As reported below, Def. Sec. Robert Gates just confirmed that all active duty Army troops in Iraq and Afghanistan will have their tours extended from 12 months to 15 months. He also promised a year of downtime between rotations, but I think we know which promise to take seriously.
I would be much obliged if somebody could offer a credible explanation that does not involve a near total lack of reserve forces.
28 Percent
You do not understand the soldiers WANT to stay and GET THE JOB DONE because they are PATRIOTS. If you were a patriot maybe you would not need for this to be expained to you so much.
Dreggas
Couple that with what Olberman was saying last night, and I am paraphrasing here:
Again that is paraphrased but in general what he said.
Luke
YUM YUM keep drinkin that koolaid 28. What the soldiers want is to come home to family and loved ones.
Dug Jay
The clear solution to the Secretary’s problem is to ask all of those highly concerned lefties – who ABSOLUTELY LOVE and SUPPORT the troops – to take their places in Iraq and Afghanistan. It is quite clear that these folks are very, very concerned about the difficulties imposed on the troops by such duty hardships.
Barry
It’s been clear for a while that Bush’s plan is to not ‘lose’ the war, in the sense that *being* in the process of losing it is not *having* lost it. Like a team coach saying that they’re not *losing* by 147-0, they’re just behind a bit. As long as he can hand an ongoing war to the next president, he and his sycophants can claim that Bush didn’t lose the war – the next president did.
But with the crap going on now, for the first time I’m wondering if Bush can actually keep the war going until January, 2009. Even if the troops were all now just starting their tours, they’d still be over in Summer ’08; it’s clear that the Army is scraping the bottom of the barrel now. I can’t imagine what would happen if the 15-month tours were officially extended to the old WWII ‘duration plus 6 months’.
What are they going to put in over the course of 2008?
Perry Como
Where’s the Democrat plan to break the military?
Pb
Dreggas,
That’s about right; here’s the transcript:
Tim F.
Been to any young conservative gatherings, DJ? How many recruiters did you see there?
Funny that I don’t recall a single Republican leader asking Americans to enlist in the last six years. Not one.
But otherwise, great point.
VidaLoca
And what are those troops going to be doing while they’re over there? Seems the hot new plan is to divide Baghdad up into gated communities:
And if all that isn’t quite depressing enough for you, see
The Crushing Fear that Stalks America
28 Percent
Luke you must not think much of our fighting men and women if you think they are so selfish that they put themselves before their country. They understand that there is a price for FREEDOM and they LOVE there country and you should not dishonor them by saying what they want you do not know.
Pb
Clinton did it too!
28 Percent
Exactly DugJay it is time for all these WHINING LIBERALS to PUT UP OR SHUT UP!!!1!!!
Mr Furious
Obviously, the Republicans are willing for somebody else to do whatever it takes to win this war.
What about you, liberal pussy?
Eural
..is to bring the fucking troops home.
Why is that so hard to understand?
The only forseeable outcome to the Iraq situation – according to the Bush policy in place now – is a “slow bleed” of US servicemen for generations to come to stabilize an occupation that will never be stable. That’s not going to happen because we’re out as soon as Bush is out. So every death between now and then is another wasted American life.
With those facts firmly in mind remind me again why prolonging deployments, destroying lives and bankrupting the US to do all that is nothing other than the ravings of a sick, twisted and wholly incompetent administration?
Whew – I feel better getting that off my chest!
Tsulagi
I like how Gates in giving the reason for the extension said “I think it is fair to all soldiers that all share the burden equally.” Yet he also said Marines tours would stay at 7 and Guard/Reserve at 12 while Army goes to 15. But I wouldn’t be surprised if a little later Marines find that 7 seems a bit long. Bush math.
Reason for it is so there can be greater numbers for The Surge. For a while. Also, the additional brigades being deployed and new rotations will be in country for essentially the remainder of Bush’s term.
Dug Jay
Know-Nothing-And-Proud-Of-It Tim says:
Former Senator Rick Santorum (who was a member of the leadership in the Senate) and John McCain have both spoken of the benefits to one’s country and to one’s self of joining the military.
Scruffy McSnufflepuss
Well, we pack our military with ex-cons. Then, we keep them deployed in Iraq indefinitely, so that we can’t be accused of coddling criminals.
That’s my theory, anyway.
RSA
How better to create a capitalist democracy in Iraq than to emulate the upper-middle class in America?
Luke
Scruffy – ex-cons and Young Republicans.
Scruffy McSnufflepuss
Ex-cons and pre-cons (a.k.a. neo-cons, at least until we get the results of the 1,001 investigations currently underway).
Seriously, would anyone have a problem with us just setting our criminal population loose on Iraq? After all, Saddam did it first, when he let everyone out of jail in 2002. If there’s one thing that years of television have taught me, it’s that sometimes it takes a hardened ex-criminal to catch a criminal, which is what those insurgents really are. (Please, nobody google Dirlewanger Brigade. That would be cheating.)
Tim F.
Stunning. Two Republicans. I can’t possibly imagine how I missed them. How about those recruiters at young Republican gatherings? Surely the bright young ideologues who believe Iraq is a millenial contest of civilizations must have signed up in droves. Surely.
Scruffy McSnufflepuss
Once Baghdad looks like Beverly Hills, we’ll trick the Hollywood celebrities into moving there, then steal their passports and leave them stranded. Take THAT, moonbats!
jenniebee
Not that Ricky would have anybody in his immediate family join up though – I think we all know his views on Santorums in the military.
Scruffy McSnufflepuss
They would have, if they hadn’t had to devote themselves to duties on the home front instead, defending the blogosphere from leftist traitors like you.
Delivering a righteous smack-down to a lefty troll in a comments thread on Red State is every bit as patriotic as serving in Iraq. It may not win you any medals, but if it keeps just one more impressionable young American from becoming the next John Walker Lindh, it was well worth it.
Pb
I was curious what their take on this actually was, over on Red State–but all I managed to find was a screed from Erik entitled “The Left Continues Its Celebration of the Murder of American Troops” — go figure. Hey Erik, wanna really rain on the lefties’ parade? If you pull all the troops out of Iraq, then they’ll have to call off their ‘celebration’, and you’ll have won!
Scruffy McSnufflepuss
Exactly. With no more Americans killed in Iraq, the lefties won’t have anything left to gloat over. That’s why Pat Buchanan is a member of the antiwar movement. Brent Scowcroft, too.
Bubblegum Tate
I believe it’s to force everybody in the military to gay marry and have abortions. That oughtta do the trick.
ZING!
Tsulagi
Show some compassion, Pb.
With all the furious jacking off they do to that kind of lobotomy delivered bullshit, they’ve had to put Purple Heart bandaids all over their little soldiers. But they’ll soldier on through their tears. They’re tough like that.
grumpy realist
Given how many promises the military has gone back on because of “expediency”, who is going to believe anything they say in the future to prospective recruits?
When the “emergency” keeps getting extended every six months for 5 years, at some point, it stops being “an emergency” and starts being “business as usual.”
mrmobi
28, you are an embarassment to yourself. Pack it up and go back to whatever else it is you do to embarass yourself. No one could be this stupid. Well… actually, are you in the administration?
tBone
Maybe the Pentagon wants to reward the troops by giving them an extra three months to rest, relax, and shop in the blissfully safe Baghdad marketplaces.
Rome Again
Nationalistic patriostism is the BANE of my existence. I will NEVER be one, ever!
Take your fake patriotic BS somewhere else please.
Rome Again
and I can’t spell worth schit!
Perry Como
And ride ponies, moonbat.
I AM A SPOOF
Ahem.
Jake
[Thunder crashes, wolves howl.]
Altered for accuracy.
tBone
I can’t believe I forgot the ponies.
I also forgot all of the candies and flowers they need to sort through. That could take 3 months by itself.
Rome Again
Really? NO SHIT! Wow, I had no freaking idea… NOT!
Rome Again
Thank you Jake, I appreciate that.
Perry Como
I think the candies and flowers may actually be piled so high that they are burying the ponies. I’ll see your 3 months and raise you a Friedman.
cd6
At hotair they’re really mad about … whoever leaked this at the pentagon yesterday.
Multiple calls for said leakers to be tried for treason.
Say what?
tBone
Good point. And let’s not forget that you have to find a way through the palettes of air-dropped cash before you can even see the vast candy/flower mountains.
Dug Jay
The Nitwit (Tim) now says:
His initial position was:
I suspect you “missed them” because you either weren’t looking, or you’re just another dimwitted leftie spouting off a preconceived notion of what “reality” should be in your screwed up dream world. And by the way, a couple of other names, among many, are Duncan Hunter, who served as Chairman of the House Defense Committee, and former Speaker Gingrich. Hunter’s son is and has served in Iraq and is expected to announce that he will be a candidate for the House.
The Other Andrew
Dug Jay–why do you think that Bush hasn’t called for mass enlistment, or even tried to institute a draft, given that this is a clash of civilizations and all? Why don’t we have war rations, a war tax, etc.?
tBone
We’re fighting them over there so we don’t have to
fight them over here!inconvenience ourselves in any way, really.Any other questions, moonbat?
Punchy
I fail to see how stocking our military with hardened crims is a bad idea. 1) They already know how to fight/kill/maim, 2) If a sentence reduction is tied to the number of insurgents they can scalp…well…I’m guessing we’d have Baghdad secured quickly, 3) Tats are probably cheaper in Iraq, 4) guns and ammo training largely unnecessary, as well as training for driving large, expensive vehicles they’ve never owned before.
Punchy
Uh…maybe this shameless hyperbole from G-tizzle:
See, Crazy Lefty, the NEWS of the extension concerns the Pentagon, but not the actual extension itself…
lard lad
I know! Pick me! Pick me!
Because then the Americans who are fed up to the tits with this clown-car war would immediately begin haranguing hell out of the under-40 hawks and Bush cheerleaders.
“So when are you signing up? Your beloved president put out the call… aren’t you going to answer? What, you’re too goddamned important to fight?”
Because God forbid that America’s youthful right-wing aristocracy should have to deal with the embarassment of being called out by liberals. Surely sparing their delicate feelings is worth the sacrifice of a few hundred working class soldiers…
Zombie Santa Claus
Those men need toughening up, if they’re ever supposed to fight on the front lines at the North Pole. There’s still a war going on up here, and the United States is still the Number One importer of my workshop’s toys. So either you try and negotiate decent Playstations out of the clutches of those Godless Trotskyist Canadians, or you help me and my elves.
Ho ho ho, bitches!
chopper
wow, “speaking of the benefits”, eh? that’s totally the same as asking people to enlist.
totally. the. same.
jesus, only the GOP would be such a bunch of pussies that the closest they could come to ask people to enlist in the army would be to mention the benefits of doing so, instead of actually having some balls and asking. i can imagine if rick santorum were a homeless dude:
“i’m not gonna ask you for any change, but let me tell you of the benefits that giving me money would bring…”
i’d punch him in the balls.
Chad N. Freude
He left out “but not citizens
Which brings us to a rousing chorus of “Where have all the eager young patriots gone?“
Chad N. Freude
For the eager young patriots reference, this is probably a better page.
John Ryan
The retention rate of West Point grads 5 years after leaving the Point is the lowest in 35 years. The Army National Guard has now lowered its passing score on the AFQT to the 16th percentile. George Bush has broken our Army.
Tim F.
Dug Jay, I dare you to actually make a point. Are you arguing that Republicans made an effort to drum up recruitment among their followers? I will laugh in your face. There was obviously, plainly no effort by the Republican party to drum up recruitment. John McCain? Sure, the base despises him. You won’t even cite an example so others can judge the context.
Maybe you only meant to correct my statement, in which case you are a nitpicking pedant.
Moron or pedant, your choice.
tBone
Me? I’d go with C) Most Boring Troll Evah.
Jon H
All the really smart high school students should take the ASVAB, score 99s and 100s, and then give the recruiters blueballs worse than a sailor on leave in Bangkok with a busted cock.
Scruffy McSnufflepuss
Sure, that seems like a good idea now, but when the GOP wins back Congress and the White House in 2008, they’ll probably write some statute that says that taking the ASVAB renders you eligible for a mandatory enlistment. (Also, talking to recruiters in the mall parking lot, or in your high school’s Career Services, or visiting the Army’s website…)
searp
28%:
Here is one “lefty” (I disdain the characterization, but you like it as a shorthand for thinking people, so I use it) who has been to Iraq and will probably return.
You are talking nonsense. Soldiers are people too. Sure they are patriots, but even patriots can be demoralized when they are sent, repeatedly, for long tours in a mess. Yes, they understand, privates to generals, that Iraq is a mess. I know, I have contact with active duty folks of all ranks as part of my job. They know how I feel about this war (stupid and dangerous), and many share my feelings.
Patriotism doesn’t mean being stupid or supporting stupid policies. It does mean you do what your country needs you to do.
So please stop speaking for our soldiers. You don’t, and I don’t. They are plenty capable of speaking for themselves, and they don’t have a single opinion. Those in theater are doing what combat soldiers always do: their jobs. They are doing that magnificently.
RSA
Maybe I’m seeing weasel words where there are none, but it’s possible to say those things without actually encouraging people to enlist right now because the military needs soldiers in Iraq. I wouldn’t be surprised if Santorum and McCain are encouraging people to enlist, of course; I’d still like to see what they’ve said.
Chad N. Freude
searp:
Very good post, but you’ve fallen victim to a spoof. 28% is a troll who complained on another thread that his/her “satire” was being missed. He/she apparently can’t tell the difference between sarcastic and stupid.
If only BushCheneyRove and company believed this. (Actually, I think they do, but it doesn’t suit their political objectives.)
demimondian
When Dug Jay mentioned Santorum’s promotion of national service, did he mean military service, or a different kind of “service”?
Chad N. Freude
Man servicing dog?
searp
Chad: I don’t feel victimized, because even if 28% is spoofing, he sounds like plenty of sincere people.
I honestly do not think Bush and Cheney think at a useful level about their policy. When I listen I do not hear any realism at all. One of 2 conclusions: they know better but are playing games, or they really are incapable of thinking seriously about security policy. Plenty of evidence for the latter, in my opinion.
Bush strikes me as someone who was affected very personally by 9/11, drew incorrect conclusions and hasn’t been able to regain his mental balance. Somehow 9/11 set off a psychic storm that permanently altered his mental landscape.
I am not saying that without sympathy; the obvious retort is “of course, and rightly so”. However, his job requires an ability to objectively consider policy options, and I honestly do not think that has been possible for him post-9/11.
RSA
What does Bush’s mental landscape look like? Sometimes I think it’s the surface of Mars, other times it’s that funny place the Teletubbies live, and still other times William James’s “blooming, buzzing confusion”.
demimondian
I’m thinking more Skinner’s _tabula rasa_, actually.
yet another jeff
Should that be current-cons, not ex-cons?
Chad N. Freude
This is possible, but I am inclined to believe that, whatever he felt, his subsequent behavior was fully consistent with his behavior before 9/11, and that he (read: Rove and Cheney) seized on the catastrophe as an excuse to pursue his/their destructive policies, including, but not limited to, this misbegotten, unjustified, self-destructive war. I think his mental landscape was not altered, but rather weeded, watered, and freshly fertilized.
Dreggas
Here’s more evidence of real desperation. A good friend of mine who teaches in the ROTC program at a college back in Indiana told me last night that next year (April 18 to be exact) he is going to Iraq. Now mind you he hasn’t been sent there yet, why? Well he’s a fucking instructor for a ROTC program, his brother has already done a couple of tours there and now they are calling him up to do one in a year. All this while he is working on adopting a child from Nepal and getting other things taken care of.