I have no idea if this is typical of how Sky News anchors grill UK politicians, but this lady is having none of this gentleman’s bullshit obfuscation, and I am here for it:
‘Is Tony Abbott the right person to represent us – even if he’s a homophobic misogynist?’ – @KayBurley
Health Secretary @MattHancock says the former Australian PM is “also an expert in trade” and denies the claims.
Follow #KayBurley live: https://t.co/Qj88d3ncEp pic.twitter.com/ELhm8PzXAo
— SkyNews (@SkyNews) September 3, 2020
I’d love to see Ms. Burley go after Bill Barr.
Election Day is exactly two months from today. It’s a good time to check your registration. I do so regularly since I live in a state that is run by corrupt Republicans who are determined to put their grubby thumbs on the scale for Trump.
I think Biden is going to win Florida, but the margin is important. Historically, it’s always close. But if Biden is clearly ahead on Election Day, that could shut down the election-stealing scheme Trump has been telegraphing for weeks, i.e., hope for a lead in in-person voting on November 3 and cry fraud when mail-in ballots shift the election to Biden.
There was a recent article about the possibility that Florida could head off a “red mirage,” in Politico (I think). How horrifying to contemplate Florida’s role in all of this in light of its history, but here’s a shot at redemption!
It’s so exhausting, worrying about this shit all the time. My worst fear is that we just don’t have it in us (as a nation) to stop our slide into decline and dysfunction, even if we do manage to kick Trump to the curb. Too many cultists, too much corruption, too much institutional damage and too many apathetic people who’ve already lost faith in democracy.
Oh well, we’ll jump off that bridge when we get to it, right? Two months to go. Open thread.
Have you seen this?
here’s a shot at redemption
A man walks down the street
He says, “Why am I soft in the middle, now?
Why am I soft in the middle?
The rest of my life is so hard
I need a photo-opportunity
I want a shot at redemption
Don’t want to end up a cartoon
In a cartoon graveyard”
Mike in NC
Watched a couple more episodes of “The Loudest Voice” starring Russell Crowe as now dead Roger Ailes. At one point he interviews a top BBC reporter for a job at FOX News, but he blows her off because of her Anglo-Indian heritage, saying “she won’t play in the Midwest” (e.g. not a vapid blonde with a big rack). Hard to imagine a more malevolent, evil piece of shit. But today he’d probably be called a RINO.
Ohio Moms for Biden launches today- with an online meeting. Sarah Jessica Parker (who is from Ohio) is “joining us”.
The Biden campaign is so normal. Like a regular campaign. It’s weirdly appealing after having been trapped with these fucking oddball, bizarre Trump people for 3 and a half years. No one at this event will be screaming and there won’t be any representatives from various conspiracy sects. There will be nothing dark and grim at the Ohio Moms For Biden event, I can assure you of that. Just your usual dorky campaign people being really polite and earnest! :)
Since it’s an open thread…its day 4 of the University of Florida’s fall semester…..and the campus seems to be nearly empty. Evidently most classes are still online. they didn’t give that impression leading up to this semester. I was expecting a disaster. Yesterday’s townhall (virtual for employees) finally said clearly that they had figured out that science labs, musical instrument instruction and something else needed to be in person but most of the rest didn’t. Grad students it’s up to the programs to figure out.
they had ordered our division back to the office unless we had medical reasons but our doors are still locked to everyone else. they are giving out zoom appointments to students who need help with their admissions/registrations and financial aid and it seems to be working. It very weird on campus though. Enrollment is around 54,000 and it’s almost empty.
On the down side, the few students I do see are often walking close together with masks not on properly. to be fair they might be room mates but I doubt all of them are.
We’ll have to see.
@gvg: Same at Georgia.
I think that if you remove Fox “News” from the midst, you have a start at returning to sanity.
Don’t know how we can do that, precisely, but its effects are dangerous and known, and it should not be hiding behind the First Amendment to propagandize a significant part of our populace.
No one is writing sad articles about “my parents/grandparents went whack after watching CBS.” It’s Fox “News.”
We cannot survive a purposely disinformed voting population, and better information cannot reach these morons and drive out bad information, since Fox has bound them to the mothership
I know Facebook is an issue too, but Fox News is the granddaddy (and the entertainment company that is posing as a news broadcast).
No American “journalist” would ask those questions. It’s “unfair” to call someone a misogynist and a homophobe just because he has a long history of saying and doing misogynistic and homophobic things.
University of South Carolina has reported 1k+ COVID cases. I’ve seen pics/video of students there just running wild, partying like we’re not in the middle of a pandemic. Monumental failure, but of course it’s USC.
@Elizabelle: Since Fox, Trump, and the Republicans admire him so much, maybe we should ask “How does Putin handle journalists who cause him problems?”
@Leto: Again, same at Georgia. From a faculty member who was told she could NOT distribute the number about students,
“UGA just reported 821 positive cases in the past week. These are the ones people voluntarily reported. There are more.”
Let’s just ponder for a moment that the Trump Administration did nothing to address the pandemic until it was too late and now have done nothing about the economic problems that were sure to follow doing nothing about the pandemic all summer.
They have now dropped the ball on this one catastrophe not once, but TWICE.
“Incompetent” isn’t sufficient to describe how bad they are at their jobs. They’re extraordinarily bad at their jobs.
They could have done something about the economy knowing the massive stimulus effect was going to end! Instead they chose to pursue the black-clad antifa on planes problem. All summer.
And they haven’t even been able to do anything about that. There’s just as many as there ever were.
It’s easy in Maryland. I’m registered for vote-by-mail, there will be a drop-box near me (at the nearby high school, it says). I can also check my registration/balloting status online anytime I’m getting antsy.
And too much encouragement (worship? enjoyment?) of opposition and defiant behavior.
Anyway, open thread so
The old slog is of course, “When you have nothing, pound the table.”
All their noise and table pounding is to cover up that they have nothing. No leader, no reasonable direction, no workable ideas, no reasonable goals, nothing. OK they have racism. Lots and lots of racism. And whiteness, lots and lots of whiteness. If it weren’t so dangerous, it would be boring, loud and ignorant. But then look who they think is a leader.
A subpoena is speeding its way right now to Antifa, LLC. Oh, wait. No it’s not, because they broke the postal service. It’ll get there sometime in October.
Quietly remove Fox News (and Sinclair) management and replace them with people who will play ball, and make the on-air talent read scripts written by cult deprogrammers to gradually talk sense into their viewers. Pretty sure that was a Philip K. Dick story.
The Moar You Know
@Elizabelle: You’ve got the influence count backwards. Fox has a small viewing audience, average 2.5 million.
Facebook has a thousand times that, over two billion active users. They are a news broadcast masquerading as a social club.
Facebook will be the end of civilization unless they are stopped. I mean that seriously.
Grrr…three houses on the street our beach house is on are flying “Trump Keep America Great” flags from poles, and I have to walk past every one of ’em on my way to the walkway out to the beach strand. Yesterday I ran into the former owner of the house across the street at the beach (they built another house a street over) with whom I’ve always been casually friendly, especially when chatting while walking our dogs – she cheerfully inquired into the health of my aging 18yo italian greyhound. To my horror, she was wearing a Trump 2020 T-shirt, and I felt the kind of horror-movie dissonance on discovering that the next-door neighbor you’d known for years was really an alien from a hostile planet, but I managed to keep poker-faced and ignore it for purposes of our totally nonpolitical chat.
I wisely decided to refrain from engaging her on her politics – wouldn’t do any good, and they were always nice, friendly neighbors – and relations will turn back to normalcy after Nov 3 and Biden wins. I hope
My house is in the southernmost barrier island in North Carolina, hard by the South Carolina line, so it’s a red area more closely resembling SC than inland NC, and not representative of the state as a whole. But geez, it was also annoying driving through Little River, SC just across the line Sunday and seeing a bunch of guys with mixed Trump and Conferate flag regalia out by the road promoting Trump and selling Trump merch.
@Kay: Oh so tempting to pay the filing fee and register a corporation with that name.
It’s been a long time since I spent money on something purely self-indulgent, but this morning I gave in and ordered a set of those Speks multi-colour magnetic fidget balls that you see advertised on line. If I start feeling guilty about spending money on a toy, I’ll justify it as an important element in regaining full use of my still-weakened left hand.
While I was shopping, I also ordered a couple of Biden/Harris 2020 tee-shirts, but I look on those as a necessity, not an indulgence.
New Illustrated Voting Plans are up.
Let them inspire you and others.
And post your Voting Plan, here, to see your plan pictured tomorrow!
The Trump merchandise might be kind of an interesting story for someone to pursue. The vendors set up here in a supermarket parking lot – that’s where they get the flags. I bet it’s wildly profitable and the Trump people at the top are taking a huge cut. It’s a whole side business of Sleazy Trump Enterprises, Inc.
This captures my feeling perfectly. So much so that I won’t be satisfied with just a Biden win. There must be prosecutions and convictions for every one of these grifting lawbreakers. If we manage to pull our own fat out of the fire, those responsible for tearing down every treasured institution must be held accountable for gleefully shoving us over the brink. they absolutely CANNOT get away with it.
Trump confronts Kavanaugh:
@raven: I saw in the post downstairs that it’s your 1 year anni for retirement. Can I say that I’m glad you’re out of that? Also I hope you figure out the issue with your foot/ankle.
I risked my life this morning to report on the danger that is current Seattle. Scroll up for all of the photos but warning: not for the faint of heart.
@The Moar You Know: Friend of mine who I formerly thought was educated now gets all of his news from Facebook. We don’t talk anymore. His college should refund his tuition money. It is stunning what he believes because it’s on Facebook.
I sat in a parking lot for 2 hours this morning because I can’t go into the nice air-conditioned building and sit in a waiting room and have access to a bathroom while my husband has tests. This has been going on all summer. Today I just broke and started screaming, “I HATE TRUMP! I HATE TRUMP!” Part of it was reading a letter to the editor in the NYT that said Trump is going to win because rioting is visible and Covid is invisible. GODDAMNIT it isn’t invisible when my whole life is turned upside down and I haven’t even caught it yet!!!!!
Not that they should take advice from me but “Antifa” is a bad name. It’s hard to say and someone hearing it won’t make the connection to “fascist”. They should change it- throw the crack Trump investigators off the trail.
how we can do that
A first step that I think maybe the FCC or Commerce can take without running afoul of the First Amendment:
Mandate cafeteria pricing of cable TV packages.
Fox News has hemorrhaged advertisers, and advertising revenue is nowhere near paying the bills. But Fox charges the cable operators very high fees to carry FN, and thus recoups its costs and considerably more.
The cable operators, in turn, cover this by putting FN in every available channel “package” offered to subscribers, and charging every customer for a share of the carriage fee.
If cable customers were allowed to opt out of Fox News, and if the law said that the pricing of FN had to reflect the carriage fee per customer who affirmatively subscribes, then FN would actually be subject to the market forces from which the current scheme protects it.
Public Service Announcement…
I think it’s easy to slip into the pattern of thinking about a nation as growing, aging and declining like a person, with an inevitable slide into senescence. But it’s not that simple. The US has had an outright slave society leading to a civil war, it’s had regional white-supremacist authoritarianism with coups d’état and pogroms, it’s had Gilded Age hyper-capitalism that let the regulatory sector rot to nothing, it’s had many violent crises of legitimacy… and we actually came back from these things. Imperfectly, and with compromises. But we’re no dumber or more apathetic than most of us were in those times.
I see the current moment as kind of like the 1960s-70s in reverse. There was a confluence of a number of things (the Vietnam War, stagflation, rising crime, oil crises… and some of it was just white resentment of expanded civil rights) that convinced the American people that the entire project of liberal governance that been the general environment of political thought from the 1930s to then was a failure.
What we’ve got now is a situation in which the conservative paradigm that followed as a reaction to that, which has been the general framework of political thought since 1980, is revealed as a failure. It’s hanging on by mental inertia and its sheer dedication to antidemocratic power. Trump is trying to win by playing ancient tunes left over from the 60s-70s crisis. But if we can kick it, which could involve elections and legislation or it might have to be some kind of revolution, we can still build a more decent society.
@Kay: The Daily Beast says Devin Nunes (of fake cow lawsuit fame) is the one who told Trump about Air Antifa. Seems legit. I’m awaiting more details on the “gear” that allegedly identifies antifa-types on a plane. We know cans/bags of soup aren’t allowed.
Let us know how your OH Moms for Biden group goes! The only targeted invitation like that I’ve received was a “Rural Believers for Biden” group that featured “faith leaders.” I declined to attend since I figured my presence would do more harm than good.
You’re a better person than I.
Former acquaintances in Trump gear get the cut direct from me.
@eclare: We need to hope there actually is a Hell, because it’s the only way Zuckerberg is ever going to be made to pay for what he’s done.
The Moar You Know
@Kay: The people working the “Mobile Trump Merch Booths” in my town have gone one much smarter step – all their shit is bootleg. Trump’s not getting a dime off of them. I’m totally OK with that. Republican penny-ante grifters stealing from other Republicans is what we’ve already devolved to.
Just wanted to add, ‘that’s no gentleman, he’s the former Prime Minister of Australia’ and a very, very nasty piece of work he is. Misogyny and homophobia are just the start of a long list. Here he is wanting the old folks to die for the sake of the economy: https://www.abc.net.au/news/2020-09-01/tony-abbott-urges-against-coronavirus-restrictions-uk-covid-19/12619264
A bloody Neo-Malthusian.
the general framework of political thought since 1980, is revealed as a failure
I blame Reagan.
And Paul Weyrich. And Jude Wanniski. And the College Republicans. And Grover [spit] Norquist. And Newt. And Alan Greenspan. And the University of Chicago economics department. And the National Review.
And especially the river of money from “conservative” wealthy such as the Kochs, the Coors family, the Waltons, etc.
But Reagan was the front man that sold this bill of goods to a mass audience.
Ignored the pandemic economy just like they ignored the pandemic. Biden talked about the Trump Administration doing nothing to support K-12 schools to reopen- it was actually worse than that, they attacked public schools – and I’m thrilled he mentioned it, but it’s bigger than not doing any work there- they don’t do any real work at all.
@The Moar You Know:
That’s interesting. I wanted to talk to our guy but I always assume they’re armed so I generally stay away from them. He has an absolute piece of shit truck, so maybe he’s a bootlegger. Good. Someone should make money off these creeps.
The Moar You Know
@eclare: It’s a savagely effective mix of peer pressure and trust relationships. It’s hard to see how effective it is from the inside, but look at what’s it’s done in India, the Philippines, and Brazil. And then realize it’s done all that and worse here. I have never in my life seen a more effective tool for manipulating people.
A Ghost to Most
The hard part starts on Nov. 4.
Right. Are they against fascism, or do they sell a pill for when you’re gassy? No way to tell from the name.
@Kay: Even though I think Boris is an upper class clueless twat at least his government swung into action (albeit late) when the pandemic hit. They introduced the furlough scheme where workers were paid 80% of their wages for staying home, so noone had to apply for unemployment. (The employer paid the wages and then they were reimbursed by the government). There were lots of other measures that were introduced to make sure people didn’t suffer as a result of being under lockdown. Just recently they had the “Eat Out To Help Out” scheme in the month off August where pubs and restaurants give 50% off food and the government picks up the remaining 50% on Mon, Tues, Weds. This has been hugely popular with restaurants and pubs absolutely jam packed on those three days a week, (which would normally be quiet). Like I said the response was not perfect but at least they realised that the only way to fix the problem was to throw money at it and defecit be damned.
@joel hanes: I welcome the votes of the conservatives who insist that Trumpworld’s crude, nakedly corrupt, racist authoritarianism is some kind of betrayal of the legacy of Reagan… but I think they’re still living in an illusion.
‘Scheme’ is a strong word for a man who has built his life around whining and lawsuits, especially since the only legal theory behind his lawsuits has been “I have the money to take this to court and you don’t”
You know, I don’t find this stuff amusing anymore
I think the idea that this is basically movement conservatism in the process of imploding is a interesting and optimistic take on what’s happening.
I think the more pessimistic take is that white America is processing the idea of a truly multi-ethnic democracy in the near future where whites would basically be first among equals instead of running the show and are in the process of deciding whether democracy should be abandoned or not to protect the existing social, cultural, and economic structure.
Definitely something off with the repeat comment function. We’ve gone timey-wimey groundhoggish! How 2020.
Enhanced Voting Techniques
It sure seems like Trumpism is a mirror for the American Malaise of the ’70s. On the other hand, despair doesn’t lead to success, so it’s vote Blue to live or vote Red to die now.
I have cut off everyone I’ve ever known who is a Trumper. Fuck them. You say they are nice people, but simply having that shirt on says she’s a monster, a disgusting monster. I live in a red area. I don’t care if I never speak to anyone in my town ever again. Fuck them all, I hope they all catch the virus an die, gasping and heaving for breath all alone.
A friend said to me the other day – “I’m not sure who I’m going to vote for, but I’m open to being swayed one way or the other.”
I worked hard not to have my eyes pop out of my head like looney-tunes character. My only thought was, ” you’re just looking for someone to give you a reason to vote for trump without guilt.”
I did not try to “sway” her. If you can’t see for yourself what a lying, evil, disaster trump is, well I’m just very sorry for you. She’s welcome to see the Biden Harris sign in my yard and on my car as my endorsement.
@zhena gogolia: Come park next to me. Don’t read the NYT, they’re nuts. The virus isn’t invisible. People are worried and scared. You have company. I park in that parking lot every day here at the clinic. I see their faces.
And, you know what else isn’t invisible? People on unemployment and miles long food bank lines. We just have to care for each other and hold on until 1/21/21!
Nero fiddles while Rome gets sick and starves.
I wrote a script to count down the time until the polls close on in my home state, CA. As I post this, the count down to the election is:
@eclare: Education doesn’t seem to be an inoculation. I cannot tell you how many dentists, doctors and veterinarians are diehard trump supporters.
I am firm with dentist offices that I will not be back if I had to endure my time in the chair being lectured about republican logic. I’ve had three dentists in three years because of that.
@VeniceRiley: Yes, but MSNBC tells me that the most important story today is Nancy Pelosi’s haircut.
@Kay: Shortening “fascist” to “fa” there strikes me as sounding like the way English-derived loan abbreviations are made in Japanese, like “Famicom” for “family computer”. (Americans given the task would probably have concocted something like “Famputer”.)
Why didn’t you just say that? Maybe hearing it, spoken aloud by her own friend, might give her pause.
I just remember something. Back in 1999 I worked for a small company for a few months. A coworker was a fan of talk radio and repeatedly engaged me in discussions about global warming. He admitted it was real, but claimed it was a benefit to mankind. That civilization really took off after the ice age, with increased agriculture, migration, etc. I only lasted there a few months, and I just realized that was 21 years ago. I wonder where he is now.
21 years later, and the debate continues.
It’s originally European, no?
Perhaps keep it simple.
“I’m voting for Biden. He’s a decent man and Trump is not.”
If your friend wants to argue, then you have confirmation that he or she isn’t really on the fence.
@Baud: As far as I know, the dudes in Spain were anti-fascist.
This might put a smile on some faces: Obama speaking 25 years ago. He looks sooo young!
Interesting. The natural climate fluctuations are not the same thing as the impact of human caused issues from industrialization, pollution, etc.
Seriously, I’d lump(en proletariat) ’em in with the petite bourgeoisie. They can be some of the most reactionary folks in this country.
“Global warming? It’s a good thing! We’ll grow oranges in Alaska!”
“We don’t live in Alaska, Dale, we’re in Texas. It was 102 degrees in the shade today. And if it gets one degree hotter, I am gonna kick your ass.”
@Elizabelle: Because I’ve found that leading by example is far more effective than confrontation. If you are in my life, you know how I live, what I believe and who I am by my actions. I’m assuming you remain in my life because those things are important to you.
I know it’s not popular with some, but I’m much more compassionate in person that I may seem here. And I’ve seen remarkable change with people in my life, including trump supporting relatives.
People who are uncomfortable with that tend to drift away (and I don’t reach out to reconnect), so I have very few in my life any longer.
@germy: I was saying this in a late night thread. A lit of what Trump is doing is theater (maybe violent and harmful theater, but theater nevertheless). We can’t get distracted by Trump signing an EO defunding Seattle (he has no power to do that); we’ve about two months until the election. We need to hunker down and concentrate on winning that and making sure the votes are counted. After that, we can get to work starting to fix things.
@joel hanes: OhPleaseOhPleaseOhPlease…
There needs to be sensible reforms of corporate boards as well. Corporations get legal benefits because they serve society, but in return they have responsibilities. We need to put teeth into those responsibilities.
How? That’s above my pay grade.
@pacem appellant: Remember to vote before it gets to 0.
Also before this countdown gets to 0.
@joel hanes: I agree, but the sports channels will fight cafeteria pricing hard too. Not an easy lift even once Agit Pai is gone.
@Omnes Omnibus: I mostly disagree. I mean yes, it’s kind of throwing ideas around to see what happens, but we can’t ignore them either. He’s floated very dangerous ideas as trial balloons and if it weren’t for the pushback, some of them would have happened.
And right now the anger of, “No you don’t, you fucker! You are not using my beloved community as your goddamn scapegoat,” is helping fuel me a bit to keep going for the next two months.
Trump is the patron saint of conspicuous consumption; the McMansion on a bubble loan, the leased Escalade, bribing your kid into USC.
I don’t get it. Why are they confessing?
They’re not confessing.
Somebody needs to ask Donny why HIS TSA allowed a planefull of uniformed, body-armor wearing miscreants onto a commercial flight. Were they also swarthy? IDK, sounds like a management failure to me.
Trump will still be president for almost 3 months more. I seriously doubt he’s going to accept losing as long as he has the levers of government at hand. I don’t know what nonsense he’ll pull, but I’m sure it’ll be bad.
Best case scenario: relations get back to normal January 21st.
@gvg: It amazes me that UF’s enrollment is 54K. I’m an alum (class of 1988), and it was around 25K when I was there, and that seemed unimaginably huge. :)
I have tried engaging the unconcerned (and geologists, always the geologists) that unlike natural climate fluctuations we (humans) have the accelerator pedal pressed to the floor and have sawed off the brake pedal entirely. “Let’s see what happens.” CO2 levels are higher than any time in the last million years.
It’s not a question of ignoring it, it’s a question of looking for the underlying reality. What exactly has to happen for him to make the threat real? What information is available to independently evaluate whatever decision was made/might be made. Does that decision have any real effect? Are there ways to reinforce the paths that might be vulnerable? The orange fart cloud is going to fart orange clouds no matter what. The thing to do is determine if there is any reality, work on that, and ignore the rest of the bullshit.
Geologists typically don’t get to perform real time lab experiments. I can understand why their excited about climate change.
I am not afraid of what Trump will pull when he loses. He is a lazy, cowardly incompetent with low quality hires. I am mildly afraid of what McConnell will pull. Wrecking the place on the way out so Democrats can’t fix anything is a Republican legislative tradition.
The real problem isn’t the people who have “lost faith in democracy,” but the tens of millions who have never had any interest in democracy. Many have the time and energy to devote to passive pursuits like being avid sports fans or being involved in social media, but not to being informed about vital issues that affect the lives of virtually everyone on the planet. When a person’s latest selfie is more important than preventing a mindless fascist from being re-elected (or elected in the first place) that person is a disaster for democracy, freedom, human rights, environmental threats and more.
Or alternatively, “I’m voting for Biden. He believes in democracy, while Trump is an authoritarian who has no understanding of the US Constitution.”
@Frankensteinbeck: What can Mcconnell do? All he can do is what he has been doing. Judges.
That is the global story against which ours is evolving. Mass movement of people is provoking reaction from dominant ethnic groups worldwide. This will only increase long-term because of environmental stresses from global warming (despite the hiatus caused by the pandemic).
Believe it or not, I think over the long haul the United States has a better shot at dealing with this than many other societies. The fact that part of our national ideological heritage is an idea that Americanness is not ethnic; that’s big. But the death throes of white supremacy are going to be violent, and it’s possible we go through something like an apartheid era first–white minority government explicitly enforced by bullet and truncheon. But the obvious practical failures of conservatism make that harder.
Just where did you expect all those gators to go after the massive D.C. swamp-draining? :-P
This is why I consider it so important that Trump goes *down*, hard, and objectively. Not in an election: in the indictment, and criminal trial, if it comes to trial.
I saw a person say a narcissist will gladly flip on all associates, and might not even realize you need a plea deal *before* you give what you have – they’re flipping because those associates were “disloyal” and “allowed this to happen”, and the goal is just to hurt them. And I suspect Trump knows enough dirt about enough of the Republican Party to trigger a cascade of witnesses turning state’s evidence.
I suspect that we’d find a lot of horrible things, enough to break the Republican Party’s back, and require it to rebuilt.
That said, I’m equally worried that the Republican Party has used too much extreme rhetoric, and allowed too many conspiracy theories to fly, that there may be too many people who will take even the most objective evidence as a frame-up. I mean, think about it: the Republicans had convinced many of their followers that over 20 judges ignored basic mistakes in fact and law, which led to the “murder” of Terri Schiavo. Did they ever say “wow… we really effed up!”? No… and given how widely they spread lies, about the facts, and the law, well, that’s as horrifying as if an administration had started a war, based on false pretenses, leading to the pointless deaths of tens of thousands of people, and unleashed Daesh/ISIS and people still pretended it was a normal political decision. Oh, wait, that happened too.
Anyway: that’s my point. The Republicans have been treating their actions as racism: it’s too horrifying to make such a nasty accusation unless you have proof that will satisfy every listener, which can’t be done; and, when they have to stop doing something, they keep grousing about their inability to do something evil, making it sound like a cruel injustice, and leading to them finding another way to accomplish the same thing – rather than, say, acknowledging they’d done something wrong, and trying to do better next time.
And their followers, reading or listening to right wing media, can only see the so-called “injustice” done to their people (much like the “horrifying injustice” of black people being able to use the n-word, while white people aren’t).
 That is to say, if you say that a Republican is racist, the first response is that the accusation is *so* nasty, it shouldn’t have been made (because to Republicans, accusations of racism are *far* worse than, you know, actual racism that isn’t violent or hateful), and, when they have to give up some aspect of racism (from slavery, to not using black face, or the n-word), they act as if something terrible was taken from them, rather than acknowledging “okay, now we know better” and (gasp) trying to make amends. It was just today that I realized that the same tactic works on a lot more than racism.
This is part of the weird thing that Trump does to appeal to his base. Half the time he sounds exactly like them. Ignorant and full of conspiracy theories. So he says crap like “I’ve heard” and “Some people say” in reference to information that you might expect to be part of his daily briefing if it were real or important.
Meanwhile, … https://www.govexec.com/oversight/2020/09/trump-administration-backing-out-647-million-ventilator-deal-after-propublica-investigated-price/168211/
Maybe the government has no need to be run as a “business”? Especially by “business” people who are incompetent?
Alternatively, this is what happens when people who want to break and ‘deconstruct’ the government get into power. We cannot let that happen again.
@Baud:I mean yeah he could stack the judiciary to the gills but other than that I couldn’t think of what else he could muck up that couldn’t be undone by the next Congress. And honestly even a few of the most unqualified justices could be impeached.
Why not both?
Imagine how huge I find my employer’s enrollment at 99,000. And my alma mater, Pitt, is at 35,000. Of course, PSU counts the enrollment at all the campuses and Pitt doesn’t count those at their satellite campuses, mainly because they are considered independent entities and share almost nothing, unlike PSU. For instance, you can take two years of almost every one of the over 170 degrees PSU offers (less than a handful of exceptions) and seamlessly change to any other PSU campus, including the University Park campus (what outsiders call the main campus), to finish as long as the student has met all the entrance to degree requirements. Pitt’s various campuses are stand alone and you have to apply to transfer into the main campus and not many are accepted.
Depends on the geologist. I worked ~20 years ago with those who very much agreed that there was global warming occurring but were (back then) not so sure humans were causing it and those who were very sure humans were behind it. This was in a more-of-less academic setting. I’d be very interested in what those latter day not-quite-skeptics are thinking nowadays.
@zzyzx: If we chase every squirrel he sets loose, that is all we will be doing.
@trollhattan: Why do these geologists lean denialist? Is it the association between geologists and the fossil-fuel industry?
@Yutsano: It can always be worse. We can’t forget that.
FY20 ends in less than 27 days and there’s no obvious rush on the GOP side to do anything about it [i.e. pass a CR] (nor the HEROES act)…
@PAM Dirac: Exactly.
Nothing about that Trump/Barr/Rand Paul conspiracy theory makes any sort of sense. Why would antifa thugs all get on an airplane “in uniform”. What is the “gear” they were carrying? Why would it even be allowed on the plane? Why weren’t they arrested on landing?
It’s not just a transparently false conspiracy theory, it doesn’t even describe anything illegal.
Doesn’t that describe virtually everyone at the convention itself?
@Aleta: The “Fall of Civilizations” podcast has 2 1/2 hour episodes.
fairly slow and restful
Of course, each episode covers thousands of years, so what do you expect?
James E Powell
I blame white people, especially the ones who are loud about Jesus.
Don’t knock the profession. A lot of the climate scientists are geologists. The ones who lean denialist usually work for the oil industry.
There was book about the doubt industry over tobacco and cancer.
They moved to climate change and fossil fuels.
Can’t think of the exact name, but somebody else will know it.
Villago Delenda Est
The vermin of the Village are nothing more than glorified PR flaks, infotainers. None of them qualify as “journalists”. They are, however, doing their actual jobs: generating revenue (via ratings) for their inhuman corporate overlords.
Wipe them out. All of them.
@Omnes Omnibus: Yeah, but to really gild this metaphor: have you ever seen the kind of damage a squirrel can do?
Could be. A lot of geological study is underpinned by resource extraction.
@geg6: 99K — wow! I wonder what’s the largest enrollment at a single university campus?
@geg6: Come sit by me six feet away… robe a Trump supporter is to be such a deficient human being that they must be shunned
only when they hold both houses and presidency
‘Losing Earth’ by Nathaniel Rich is pretty good in that regard.
@different-church-lady: Okay, think of it as our version of the gom jabbar.
@catclub: A lot of the prominent climate-denialist people are literally the same people who got their start shilling for tobacco, and a surprising amount of early anti-environmentalist propaganda was actually funded by the tobacco industry.
I wondered about that for a while, but apparently a lot of it was motivated by a desire to sow suspicion of international NGOs in general, to make people mistrust ones like the WHO that were saying tobacco was a major global health hazard. Also, of course, the tobacco lobby is an ag lobby and the industry has to deal with environmental regulation directly.
Marginally on topic, but it seems today is the day the stock market discovered that there may be problems with the economy.
@Betty Cracker: It amazes me that it isn’t bigger. I went back to school and finished after 30. Graduated in 93 and it was already 52,000 then. They put the brakes on and said we can’t….it actually seems less crowded than when I was here as a student. Some of them are already online only. A lot fewer attend summer than used to and it’s quiet in the summer. The buses got efficient and until this semester bikes had almost disappeared. Pandemic is making people rethink that. Lots more parking garages and dorms and even apartment complexes built. Things just aren’t as crowded.
A lot of classes already had online components. quizzes and papers had to be done online. We have online MBA’s and undergrad for a few majors. It gave us some advantages for switching to online.
Oh yes, the townhall this week specifically came out and said they expect spring term to be the same as fall, virus won’t be done. It’s a relief to hear it said. People can make plans.
Ms. Joe and I are training to do Vote Tripling phone banking: Once the person you’re talking to has said that Yes, he/she is supporting Candidate X (we’re doing Senate races) and will vote, we ask if there are three people who he/she can remind to vote. We ask for first names only, or some identifier (“my sister-in-law”), and a couple of weeks later we follow up with a post card reminding them to remind their SIL, and Pete, and The Guy across the Street, to vote.
We can’t do this ourselves because we literally don’t know anyone who doesn’t vote — or, of course, will vote for Trump. Through years of social sifting we have eliminated all such people from our lives … which wasn’t hard, because we never hung out with those types in the first place.
I can’t speak to your friend, but the wavering Trump voters I know liked him for a very specific reason (usually conservative judges, or the economy). If you can convince them he’s failing on that point, you have a chance, but it’s a hard slog.
You’d have an easier time convincing someone who simply always votes (R), held their nose and hoped for the best in 2016. But if they’re flying his flag and wearing his gear in September 2020, it’s probably not worth the effort.
@catclub: Merchants of Doubt. It’s very good, but I wish they had run it by a lawyer first. Their discussion of various depositions and misunderstanding “object the form” and so forth was a bit jarring to me (who is far from a lawyer).
Jen Rubin (again) says the Republican Party is past redemption.
@Haroldo: In 2000, it was generally accepted that humans were the cause, but the evidence wasn’t quite so damning as it is today.
Coincidentally, that was also when Republicans started to go all-in on denial, because it would let them continue to fellate the fossil fuel fsckers, and draw a distinction between Republicans (“WE WILL KILL MILLIONS TO LET YOU KEEP YOUR HUMMER!”) and Democrats (“we’d love for global warming to be false, but it *isn’t*”).
@Another Scott: Well, Sarbanes-Oxley and McCain-Feingold attempted to do just that, but got gutted as time went on, or else weren’t enforced. THAT is what has to stop…
I think of these as different threats. McConnell will definitely plan to hobble the government with specific targets and in a way that will continue to poison the country after he loses power. Trump is more likely to appeal to violence, to sabotage agencies, abandon allies or commit open treason.
I worked in a building that lost one leg of the three-phase power every couple months, because a squirrel was crawling on the transformer and shorted it.
Different squirrel each time, of course.
I just read in the The Jerusalem Post that a drone dropped hundreds of bags of cannabis onto Rabin Square in Tel Aviv today. Police say they have arrested the two drone operators. Truly the land of milk and honey.
Or at least made indirectly possible. I understand that there’s relatively little knowledge of the subsurface geology of Iowa, because there’s no oil so no deep-drilling.
Don’t confuse “professional diploma” with “education.” Most professional degrees signify nothing but the holder’s ability at rote memorization – no actual thinking required – and yet the motherfuckers think they’re goddamn geniuses, & that after a half-hour’s worth of desultory consideration they know more about any field of inquiry than everyone who’s devoted a lifetime of study to it. (The cretinous Rand “Aqua Buddha” Paul is a prime example.)
@Matt McIrvin: Merchants of Doubt! I remembered.
I voted in 2018 not for Nancy to stop Trump, because I knew the House has limited power alone, but for Nancy to stop McConnell. I am very, very glad I did it. A Democratic House with a strong Democratic leader has reduced McConnell to ‘appointing judges’ and ‘sitting on his ass style obstruction.’
@The Moar You Know:
Tis as it always was.
They wouldn’t care if they were screwing their supporters, as they show by their policy “decisions.” The republican party has devolved into it’s minimum actual functional bit, a grifting enterprise, and nothing more. It is all about the money, it always has been, always will be and their supporters are the rubes. They were never about good government, they only believe in self enrichment, the strong get over, the weak get run over. One for all and all for ME! It’s not that they don’t know who shitforbrains is, they respect him because he’s gotten ahead screwing everyone. We think it’s wrong, they think it’s great. Those peeling off of the republican party thought it was a political party that just wanted minimal governance. But it is a grifting scheme extraordinaire first and an even minimal political party last and least. shitforbrains is their leader because while he says the quiet parts not just out loud but at the top of his lungs and brainpower, the old guard party leaders have been screwing the party, the country, each other, and their supporters behind the scenes, but he puts it right out front and proud, just like the KKK of his dad. As someone put it so well, something about not having a curtain rod, they will suffer anything, as long as their enemies suffer the slightest bit more.
@TaMara (HFG): I think we can agree that this election *really* is like “you can have chicken, or a dog turd coated with splinters of broken glass” and your friend is like “how is the chicken cooked? Fried, roasted, etc.?”
I like that analogy, because if you truly love Trump, then, yeah, I guess you must hate an honorable, decent, human being who says he can fix a lot of what Trump has broken. And if you’re sane, reasonable, and at least a *tiny* bit informed, you’d never vote for Trump.
If nothing else, Trump saying, “Seattle is an anarchist jurisdiction,” mixed with his defense of Rittenhouse is a message to his violent supporters to come here and attack people.
I’m sorry but I live here. I have a friend who lives right on the edge of the CHAZ area. Some of my favorite restaurants are there and go to that part fairly regularly in normal times. I can’t just laugh it off.
@TaMara (HFG): My dentist and I had a horrified conversation in 2016 about the number of dentists he knew professionally who supported Cheeto. Saw him a few weeks ago, and same-same. It’s even more horrifying now than in 2016. (The dentist & I are both from the east coast, so we’ve known what a schmuck Cheeto is all along.)
@sdhays: A floor wax AND a dessert topping!
Mike in NC
@TaMara (HFG): It’s all about the tax cuts with those people.
So much this. COVID is visible to me every day when I have to put on a mask to leave the house. It’s visible when I walk by schools on the way to work that don’t have any in-person classes right now but are still passing out free school lunches. I can see it when I get to the train station and see an almost empty parking lot and signs saying masks are mandatory. I see it when I get to work and have to go through a COVID screening every day. I see it when I can’t wait until lunch because it’s my one chance of the work day to take off my mask. If you can’t see COVID at similar times in your day, you’re blind.
@Litlebritdifrnt: The Tory government has made numerous mistakes in their response to COVID-19 but, at least since BoJo’s near brush with death, I believe they’ve genuinely been trying. And, to be fair, all but a handful of governments, have made errors.
Tony Abbott is a sign of how desperate the government is, now the “easy to get” deal with the EU is proving as difficult to get as we knew it would be. I suspect they would overlook him being found in bed with a barnyard of farm animals if they felt he could pull off a trade deal- any trade deal with anyone- they could wave around to ‘prove’ Brexit will be successful.
As for the interview with Matt Hancock, I am amazed how polite and respectful American interviewers are. She was polite compared to some political journalists over here. A while ago some Rethug got interviewed by Andrew Neil and ended up calling him a leftist because he asked hardball questions. For US readers, Andrew Neil is about as far from left wing as its possible to be in the UK and still get invited to nice parties.
@zhena gogolia: Anyway, the rioting is largely invisible because most of it doesn’t exist. Trump’s message, which most Republicans seem to believe, is that every major city in America is burning and wracked with political violence. This just isn’t happening. It’s, like, a few blocks in the downtown area of 2 or 3 cities that are having trouble, mostly fomented by cops. It’s hard for me to believe that people will fail to notice this forever.
@zzyzx: No one is asking you to laugh it off.
The US national affairs news media are a bunch of contemptible, lazy, ignorant, servile boot lickers pf power and money compared to other countries. I remember watching a roundtable discussion of RT news staff with their boss man Putin several years ago, which was a very weird thing to see. Not sure how thoroughly rehearsed it was, but everyone knew what to do and say. US press behavior is almost as bad.
I do agree that American conservatism being so obviously tied to plutocracy and predatory capitalism makes buy-in from white America for a illiberal state under the guise of conservatism more difficult.
I also think (hope) our version of corporatism and consumer capitalism isn’t compatible with a non-free society (China seems to have found a model but I suspect it’s unique to them) so I don’t think the uber-wealthy and Corporate America are going to finance or back a form of government that is outright authoritarian.
I hope I’m not like some Weimar liberal putting my hopes in conservative elites recognizing the dangers they face from the right but I don’t think if America turns authoritarian it will be a top-down coup. I think it will have to be a right-wing bottom-up overturning of the American republic.
I think codetermination would be great, but I have not idea how to make it work without functioning unions.
@Roger Moore: Blockquote/linky fail??
Perhaps I should have been more specific. I started working with geologists ca. 1996. By 2000, the case for anthropogenic climate change was stronger, and in the intervening 20 years much stronger yet. My point was there were still geologists in, say, 1998, who wanted more evidence. However, there were a lot of geologists I worked with in 1998 who said the jury was in. I’d love to go back and talk with my old mates about this.
I have no idea what the USGS is like these days, but back then it was still undergoing stress from a lot of non ‘hard-rock’ geologists being brought into the Survey (e.g., hydrologists, climate scientists). Some very hard feelings, it seemed. Perhaps that was driving Trollhattan’s geologist comment.
@Omnes Omnibus: When Trump is trying to encourage people to come to my city and smash heads to win reelection, seeing, “Eh, it’s just a distraction. Ignore it,” doesn’t feel particularly helpful to me.
(And yes, I mocked it, but that’s different from laughing it off. That’s an attempt to try to push back.)
ETA: And yeah, I’m probably a bit cranky because of…. looks around and points at the world and shrugs… but this is the second time Trump has threatened my city for his kicks and it’s not fun.
Absolute clowns. They do this “work” all day, everyday. Nothing on the pandemic, nothing on the economy – just stupid, nasty juvenile bullshit all day long.
I like to imagine the low quality hires around a table planning another week of …not working.
@TaMara (HFG): Dentists and doctors tend to be R. Especially dentists since it has been conservative for so long and until recently was all small businesses with 1 or 2 dentists; the rise in corporate chain dentistry is changing that business model. I think that’s part of the “screw small businesses on taxes with one hand while harping with the other about how pro-small business they are” scam that The R’s and their media system has been running for decades.
The data show that the more profitable the medical specialty, the more conservative so ortho surgeons and cardiologists are the most R, something like 70%. What was interesting in the study I saw was the majority of general practice and paediatric doctors were D and pro ACA, and the younger they were, the stronger they believed that healthcare is a right. Those two are also the least profitable medical degrees. Even my wing nut niece the GP said it was criminal how poorly compensated pediatricians are, something to the effect of “yeah pay the people who treat kids the worst, so stupid”. You could have knocked me over with a feather since she’s a Bob Jones grad and used her completing her residency speech at the local hospital as an opportunity to witness her faith (SB at the time, now Episcopalian by marriage and reality exposure).
More fake work. Go look for an example of one of the Trump people doing any productive work at all- Biden’s really hit on something with his “they did nothing”. They perform no work at all.
@TaMara (HFG): Yeah, but you can say that in a non-confrontational matter, and not harp on it.
When people are saying things like that, maybe they want a reaction, and maybe they want to hear the counterargument. In a gentle and respectful manner.
I tend to avoid the strident in real life, too.
@Mike in NC: I thought that series was riveting.
Normalizing wrong is a tool of grifters. They want you to willingly give them money because that’s less work than actually taking it out of your pocket, which you might notice. Do you want an AR-15? Why would you, we don’t live in a war zone. Oh wait, aren’t all those people trying to kill you, rob you, rape your children, burn down your house? And aren’t the police supposed to protect you from all of that? Problem is that normalizing wrong only goes so far and only works on some people, which is where we are now. The process is obvious to many, even if they can’t explain it. So when it’s carried out on a national level it can really go very wrong, which is exactly what is happening here and in other countries right now. The real rubes haven’t and won’t catch on, but the rest of us are seeing the shit show up close and personal.
He’s already doing the two things he can do: confirming judges as fast as possible and blocking all the legislation that comes out of the House.
How many people did it take to come up with and draft the ridiculous EO claiming to do something or other to cities? 20, do you think? We paid 20 low quality Trump hires to produce that garbage. It’s what they accomplished this week.
@Matt McIrvin: Geologists who work in oil and gas tend to be hard-core AGW denialists, tossing out “and there’s nothing we can do about it anyway” as the kicker. I started out as a geologist, MS in hydrogeology, and in my college classes in the late 70’s it was taught as a given that this was happening, that peak oil was real. We even had a guy from a hydrogen fuel cell research group come give a presentation.
I did argue with several classmates about extinction rates. The field now seems to select more for R’s, and I think lots of time in the road listening to hate radio, often the only thing you can get in really remote areas, has a lot to do with it.
Wikipedia says it’s a two way race between Central Florida and Texas A&M, both in the 65-70K range.
You may be onto something there…
Yeah, I thought I copied, but I wound up pasting the same thing as from a previous post. Oopsie!
@StringOnAStick: It is possible to turn some doctors around. Pre-ACA my rheumatologist was spouting Tea Party bullshit and I being in a flare and a lot of pain lost it and ranted for quite a while. I didn’t change doctors because she’s the best I’ve ever had and we stayed off politics. Fast forward a couple of years and she abruptly apologized to me because of the flood of new patients she had who were suffering for years before Obamacare kicked in. She’s now a flaming blue liberal Democrat and has even converted her husband. Her son who was a toddler when we first met has just graduated college and has a job with the Florida Biden campaign. It’s not me, she works in Laguna Beach and is surrounded by liberals, but she gives me hope.
James E Powell
For many years, my beloved alma mater THE Ohio State University – nobody said THE when I was there – had the most students. We are spread out across the nation. It’s why every big city has a large supply of obnoxious Buckeye football fans.
Barr doing a nice job there of supporting Biden’s case that the lack of law & order is Trump’s America. “Wait, you know exactly who these people are and when they’re making plans to riot, and you’re not doing anything about it?”
@zhena gogolia: I am sitting in a wait room right now. I called ahead and got permission for my husband to come in to the waiting room and use the bathroom because we’re an hour-plus from home in the big city. Could you try that? I told them we’re old and he needed to drive me.
I don’t know how the UC system counts its student population, but if they do it like we do, it’s got to blow ours away.
It would be fun to do a whole theme about how they have no “work ethic” – just all start saying that.
“Well, as you know, Chris, the Trump Team has no work ethic, so not much gets done” “Schools would be open safely but for the lack of a work ethic in the Trump Administration”
Just stick it in everywhere.
I think we deserve to play with this some. They’ll be enraged.
@Steeplejack (phone): Orange county is not particularly anti-vax. We did have a lot of personal exemptions about 5 years ago, when we had a big measles outbreak, but the county seems to have gotten its shit together. We’re pretty good at shaming our neighbors here. OC is one of the counties in CA with >95% vaccination rates.
The problem areas are low-income LA and agricultural regions, and the granola coast from SF to Oregon.
@geg6: Per Wikipedia, total enrollment for the all 10 campuses of the University of California is 285,000, led by UCLA at 44k.
@different-church-lady: Everything sucks, yeah. https://youtu.be/vsEOIpXNyzI?t=66
And yes, I used to listen to a lot of ska. Though this band wasn’t too high on my list.
The University of California has always called itself a system and treated the individual campuses as separate universities. The system as a whole has about 285,000 students, which puts it well behind the Cal State system.
It works with some places, not others.
@Kay: Funny how these people are getting on planes and flying around the country in their black clothes with their gear and no one catches them on camera.
@Haroldo: This may have been addressed, but what about Sky News? Are they an unbiased objective news outlet? I’ve a hard right relative who’s always sharing video and stuff from Sky News. It was from her early share last April that I first saw the meme that Biden couldn’t string 2 sentences together….. a meme all of my relatives are running with.
@Calouste: Of course they don’t show up on cameras, they’re dressed in black. I’m sure it’s in TV Tropes somewhere.
@Kay: I’ll be doing this with all my conservative relatives, as they set such great store by a person’s work ethic, or lack thereof.
@geg6: No, we count as separate campuses. PSU, OSU, etc. have a model of a central administrative campus with satellites. So the dean of letters at OSU is the dean of those programs at all satellites. It’s effectively one program with multiple locations.
UC are fully independent campuses. There’s some common policies among all of them, but we’re actually encouraged to do different things than our sister campuses. We’re organized differently, different programs – just about everything. The idea is to give students more choices in what campus is the right fit for them. UCSD does some truly bizarre shit with their schools. Santa Cruz for a while basically had no grades – everything was P/NP.
Pretty sure ASU is the largest population campus in the US.
Systemwise, the California community college system is the winner at 2.1 million students. CSU is about 500,000, UC is about 300,000.
Round numbers, CA public universities is about 3 million students – roughly the population of Iowa.
@Calouste: They put the lemon on their face.
David ? ☘The Establishment☘? Koch
@Calouste: nobody flys planes anymore, they’re too crowded
@MazeDancer: Thanks–these are inspiring!
J R in WV
How long do you think it will take them to figure out that there is no organization called Antifa, no officers, no address, no bank accounts, nothing!???
It’s just people fighting Nazis and Trumpist fascists out of patriotism and love of America, two more things the administration will never understand.
No Money Being Made? Whut???
@Mary G: That’s a great story, so glad she got a reality check and was able to change her attitude. Good for you for staying your case.
J R in WV
Actually, there are a ton of serious diseases he could be diagnosed with, with no treatment or cure, that would make him way more miserable than just being dead. Good people get that kind of diagnosis all the time.
I’m hoping for a new incurable disease spread by believing what you see on Faux News, or similar RWNJ news services.
Enhanced Voting Techniques
That’s exactly what Antifa wants us think! Remember these are the same people who can sneak plane loads of uniformed members along with their carry on BBQ baby lunches, pallets full of weaponized soup cans and the reanimated corpse of Barnabas Collins threw TSA without being noticed! Checkmate Libertards!
Uhh…I hate to have to break it to you…but isn’t that what’s happening in the US *right now*?
J R in WV
I have no friends who will even speak to someone who supports der trump.
J R in WV
That isn’t incompetent, it’s larceny. Navarro may be getting kickbacks into an off shore bank account in the Caymans, or perhaps Cyprus… doesn’t one of his co-workers have connections with Cypriot banking?
@different-church-lady: Oh no, there’s another way. He wants to override the wishes of a bunch of Hawaiians so he can build a compound there on a sacred site. I personally foresee that ending about the best way possible; him going into a volcano.
@Mary G: Wow, that’s a great story.
Enhanced Voting Techniques
This is all about the Blacks are becoming “White” now. The same kind of insane violence happened with the Irish, then the Italians, then Germans. Democracy by other means as one historian put it. The old guard resist violently the Blacks becoming mainstream, the Black assert themselves violently and who gets the most support from everyone else wins in a show of fists.
J R in WV
@Enhanced Voting Techniques:
The Irish, Italians and Germans (and Poles, and Hungarians, etc, etc) were in effect imported to work in the mines and mills, but were never bought and sold like cattle. Their women were never treated as unwilling sex objects, impregnated by the Master and their children sold as soon as they were weaned.
So your comparison is wholly incorrect in every way.
@dww44: Sky News used to be owned by Murdoch, but after the reorganization of his empire, it has ended up being owned by Comcast. There’s a requirement of impartiality on British news broadcasters, so it’s never been anywhere near as bad as Fox. It has a slight lean to the right, I think – the political journalists have a tendency to give a harder time to the left than the right, but mainly, it’s a little bit more sensationalistic than the BBC. So it’s happy to have an interviewer rough up a government minister, but might also be more likely to include “some are saying…” rumours about Biden.