• Menu
  • Skip to primary navigation
  • Skip to main content
  • Skip to primary sidebar

Before Header

  • About Us
  • Lexicon
  • Contact Us
  • Our Store
  • ↑
  • ↓
  • ←
  • →

Balloon Juice

Come for the politics, stay for the snark.

Republicans seem to think life begins at the candlelight dinner the night before.

Never entrust democracy to any process that requires republicans to act in good faith.

Mediocre white men think RFK Jr’s pathetic midlife crisis is inspirational. The bar is set so low for them, it’s subterranean.

Motto for the House: Flip 5 and lose none.

Their boy Ron is an empty plastic cup that will never know pudding.

Dear elected officials: Trump is temporary, dishonor is forever.

When I was faster i was always behind.

The gop is a fucking disgrace.

“woke” is the new caravan.

They fucked up the fucking up of the fuckup!

Nothing worth doing is easy.

Republicans are the party of chaos and catastrophe.

The lights are all blinking red.

I desperately hope that, yet again, i am wrong.

They think we are photo bombing their nice little lives.

The media handbook says “controversial” is the most negative description that can be used for a Republican.

Too often we hand the biggest microphones to the cynics and the critics who delight in declaring failure.

There are some who say that there are too many strawmen arguments on this blog.

Bark louder, little dog.

Beware of advice from anyone for whom Democrats are “they” and not “we.”

The revolution will be supervised.

The words do not have to be perfect.

Their freedom requires your slavery.

He seems like a smart guy, but JFC, what a dick!

Mobile Menu

  • Seattle Meet-up Post
  • 2025 Activism
  • Targeted Political Fundraising
  • Donate with Venmo, Zelle & PayPal
  • Site Feedback
  • War in Ukraine
  • Submit Photos to On the Road
  • Politics
  • On The Road
  • Open Threads
  • Topics
  • COVID-19
  • Authors
  • About Us
  • Contact Us
  • Lexicon
  • Our Store
  • Politics
  • Open Threads
  • 2025 Activism
  • Garden Chats
  • On The Road
  • Targeted Fundraising!
You are here: Home / Food & Recipes / Beer Blogging / More-On

More-On

by Betty Cracker|  February 18, 20127:42 am| 111 Comments

This post is in: Beer Blogging, Media, Politics, Republican Stupidity, Assholes, General Stupidity, Wingnut Event Horizon, WTF?

FacebookTweetEmail

James Poulos cranked a particularly stinky nugget into Tucker Carlson’s cat box Thursday, a column entitled “What Are Women For?” that was at once so offensive, pretentious, incoherent, clueless and just plain dumb that it attracted hoots of derision from every corner of the internet. Balloon Juice commenter Clark Stooksbury summed it up pithily as follows:

I think that English is his second language, and perhaps Earth is his second planet.

Yup. Stung by the “wave of anger and condemnation” occasioned by his column, Poulos apparently decided to spend Friday afternoon masticating and swallowing an unabridged thesaurus along with a freshman introduction to philosophy textbook and wash it down with a liter of Everclear. The resulting geyser of vomit was pixelated into a dripping rebuttal to his critics that contains half-digested chunks such as this:

It’s not very controversial to point out that sex and gender are foundational to the culture wars. But it is apparently extremely controversial to claim that we can’t make sense of how and why they’re foundational without acknowledging that the root of the battle is over reaching — and enforcing — a consensus about the relationship between what women do and who women are.

And…

The same [Meh, never mind; it doesn’t really matter what is allegedly “the same”—ed.] is true for the meaning of the relationship between women as sovereign individuals and as beings with female bodies.

But its conclusion may contain a kernel of truth that the incredulous and exasperated reader espies with wonder similar to that of a janitor engaged in mopping up a binge drinker’s pool of sick upon finding a single kernel of undigested corn, whole and recognizable, in the barf on the frat lounge floor:

Difference doesn’t presume or ordain inequality. I’m not alone in thinking that women are uniquely able to help humanity avoid becoming enthralled to the more sterile cultural creations of men. But this sort of insight is far more circumspect and modest than the central principles of virtually all social conservatives. If my claim is doomed to be met with an avalanche of contempt, it seems likely that in our lifetimes social conservatism as we know it will be mocked, despised, and shamed right out of existence. You might be deeply uncomfortable with that even if you do hope to see an America without a social conservative movement.

I think he means “Après moi, le déluge” or something. But I’m not sure why I’m supposed to be “deeply uncomfortable” with the extinction of social conservativism that Poulos’ blogular rogering is supposed to portend. Say bye-bye to all-male panels of sanctimonious, god-bothering pricks deciding women’s healthcare issues? Bring it on, I say.

[X-POSTED at Rumproast]
FacebookTweetEmail
Previous Post: « Look- They Just Fucking Hate Gay People
Next Post: Marry, Marry, Why Ya Buggin’? »

Reader Interactions

111Comments

  1. 1.

    Egg Berry

    February 18, 2012 at 7:46 am

    If my claim is doomed to be met with an avalanche of contempt, it seems likely that in our lifetimes social conservatism as we know it will be mocked, despised, and shamed right out of existence.

    Well, he’s right about part of that. But no amount of mocking, shaming and despising seems to have gotten rid of it yet. It is immune to such weaponry.

  2. 2.

    c u n d gulag

    February 18, 2012 at 7:48 am

    This is what happens when an evil assclown like Tucker, who couldn’t get laid with a fistful of pardons in a women’s prison, gives space at his shitty blog to a guy who couldn’t get laid with a fistful of pardons in a men’s prison either.

  3. 3.

    JPL

    February 18, 2012 at 8:02 am

    What is a James Poulos for?

  4. 4.

    Some Guy

    February 18, 2012 at 8:13 am

    His greatest sin is burying his point in poorly drafted and crappily thought “philosophy.” His point is no point, his reasoning is pretense.

    If you want to argue that women’s relationship to child-bearing has some special value to society, then argue what it is. Saying you simply want to bring up the subject, and suggesting maybe we should just let a lot of different ideas about that relationship hold sway is just not much of a point. You know why? Because that is EXACTLY what the pro-choice position is. You cannot have a choice unless the option to control fertility is on the table but nobody forces anyone to use it.

    All the while alluding in metaphysical doggerel to the value of women undoing the harm men have done to the world is just dishonest. If you want to argue women are moralizing, purifying agents in the world, please go back to the 19th century. Or, better yet, re-state the doctrine of True Womanhood in 21st century terms and see if you can have it make any sense.

    Dishonest, badly written, poorly thought.

  5. 5.

    dmsilev

    February 18, 2012 at 8:13 am

    If my claim is doomed to be met with an avalanche of contempt, it seems likely that in our lifetimes social conservatism as we know it will be mocked, despised, and shamed right out of existence. You might be deeply uncomfortable with that even if you do hope to see an America without a social conservative movement.

    Dunno about the rest of you, but I’d be entirely comfortable with that.

  6. 6.

    Cermet

    February 18, 2012 at 8:14 am

    Afer one page of his nonsense yesterday, I gave up even trying to understand what the clown was writing – from the shit storm, at least someone did manage to understand this writer’s attempt at thought. Maybe I’m glad I couldn’t.

    So this guy thinks that anyone who is intelligent (exculdes all rethug voters) wants right wing racism called the re-thug party and their sick rasist supporters to surieve has to be a nutcase.

  7. 7.

    The boss

    February 18, 2012 at 8:15 am

    Derrida requires that, stinky or not, we must deconstruct the writer’s text. This is gonna hurt, but let me try…

    I CAN HAZ KEYBORD, BITCHEzZ!!

  8. 8.

    JPL

    February 18, 2012 at 8:15 am

    @dmsilev: seconded.

  9. 9.

    Samara Morgan

    February 18, 2012 at 8:18 am

    Poulos is another nasty little embryo Douthat that i remember from Culture 11 and TAS. Its purely Lovecraftian, like the Colour Out of Space.
    Douthat is like the evil soulsucking monstrous being that fed up and got strong and beamed itself up out of the well onto the NYT, and Poulos and Kain and DeBoer and Joe Carter and Frierdersdorf are like the weak half-formed creature that didnt get enough food (pageclicks) and fell feebly back into the well.
    Reihan too I guess, because NRO is far as he can ever get.

    And from that stricken faraway spot he had seen something feebly rise, only to sink back down again upon the place from which the great shapeless horror had shot into the sky.

  10. 10.

    bemused

    February 18, 2012 at 8:22 am

    What a coward this guy is. He writes a pile of gobbledegook because he’s too scared to say what he really feels.

  11. 11.

    Villago Delenda Est

    February 18, 2012 at 8:23 am

    @Some Guy:

    His point is no point, his reasoning is pretense.

    OK, I’m going to have to object to this.

    Not only is his point no point, he doesn’t even bother to try to reason, at all. It’s just a stream of word salad in defense of being a dumbasshole, which winds up being about as much of a defense as say the Germans put up to defend occupied Paris in 1944. Waay too busy fleeing back to the Reich to even grab a croissant for the trip.

  12. 12.

    amk

    February 18, 2012 at 8:23 am

    @dmsilev: +1.

  13. 13.

    Samara Morgan

    February 18, 2012 at 8:23 am

    @The boss: bam!
    Poulos’ old blog was Post-modern Conservative.
    back in the day, they called themselves the PoMoCons.
    a fourth leg of the stool?

  14. 14.

    WereBear

    February 18, 2012 at 8:25 am

    So it all boils down to they are going to take their balls and go home?

    I am so down with that.

  15. 15.

    harlana

    February 18, 2012 at 8:25 am

    i’m sorry, i still can’t get through it; i’d almost rather listen to Sarah Palin’s word salad and voice! maybe if you paid me.

  16. 16.

    Samara Morgan

    February 18, 2012 at 8:28 am

    the metaphorical ladder out of the well (so to speak) was Culture 11->TAS->Atlantic->NYT for Ross.
    Conor seems stuck at the Atlantic, and de Boer and Kain are still wannabe Atlanticons.
    Sadly for PoMoCon Poulos, the bottom two rungs have fallen off the ladder.

  17. 17.

    Rita R.

    February 18, 2012 at 8:31 am

    Is this what passes for writing in the wingnut welfare world? Although slightly less incomprehensible than the first “What are Women For?” post, after slashing and hacking through Poulos’ latest overstuffed screed I’m still not sure exactly what the hell he’s trying to say.

    Is it biology is destiny? Is it you should really pay attention to me because I’m less of a dick then a lot of other conservatives out there? Is he just using a lot a words to restate the obvious — that the fight is about whether women will be allowed to control their own bodies or not? And has he ever spoken to an actual woman instead of engaging in offensive theorizing about what they “are for”?

    In any case, I liked this from the comments section:

    The problem arises from the idiotic assumption that because women bear children, that is all they should or could or must do.

    It would be like stating the fact that men are sperm donors, and strictly defining their lives as donors of sperm and nothing else.

    EDIT: That second sentence is supposed to be in the blockquote too. Don’t know why it isn’t.

  18. 18.

    Samara Morgan

    February 18, 2012 at 8:35 am

    @WereBear: well…..the conservative elite have a problem now. With both TAS and Culture 11 defunct, there is no official incubator for young conservative “intellectuals”.
    That is why Poulos is at DC and Erik Ericksson at Redstate, and Kain is still wandering aimlessly in his “Freed” Market Forest.
    There is just no market among the ‘slines of the conservative base for intellectualism.
    Culture 11 died the same day Big Hollywood sprang to foul nascent life.
    all those blogs– Culture 11, TAS, Big Hollywood were about “taking back the culture”.
    This is a failmene of conservative ideology like i pointed out on EDK’s McNaughton thread (approvingly linked by Sully).
    Culture is a reflection of society, not a steering wheel for it.

  19. 19.

    Rita R.

    February 18, 2012 at 8:39 am

    @dmsilev:

    You’ve been seconded and thirded, so I guess I’m fourthing.

  20. 20.

    THE

    February 18, 2012 at 8:44 am

    Christianity itself — often associated with Aristotelian views tightly tying sexual biology to social role — is in fact a creed that in many ways profoundly liberates individuals from their natural bodies.

    Very true. Lots of heretics burned at the stake, and unbelievers persecuted into conversion, who were liberated from their bodies by Christianist whackjobs, can testify to the deep truth of this.

  21. 21.

    geg6

    February 18, 2012 at 8:45 am

    The idea that I would be anything less than ecstatic if the social conservative movement in America (hell, the world) died out is laughable at the very least.

    I would prefer if they died out in a very hot fire, but I’ll take it any way I can get it.

  22. 22.

    Villago Delenda Est

    February 18, 2012 at 8:52 am

    I’m not alone in thinking that women are uniquely able to help humanity avoid becoming enthralled to the more sterile cultural creations of men.

    It’s painfully obvious that this guy is destined to be a 40 year old virgin, with no hope of changing that when he hits 40.

  23. 23.

    Samara Morgan

    February 18, 2012 at 8:54 am

    Tbogg’s take that SPT linked.
    Airborne Pompous Event.

    betty, your link doesnt work for me.
    the comments are 100% negative from my sample.

  24. 24.

    Samara Morgan

    February 18, 2012 at 8:55 am

    @THE: Spock you are such an albigensian.

  25. 25.

    JGabriel

    February 18, 2012 at 8:56 am

    If my claim is doomed to be met with an avalanche of contempt, it seems likely that in our lifetimes social conservatism as we know it will be mocked, despised, and shamed right out of existence. You might be deeply uncomfortable with that even if you do hope to see an America without a social conservative movement.

    Hmm. My love for America vs. my love of a good target for mocking.

    Decisions, decisions…

    .

  26. 26.

    THE

    February 18, 2012 at 8:59 am

    @Samara Morgan: They’re a good example.

  27. 27.

    JPL

    February 18, 2012 at 8:59 am

    The entire article was written solely to get links in order to improve the quality of ads. We have been taken and it’s not even April fools day.

  28. 28.

    MariedeGournay

    February 18, 2012 at 9:04 am

    Crows have a more profound metaphysics.

  29. 29.

    Samara Morgan

    February 18, 2012 at 9:05 am

    @JPL: no, this is a valid sample of what passes for PoMoCon “intellectual philosophy”.
    I remember this guy from Culture 11 and TAS.

  30. 30.

    Groucho48

    February 18, 2012 at 9:09 am

    @Samara Morgan:

    Well, “The Colour Out Of Space” Is chilling, and, Poulas is chilling, but they are chilling in very different ways. I read Coluor for the first time when I was maybe 10 or 11. It was one of the very few things I’ve ever read that sent shivers down my spine. But, the shivers were kind of good shivers…

    West of Arkham the hills rise wild, and there are valleys with deep woods that no axe has ever cut. There are dark narrow glens where the trees slope fantastically, and where thin brooklets trickle without ever having caught the glint of sunlight. On the gentle slopes there are farms, ancient and rocky, with squat, moss-coated cottages brooding eternally over old New England secrets in the lee of great ledges; but these are all vacant now, the wide chimneys crumbling and the shingled sides bulging perilously beneath low gambrel roofs.

    The old folk have gone away, and foreigners do not like to live there. French-Canadians have tried it, Italians have tried it, and the Poles have come and departed. It is not because of anything that can be seen or heard or handled, but because of something that is imagined. The place is not good for imagination, and does not bring restful dreams at night. It must be this which keeps the foreigners away, for old Ammi Pierce has never told them of anything he recalls from the strange days. Ammi, whose head has been a little queer for years, is the only one who still remains, or who ever talks of the strange days; and he dares to do this because his house is so near the open fields and the travelled roads around Arkham.

    There was once a road over the hills and through the valleys, that ran straight where the blasted heath is now; but people ceased to use it and a new road was laid curving far toward the south. Traces of the old one can still be found amidst the weeds of a returning wilderness, and some of them will doubtless linger even when half the hollows are flooded for the new reservoir. Then the dark woods will be cut down and the blasted heath will slumber far below blue waters whose surface will mirror the sky and ripple in the sun. And the secrets of the strange days will be one with the deep’s secrets; one with the hidden lore of old ocean, and all the mystery of primal earth.

    Many right wing writers can also send shivers down my spine, but they are bad shivers. Hopefully, the twain shall never meet.

  31. 31.

    WereBear

    February 18, 2012 at 9:14 am

    @Samara Morgan: In other words, they fake it, all the way down.

    @MariedeGournay: Crows have a more profound metaphysics.

    Oh yeah, I got a lot of you should treasure your baby-making abilities because they are soooooooooo much better than bestriding the world like a colossus you lucky second class citizen you CRAP while I was growing up.

    He sounds like just the kinda guy that makes conservatives think men who are gay are that way because they hate and fear women; and since they are straight and hate and fear women, the sex must be so much better and that’s why there is gayness which we manly men must resist 24/7 because it’s a sin.

    When I think of the Conservative Mind, I think of an infinite screw turning in an eternity of Möbius bottles. And never getting anywhere.

  32. 32.

    Omnes Omnibus

    February 18, 2012 at 9:14 am

    If my claim is doomed to be met with an avalanche of contempt…

    If? How about when? I think when works better.

  33. 33.

    Samara Morgan

    February 18, 2012 at 9:16 am

    @Groucho48: haha, one of my favorite lovecrafts.

    but i think i think “shapeless horror” that sucks the life and sanity out of everything is a very good analogy for douthat.

    Poulos is a PoMoCon. that is simply never going to catch on.
    post modernism.
    its deeply oxymoronic.

  34. 34.

    Narcissus

    February 18, 2012 at 9:16 am

    “Beings with female bodies.”

  35. 35.

    Linda Featheringill

    February 18, 2012 at 9:19 am

    In addition to the idea that men are for donating sperm, NYT has an interesting article on the frequency of out-of-wedlock births in the US:

    http://www.nytimes.com/2012/02/18/us/for-women-under-30-most-births-occur-outside-marriage.html?_r=1&hp

    Over 50% of births to women younger than 30 happen without marriage. And over 40% of all births in the US occur outside of marriage.

  36. 36.

    Groucho48

    February 18, 2012 at 9:20 am

    @Samara Morgan:

    I was rambling a bit, but, my point is, the world would be a better place if there were a bunch more stories of comparable quality to Colour. We can’t say that about right wing pundits.

  37. 37.

    Samara Morgan

    February 18, 2012 at 9:22 am

    @WereBear: they arent faking it….well…maybe Jonah Golbberg is. But for the most part they truly believe this crapology.
    Conservatives are always trying to “Take Back teh Culture” but they have a profound misunderstanding of what culture is.
    Culture is a multidimensional reflective surface, not a steering wheel you can grab and wrench back onto your chosen path.

  38. 38.

    JPL

    February 18, 2012 at 9:23 am

    OT..MSNBC has an article on Santorum’s foreign police speech. I think he wants to bomb France.

    “Ladies and gentleman, we have a president who not only apologizes for America, but consistently makes our country less safe,” Santorum told the 750 people gathered here for a Lincoln Day Dinner on Friday……………………..
    Anybody that he treats well is our enemy, anybody he treats poorly is our friend. That’s how the president deals with our allies,” Santorum said………………………….
    “He actually went to France a year or so ago and was with Nicolas Sarkozy and said that, ‘Here I am with the French Prime Minister, our best ally in the world.’ Now think about this. Name one time in the last 20 years that the French stood by us with anything,” Santorum said.

    The article does point out that Sarkozy isn’t the prime minister but does not mention France’s involvement in Arab Spring or Afghanistan. link

  39. 39.

    Samara Morgan

    February 18, 2012 at 9:24 am

    @Groucho48: lol. of course not. right wing pundits are more like Lovecraftian monsters than Lovecraftian writers.

  40. 40.

    Tyro

    February 18, 2012 at 9:24 am

    I am genuinely shocked how someone other than a pretentious 19 year old could have written this crap. It has all the markings of a juvenile who thinks, “this is how you sound profound” before he’s actually read anything significant.

    Hs own Christian background has an extensive theology rejecting the whole “women as strange alien creatures and/or man’s total opposite” ideas in the classical era. It is as though he has no idea how dumb everything he just wrote is, though I’m sure this is what passes for profound in wingnut welfare circles.

  41. 41.

    Samara Morgan

    February 18, 2012 at 9:26 am

    @Tyro: im just in awe of the epic cognitive dissonance involved in being a post modernist and a conservative at the same time.
    well….i guess postmodernists and conservatives both reject science…but the rest must be brainsplitting.
    perhaps Poulos is now schizophrenic?

  42. 42.

    Omnes Omnibus

    February 18, 2012 at 9:27 am

    @JPL: You have to understand that the man is, at bottom, a vicious idiot.

  43. 43.

    Garbo

    February 18, 2012 at 9:30 am

    I salute those who waded into the muck. The title alone, What Are Women For, was enough to send my head into a low earth orbit of rage. For? For?!!!

    Here’s my deep thinking. Since males have more musculature, they should be confined to only those professions or activities that call for strength or heavy lifting, m-Kay? I mean, it’s clearly their destiny to be pack animals, what’s the argument?

  44. 44.

    JPL

    February 18, 2012 at 9:30 am

    @Omnes Omnibus: Surprisingly most of those commenting understand that. Ten years ago many were ready to think France our enemy.

  45. 45.

    Omnes Omnibus

    February 18, 2012 at 9:30 am

    @Samara Morgan:

    i guess postmodernists and conservatives both reject science

    I know I will regret this, but quoi?

  46. 46.

    Linda Featheringill

    February 18, 2012 at 9:31 am

    @Samara Morgan: #37

    Culture is a multidimensional reflective surface, not a steering wheel you can grab and wrench back onto your chosen path.

    Very nice. :-)

  47. 47.

    JD Rhoades

    February 18, 2012 at 9:32 am

    If my claim is doomed to be met with an avalanche of contempt, it seems likely that in our lifetimes social conservatism as we know it will be mocked, despised, and shamed right out of existence.

    YAAAAAY!

  48. 48.

    Garbo

    February 18, 2012 at 9:34 am

    Culture is a multidimensional reflective surface, not a steering wheel you can grab and wrench back onto your chosen path.

    Now THAT is some fine thinking and writing.

  49. 49.

    Omnes Omnibus

    February 18, 2012 at 9:34 am

    @JPL: At the time, I thought of France as the good friend who said, “Bro, I’m, like, not totes sure that this is cool. Maybe you should, like, chill and shit.” Also too, given France’s real history of martial fervor, if they didn’t want to be involved in a war, it was a bad idea.

  50. 50.

    PeakVT

    February 18, 2012 at 9:37 am

    @Linda Featheringill: Marriage is declining, but at the same time the cost of a typical wedding is exploding. Effect, or another cause of the decline?

  51. 51.

    Samara Morgan

    February 18, 2012 at 9:41 am

    @Groucho48: Lovecraft was peerless at conveying horror…..i feel that horror now for what the conservative movement has become….
    a classic Lovecraftian monster like the soggoth in The Dunwich Horror.

    Oh, oh, my Gawd, that haff face–that haff face on top of it…it was a octopus, centipede, spider kind o’ thing, but they was a haff-shaped man’s face on top of it an’ it looked like Ronald Reagan’s, only it was yards an’ yards acrost….

  52. 52.

    General Stuck

    February 18, 2012 at 9:41 am

    He dunt make sense, but that Poulos feller sure do talk purdy.

  53. 53.

    scav

    February 18, 2012 at 9:42 am

    What part of “shut up bitchz and stand still on that pedestal and inspire me, don’t you worry your pretty little head about the empty nothings of the actual world.” does he think is a compliment? Forget mere combat, some women are entirely mean, souless and real enough to be successful hedge fund managers. Welcome to true equality, you’ll find women coming at you from all sides. Cage match between Iron Man and The Iron Lady? Place your bets.

  54. 54.

    rikyrah

    February 18, 2012 at 9:44 am

    these assholes never apologize.

    that’s for mere mortals. we just are too stupid to see his brilliance.

    in actuality?

    fuck this asshole.

  55. 55.

    Samara Morgan

    February 18, 2012 at 9:45 am

    @Omnes Omnibus: this was a BEEG topic of discussion at Culture 11….Poulos argued that since science was modern rejecting science was post-modern.
    sadly, the archives are all gone, but it was Epic.

  56. 56.

    General Stuck

    February 18, 2012 at 9:46 am

    @scav:

    Place your bets.

    I’d prefer to duck.

  57. 57.

    Omnes Omnibus

    February 18, 2012 at 9:47 am

    @Samara Morgan: That is simply further evidence that Poulos is, individually, an idiot. Don’t take it as evidence that post-modernism rejects science.

  58. 58.

    pluege

    February 18, 2012 at 9:48 am

    since “social conservatism” is the manifestation of all the vile, repugnant, insecure, violent, irrational, loathsome attributes of being human, why wouldn’t we rejoice at the extinction of social conservatism? It is in fact the goal.

    Enlightenment, the triumph of empathy and decency is the exact opposite of social conservatism. Humanity can not achieve enlightenment as long as social conservatism exists.

  59. 59.

    dmsilev

    February 18, 2012 at 9:49 am

    I will say though that anyone who believes that their best byline is “Host of Something Nobody Has Ever Heard Of on PJTV” deserves at least a little nanosecond or so of pity.

  60. 60.

    boomshanka

    February 18, 2012 at 10:00 am

    wow, i’m glad i read this. yet another reminder that a “reasonable” conservative is a total fucking fraud. his article and response discredits everything he’s ever written.

  61. 61.

    DanielX

    February 18, 2012 at 10:02 am

    Attempting to find the point of Poulos’ original gibberish, my reaction was “what the fuck does this even mean?”. Couldn’t figure it out, except Poulos thinks women ought to…something. Then I thought about how I’ve had this precise reaction before. But where and when? It came to me quickly – this word salad is like one of David Brook’s more putrid efforts, except Poulos had to put more work and more words into it. Keep practicing, James – eventually you’ll reach the point where you too can effortlessly crank out complete horseshit with a conservative twist and to do it in 800 words or less.

  62. 62.

    General Stuck

    February 18, 2012 at 10:04 am

    yet another reminder that a “reasonable” conservative is a total fucking fraud.

    It’s hard to be reasonable, when the GOP tent is surrounded by portable guillotines.

  63. 63.

    Chris

    February 18, 2012 at 10:05 am

    If my claim is doomed to be met with an avalanche of contempt, it seems likely that in our lifetimes social conservatism as we know it will be mocked, despised, and shamed right out of existence. You might be deeply uncomfortable with that even if you do hope to see an America without a social conservative movement.

    No. No I’m not. I’ve been waiting my entire admittedly short life to see social conservatism mocked, despised and shamed right out of existence.

    And this being a democracy and us being liberals, “mocking, despising and shaming” is as far as we’ll go. We will not pass laws denying social conservatives the right to marry. We will not pass laws denying social conservatives access to health care. We will not fight for some “constitutional right” to segregate social conservatives out of our restaurants, offices, apartment buildings and other parts of society. We will not impose poll taxes designed to prevent social conservatives from voting. Because even though you deserve nothing more than all these things, we’re not like you.

    So shut up and be happy that the “mocking, despising and shaming” is the closest thing you’ll ever know to the oppression you’ve visited on millions of people.

  64. 64.

    Samara Morgan

    February 18, 2012 at 10:08 am

    @Omnes Omnibus: oh no….its how conservative cognitive dissonance and factblocking accomodate the impossible task of reconciling conservativism and post-modernism.
    Poulos’ old blog was Post-modern Conservatism.
    He is a PoMoCon.
    this is evident in his writing style.

  65. 65.

    handsmile

    February 18, 2012 at 10:17 am

    @Samara Morgan:

    Not to quibble, but since Poulos is being rightfully slagged for his word salad rhetoric, among other things, I must ask respectfully, what does this mean:

    “Culture is a multidimensional reflective surface, not a steering wheel you can grab and wrench back onto your chosen path.”

    Whenever I hear the word “culture,” I reach for my copy of Raymond Williams’ Keywords. This is the first paragraph of his definition:

    Culture is one of the two or three most complicated words in the English language. This is so partly because of its intricate historical development, in several European languages, but mainly because it has now come to be used for important concepts in several distinct intellectual disciplines and in several distinct and incompatible systems of thought.

    And the full text, if you’d be interested:

    http://pubpages.unh.edu/~dml3/880williams.htm

  66. 66.

    Samara Morgan

    February 18, 2012 at 10:19 am

    truly my favorite line.

    The purpose of lifting the left’s Potemkin skirts is not to score tits for tats.

  67. 67.

    scav

    February 18, 2012 at 10:22 am

    @handsmile: I thought it meant you can’t drive a petri dish, no matter how much it looks like a steering wheel (although the possibility of driving youghurt flashed through my mind briefly, I did reject that one). mmmm, must read more carefully in future.

    ETA: Yes, some of you did see the potability of driving youghurt briefly, but I fixed it. FYSC.

  68. 68.

    Samara Morgan

    February 18, 2012 at 10:28 am

    @handsmile: the point im trying to make is that culture reflects society. i thought that EDK post was truly awful, partly because he still trying to pimp his argument that failed 3 years ago at TAS.
    cw says it better than i. he was my Dark Sith Master at TAS in the old days.

    Well said, Conor. There is a great deal of room to make good, conservative movies. The thing is, they shouldn’t be overtly conservative. I would argue that a book/film like The Lord of the Rings is inherently conservative in its critique of all-consuming power; in its embrace of the value of friendship, loyalty, and courage; in its hesitance and caution, and so on and so forth. And there are others like that. The thing is, I’m sure not a soul making the film version of LOTR ever even considered the conservatism of it. This is the sort of thing that conservatives need to be thinking about. How to infuse scripts with ideals rather than politics, with conservative values that are exemplified in the characters rather than preached by them.
    __
    Great post.
    __
    — E.D. Kain · Feb 27, 11:10 AM · #

    “This is the sort of thing that conservatives need to be thinking about. How to infuse scripts with ideals rather than politics, with conservative values that are exemplified in the characters rather than preached by them.”
    __
    Did you read the post? The point is people who are also liberals are not trying to “infuse scripts with ideals rather than politics.” They are just making movies that the think will be good and will make money. They are not trying to change the culture, they are just being part of the culture.
    __
    I mean to call these movies “liberal” or “conservative” is even a mistake. They are just movies (or books) and as such reflect the culture. You can find plenty of conservative values in todays popular movies and plenty of liberal vaules. But to even look for that and wring your hands that the movies are not propogandistic enough of your particular point of veiw is to totally misunderstand the nature of art. It’s stalinist thinking. The subtext of all this conservative whining about “liberal hollywood” is that the movies DO reflect the culture and that scares conservatives becasue it shows that their “values” are not really that widely held. Which as it should be, right? Isn’t conservativism’s main concern trying to conserve dying values?
    __
    Occasionally a work of art can change culture, but generally it is a reflection of what is going on.
    __
    — cw · Feb 27, 12:00 PM · #

    In evo theory of culture 101 we learned that culture doesnt shape society as much society shapes culture.
    ;)

  69. 69.

    Samara Morgan

    February 18, 2012 at 10:31 am

    @handsmile: take EDK’s LOTR example.
    there is no sucha thing as “inherently conservative” about LOTR.
    it reflects the cultural values of that slice of spacetime, both liberal and conservative, as well as motifs that transcend time and space like friendship, loyalty, and sacrifice.
    that is why i said multidimensional.
    ;)

  70. 70.

    harlana

    February 18, 2012 at 10:33 am

    @DanielX: the only thing i got out of it that was marginally comprehensible was that women are “privileged” because they can get pregnant and bear children (no mention of the circumstances of how they conceived or whether or not they wanted to get pregnant or whether that pregnancy might threaten their lives), and that we should be really concerned that men have no say in what happens to their sperm after it leaves their body, i guess that’s supposed to be comparable to women practicing birth control or getting abortions.

  71. 71.

    Samara Morgan

    February 18, 2012 at 10:38 am

    @handsmile: see this?

    They are not trying to change the culture, they are just being part of the culture.

    that is what Poulos is attempting….to claim postmodernism for conservatism.
    ..or claim you can be a postmodernist AND a conservative….something like that.
    Or when EDK or Peter Suderman call themselves neo-liberals or liberaltarians they are trying to claim liberal values for conservatism.
    they are trying to drive culture.
    it can’t be driven.

  72. 72.

    Comrade Nimrod Humperdink

    February 18, 2012 at 10:40 am

    I dunno, all this Po Mo Con stuff is giving this doofus more credit than he warrants. That might be how he packages it, but it sounds more to me like a drunken undergrad frat guy hanging out with a few people in the pre-dawn hours and trying to explain his objections to the Women’s Studies 101 class he took to fulfill a GenEd requirement and hopefully hook up with somebody.

    I don’t care how old he is biologically, as noted above, he’s still 19, doesn’t actually know what he thinks because he lacks the balls and focus to chase it down, and then cries about being misunderstood when the actual adults around him point and laugh.

  73. 73.

    Roger Moore

    February 18, 2012 at 10:42 am

    @Samara Morgan:

    Culture is a multidimensional reflective surface, not a steering wheel you can grab and wrench back onto your chosen path.

    Gems like this are why we’re happy to have you around here.

  74. 74.

    Samara Morgan

    February 18, 2012 at 10:49 am

    @handsmile: and Williams definition of culture is very multidimensional, isnt it?

  75. 75.

    scav

    February 18, 2012 at 10:50 am

    @Comrade Nimrod Humperdink: Basically, yeah, he can dress up in PoMo pajamas all he wants but that doesn’t mean he can wield the best of it effectively. Needs more batteries in his light saber. If he’s confusing getting yelled at for being proved correct, I’d say it’s odds on he thinks his string of F’s is graduating Summa Cum Laude. He’s blatherng on about women’s natural bodies and unique or particular purposes, while his body and natural purpose, examined at bottom, might be stored cryogenically and used when convenient, with far less bother, fuss and possibly, cost. Stepstools don’t cost that much.

  76. 76.

    gocart mozart

    February 18, 2012 at 10:52 am

    Here is Roy Edroso’s take on the original article. As usual, vey funny and so are the comments.
    http://alicublog.blogspot.com/

  77. 77.

    handsmile

    February 18, 2012 at 10:53 am

    @Samara Morgan:

    I appreciate your taking the time to write several comments explicating your original remark. Thank you.

    The channels of interaction and influence, reflection and absorption, between culture and society are profoundly intertwined. (Trying to navigate them has been the broad subject of my professional work for many years.)

    Ideological conservatives’ notions of the interrelationship between art, culture and society, as baldly exposed by your citation of Kain’s example of LOTR, are simply too shallow to offer guidance.

    ETA: Just now saw your comment #74. Raymond Williams was and remains my own Sith Master. “Multi-dimensional” is inadequate to describe his genius.

  78. 78.

    RalfW

    February 18, 2012 at 10:57 am

    Commenter SteveM at TBogg’s place dug up this fantastic gem from 2009 (via wayback machine) in which Poulos rails against new type fonts as contributing to the decline of civilization. Seriously. He’s that pretentious and simultaneously unhinged.

    Poulos can use a lot of fancy words, but no matter the cleanliness of the Arial font on my Mac, they just don’t make a damn bit of sense.

  79. 79.

    GregB

    February 18, 2012 at 11:04 am

    Oh, you mean the tools that shout amen at chief ditto-head Rush Limbaugh as he talks dreamily about the wonderful day in the future when there is a zoo with one liberal in it behind bars, just so the rubes can see what one looks like?

    These people.

  80. 80.

    RalfW

    February 18, 2012 at 11:05 am

    @Chris:

    +1, Chris. You’ve captured a good chunk of why I’m a liberal. Thanks.

  81. 81.

    Benjamin Franklin

    February 18, 2012 at 11:06 am

    @handsmile:

    I don’t think the def of culture is more complex than when I took Anthropology;

    Culture; The way of life for a People

    Just sayin…

  82. 82.

    scav

    February 18, 2012 at 11:13 am

    @RalfW: “. . . the eradication of ennobling, culturally demanding, fonts from public print”? ! Oh Thank you! Thank you! Yet another reason to not be able to sleep at night from all the hysterical laughter.

  83. 83.

    Comrade Nimrod Humperdink

    February 18, 2012 at 11:14 am

    @scav: Well, getting yelled at is bracing evidence that he’s touched some nerve central to the ideological identity of the evil Left and complacent Middle, don’t you see?

  84. 84.

    Samara Morgan

    February 18, 2012 at 11:18 am

    @handsmile:

    The channels of interaction and influence, reflection and absorption, between culture and society are profoundly intertwined.

    beauty.
    i totally agree with this.
    that is very good actually.
    have any published works i can read?

    for example, consider blacks in entertainment and sports in pop culture.
    this represents reflection, in that it reflects the increasing share of minorities in the population, but also absorption, and fulfills a societal need to reshape non-black perceptions post civil rights.

    Culture doesn’t shape society AS MUCH AS society shapes culture according to its needs.
    that might be Dan Sperber, i forget.
    thank YOU for the learning.
    ;)

  85. 85.

    Egg Berry

    February 18, 2012 at 11:18 am

    Social conservatives can’t be post-modern, since their worldview is decidedly pre-modern.

  86. 86.

    Brachiator

    February 18, 2012 at 11:19 am

    Started reading it, stopped after a few paragraphs. Typical lame shit stuck in an old philosophical framework. Looking for essences and purpose. Sullivan also likes this kind of thing.

    But in the end, who gives a shit what he thinks women are for?

    And you know, that when that odd little document, The Declaration of Indepdendence, talks about “the right to life, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness,” there is the clear implication that each individual is the author of his or her own story, without respect to tradition, culture, society, or even psuedo genetic notions of essence, purpose or destiny.

    Why don’t conservatives believe in America?

  87. 87.

    General Stuck

    February 18, 2012 at 11:20 am

    Wingnuts can be counted on to be reactionary, if nothing else, and doubly so when they think they are losing. But I have an odd feeling about what is going on now with these usually cautious political creatures now throwing caution to the wind and letting their freek flags fly. It is almost getting to be like a long drawn out confessional to let us all know the dark ideals harbored in their hard tiny hearts. A sort of cathartic grunt toward shedding skin as a molt toward some kind of half assed idea of salvation. Right now it concerns their attitudes towards women. That is coming out sideways, and just screams political suicide from alienating more than half the electorate. I am likely being too hopeful as to a positive underside to the nature of the current bullshit they are disgusting us all with. But I can’t think of a better explanation for it. They used to do all this on the sly, but not anymore.

  88. 88.

    scav

    February 18, 2012 at 11:21 am

    @Comrade Nimrod Humperdink: Ahh, yes, but then he’ll have to find out what the purpose of the Left and Middle are tomorrow and attempt to counter that as well. We just need to keep intellectually flexible and his 1000-year Right can be toppled with a Zapf Wingding . . .

  89. 89.

    Villago Delenda Est

    February 18, 2012 at 11:25 am

    @handsmile:

    Whenever I hear the word “culture,” I reach for my copy of Raymond Williams’ Keywords

    I see what you did there.

  90. 90.

    FlipYrWhig

    February 18, 2012 at 11:28 am

    @RalfW: So if a women’s fashion boutique used girly fonts, would that be a good thing, reflecting feminine special femininity, or a bad thing, conveying decadent manners and sloth?

  91. 91.

    gocart mozart

    February 18, 2012 at 11:28 am

    “In a simpler time Sigmund Freud struggled to understand what women want. Today the significant battle is over what women are for.”

    I’m going to make a wild guess and predict: On the one side, babies and Jesus, and on the other side, sterility, plus maybe careers, soft drugs, Tumblr, and kittens.

    Heh.
    http://alicublog.blogspot.com/

  92. 92.

    Comrade Nimrod Humperdink

    February 18, 2012 at 11:28 am

    @Egg Berry: It seems strange to see somebody that claims to be PoMo making all kinds of weird allusions to stuff that’s “Natural” while speaking in largely cultural terms. It’s all the more reason for me to think of Inigo Montoya and Vizzini.

  93. 93.

    Villago Delenda Est

    February 18, 2012 at 11:32 am

    @Brachiator:

    Why don’t conservatives believe in America?

    It takes more operative neurons than they have.

    Collectively.

  94. 94.

    Samara Morgan

    February 18, 2012 at 11:32 am

    also too, you should all brace yourselves for Disney’s John Carter and EDK arguing that Tal Hajus and the Green Horde were socialists (and possibly muslim “jihaadis”), and that Princess of Mars is “inherently conservative”.
    ;)

  95. 95.

    Samara Morgan

    February 18, 2012 at 11:33 am

    oh darn.
    moderation.
    i said the s-word, didnt i?
    ;)

  96. 96.

    Samara Morgan

    February 18, 2012 at 11:34 am

    also too, you should all brace yourselves for Disney’s John Carter and EDK arguing that since Tal Hajus and the Green Horde are soc1al1sts (and possibly muslim “jihadis”, because, like, Green), that means ERB and Princess of Mars are “inherently conservative”.
    ;)

  97. 97.

    Omnes Omnibus

    February 18, 2012 at 11:40 am

    @Samara Morgan: FWIW this is a much better way of carrying on your kanly against EDK. It is rather witty, it makes your point, and it doesn’t completely torque up the thread for everyone else.

  98. 98.

    Brachiator

    February 18, 2012 at 11:41 am

    @Samara Morgan:

    for example, consider blacks in entertainment and sports in pop culture.
    this represents reflection, in that it reflects the increasing share of minorities in the population, but also absorption, and fulfills a societal need to reshape non-black perceptions post civil rights.

    I can’t decide whether this is nonsense or gibberish.

    Upon further reflection: gibberish.

  99. 99.

    Narcissus

    February 18, 2012 at 11:42 am

    Everything James Poulos knows about women he learned from Tarnsman of Gor.

  100. 100.

    ExurbanMom

    February 18, 2012 at 11:43 am

    The comments, seriously, are 100% against him. 100%. And the commentariat, taken collectively, makes more sense and is much funnier and smarter than him. Quite an achievement, that, to have sparked such unanimous opposition and quality snarkage.

  101. 101.

    Samara Morgan

    February 18, 2012 at 11:44 am

    @Narcissus: AMG! Gor the counter-earth.
    that is where all conservatives actually belong.
    where women are slaves and totally dig it.

    Narcissus, PLEASE go post that comment on Poulos’ thread!

  102. 102.

    Persia

    February 18, 2012 at 11:50 am

    @dmsilev: Yeah, I keep thinking that ‘bodily autonomy’ thing is important to me, I guess I won’t shed any tears when social conservatism goes down.

  103. 103.

    Samara Morgan

    February 18, 2012 at 12:00 pm

    Narcissus, i can do it for you, if you like….. that is too awesome not to share.

    done.

    could this spawn a new internet meme?
    James Poulos, Tarnsman of Gor.

  104. 104.

    JR in WVa

    February 18, 2012 at 12:20 pm

    @Chris: Chris, is it OK to hope that the mocking and shaming we’re allowed to do will make them go way away to anywhere else so we don’t have to look at them or hear them anymore?

    I sure hope so!

    Thanks,
    JR

  105. 105.

    Samara Morgan

    February 18, 2012 at 12:34 pm

    here is a simply awesome example of what i meant by using religion to try to grab the (imaginary) steering wheel of culture.

    A speech former Senator Rick Santorum delivered at a Catholic college in 2008 began burning up the left-wing blogosphere Friday afternoon. At Ave Maria University in Naples, Florida, Santorum argued that Satan was using the national debate over abortion as a tool to destroy the institutions of American culture — including universities, the government, popular culture, and mainline Protestant churches.
    “This is not a political war at all. This is not a cultural war at all. This is a spiritual war,” Santorum said during his August 29, 2008 speech. “And the Father of Lies has his sights on what you would think the Father of Lies, Satan, would have his sights on: a good, decent, powerful, influential country, the United States of America.”

    religion is PART of contemporary culture, but not neccessarily the steering part..
    watch out America, Satan is gunna get yah.

  106. 106.

    JR in WVa

    February 18, 2012 at 12:42 pm

    Tarnsman of Gor:

    I read that article about fonts. He used Ariel mostly, and in the code referred to ‘Helvetica’,’Lucida Grande’, and ‘Arial’. Though I’m sure he didn’t ever look at the HTML he was generating, and probably didn’t know how to control what font his precious words would appear in.

    What a bowl of chowder! His more recent work is far more unintelligible than the older one about fonts, but how does one become convinced that fonts can doom (or save) a society or culture.

    Some excellent observations about culture in fiction can be seen in Ian M Banks’ work, if anyone is interested about real discussion of culture and society.

  107. 107.

    RalfW

    February 18, 2012 at 12:53 pm

    @FlipYrWhig:

    I suspect that any font less serious than a 19-th century serif implies decadence, homosexual tendencies and sloth. At least for the nutter Poulos.

    Now, personally, I hate a variety of Microsoft fonts, but that’s because they’re just ugly or lame. Which I suppose indicts capitalism for it’s flim-flammery. Ha-HA! I see how this works! Cool!!

  108. 108.

    THE

    February 18, 2012 at 2:01 pm

    Today the significant battle is over what women are for.

    Ummm. Gaia’s secret strategy for conquering the Galaxy? ;)

  109. 109.

    DanielX

    February 18, 2012 at 7:56 pm

    @Samara Morgan:

    Yup. Where is the Church Lady when you need her?

  110. 110.

    Samara Morgan

    February 19, 2012 at 9:40 am

    i thot about this in the wee hours when i was gaming.

    there is a reason that the Culture 11 archives were purged. does anyone remember Young Conors screed against Palin, Snowmobile Wreck?

    I also thought about James Poulos, noted PomoCon and Tarnsman of Gor.
    Now there is a literary work with True Conservative Values.
    paging EDK

    I read this as an extension of James’s broader critique of libertarianism or perhaps libertinism.

    can someone that speaks glibertarian explain what libertinism is?
    ;)

  111. 111.

    THE

    February 19, 2012 at 6:06 pm

    I presume libertinism means you want to be a libertine

Comments are closed.

Primary Sidebar

On The Road - Mike in Oly - Woodard Bay Natural Resources Conservation Area
Image by Mike in Oly (5/24/25)

Recent Comments

  • Professor Bigfoot on Saturday Morning Open Thread (May 24, 2025 @ 12:00pm)
  • Professor Bigfoot on Saturday Morning Open Thread (May 24, 2025 @ 11:57am)
  • lowtechcyclist on Saturday Morning Open Thread (May 24, 2025 @ 11:55am)
  • Professor Bigfoot on Late Night Open Thread (May 24, 2025 @ 11:52am)
  • Citizen Alan on Late Night Open Thread (May 24, 2025 @ 11:50am)

PA Supreme Court At Risk

Donate

Balloon Juice Posts

View by Topic
View by Author
View by Month & Year
View by Past Author

Featuring

Medium Cool
Artists in Our Midst
Authors in Our Midst
War in Ukraine
Donate to Razom for Ukraine

🎈Keep Balloon Juice Ad Free

Become a Balloon Juice Patreon
Donate with Venmo, Zelle or PayPal

Meetups

Upcoming Ohio Meetup May 17
5/11 Post about the May 17 Ohio Meetup

Calling All Jackals

Site Feedback
Nominate a Rotating Tag
Submit Photos to On the Road
Balloon Juice Anniversary (All Links)
Balloon Juice Anniversary (All Posts)
Fix Nyms with Apostrophes

Hands Off! – Denver, San Diego & Austin

Social Media

Balloon Juice
WaterGirl
TaMara
John Cole
DougJ (aka NYT Pitchbot)
Betty Cracker
Tom Levenson
David Anderson
Major Major Major Major
DougJ NYT Pitchbot
mistermix

Keeping Track

Legal Challenges (Lawfare)
Republicans Fleeing Town Halls (TPM)
21 Letters (to Borrow or Steal)
Search Donations from a Brand

PA Supreme Court At Risk

Donate

Site Footer

Come for the politics, stay for the snark.

  • Facebook
  • RSS
  • Twitter
  • YouTube
  • Comment Policy
  • Our Authors
  • Blogroll
  • Our Artists
  • Privacy Policy

Copyright © 2025 Dev Balloon Juice · All Rights Reserved · Powered by BizBudding Inc

Share this ArticleLike this article? Email it to a friend!

Email sent!