Frankensteinbeck

    Every congregation is filled with people who were beaten, had dogs sicced on them, shot with firehoses, intimidated, and so forth

    Ugh. That really puts it in perspective, doesn’t it? A seven hour voting line is not going to stop someone who’s been through that, and knowing them personally must drive home how ugly this can get.

  13. 13.

    misterpuff

    Can someone do a mix of Harold Ford morphing into Rudy Giuliani, they have the same noggin, and level of thought inside those noggins.

  14. 14.

    a hip hop artist from Idaho (fka Bella Q)

    FWIW, the 4000 estimate was a tad high, based on end of the day report. But I can tell you that the line was many blocks longer that what I ever saw yesterday when I was an observer (with local party credentials), so I question his numbers. The official number was similar for Friday and the line was never that long. I’m slightly confused, based on both party reports about Friday and my observation of line length yesterday.

    @Punchy: A: In OH, the last person in line at close (5pm today here) votes.

  15. 15.

    AxelFoley

    Sorry, Cole, but Kasich would’ve got his ass stomped by Hillary if he won the GOP nomination. All of their candidates would’ve caught a beat down.

  16. 16.

    dmsilev

    @Corner Stone: I’m pretty sure Rather and his ilk said the same thing, more or less, about Obama when he won. He needs to “reach out to Republicans” and “be humble, not arrogant, in victory”, etc. Somehow, nobody said that about GWB in 2000. Odd, that.

  17. 17.

    hovercraft

    This bullshit will keep pissing people off. At some point they will realize that when they do this shit they do two things, make people never want to vote for you, and make people determined not to leave. People died, people were beaten up, people were bitten by dogs, people went to jail, people had their property destroyed, and still people marched for the right to vote, standing on line for hours will not stop them from voting.

  18. 18.

    CarolDuhart2

    @donnah: Donnah, they will show up. Trump has made it clear he plans to make things more miserable if he wins. Usually a more generic Republican promises a few modest things that sting a bit, but Trump is a stop too far. And with all of the resources Hillary has, and the time so many do have, they will vote. And they haven’t forgotten the callousness of Katrina and rightly fear another Republican will not help them when they need it.

  20. 20.

    Latino J

    There’s all the young girls and young women coming to age during this election as well. They are learning some strong lessons here. 1) Yes i can 2) I need to work twice as hard 3) Many of them will hate me for it

  21. 21.

    hovercraft

    @dmsilev:
    It wasn’t just Rather, the whole segment was terrible. Re-posting from the last thread:

    Tweety says the Ashcroft hospital bedside story convinced him Comey was a good guy, and that’s that. Never mind precedent.Dan Rather thinks the rigged election/system means that we are in a dangerous place. Jeff Greenfield, says the fact that they will believe the next president is a criminal, that 3 senators say no new SC justice, almost defaulting on the national debt, we across the Rubicon. He says he has no faith the GOP will do the right thing is interested in their desire to govern. Rather says he has faith in the American people, who will want the president to get things done, so he doesn’t think it matters what kind of concession speech Trump gives. Greenfield says a man who goes to the Al Smith dinner and says she hates catholics shows that he is capable of anything. Tweety laughs and chuckles yes he did, he doesn’t want to accept that Trump is really a racist fucking troll. Susan Page says she can overcome this by getting something done by reaching across the aisle. Rather says she can do this by being humble and magnanimous, something he’s never seen her be. Greenfield says if she does something with Ryan democrats will howl because we hate compromise. So basically an entire segment saying she needs to knuckle under to the rethugs or it’s her fault when nothing gets done.
    Useless pieces of shit all 4 of them.

  22. 22.

    Tazj

    That’s crazy. I’ve never waited more than 15 minutes to vote, or driven longer than 3 or 4 miles. I live in WNY.
    You’re right that Kasich would have been tough to beat. The village loves a “moderate” Republican.
    What’s the reason(I know the real reason) there are so few places to vote, the budget? Is that what Kasich and the Ohio legislature state, that they can’t spend taxpayer money on elections?

  25. 25.

    CarolDuhart2

    BTW, Cincinnati is very blue these days. All of the reactionaries moved out to Westchester, Fairfield and beyond. Extended white flight, as you will. OTR is now a combinations of hipsters and minorities. The rest is minorities and liberals and students. Remember when Trump was going to have a rally at the Duke Center? Someone who actually read a street map in his campaign noted that Fountain Square was less than 2 blocks away. Fountain Square is the heart of downtown, an open space where people routinely gather-and do gather-for protests.

  26. 26.

    Baud

    @Corner Stone:

    HRC does not “need” to be humble.

    I would be perfectly happy if her victory speech on Tuesday consisted of her holding up both middle fingers in the air for 10 minutes.

  27. 27.

    different-church-lady

    @hovercraft:

    Susan Page says she can overcome this by getting something done by reaching across the aisle.

    Oh. So Susan Page was in a coma for the last few years?

  28. 28.

    different-church-lady

    @Baud: Well, you know that’s going to be Trump’s concession speech, so she’ll probably come up with something else.

  29. 29.

    seaboogie

    @donnah:

    We’re in SW Ohio and hopeful that Hillary can pull Ohio, but it’s a mess of gerrymandered snaky districts and the polling indicates a win for Trump.

    It is what it is for now in Ohio and many other states, especially the swing states. However I take some hope going forward one of Obama’s priorities going forward once he leaves office (along with Eric Holder) is to work on redistricting.

    And we if can swing SCOTUS in the next couple years, voting rights will be a priority also.

  34. 34.

    redshirt

    As to the title of Cole’s Bigfoot, yes, I think voter suppression will fail. I don’t think it must fail though. By definition if successful it creates it’s own success. If we don’t defeat it, it will succeed.

  39. 39.

    hovercraft

    Tweety says that the KKK doesn’t exist, it’s a joke, so Michelle Bernard should not be concerned about it. How many members does it have, when’s the last time she encountered a member. Don’t know?

  42. 42.

    a hip hop artist from Idaho (fka Bella Q)

    @CarolDuhart2: It is totally blue downtown! And lots of the city neighborhoods, but as you noted, deep red where white flight went, including many places in Hamilton County along with Butler, Clermont, and Warren.

    For non locals, the last 3 are adjacent counties heavy with GOP residents, as are some parts of the county Cincinnati’s in. CarolDuhart2 knows this, and makes the important point about city itself. It’s quite distinct from surrounding exurbs and some very white suburbs closer in.

  44. 44.

    amk

    Kumail Nanjiani ‏@kumailn 4h4 hours ago

    It makes perfect sense that a group of people who are against science and progress would be so terrified by emails.

    0 replies 1,385 retweets 4,644 likes

  46. 46.

    Iowa Old Lady

    When we lived in Detroit, I stood in line for 2 hours on election day once. Then we moved to a nice suburb and there’d be maybe one person in line ahead of me. It was shocking.

  47. 47.

    dmsilev

    @Baud:

    I would be perfectly happy if her victory speech on Tuesday consisted of her holding up both middle fingers in the air for 10 minutes.

    She should get up and say “I have a speech prepared, but instead of giving it now, I’m going to email it to everyone.”

  50. 50.

    Baud

    Remember when Bush v. Gore said equal protection required everyone’s vote to be treated equally.

    Good times.

  56. 56.

    Adam L Silverman

    @Punchy: @redshirt: I checked with Bella Q on how this works in Ohio. Here’s her response:
    Deputies place a traffic cone (pylon?) behind the last person in line at 5pm. Everyone in from of that traffic cone gets to vote. They will stay open until that person votes.

  58. 58.

    redshirt

    @Iowa Old Lady: When I lived in the Fenway of very liberal Boston, I’d often have an hour + wait. I now have approximately a 1 second wait.

    Maybe it’s more of just a general urban demographic thing (not enough throughput for the population) and not necessarily voter suppression. Sometimes. Unless you think Boston was trying to suppress the vote.

  60. 60.

    jacy

    Spent the last three days calming people down. Yesterday my daughter called me in a tizzy, and it took me 20 minutes to reassure her. I’m nervous enough, but I feel pretty good about things. I’ve obsessively read everything: every report, every poll, every bit of analysis I could find. I’ve stayed away from the news, because it’s just crazy noise right now. I early voted, and did as much to help the GOTV effort as I was able to. I’m going to make a prediction and then not worry about it until Tuesday night: We take the Senate 52/48. Hillary wins 352 EV to Trump’s 186. Too Pollyannaish? So be it. That’s my good thought to get me through the next two days, and I’m sticking to it.

  62. 62.

    Percysowner

    @Tazj: The only areas that have this long a wait are Democratic areas. The Republican districts have plenty of voting machines. In Ohio, you can only do early voting at the County Board of Elections. If you are a blue area, you CBOE gets fewer voting machines. Money is NOT the issue.

  64. 64.

    Scamp Dog

    I dropped off my ballot a half hour ago, and I’ll be doing GOTV Tuesday morning. My bit to keep Colorado blue again! Now it’s time to grade some more exams…

  66. 66.

    Frankensteinbeck

    @hovercraft:
    Tweety is the Platonic ideal of the MSM pundit for whom racism is dead and Republicans are the party of responsibility. That the Republican Party and Republican policies might be driven by racism is… unthinkable. It would open up Tweety to facing that his close friends and he himself are racists. Anyway, it’s easy to explain away when he doesn’t give a damn about what happens to women and minorities, and can focus solely on how Republicanism affects white people.

  69. 69.

    Peale

    @Percysowner: yep. I swear. Why doesn’t someone just run for that office on the promise that no one will ever have to wait more than 4 hours to vote. Lol. Even that would be an improvement over what we currently see.

  70. 70.

    Schlemazel

    Out here on the frozen tundra I have never seen a problem with voting. We have calm, open polling places & there has never been any sort of problem. There have never been issues with asshole outside the polling place. I never even knew there could be a problem until I moved to Florida and saw the bullshit they put up with there. I really do believe our Republicans are better than most even though they still suck most of them believe that the people deserve to vote.

  72. 72.

    CarolDuhart2

    @debbie: But Kasich would have come across as relatively “nice” with no major personal scandals. He certainly would have avoided some of Trump’s stunts, had a reasonably competent campaign organization, and decent funds. He would have been the Midwestern Romney family man type. In short, reasonable.

  73. 73.

    a hip hop artist from Idaho (fka Bella Q)

    @Omnes Omnibus: When Karin and Linford started that band, OTR (as the neighborhood is now abbreviated) was far from hipsterville! It was considered a scary place by many/most people. Not me, of course, both because I’m a badass* and I know lots of artists who had studios and/or lived there back in the day. Now it’s quite gentrified and hip, with some patches that still alarm many people.

    As I was recently officially declared by a 27 year old college guy of my acquaintance. He did an Army stint after high school and is now a bio major.

    @redshirt: 5 pm is for early voting today; yesterday was 8a-4p. Election day poll hours are 6:30a-7:30p

  74. 74.

    hovercraft

    Mrs. Greenspan calls the NH Clinton event a “magical night”, says James Taylor was amazing and Kazir Khan topped him, huge crowd.

  75. 75.

    Corner Stone

    It’s weird but I fucking love these striped ties Brian Williams chooses. No clue how much they cost but they are glorious. Probably more than I’m willing to go.

  76. 76.

    Baud

    @CarolDuhart2: Agree. The question would have been how interesting he would have been to his own voters. Remember a long time ago when Scott Walker was considered a real threat.

  77. 77.

    Adam L Silverman

    @srv: You do understand that KrissAnn Hall is the disbarred, but still one of the go to legal authorities for the sovereign citizen movement, militia movement, white supremacists and white nationalists? She regularly spouts anti-Semitism (both anti-Jewish and and anti-Muslim), homophobic, racist, and xenophobic BS made to sound like its legalese. I just want to make sure that you’re aware that this is what you’re promoting. Because if so, and Cole can fire me if he wants, but I’m going to bounce your ass out of here for being a bigoted, anti-Semitic ass so fast you won’t ever stop spinning.

    Putz!

  79. 79.

    Omnes Omnibus

    @Schlemazel: Same on my side of the Mississippi and St. Croix. Longest line I have ever faced in WI is a half hour wait to vote early for Obama in 2008. A good two hours in the rain in 2004 to vote for Kerry in downtown Columbus, Ohio, though.

  82. 82.

    jacy

    @Corner Stone: I gave Clinton both Ohio and a surprise in AZ. AZ may be the point where I’m really blue-skying it…. But I just found out that my prediction matches the final LA Times prediction. Not that that’s worth anything…..

  84. 84.

    NotMax

    @redshirt

    States run elections, not the fed.

    5 p.m. on a Sunday isn’t all that onerous. Closing time in Ohio on election day is, I believe, 7:30, so folks on line by then will be accommodated. Most states set election day closing time at either 7 or 8. KY and HI have the earliest times, at 6 p.m. Poll openings are generally either 6 or 7 a.m. (NH’s odd rules allowing certain spots a midnight opening being an exception).

  86. 86.

    Tazj

    @Percysowner:Thank you for explaining what’s going on in Ohio. I just wondered if Kasich had ever been pinned down by a reporter about why it’s so hard to vote in Democratic parts of the state and what excuse he gave.

  87. 87.

    Corner Stone

    @jacy: You mean EV in OH and AZ? Because she is not winning AZ and we are going to lose Senate races in both OH and AZ.
    Man, if she pulled AZ EV across the blue line I would literally shomi pants wet myself.

  91. 91.

    a hip hop artist from Idaho (fka Bella Q)

    @Omnes Omnibus: Completely understandable assumption, which just happened to be a mistaken one w/r/t what the neighborhood was like when they started.

  92. 92.

    CarolDuhart2

    @Omnes Omnibus: About OTR: became majority black after the first white flight in the 1940’s when better homes for whites opened up in Bond Hill, Greenhills, and so forth. When the expressway displaced a lot of people in Walnut Hills, and urban renewal the West End, a lot of black people moved up the hill to Avondale, Bond Hill, the rest of Walnut Hills, Evanston, and the rest. Now thanks to open housing policies and the rise of the black middle class, OTR has hollowed out considerably. Me and all my siblings were born in OTR: none of us live there now-I’m probably the closest to there now-need to stay on a busline. The result is a mass of vacant buildings that are now being gentrified into something like Soho. These people are not Trump fans. In addition, the old office buildings downtown are being converted into condos practically once a month-they aren’t Trump fans either.

  94. 94.

    dr. bloor

    @Percysowner: @Face: There will be nine. But even at eight, I’d bet Roberts would go the other way on another Shelby case. He’s an asshole, but he’s smart and vain, and he doesn’t want his court associated with a Plessy decision anymore than he wanted to get stuck holding the bag for dismantling the ACA.

  97. 97.

    GrandJury

    @jacy: LA Times polling has been an outlier on everything. This time will be no different.

    News flash. No, the Latinos are not showing up for the first time ever and Arizona is not turning blue.

  99. 99.

    Schlemazel

    @Omnes Omnibus:
    Dispite Scott Walker WI is a place of decent people. I think the places that WANT to prevent democracy do so. That is is shitholes like Ohio, Kentucky, Indiana and the slave holding states of the CSA that have a problem is not an accident. At some point in the very near future the Federal government must take the power away from these bastards.

  100. 100.

    redshirt

    @NotMax: Ah, I thought the 5PM was for Tuesday. Yeah, for Sunday it’s fine.

    I’m not saying the Feds should run the elections, but they should set the standards by law. For example, 8 to 8 or until the last voter has voted; a specific proportion of voting machines per district population; the same number of early voting days/absentee; etc.

  101. 101.

    NotMax

    Hoping someone among the media has the gumption to spend a few minutes on Tuesday evening reporting results from Ferguson and from Flint.

  102. 102.

    jacy

    @Corner Stone:

    Yeah, EV in AZ and Ohio. I think we lose both those senate races. I think AZ and Ohio are the two least likely of possible states for her to win, but I’m going out on a limb with it to reinforce my own positive thinking! (Or maybe I’m just smoking whatever the fellas at the LA Times are smoking….)

  104. 104.

    Edward G. Talbot

    @Adam L Silverman I read @srv’s post as bemoaning the next step in Trumperism (after he loses), not promoting it. You are correct that KrisAnn Hall (and the entire alt-right) is racist and anti-Semitic garbage.

  108. 108.

    OGLiberal

    @Corner Stone: This was the beauty of Obama. He and his team were hard pipe hittin’ n**gas but with a smile. (Not being racist here, most of those n**gas were white dudes/woman) They were not humble or polite, just civil in sticking in the shiv. That’s what Obama will close with. That’s what I want them all to close with. Of course, wing nuts will read my metaphoric shiv stuff literally, which is why they are both idiots and self-projecting pukes.

  110. 110.

    Bobby Thomson

    @redshirt: In Shelby County v. Holder, the four racists on the SCOTUS and Scalia (who also is racist but is still dead – praise FSM) held that Section 4 of the Voting Rights Act is unconstitutional. Section 4 required certain states with a history of de jure discrimination to submit their voting laws to the DOJ for preclearance, to allow the DOJ time to file enforcement actions. To invalidate that, the racists just made up an entirely new principle that states have to be treated alike. Because of that opinion, none of the surviving justices who voted for it should be able to walk the streets without saliva on their faces. Roberts essentially said that because preclearance was working, it was no longer necessary. The results were predictable.

  111. 111.

    Schlemazel

    @Corner Stone:
    “Now, it is true what they say about Boss Grissom, he is a murderer and a fiend. On the other hand he has a beautiful singing voice.”

  113. 113.

    jacy

    @GrandJury:

    A) Not going by the LA Times — found out they matched me only after I played with the maps on 270toWin. Just a curiosity.

    B) I’ma guess you don’t know shit about Hispanic/Latino turnout, and politely tell you to go fuck yourself.

  114. 114.

    dr. bloor

    @Schlemazel:

    Dispite Scott Walker WI is a place of decent people

    Decent people who keep reelecting Scott Walker and his hand-picked judges.

    But yeah, those other states are fucking messes.

  115. 115.

    scav

    I forget, was it the Brinks Trucks that were going to back up (ding! ding! ding!) bringing all the Latinos to the polling stations (“Bank on it!”) or was there a last minute switch to taco trucks?

  117. 117.

    Baud

    As we’re now debating the meaning of an srv comment, it’s time to call it a day.

    Night, all.

  120. 120.

    GrandJury

    @jacy: I’ll return the favor on Nov09 when I come here to make fun of all “The latinos are totally going to show up this time for sure and Arizona/Texas will turn blue” people. Same shit every 2 years. People just never learn.

  124. 124.

    Peale

    @GrandJury: oh you and your Jill Stein pessimism. You remind me of Democrats in 1988 sniveling that maybe the black vote wasn’t worth the investment because those people never showed up. If Hillary loses by six or less, that will be a major improvement in a state that’s gone +10 for the republicans for the past 20 years. And that will be due to Hispanics showing up.

    African Americans now turn out at rates equal to white voters, and no, that wasn’t just because of Obama. That was a trend that started 20 year before that. What on earth are you afraid of if it turn out Hispanics In Arizona somehow reach a 50% percent turn out this time?

  125. 125.

    dr. bloor

    @Omnes Omnibus: They’ve gone blue in the presidential races since 1988, but still bend over for Koch surrogates at the state level, which has a much bigger impact on their quality of life. Maybe we can agree on decent but stupid?

  127. 127.

    JPL

    ABC Politics twitter feed has snippets of the speech in NH. link
    Khizr Khan is amazing, and he along with others that Trump has slammed, might take him down.

    If Hillary wins, I want the Khan family behind her on Inauguration
    day.

  129. 129.

    GrandJury

    @Peale: When the Latinos have trended towards higher turnout for the past 10 years let me know. Currently we are at year 0. Just like we were in 2014,2012,2010,2008.

    Every time it was “oh this year is different because…reasons”. And it never was different.

  130. 130.

    Schlemazel

    @Omnes Omnibus:
    Mr Johnson is a mench. While I count on the WCHA winning every national championship on the womens side I do not mind his never lifting the trophy! :) There are two great tems who play the game the right way & win trophies. His is the the lesser of the two.
    He has a gold medal, (which he got only because the coach was a Minnesotan) that is enough.

    That is the spots guy talking. I love Wisconsin, My dads family is from there ( a cousin played for Green Bay) and until Walker made a joke of the place a decent Midwest place to live & work.

  131. 131.

    Adam L Silverman

    @Corner Stone: I wanted tacos so badly last night and there were no taco trucks to be found. I’m beginning to think its all just an urban legend.

  132. 132.

    Omnes Omnibus

    @dr. bloor: Maybe we could agree on complicated demographics that when matched with typical off-year voting patterns gets weird results.

  133. 133.

    Gelfling 545

    @Tazj: Also in WNY. I waited 2 hours in 2008 but that was the very first time I ever waited that long. Maybe 45 minutes in 2012. Before that it was usually pretty quick if you avoided the after work crowd.

  134. 134.

    NotMax

    @redshirt

    A lot to take issue with there, but the main thing is that 8 a.m. would be awfully late for poll opening. There are plenty of people who try to get their vote in before heading to work/commute. All 48 states plus D.C. with physical polling places (OR and WA are vote by mail) currently set opening earlier than 8. 5 a.m. (!) in VT for some precincts.

  136. 136.

    hovercraft

    @Corner Stone:
    She initially was happy with the Palin pick, it was only once she became her handler and spent time with her that she developed doubts.

  140. 140.

    japa21

    Well, in about 48 hours I will be getting home after taking all the ballots etc., to the central collection point. They are super security conscious. Two people must take the stuff in, a representative from each party. This may be my first time as an election judge, but I can already tell how secure the process is. There are so many examples of information back-up, the touch screens have paper trails, as to the optical scan ballots (voters have their choice).
    So I can now take all this rigging talk as a personal insult. Maybe I should try to get a class action suit going against Trump for defamation of character.

  148. 148.

    Omnes Omnibus

    @japa21: It is funny, isn’t it? Once one knows the actual process, that fear of rigging and hacking seems to fade.

  149. 149.

    Schlemazel

    @Mike G:
    I am still pissed that Obama, who won a majority, was encouraged to be bipartisan while Boy Blunder who lost the popular vote was never encouraged to add Dems. Liberal media my ass

  151. 151.

    scav

    @Lizzy L: mmm, not quite caught on to the general level of snark in the air, are we? and here I thought such a shopworn collection of mismatched troll platitudes might be too obvious.

  154. 154.

    Peale

    @Schlemazel: ok. To be fair. Obama did run on healing the country and being the president for everyone. That was one of his core messages. It’s hard to call yourself everyone’s president without reaching across the aisle so to speak.

  155. 155.

    Schlemazel

    @Lizzy L:
    Just had a lengua burrito yesterday, braised in excellent Mexican spices and broth. If I had to eat like that every day I would be OK with that.

    Leaving the place I saw a sign (posted illiberally on the freeway entrance) for “Deplorable Rom Moey” He and Trump are in for an ass kicking in a couple of days

  156. 156.

    Corner Stone

    I am just tired of pundits telling me that the reason HRC is in X Blue State is because her campaign is scared is bullshit garbage time bullshit nonsense bullshit.
    And the fact that I am somehow attracted to Nicole Wallace is completely irrelevant here, people!

  160. 160.

    Percysowner

    @Gator90: Yes. From the Merriam/Webster Dictionary

    Definition of Semite

    1 a : a member of any of a number of peoples of ancient southwestern Asia including the Akkadians, Phoenicians, Hebrews, and Arabs
    b : a descendant of these peoples

    2 : a member of a modern people speaking a Semitic language

  161. 161.

    Omnes Omnibus

    @Corner Stone: She is going to states without early voting. More bang for the buck. I know that you already know that. The other thing is between you and your sense of decency.

  162. 162.

    japa21

    @Omnes Omnibus: Yes. But then knowledge is frequently the antidote to fear which is why the GOP is so anti any knowledge being disseminated to the populace in general.

  163. 163.

    Schlemazel

    @Omnes Omnibus:
    I hope so. I was VERY disappointed you guys did not kick him out on recall. Off the sports fields I wish you nothing but good stuff (although fuck the LEOs who pick off non-locals for tickets)

  164. 164.

    Adam L Silverman

    @Gator90: Yes, but… Islam originated in the Arabian peninsula, specifically the Hijaz of what is now Saudi Arabia among Arabs. Arabs are Semites. Technically anti-Semitism as a term should cover bias and prejudice against the religions of all Semites. I tend to include it because, unfortunately, there are to many Jews who seem to discount, and an even worse group that actively engage/encourage, anti-Muslim bias and prejudice.

  169. 169.

    Corner Stone

    @Adam L Silverman: The Ambulatory Cream Cheese Sculpture is not that fucking stupid but he is paid hard core to act like he is. Thankfully, I am not similarly attracted to him in any way or degree.

  170. 170.

    Omnes Omnibus

    @Schlemazel: In retrospect, the recall was a bad idea. It sucked up money and enthusiasm that would have been better directed at the 2012 election. Taking back the Assembly and Senate would have changed a lot. At the time, those decisions were being made, I was at our election agency and not in a position to offer my opinion.

  172. 172.

    jacy

    @Corner Stone: Nicole Wallace reminds me of a lot of Republican women I’m somewhat friendly with — nice enough and seemingly well-educated, but with inexplicably stupid ideas.

  175. 175.

    Suffragete City elftx

    @srv: KAH is the whackaloon that was on the phone w Fry last day of Malhuer occupation. There were quite a few of us terrified she had him convinced he could pull that trigger because God. She is as disgusting a human as Ammon Bundy whom she so admires.

  176. 176.

    Peale

    @NotMax: oh, don’t mind him. He used to be an o.k, guy, but lost his shit in 2010 when he found out cole used to be a republican. He’s never recovered for some reason. He actually favors everything we favor politically. But likes boundaries. and really really despises people who have hope for some reason. and obviously needs to work on forgiveness and forebearance. He must give his performance manager heartburn.

  179. 179.

    Miss Bianca

    Just got back from phone-banking in Huerfano County, which is not the most heavily Hispanic county in my district, but a lot of Hispanic surnames. Struck by how transient the Dem population seemed to be, at least in terms of phone #s – lots of disconnected or wrong numbers. Also lots of left messages. A few live calls, most of whom had already voted. One who thanked me for calling (!! awww!!). One guy, registered Dem, 83 years old by the info we had, who flatly said he wasn’t voting. Unfortunately, I was so taken aback, I didn’t have the presence of mind to say, “May I ask you why?” Maybe I could have changed a mind. Another, 91 year-old woman, who said she’d already voted. Way to go!

    And so it goes. Step by step. I only wish I had time to do more volunteering. More money to donate. All I can do now that I’ve voted is pray.

  184. 184.

    Omnes Omnibus

    @redshirt: He hates Zandar from something personal in meatspace, and has managed expand his hatred from Zandar only to Cole, the other FPers, and the commenters. He’s nucking futs.

  185. 185.

    NotMax

    @Peale

    Oh, learned early to pay its content no mind whatsoever and scroll on by. Just pointing out the trail of banhammers.

  186. 186.

    Corner Stone

    @Omnes Omnibus: That’s a different one.
    This one does Cole, MuckyMux and DougJ. The other one was psychopathic Zandar.
    Although, to be fair, Zandar sucks balls. Still, that guy took it to —>here.

  193. 193.

    Peale

    @Major Major Major Major: nah. Same guy. I don’t really think he’s wrong, and the “radical moderate dem who won’t compromise” position can be funny. There can be a lot of false hopes on democratic blogs. and a lot of negative emotion. So for some reason his idea of moderation involves chastising anyone with too much negativity or positivity on any given day. It’s like he’s a theraveda Buddhist troll, with a very underdeveloped sense of kshanti.

  194. 194.

    Miss Bianca

    @donnah: Some of my canvassing contacts in the southern part of the state reported seeing Trump signs overwhelmingly in a very poor town, half white, half-Hispanic. All they’d say is that Trump is the only guy listening to them and somehow he’s going to bring all their (mining) jobs back. When asked why they believed anything the guy said about jobs that *weren’t* going to be coming back, no matter what he said, and why they believed that Hillary might not be listening to them, all they’d do is repeat that Trump was the only guy who cared. I can’t figure it out, myself, but I guess that just makes me one of those heartless elitist liberals the “Hillbilly Elegy” guy deplores.

  195. 195.

    Gator90

    @Percysowner: Does the same dictionary define “anti-Semitism” and if so, what is the definition? Every standard English dictionary, to my knowledge, defines “anti-Semitism” as some sort of animus directed to Jews specifically; I’m curious to know if any such dictionary defines it otherwise.

  197. 197.

    Peale

    @Corner Stone: agreed. Zander’s troll was about the worst we’ve had. Personally obsessed and threatening. I don’t know why shomi doesn’t like DougJ in particular, but I’ve never really been worried that he’ll show up at Doug’s house.

  198. 198.

    Miss Bianca

    @Scamp Dog: Yay, you! I was thinking I should hose writer’s group tomorrow and go do more phone-banking, to try to turn CO bright blue!

  199. 199.

    Gator90

    @Adam L Silverman: unfortunately, there are too many Jews who seem to discount, and an even worse group that actively engage/encourage, anti-Muslim bias and prejudice.

    Agreed. There are also too many non-Jews who discount and/or engage in anti-Muslim bias and prejudice. How does altering the commonly understood meaning of “anti-Semitism” solve either problem?

  203. 203.

    Adam L Silverman

    @Gator90: By expanding use of the term, and defining it when doing so as I did, when using it as a technical term one begins to change the discussion.

  204. 204.

    cckids

    @dmsilev:

    Wall Street, which is after all somewhat-legal gambling, will probably also jump tomorrow morning due to the FBI letter thing. Which says nothing about the election, just about people’s perceptions of what is going to happen.

    Dow Jones futures trading (hopefully that’s the right term) is up over 200 points tonight, according to ccspouse, whose business applies to such things. Wall Street is pants-shitting terrified of a Trump presidency.

  209. 209.

    SFAW

    @srv:

    Hall is a registered Republican but says she blames both major parties for creating a corrupt federal government colossus that taps citizens’ phones, imposes national health care and “steals” Americans’ rights on guns, land, speech and religion.

    And yet, that same “corrupt” federal government allows nutjobs like KrisAnne Hall to roam freely.

  212. 212.

    Gator90

    @redshirt: Again, “anti-Semitism” is a term that most if not all standard English dictionaries actually define. They define it in reference to Jews, specifically. Adam, as he has acknowledged, seeks to change that definition to include Muslims, for the purpose of reducing anti-Muslim bigotry. While that is of course an admirable purpose, I fail to see how it is to be accomplished by making a precise term imprecise. Anti-Semitism means what it means. Anti-Muslim bigotry and anti-Semitism are both toxic, but they are not the same thing. (Personally, I think the increasingly used term “Islamophobia” is a pretty good term for anti-Muslim bigotry, but your mileage may vary.)

  214. 214.

    redshirt

    @Gator90: We’re just talking about words, of course. Right?

    Thus, we can re-define our terms if they no longer make sense. Or we can change our opinions based on what terms mean.

    All people from the Middle East and Arabia are generally Semites. Right?

  216. 216.

    Hob

    @Adam L Silverman: I appreciate that you at least have a rationale beyond “that’s the literal meaning of the etymology” for this nonstandard usage of the word, but… unless you’re going to explain that rationale to everyone every time you use the word that way, I think it’s misguided because it will just come across as uninformed. It’s not just a question of “literal meaning” versus “common usage”; the word was specifically made up to mean “being against Jews”, it doesn’t have an etymology that is separate from that intent, it’s virtually never been used in any other way, and redefining it arguably erases the very specific history that goes along with it.

    You might as well say that “homophobia” should be used to mean “being afraid of things that are the same as other things” because those are the literal meanings of the two halves of the word. I mean, of course that would be a weird arbitrary thing to do and I get that your intent with this is more noble, but I can’t begin to imagine that someone who actually needs consciousness-raising on this subject will get any of it from hearing you do this, rather than just concluding that you’re unaware of the history behind the word.

    Sorry to rattle on but this is a pet peeve.

  222. 222.

    Gator90

    @Hob: Yes, there is a bit of history behind the word “anti-Semitism,” isn’t there. And those who attempt to change the word’s meaning are, in essence, seeking to appropriate that history for their own purposes. In Adam’s case, the purpose is noble. In many other cases, not so much.

  226. 226.

    GrandJury

    @JPL: What is with this “if” shit?! The only questions are how big a win and do we get the senate.

    Right now its Clinton 314, Trump 224 EV.

    Polls are flat but I suspect there will be a bit of a move toward Hillary tomorrow. So best case is maybe 318/220. I was expecting a much bigger blow out than that but I’ll take it.

  228. 228.

    Aleta

    I remember a few months back a commenter objecting to the convention we use to speak of the actions of dictators. We say “the Saudis do this” and “the North Koreans have done this,” although the people suffering under the dictator have no control over his actions. If I recall, the response was along the lines of “but that’s the convention; that’s how we always speak of a country’s actions–it doesn’t imply the people are responsible.” And he or she was given a bit of a hard time for believing that a change in our conventional way of speaking might matter.

  229. 229.

    Linda

    They might be losing the minority vote for a generation, but GOP officeholders right now don’t care. They are holding onto their jobs for this nanosecond, and it’s all they can do. Like a thief who hears the police sirens coming, their every thought is to fill the pillowcase with goodies.

  230. 230.

    Origuy

    @redshirt:

    All people from the Middle East and Arabia are generally Semites. Right?

    Except Kurds, Turks, Persians, Azeris, Pashtuns, Armenians, Baluchis, and a few smaller groups.

  232. 232.

    Gator90

    @joel hanes: That’s fine, but neither Mr. Silverman (who acknowledges that he “wasn’t using the term the way it is commonly used”) nor Mr. Webster shares your understanding.

  233. 233.

    Sondra

    @Corner Stone:
    I’m guessing he’s one of the grand poobahs they dig up every 4 years to tell us what our candidates have to do to win? So bravo what you said. Hillary just needs to be her natural self – period. That’s the way we like her. (Plug in your favorite song of choice in this slot.)

  234. 234.

    Sondra

    I am a Precinct Captain here in West Palm Beach and I was working with one of my voters yesterday. The man and his wife are from Canada originally and he, at 92 years old, is a first time voter. He had no idea what the fight to desegregate our schools was like back in 1963 and right after the VRA was passed. I explained to them both that as a kid growing up in Cincinnati I was part of that first effort and I have a vivid memory of one of the Governors down South standing in the doorway of a school holding a pick-ax to prevent the young blacks students from coming in. That’s how visceral it is even now after all of these years, but there are fewer and fewer of us who remember.

  235. 235.

    Uncle Cosmo

    @Omnes Omnibus: FWIW I have it on Badenov authority that Trump scampaign internally abbreviates Cleveland as “OнO” for Oшибка на Oзере (Oshibka nad Ozero, “Mistake by Lake”). ..

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