Well, that escalated quickly!
We all know why John Fetterman isn't coming to the debate on Sunday.
He doesn't want to talk about the fact that he chased down an unarmed Black man and held him at gunpoint.
That's the elephant in the room. And we have to talk about it. pic.twitter.com/eiGx1Yoqz8
— Conor Lamb (@ConorLambPA) March 31, 2022
Not my state, not my candidates, but so much for the idea that this primary race wasn’t going to get personal and ugly!
A recent poll has Fetterman at 33.4% and Lamb at 10%. Kevin Baumlin, who dropped out yesterday, was third at 9%, and Malcolm Kenyatta was fourth with 7.6%. Alexandria Khalil polled at 2.8%. So far, “undecided” leads the pack at 37.3%. The Democratic primary is in May in Pennsylvania.
Open thread.
Baud
Why is he skipping the debate?
NotMax
Obligatory.
April first classic turns 65.
Betty Cracker
@Baud: I don’t know, but Fetterman, Lamb and the other candidates already had one debate, and according to people in that thread (who may not be reliable sources), Fetterman is scheduled to participate in other upcoming debates. Maybe someone here who’s following the race can confirm that.
Ohio Mom
I’ve wondered if Fetterman’s I don’t know, approach to governing? Shtick? would scale up.
As an analogy, just because you run a great neighborhood watering hole, does not mean you’d be great at running a national chain. Or maybe I’m thinking of the Peter Principle.
germy
germy
these op-eds are grotesque:
Baud
@Betty Cracker:
That makes the Lamb tweet seem kind of weird.
Raven
@Betty Cracker: I don’t think Herschel will be in any debates.
germy
Baud
@germy:
Those look like syndicated columnists rather than the WaPo editorial board. Right wing columnists are unique to Bezos publications.
Baud
@Raven:
That makes sense though.
Raven
@Baud: Yea because he’s a fuckin moron.
In other news I seem to have gotten over the booster, I slept most of the day AND night (which almost never happens)!
Betty Cracker
@Raven: Even if he wins the primary?
germy
@Baud:
they’re always given a platform. See Mulvaney, Mick. His job is to explain Biden’s policies to normie viewers.
germy
@Raven:
I envy you guys who feel something from the vaccines and boosters.
I had my second booster yesterday. Aside from a slight sting in my arm, I feel nothing.
I wouldn’t mind a few feverish chills. At least that’d mean my stupid immune system was reacting.
Baud
@germy:
Oh, I agree. The problem is systemic. That’s why I don’t agree with the suggestion that it’s a problem limited to or caused by Bezos.
Raven
@Betty Cracker: I wouldn’t be surprised, I don’t think all that “save America” shit will hold up against Warnock.
Raven
@germy: Yea, I was pretty punky but it was expected. What bugs me is all this “maybe you should wait” and “maybe you should get Moderna”. Maybe I should win the lottery too.
lowtechcyclist
I’m gonna have to get all stats-nerd here. (What can I say, it’s my day job!)
The MOE on this poll was +/-3%, which basically means it really can’t distinguish who is really ahead of whom in that Lamb-Baumlin-Kenyatta group. They’re all basically tied for second.
Wonder if Baumlin’s reconsidering his decision to drop out, now that the candidate who was leading by a mile just shot himself in the foot (or maybe higher up)?
Baud
@Raven:
I would choose winning the lottery.
Chief Oshkosh
@Baud: Really? I thought TFNYFT was well-stocked in rightwing shitbirds. Hell, at least one instance, they hired a shitbird specifically because he’s a shitbird (albeit a religious shitbird, so…worse), and then bragged about it.
ETA: But maybe I’m misunderstanding titles here (columnist vs editorial board member vs shitbird…?)
Baud
@lowtechcyclist:
How did Fetterman shoot himself?. By not attending the debate?
Baud
@Chief Oshkosh:
Sorry, are = aren’t
rikyrah
Good Morning, Everyone ???
schrodingers_cat
@Baud: The black women I follow on Twitter are dead set against Fetterman.
He has also skipped forums with black clergy. Good luck winning a statewide race as a Democrat without their support.
FWIW Nina Turner also led in the polls.
Baud
@rikyrah:
Good morning.
lowtechcyclist
@Baud: I would think chasing down an unarmed Black man and holding him at gunpoint might be a problem.
eclare
Signed up for booster #2, Pfizer, on Sunday. That is two weeks from Easter, and my relatives usually get together for that.
Baud
@schrodingers_cat:
Twitter isn’t real life, but skipping black forums is bad.
germy
@Baud:
Here’s something I’ve noticed through the years. About ten, twenty years ago I used to watch more than a few of the network shows, the political discussions. All mainstream. And I’d see people like Luntz and Andrew Sullivan (among many others) featured prominently. I didn’t know who they were but the hosts wanted to hang on their every word and give them lots of air time.
And now I see the stuff they write and say online, or in less mainstream venues, and it dawns on me that the networks wanted me to absorb their talking points. They were trojan horses wheeled into our living rooms, all respectable and “sensible” on the outside, but full of ugly and bigoted views on the inside.
Hell, my PBS station was running the Mclouglin (sp) Report with Pat Buchanan right up to the very last show. And in a prime time slot. If I got up early and put on PBS, I’d see intelligent discussion 4:30 or 5:00 in the morning with a Black host and progressive activist guests. But Buchanan was blathering 11:00 am, right up there with the big shows.
Baud
@lowtechcyclist:
That’s not new though. That story has been out there for a while.
lowtechcyclist
Thanks for the laugh!
debbie
@Raven:
LOL. It’s all a crap shoot anyway. ?
Honus
@Baud: I think you meant aren’t and if so I agree. In fact it was about twenty years ago I opened the WAPO opinion page and saw R Emmet Tyrell, George Will, Cal Thomas and I think also Jack Kilpatrick or Pat Buchanan at the same time, thought “I don’t need this” and canceled my subscription.
A few years later I switched back to the Post after a similar experience with the NYT. Newspapers employing stupid right wing cranks is tradition that predates Bezos by decades
schrodingers_cat
OT : Sharing something I made: A parrot and some toucans
I am getting some more art supplies, fancy shmancy colored pencils, good old Crayolas, tracing paper, kuretake brush pen and a crochet hook! Should be here tomorrow.
I think I has an addiction!
lowtechcyclist
Betty C:
So it escalated slowly, then?
ETA: I can’t see how it doesn’t hurt him, even if it’s been around since last year.
Buckeye
@germy:
Oh, your immune system is definitely working, even without the side effects.
My side effects from the 2nd Pfizer-a year ago already!-were terrible, but still better than being on our Covid unit.
But of all the people I know, and am related to, my reaction was the worst. My sisters had no side effects. (I hate them!) :)
I had my 2nd Shingrix yesterday, arm hurts like hell, and I’m just tired and unmotivated.
Baud
@germy:
I agree. I’ve given up on a lot of mainstream news, especially TV, for that reason. There’s a bias toward respectability for the right, no matter what they do.
Chief Oshkosh
@Baud: Thanks. Now I understand. I just saw a dog and a cat playing together, and along with your OP, was getting concerned about the hallucinations returning…
;)
James E Powell
@Baud:
It’s been around so long that it’s disappointing that Fetterman hasn’t come up with a better response.
Baud
@lowtechcyclist:
The escalation is that Lamb is now making it a campaign issue. That’s not Fetterman “now” shooting himself in the foot, which is what your original tweet said.
schrodingers_cat
@Baud: It is not RL but these women know what they are talking about. They are among the most hard nosed and pragmatic voters and followers of politics.
They are rooting for Lamb. And he has more endorsements from other elected Ds in PA.
lowtechcyclist
@Buckeye: From my three Modernas, my only side effect was a sore shoulder. But after the Shingrix shots, both times, I felt like I was coming down with something and just wanted to stay under some blankets.
Felt better after about a day, though.
eclare
@schrodingers_cat: Very pretty! And topical, OTR today has birds of Belize.
Baud
@schrodingers_cat:
Primary voters will decide. As always, I just hope people can come together to support the winner.
Betty Cracker
@lowtechcyclist: The temperature of the rhetoric is what escalated.
eclare
@Baud: I watch MJ some, to see what the lead story is, and other than that I read and watch shows like Colbert. Last night he skewered his employer for hiring Mulvaney.
Geminid
@Betty Cracker: Politico Magazine put up a very long article about Charlie Crist’s run for Florida governor. To oversimpify, Crist is running as a “Uniter” against DeSantis the “Divider.” It will be interesting to see how Florida Democrats judge this theme.
There is little about Crist’s opponents, Agriculture Commissioner Fried and State Senator Taddeo, but the writer notes that Fried is taking a more sharp-elbowed approach to DeSantis. I don’t think that policy differences between the three are very big, so the choice seems to hinge on electability.
Betty Cracker
The Florida primaries take place in August, which seems very far away.
schrodingers_cat
@Baud: Indeed they will. I am allergic to populists who cosplay being working class and think that politics is performance art.
Baud
@schrodingers_cat:
I don’t know enough about the candidates to judge.
mvr
@schrodingers_cat: Exactly my experience. Fetterman did something awfully racist and toxic and has doubled down by defending it and they don’t like him for that. The ones I follow would probably agree more with Kenyetta but seem to favor Lamb for campaigning in the right places and not ignoring black voters and having the potential do well outside the Philly area in the general election. I take what they are saying pretty seriously.
Betty Cracker
@Geminid: It’ll be interesting to see how the gubernatorial primary shakes out. (I’m saying that in the same spirit that a person on a train hurtling toward an open draw bridge that is closing ever-so-slowly would express interest in the outcome. ;-)
schrodingers_cat
@Baud: Fetterman hasn’t apologized for pulling a gun on an unarmed black men. Yet.
Buckeye
@schrodingers_cat:
I’m a white women, and I don’t live in Pennsylvania. But I have friends that do, and I do look at the social media. And the number of white people who support Fetterman who brush off the attack ‘Oh, the guy he chased supports him now’ or whatever excuse they like that day, it’s troubling.
I understand having a preference for Fetterman’s politics and policies over Lamb’s, or any other candidate. But it seems really easy for a lot of white progressives to just slide right over the fact that Fetterman’s behavior and attitude need to be addressed.
schrodingers_cat
@mvr: My mutuals too like Kenyatta but think he is not seasoned enough for a senate race. They think Lamb is the only one who can flip that seat.
lowtechcyclist
@Baud: Look, I was reading what Betty C wrote, and reading it in the obvious way: IOW, it just fucking happened, and Lamb didn’t waste any time jumping on Fetterman about it.
And Lamb’s tweet certainly reinforced that impression: why would Fetterman avoid the second debate to avoid defending his conduct in that incident, unless it had happened since the first debate?
If you want to keep jumping on me over having read it that way, feel free.
Lapassionara
@schrodingers_cat: these are great! Thanks.
Betty
This incident plus his progressive positions are the ammunition they are using against Fetterman. My understanding is that the person was perceived as prowling around Fetterman’s home, and he went out with a shotgun to confront the guy. This after years of work with young Black men to help them get GEDs and jobs. If there is more to it, I haven’t heard it. He has pretty much covered the entire state with in- person meetings.
Baud
@Buckeye:
If that’s true, it’s pretty compelling. But it sounds like Fetterman still isn’t handling the issue well.
mvr
@Buckeye:
Had the second booster yesterday; this time Moderna after 3 Pfizers. Today would be 6 months since #3. Easy to get an appointment and saw another guy just do it walk-in.
No ill effects noticed so far. I’ve been so tired lately (our 106 yo basement is being replaced under us while we live upstairs and I am pretty involved in that plus the day job) that I would not notice being tired as resulting from the shot.
schrodingers_cat
@Baud: He says he has forgiven Fetterman. The individual is in prison right now and Fetterman is on the parole board.
Baud
@lowtechcyclist:
Not jumping on you. I was just confused by your initial comment and wanted clarification about what, if anything, Fetterman might have done recently. Sounds like we’re all on the same page.
Baud
@schrodingers_cat:
So many layers.
mvr
@schrodingers_cat:
Yes, that was what I was trying to say if it didn’t come across – that the support for lamb is pragmatic but also personal trust rather than directly about issue agreement.
Geminid
@lowtechcyclist: The 2013 Fetterman-jogger incident made the local TV news right after it happened, but faded away until 2020. Fettermans opponents, both in the state and out, have been going after him hammer and tongs for the last year and a half. He told reporters last year that he had said all he was going to say about the incident, and has since stuck to that resolution.
The escalation is that Lamb is now explicitely making an issue of the incident, and Fetterman’s silence on it. Lamb has alluded to this before, and cited a push poll the Kenyatta campaign did on the issue.
While they took different paths, both Lamb and Fetterman are very ambitious politicians with greatly contrasting personal styles.
eclare
@schrodingers_cat: Hmmmm…
Betty
@schrodingers_cat: And Fetterman has worked to get people released while unfortubately the AG who is the only Dem candidate for Governor has not.
Ken
That doesn’t stop 95% or more of American voters.
lowtechcyclist
Hmmm. I think Tyrell’s tenure with the WaPo was more like forty years ago. My recollection is that he was only a regular columnist there for a few years; my WAG is that he was too nutso even for the WaPo. He always sounded like he was foaming at the mouth.
Cal Thomas may have had a guest column there but if he was a regular, it would have been during the 1988-1998 time frame when I was out of the WaPo’s circulation area. He was in the Bristol Herald-Courier for most of the time I was living down there.
Thomas was the first columnist that routinely made me think that if I had a platform, I’d have no trouble shooting him down every week. So I’d be surprised if the WaPo ever considered him bright enough to be on their pages. As repugnant as Buchanan and Kilpatrick and Will could be, at least they had a fair number of brain cells to rub together.
Anyway
@Ohio Mom:
A senator is a “legislator” not necessarily “running” things
rikyrah
@Baud:
Not the first time either
rikyrah
@Baud:
He hasn’t just skipped debates. He has skipped every forum where there would be a large Black audience
schrodingers_cat
Anyway I am super excited to be getting these pencils. I am just getting a 24 pack because they are spendy. With that I have to leave for my first Zoom of the day
@rikyrah: Good morning
One last thing it is quite troubling to me how many people on our side on this blog and otherwise are dismissive of the concerns of non-white demographics wrt to their populist heroes. We are speaking from hard earned lived experience that helps us survive in a world where we are not the default. We see things that may not be visible to you.
Starfish
@schrodingers_cat: I am slightly skeptical that vocal Twitter represents the state.
How religious is Pennsylvania? What impact does the black clergy there have? In the South, the influence would be HUGE, but I am not sure about Pennsylvania.
I have a friend who lives in Philadelphia, and I think they were very supportive of Kenyatta, but Kenyatta may not do well outside the city centers.
How many candidates have we seen who have won on their pro-police BS lately? I think a number of them have.
narya
I don’t have any planned events or outings until May, so I think I’ll hold off on boostering through April. The beer runs (which tend to have outdoor space for beer consumption after the events) start May 1, and then there are plans to attend the 500 in Indy this year, so I think mid-May might be the right timing for me. I had my first booster in late November, so it would be 6 months-ish. I’m still a little nervous about the 500, to be honest, and if there’s a big spike in cases we might reconsider.
Anyway
@schrodingers_cat:
Where do you get the “template” for coloring? I don’t know the right term…
Our library has an Adult coloring group that was suspended during the pandemic but is back up and running now. County pays for the supplies and it’s very popular (I hear). There was lots of pressure to reopen the program.
schrodingers_cat
@Anyway: I will share the link to the book later. I am late for my Zoom!
Geminid
@Betty: No one prowled around Fetterman’s home. By his account, Fetterman was in his front yard playing with his son when he heard what he was certain were gun shots a block over. He saw a man apparantly running away, so he took his son indoors, grabbed a shotgun, and pursued the man for several blocks in his truck and detained him until police arrived. Mr. Miyares, the jogger, was searched by police and found to be unarmed. Miyares told reporters at the time that Fetterman pointed the 20 gauge shotgun at his chest, but Fetterman denied this.
Driving with a loaded shotgun in his vehicle was a clear violation of Pennsylvania law, but Fetterman was not charged.
Another Scott
@Betty:
This PGHCityPaper Story seem to be a fair summary of Fetterman’s history.
I don’t have a strong opinion on him. Successful politicians have to find a way to get enough people to vote for them to win the seat and get the authority to do what they want to do. Jimmy Carter ran a pretty bad campaign for Georgia governor, to win over someone who would not have done as much good as he did.
Has Fetterman behaved differently/better since this incident? Has he learned from it? I haven’t watched closely enough.
The latest Twitter mumblings I’ve seen are that Fetterman’s campaign is running him as a Populist and not a Progressive. Populist has come to mean RWNJ / Fascist in most of the MSM these days, so that’s a concerning turn to my eyes (I don’t think that he is, but I think he is playing with fire in using that language).
I’ll support the party nominee. I hope that PA Democrats make the best possible choice.
Cheers,
Scott.
Starfish
@Buckeye: I am going to go a little further than this. A lot of white liberals are going to turn up their nose at Lamb for having won in a Trump county. Racism is not a dealbreaker for them; but if you call liberals out on their racism, they get very mad because they don’t see color.
In addition to that, Lamb has cross-party appeal for being able to win in a Trump part of the state. Fetterman has cross-party appeal because racism appeals to Republicans.
Ohio Mom
Anyway:
I see your point that my analogy stank. I still wonder how Fetterman’s way of doing things will translate to the much more abstract work of the office he’s running for.
I don’t dislike him exactly, I’ve just grown to be suspicious of colorful types.
Geminid
@Starfish: Well, it’s true that some Republicans might look at the jogger incident and wish they had such a pro-active mayor. I don’t think Fetterman is planning around this, but Fetterman’s strategy is hard to figure anyway.
I personally find very little I like about Fetterman, but- I think he would have chased a white man like he chased Mr. Miyares. Many Black Democrats I follow see it differently, and given the vastly disproportionate effect that vigilatism has on their community I can’t blame them for this.
Amir Khalid
I ordered a Chicken Garlic Foldover from Mickey D’s for dinner. The original ETA, via Food Panda, was 8:45pm. It is now 9:20, and I just got a message saying the ETA is now 9:30. I am currently both hungry and pissed off.
artem1s
this is absolutely the best twitter take I’ve seen on the whole ‘sportball is making American men ghey’ thing.
Starfish
@Geminid: The one thing that bothers me about Fetterman is that his candidacy seemed very online and very much appealing to out of state money, so I wondered how much in-state support he had, and it turned out to be more than I thought
Well, that is not the ONE thing. People had been complaining about this incident earlier with respect to Fetterman. The discussion of it has gotten louder because the other candidates want to win.
Baud
@Starfish: He’s the Lt. Governor so he’s already won statewide.
Geminid
@Baud: Fetterman won a five-way statewide Democratic primary to replace an unpopular Lieutenant Governor. He then ran on a unitary ticket with the popular Governor, Tom Wolf. So he has not won a statewide general election on his own.
Baud
@Geminid: Oh, I didn’t realize PA had a combined ticket like the feds. I think most states have LG as a separate election.
Suzanne
I participated in that PA Senate poll! I am one of the “undecided”.
Betty Cracker
@Suzanne: Did they call you?
Suzanne
@Betty Cracker: No, text.
Geminid
@Baud: I think that John Fetterman would be the tallest Senator at 6 feet, 8 inches. Conor Lamb would be the second youngest Senator at age 37, two years older than Jon Ossoff.
Baud
@Geminid:
All things being equal, youth is a plus in my book.
leeleeFL
@NotMax: My favorite, BRILLIANT, advanced placement English teacher in High School fell for this hook, line and sinker! Changed my life, I can tell you. If she was that gullible, what hope for the world, I ask you!
Geminid
@Geminid: Fetterman and Lamb differ a lot in style and some in politics. Lamb’s supporters assert that he is more electable. This makes some intuitive sense. After all, Pennsylvania Senator Bob Casey is another politically moderate, white, Catholic man, and he won reelection in 2018 by 650,000 votes.
Philadelphia Mayor Jim Kenney emphasized this when he endorsed Lamb in January. “I wanna win,” Kenney said at the press conference. The Mayor said that he respected the other Democrats who were running, but that Lamb is “the strongest Pennsylvania Democrat to beat the Republican extremists in November.” (from the Philadelphia Inquirer Jan. 18 2022)
Suzanne
Coming from Sinema-land, I am just enjoying having options, honestly. That’s part of why I haven’t made up my mind.
Also, I think most of the candidates are someone I could feel all right about voting for (which is not the same as saying that I’m in perfect alignment). I always had to hold my nose to vote for Sinema. So now I have to decide if closer alignment outweighs a strategic approach.
Jim, Foolish Literalist
@NotMax:
ah yes, it’s the day to take everything, say on twitter, with a grain of salt….
Enhanced Voting Techniques
@germy: Inverse can be true too; they hire people they know will create controversy to increase ratings
Another Scott
I had some time, so I took a quick look at his Twitter thing…
This is just pandering. And, because of the way it actually works, it wouldn’t help people pay less at the pump.
RollCall:
Our candidates should spend the time to understand the details if they’re advocating policy changes. Especially changes that are actually counter-productive.
Cheers,
Scott.
Jim, Foolish Literalist
@Another Scott:
Yup. Ugh.
A Fetterman fan got very angry with me for saying he strikes me as more (cosplay) style than substance. He apparently has a great many substantive accomplishments. I asked them to name a couple, but they must have gotten a phone call or something.
Enhanced Voting Techniques
@Another Scott: Actually this is politics; friend of mine works in the oil industry and was explaining during the pandemic the demand for gasoline crashed so much a lot of refineries were shuttered and they’ve been slow about reopening, but they are reopening. So between the Russo-Ukrainian war winding down and increase in gasoline production prices will drop, but this way the Democrats get to take credit, because most people aren’t paying attention. ROFL
BobbyK
Conor Lamb is a conservadem. I have donated to Fetterman’s campaign and will do so as I have funds to spare. If Lamb somehow manages to win the primary I won’t donate a cent. He’ll get in the senate and vote with the republicans as often as possible. Lamb’s Progressive Punch score is an F, the 20th worst Democrat in the HoR.
Another Scott
@Enhanced Voting Techniques: Good points. I too believe that oil and gas prices will come down substantially before the election (unless something else throws a monkey wrench into the market). And it should benefit Democrats to some extent (or at least not be a huge minus).
But, still, we know the GQP always wants to cut taxes that pay for essential functions of government (roads, transit, etc.). And that restoring the taxes after an emergency can be very painful. Supporting their talking points, which rarely actually help the government work better or help the country as a whole, is lazy. Sometimes, yeah, it’s temporarily good politics. But politicians should help move the polity forward in understanding the implications of the choices that government makes. There’s much more to being a leader than just jumping in front of the noisiest parade.
My $0.02.
Cheers,
Scott.
(“Again, I’ll support him financially if he’s the nominee.”)
Jeffery
I am voting for Fetterman. He is the real progressive or as real as he can be. Lamb is not going to shake anything up anywhere.
The Thin Black Duke
I wouldn’t vote for Fetterman. Uh-huh, I’m holding a grudge.
Geminid
@BobbyK: Progressive Punch rates one of my Senators, Mark Warner, as “F.” They give Tim Kaine a “D,” an improvement over his previous “F.”
Any Virginia Democrat would find these ratings laughable.
Suzanne
@BobbyK:
I have been impressed by Kenyatta so far. It looks unlikely that he will win the primary, but I hope he has a good career.
Soprano2
@Enhanced Voting Techniques: There have been articles in the financial press that American oil producers are deliberately keeping production lower than it could be because of demands from investors that they be more profitable after the crash during the pandemic. Evidently a lot of investors got out of the oil field in 2020, so they’re trying to lure the investors back. Not that the general public knows any of this because it’s easier for the press to repeat stuff about how Biden’s in trouble because of high gas prices without bothering to tell people why they’re high.
catclub
@germy: isn’t the richest man in the World Putin?
Z. Mulls
Fetterman is the real deal, in the Jon Tester mode. And he will be more progressive than someone like Conor Lamb, who is viewed as safe and moderate, like Bob Casey. This is why Lamb gets the endorsements. I am not familiar with the incident above, but I am betting that the details will tell a more nuanced story, and Fetterman has walked the walk on issues that really matter.- He understands the challenges of a dying town, which is where we build a bridge to the rural parts of America that Democrats can really help. The ad above looks pretty desparate.
catclub
4 hours of napping on day two for me.
schrodingers_cat
@The Thin Black Duke: I don’t blame you. If I were in PA I would not have vote for person who doesn’t even bother to put on pants to meet the President.
Ruckus
@James E Powell:
I’m thinking that if he hasn’t come up with something better before now, there isn’t anything better to come up with.
Jim, Foolish Literalist
@Z. Mulls:
What does that mean?
It’s a pretty short story. It wouldn’t take you long to find that nuance that few Black people seem to see.
Ruckus
@mvr:
I looked into making an appointment for Moderna and the things they ask for I have no idea what they are talking about. Some number, I think it’s BIN number and who is my insurer. The VA has Pfizer and if I want to go Moderna I have to go public. I have no number or insurance info to provide them. And so I can’t make an appointment. Do I do a walk in? That’s all I do at the VA walk in the clinic, give them my name and get my shot. Does a walk in work that way?
zeecube
@schrodingers_cat: Pretty. Hope you post more. Thanks.
cliosfanboy
@Geminid: a D for Kaine? Christmas, what they they score on?
Brantl
@lowtechcyclist: I never had the impression that George Will had anything more than a snotty attitude, and a slightly better than average vocabulary.
Jim, Foolish Literalist
@Brantl: I can’t remember now if it was Charlie Pierce or Molly Ivins who once wrote something like: George Will, whose poor assistant must have Bartlett’s Book of Great Quotations half-memorized by now….
BellyCat
@Another Scott: Weird how Fetterman said nothing about what (I’ve been told but not personally confirmed) is the highest state gas tax in the nation. Huh… //
Jim, Foolish Literalist
@Jeffery: what does “shake things up” mean in the context of the United States Senate? or in any political context, really, but in this case let’s concentrate on the Senate. He’s gonna wear shorts? I know Kyrsten Sinema has laid waste to Senate sartorial convention.
Ruckus
@The Thin Black Duke:
Sounds very reasonable.
It also sounds like the only person to vote for in this case is the least worst. I think sometimes figuring that out is harder than deciding who is best.
Ken
WH Press Secretary. “Yes, Ms. Psaki from MSNBC.”
PSAKI: “Several of my colleagues today have asked basically the same question, whether the President is worried that high gas prices are a problem for the administration. Do you have any information about why oil and gas prices are so high?”
Zelma
@BobbyK:
Why would you think Lamb is a conservadem? His voting record in the House doesn’t support this. He’s not a “progressive,” whatever that is, but he’s a solid Democrat. Also, Lamb represents his constituency. Fetterman is basically a “celebrity” candidate. His size and his behavior (i.e. his dress) get him coverage. He’s “famous” for being “famous.”
Jim, Foolish Literalist
does the PA lite-guv have independent powers and functions, as Molly Ivins always said was the case in TX (I took her word for it), but I think is pretty rare?
Geminid
@Jim, Foolish Literalist: Pennsylvania is not like Texas. The Lt. Governor presides over the Senate, but hasn’t much power. I guess he can cast a tie breaking vote like in Virginia. The Pennsylvania Lt. Governor also has a role on the state Parole Board.
Geminid
@cliosfanboy: Progressive Punch grades on a very steep curve. They’ll cut a little bit of slack for districts or states that are not blue, but I think they regard Virginia as safely Democratic, so any deviation from the “Progressive” ideal is considered unacceptable.
Also, one “progressive” tenet is that the defense budget must be cut by 10% at least. Kaine and Warner don’t see it that way.
DropDminus
@Ruckus: I seriously doubt there’s a significant difference in how any of the two leading candidates will vote as senators. The only question for me is how to ensure they win the damn seat. I’ll admit that Fetterman’s style is appealing because he is unapologetic about being a democrat. Lamb is actually my rep. and he’s…fine. I hate his campaign style of basically acting like he has to apologize for being a democrat but maybe Jan 6 changed him. I actually worry about losing his seat if he goes up to the senate because it’s a very swingy district that could fell for a Youngkin style bullshit Republican “moderate”.
debbie
@Jim, Foolish Literalist:
No one’s done that more than Madison Cawthorn. WTF was he doing wearing a backwards baseball cap when explaining all the GOP orgy and snort parties???
GoBlueInOak
@Ohio Mom: If Tom Cotton, Lady Lindsay, Rick Scott, Joni Ernst, Rand Paul, Cindy Hyde-Smith, Josh Hawley, Jim Inhofe, and Ted Cruz are all qualified to be US Senators…then Fetterman surely is.
DropDminus
@Ruckus: I seriously doubt there’s a significant difference in how any of the two leading candidates will vote as senators. The only question for me is how to ensure they win the damn seat. I’ll admit that Fetterman’s style is appealing because he is unapologetic about being a democrat. Lamb is actually my rep. and he’s…fine. I hate his campaign style of basically acting like he has to apologize for being a democrat but maybe Jan 6 changed him. I actually worry about losing his seat if he goes up to the senate because it’s a very swingy district that could fell for a Youngkin style bullshit Republican “moderate”.
schrodingers_cat
@GoBlueInOak: All the clowns you have named are Republicans. Are you saying that we need our own clown caucus?
Geminid
@Jim, Foolish Literalist: Fetterman wore a suit and tie when presiding over the Pennsylvania Senate. He wears shorts to voter events, and a recent Good Morning America interview.
Ironically, Fetterman looks really sharp in a pair of weathered blue jeans. He’s stubborn about the shorts, though.
Geminid
@DropDminus: I think Lamb’s Senate run will keep him from defending your district’s Congressional seat. The radicals will probably control the Republican nomination, so they are likely to nominate their biggest asshole.
Youngkin was a singular, “one off” candidate. He essentially bought his party’s nomination through short, opaque “Disassembled Convention” campaign.
Suzanne
@DropDminus: I live just over the district line (in Brookline) and I share your assessment. Lamb would be fine. Totally adequate. He seems milquetoast but I think he is as no controversial as is possible for a Dem.
I went to the yoga studio at which I am a member on Sunday, and I learned that Conor Lamb’s sister is a fellow member. A little weird.
Ruckus
@DropDminus:
Tell him what you just told us.
We are the ones that have to vote for people, they are the people that we have to vote for. They get paid to listen, we are free to speak up. Do so. He may think he has to be less up front/shouty because that’s what people tell him or how he sees things. That doesn’t make him a bad candidate, just one harder to elect. If he’s good he deserves to hear that mousy isn’t floating your boat. Telling me gives you exactly squat. Tell him. If he does not want to listen, maybe that’s your answer. If he disagrees with you, maybe he’s right. Maybe he’s not. But none of us need to hear this. Maybe he does.
EmbraceYourInnerCrone
@schrodingers_cat: Wow! those are gorgeous.
Ruckus
@debbie:
Maturity wise he seems at best to be 16 yrs old. And not Rhodes Scholar 16 yrs old, not even close. Not even in the same universe.
EmbraceYourInnerCrone
@Z. Mulls: Not sure what “the real deal” means. The incident mentioned above, which happened almost ten years ago, is about Fetterman hearing what he thought were shots in his neighborhood, getting in his truck and chasing an unarmed black jogger:
Black jogger Fetterman chased and pointed a shotgun at still wants him to win his current political race.
“He has previously said he was jogging in the neighborhood when he heard fireworks, just before Fetterman confronted him.
“He knew my race. The gun was aimed at my chest while he loaded five red shells into the tube of the 12-gauge TAC shotgun,” Miyares wrote. “Once he finished, he aimed it at my face out of the Ford F-150 Truck.””
And yes I am aware the man that (then mayor)Fetterman pointed the gun at, is currently in jail for a crime committed in 2019. Something that has nothing to do with Fetterman pointing a gun at the man in 2013…
debbie
@Ruckus:
Good god. Was he an actual Rhodes Scholar???
Steeplejack
@debbie:
No! Ruckus was just emphasizing how not mature he is.
debbie
@Steeplejack:
Whew!
Will
Fetterman or bust. I’m not turning out for people like Lamb anymore. Lamb gets nothing done. Legalize Marijuana? We need a study. Climate Change? We need a study. Single payer? We need a study.
We need a study… We need a study… We need a study…
Nope, I don’t give a shit if Fetterman pulled a gun on someone. He’s real, he does real things, sometimes he makes mistakes, but I’ll take them over another fucking we need a study.
Jim, Foolish Literalist
This is one of those cases where I know I can’t blame the candidate for their supporters, but they sure seems to attract a lot of ….
@Will:
I keep hearing this. Could you name three?
CaseyL
“I’m not turning out for Democratic Candidate X because of their stance on [Climate Change] [Student Debt] [Marijuana Reform].”
Democratic Candidate X loses, Republican Candidate Y wins.
A Republican Congress passes laws making the situation with [Climate Change] [Student Debt] [Marijuana Reform] worse than they already were.
Democratic Candidate X-1 runs in next election against incumbent Republican Y.
“I’m not turning out for Democratic Candidate X because of their stance on [Climate Change] [Student Debt] [Marijuana Reform].”
Democratic Candidate X loses, Republican Candidate Y wins…
Etc. Rinse, repeat.
Jim, Foolish Literalist
all the drive-by posters who know about Jon Fetterman’s long list of awesome accomplishments, but don’t want to share
curious and curiouser
and yet, very familiar…..
Geminid
@Jim, Foolish Literalist: I’d be in the Lamb camp if I lived in Pennsylvania, but I would note that even though Fetterman supported Sanders both in 2016 and 2020, he loyally campaigned for Clinton and Biden in the two general elections. So Fetterman is no Nina Turner.
I still think Lamb would be the stronger candidate in November.
Geminid
@Jim, Foolish Literalist: Not that I thought you were equating Fetterman and Turner.
@Geminid:
wetzel
I don’t see any attempt to educate in Conor Lamb’s attack. It feels to me like there should be respect for the gravity of the situation, Fetterman bringing the threat of physical violence into the scenario. What happened? Maybe Fetterman should tell his side of the story. I am not fond of this Conor Lamb style of politics.
Physical violence is very serious. To violate mores on violence is a big deal. Did that happen? It appears almost that Fetterman must have committed some kind of hate crime! If somebody attributed me as a race villain I probably would not debate them either. What would you talk about? I am not a race villain?
I once had to raise a cane to demand a physically abusive person depart from my home. It was a long time ago and he didn’t press charges. He was unarmed. Upon reflection, it was criminal because he was not threatening anyone at that time, but had struck a person earlier. I am not bragging. The experience traumatized both of us. Was it something like that? Does Fetterman make a habit of pointing guns at unarmed black men? Fetterman is a big guy! I don’t know him. I’ve seen him on TV and I thought he looked cool. I thought Conor Lamb looked cool too.
This fellow in the kitchen, my cocaine addicted business partner, he was big!!! Bigger than Fetterman!!!! He had played on the line in a division 1 school. I think I could kick Fetterman’s ass!!!
wetzel
@wetzel:
Getting the last word is lonely. I’m a typing fool. I got so much to say I reply to myself!
Will
@Jim, Foolish Literalist:
Fetterman has focused what little power and camera time he gets as a Lt. Gov to focusing on reforming the Board of Pardons and pushing for the legalization of marijuana.
His campaigning across the state has now moved polling in the state to where six in ten Pennsylvanians now approve complete legalization.
His work on the Board of Pardons is tangible progress. He has had the fees required just to make an appeal to the board done away with. He traded the Governorship for the freedom of Dennis and Lee Horton.
Geminid
@wetzel: John Fetterman has told his side of this story. Some people think his explainations were disingenuous and misleading, and they say that is why Fetterman won’t take any more questions on the matter. Whatever the reason, he clearly seems resolved to put the issue behind him.
Conor Lamb’s job is not to educate Fetterman, but to win that Senate seat for Pennsylvania Democrats. Republicans certainly won’t be educating Fetterman if he is the nominee. In Pennsylvania, they’ll be running ads about Fetterman and Miyares on radio stations with Black audiences. Nationally, I expect that Republicans will gleefully point out how hypocritical the “Woke Democrats” are when it comes to their own.
Aside from it’s unfortunate political impact, the story of Fetterman’s encounter with Miyares is fascinating in a Rashomon-like way. There is contemporaneous TV reporting that lays out out the basic facts, with brief interviews of both Fetterman and Miyares. Later there is brief mention of the DA declining to prosecute Fetterman on his obvious firearms violation. Then, seven years of obscurity before Fetterman’s detractors begin pounding him on the issue in 2020, the year of “Black Lives Matter.”
It’s a little sad, because I don’t think Fetterman is a bad guy. With a willing media, he consciously created something of a legend about his tenure as Mayor of Braddock. I doubt if there is a better known Lieutenant Governor in the U.S. That could be why he’s been so stubborn about the Miyares incident.
But there is enough reporting out there for people to form their own conclusions.
.
Another Scott
@Will:
Today in the US House:
Lamb voted Yes.
Yes, he wants studies too. But when the time comes for a vote, he supports the party.
(via Popehat)
Cheers,
Scott.
Jim, Foolish Literalist
@Will: Well, I will say, you’re the first Fetterman to actually come up with something. That said, this
Is one of the stupidest comments I have seen in a while
Will
@Jim, Foolish Literalist: I honestly don’t care. I’m sorry if that bothers people, but I live a few blocks from Braddock. It’s a very tough neighborhood where people are murdered far more than the surrounding boroughs or townships. This isn’t Ahmaud Arbery where some white guys decided to chase a black man down for being black on a peaceful afternoon in suburbia. There was a shooting the street over. Should he have never involved himself? Yes. Is it a grave mistake to me? No.
Cynical me also feels like it makes him kryptonite to the GOP’s plan to run against “woke” in 2022. You think David “Took yinz jobz to China” McCormick or Dr. Land of Oz want to face him? Any of them ever pulled a gun on someone?
Geminid
@Will: I think that if I were McCormick or Oz I would much rather run against Fetterman than against Lamb. Fetterman’s appeal as a big tough stud runs really deep with some people, but I suspect that appeal is not wide.
Will
If you think Lamb is the stronger candidate than Fetterman in a state like Pennsylvania, you don’t understand the state well enough. While Pittsburgh proper and a couple suburbs are deep blue, the metro region is too red now to run a guy like Lamb that constantly talks out both sides of his mouth. He barely won re-election in 2020 and I’m willing to bet he decided on the Senate cause he feels he will lose in 2022 in the House.
Geminid
@Will: Now I’m curious. How do you evaluate Bob Casey Jr. as a Senator? He and Lamb seem similar in their politics.
Will
Bob Casey is still able to win some of the poor and lower-middle class white people that live in areas where Democrats once reigned. He doesn’t win them, but he pulls enough of them that he is able to win. He’s from a different era and if he was running as a first time candidate in 2024 he wouldn’t make it out of the primary. Fetterman can win some of those same people.
I have to deal with a couple of housing contractors on the South Side and I’ll have a beer with them time to time since they like to meet at Mario’s or Local for lunch and they’ll have the whole crew there, mostly Republicans, a couple of Trumpers. Several of them like Fetterman. Whatever, I know that might turn some people on this forum off to Fetterman, but when they look at him they see one of themselves, not the Harvard educated liberal he is. In a non-presidential election year, you still depend on huge turnout in Philadelphia and the ring of suburbs, but you need to peel enough of those “folks” to really pull it out
Fetterman is going to eat McCormick’s lunch about how he was the mayor of a town and saw the devastation that corporatists like McCormick rained on towns like Braddock by offshoring American jobs. He’ll be able to point to the names tattooed on his arm, residents that have died in what once used to be a good hard working neighborhood. Dr. Oz just isn’t a real candidate and the whole dual citizenship isn’t going to play well with certain voters in the state.
Geminid
@Will: Thank you for sharing your perspective. Local reporting is valuable.