They are very, very good at responding to this stuff in a way that reinforces, rather than detracts from their message. Lots of oldster politicians and pundits could learn a lot from them.
IIRC Beck just got canned from Fox, but O’Reilly had a short “time away” and then just never came back and Fox never said anything about it.
7.
RemindsMeOfThatMovie
tots n pears
8.
Garbo
Exactly! After years of draping themselves in the flag, appointing themselves the “moral” majority, and screeching “what about the children,” they are confronted by patriotic, morally just, actual children calling them out on their shit. Hoist by their own petard and I LOVE it.
My favorite thing about these kids is how they take all the rightwing bullshit and throw it right back at them.
Not so much that they have no fucks left to give. More like they haven’t accumulated any fucks yet; too young. Fascist smear artists can’t materially hurt them. Maybe they’re losing their touch: not going after the parents’ countertops… yet. Or maybe they’ve gone to the well so much all but the 27% are now immune.
10.
Another Scott
I hope this reinforces the message with young people that boycotts work. Companies supply the money that keeps these RWNJ media outlets in business. Companies direct their advertising dollars where think they work best. Both the companies and the media outlets have developed these approaches because they figure they understand it and it makes them money. We have to convince them both, with our dollars, that this way of doing business and this type of RWNJ media is no longer acceptable.
That means voting with our dollars.
And voting in November. 220 days to go.
Cheers,
Scott.
11.
Yarrow
My favorite thing about these kids is how they take all the rightwing bullshit and throw it right back at them.
Me too. I just love them.
I was out for a walk yesterday and saw some neighbors that usually have some Dem candidate signs in their yard. We all got to chatting and I mentioned the Parkland kids after we all talked about how amazing they are and how much we love them, one neighbor said, “You know, sometimes I worry about the kids and what my future will look like, but not with these kids. I want to live in the future they’re building.” Yes!
@p.a.: Hogg’s dad is or was an FBI agent I believe. That would certainly double the pleasure, double the fun if they went countertop inspection on his ass.
As soon as I saw the headline, I knew this was about Ingraham! I love how these kids point out the obvious and everyone is shocked. There’s a reason it’s a kid in crowd who points out the emperor has no clothes.
15.
Corner Stone
@schrodingers_cat: Speaking of eated, I made my greens last night with mustard and collard greens. Think I went a little heavy on the spicy but since it’s just for me I find it deeelicious.
… Receipts include everything from diaries and contemporaneous notes to video, contracts and DNA. They are those incriminating records that checkmate. Lately it seems we’re craving receipts — anything to put an end to head-spinning relativism, alternative facts and the president’s unrelenting cacophony.
As Trump’s presidency drags on — having blown past tarnished and into deep, dark ignominy — receipts have become vitally important. They’re the key to blowing open the Trump syndicate, which seems committed to making history and truth “go away,” in the words of a Trumpworld lawyer.
“Access Hollywood” kept receipts. Long ago, Trump’s desperate crowing about crotch-grabbing surfaced in audio and video. His weak denials since then mean nothing. The recording is a receipt.
Rep. Frederica Wilson (D-Florida) kept receipts. When Trump’s waning Chief of Staff John F. Kelly conjured some lies a year ago about Wilson’s remarks at the 2015 dedication of a new FBI building, her allies presented a video of her remarks that made Kelly look like a fabulist.
Colbie Holderness kept receipts. [Ex-wife of John Kelly’s golden boy, Rob Porter, wifebeater.] …
Karen McDougal kept receipts. The former Playboy model’s handwritten notes chronicle an alleged affair in 2006. These non-coy notes —”we got naked + had sex” — were published in the New Yorker. A White House rebuttal —”more fake news”— crashed on the shoals of receipts.
Stormy Daniels kept receipts. ….
… Even Tiffany Trump, the president’s younger daughter, has submitted a receipt. It’s a small one, to be sure, but last week, she “liked” an Instagram image that showed a demonstrator with a sign that read, “Next Massacre Will Be the GOP in the Midterm Elections.” It may be a record in the public square of her dissent from her father’s party. And maybe from her father.
Notice anything consistent about these receipts? For the most part, they were kept by women. When despots come to power, it’s often the marginalized — the escorts, the porn actresses, the ex-wives, the less-loved daughters — who maintain careful records, lest anyone try to silence them, deceive them or call them crazy.
Bring on the receipts. And open those nondisclosure agreements to some public sunlight.
17.
WaterGirl
It will be interesting to see whether this “week off” is a prelude to firing her or if they think everyone will forget about this in a week. Maybe they think those advertisers will come back once the spotlight is gone OR maybe they think other advertisers will race to the show.
18.
Elizabelle
Since I didn’t know what bye Felicia means.
When someone says that they’re leaving and you could really give two shits less that they are. Their name then becomes “felicia”, a random bitch that nobody is sad to see go. They’re real name becomes irrelevant because nobody cares what it really is. Instead, they now are “felicia”.
“hey guys i’m gonna go”
“bye felicia”
“who is felicia?”
“exactly bitch. buh bye.”
We can hope and pray that it’s the case. One time when hopes and prayers make sense.
20.
HAL
@Elizabelle: Even better, it originated from Friday, the Ice Cube stoner comedy and then went to Rupaul’s Drag Race:
The saying gained popularity and continues to be used, even by people who have never seen the film. In 2009, it entered the lexicon of RuPaul’s Drag Race, an American reality competition television series. However, People said “even that wouldn’t necessarily account for the phrase extending beyond the cultures that would watch either Friday, Drag Race or both. (Seriously, just look how often people use it on Twitter.)”[1] Furthermore, the magazine said of the phrase, “So when your square friend uses it, take a little bit of pleasure in knowing they’re referencing a stoner comedy – or a drag reality show referencing a stoner comedy – even if they have no idea.”[1]
21.
Baud
@Elizabelle: I look forward to the day when the asshole who gets theirs is actually named “Felicia.” That’ll be a fun day.
22.
The Moar You Know
As usual, Foxbot Ingraham brought a gun to the gunfight. Well, the fucking kid didn’t play fair and showed up with a goddamn tank, blowing her bullshit schtick back into the Stone Age where it belonged and possibly cost her job on the process. This is how it’s done, Dems. If Dem leaders aren’t willing to go for the kill shot very time with these fuckers, they need to go home. Let these kids take the wheel. They seem pretty fucking good at it.
23.
Roger Moore
The thing that’s become most obvious to me is that the Republicans literally have no arguments left but argumentum ad hominem. Their first response to just about anything is to attack the messenger. When that doesn’t work, they have nothing left to do but throw up a squid cloud of butthurt. This makes me thing that the Democrats need to do less on refining their message than they do at finding the right messengers. Find somebody the Republicans can’t smear effectively, and their whole line of attack evaporates.
24.
Elizabelle
@HAL: Thank you. Never heard of “Friday” and cannot keep my “Ice” rappers straight either (except Vanilla Ice, which is probably in the urban dictionary too.)
25.
Schlemazel
@SiubhanDuinne:
She is just a symptom, the disease will roll merrily along
Find somebody the Republicans can’t smear effectively, and their whole line of attack evaporates.
I have no idea why you think this is possible. And before you say, what about Obama, although they couldn’t defeat him directly, they smeared him to the point of being able to take back Congress.
27.
HRA
I get on FB this morning and the first post I see is from a granddaughter she shared from a site about the Parkland kids bullying the shooter. This one granddaughter out of seven I must explain uses FB like her personal diary which has been aggravating me to begin with for weeks. I looked up his neighbors interview in which she describes him as a child growing up when playing with her son and his home life where his mother padlocked the refrigerator.
Another granddaughter showed up and liked what I sent as a reply. I was not surprised since she was one of the grandchildren who participated in the March for Life.
These Parkland students have my sincere admiration and support for their endeavors.
28.
tobie
I can’t help but compare the response these kids get when they’re forceful and attack FOX, the GOP, the NRA, etc. and the outage HRC faced when she made her ‘basket of deplorables’ comment or noted who voted for her in economic terms as opposed to Trump. One difference is they’re not scared, they don’t let up, they don’t worry what focus groups say, etc. and this ends up making their opponents scared. The other is they’re not alone. Many jump to their defense. Who defended HRC? Even beloved Obama would give mealy-mouthed defenses of her sometimes conceding that her private server was wrong but we should look past it. And then there are conserva-dems like Heidi Heitkamp who proudly state that she can’t be gone “soon enough.” What I think Dems should learn from the Parkland kids is not to cower in fear and not to apologize in the hope that this will make you friends. It won’t.
Let these kids take the wheel. They seem pretty fucking good at it.
The kids are great, but they have been elected to so much as dog catcher. It’s ultimately facing the voters, especially in purple and red states and districts, that weakens us.
31.
Schlemazel
I work (really should say “worked” since most of them have been exited now) who used “bye felicia” derisively about their female boss. I find it obnoxious & not even marginally humorous now.
And then there are conserva-dems like Heidi Heitkamp who proudly state that she can’t be gone “soon enough.” What I think Dems should learn from the Parkland kids is not to cower in fear and not to apologize in the hope that this will make you friends.
I refer you to my comments at #26 and 30. Heidi needs to win reelection in a very red, very pro-Trump state. These kids do not. It’s not a good comparison.
33.
Schlemazel
@HRA:
If bullying caused mass shootings the shooters would all be LBGTQ, geeks, nerds, undersized. But there are none of them, are there?
34.
zhena gogolia
As someone who actually takes Holy Week seriously, her Holy Week comment offended me even more than her original piece of crap comment.
One difference is that they’re judged on an entirely different scale. Adult Democrats who say this stuff on air are not invited back, or lost in the middle of a shouting match. Their constituents, including us here, don’t notice or forget them as soon as it’s out of their mouth. If they can’t be ignored, they receive a tidal wave of abuse from the media.
I don’t know why these kids are being treated differently. I don’t care. It’s great that someone who calls out this bullshit is being given a public platform.
I think more importantly, this is the first generation not raised to be polite about racism, and actively raised to spot attempts to deceive you on the internet. Phishing scams and lying ‘Your computer has 1627 viruses’ popups are facts of their life. They will be immune to NPR.
That is absolutely true. I unfortunately was bullied twice when my parents brought me to the US from Canada. Tomorrow I will take that granddaughter aside and tell her about my own experiences.
41.
judge crater
I think you’ve got to be emotionally damaged to work for Fox. Ingraham has been doing this shit for her entire life. Outing gays at Dartmouth. How do you become that warped?
And they’re all good Christians. There is some kind of weird compensation going on. Ingraham, and her ilk, are filled with anger and intolerance. Invoking Jesus is an ego reinforcing strategy that preserves what’s left of the wreckage of their true selves. They are truly dark people.
42.
NotMax
Speaking of people going away, this old geezer must be especially thick because it was only today that it dawned on me that TCM no longer has Tiffany Vasquez as Saturday host. Turns out they quietly did not renew her contract back at the end of January.
Good move, IMHO. To put it delicately, the gig was not a good fit for her at all.
43.
Hkedi [Kang T. Q.]
One thing that warms my heart is that there is a good chance her “vacation” from fox news may be permanent, due to their structural misogyny. That company won’t go to the mat nearly as hard for her as say Tucker Carlson.
44.
Villago Delenda Est
@Corner Stone: Billdo never came back from his last vacation from Faux Noise.
@Frankensteinbeck: I am immune too, as are many of my friends who are immigrants (even the white ones) we see through the BS more clearly than even many BJers do. And the average BJ commenter is way ahead of the average voter.
46.
tobie
@Baud: I think you’re right that it helps they’re not running for everything. And as Hogg himself has acknowledged, being white and upper middle class allows him and his classmates to say things that kids of color cannot.
I don’t know why these kids are being treated differently. I don’t care.
I think there’s something we adults can learn from them. That’s why I care. Other than that, I’m with you–thank dog for their pluck, savvy and righteous indignation.
@Corner Stone: Sounds delicious. What spices did you use?
48.
Schlemazel
@tobie: And as Hogg himself has acknowledged, being white and upper middle class allows him and his classmates to say things that kids of color cannot.
They rarely miss a chance to mention this and to remind people that minorities are disproportionately affected by gun violence. I am blown away at how aware these kids are when their life suggests they could live in comfortable privilege and pretend otherwise.
EDIT: They also mention that the media is ignoring children of color.
I LOVE these kids
and now Ted Nugent is calling the kids “Soulless”.
53.
Van Buren
@Hkedi [Kang T. Q.]: My enthusiasm for this possibility is tempered by the knowledge that it is just playing Whack-a-Mole; there are dozens of telegenic blondes ready, willing, and able to take her place, and an enormous machinery ready to promote them into notoriety.
54.
germy
UPDATE: Georgia bill that would eliminate Sunday voting and suppress black turnout fails https://t.co/DpFWs79vz7— Judd Legum (@JuddLegum) March 30, 2018
I think something went wrong in this country when the press decided it had to relay all the thoughts of a guy who is now on the club and state fair circuit. pic.twitter.com/sJ70LhdhMS— Schooley (@Rschooley) March 31, 2018
56.
BubbaDave
@Van Buren: All true, but… if Ingraham goes down that’s it for her. She can’t spin a story of being persecuted by the liberal Fox News; she’s not getting younger or any better suited for the fantasies of wingnut men; and the random telegenic blonde who replaces her is going to know that there are limits to how far she can step. We don’t want Ingraham’s head just because we have an empty platter; the goal is to take her down pour encourager les autres.
57.
The Lodger
@Elizabelle: I thought it was a reference to Felicia Day.
Of course, since I know virtually nothing about Felicia Day, I suppose that supports the actual definition,
58.
O. Felix Culpa
@germy: Excellent news. The Nazis are losing, *even* in Georgia.
59.
Elizabelle
PS: with all this Bye Felicia wokeness:
Now we know how to greet the trolls who occasionally show up here.
Mel AAA na! He’s picking on me.
Also, too, calling sponsors has always been a tactic of the RWNJs. Ask Whoopie
64.
KithKanan
@Mnemosyne: As Spocko at Digby’s blog has said/demonstrated, it doesn’t even necessarily have to go all the way to a boycott. Making the right people at a company (a) aware of what they’re now publicly known to be sponsoring and (b) asking whether that’s in conflict with the internal values/mission of the company and the public perception they want to create of their brand can be surprisingly effective.
And this comment by Traitor Turtle must never be forgotten:
“If we can’t sell this to the American people, we ought to go into another line of work,” Senate Majority Leader Mitch McConnell (R-Ky.) said after the bill’s passage.
Totally agree on the being in another line of work comment. You can start right now, Mitch.
Next week Laura Ingraham will be taking a 100% pre-planned vacation, unrelated to the onslaught of bad press she’s gotten, during which she will definitely NOT be mad
The Parkland students aren’t just smart, savvy kids — they’re extraordinary people who happened to get thrown together in a school that happened to experience a mass shooting. The RWNJ/ammosexuals walked into a buzz saw. It’s as if a yahoo decided to go into a bar and harass some women, and the first ones he sauntered up to were Xena and Wonder Woman.
71.
Elizabelle
@rikyrah: Did you see the LA Times article on receipts? Because of you, I knew what that meant. (Think it’s comment 16, above.)
To keeping receipts, and keeping peeps honest.
72.
dmsilev
@Yarrow: I wonder whether that’s an attempt at spin or whether they truly believed that a tax bill that shovels hundreds of billions of dollars to the Donald Trumps of the world and hundreds of cents to normal people was ever going to be “popular”.
73.
germy
What kind of world do we live in if an awful millionaire ghoul can’t bully a teenage mass shooting survivor without losing some of her TV show’s advertisers??? Slippery slope https://t.co/nv5enfL1wb— Patrick Monahan (@pattymo) March 30, 2018
Keith Olbermann also used “bye, Felicia” a lot. (That’s where I learned of it.) I don’t know where that fits in the chain of popularization, but it could be a link either to or from usage by sportsball fans, which might be how it got into mainstream usage.
75.
Yarrow
@dmsilev: I don’t know. McConnell said it right after the bill passed and I have kept it in mind because it seemed like something that might come back to haunt him. As is being discussed in this thread, receipts.
@dmsilev: I think they believed they could make it popular among the same people who believe the economy was terrible under Obama and is doing great under Trump, at least enough to make them enthusiastic about turning out in the midterms.
It wasn’t unreasonable to think they could make it a successful campaign point, since they were able to sell previous tax cuts for the rich with “you’re going to get rich someday, and will be glad not to pay taxes on it.” I don’t know if they overplayed their hand or what, but I’m glad it’s not working this time.
The right must be gnashing their teeth. The kids see through them, are cool and composed and not intimidated by sliming tactics. I love that the young people have been able to run the right up a tree that adults have failed to do.
For a while, the media was playing along hyping all those stories about raises for low wage workers and new investments.
82.
Xenos
I still just find it amazing that these people my age, in their 40s and 50s, think they can intimidate American teenagers by being aggressively mean to them on the internet.
Do they even know any teenagers? Do they have any idea of the short-form rhetorical skills they have developed in the vicious jungle of electronic post-millennial adolescent society? Talk about getting old, flabby, and out of touch! They have no clue what sort of beating they are asking for by going after these kids.
@germy: Joe Concha is/was a writer for WashingtonTimes. IOW, an asshole.
The Hill used to be fairly middle of the road but over the last couple of years they have really slanted to the right. I wonder if there was a management change.
If bullying caused mass shootings the shooters would all be LBGTQ, geeks, nerds, undersized. But there are none of them, are there?
THANK YOU.
Not just would more of us Luzers be represented among the mass murderer group, there would be a hell of a lot more of them. I hope this attempt to stir in one important topic to squelch another one GOES AWAY SOON.
As Spocko at Digby’s blog has said/demonstrated, it doesn’t even necessarily have to go all the way to a boycott. Making the right people at a company (a) aware of what they’re now publicly known to be sponsoring and (b) asking whether that’s in conflict with the internal values/mission of the company and the public perception they want to create of their brand can be surprisingly effective.
Exactly. The reality is not that boycotts (in the sense of “voting with your dollars”) work, it’s that threats of boycotts and reputational damage can work. Ingraham’s advertisers didn’t flee because they were losing money (there hadn’t been time for that to happen), they fled because of the risk of their brand getting associated in the long term with something people despise.
94.
Humdog
I think there is a much darker meaning to bye Felicia, but I hope to be wrong. In the real life the movie depicts, the main guy says it to dismiss the woman he just kinda sorta raped. I hope I am wrong, but I get squicked by its more common usage now. Correct me?
@Redshift: In other words, voting with your dollars only makes you feel good. Publicly talking about why you’re voting with your dollars and encouraging others to do, in a sphere where the company can see it, like social media, so is what can work.
I hope this reinforces the message with young people that boycotts work.
Things moved too quickly to say that any boycott worked. Advertisers were reacting to the controversy and to expressions of disgust from people who were appalled by an adult mocking a child.
and now Ted Nugent is calling the kids “Soulless”.
It’s always projection with the right wing. Always!
98.
Schlemazel
@Lyrebird:
no, shout more! As an undersized nerd I find it amazing that more of us don’t go off.
99.
Schlemazel
@Humdog:
see my earlier comment. I find its use to have ugly undertones & don’t like it.
100.
Chip Daniels
What is ironic is that Ingraham, Erickson, Coluter, Goldberg and all the rest of the rightwing jackals made their bones by being the sneering adolescents in the room and engaging in shitposting instead of Buckley style arguments.
Now they are confronted by actual adolescents who, instead of snide quips, have actually thoughtful serious things to say.
101.
Another Scott
@Corner Stone: AFAIK, TheHill has always been mostly RW. They do have LW “opinion” pieces too, but much lower frequency.
I only look at them because they very quickly aggregate news about Congress, etc. It’s a shame there isn’t a decent alternative (at least I haven’t found one yet).
As Spocko at Digby’s blog has said/demonstrated, it doesn’t even necessarily have to go all the way to a boycott.
This. While people talk about boycotts, the bigger thing is just that the companies pulling their ads have decided the bad publicity from supporting somebody like Ingram is bigger than the value of the advertising. This, incidentally, is why so many more liberal “boycotts” have been successful recently than conservative ones. Conservatives are almost uniformly overreacting to something stupid, and advertisers just aren’t going to stick out their necks and cancel ads over something stupid like that. In contrast, conservative commentators are doing stuff that’s really toxic, and advertisers know it’s smart to pull their ads when pushed on it.
@Van Buren: Yes & no. Telegenic, yes; able to hold as much attention during primetime, maybe not. Fox has barely held onto its viewer ratings in the Trump era and is haemmhoraging market share at a shocking rate. There’s no guarantee her replacement would do as well in ratings.
104.
Chip Daniels
@Redshift:
Which is why these things work in one direction.
I’ve seen plenty of rightwingers declare that they too will “vote with their dollars” but corporations aren’t going to go out of their way to side with racists or make big public statements that Mexicans are rapists so as to curry favor with the Trumpists.
Instead they will always side with whichever side makes them look the best, the most noble and friendly. And right now, thats us.
When will the right wingers realize they can’t dominate a public platform like twitter.
At least not without the help of a Russian bot army.
109.
coin operated
One of the benefits these kids have…no history. If there is one thing right wing hacks are good at is taking innocuous history and inflating conspiracies out of it. Once tainted, they can launch the ad hominems against their target without fear of reprisal. That playbook isn’t working here. Who was the congressional candidate who went after Gonzalez with the ‘skinheaded lesbian’ remark? He’s history. Ingraham…same story.
110.
grandpa john
@germy: Our media is on a mission to enable every wing nut asshole idiot , their 15 minutes of fame
It will be interesting to see whether this “week off” is a prelude to firing her or if they think everyone will forget about this in a week.
If she comes back, she will soon be back to her old tricks again. If she is gone for good, she will be replaced by another blonde blowhard.
This is Fox News. This is what they do. They have captured the stupid angry white demographic. You can’t teach this old dog new tricks.
112.
Roger Moore
@Chip Daniels:
Also, too, don’t underestimate the extent to which the threat of a boycott is giving companies an excuse to ditch somebody they were already considering abandoning. The threat of a boycott may just be the final straw in a decision that’s been stewing for a while.
and now Ted Nugent is calling the kids “Soulless”.
It’s always projection with the right wing. Always!
Yep.
118.
Ruckus
@judge crater:
They are dark people because they have been raised to think that their shit doesn’t stink. It does. And it only gets worse the more of it they spread around. When they are just being dickish to themselves, most people can just ignore them, the stench is somewhat contained. But they squat on street corners yelling and screaming that their shit doesn’t stink because they aren’t getting any attention. The only people who can’t smell their shit are the rest of the people with their pants down around their ankles crapping on everything.
They are adults who haven’t been potty trained, taught to live in a society. They think that society owes them. It’s why they complain about paying taxes, about why they complain about people with actual needs being helped. They are special, but not in the way they think they are. We have been treating them as adults because they are physically big enough to be adults. But they are not adults. They are spoiled brats. The Parkland kids are still young enough to remember the spoiled kids, the screamers, the shit slingers. How many of us are half a century old and still think the world owes us, everything, because we are special?
ETA Republicans are the me generation. Rich republicans are the epitome of the me generation. Not that rich assholes haven’t been rich assholes for eternity.
Tell me about it. I finally got the bill on my 2017 taxes on Thursday. Even after prepaying every quarter, I’m still going to owe nearly $5,000 plus another $1,500 for my first quarter taxes. Which I can pay, but it means eating up all the money that I had been setting aside for repair work on my house, for next Summer’s vacation and for a new car I’ll need in about 3 years. And the thing that really gets me mad is that I wouldn’t even mind paying it if a Democrat was still president, because I have always taken pride in paying my fair share of taxes. It is only now that we have a president who would probably laugh in my face for not doing everything I could to dodge taxes that my bill pisses me off so much.
120.
Humdog
@Captain C: Cube based some of the movie on his real life, I thought, and I read the woman who he dismissed similarly in real life has a problem with him and the phrase. I wish I could find where I read that, I think it was on Jezebel or the Root.
I’m pretty sure you’re mistaken. As I recall from the movie, and Wiki seems to back me up, Felicia was the girlfriend of the Chris Tucker character and shows up to beg him for the use of his car. And then a blunt when he says no to that. Apparently she is well known in the neighborhood for being an unemployed Stoner who constantly begs her way through life. When Chris Tucker turns her down, she looks at Ice Cube speculatively, but then he says the iconic line without even looking at her before she even has a chance to speak. As I see it, “bye Felicia” is away of completely dismissing someone who has nothing else to say that you’re interested in hearing.
122.
SWMBO
@HRA: You could also point out that the shooter had the cops called on him multiple times for violent, aggressive behavior. The kids were fighting back against a bully. The shooter escalated this and brought a gun. They weren’t necessarily bullying him. He was bullying others and “being nice” to him might have stopped this is just victim blaming bullshit. I’m not saying there wasn’t bullying. Just that there was a very good chance that he was instigating it.
123.
BroD
@zhena gogolia:
I’m really glad you said that–I’m not a Christian but that did seem pretty twisted.
Tell me about it. I finally got the bill on my 2017 taxes on Thursday. Even after prepaying every quarter, I’m still going to owe nearly $5,000 plus another $1,500 for my first quarter taxes.
Are you self-employed?
The 2018 1040-ES worksheet was released late and has to be prepared carefully to account for the new tax law. Some preparers and tax programs do not handle the projections adequately.
125.
WaterGirl
@Brachiator: I agree with you. FOX is FOX. What I will find most interesting is whether that actually works for them this time – will old advertisers sneak back under the radar and/or will new advertisers come on board. At this point, I think it’s more interesting to see what the advertisers will do.
126.
WaterGirl
@Roger Moore: Just like the people who lose positions because of “budget cuts” just happen to be, coincidentally, someone that management wasn’t that fond of anyway.
127.
Ksmiami
@judge crater: that’s why we can’t reason withem, can’t accommodate them, can’t agree to disagree- we just have to smash them, defeat them and send the rats scurrying away. The whole gop worldview now is inhuman and vile and incompatible with the American idea
@Baud: also, too, President Kerry was a volunteer for Vietnam combat who was wounded in the line of duty twice and earned medals for his courage. He was running against a military deserter.
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Just the Facts
Couldn’t have happened to a nicer Nazi.
Another Scott
They are very, very good at responding to this stuff in a way that reinforces, rather than detracts from their message. Lots of oldster politicians and pundits could learn a lot from them.
Cheers,
Scott.
Corner Stone
A prelude to her perm departure?
SiubhanDuinne
@Corner Stone:
One can but hope.
Mike in NC
She’s a snowflake!
Corner Stone
IIRC Beck just got canned from Fox, but O’Reilly had a short “time away” and then just never came back and Fox never said anything about it.
RemindsMeOfThatMovie
tots n pears
Garbo
Exactly! After years of draping themselves in the flag, appointing themselves the “moral” majority, and screeching “what about the children,” they are confronted by patriotic, morally just, actual children calling them out on their shit. Hoist by their own petard and I LOVE it.
p.a.
Not so much that they have no fucks left to give. More like they haven’t accumulated any fucks yet; too young. Fascist smear artists can’t materially hurt them. Maybe they’re losing their touch: not going after the parents’ countertops… yet. Or maybe they’ve gone to the well so much all but the 27% are now immune.
Another Scott
I hope this reinforces the message with young people that boycotts work. Companies supply the money that keeps these RWNJ media outlets in business. Companies direct their advertising dollars where think they work best. Both the companies and the media outlets have developed these approaches because they figure they understand it and it makes them money. We have to convince them both, with our dollars, that this way of doing business and this type of RWNJ media is no longer acceptable.
That means voting with our dollars.
And voting in November. 220 days to go.
Cheers,
Scott.
Yarrow
Me too. I just love them.
I was out for a walk yesterday and saw some neighbors that usually have some Dem candidate signs in their yard. We all got to chatting and I mentioned the Parkland kids after we all talked about how amazing they are and how much we love them, one neighbor said, “You know, sometimes I worry about the kids and what my future will look like, but not with these kids. I want to live in the future they’re building.” Yes!
schrodingers_cat
My comment just got eated.
Corner Stone
@p.a.: Hogg’s dad is or was an FBI agent I believe. That would certainly double the pleasure, double the fun if they went countertop inspection on his ass.
Dorothy A. Winsor (formerly Iowa Old Lady)
As soon as I saw the headline, I knew this was about Ingraham! I love how these kids point out the obvious and everyone is shocked. There’s a reason it’s a kid in crowd who points out the emperor has no clothes.
Corner Stone
@schrodingers_cat: Speaking of eated, I made my greens last night with mustard and collard greens. Think I went a little heavy on the spicy but since it’s just for me I find it deeelicious.
Elizabelle
A gift for rikyrah, who introduced me to the concept of “receipts”. LA Times, Virginia Heffernan. If you’re trying to nail Trump, follow the receipts.
Bring on the receipts. And open those nondisclosure agreements to some public sunlight.
WaterGirl
It will be interesting to see whether this “week off” is a prelude to firing her or if they think everyone will forget about this in a week. Maybe they think those advertisers will come back once the spotlight is gone OR maybe they think other advertisers will race to the show.
Elizabelle
Since I didn’t know what bye Felicia means.
Urban Dictionary, of course.
Wag
@Corner Stone:
We can hope and pray that it’s the case. One time when hopes and prayers make sense.
HAL
@Elizabelle: Even better, it originated from Friday, the Ice Cube stoner comedy and then went to Rupaul’s Drag Race:
Baud
@Elizabelle: I look forward to the day when the asshole who gets theirs is actually named “Felicia.” That’ll be a fun day.
The Moar You Know
As usual, Foxbot Ingraham brought a gun to the gunfight. Well, the fucking kid didn’t play fair and showed up with a goddamn tank, blowing her bullshit schtick back into the Stone Age where it belonged and possibly cost her job on the process. This is how it’s done, Dems. If Dem leaders aren’t willing to go for the kill shot very time with these fuckers, they need to go home. Let these kids take the wheel. They seem pretty fucking good at it.
Roger Moore
The thing that’s become most obvious to me is that the Republicans literally have no arguments left but argumentum ad hominem. Their first response to just about anything is to attack the messenger. When that doesn’t work, they have nothing left to do but throw up a squid cloud of butthurt. This makes me thing that the Democrats need to do less on refining their message than they do at finding the right messengers. Find somebody the Republicans can’t smear effectively, and their whole line of attack evaporates.
Elizabelle
@HAL: Thank you. Never heard of “Friday” and cannot keep my “Ice” rappers straight either (except Vanilla Ice, which is probably in the urban dictionary too.)
Schlemazel
@SiubhanDuinne:
She is just a symptom, the disease will roll merrily along
Baud
@Roger Moore:
I have no idea why you think this is possible. And before you say, what about Obama, although they couldn’t defeat him directly, they smeared him to the point of being able to take back Congress.
HRA
I get on FB this morning and the first post I see is from a granddaughter she shared from a site about the Parkland kids bullying the shooter. This one granddaughter out of seven I must explain uses FB like her personal diary which has been aggravating me to begin with for weeks. I looked up his neighbors interview in which she describes him as a child growing up when playing with her son and his home life where his mother padlocked the refrigerator.
Another granddaughter showed up and liked what I sent as a reply. I was not surprised since she was one of the grandchildren who participated in the March for Life.
These Parkland students have my sincere admiration and support for their endeavors.
tobie
I can’t help but compare the response these kids get when they’re forceful and attack FOX, the GOP, the NRA, etc. and the outage HRC faced when she made her ‘basket of deplorables’ comment or noted who voted for her in economic terms as opposed to Trump. One difference is they’re not scared, they don’t let up, they don’t worry what focus groups say, etc. and this ends up making their opponents scared. The other is they’re not alone. Many jump to their defense. Who defended HRC? Even beloved Obama would give mealy-mouthed defenses of her sometimes conceding that her private server was wrong but we should look past it. And then there are conserva-dems like Heidi Heitkamp who proudly state that she can’t be gone “soon enough.” What I think Dems should learn from the Parkland kids is not to cower in fear and not to apologize in the hope that this will make you friends. It won’t.
Ben Cisco
Sending plenty of these: https://i.imgur.com/gRssjsv.jpg
Baud
@The Moar You Know:
The kids are great, but they have been elected to so much as dog catcher. It’s ultimately facing the voters, especially in purple and red states and districts, that weakens us.
Schlemazel
I work (really should say “worked” since most of them have been exited now) who used “bye felicia” derisively about their female boss. I find it obnoxious & not even marginally humorous now.
Baud
@tobie:
. Yep. We failed her bigly.
I refer you to my comments at #26 and 30. Heidi needs to win reelection in a very red, very pro-Trump state. These kids do not. It’s not a good comparison.
Schlemazel
@HRA:
If bullying caused mass shootings the shooters would all be LBGTQ, geeks, nerds, undersized. But there are none of them, are there?
zhena gogolia
As someone who actually takes Holy Week seriously, her Holy Week comment offended me even more than her original piece of crap comment.
zhena gogolia
@Baud:
The only Felicias I can think of were married to Jack Lemmon and Leonard Bernstein and I think they’re both deceased.
Frankensteinbeck
@tobie:
One difference is that they’re judged on an entirely different scale. Adult Democrats who say this stuff on air are not invited back, or lost in the middle of a shouting match. Their constituents, including us here, don’t notice or forget them as soon as it’s out of their mouth. If they can’t be ignored, they receive a tidal wave of abuse from the media.
I don’t know why these kids are being treated differently. I don’t care. It’s great that someone who calls out this bullshit is being given a public platform.
I think more importantly, this is the first generation not raised to be polite about racism, and actively raised to spot attempts to deceive you on the internet. Phishing scams and lying ‘Your computer has 1627 viruses’ popups are facts of their life. They will be immune to NPR.
schrodingers_cat
@Baud: Rs have an unfair advantage, they have the media on their side.
Betty Cracker
I hope Ingraham uses this Holy Week break to reflect on Felicia, Patron Saint of BYE!
Baud
@zhena gogolia: The ultimate Bye.
HRA
@Schlemazel: @Schlemazel:
That is absolutely true. I unfortunately was bullied twice when my parents brought me to the US from Canada. Tomorrow I will take that granddaughter aside and tell her about my own experiences.
judge crater
I think you’ve got to be emotionally damaged to work for Fox. Ingraham has been doing this shit for her entire life. Outing gays at Dartmouth. How do you become that warped?
And they’re all good Christians. There is some kind of weird compensation going on. Ingraham, and her ilk, are filled with anger and intolerance. Invoking Jesus is an ego reinforcing strategy that preserves what’s left of the wreckage of their true selves. They are truly dark people.
NotMax
Speaking of people going away, this old geezer must be especially thick because it was only today that it dawned on me that TCM no longer has Tiffany Vasquez as Saturday host. Turns out they quietly did not renew her contract back at the end of January.
Good move, IMHO. To put it delicately, the gig was not a good fit for her at all.
Hkedi [Kang T. Q.]
One thing that warms my heart is that there is a good chance her “vacation” from fox news may be permanent, due to their structural misogyny. That company won’t go to the mat nearly as hard for her as say Tucker Carlson.
Villago Delenda Est
@Corner Stone: Billdo never came back from his last vacation from Faux Noise.
schrodingers_cat
@Frankensteinbeck: I am immune too, as are many of my friends who are immigrants (even the white ones) we see through the BS more clearly than even many BJers do. And the average BJ commenter is way ahead of the average voter.
tobie
@Baud: I think you’re right that it helps they’re not running for everything. And as Hogg himself has acknowledged, being white and upper middle class allows him and his classmates to say things that kids of color cannot.
@Frankensteinbeck:
I think there’s something we adults can learn from them. That’s why I care. Other than that, I’m with you–thank dog for their pluck, savvy and righteous indignation.
schrodingers_cat
@Corner Stone: Sounds delicious. What spices did you use?
Schlemazel
They rarely miss a chance to mention this and to remind people that minorities are disproportionately affected by gun violence. I am blown away at how aware these kids are when their life suggests they could live in comfortable privilege and pretend otherwise.
EDIT: They also mention that the media is ignoring children of color.
I LOVE these kids
Mnemosyne
It just occurred to me that these kids aren’t bothering to complain to Fox News about what Ingraham said — they just went straight to the advertisers.
There may be a lesson there for the next time the FTFNYT pisses us off. Don’t bother calling them to complain, start a boycott of their advertisers.
Neldob
@tobie: yes
Formerly disgruntled in Oregon
@judge crater: And Nazi wannabes too… pretty dark shit
PaulWartenberg
and now Ted Nugent is calling the kids “Soulless”.
Van Buren
@Hkedi [Kang T. Q.]: My enthusiasm for this possibility is tempered by the knowledge that it is just playing Whack-a-Mole; there are dozens of telegenic blondes ready, willing, and able to take her place, and an enormous machinery ready to promote them into notoriety.
germy
germy
@PaulWartenberg:
BubbaDave
@Van Buren: All true, but… if Ingraham goes down that’s it for her. She can’t spin a story of being persecuted by the liberal Fox News; she’s not getting younger or any better suited for the fantasies of wingnut men; and the random telegenic blonde who replaces her is going to know that there are limits to how far she can step. We don’t want Ingraham’s head just because we have an empty platter; the goal is to take her down pour encourager les autres.
The Lodger
@Elizabelle: I thought it was a reference to Felicia Day.
Of course, since I know virtually nothing about Felicia Day, I suppose that supports the actual definition,
O. Felix Culpa
@germy: Excellent news. The Nazis are losing, *even* in Georgia.
Elizabelle
PS: with all this Bye Felicia wokeness:
Now we know how to greet the trolls who occasionally show up here.
Just One More Canuck
@PaulWartenberg: talk about projection
Corner Stone
@Van Buren:
Maybe they will take Megyn Kelly back.
Elizabelle
@The Lodger: Dorothy’s loopier sister?
maya
Mel AAA na! He’s picking on me.
Also, too, calling sponsors has always been a tactic of the RWNJs. Ask Whoopie
KithKanan
@Mnemosyne: As Spocko at Digby’s blog has said/demonstrated, it doesn’t even necessarily have to go all the way to a boycott. Making the right people at a company (a) aware of what they’re now publicly known to be sponsoring and (b) asking whether that’s in conflict with the internal values/mission of the company and the public perception they want to create of their brand can be surprisingly effective.
germy
@maya:
That’s why Nat King Cole’s TV show failed. Couldn’t find a national sponsor. And this was 1956.
Yarrow
Oooh, I missed this yesterday.
And this comment by Traitor Turtle must never be forgotten:
Totally agree on the being in another line of work comment. You can start right now, Mitch.
rikyrah
I love that they treat the RW exactly as they should be treated. Democrats could learn something from these kids.
zhena gogolia
@NotMax:
I liked her.
germy
Hungry Joe
The Parkland students aren’t just smart, savvy kids — they’re extraordinary people who happened to get thrown together in a school that happened to experience a mass shooting. The RWNJ/ammosexuals walked into a buzz saw. It’s as if a yahoo decided to go into a bar and harass some women, and the first ones he sauntered up to were Xena and Wonder Woman.
Elizabelle
@rikyrah: Did you see the LA Times article on receipts? Because of you, I knew what that meant. (Think it’s comment 16, above.)
To keeping receipts, and keeping peeps honest.
dmsilev
@Yarrow: I wonder whether that’s an attempt at spin or whether they truly believed that a tax bill that shovels hundreds of billions of dollars to the Donald Trumps of the world and hundreds of cents to normal people was ever going to be “popular”.
germy
Redshift
Keith Olbermann also used “bye, Felicia” a lot. (That’s where I learned of it.) I don’t know where that fits in the chain of popularization, but it could be a link either to or from usage by sportsball fans, which might be how it got into mainstream usage.
Yarrow
@dmsilev: I don’t know. McConnell said it right after the bill passed and I have kept it in mind because it seemed like something that might come back to haunt him. As is being discussed in this thread, receipts.
debit
@Elizabelle: Pie Felicia.
Origuy
@The Lodger: Felicia Day is a actress and geek goddess and is awesome. She is currently on the reboot of MST3K.
Redshift
@dmsilev: I think they believed they could make it popular among the same people who believe the economy was terrible under Obama and is doing great under Trump, at least enough to make them enthusiastic about turning out in the midterms.
It wasn’t unreasonable to think they could make it a successful campaign point, since they were able to sell previous tax cuts for the rich with “you’re going to get rich someday, and will be glad not to pay taxes on it.” I don’t know if they overplayed their hand or what, but I’m glad it’s not working this time.
Redshift
@debit:
Heh.
bemused
@rikyrah:
The right must be gnashing their teeth. The kids see through them, are cool and composed and not intimidated by sliming tactics. I love that the young people have been able to run the right up a tree that adults have failed to do.
Baud
@Redshift:
For a while, the media was playing along hyping all those stories about raises for low wage workers and new investments.
Xenos
I still just find it amazing that these people my age, in their 40s and 50s, think they can intimidate American teenagers by being aggressively mean to them on the internet.
Do they even know any teenagers? Do they have any idea of the short-form rhetorical skills they have developed in the vicious jungle of electronic post-millennial adolescent society? Talk about getting old, flabby, and out of touch! They have no clue what sort of beating they are asking for by going after these kids.
bemused
@Xenos:
So true, lol.
Corner Stone
@germy: Joe Concha is/was a writer for WashingtonTimes. IOW, an asshole.
The Hill used to be fairly middle of the road but over the last couple of years they have really slanted to the right. I wonder if there was a management change.
Elizabelle
@debit: LOL. Pie pie.
germy
Onion headline:
Jeff
When will the right wingers realize they can’t dominate a public platform like twitter. They need their FOX bubble to survive.
Baud
@Corner Stone: You can see why he regards it as dangerous precedent.
Villago Delenda Est
@Xenos: Spot on. These “kids” have a skill set us fogies can only dream of developing.
Baud
@Jeff: Didn’t they dominate Twitter in 2016 with the assistance of this Russian bot friends?
Villago Delenda Est
@Baud: It means his worthless Villager scum ass could be next on the hit parade.
Be afraid, Joe. Be very afraid.
Lyrebird
@Schlemazel:
THANK YOU.
Not just would more of us Luzers be represented among the mass murderer group, there would be a hell of a lot more of them. I hope this attempt to stir in one important topic to squelch another one GOES AWAY SOON.
Sorry so shouty.
Redshift
@KithKanan:
Exactly. The reality is not that boycotts (in the sense of “voting with your dollars”) work, it’s that threats of boycotts and reputational damage can work. Ingraham’s advertisers didn’t flee because they were losing money (there hadn’t been time for that to happen), they fled because of the risk of their brand getting associated in the long term with something people despise.
Humdog
I think there is a much darker meaning to bye Felicia, but I hope to be wrong. In the real life the movie depicts, the main guy says it to dismiss the woman he just kinda sorta raped. I hope I am wrong, but I get squicked by its more common usage now. Correct me?
Redshift
@Redshift: In other words, voting with your dollars only makes you feel good. Publicly talking about why you’re voting with your dollars and encouraging others to do, in a sphere where the company can see it, like social media, so is what can work.
Brachiator
@Another Scott:
Things moved too quickly to say that any boycott worked. Advertisers were reacting to the controversy and to expressions of disgust from people who were appalled by an adult mocking a child.
Roger Moore
@PaulWartenberg:
It’s always projection with the right wing. Always!
Schlemazel
@Lyrebird:
no, shout more! As an undersized nerd I find it amazing that more of us don’t go off.
Schlemazel
@Humdog:
see my earlier comment. I find its use to have ugly undertones & don’t like it.
Chip Daniels
What is ironic is that Ingraham, Erickson, Coluter, Goldberg and all the rest of the rightwing jackals made their bones by being the sneering adolescents in the room and engaging in shitposting instead of Buckley style arguments.
Now they are confronted by actual adolescents who, instead of snide quips, have actually thoughtful serious things to say.
Another Scott
@Corner Stone: AFAIK, TheHill has always been mostly RW. They do have LW “opinion” pieces too, but much lower frequency.
I only look at them because they very quickly aggregate news about Congress, etc. It’s a shame there isn’t a decent alternative (at least I haven’t found one yet).
Cheers,
Scott.
Roger Moore
@KithKanan:
This. While people talk about boycotts, the bigger thing is just that the companies pulling their ads have decided the bad publicity from supporting somebody like Ingram is bigger than the value of the advertising. This, incidentally, is why so many more liberal “boycotts” have been successful recently than conservative ones. Conservatives are almost uniformly overreacting to something stupid, and advertisers just aren’t going to stick out their necks and cancel ads over something stupid like that. In contrast, conservative commentators are doing stuff that’s really toxic, and advertisers know it’s smart to pull their ads when pushed on it.
(((CassandraLeo)))
@Van Buren: Yes & no. Telegenic, yes; able to hold as much attention during primetime, maybe not. Fox has barely held onto its viewer ratings in the Trump era and is haemmhoraging market share at a shocking rate. There’s no guarantee her replacement would do as well in ratings.
Chip Daniels
@Redshift:
Which is why these things work in one direction.
I’ve seen plenty of rightwingers declare that they too will “vote with their dollars” but corporations aren’t going to go out of their way to side with racists or make big public statements that Mexicans are rapists so as to curry favor with the Trumpists.
Instead they will always side with whichever side makes them look the best, the most noble and friendly. And right now, thats us.
AnonPhenom
The Kids Are Alright…
germy
Brachiator
@germy:
His response to this despicable racism was marvelous.
Roger Moore
@Jeff:
At least not without the help of a Russian bot army.
coin operated
One of the benefits these kids have…no history. If there is one thing right wing hacks are good at is taking innocuous history and inflating conspiracies out of it. Once tainted, they can launch the ad hominems against their target without fear of reprisal. That playbook isn’t working here. Who was the congressional candidate who went after Gonzalez with the ‘skinheaded lesbian’ remark? He’s history. Ingraham…same story.
grandpa john
@germy: Our media is on a mission to enable every wing nut asshole idiot , their 15 minutes of fame
Brachiator
@WaterGirl:
If she comes back, she will soon be back to her old tricks again. If she is gone for good, she will be replaced by another blonde blowhard.
This is Fox News. This is what they do. They have captured the stupid angry white demographic. You can’t teach this old dog new tricks.
Roger Moore
@Chip Daniels:
Also, too, don’t underestimate the extent to which the threat of a boycott is giving companies an excuse to ditch somebody they were already considering abandoning. The threat of a boycott may just be the final straw in a decision that’s been stewing for a while.
Captain C
@Elizabelle: Originally from the movie Friday
rikyrah
@Elizabelle:
??????
Captain C
@Humdog: Which movie is that? In Friday, from which it came, Cube’s character says it to the mooching character Felicia to hurry her off of his porch.
Captain C
@Roger Moore: Ted Nugent, who never has seen a war he didn’t want someone else to fight.
Brachiator
@Roger Moore:
Yep.
Ruckus
@judge crater:
They are dark people because they have been raised to think that their shit doesn’t stink. It does. And it only gets worse the more of it they spread around. When they are just being dickish to themselves, most people can just ignore them, the stench is somewhat contained. But they squat on street corners yelling and screaming that their shit doesn’t stink because they aren’t getting any attention. The only people who can’t smell their shit are the rest of the people with their pants down around their ankles crapping on everything.
They are adults who haven’t been potty trained, taught to live in a society. They think that society owes them. It’s why they complain about paying taxes, about why they complain about people with actual needs being helped. They are special, but not in the way they think they are. We have been treating them as adults because they are physically big enough to be adults. But they are not adults. They are spoiled brats. The Parkland kids are still young enough to remember the spoiled kids, the screamers, the shit slingers. How many of us are half a century old and still think the world owes us, everything, because we are special?
ETA Republicans are the me generation. Rich republicans are the epitome of the me generation. Not that rich assholes haven’t been rich assholes for eternity.
Citizen Alan
@Yarrow:
Tell me about it. I finally got the bill on my 2017 taxes on Thursday. Even after prepaying every quarter, I’m still going to owe nearly $5,000 plus another $1,500 for my first quarter taxes. Which I can pay, but it means eating up all the money that I had been setting aside for repair work on my house, for next Summer’s vacation and for a new car I’ll need in about 3 years. And the thing that really gets me mad is that I wouldn’t even mind paying it if a Democrat was still president, because I have always taken pride in paying my fair share of taxes. It is only now that we have a president who would probably laugh in my face for not doing everything I could to dodge taxes that my bill pisses me off so much.
Humdog
@Captain C: Cube based some of the movie on his real life, I thought, and I read the woman who he dismissed similarly in real life has a problem with him and the phrase. I wish I could find where I read that, I think it was on Jezebel or the Root.
Citizen Alan
@Humdog:
I’m pretty sure you’re mistaken. As I recall from the movie, and Wiki seems to back me up, Felicia was the girlfriend of the Chris Tucker character and shows up to beg him for the use of his car. And then a blunt when he says no to that. Apparently she is well known in the neighborhood for being an unemployed Stoner who constantly begs her way through life. When Chris Tucker turns her down, she looks at Ice Cube speculatively, but then he says the iconic line without even looking at her before she even has a chance to speak. As I see it, “bye Felicia” is away of completely dismissing someone who has nothing else to say that you’re interested in hearing.
SWMBO
@HRA: You could also point out that the shooter had the cops called on him multiple times for violent, aggressive behavior. The kids were fighting back against a bully. The shooter escalated this and brought a gun. They weren’t necessarily bullying him. He was bullying others and “being nice” to him might have stopped this is just victim blaming bullshit. I’m not saying there wasn’t bullying. Just that there was a very good chance that he was instigating it.
BroD
@zhena gogolia:
I’m really glad you said that–I’m not a Christian but that did seem pretty twisted.
Brachiator
@Citizen Alan:
Are you self-employed?
The 2018 1040-ES worksheet was released late and has to be prepared carefully to account for the new tax law. Some preparers and tax programs do not handle the projections adequately.
WaterGirl
@Brachiator: I agree with you. FOX is FOX. What I will find most interesting is whether that actually works for them this time – will old advertisers sneak back under the radar and/or will new advertisers come on board. At this point, I think it’s more interesting to see what the advertisers will do.
WaterGirl
@Roger Moore: Just like the people who lose positions because of “budget cuts” just happen to be, coincidentally, someone that management wasn’t that fond of anyway.
Ksmiami
@judge crater: that’s why we can’t reason withem, can’t accommodate them, can’t agree to disagree- we just have to smash them, defeat them and send the rats scurrying away. The whole gop worldview now is inhuman and vile and incompatible with the American idea
r€nato
@Baud: also, too, President Kerry was a volunteer for Vietnam combat who was wounded in the line of duty twice and earned medals for his courage. He was running against a military deserter.