First, a little fun with the Jack E. Smith that’s on twitter.
I’m not sure what is more concerning.
That a conman and international fugitive thought he would be welcome in Congress…or that he might be right.
— Jack E. Smith ⚖️ (@7Veritas4) January 8, 2023
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BREAKING: Satan hires additional staff to keep track of all the Faustian pacts made with Kevin McCarthy.
— Jack E. Smith ⚖️ (@7Veritas4) January 7, 2023
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“WHY DIDN’T I GET 15 DO-OVERS?!?”
Overheard at Mar-a-Lago tonight
— Jack E. Smith ⚖️ (@7Veritas4) January 7, 2023
Okay, the tweets above may be parody, but these two are for real.
JUST IN: The Fulton County GA special Grand jury has completed its report on Donald Trump’s interference in the 2020 election.
There will be a hearing on Jan 24th to determine whether the report will be made public.
— Jack E. Smith ⚖️ (@7Veritas4) January 9, 2023
“…they will lead the DOJ investigation of Congressional members” https://t.co/PDj1ckHmOW
— Jack E. Smith ⚖️ (@7Veritas4) January 6, 2023
Special Counsel Jack Smith has tapped Ray Hulser, a veteran prosecutor who previously led the Justice Department’s public integrity section, and hired David Harbach, who previously served as counsel to a Trump adversary, former FBI Director James Comey, according to the person who asked to remain anonymous.
The two attorneys have prosecuted some of the most high-profile public corruption targets of both political parties in recent years, including cases against Senator Bob Menendez of New Jersey, former Virginia Governor Bob McDonnell and former presidential candidate and Senator John Edwards.
Open thread.
catclub
Faustian bargains:
Faust fell, which is to say he had a lot of good in him. McCarthy?
Betty Cracker
Depressingly, the track record of prosecutions imply public corruption that involves money is basically legal unless the crooked pol signs a notarized statement saying something brazen like, “Pay for my daughter’s wedding and buy me a Rolex, and I’ll deregulate your industry.” IIRC, SCOTUS overturned McDonnell’s conviction, and he got caught red-handed. IIRC, his wife flipped on him! (Or vice-versa.)
Sometimes the law is an ass.
On the bright side, the public corruption Trump is being investigated for seems more along the lines of sedition and/or classified documents theft, so maybe the powers that be will see that as something that won’t interfere with their own existing or potential side hustles and will therefore allow justice to be done on the crook Trump.
Redshift
@catclub:
Kev’s talking out multiple mortgages on something he already sold. Seems on brand…
WaterGirl
@Betty Cracker:
I think T**** will be nailed for sure on the documents thing. That is not over for sure. New information has come out that the judge didn’t actually deny the DOJ request re: the documents, but decided to rule on it immediately, perhaps sending the DOJ back for one last attempt first.
I also think T**** will be nailed for sure on the false slate of electors thing, because they have now connected him directly to that, placing a phone call to Ronna Romney and then telling her that his friend (Eastman) would fill her in on the details.
I think (the real) Jack Smith will believe it would be much more political NOT TO CHARGE a former president – when there is so much proof – than it would be to charge a former president who has clearly thumbed his nose at the law, repeatedly, while in office and out.
Parfigliano
James Comey portrayed as Trump adversay. Again. Bullshit. Isnt he the guy who helpful brought up an on-going investigation about Hillary’s e-mails days before an election.
MisterForkbeard
@WaterGirl:
What was that? I must have completely missed that whole thing, what did we think get denied but wasn’t?
Jim, Foolish Literalist
Yup. I’ve forgotten the details, but I remember being gobsmacked that he got away with it. And then (correct me if I’m wrong, lawyers), that reversal on McDonnell’s conviction was how Menendez got off, and we were robbed of a chance to be rid of the Joe Manchin of foreign policy. We coulda had Senator Malinowski! Maybe!
I believe Menendez’s son was just elected to the House, and his daughter is an up-and-coming MSNBC host.
and Malinowski was defeated by legacy candidate Tom Kean, who I believe is well to the right of his “old-fashioned northeastern moderate Republican” father
CaseyL
@Parfigliano:
Yes. Yes, he did – but then he, too, found out that loyalty only goes one way in TrumpWorld.
Since GOPers only recognize reality when it hits them, personally, upside the head with a 2×4, his perspective may have changed some.
Baud
@Jim, Foolish Literalist:
I believe Mendendez was found not guilty based on jury instructions that were based on the McDonnell case. McDonnell was found guilty but the Supreme Court threw it out.
Redshift
@Betty Cracker:
In that case, it was the Supreme Court that was an ass. They decided, contrary to previous interpretation, that only direct quid pro quo bribery is corruption, not “I give you outrageous gifts, and later you happen to let me use the governor’s mansion to promote my shady business,” because, y’know, that could just be because they’re pals.
Speaking of McDonnell, he had the gall to appear at an event for the current odious Republicans and accuse Democrats of being “criminal apologies.”
Baud
@Redshift:
Not really gall. Republicans project like you and I breathe.
artem1s
Lawspaining request for the Jackal lawyers – If the GA report from the grand jury recommends taking the case to court, can the AG act on that? Can the GA GQP governor block it? Or will he have to fire the AG, a la Nixon, to keep it out of the courts?
narya
@Redshift: That’s ringing a bell–and brings to mind Popehat’s information about how hard it is to prove a case when you have to prove state of mind: prove they knew what they were doing was corrupt and then did it knowing that it was wrong. My (uneducated) guess is that DOJ is aiming for convictions on things that do NOT require proof of state of mind. That’s why DOJ wanted access to the non-classified materials as well: they were intermingled with classified materials, making it easier to disprove a claim that TFG didn’t do the packing, didn’t know what was there, etc.
WaterGirl
@Parfigliano: Yeah, I thought that was bullshit, too.
jonas
@Baud: As I’ve commented before, Republicans view corruption and graft in their own ranks as just a poor, put-upon pol disregarding blatantly unfair oversight and byzantine campaign finance rules in order to “get things done.” Why should they get blamed for a crime someone else noticed? When Democrats get caught wetting their beaks in some scheme, it’s because they’re crooks who think the rules don’t apply to them.
Betty Cracker
@Jim, Foolish Literalist: I don’t know anything about NJ politics, but I was sorry Dems didn’t kick Menendez to the curb when they had the chance. I read something fairly recently about him being investigated again for similar shit. Of course he’ll reoffend — most crooks do, especially if they get away with it!
jonas
@artem1s: My understanding is that this “special” grand jury’s report now goes back to the AG, who can then decide whether to seek a criminal indictment from a *regular* grand jury.
jeffreyw
Everything You Ever Wanted to Know About Georgia Special Purpose Grand Juries But Were Afraid to Ask
Gin & Tonic
I’m lousy at political predictions, but I have gone on record repeatedly that TFG will never see the inside of a prison cell. I see no reason to alter that prediction.
trollhattan
We’re beginning to learn what it cost for McCarthy to win the world’s currently worst job.
Nice democracy you got there, be a shame if anything happened to it.
SFAW
@Gin & Tonic: Same with me
ETA: Of course, this probably means you and I will get labeled as Eeyores or doomsayers or some such. Oh well.
SFAW
Now that Gym Jordan has assumed the role of Grand Inquisitor — OK, not yet, but it’s a-coming — is there any feasible way he can interfere with Jack Smith’s efforts? I’m hoping not, because if there is a way, Jordan will use it.
WaterGirl
@MisterForkbeard: You can find the info in a million places, but here’s one.
A federal judge declines Justice Department’s request to hold Trump’s team in contempt over classified documents.
Originally, all the stories in the media stated that the federal judge had declined the DOJ request to hold the Donald John Trump something-something in contempt re: not turning over classified documents.
The news in the last few days is that the judge did not actual decline to hold them in contempt. Possibly/likely that the judge may have asked them to take some further step before the judge rules.
WaterGirl
@SFAW: It’s my understanding that because the investigation has shifted to the Special Counsel, Jack Smith, the Rs won’t even be able to call Merrick Garland before congress to ask about details of the investigation.
And they can’t defund it because the funding is set.
Old School
Geminid
@SFAW: I am inclined to agree that Trump will likely not spend any time in prison.
I still think it’s still likely that he will be tried and convicted for more than one felony, though.
Aziz, light!
@Gin & Tonic: Last spring I said he will find ways to kick the can until he kicks the bucket and was blamed here for lacking optimism.
Burnspbesq
@artem1s:
Far from expert on GA process, but if the Fulton County special grand jury recommends prosecutions, it will be up to Fani Willis, the Fulton County DA, to decide whether to go forward. And she has no incentive to not move forward.
MattF
I’ve had a suspicion for some time now that there was a lot of behind-the-scenes lobbying that took place before Smith was named special counsel, not least by Smith himself. I think he wanted this job pretty badly— and perhaps we’ll see why in the next year or so.
Sister Golden Bear
McCarthy had to get it done under 16, otherwise Matt Gaetz would’ve lost interest.
feebog
I follow Joyce Vance (Joyce Alene) on Twitter and just posed this question; I can’t imagine DA Willis would want the Grand Jury report made public, at least not until she issues indictments. Should we make any inference if Fulton County moves to delay the January 24 hearing on the issue?
feebog
@Burnspbesq:
Burnsy, do you think DA Willis and the DoJ have had any discussion on her moving forward with indictments vs. handing off the report to the feds?
WaterGirl
@MattF: I think that’s pure speculation on your part, yes?
What leads you to believe that?
MattF
@WaterGirl: Yes, just a guess. But he dove right into it from across the ocean, and his background is in prosecuting authoritarians. My guess is that he’d be on the short list, and making an emphatic, unembarrassed case for greater responsibility is a requirement at that level.
artem1s
@trollhattan:
Good news for Dem challengers then. TFG’s picks and extremists had a hard time in the general elections. IIRC a couple of Dems picked up seats in safe red district because the OH GQP party insisted on running a wingnut MAGAt. Also,too how are they defining ‘safe’ and who gets to define that? Qevin probably figures he won’t be speaker anymore come 2024 anyway so what does he care if the cray cray factor explodes in the R-House membership?
Betty Cracker
@trollhattan: Saw something about that last week — allegedly, in the intraparty spat, the Club for Growth was the CLF opponent on this issue, and members affiliated with CFG weren’t going to drop their opposition to McCarthy until CLF said it would stop opposing kooks in “safe” red seats.
The claim that the GOP is wholly motivated by bigotry always rang false for me — I’m not a big believer in simple, neat explanations. And there’s a lot of evidence that a powerful wing of the Republican Party really is mostly focused on deregulation and favorable tax treatment for rich people and that they leveraged bigotry to bring voters on board because plutocracy isn’t popular.
That said, the plutocracy wing, which includes people like the Bushes, Romney, McConnell, McCarthy, etc., has basically lost control of the party to the Bull Connor faction, so it’s unsurprising that the CLF blinked first.
Jim, Foolish Literalist
@MattF: I’m sure there were at least unofficial phone calls from old friends or acquaintances at DoJ, “What would you say if you were asked to serve….”
I’m always a bit curious about those kinds of feelers sent both ways with big political appointments, from Veep on down. “Of course I don’t speak for [political bigwig on whose behalf the person is of course speaking], but if your name should come up…”
Burnspbesq
@feebog:
I do not, for one simple reason: Federal courts don’t have jurisdiction to hear cases involving alleged violations of Georgia law.
Kelly
@artem1s: Marie Gluesenkamp Pérez probably would not have won Washington’s CD3 against a less Trumpy Republicanism
WaterGirl
@Burnspbesq: It’s not against federal law to interfere with a federal election and the peaceful transition of power?
WaterGirl
@Kelly: Where do we send the thank you note?
Geminid
@feebog: Willis is investigating Trump and others for violations of Georgia state law. I’m not sure if federal law in this area tracks Georgia law, so she will have to prosecute the case if she can make it.
However, I think I read that Michigan handed its false electors case off to the feds, so federal prosecutors might still be interested in Willis’s work product for their own purposes.
lowtechcyclist
@jonas:
‘Protects but does not bind, binds but doesn’t protect,’ etc.
Which:
@narya:
which is one of the classic examples. Funny how, in so many white-collar crimes, state of mind must need to be proved, and how that’s almost never the case for the crimes of ‘common’ criminals.
The law is an ass, and it’s an ass for a definite reason in these situations
ETA: Not dumping on Popehat here, he’s just explaining what the law is.
jonas
@Gin & Tonic: I think that’s true with one qualification: it will only be because a future Republican president or governor will immediately pardon him if he is convicted.
jonas
@lowtechcyclist: Yep, if the bar for “intent to defraud” were as low as it is for “intent to sell”, half of the C-suites in corporate America would be behind bars.
Kelly
@WaterGirl: The Mar-a-Lago Club 1100 South Ocean Boulevard, Palm Beach, Florida 33480
lowtechcyclist
@WaterGirl:
There may well be a Federal statute that Trump violated in leaning on Raffensperger for those extra 11,780 votes. But the Georgia grand jury is looking into violations of Georgia state statutes. The Feds can’t charge someone with breaking a state law.
What they can do (at least as I understand it, legal eagles should correct me as appropriate) is see whether the alleged crime against the Georgia law is also a crime against a U.S. statute, and see whether the evidence presented to the GA grand jury is enough to convict on the Federal statute.
lowtechcyclist
@jonas:
It would certainly be one hell of an incentive to improve corporate conduct.
WaterGirl
@Kelly: ha!
WaterGirl
@lowtechcyclist: I imagine that Jack Smith is doing just that.
trollhattan
@Old School: Wonder how many times in his deposition Trump says, “Besides, she’s not my type”?
Burnspbesq
@WaterGirl:
Of course it is, but in the context of what is or isn’t happening in Georgia, that’s completely irrelevant. The special grand jury was tasked with investigating potential violations of Georgia law.
tobie
@WaterGirl: I’m convinced it was to protect the integrity of the investigation that Garland appointed a Special Counsel as soon as it was clear the GOP had won the House.
lowtechcyclist
@Gin & Tonic:
I make no predictions, but I certainly won’t expect any other outcome until the doors of a prison slam shut behind him. Hell, I’ll believe he’ll be indicted only when it actually happens.
I’m not saying neither will happen, just that I’ll be the doubting Thomas until the proof is there for all to see.
LoveNOLA
@WaterGirl: My birthday is January 24. I do not need material things. A fine gift would be some documents that I and others (my gift to you) can read. Please help me get this gift
WaterGirl
@tobie: I believe that was a big part of his decision, not all, but a very big part.
Also, I suspect that Merrick Garland has a keen understanding of his own strengths and weaknesses, and I’ll bet he can see that Jack Smith is the right person for particular task at this moment.
Plus it was a total time sink, and Garland has a lot of other stuff to address, too.
Omnes Omnibus
@WaterGirl: Different crimes.
WaterGirl
@Omnes Omnibus: That makes sense.
It sort of seemed like someone was dismissing what happened in GA as nothing the DOJ would have jurisdiction over, and I disagreed with that.
Bobby Thomson
@Old School: His entire transcript is redacted. The only visible testimony is Carroll’s.
WaterGirl
@LoveNOLA: If it were up to me, it would already be done!
WaterGirl
@Bobby Thomson: For real? Or a prediction on your part?
Bobby Thomson
@WaterGirl: the link in the tweet is to what was already in the public record. Apparently his lawyers are arguing for a do-over with nonsensical arguments, including that she didn’t provide a good reason for his testimony to be unsealed. There is a strong First Amendment right to open courts that sealed records infringe upon, so the presumption always is against sealing the record.
It could be that the judge’s clerk has called the parties to let them know there will be an opportunity for DFG to make his tardy filing. Or there is an angry lawyer in the Clerk’s office threatening lawsuits. Or the Clerk’s office is waiting until close of business. We don’t really know.
artem1s
OK, that seems like a weird extra step. but clear enough.
Another Scott
@Burnspbesq: I guess we’ll know soon enough, if this is accurate.
We’ll see!
Cheers,
Scott.
ETtheLibrarian
George’s first con was his mom.