Come for the politics, stay for the snark.

They’re not red states to be hated; they are voter suppression states to be fixed.

Fuck these fucking interesting times.

The worst democrat is better than the best republican.

When do we start airlifting the women and children out of Texas?

Tick tock motherfuckers!

The poor and middle-class pay taxes, the rich pay accountants, the wealthy pay politicians.

“Everybody’s entitled to be an idiot.”

Nancy smash is sick of your bullshit.

Perhaps you mistook them for somebody who gives a damn.

Historically it was a little unusual for the president to be an incoherent babbling moron.

The GOP is a fucking disgrace.

Republicans don’t want a speaker to lead them; they want a hostage.

Accountability, motherfuckers.

Infrastructure week. at last.

Come for the politics, stay for the snark.

Whatever happens next week, the fight doesn’t end.

If senate republicans had any shame, they’d die of it.

Republicans do not pay their debts.

If you tweet it in all caps, that makes it true!

“Squeaker” McCarthy

Not all heroes wear capes.

The words do not have to be perfect.

if you can’t see it, then you are useless in the fight to stop it.

Hot air and ill-informed banter

You are here: Home / Past Elections / Election 2016 / The Friday Evening News Drop Begins

The Friday Evening News Drop Begins

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Russian ambassador told Moscow that Kushner wanted secret communications channel with Kremlin

Ambassador Sergei Kislyak reported to his superiors in Moscow that Kushner, then President-elect Trump’s son-in-law and confidant, made the proposal during a meeting on Dec. 1 or 2 at Trump Tower, according to intercepts of Russian communications that were reviewed by U.S. officials. Kislyak said Kushner suggested using Russian diplomatic facilities in the United States for the communications.

The meeting also was attended by Michael Flynn, Trump’s first national security adviser.

Neither the meeting nor the communications of Americans involved were under U.S. surveillance, officials said.

The Post bolded that last. So the information came from…?

This is kind of stunning. They didn’t want to be surveilled by the Americans, but they were okay with Russian communications? And this was for the campaign.

The entire idea, he [senior intel official] said, “seems extremely naïve or absolutely crazy.”

 

Reader Interactions

194Comments

  4. 4.

    dmsilev

    So, as an exercise, consider how would you distinguish this behavior from the behavior of an extremely stupid active Russian agent.

  5. 5.

    piratedan

    but her e-mails….

    and my tax cuts….

    if all of this shit ends up being substantiated, I really want to see some asses in prison but I suspect what will happen is that Trump and his family will resign, due to “health issues” and Mike Pence will pardon everyone.

  8. 8.

    TenguPhule

    Fair Trials, Sentences and Executions for these bastards. All of em, Katie!

  9. 9.

    SiubhanDuinne

    Jesus Christ (said with all respect).

    Also too, What the Everloving Blue-eyed FUCK?

  10. 10.

    TenguPhule

    @piratedan:

    but I suspect what will happen is that Trump and his family will resign, due to “health issues” and Mike Pence will pardon everyone.

    Military firing squads for the lot of them, including Pence.

    Commander is Chief does have its down side when you’re a fucking traitor.

  13. 13.

    TenguPhule

    Again, why is all this shit coming out A YEAR LATE.

    President Obama should have had Trump and company arrested on 1/20/17 and fuck the GOP’s feefees.

  14. 14.

    mike in dc

    We’re going to need a constitutional amendment to prevent ANYTHING LIKE THIS FROM EVER FUCKING HAPPENING AGAIN, EVER.

  18. 18.

    PsiFighter37

    @mike in dc: Not gonna happen. The GOP won’t let any constitutional amendment pass unless they control the 2/3 of the votes at the state level to roll back everything to the original language of the Constitution.

  24. 24.

    TenguPhule

    @mike in dc:

    We’re going to need a constitutional amendment to prevent ANYTHING LIKE THIS FROM EVER FUCKING HAPPENING AGAIN, EVER.

    Or we could intern the entire Republican party in labor camps. Which would probably be both easier and faster then an amendment.

    /satire

  27. 27.

    TenguPhule

    @Baud:

    You can’t protect voters from themselves.

    Fuck the GOP voters, let’s worry about protecting ourselves from them.

  28. 28.

    Corner Stone

    Lots of people don’t want to hear it. But we had an admin in place that swore an oath to protect this nation and uphold the Constitution against all enemies. They chose political expediency and abandoned the risks involved in not upholding that oath.

  30. 30.

    TenguPhule

    @dmsilev:

    So, as an exercise, consider how would you distinguish this behavior from the behavior of an extremely stupid active Russian agent.

    The extremely stupid Russian agent would be more coherent when speaking.

  35. 35.

    Cheryl Rofer

    [Mah kittehs really wish that the news organizations wouldn’t do this. It prevents me from sitting in the living room reading dead-tree stuff. They are now sitting impatiently on my desk and worktable.]

  36. 36.

    Jeffro

    Frum has a great take up: Donald Trump’s Moral Holiday: How four remarkable stories breaking on the same day show that GOP acquiescence means they’re going to get more of the same.

    In the annals of the Trump era, May 25, 2017, will deserve a special mark. Four remarkable things happened on Thursday, each of which marks a way that this presidency is changing the nation.

  40. 40.

    efgoldman

    @PsiFighter37:

    The GOP won’t let any constitutional amendment pass unless they control the 2/3 of the votes at the state level

    There are many crazies, but not enough to call a convention (which could, theoretically rewrite the whole document, making christofascism the state religion, outlawing public education, explicitly making white people superior, whatever fever dream the prion disease puts upon them).
    All the constitutional amendments so far have been by the congressional procedure: 2/3 of each house and then 3/4 of the states. Not every amendment gets ratified – the ERA has been out there since the 70s.

  41. 41.

    Mary G

    While this is all very satisfying, doesn’t leaking this let the Russians know we are eavesdropping, or have a mole in place, or something?

    That said, I have long thought Kushner was much more dangerous than Twitler, and it’s good to see him go down in flames. Still fuming over him not knowing they’d have to replace all the WH staff AFTER Trump had won. Born on third, thinks he hit a triple.

  42. 42.

    Jeffro

    @TenguPhule: Correction: Obama should have had the whole campaign arrested back in the summer of 2016 (but he seems to have been weighing the likelihood that the Second American Civil War would kick off at that point, vs the seeming unlikeliness that Trumpov was going to get elected)

    Now, the House GOP should have impeached Trump over the emoluments clause on 1/20/17, that is certain. And just about every day since for obstruction of justice.

  43. 43.

    Adam L Silverman

    @Waratah: More likely one of the Eastern European members of NATO, the Germans, the Brits, or the Israelis at this point. Given that the former are on edge by the lack of affirmation regarding Article 5 of the NATO charter and the latter have all been burned or insulted in the past week.

  45. 45.

    Jeffro

    @Cheryl Rofer: True enough.

    We shouldn’t worry about impeachment. Let’s keep letting the IC stuff drop, let the FBI CI investigations do their thing, and then start indicting the guilty. They’ll turn on each other like wounded hyenas.

  46. 46.

    Adam L Silverman

    @Mary G: This wasn’t the Russians. And based on the bolded portion of the reporting, it wasn’t us. Most likely one of the Eastern European members of NATO, the Germans, the Brits, or the Israelis at this point. Given that the former are on edge by the lack of affirmation regarding Article 5 of the NATO charter and the latter have all been burned or insulted in the past week.

  49. 49.

    dr. bloor

    @Mary G: They’d be pretty surprised to learn that this wasn’t picked up by someone. If not us, then someone in Europe.

    Can’t wait to hear what the boys in Berlin have sussed out over the past several months.

  50. 50.

    Corner Stone

    @Waratah:

    i have to wonder if the Russians deliberately leaked this

    I wish I could do this out loud in my best Boris & Natasha voices:
    “Ya Tink?!”

  52. 52.

    Jeffro

    @Corner Stone: I have to agree. As well-intentioned, as high-minded, as probability-minded as it probably was…it still would have been better to go way, way public with all of Russia’s efforts to date, including all the known links to the Trump campaign. And I probably would have made the same calls, so I’m not going to say any more except hindsight is 20/20 and I sure hope to see RICO kick in so that Trump dies penniless, in jail.

  56. 56.

    TenguPhule

    @Jeffro:

    They’ll turn on each other like wounded hyenas.

    Or they stick together and dare the system to try and stop them. Which has been Trump’s MO since day one.

    They don’t care about rules or laws. And too much of the system was built on voluntary compliance.

  58. 58.

    Corner Stone

    @Mary G:

    That said, I have long thought Kushner was much more dangerous than Twitler, and it’s good to see him go down in flames.

    I would argue J Kush is much less dangerous than Trump. But I still do want to see him go down in flames.

  60. 60.

    MomSense

    Jesus, a gal can’t even have a light supper and a glass of wine without another treasonous revelation.

  65. 65.

    hovercraft

    So now do you think that Twitler is beginning to understand how badly he miscalculated when he shit all over the intelligence community? Nah, he’s too dumb, he still thinks that he can beat these guys, he’s the president, he won the biggest landslide ever and no one can touch him!

  67. 67.

    Corner Stone

    @hovercraft:

    Nah, he’s too dumb, he still thinks that he can beat these guys, he’s the president, he won the biggest landslide ever and no one can touch him!

    He is forming a cocoon and will emerge as a massive Victim yeti. This has nothing to do with his actions, statements or mistakes. Someone has been out to get him this whole time! And now more lies!! More attacks that are hoaxes!!

  70. 70.

    hovercraft

    @TenguPhule:

    Or we could intern the entire Republican party in labor camps. Which would probably be both easier and faster then an amendment.

    /satire

    Fuck satire, I want my FEMA Camps!

  71. 71.

    Cheryl Rofer

    And here’s the Times’s scoop.

    Russian Once Tied to Trump Aide Seeks Immunity to Testify Before Congress

    Oleg V. Deripaska, a Russian oligarch once close to President Trump’s former campaign manager, has offered to cooperate with congressional committees investigating Russian meddling in the 2016 election, but lawmakers are unwilling to accept his conditions, according to congressional officials.

    Mr. Deripaska’s offer comes amid increased attention to his ties to Paul Manafort, who is one of several Trump associates under F.B.I. scrutiny for possible collusion with Russia during the presidential campaign. The two men did business together in the mid-2000s, when Mr. Manafort, a Republican operative, was also providing campaign advice to Kremlin-backed politicians in Ukraine. Their relationship subsequently soured and devolved into a lawsuit.

  75. 75.

    TenguPhule

    @Cheryl Rofer:

    but lawmakers are unwilling to accept his conditions, according to congressional officials.

    No quarter for any of them. They wanted to play in the big leagues. Time for them to learn that the penalties are equally big.

  78. 78.

    TenguPhule

    @hovercraft:

    So now do you think that Twitler is beginning to understand how badly he miscalculated when he shit all over the intelligence community?

    No. SATSQ.

    He’s gonna double down.

    That’s all he does.

    And where he leads, the Republicans follow.

  82. 82.

    TenguPhule

    @dm:

    Is this a new nickname for the Zombie-Eyed Granny-Starver?

    The times we live in. For every day ending in a Y.

  83. 83.

    joel hanes

    @TenguPhule:

    President Obama should have had Trump and company arrested

    Yeah, if you wanted an armed insurection with overtones of a race war,
    that’d be a good way to start it.

    Fortunately for us, that’s not what Obama wanted.

  84. 84.

    Bill E Pilgrim

    Oh man. I have no response except absurdist satire at this point.


    Oh Donny’s in the White House, cookin up the Tweets again
    I’m on the Internet, thinkin’ about the government
    the man in the trench coat, badge out, laid off
    says he’s got a memo, wants to get payback
    look out Don it’s something you did
    God knows when but you’re doing it again
    you better look through the Rolodex, looking for an old friend
    the man in the sheepskin hat in the Kremlin
    wants a billion dollar bills, you only got ten

    Oh Jared comes fleet foot, face full of empathy
    talkin’ that the heat put bugs in the embassy
    phone’s tapped anyway
    Jared says “The man he say”
    they must bust in early May, orders from the DJ …

  85. 85.

    Mary G

    I swear to God, if whichever Democrat elected in 2020 declines to prosecute in the interests of looking forward, not back, heads will roll. Obama’s failure to go after the big banks is a small part of all this.

  86. 86.

    Calouste

    @Cheryl Rofer: Are the GOP unwilling to give him immunity because they don’t think he deserves it, or because they don’t want him to testify?

  87. 87.

    TenguPhule

    @joel hanes:

    Yeah, if you wanted an armed insurection with overtones of a race war,
    that’d be a good way to start it.

    At least we would have started out from a really good position.

    We’re gonna get that civic breakdown anyway, and the timing is going to be much much worse.

  88. 88.

    rikyrah

    Richmond students rise above — on a private jet to L.A.

    By Otis R. Taylor Jr.

    May 26, 2017

    A line of black SUVs — looking like the motorcade of a dignitary or celebrity — parked at the curb of a hangar at the Buchanan Field in Concord.

    But the occupants weren’t famous. They were middle-school students from Richmond arriving for a flight on a private jet.

    As they walked into the hangar, businessmen carrying briefcases and duffel bags looked up in surprise to see the students settling into the leather seats in the JetSuiteX lounge.

    By being the most improved students at their schools, the 19 students earned the private flight coordinated by For Richmond, a nonprofit organization dedicated to improving Richmond, and JetSuiteX, a company that runs short-haul flights from Concord to Burbank and Las Vegas.

    For about half of the students, it was their first time on the plane — and their first time traveling outside of the Bay Area.

    It was the inaugural flight of “LA for a Day,” a program For Richmond hopes will let students see the possibilities that lie beyond their neighborhoods. If you want to change the course of at-risk youths’ lives, show them what’s hovering above and beyond their world.

    But you’ve just got to get them on the plane first.

    ……………………….

    Kyra Worthy, For Richmond’s executive director, met Alex Wilcox, the JetSuiteX CEO, at a luncheon. Wilcox told her he was looking for a nonprofit to work with, and he asked Worthy to think of something that made sense in Richmond.

    The idea took off from there. Worthy plans to take high school students on a flight to tour colleges in Los Angeles. And in the fall, she wants to take local high school football players to a UCLA football game. Takkarist McKinley, a graduate of Richmond’s Kennedy High School and a recent first-round pick by the NFL’s Atlanta Falcons, played at UCLA.

    “This is showing that we can do anything,” Worthy said. “Sometimes the kids, they’re embarrassed being from Richmond, because they don’t hear too many positive things about it.”

    Messiah Espinoza, 12, told me she likes jets.

    “I’ve just never been on one,” said Messiah, who attends King Elementary School and was the lone elementary school student on the trip. “I’m ready to go.”

  89. 89.

    West of the Rockies (been a while)

    @Adam L Silverman:

    Adam, can you bottom-line this? Is this a potential criminal event or just a weird thing the administration can once again just whitewash? How big a deal is this?

  91. 91.

    mike in dc

    My fear is not that the truth won’t be discovered. My fear is that, when it becomes clear how wide and deep the scandal is, the Democrats will take their foot off the neck of the establishment GOP and let (most of) them off the hook politically(and possibly legally too).

  92. 92.

    rikyrah

    Maxine Waters‏Verified account @MaxineWaters

    Jared Kushner is under scrutiny in the FBI’s Trump-Russia investigation. In other news, water is wet.

  96. 96.

    TenguPhule

    @mike in dc:

    My fear is that, when it becomes clear how wide and deep the scandal is, the Democrats will take their foot off the neck of the establishment GOP and let (most of) them off the hook politically(and possibly legally too).

    Extremely Doubtful. Say what you will about the Democratic weak knees, flat out treason is not something even the wobbliest is gonna want to have any part of condoning by forgiveness.

    It helps that the GOP already pruned out those Blue Dogs closest to them.

  98. 98.

    TenguPhule

    @Gin & Tonic:

    Why the fuck does Deripaska want immunity? All he has to do is leave the country.

    Because he wants to stay out of Putin’s reach. And that is one very long reach.

  103. 103.

    Baud

    I can see the circular firing squad forming. It’s like watching one of those tornado videos.

  104. 104.

    Adam L Silverman

    @West of the Rockies (been a while): I’m not sure. I know a lot about the clearance process from going through it. I know a lot about clearance versus access because I live and work in that world. But I’m not a lawyer and don’t specialize in those issues. Brad Moss who specializes in this stuff and is a lawyer had this to say:

  105. 105.

    rikyrah

    @mike in dc:

    My fear is not that the truth won’t be discovered. My fear is that, when it becomes clear how wide and deep the scandal is, the Democrats will take their foot off the neck of the establishment GOP and let (most of) them off the hook politically(and possibly legally too).

    UH UH UH

    GET ALL OF THEM.

  107. 107.

    Gin & Tonic

    @TenguPhule: He can certainly reach NY if he wants. How did Sergei Krivov die, anyway? He can reach London. He can reach anywhere Deripaska can go.

  108. 108.

    Cheryl Rofer

    @clay: LOL
    @Calouste: A lot of possible reasons. Immunity to testify in Congress could interfere with other prosecutions. They may feel they have the information that he is offering already, from other sources. They may think that he doesn’t have as much to offer as he claims (although this seems improbable).
    @West of the Rockies (been a while): @Sanjeevs: That’s the big question. Dan Drezner speculates on Twitter that Jared talked to Henry Kissinger and got the idea that a backchannel would be cool. That’s a kind interpretation. It’s hard to come up with anything that doesn’t involve some variety of lawbreaking. The rush may have been because Obama was clearly going to levy more sanctions on Russia before he left office. The answers to your questions will determine the lengths of prison sentences.

  114. 114.

    Adam L Silverman

    @Sanjeevs: It is not unusual for formal contacts during the transition. They are supposed to be run through the State Department. A liaison office/officer (LNO) is established, and was this time as well, to facilitate this process. This includes having career personnel prepare and deliver key leader engagement (KLE) and specific subject backgrounder briefings prior to the call, use of secure State Department communications equipment, etc. The Trump transition refused all of these offers. This was strange, but seemed to be partially explainable by the President and his people not expecting to win and none of them having any experience in government at any level.

    Wanting to establish a backchannel, however, is very strange. It is way outside the lines and makes little sense unless one is planning on doing something highly unusual that was outside the bounds.

  116. 116.

    MomSense

    @Cheryl Rofer:

    I’m going to get breaking news butt from sitting in front of my damned tv all the time waiting for the next big scoop.

  119. 119.

    PaulWartenberg

    Ambassador Sergei Kislyak reported to his superiors in Moscow that Kushner, then President-elect Trump’s son-in-law and confidant, made the proposal during a meeting on Dec. 1 or 2 at Trump Tower, according to intercepts of Russian communications that were reviewed by U.S. officials. Kislyak said Kushner suggested using Russian diplomatic facilities in the United States for the communications.

    HOW THE F-CK IS THIS NOT TREASON?

  120. 120.

    Mary G

    @Major Major Major Major: Doesn’t matter. They paid big settlements, so they did something wrong. But failure to have some CEOs perp walked, whether they got off later or not, gave people the impression Obama was bought off by Goldman Sachs, et al. There was certainly enough robosigning, foreclosing on people by mistake, and other stuff.

  123. 123.

    West of the Rockies (been a while)

    @Cheryl Rofer:

    Thanks, Cheryl. I hope Kushner is sweating bullets.

    I suspect we all know people who self identify as Republican. We’re probably related to some of them. We know some of them to be kind, caring people. But a god damned line has been crossed. Tribalism aside, I don’t know how any of those kind and caring Repubs can continue to support this crap.

  124. 124.

    TenguPhule

    @Adam L Silverman:

    It is way outside the lines and makes little sense unless one is planning on doing something highly unusual that was outside the bounds.

    Is that a polite way of saying they’re fucking traitors trying to contact the Motherland?

  126. 126.

    PaulWartenberg

    @Calouste:

    Are the GOP unwilling to give him immunity because they don’t think he deserves it, or because they don’t want him to testify?

    It’s possible they’ve got enough on him to make him talk anyway and plead out to lesser charges.

  127. 127.

    Suffragette City

    So it’s looking like Kislyak probably laughed up his sleeve at the suggestion. Then the next meeting with Erik Prince took place. Wonder what came of that one and if we’ll find out.

  128. 128.

    TenguPhule

    @Cheryl Rofer:

    This explains why Trump uses Jared instead of his Secretaries of Defense and State, and refuses to staff up those departments.

    “I have agreed to have Russian Peacekeepers secure our dangerous streets in America! Since our Military is so SAD and NOT WINNING!”

    /I thought I was joking when I first suggested this

  129. 129.

    West of the Rockies (been a while)

    @MomSense:

    Do you suffer from painful “Breaking News Butt”? Are you embarrassed to show your diminished keister in public? Talk to your doctor about Nuzleara….

  131. 131.

    PaulWartenberg

    @Cheryl Rofer:

    That’s part of it. but it’s also the practice of dictators to use/rely on family members for the important devious stuff because blood (or marriage) equals loyalty. trump is using Jared because he can’t really trust any of his lackeys (and his habit of firing them for even minor failures means he can’t give them enough information or power that could backfire on him).

  132. 132.

    Jeffro

    @rikyrah:

    GET ALL OF THEM.

    Seconded. If someone needs a break from holding their boot on the GOP’s neck, I’ll be there to spell ’em for however long it takes.

  135. 135.

    SatanicPanic

    @TenguPhule: yeah, there’s a point when even the most lazy establishment Dem will get mad. It helps that a lot of them are old cold-war people. They’re not having this.

  138. 138.

    Comrade Colette Collaboratrice

    @Mary G:

    [Kushner] Born on third, thinks he hit a triple.

    Born halfway between third and home plate, currently caught in a squeeze play but thinks he’s about to steal home in a blaze of glory.

  141. 141.

    Adam L Silverman

    @TenguPhule: It is saying I don’t actually know what they’re up to, but from what I do know from the reporting it is not good.

  143. 143.

    p.a.

    Oh c’mon, Kushy was just working on an exclusive deal for Trump Vodka and Caviar. Why do moonbats hate capitalism? Gulag labor is economical.

  144. 144.

    rikyrah

    Malcolm Nance IS the truth!

    Telling it like it is.

    Kushner needs his security clearance REVOKED.

    The White Dude is like, ‘ well, we don’t know their intent’..

    Malcolm is like.. ‘ phuck that…revoke the clearance.’

  145. 145.

    Another Scott

    @SiubhanDuinne: I don’t know any of them, of course, but Donnie and his hangers-ons’ actions tell me a compelling story:

    All Kushner cares about is the grift. Daddy won the big prize, so Kushner wanted a direct line to Vlad to make as much money as possible as quickly as possible.

    He’s the same as Trump, except he doesn’t (yet) have the overbearing desire for adulation and total fealty. It’s all about money with Jared.

    Jared’s not going to let something like norms or conventions or (now) even an oath to the USA or protect classified information prevent him from looting the Treasury and taking money from anyone who will give it (no matter what they want in return).

    Scorpion, frog, etc., etc.

    Here’s hoping Mueller finds all the connections and throws the book at these monsters who are trying to destroy the country while they loot everything we have built over generations…

    Grr…

    Cheers,
    Scott.

  148. 148.

    manyakitty

    @rikyrah: Brilliant. Keep on with these stories of hope. We’ll need things to cling to in the dark days ahead.

  149. 149.

    Roger Moore

    @PsiFighter37:

    Also, amendments expire if not ratified within 10 years – the ERA is long dead.

    Newer amendments include language that restricts their ratification time. They didn’t always do that, which is how the 27th Amendment managed to get ratified more then 200 years after it passed Congress.

  150. 150.

    Adam L Silverman

    @rikyrah: 1) He has an interim clearance. 2) It should be suspended/revoked pending investigation. This is what would happen under normal circumstances. The President has the authority to override this and insist that Kushner get cleared and be given access. If this happens I would expect the IC to go into full revolt.

  154. 154.

    jl

    @Adam L Silverman: @Steve in the ATL:

    The Trump campaign already had backchannel communications with the Russians. We knew that already. This news makes it sound like they wanted their own super secret redphone line to the Russians, hosted by Russian diplomatic stations in the US.

  157. 157.

    TenguPhule

    @Adam L Silverman:

    If this happens I would expect the IC to go into full revolt.

    So twice as many stories released each day? Or something a little more proactive?

  158. 158.

    Adam L Silverman

    This is a very accurate take by Josh Marshall that this really is not a backchannel. Rather it is the attempt to use a foreign adversary’s secure communications systems to communicate in a way that is completely compartmented from everyone and everything.

  162. 162.

    Steve in the ATL

    @Adam L Silverman:

    If this happens I would expect the IC to go into full revolt.

    Have they stepped up their game since the Castro days? Otherwise, it’s all just a cruel tease.

  163. 163.

    LongHairedWeirdo

    Neither the meeting nor the communications of Americans involved were under U.S. surveillance, officials said.

    The Post bolded that last. So the information came from…?

    Um… the surveillance of the Russian ambassador?

    That’s the story: the Russian Ambassador said to Russia “hey, I met these two guys, they want a secure communication channel”.

  164. 164.

    Another Scott

    @Adam L Silverman: Why not Canada? I would assume they’re capable of monitoring such things, and probably have good agents in DC and NYC. Could have been almost any modern state that’s a member of NATO, couldn’t it?

    Donnie has properties in Canada, and of course, they’re not doing well.

    More from the WaPo story linked above:

    The Post was first alerted in mid-December [about 2 weeks after the meeting] to the meeting by an anonymous letter, which said, among other things, that Kushner had talked to Kislyak about setting up the communications channel. This week, officials who reviewed the letter and spoke on the condition of anonymity to discuss sensitive intelligence said the portion about the secret channel was consistent with their understanding of events.

    For instance, according to those officials and the letter, Kushner conveyed to the Russians that he was aware that it would be politically sensitive to meet publicly, but it was necessary for the Trump team to be able to continue their communication with Russian government officials.

    In addition to their discussion about setting up the communications channel, Kushner, Flynn and Kislyak also talked about arranging a meeting between a representative of Trump and a “Russian contact” in a third country whose name was not identified, according to the anonymous letter.

    The Post reported in April that Erik Prince, the former founder of the private security firm Blackwater and an informal adviser to the Trump transition team, met on Jan. 11 — nine days before Trump’s inauguration — in the Seychelles islands in the Indian Ocean with a representative of Russian President Vladimir Putin.

    The Seychelles is part of the (formerly British) Commonwealth (as is Canada).

    I honestly have no idea who is the source of the letter and the WaPo story. I wouldn’t be surprised, though, if Canada got wind of something that Jared was up to, passed it on to their counterparts in the USA, and someone in the US IC leaked it to a friendly reporter at the Post.

    It’s safe to expect that this won’t be the last leak, no matter how much Donnie stamps his feet about it.

    Cheers,
    Scott.

  165. 165.

    joel hanes

    @Corner Stone:

    Then what did he want?

    Obama has not confided this particular bit to me, but I would suspect

    – to preserve the union
    – to preserve civil order
    – for the nation’s open racial wounds to scab over after he left office
    – a better electorate than we in fact have

  166. 166.

    Mnemosyne

    @jl:

    This news makes it sound like they wanted their own super secret redphone line to the Russians, hosted by Russian diplomatic stations in the US.

    I think that’s what Josh Marshall is saying in the tweet Adam highlighted above.

  168. 168.

    Sanjeevs

    This story about the super secret channel makes me wonder again about that story that Obama team catching Trumps team copying data in a SCIF. Then they restricted access to info including plans for dealing with crises.
    Bet we’ll be hearing more on that later.

  170. 170.

    jl

    @Sanjeevs: Thanks for reminding me of that.

    I wonder if the Senate request for documents includes the stuff they stole out secure executive branch facilities during the transition?

  171. 171.

    Sanjeevs

    One other possibility why the existing communication channels between Trump and the Russians wasn’t sufficient – the Russians knew about the dossier but not the names of the moles. If they wanted Flynn to find and deliver those names they needed something way more secure than used previously..

  173. 173.

    TenguPhule

    @amk:

    yeah, why didn’t obama bring out the tumbrels, right?

    An arrest would have been nice and warranted given just how much fucking evidence was apparently ALREADY KNOWN.

    But sure, taking the high road sure worked out well for the nation, didn’t it?

    /And yes, that’s sarcasm directed at you amk.

  174. 174.

    marv

    well, yeah, we can do all this stuff, but maybe also we can finally get a little real: “I am so miserable under Trump, it is so awful”, etc. But I think also it is true that as an average white person (which I am) my life in 2017 is a whole lot better than it was for an average black person in, say, 1936 when our second or third greatest president by pretty much all accounts (FDR) was in office (and I just have to add, pretty obviously did not give one good goddam about Jim Crow)

  175. 175.

    LongHairedWeirdo

    @TenguPhule: Note the qualifier: The *establishment* GOP – not the actual perps.

    Look: All of this sort of thing was clear, and obvious, and warned about: Trump couldn’t be trusted, he was a braggart and a fool, and playing kissy-face with Putin (I prefer Colbert’s formulation, though, while I don’t think it was *intended* as homophobic, I can’t deny that’s how it would play), and that he wasn’t willing to remove himself from huge conflicts of interest.

    That he may *also* have been willing to turn a blind eye to treason? It’s kind of like “it’s okay if a recent driving school graduate wants to go joyriding in a high powered sports car while blowing .30 BAC – OH! Unless he’s intending to drop off a drug delivery to his contact.” The first part is so indescribably stupid that the second is kind of an afterthought. “Oh, I never thought he would *also* be assisting in smuggling drugs!” is such a pathetic excuse at that point.

    All the GOP had to do was say that a compete incompetent with a record of cheating people and who is likely a serial sexual harasser, if not rapist, should not be President. They couldn’t even do that. The mainstream GOP needs Trump hung around their neck. “You know what? You’re right. You *did* build that!”

    And they did. They supported pointless wars, torture, “Why do liberals want Terri Schiavo to die?”, “Obama is lawless,” “Obama is incompetent,” “Hillary Clinton, whom we have no reason to suspect committed any crime, yeah, SHE’S A CRIMINAL! LOCK HER UP!”

    They built this, brick by fucking brick. It’s theirs. And they need their noses rubbed in it. (This is actually a bad idea for dogs, but I don’t see any reason to worry about it with the GOP.)

  176. 176.

    TenguPhule

    @LongHairedWeirdo:

    The *establishment* GOP – not the actual perps.

    So far it looks like the establishment are the perps. Or at a minimum aiding and abetting.

  177. 177.

    Another Scott

    @Adam L Silverman: The letter went to the WaPo in mid-December. ;-) I assume the WaPo reporters have been trying to tie down other leads, get people to confirm, etc., over the last 6 months.

    As you say, this stuff takes time. Or it does when the targets are minimally competent. With Jared and Donnie, who knows. Maybe Mueller will have his report done by July 4 at the rate things are going…

    (sigh)

    Cheers,
    Scott.

  179. 179.

    LongHairedWeirdo

    @TenguPhule: Shrug. The Dems keep wanting things to go back to “normal”. They think there *is* a normal that’s acceptable, if only a more rational Republican had been the candidate, if only they’d won control of the Senate….

    They are quite likely to be too foolish to say things like “aiding and abetting”, even if they are given a clean opening and it’s clear the accusation is fair and just.

  181. 181.

    Bill Arnold

    @?BillinGlendaleCA:

    I’m not sure I understand this, this was in December. The campaign was over, Trump was president*-elect.

    Technically, the WaPo was wrong here: he was not president-elect until (arguably) the electoral college voted (Dec 19) or (definitely) early January (Jan 6) when the Congress “counted” the electoral votes. So there was a window where something could have been done politically. Won’t try to predict the alt-history outcome, though.

  182. 182.

    TenguPhule

    @amk:

    Of course, you would think obama just orders the arrest and it happens.

    Who was still in charge of the AG?

    Hint, it sure as hell wasn’t Sessions.

  184. 184.

    Davis X. Machina

    Trump, uniquely among postwar US presidents, realizes that we need to embrace Russia, not intimidate it.

    Russian cooperation was, and is, badly needed on a number of issues of importance to true progressives, whether it’s ME security, the Iran deal, climate, or — and this is the big one — keeping Mrs. Clinton out of the White House.

    Jared was just taking necessary steps towards those important ends. Sometimes the mir i druzhba gets out of hand, is all.

    Hey, it’s all I’ve got.

  185. 185.

    amk

    @TenguPhule: You can keep fucking that chicken. Thankfully, Obama knew the limitations to his power and the constitution unlike the arrest/tumbrel them all kneejerks like you.

  187. 187.

    randy khan

    @Roger Moore:

    There is some question about whether language limiting the time for ratification is enforceable, but no amendment that hadn’t been ratified by the deadline has gotten enough additional states (well, any) to make the question come up.

    ERA advocates are still trying to get ratification, for what it’s worth.

  189. 189.

    J R in WV

    @PaulWartenberg:

    HOW THE F-CK IS THIS NOT TREASON?

    Some people say it can’t be treason unless we’re at war with the country on who’s behalf the “might be treason” was committed. Like Germany or Japan in 1943, for example.

    Others (like me) believe that collaborating with an enemy, which Russia/Putin clearly is, is close enough to the Constitutional definition of treason – though no one was accused of treason during the Cold War, just all the lessor crimes with identical definitions, espionage, etc.

  192. 192.

    sukabi

    @Sanjeevs: they wanted to cut the state department and intelligence communities out of the loop…only reason to do that is for private, non governmental reasons…say money laundering, human trafficking, drug and gun running….you know, that kind of thing.

  194. 194.

    TenguPhule

    @amk: I will attribute your stupidity to basic lack of reading comprehension.

    There was more then enough evidence to start making arrests and doing a full investigation. That you refuse to recognize that doesn’t speak well for you.

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