Dems made quick work of the House Republican impeachment circus, striking the tents in an afternoon. Ted Cruz had time to make an ass of himself, but that’s an everyday thing. Good work, Senate Dems!
It was considerate of Republicans to deliver charges today, when Trump’s trial in New York is NOT in session. Now they won’t get the hoped for distraction. And they need to draw the nation’s attention elsewhere because, as Josh Marshall at TPM observes, Trump’s entire game is domination. And in the courtroom, the judge is the alpha dog:
What is clear to anyone who has ever tried to understand the man is that he lives in a binary world of the dominating and the dominated. The visuals around the man endlessly illustrate this. Most of us live in a much more fluid and textured world. We interact with most people on a ground of relative equality. Where real differentials of power exist most of us try to paper over those realities with softening trappings. Trump’s whole world view, the way he interacts with friends and foes, won’t accept any middle ground. And this is more than just performance. It’s clear that this is deeply rooted in his experience of the world. Being dominated is a kind of social and ego death. That’s why he’s so good at his whole racket. Because it’s coded so deeply into him.
Nothing puts you more squarely in the bucket of the dominated than being a defendant in a criminal trial and at risk of losing your freedom. The state makes its case against you and you have to sit there and take it. In case there was any question, the judge told Trump you have to be here in my court and sit here. A dozen randomly picked people hold your fate in their hands. You have to make your case, an actual case. Bullshit and attitude, Trump’s coins of the realm, could work. Unless those twelve people decide it doesn’t.
Seeing Trump sitting there, even on this least weighty prosecution, you get a sense of why he’s fought so tooth and nail to avoid this. The biggest and most obvious reason is that he doesn’t want to go to jail. That is certainly a sufficient reason. But it’s not the whole story. At the most basic level, sitting in the dock is horribly and perhaps even fatally off brand. Trump’s brand is swagger and impunity. Always be dominating. Until you’re not.
I think that’s right. I also agree with something Dan Pfeiffer said about the effect of the trial, which many pundits are assuming (as an article of faith) will not harm Trump at all in the upcoming election.
The scale of his crimes (Donald Trump falsifying records to cover up an extramarital affair) seems like small potatoes when compared to his violent attempt to overthrow an election or stealing closely-held national secrets from the White House and then showing them to random people at his beach club. Trump is unlikely to be sentenced to prison if convicted. Still, a felony conviction months before a divisive election is nothing to scoff at.
Pfeiffer notes that in close elections, everything matters. He also cites polls that show majorities of voters take the charges seriously — even a quarter of Republicans:
One in four 2020 Trump voters are not yet sure if Trump should be acquitted. What happens to those voters if Trump is convicted? Most of them vote for Trump anyway. Partisanship is a hell of a drug, but the results of the Republican Primary suggest that drug’s effects may be waning. The exit polls consistently showed that about 30% of Republican primary voters would not believe Trump was fit for the presidency if convicted.
Even if only a fraction of these voters stay home or vote for Biden, it will be enough to tip the election. In the Times poll, Trump is up by one point while getting 94% of his 2020 voters. If only 3% of those voters decide not to vote for Trump, Biden will win by a decent margin…
Finally, Trump being in the news has generally been bad for him and a high profile trial in the media capital of the world guarantees that much of the political coverage will be centered on the former President for the duration of the trial.
Of course, a conviction doesn’t guarantee a Trump loss, but that’s not the same as saying it doesn’t matter.
I’m not even sure a trial ending in an acquittal or hung jury would erase the spectacle of Trump being dominated daily in the courtroom and raging incoherently on the sidewalk afterward. I agree it doesn’t mean he’ll definitely lose, but it’s not the nothingburger some pundits are making it out to be.
My theory is their brains broke when The Beast clawed his way back to GOP dominance after the coup attempt. So now they think Trump is invincible. With that group, at least, he’s still the alpha dog who they roll over for every time.
Open thread.
Baud
It’s the whole alpha male schtick that’s popular among certain young men now. It’s hollow, but you do have to stand up to it or it’ll work.
Harrison Wesley
I think he’s too stupid to realize the judge is serious when he says to STFU about witnesses and jurors and family members. Sooner or later, he’s not going to get a fine – he’ll get a week or two in jail (not much, but it would have a very interesting effect on him).
WaterGirl
Isn’t that the truth!
waspuppet
It’s definitely true that leaving behind “Don’t you know who I am?” and getting down to actual nouns and verbs of what you did is Trump’s worst nightmare.
It’s also true that the only thing that turns people off to Donald Trump is finding out who he actually is and hearing what he says and thinks, without the Peter Bakers of the world to clean things up for him. Which is ironic, since Trump remains utterly convinced that talking at length and unedited will fix any problem he ever runs into.
My favorite piece of information about the jury selection was Trump having to sit there while the lawyers read out some of the jurors’ social media burns and debated whether that meant they couldn’t serve
ETA: Regarding our media stars, no one seems to have spent much time talking about the fact that until a few years ago Trump styled himself the God King of Noo Yawk, and now he claims he can’t get a fair trial there. You know, the place where they know him best.
TBone
This entire thing is fucking hilarious 😆 bwahahaha! Cry harder, bitchez!
https://www.huffpost.com/entry/republican-governors-highly-concerned-workers-are-about-to-form-unions_n_662001f0e4b0256906b72c7a
TBone
Today, he was very mad at…
Jimmy Kimmel
😆
waspuppet
@Harrison Wesley: But — but then he’ll miss going to graduation and having someone point out to him which one’s Barron!
bbleh
I think it’s more just like it’s an easy story-line with guaranteed clicks — from both sides — and everybody else is writing it, so just file and then go have drinks. Plus it doesn’t jeopardize future access (unless of course they’re among the ones who will be sent to the gulags, but they all think they’re protected).
The other thing I think is worth noting is, it’s not just that TIFG has to sit there and keep his fat mouth shut, but there’s also going to be some really sordid testimony that is very accessible even to (arguably especially to) “low-information voters.” They may not care about conspiracy or espionage, but this is Jerry Springer stuff, and that’s juicy! I don’t think that’s gonna help his “brand” much either.
Dan B
@waspuppet: Trump hasn’t been to the graduation of any of his children.
UncleEbeneezer
There are absolutely people who voted for Trump because they thought he was cool as he was portrayed in The Apprentice. And nothing more. These are the types of people who might not vote for him based on his indictments and the way he seems in his court appearances. What % of the electorate is this group? Who knows. But these trials will absolutely peel off some support.
Brachiator
I like these insights. My sister was recently talking about not being able to watch the Trump trial because of work, and I wondered whether Trump might feel insecure because he would have to behave.
I don’t think that he is good at this racket at all. He is not naturally the top dog; he is deeply insecure and always requires flattery and deference.
From news reports, Trump has been playing dominance games in the courtroom, glowering at witnesses. The judge has shut that down. And so, Trump is reduced to scurrying to the microphones after court, or being offensive on Un-Truth Social, and the judge may shut him down here as well.
This leaves Trump with one option. To fall asleep in court, and to dream that he is a Top Dog.
gwangung
Yeah….I don’t know if he’ll be convicted, and even a conviction will not shake the vast majority of his supporters…but he needs every single one of his voters to have a hope of winning. And if he sheds even 4-5% of them, that probably is a match for any losses Biden has through disinterest and his handling of Israel…
SiubhanDuinne
@TBone:
Yes he was. He was, moreover, mad at Jimmy Kimmel about something that Al Pacino, not JK, did. Hilarious.
schrodingers_cat
@Baud: Its pretty stupid. And that was a flawed study of wolves in captivity. Wolves in the wild don’t behave like that.
Redshift
The other thing that pundits get wrong is that legal troubles keep being good for TFG’s political popularity. What they persistently miss is that they made him more popular with Republicans and in Republican primaries, but Republicans alone are not enough for him to win.
Jackie
@Harrison Wesley:
At the most it would be for one night. One night without his phone would probably just about kill him.
Redshift
@schrodingers_cat: Yeah, wildlife biologists are constantly reminding people that it’s just wrong about wolves. Which perhaps explains why people who believe that about humans are so pathetic except in their own minds.
schrodingers_cat
@Redshift: Hasn’t a larger percentage of Republicans voted for Haley than Democrats voting for a non Biden alternative.
The press is his base they are not at all objective about him. Save a few exceptions like John Harwood
Marcus and Brooks were saying the same stuff on the Snooze Hour last week that these cases make him popular. And this NY one is a nothingburger.
Jackie
@Dan B: And, he probably only attended his MIL’s funeral to get out of court. He also did a campaign event that day.
TIFG isn’t fooling anyone with his fake obligations for family events.
Trivia Man
A new angle just struck me. Id stay quiet if i thought he’d hear me and start using it… bit I’m confident he doesn’t read BJ. His loss.
he could spin it as HIS decision to stay quiet in the courtroom. “I am the most polite and patient man you will ever see. I could correct that judge when he makes so many mistakes, nobody knows the law like i do, everybody says that. ‘Sir! You never went to law school! How do you know so much.’ Very powerful law knowledge. I have every right to correct him and show him how he is wrong. But im patient like a tiger in the jungle, waiting to spring like a tiger. When i do respond, and i will, very strongly, you know i will, he won’t even know what hit him. He will be so humiliated he will apologize and probably pay me damages. Big damages the likes of which you have never seen. And then he will resume gn – he has to after a defeat like nobody has ever been defeated before. Probably.”
Trivia Man
Im quiet because i want to, not because he told me. Hes not the boss of me.
Hoodie
@Harrison Wesley: I’ve been wondering what the effect might be if one of the judges puts him jail for contempt, precisely because it might shatter his dominance playacting that someone actually could force him to do something he really doesn’t want to do. I know some fear it might make him a martyr, but I have some doubts about that given the nature of his supporters. They don’t like losers. Having to sit in the courtroom is certainly a step in the direction, but jailing is a whole order of magnitude more. The interesting thing is that he flaunts the gag orders as part of his dominance display, which is kind of a risky move. While it might be effective with the idiots who buy into that schtick, it might not be worth the risk because god knows when a judge might say “fuck it, let him be a martyr.”
Chip Daniels
We politically attuned people forget that much of what we consumes as news is just background noise for most people that never rises above the entertainment din.
So many people might not be aware of all of Trumps crimes unless something shocking happens like a criminal trial.
Trivia Man
@Harrison Wesley: I think it will start with an afternoon locked up. The logistics of overnight are daunting. Certainly could be down ne but I’m n an over/under prop bet ill take under 6 hours for a first contempt ruling.
Shalimar
@waspuppet: That’s silly. Everyone knows Barron is the one who is a lot taller than Donald.
smith
Some recent polling:
Trivia Man
@waspuppet: you just know he brags about baron’s height ever time his name comes up. Every time.
He hates being next to him but in theory it makes him more virile.
Shalimar
The fact that we all have already forgotten the non-Biden alternative’s name pretty much answers that question.
Baud
@Trivia Man:
I want stockades!
Leto
@TBone: the two previous unionization attempts at the VW factory were fairly close affairs. Hopefully this third attempt will stick, with more unions to follow. This is one of those decades long project that’s hopefully starting to show results. Any inroads we can make in workers rights in the south is progress.
Trollhattan
@smith:
Four convictions later: “You said serious crimes. These were things we’ve all done; yeah, I’m voting for him.”
Baud
@Leto:
Another reason the oligarchs are going to go all out for a Trump win.
grumbles
That thought occurred to me too – so many of the current crop of republicans in congress are followers. They win via a weird flavor of celebrity, have no real policy preferences other than “winning”, don’t know how Washington works, and don’t seem to care to learn.
So you’re Roscoe Instagram, (R) Flyover. Trump has rolled you multiple times, and you and your team start to think “He may suck, but he’s a great politician” rather than “I make barnacles look savvy”.
The super gross part is that a lot of them will be re-elected.
sab
@Trivia Man: Apparently Melania was better at nutritionally feeding kids than the mom raised raking kelp. That makes sense. Better food, bigger kids. Not rocket science, but it does make sense.
Marcopolo
@Dan B: Well, I am of the understanding that he attended Don Jr’s graduation in 2002—someone who was there attested to it so I think this is wrong, though it’s something I’d like to believe. Don’t know about anyone else though he might also have made Ivanka’s.
ColoradoGuy
A significant part of the population treats politics as a sports game. There’s the home team, that you and your friends always root for, and there are the outside teams. So it’s all just flag-waving and razzmatazz to them.
Leto
@Chip Daniels: if only we had a profession, whose protected job it was to report on this stuff….
In other news, idk who the court sketch artists are but they’re doing the Mango Menace absolutely ZERO favors wrt how they’re sketching him. Good. He’s a loser and deserves to be drawn as one.
Leto
@Baud: agreed; part of why they’re circling the wagons around him again. If you remember shortly after Jan 6th, a lot of them (as well as major corporations) came out against him and the coup. Promised to not donate money to coup supporters. Then that quietly faded, the economy didn’t shit the bed, Biden has done an admirable job on almost all fronts, and off they go slithering back to business as usual.
sdhays
I saw exactly one episode of The Apprentice, and I really don’t understand how people came away thinking Donald Trump was some kind of genius. He wasn’t in the show at all. He wasn’t involved. He told someone that they’re fired at the end, which you can train a parrot to do. I didn’t know hardly anything about him, but I walked away knowing #1: it’s an awful show and #2: Trump has almost nothing to do with it. And I was right!
One show!
geg6
@Leto:
Right? The sketches I’ve seen have been glorious.
sab
Look at the news!! and my very elderly dad just died. But I am having a hard time not being elated by Spring. Hope that enough of the Republicans come to their sense, or at least npkow fishing leaving others to vote.
Baud
@sab:
My condolences.
Tom Levenson
My take: I don’t think our elite media betters have fully got their heads around (narrator: have even begun to do so) the impact of the testimony in this trial.
Stormy Daniels describing in detail the encounter for which her silence was bought ain’t going to help. The sleaze of the payoff and Cohen’s testimony, for all that he’ll get savaged as a convicted asshole, will color Trump an unattractive non-orange shade. Etc.
The issue isn’t (just) the verdict. It’s the day after day wall-to-wall coverage of a shitty little scheme run by a fecally-enhanced tiny man that will do damage.
Tom Levenson
@sab: I am very sorry for your loss.
geg6
@sab:
So sorry! Sending you good vibes.
Trivia Man
@sab: Im still not convinced she is NOT a Soviet genetic experiment. If true then it was the most brilliant way to destabilizes america ever. She PRETENDS she hated winning but that’s what we call ACTING! Maybe she egged him on so that russia could trigger their information Psy Ops.
Jay
@sab:
Or different Dad, she is his Slovenian Time Share.
Manyakitty
@sab: I’m so sorry to hear about your dad. May his memory be a blessing. All the love to you and yours.
Trivia Man
@ColoradoGuy: Two things absolutely hard wired into human brains. Finding patterns and banding together against an enemy. If neither exists it will be invented. Doesn’t matter … just as powerful as if it was real.
Jay
@sab:
am sorry to hear that Sab, you took good care of him.
Betty Cracker
@sab: So sorry to hear that. Take care of yourself.
RaflW
@Trivia Man: More like “I am the most polite and patient — really, like Lincoln was patient in that war, the incivility war — I’m as patient a man you will ever see. I could correct that judge when he makes so many mistakes, nobody knows the legals like I do, everybody says that. ‘Sir! You never went to school … uhrned … never went to law school. How do you know so much?’ Very powerful, so strong that law school stuff I know.
By the way have you noticed that Robert E Lee never went to college? Well I guess he went to West Point, but Wow! that was a military school, not a prestigious school like Wharton — but no one talks about Wharton any more, I wonder why that is?
[Louder] But… I have every right to correct him and show him how he is wrong. But I’m patient like a tonningerette …[inaudible] in the jungle, waiting to spring like a tingiter… When I do respond, and I will, very strongly, you know I will, he won’t even know what hit him.”
Brachiator
@Baud:
Apparently, the GOP leadership didn’t get the memo.
They love sucking up to Trump. Enablers.
Jackie
@sab: sab, I’m sorry. 99 is a long life; my dad passed at that age, too.
Sending you hugs.
Trivia Man
@RaflW: even better!
bbleh
@sab: ah sorry. he was very lucky to have had someone like you to care for him.
Brachiator
@sab:
My condolences.
NutmegAgain
Honestly I do hope the judge throws him in the pokey for misbehavior. Even if only for a very short while. Just long enough for it to sink in that he is not in charge.
NutmegAgain
@sab: Warmth and condolences to you & family
Baud
@Brachiator:
Alpha male-ism is like feudalism. You suck up the the top dogs so you can kick the ones below you
Dan B
@sab: Glad that Spring brings you joy to counteract the loss of your father. It’s a beautiful Spring day here which makes news about terrible things in the world bearable.
zhena gogolia
@sab: Oh, I’m so sorry. You were so caring about his welfare. I’m sure he appreciated it.
brantl
@WaterGirl: And then they pee all over themselves.
RaflW
@Shalimar: I barely remember the non-Biden alternative’s name and I live in Minnesota (but not in the well-drink-scion’s district).
Dangerman
I’m reasonably sure this is my first effort of pendanticism …
… and I just woke up from a nap, always a dangerous time …
… but I was taught to never use the word hung (unless you have just watched one of San Fernando Valleys finest productions and want to review, um, important aspects of it, in which case, perfectly acceptable).
Is it hanged jury or hung jury (this is called a hanging curveball, a true cement mixer, and why baseball calls hanging curveballs cement mixers is entirely unknown)?
Ken
Convicted for doing what Trump said, which I would think counters the impeachment value.
Oh gee, I just thought — do you suppose the prosecution will use the phrase “goes to impeach the witness” a lot? I can definitely see Trump forbidding his lawyer from using the word.
sab
I was lost and angry this month, but I cannot express how Impressed I was with hospice workers dealing with a dying old man and stressed children local and out of state. Just amazing in diffusing fights and issues, and focussing us on Dad as he was dying.
They got called in at the worst possible time, Dad declining, his nursing home tossing us out, and another wonderful place receiving us with real warmth when we were very traumatized. Then he looked to be dying and he was. We thought he was safe, but only for a comfortable place to die.
Same hospice. They did their job and followed us protecting Dad through all our corporate caregiver and family dynamics. Lovely amazing people.
If you have an elderly person especially with demetia, you need to call for help early. They know more than you ever will about communicatimg with their patients. Not what they are possibly dying of. But what worries them or hurts them. The smaller issues that consume their lives that you might not even notice., but which cause them pain or anxiety.
mrmoshpotato
Or the punditocracy still enjoys jerking off to the orange shitstain.
As a great man once said, “Fuck ’em!”
WaterGirl
@sab: When the hospice person said very soon, they were right. I would guess that what you’re feeing is pretty complicated at this point.
Dorothy A. Winsor
@sab: peace and strength to you
Geminid
@Dangerman: It could be that hanging curves are called “cement mixers” because the paddles on cement mixers spin relatvely slowly and are easily seen.
Brachiator
@bbleh:
Trump supporters have already discounted this. They either see the trial as part of the conspiracy against Trump, or they envy him and wish that they could have sex with someone like Stormy Daniels.
But I think that Trump will be stung if he is convicted because it will mark him as a loser criminal.
If he is convicted, someone should note that he has become an example of the kind of criminal he wants to keep out of the country.
mrmoshpotato
@waspuppet:
“And here’s how potential juror #7 thinks Donald Trump is a walking pile of shit!…”
Brachiator
@Dangerman:
Hung jury.
“Henry could not be hanged because there was a hung jury.”
sab
@WaterGirl: I am felling so fucking grateful. Our longtime caregiver was in denial. So was I. The hospice people called us in one night to say do you want a volunteer to sit with him his last night. I had no idea it was that bad. Denial. The next day they called again and I called my sisters. Without that call my sisters, especially my oldest, wouldn’t have been there and he would have died without them.
My dad died five minutes after his favorite child my oldest sister came into the room and talked to him. I am so grateful that he got to hear her voice.
Hospice did that.
mrmoshpotato
@sab: Sorry for your loss. May your dad rest in peace.
As for Spring, glad it brings you joy. I highly recommend hanging out in a nice park (as I am right now on this breezy Chicago day.)
prostratedragon
🎧🎵 “Close Your Eyes and Listen,” Gerry Mulligan and Astor Piazzolla
mrmoshpotato
@Brachiator: Well hung jury?
wjca
The jury is well hung. Unlike TIFG. (OK, that was tasteless. Sorry.)
SiubhanDuinne
@sab:
Oh, sab, I am sorry. You’ve had a tough time of it. I hope your dad had a peaceful transition. Hugs to you, and peace on his memory.
Omnes Omnibus
@sab: My condolences.
smith
@mrmoshpotato: Not the defendant, at any rate, as witness testimony will prove.
sab
@mrmoshpotato: I would but my dog hates going outside the yard. Timidest pitbull ever.
wjca
Or he could react like he did with Putin, and start fawning over the judge.
Brachiator
@Trivia Man:
Trump may well come up with something like this. He ain’t smart, but he is desperate and cunning. He must always show that he is in control.
But if he starts doing shit like this, you will have earned some bragging rights.
Dan B
@sab: Glad to hear you found hospice and they found you all.
Wapiti
@sab: It’s somewhat uncanny to me how a ailing person can hold on for a child to be with them, or for a spouse to predecease them, but some do it. I was very thankful that I got to see my mother before she passed (about a month before, but I’ll take what I can get) and I imagine your siblings are thankful as well.
Brachiator
@mrmoshpotato:
“Henry was hung. But he was hanged. And so he swung.”
cain
@sab: my deepest condolences on your loss.
sab
@SiubhanDuinne: Dad’s caregiver hates the word “transition” but I think it is very apt. Not quite yet dying but pretty much close to the same thing.
He had dementia, and his last weeks or months could have been horrible. Hospice protected him from all of that. Protected him from too much pain or anxiety.
Also too, they showed my skeptical out of area sisters what and why they were doing hopxpce things.
schrodingers_cat
@sab: I am so sorry. May he RIP. You were a good daughter to him.
Spanky
@sab: You are a very good daughter. My condolences to you.
Leto
@sab: I’m so sorry for your loss. Sending the best of vibes to you and your family.
Trivia Man
@Brachiator: Thank you
But upon reading it again , i can’t think if a single time he has used an abstract analogy. “Like a tiger” is too unreal. He can reference actual events, as he recalls them, like The Civil War or That Terrible Crime XYZ as ling as it starts with “Remember that person place or thing” and not “Imagine something that didn’t happen yet”
cain
@sab:
A good death everyone got to say goodbye. 😢
WaterGirl
@Tom Levenson: Hey Tom, I think you had said you wanted to join the Einstein zoom, but I haven’t seen an RSVP from you yet, so I just wanted check in.
sab
@SiubhanDuinne: He was a lovely kind man. He was also 99 1/2 years old. He had a long full life, and he missed Mom a lot.
VFX Lurker
@sab: Condolences from California.
sab
@cain: Yes. So much.
TBone
@Leto: of course – it’s the stupidity of the Governors that I find hilarious.
schrodingers_cat
@cain: So did you figure out what caused your Hindutva uncle’s change of heart
Citizen Alan
@Trivia Man: That or it makes melania’s chauffeur more virile. Or whoever else she’s banging on the side.
Jackie
TIFG is already targeting the jurors:
Judge Merchan is VERY PROTECTIVE of his jurors; this won’t bode well for TIFG.
Melancholy Jaques
@sab:
Sorry for your loss.
Quadrillipede
@Dangerman: “A person is hanged, a portrait is hung” is what I was taught in school. I presume the latter sense works for anyone/anything not being executed by rope.
A woman from anywhere (formerly Mohagan)
@schrodingers_cat: Exactly. Wolves in the wild, along with many other pack or herd animals. are basically an extended family unit, with the mother and kids forming the core. Often, it’s a matriarchy (as with elephants).
Jeffro
@Jackie: since there is absolutely no evidence of this, since it’s obviously made up, since it’s obviously being made up directly by trump himself, and since it serves trump no other purpose that to either a) intimidate jurors (current and prospective) or b) delegitimize the whole proceeding…
…THROW. HIS ENTIRE ASS. IN JAIL.
geg6
@WaterGirl:
I know that feeling. Hospice told us our mom was going to die after a years long battle with breast and bone cancer. We got her into a place that, coincidentally, had a head nurse who was a former student of mine and my sister. She didn’t make it 10 days there, but had great care from our former student and hospice, thankfully. But when she died, it was confusing because it was very sad to realize we were now orphans and how much we counted on our tough as nails mother. We also felt relieved, which was why it was complicated. Relieved she wasn’t suffering any more (she refused almost all pain meds in favor of a clear mind) and relieved that the whole ordeal was over. In many ways, we had an easier time emotionally dealing with my dad’s sudden death two years before (massive heart attack). It was a huge shock, but we didn’t have the clashing emotions that we had when mom passed.
eclare
@sab:
Oh I’m so sorry.
Mr. Bemused Senior
@sab: more condolences from CA.
sab
@Dan B: If you are ever doing elder care with dementia, get hospice in early, and do not argue if your nursing home suggests it. Hospice protects the patient from the nursing home and also family in denial and family in absentia.
We were furious at what they were giving him, but on retrospect those were medications he needed for comfort, anxiety and pain.
He was never a whiner. Just because he didn’t tell us he was in pain doesn’t mean he wasn’t. At 99 he might have been in a lot.
Elizabelle
@sab: my condolences. And Spring is marvelous. Reward for getting through it all.
A woman from anywhere (formerly Mohagan)
@Hoodie: Maybe you mean “flouts” instead of “flaunts”? Either way, he really is pushing it with his defiance of gag orders, and I agree, he is eventually going to have a judge say “OK, that’s it. You’re going to jail”.
martha
@sab: I wish you strength to weather these next days (been there) and yes, good hospice workers are angels. Big hugs to you.
Another Scott
@Dan B: Supposedly he told his wives that it was their job to raise the kids; he wanted nothing to do with them until they were adults. Then he’d take over and teach them how to be MotUs, or something.
Missing their graduations would fit in that picture.
FWIW.
Cheers,
Scott.
Frankensteinbeck
@Another Scott:
Trump’s father is said to have been abusive and contemptuous of Donald.
Jackie
Good news for the popular vote!
Maybe we can outsmart the GQP’s refusal to abolish the EC informally, rather than trying to defeat the EC through Congress. If all states decide “to let the states decide…” Of course at the moment, I don’t foresee Red states jumping on board anytime soon.
Soprano2
@Redshift: These people are the ones who think R’s are half of the voters.
cain
@schrodingers_cat:
Not yet but it’s likely some person he is following but he personally does not like bragging and that might chafe.
Curious to see how it goes. He has some challenging issues with cancer eating away at him.
Starfish
@Brachiator:
lollipopguild
@cain: I have heard all kinds of stories about people who should be “dead” who hang on for hours or days waiting for a loved one to show up.
cain
@sab: my grandfather lived till 5 months after his 100th birthday and then said ‘achievement unlocked’ and checked out.
My dad is 85 and in great shape. My grandfather was winning races at this age. 😊
cain
@lollipopguild:
I can believe that.
Brachiator
@Trivia Man:
Fair point. He would probably use some business related analogy.
Another Scott
@sab: Condolences to you and yours, sab.
Remember the good times, and try to decompress from all the stress of the past few weeks/months.
Best wishes,
Scott.
sab
@martha: What hospice wants to give him may clonk him out. But that is because his pain or anxiety is so high. And in many families the patient will not tell family they have a weakness and are stessed and hurting.
Harrison Wesley
@Starfish: When I first saw the two-scoop story, I thought it was one of the most pathetic things to ever pass in front of my eyes.
Sister Golden Bear
@Redshift:
Especially as the number of self-identified Republicans has been shrinking, as those not on the MAGA train have moved to identifying as “independents.” But hey, fewer but better Republicans amirite?
West of the Rockies
@sab:
Deepest sympathy, sab. Hospice was wonderful to my father, too.
Josie
@sab:
Late to the thread, but I am sorry for your loss. So good that hospice could ease your father’s last days and help your family cope. They are so wonderful. You have been a good and loyal daughter.
Sister Golden Bear
@sab: My condolences.
And yes, hospice care workers know when someone is about to go.
A woman from anywhere (formerly Mohagan)
@sab: So sorry for your loss, but it sounds like a good death. May his memory be a blessing. Hugs to you.
sab
@Another Scott: I remember so many good times. A solid serious man but he could be a goof. Our first dog was a tired bassett hound. Our first horse was a retired race horse age 3. He didn’t think he was retired. My dad said he owned the half that ate.
He made us sail! (bastard) Tiny children in a small boat hoping the boom swinging wouldn’t toss any child overboard.
karen marie
@waspuppet: Every time he whines that he might not get to go to Barron’s HS graduation, someone should ask him for a photo of him at any one of the eight opportunities he’s already had to attend a HS or college graduation ceremony.
Old School
@sab: Sorry for your loss and I’m glad you are remembering the good times.
Brachiator
@Quadrillipede:
You can hang curtains, but then they are hung.
karen marie
@SiubhanDuinne: Delicious!
Ghost of Joe Liebling’s Dog
@sab: I’m so sorry.
Citizen Alan
@Jackie: This scares me for reasons.I cannot articulate. But I just know there is some possible application of this law That will allow it to be gamed so that it only helps republicans and not democrats.
karen marie
@Ken: I agree – he was convicted of lying FOR TRUMP, at Trump’s behest. I’m baffled that anyone thinks that’s a winning argument against Cohen’s credibility.
sab
@A woman from anywhere (formerly Mohagan): Horrible to say, but I think it was a good desth. And vastly better than many options.
The populace needs to think about these things.
We don’t just keel over. We die among people who care, or among people who don’t. If we are very lucky we get to chose which.
sab
@Ghost of Joe Liebling’s Dog: He was 99 years old and had been mostly healthy.
PaulWartenberg
Betty, just wanted to share my thoughts about one of the last good Florida governors and fellow Gator alum, Bob Graham:
https://noticeatrend.blogspot.com/2024/04/eulogy-for-fellow-gator.html
JoeyJoeJoe
@cain: it’s never too late to run. I know of people in their 90s who still did races, even recalls reading about a guy who did a half marathon at 100. Don’t remember his name, but remember his nickname is the Running Sikh
sab
Yikes. I feel like I highjacked this thread. I am fine. Extremely old Dad died peacefully. Hospice was beyond amazing.
Baud
@sab:
You shouldn’t feel that way.
sab
@Jay: I didn’t. Lu our nurses aide did. I never had kids. ( Wanted to, but bad genes.)
Ghost of Joe Liebling’s Dog
@sab: I understand, and I would sign up for that myself if I had a choice.
My mother’s death was similar; she was very old, and lucky enough to have her wits about her up to the end.
But it was still terribly hard to lose her, and I’m sorry for your loss.
Matt McIrvin
@sab: I know what you mean. My grandmother got cancer at 96 and I’m grateful to this day that she was able to make her own end-of-life choices–she declined heroic measures and died under hospice care, fairly comfortable and well-cared-for. We should all be so lucky.
Ken
But then month two of the Trump administration began….
BretH
@sab: late as well but condolences and thanks for sharing about hospice. They were absolutely the best when my mom died a while back.
I too love spring. But having lost family members at this time, well, sometimes Spring Can Really Hang You Up The Most.
Matt McIrvin
@Jackie: While I support the National Popular Vote Compact as, at the very least, a good measure of public support for a popular vote, I don’t hold out a great deal of hope for it actually working–feels a bit too much like a Weird Trick that the courts will find some reason to smack down if it actually comes to making a difference.
Bex
@sab: May his memory be a blessing.
Soprano2
@sab: I’m so sorry, I know you’ve been struggling with his care for awhile now. I hope his last days were good for all of you.
Kayla Rudbek
@sab: so sorry to hear that.
Tom Levenson
@WaterGirl: Can’t. Teh day got away from me and I’m still in the midst of the fray.
RaflW
@sab: So sorry for your loss.
My dad was in fairly steady decline but we knew (or thought we did) that it was nearing time for hospice. I flew down, the very nice folks came, and the nurse looked at his toes and said, gently, they’re blue-tinged. He’s closer than you think.
His very devoted partner went on a planned weekend/respite trip to see her daughter. Dad’s decline accelerated way more than we expected. He more or less lost consciousness before she returned from 3 days/2 nights away, and passed a little over a day later, with her and I each holding a hand.
Jackie
@Citizen Alan: I know you say you can’t articulate why abolishing the EC scares you, but I can’t see why. I do know twice in my voting lifetime, we lost two Democratic presidents who both won the popular vote, but lost to 1) The SCOTUS, and 2) the EC.
Mike in NC
@Ken: What’s so bizarre is that Trump comes across as the neediest snowflake who requires constant adulation. I almost had a hard time believing that he has a nightly ritual where he and Melania enter a dining room at Mar-A-Lago and everybody gives him a standing ovation. Pathetic.
frosty
@sab: I’m sorry about your loss. I’ve been very interested in your experience with hospice. They did wonderful things for your dad. The advice to get hospice in early with a dementia patient and how they protected him was really good. I’m filing that away for my later years, if necessary.
Both my parents died with some version of dementia. Both were in a continuing care facility and both had hospice at the end. We were there for my dad – he waited until no one was in the room to let himself go. Mom went with the staff at her side; we all saw her a week before and they told us not to make the 300+ mile trek.
Soprano2
@sab: My husband told me he was fine even though he was unable to sit up. They are not reliable reporters on their own condition. That said, hospice is wonderful but we’re not ready for that yet.
Jackie
@Matt McIrvin: Like the court’s choosing Bush?
RaflW
@Mike in NC: Here’s some bonkers neediness ~ via Trump stenographer Maggie Haberman April 15, 2024
Among the Trump aides in the courtroom is Natalie Harp, his ever-present favorite who uses a wireless printer to provide him with an ongoing stream of good news from the internet. She was initially sitting two rows behind the defense table, as she usually does. A security official in court just made her head to the back to sit in the same row as Trump’s other aides.
Miss Bianca
@sab:
My condolences.
Miss Bianca
@mrmoshpotato:
I have to confess, that made me lol.
Jackie
@Miss Bianca: None of us Jackals would get selected. BJ participation = automatic disqualification!
Timill
@Jackie: It’s way too close to the Independent Legislature theory, which says: “the voters be damned, we chose who the state votes for”.
Mike in NC
@RaflW: I recall he had two full-time employees in the West Wing whose entire purpose was to go through newspapers and magazines to cut out favorable stories about him and put them in three-ring binders for him to look at.
artem1s
@TBone:
Yea, jobs they stole from the rust belt states because they promised those companies they wouldn’t have to pay union wages in their states. Serves them right assholes.
Facebones
I have long believed that a large part of the appeal Trump holds for his base is that he says and does horrible things and gets away with it. If any of his cult tried to do what he does, they would be fired or jailed. So I have always thought that if he has to pay some consequences, that veneer of invulnerability will get chipped away.
artem1s
@Matt McIrvin:
True, but there are two states that split their EC votes now. There have been several voter initiatives to have California split their EC vote by congressional district. You can bet the GOP would be all in favor of that rather than the current ‘winner takes all’. Since states are in charge of how they run their elections. Ranked voting seems to be a choice that several states are considering too. In any case giving the state EC’s to the national popular vote winner isn’t any weirder than jungle primaries.
WaterGirl
@Tom Levenson: Understood! I wanted to give you the option just in case.
Princess
@sab: I’m sorry, sab. I’m glad you have the consolation of a long life, well-lived.
sab
@Soprano2: I read your comments and I am so grateful that Mom passed before Dad’s dementia got bad. She adored him for his intelligence. They were already bickering as he declined into dementia.
When she died we thought he would die within months. She was his only friend. But our caregiver kept him feeling loved for another twelve years. We kids also loved him, but we were out and about. Lu was there every day telling him he was loved and that he mattered.
Barney
I’m late to the thread, but if anyone’s still reading it:
If there have been enough polls to be “consistent” about him not being fit if convicted, has there ever been a single poll (primary exit or otherwise) asking Republicans if they think Trump is fit already having been found liable for sexual assault (aka rape in most jurisdictions’ definitions)? Personally, I find him being a sexual assailant far worse than him using campaign funds to cover up extra-marital, but consensual, sex. Wouldn’t Republicans too? And why does it seem pollsters, like most of the media, just don’t mention the sexual assault?