Guys, I didn’t just fall off the turnip truck. I’m Aware of All Internet Traditions and know I must present my pets for inspection. Meet Echo the basenji.
Poor Echo was a hard-luck case. When her original parents had a new baby, she was tossed out of the house to live in the backyard. You can’t do that with a basenji, especially not one like Echo, who needs a steady infusion of cuddles throughout the day. She became an expert escape artist and roamed her New Orleans neighborhood, a lovable vagrant searching for food scraps, unwary squirrels, and human affection. Her owners decided to do the responsible thing and relinquish her to a breed rescue. She arrived at our house coming down off of a bunch of mood-altering medications she didn’t need, which her previous owners put her on in a last-ditch effort to make things work. She’s snappish and unpredictable at times, but getting better all the time.
I would grow my beard down to my knees if left to my own devices, but for some reason my wife does not want to be married to Gabby Hayes. She is a dab hand with the old trimmer and neatens up my beard every two to three weeks. What does this have to do with Echo? From the time we got her, the beard trim has always stirred great pity and concern in her little heart. I know she is concerned on my behalf and not her own, because she doesn’t flee the trimmer like she does the Dread Vacuum. She insists on sticking close to my side while I undergo this cruel ordeal, nuzzling her head under my hand and making sure I know she’s there to stabilize me and help me through my difficult time.
Update:How did WP eat this in the first place? Anyway, here is the fund that’s split between all eventual
Democratic nominees in House districts currently held by Republicans so maybe Echo does not have to suffer under the idiot tyranny of Darin LaHood come 2019.
Sandia Blanca
Oh my goodness, those pics are so cute!
Sebastian
In the great tradition of this blog, let me be the first to properly welcome you. Fuck you! I think that is the proper protocol. Now with that out of the way, cute doggies!!
Welcome to this home of unruly jackals.
Mnemosyne
I had a writer friend who had a Basenji. I wanted to love him, but he never warmed up to me. Alas.
Mnemosyne
@Sebastian:
I think the canonical greeting around here is, “Go fuck yourself.” ?
Spanky
Hi-larious.
West of the Rockies (been a while)
@Mnemosyne:
The writer friend or the dog?
JR
Was the dog named for the Pink Floyd song?
bemused
Echo has a hilariously expressive face.
Even if the breed is a handful, it’s easy to see why they are so appealing.
West of the Rockies (been a while)
Anyone see the horse shit Tony Perkins has been spewing about Trump’s Mulligan?
Roger Moore
Testing our knowledge of song lyrics is also a good place to start. “Echoes” from Meddle.
Overhead the albatross hangs motionless upon the air
And deep beneath the rolling waves in labyrinths of coral caves
The echo of a distant tide comes willowing across the sand
And everything is green and submarine
Kristine
Helloooo, Echoooooo!!
Helllloooooo….
Great pics, and welcome to the din.
Mnemosyne
@West of the Rockies (been a while):
I knew that would be confusing. The writer friend was a straight woman like myself, so it was the dog who never warmed up to me.
jimmiraybob
@West of the Rockies (been a while): I believe that it is a verse from the little known and underappreciated Jesus’ “Sermon on the Back Nine.” Sometimes referred to as a morality for every situation.
efgoldman
@Mnemosyne:
JS isn’t really new here. He’s been commenting, sometimes under variants of his nym, for about as long as I’ve been here (ca. 2006).
Nevertheless, he can certainly go fuck himself, as can one and all.
Mnemosyne
Also, too, I would like to take this opportunity to take a victory lap after people worried that the Golden Globes’ weird categorization of Get Out would hurt its Oscar chances, because I called it. Best Original Screenplay, Best Actor, Best Director, and Best Picture.
bemused
@West of the Rockies (been a while):
Bah! Horrid people using religion to justify their vileness.
Major Major Major Major
@efgoldman: Fuck you.
My brother had a basenji, Fred, when I was a kid. The only two things Fred was nice to were my sheltie and my brother. Fred was very smart but very cranky. (My sheltie was dumb as toast but very sweet.)
Yarrow
Your puppies are adorable! Love how Echo is so concerned about you and the beard trimmer. You can see it in her eyes. Awww….
rikyrah
those pictures are so sweet
rikyrah
@West of the Rockies (been a while):
They are totally being exposed as the frauds that they are.
” Men of God.”
Whatever.
Mnemosyne
@Major Major Major Major:
For some reason, dogs in the herding group really love me. I used to take care of a friend’s Sheltie in college (Typo! I miss her) and when I went to a large group meeting at a screenwriter’s house, his Border Collies all decided I was their new BFF and one of them insisted on sitting on my lap for most of the meeting.
ETA: Maybe they sense my ADHD and think I need some herding assistance. ?
Jewish Steel
@Sebastian:
@Mnemosyne: I’m tearing up!
@JR: Nah, she came with the name. Since we rescue I haven’t been able name a single one for myself.
Mike E
You gotta love a dog whose arched eyebrow says everything
TaMara (HFG)
Ooooo, doggy! Day made, thanks for pix and story….
zhena gogolia
Ooh, I’m in love with that doggie!
Jewish Steel
@Roger Moore: I have a post ready to go that is such a perfect synthesis of song title and content that I wonder if I shouldn’t just hang it up after I do it. Go out in a blaze.
@efgoldman: True! Although I don’t think I’ve been around quite that long. But who knows? Time seems to be accelerating with each year somehow…
trollhattan
That doggie has quite the face! “Hello, hooman. It’s my time now, m’kay?”
BTW the Pink Floyd dog name is Seamus, at least the one dog song I’m aware of.
West of the Rockies (been a while)
@rikyrah:
They are horrible, wretched people.
Oh, and is the proper BJ response to FU “Up yours”?
Roger Moore
@Jewish Steel:
Maybe you’ll have a great peak that way, but the route to the Front Pager HOF is racking up Value Over Replacement Poster.
trollhattan
Wow, Lady Bird scores five nominations. Go Greta!
Roger Moore
@trollhattan:
That’s the only one I can think of. It’s even from the same album as Echoes, so that’s a plus. The dogs in “Dogs” are only figurative.
danielx
@efgoldman:
There’s the extended version: go take a flying fuck at a rolling doughnut.
dimmsdale
HI JS, and thanks for your post on the noble Basenji. my next-door apartment neighbors got one as a very young puppy. I’d hear them go out, then I’d hear a sound like a nest full of tiny tiny mice, yowling their tiny tiny lungs out. Fast forward to today, and the noble Basenji next door yowls nice, full-throated yowls the second the outer door shuts behind the departing owner. Fortunately they discovered a stuffed toy with a battery-operated heartbeat, so our noble Basenji settles down with that whenever the owners are out for a prolonged period of time. Like Echo, he’s a cute little guy, friendly, inquisitive, and very smart. (glad they discovered the toy with the heartbeat, though. That guy can SING when left alone!!)
Patricia Kayden
Echo is so cute!! Great that she landed in such a loving home after her rough start. For some reason, the first two photos are upside down.
Amir Khalid
I have to say, I admire you for agreeing to become a frontpager. I’ve been invited a time or two, but have never worked up the nerve to do it. (And before anyone asks again, I doubt I ever will.)
Adria McDowell
Doggo is cute!!!
danielx
@Amir Khalid:
In my experience the FPers don’t get that much grief; the bloodshed is usually fratricidal.
Major Major Major Major
@danielx: Why don’t you go take a flying fuck at the moooon!
@danielx:
Except for Cole, mistermix, and Doug!.
Kay
He’s cute. If I ever get another dog I’m getting a dog like that one.
Amir Khalid
@West of the Rockies (been a while):
That phrase reminds me of Orlando Jones and his soft-drink commercials: “Make 7-Up yours!”
efgoldman
@Jewish Steel:
Maybe, maybe not. That seems to be the time frame where I showed up here (linked from insufferable Sully, of all places) and when I first became acquainted with many of the regulars. OTOH, I was spending a lot of time at Obsidian Wings back in the day, and there was a lot of cross-pollination.
Jewish Steel
@dimmsdale: Can they ever. Here is Echo’s brother Cisco and the OB (Original Basenji) herself, Shiva.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Jp8DmG_tULg
ruemara
Welcome, Echo! Aren’t you sweet and cute? You are! Purty, handsome and a good support dog! Yes, you are! So nice to meet you!
oh, hey, … Steel or whatever.
Jewish Steel
@Amir Khalid: Do it! I’ve always read your comments with interest.
Tim C.
@efgoldman: We really should have a South Park style song of greeting for new front pagers. Something upbeat and inspiring while also incredibly profane.
barb 2
I love, love, love Basenjis! We had one, she passed in 2005. So all through the 90s our home was ruled by a Basenji. She would sit on my spousal unit’s lap when he came home from work and would explain her day to him. When she would turn and give me a dirty look — I knew she was rating me out for something. She never talked to me, but she talked to a good friend. Basenjis don’t bark but they can make other sounds. She loved to ride in the car and always got excited when she saw horses or cows. We miss her — she was very smart and thus was a challenge.
This breed is from Africa and the story goes that an English chap was in Africa during WWII out in the bush looking for Nazis. Instead, he saw a dog jumping up from a patch of tall grass to look at the strange people. The English are known to be big dog lovers. The English chap recognized the dog as the extinct breed == Basenji. So he changed his search objective from Nazi to follow that dog. The village was home to lots of Basenjis who had trained their people well. Basenjis were imported into England and re-recognized as a breed. They are an old dog breed — depicted on the walls of ancient Egypt’s buildings.
They are a challenge but worth it — you have to adapt to them. Our Basenji loved her Chihuahua and cat. She raised the cat — he was 10 days old when we found him. I miss her.
Kay
Maybe too hard for me, since I failed with the (latest) cat. She was probably looking for consistent leadership. I do like sighthounds though.
Jewish Steel
@ruemara: This was almost 20 years ago: I walked into a local bodega that I had never been in before with my original basenji. “Shiva!” they cried when they saw her. They had no idea who I was. I found out later my roommates had brought her in a couple of times. You’re persona non grata when you travel with a charismatic dog.
bemused
@West of the Rockies (been a while):
I read/skimmed that politico piece but it’s gotten so tiresome reading about their feelings. What comes through in this and so many other pieces is their resentment of liberals, anyone not their brand of rightwing. They feel persecuted by the left, poor babies. I’ve seen this resentment expressed so many times from the well-known to locals. They love it when they think they’ve angered liberals, gotten under their skin in some way as if they have won something. Sticking it to liberals is a huge motivator for them and I think many of their republican “principles” are almost incidental to their war on liberals.
Mary G
Echo is a star, keep those pictures and stories coming!That concerned face is priceless. I turned the tablet over to see the first picture, only to have it flip around more times than I like to admit. D’ohh!
Jewish Steel
@barb 2: Aw, sounds like you had a very sweet girl. Our basenjis would murder a cat no questions asked, unfortunately.
@Kay: That quote is 100% spot-on. They are a high-energy hound handful until they are about 8. Then they mellow a little.
Shana
Or the parents when the grandparents visit.
Alex
We have a Basenji mix, and that book photo looks pretty familiar! She hates having her claws clipped, and we usually let her wear them down on her own. But with the ground being frozen, her dewclaws don’t get enough digging action. So last night we combined the cone of shame and a heavy wool blanket to clip them without having her opinion of our temerity taken out of our hides. You wouldn’t think a 14 year old dog would have so much fight in her!
pinacacci
Lovely beard story!
opiejeanne
@Major Major Major Major: And AngryBlackLady. And didn’t we have TNC here briefly? The attacks were terrible.
mart
I have issues with Jewish Steel, what with the contempt shown old men with Eric Clapton stuck in their heads.
Jewish Steel
@opiejeanne: ABL got it bad. That was shameful.
@Mary G: She figured out upside-down dog cracked us up from the beginning so it’s part of her repertoire.
@Alex: We have accustomed the boys (we have two other basenjis) to the dremmel for their nails and they’re pretty good now. Lots of treats is the secret. And patience. Echo has to be muzzled and have a jar of baby food stuffed in her face while we do her. She growls the whole time too. But, after 18 mos she is getting a little more relaxed with the process.
Jewish Steel
@mart: Hate the player, sure. But not his dog!
Gravenstone
@Major Major Major Major: Well, they’re all the same guy, so …
The Moar You Know
I am hoping that the basenji that used to terrorize my street was an aberration. We were all thrilled when he and his owner moved. I have met very few dogs that were dangerous; he was dangerous. Kids, other animals, humans. He would go after anyone and he hurt a few dogs and humans in his brief tenure in our neighborhood. His owner was not helpful, downplayed and did not acknowledge that he had a dangerous dog on his hands (which is the worst part, you can keep a tiger in your house for all I care just so long as the fucker can’t get out).
They are born hunters and one of the oldest dog breeds on the planet, and a mean basenji is bad news.
Anyhow, welcome to the front page, JS! Echo obviously adores you; I’ve seen that look in a dog’s eyes before, and the recipient is a lucky, lucky person.
@Jewish Steel: I have a golden that is charismatic beyond belief. You’re not kidding. Took him to the bank. Now they never stop. Walk in the door: “where’s your dog?” Took him to get my oil changed. The freaking dealership empties out. Literally. I had twenty people around me begging to pet and take pics of the dog (of course I said yes!) I was a working musician for a few years and always dreamed of the kind of reception my dog gets just going to the damn bank. It’s awesome.
donnah
I love the protective possessiveness your dog shows when you get a beard trimming. We had a yellow lab mix who was very loving and sweet, but if we tussled or wrassled with our young sons, he immediately jumped in to defend them and protect them from harm. He would take either me or my husband by the sleeve or shirt tail and pull us off the boys, growling deep in his throat. It wasn’t a scary growl, just a warning.
Gravenstone
@opiejeanne: Dunno about TNC, but Zandar had some hellacious stalkers who abused anything not nailed down.
skyweaver
Either you are an amazing pet photographer or Echo wins Most Photogenic Dog Ever. Loved every single pic
LAO
Echo is adorable. A bassenji puppy joined my dogwalker’s pack about 2 months ago and has proven to be a troublemaker and bad influence on my well-behaved dog. JK — according to the DW, my Maggie is a horrible influence on the little guy.
Welcome to the front page
Jewish Steel
@The Moar You Know: What a shite owner that is. One of our B’s is other dog aggressive and we keep a tight lid on him 24/7.
Jewish Steel
@Gravenstone: Funny how ABL and Zandar both got it pretty hard. I wonder if they have anything in common…
Although to be fair the commenters rightfully roasted Freddie and ED Kain.
Roger Moore
@Major Major Major Major:
Plus the ones who got so much grief they were more or less driven off the site. Some of that was deserved (like Freddie deBoring) but a lot of it was from malicious stalker trolls trying to run off valuable front pagers like Angry Black Lady.
Jewish Steel
@skyweaver: She has gigantic eyes and weighs as much as a feather. Like any supermodel.
@LAO: Good owner! Socializing them is so important. Otherwise they end up weird, angry little loners. Like some other species I can think of.
opiejeanne
@Gravenstone: Zander! I’m sure that was who I meant. I mean, could we really have had TNC here? My memory is terrible.
trollhattan
@The Moar You Know:
Our GSP is the World’s Happiest Dog and even non-dog people want to meet him when they see that butt wiggling at 120 HZ. Every other dog we’ve had has been cool to strangers, which is a problem when you have a Dalmation that is guaranteed to attract each child within 200 yards. Kids who can’t yet say “mama” somehow know “Dalmatian!” I blame Disney.
geg6
Echo is way too cute.
Capri
I am a basenji owner too! Great dogs, although the 3 words “not for everyone” hide a War and Peace sized novel about their quirks. I’ve had other much more trainable dogs, but none smarter.
rikyrah
THE RACHEL MADDOW SHOW 1/22/18
Wray threatened to quit over pressure to fire McCabe: Axios
Benjamin Wittes, MSNBC legal analyst, talks with Rachel Maddow about a new Axios report that FBI Director Wray stood up to pressure from A.G. Sessions to fire Deputy Director McCabe and threatened to quit over the matter.
The Moar You Know
@Gravenstone: Just the one, but IMHO that one was bad enough to justify law enforcement intervention. I was scared for him.
@Jewish Steel: EVERY owner of a dangerous dog I’ve ever met is like that. They’re why the dog is dangerous. You’re willing to call the dog for what it is, the guy trying to rehab them. Cannot give you enough respect for that.
I raise for GDB and do rally training with my golden, so we get exposed to a lot of dogs. The GDB dogs are never an issue, of course. I quit taking mine to the local dog park after some incidents which were going bad but I intervened, once over the objections of the other dog’s owner “you just gotta let ’em fight it out!” Fuck you, buddy. My dog is not a chew toy for your dog.
As to those who tar all basenjis as bad: I have met two aggressive Goldens (no one ever believes that, but if you look at the bite stats they’re more common than one might think.) One was dog aggressive and put six hundred bucks worth of stitches into my golden, never saw a dime out of the owners afterwards, of course. The other – and this was bad – was biting his own owners. THAT was scary enough that our instructor pulled them out of class on the spot and sent them home. A dog that will bite his owner needs to be removed from the home, and the odds of that dog getting rehabbed successfully are pretty poor. Felt bad for the dog. Felt kind of bad for the owners, they’d gotten him from a rescue, but they could not admit they were in over their heads. They were. I wouldn’t even know where to start with a dog that far gone.
rikyrah
THE RACHEL MADDOW SHOW 1/22/18
New report suggests Jared Kushner may be compromised by China
Rachel Maddow looks at a new report in the New Yorker about U.S. intelligence concerns that Jared Kushner tried to mix personal business with U.S. China policy and made himself vulnerable to manipulation as a result.
rikyrah
THE RACHEL MADDOW SHOW 1/22/18
Still no security clearance for Jared Kushner one year later
Evan Osnos, staff writer for the New Yorker, talks with Rachel Maddow about Jared Kushner’s relationship with China and Kushner peculiar inability to attain a security clearance a year into the administration in which he is serving.
efgoldman
@bemused:
Cleek’s law illustrated
rikyrah
THE RACHEL MADDOW SHOW 1/22/18
Republicans draft memo to smear FBI, plan public release
Rachel Maddow reports on a plan by Republicans to use their access to intelligence materials to write a memo that smears the FBI in order to undercut American intelligence and law enforcement as it investigates Donald Trump.
rikyrah
JUST IN: Former FBI director James Comey was interviewed by Mueller’s team late last year, a source close to him tells NBC News. The focus of the interview was the memos he wrote about his interactions with President Trump, the source says. — @KenDilanianNBC pic.twitter.com/RtbDP9MjYR
— MSNBC (@MSNBC) January 23, 2018
efgoldman
@opiejeanne:
And who can forget (although I’ve tried to) Freddie de Boring’s brief possession of keys to the front page.
Suzanne
@Mnemosyne: Funny you mention. I have always been a working dog kind of girl. I love all dogs, or course, but my favorite breeds are those that DO STUFF.
catclub
@Alex:
We have a 10 year old cat that is still ten pounds of pure muscle when she wants to get away. We are still waiting for the calming down.
Gelfling 545
@Amir Khalid: it would be rather like painting a target on your back and shouting “take your shot”.
Gin & Tonic
@efgoldman: Or E.D. Kain (Kane?), who so generously offered himself as ombudsman or something. Memory is hazy.
Barbara
@Jewish Steel: Your story about your dog being known at the local cafe brought to mind my parent’s dog, who loved kids and who could open our front door, which she did every day at around 2:30 pm to go to a local playground nearly a mile away to play with kids after school. When I was home from college I took her for a walk and we went through the playground and she trotted over to the water fountain, where she simply sat down. These kids came up to her and asked her by name if she needed a drink and proceeded to turn the fountain on so she could stand (she was a tall girl) and get a drink of water. That dog had a better social life than I ever have.
rikyrah
Uh huh
Uh huh
Greitens won’t say whether he took a photo of woman with whom he’d had an affair
By Jack Suntrup
St. Louis Post-Dispatch
EFFERSON CITY • Gov. Eric Greitens on Monday sidestepped one question asked repeatedly during a rare news conference: Did he take a compromising photo of a woman with whom he had had an affair?
The question came in various forms from various news outlets. After initially addressing the affair, he attempted to steer the reporters back to the state’s $28.7 billion budget blueprint, the planned topic of the day.
The question stems from Greitens’ admission this month that he had an extramarital affair in 2015. A related allegation is that he took a compromising photograph of the woman and threatened its release if she spoke of their relations.
Gelfling 545
@Jewish Steel: One can sort of picture them signaling to each other across the plains.
Tim C.
@Jewish Steel: If anyone hasn’t checked it out, Freddie recently did a big post about his mental illness and how he decided after some stuff he had done related to that and his online behavior he needed to go do something else. It’s a raw and painful read. https://fredrikdeboer.com/2017/12/ Not saying it justifies him being an asshat in various locations, but I have more sympathy now.
ruemara
@Jewish Steel: As a person surrounded by talented creatives, I feel your pain.
bemused
@efgoldman:
It makes my head hurt when they are pro-something until liberals are for it too and instantly they are against it. Pathological.
Just my opinion but I think some rightwingers react with opposite syndrome because they have low self esteem. By god, I’ll show those elitists.
Barbara
@rikyrah: He said he didn’t take a photograph for the purpose of blackmailing anyone. I think the answer to the question of whether he took a compromising photo would therefore by “yes.”
randy khan
@West of the Rockies (been a while):
What’s amazing is that Perkins is saying out loud something evangelicals have been trying not to say out loud for a very long time: They wouldn’t care if he was Satan’s spawn so long as he enacted their agenda.
Frankensteinbeck
@Jewish Steel:
I adored ABL and learned a huge amount from her. I remember Cole saying that the hostility we saw in threads was nothing compared to the deluge of racist hate comments that got caught in moderation. It’s shameful that she should be subjected to that, and makes her points for her.
Jewish Steel
@Tim C.: I had heard he had a breakdown of some kind. That was a tough read and a testament to his talent as a writer that I have a newfound sympathy for him. I hope he stays on track.
bemused
@Frankensteinbeck:
I never did get why ABL got so much hostility. It was extremely weird.
Jewish Steel
@Frankensteinbeck:
Me too. Never forgot that.
ruemara
@bemused: black. female. talking. It happens.
MomSense
@Mnemosyne:
Border Collies are a bit cat like so maybe that’s why they like you.
tobie
I’m late to the party, but wanted to say welcome to Jewish Steel. I’m not sure who has more on his plate–Doug! with a newborn or you with a basenji. I look forward to your posts.
Immanentize
@ruemara: Add “Angry” and Bob’s your Uncle!
trollhattan
@Suzanne:
As non-hunters with a pointer I feel kinda bad he has to point stuff without the doggie thrill of going to fetch it. He does need to be kept super busy and we may yet explore agility training because he’s freakishly agile and loves a challenge.
ruemara
@Immanentize: I wish it was because we were Angry. Because we’re stereotyped that way, so just showing annoyance takes strength.
Roger Moore
@bemused:
I think a key part of Cleek’s Law is the conservative view of the world as zero sum. For one person to win, another person has to lose. Just as importantly, if one person is losing, that means another person must be winning. What that means in practice is that when they don’t have a strong policy preference on an issue, they assume the answer must be the opposite of what liberals want. After all, if the liberals are losing, the conservatives must be winning. The idea of a win/win or lose/lose situation is just beyond them.
germy
Front page at the WaPo
Allrightythen.
Immanentize
@ruemara: I know, I was just referring to her handle — Angry Black Woman. I miss her here. I liked how she mixed it up. Not a taker of shit.
Mart
@Jewish Steel: No hate meant, just my ceremonial BJ-FU to you. When I was in HS a buddy lived a couple doors down from Muddy Waters. We would hang out on the porch and listen to the band practice. Even made it inside a couple times. Muddy was a joyous man. A voice like no other and his slide guitar was awesome. At times seemed like he was not from this planet. (Could have been the drugs.) A love for all things Chicago blues was burned into the young brain. Of course British blues men who took up the style were awesome in our minds as well. Still have a soft spot for Peter Green’s Fleetwood Mac, along with EC, etc. And to relieve your concerns, I never took, and will never take a guitar lesson!
Dogs look awesome. Don’t think I have the temperament for them.
normal liberal
Echo is downright winsome, especially in the book photo.
And it could be worse, Congressionally speaking-you and yours could be dealing with the evil bowl of oatmeal known as Rodney Davis.
The Moar You Know
@bemused: We never saw the real hostility she was getting, it never made it to comments. I gather it was horrendous. She did see it. Given the results of the election and the “coming out of the closet” of the millions of ragebots who couldn’t stand the thought of a black president, I can now easily imagine what was getting posted.
She was not my cup of tea as a writer but I generally just stayed off her threads. She certainly was no DeBoer, who was a poor writer and a sociopath to boot (I’m not buying his breakdown story, TBH) who had no business being here at all.
Roger Moore
@Barbara:
I’m willing to be that he means blackmail only in the strictest monetary sense.
Immanentize
@germy: I saw a poll over at TPM which had the public at 56% blaming Trump or the Republicans and 39% blaming Democrats. I’ll take that type of losing every damn day.
bemused
@ruemara:
I’ll never wrap my mind around how people can choose to be so vile. I don’t remember who were the worst attackers but assume they haven’t been here since.
Roger Moore
@bemused:
Racism.
The Moar You Know
@germy: We didn’t use that playbook. We did even worse, we folded on a winning hand. Now the GOP knows we can be bullied into submission. I have lost any respect for Schumer that I had, if he can’t do better than this he needs to go.
bemused
@The Moar You Know:
Thx for refreshing my spotty memory.
germy
@Roger Moore: She was before my time here. Do the people responsible still comment here, or were they banned?
trollhattan
@Mart:
You hung out with royalty. Damn, I’m jealous!
Gravenstone
@Immanentize: Except the breakdown was ca. 1:1 Trump/Democrat blame, with the Republicans as a body pulling up the rear. Would have much preferred seeing that 1:1 being Trump/Republicans, even if it meant Democrats still pulled in over a third of the total blame.
I guess the optimistic take is that everyone still hates Trump, with the Republicans getting splattered with his shit.
Spanky
@germy: Yeah, the whole front page was like that earlier, before being replaced by the school shooting and JeffyBo’s little talk with Bobby Three Sticks.
Also too, the Republican plan is working!
Read the whole article, if you can. It’s WaPo, though.
ETA: The last couple of paragraphs seem to rely on the author’s assumptions about what the polling data means, which in my eyes can’t be supported by the data as presented.
Gravenstone
@bemused: Easy to be vile as an anonymous online voice. Cowards know they’re highly unlikely to ever face actual consequences for their abuses. Build that onto the existing racist/sexist architecture of their lives, and the worst is unleashed.
zhena gogolia
@opiejeanne:
No, I don’t think TNC was ever here. I’d remember that. I do vividly remember Jake Tapper engaging with us in the comments before he was too famous, but maybe the authenticity of that has had some doubt cast on it. It seemed real at the time. But maybe I was dreaming.
Barbara
@The Moar You Know: Also too, there are free ponies in Aisle 5. Better not leave without one.
Ruviana
@The Moar You Know: Please! Do NOT keep a tiger or any other big cat in your house for any reason. Do not. That is all.
Gin & Tonic
@Immanentize: Tried to catch you in a thread the other day, with no luck. OT, but did you finish that NPT curriculum?
Chip Daniels
@West of the Rockies (been a while):
Stormy Daniels in “Mulligan MILF Babes III- Hole In One!”
Jewish Steel
@Mart: You met McKinley Morganfield? Wow! I met Lonnie Brooks in a bar in Lakeview back in the ’90s. That’s as close to blues royalty I’ve ever come.
@normal liberal: I think IL-13 has a shot to get flipped. Darin LaHood won IL-18 by 27 points so it’s going to be an uphill battle.
LAO
@The Moar You Know:
What exactly was the winning hand?
? ?? Goku (aka The Hope of the Universe) ? ?
@The Moar You Know:
Maybe you need to understand there is only so much the minority can do. What did you expect? That McConnell was ever going to cave and provide a path for citizenship for Dreamers? That Ryan would bring vote for it in the House? Please.
That shutdown couldn’t have stretched on forever, if it did, I do wonder if McConnell’s BS about Dems preceding illegal immigrants over American children wouldn’t have worked.
Immanentize
@Gravenstone: The question was, who do you blame:
Trump 38
Republicans in Congress 18
Democrats in Congress 39
That is an overwhelming majority blaming “NOT Democrats.” Spin aside, we won. And this lines up pretty good with Trump’s support. Which is low.
Frankensteinbeck
@The Moar You Know:
What? McConnell clearly lost here. It’s not like the negotiations are over. He gave us one of the two things we wanted, and now he has to go right back and start over without it. It’s a CR for less than three weeks. He gave up something huge and we gave up nothing in the first round.
Gin & Tonic
@The Moar You Know: Curious what winning in that scenario would have looked like.
trollhattan
@Ruviana:
Start with a bobcat and see how it goes, only then should you go bigly.
Or get a possum, like in Florida.
Peale
@The Moar You Know: What makes you think DACA is a winner? Because from where I sit, even though the DACA people are popular, that popularity don’t translate into votes and doesn’t motivate the community that is most impacted by it. Perhaps the immigration activists should prove that they can deliver the votes to compensate for the ones we lose for being the “friend of immigrants” before they run around screaming about how we have sold them out.
I’m in favor of a six year extension of DACA without a path to citizenship but a path to permanent residency at the end of that six year period. That’s a compromise that will keep them safe in case Trump wins election. We can change that blockage later. In order to get even that much, we will probably have to agree to fines and that fake parole crap for six years.
But honestly, please show the work that having to assist DACA recipients is a winning hand. It looks to me like its at most king high. It may feel good, but it sure doesn’t look like “Friend of Immigrants” = “Win win win”.
Prove me wrong. Show your work.
The Moar You Know
@zhena gogolia: He did. Once.
@zhena gogolia: dengre tossed up a few front page posts, not TNC. He didn’t stay. That was a shame, that guy was a damn good writer.
@Barbara: You better learn to call out failure of leadership when you see it or you’ll get dragged down with them. I don’t want free ponies. I want a guy who will stand fast when he’s got the advantage. Schumer did not do that. He frankly did the opposite. When you’re dealing with sociopathic bullies like McConnell and Trump you can’t give them your lunch money, not even once. Schumer did.
I will note that Pelosi did not make the same mistake.
West of the Rockies (been a while)
@bemused:
Yeah, Perkins talks about how liberals are playground bullies and Trump is finally punching back.
Long pause…
No, Evil-nonangelic(als), YOU are the bullies!!!
Immanentize
@Gin & Tonic: Hey there! I finished the course syllabus — in fact I have to trot off soon to teach. The NNPT is only one part — this semester toward the end so we can get as much mileage first from current events. I do have related materials just for the NNTP. Who else was interested? eric?
Thanks
Gravenstone
@Immanentize: I saw the results. Yes, the aggregate is Dem favorable, but I wanted more direct blame to be placed on the Republicans in Congress. That is the wedge that will be needed to give future confrontations/shutdowns a chance to give us favorable outcomes. Otherwise the Rs will be less inclined to see the downside if they believe they can successfully put the blame on Dems and/or Trump.
Immanentize
@The Moar You Know: @LAO: Friends, we have no winning hand unless you think keeping government shut down is a big win. It is a leverage point, not an end in and of itself. Nearly 9 Millions kids got health insurance back.
win.
Hi LAO!
Ruviana
@trollhattan: No.
LAO
@Immanentize: HI!
I agree, I don’t believe the democrats had a winning hand.
West of the Rockies (been a while)
@Chip Daniels:
The script writes itself!
? ?? Goku (aka The Hope of the Universe) ? ?
@The Moar You Know:
As several others have already asked, what does winning look like re:Schumer and the shutdown over the weekend?
Immanentize
@LAO: Dreamer relief is popular, but shutting down government for Dreamer relief is not as popular. That is where we are, and we have no power in congress except that of saying, “NO!” That is real power, but just not a winning hand. More like turning over the card table, yelling “fire!” and running from the game.
The Moar You Know
@Peale: Nothing. I frankly thought that was an idiotic hill to die on, but that wasn’t my decision to make. The Dem caucus thought they could make a deal on it. They could have forced a vote on it, which would have lost. Which, again, is something I didn’t think is a good idea. It’s popular (with Dems) but not popular enough. The DACA folks are frankly fucked until Dems can regain control of everything, which I don’t think will happen anytime soon.
The Republicans needed 12 Dems to pass a budget. As the actor says, “what’s my motivation?” Give me something or no votes. That is your winning hand, end of story.
I personally would have preferred to see some restoration of ACA funding instead of dealing on DACA, which I see no upside to. There were many things we could have asked for and gotten. We didn’t. Just gave ’em the votes and walked off.
normal liberal
@Jewish Steel:
There may be a chance at flipping the 13th, but I won’t believe it until I see the turnout map. As for Darn, he benefits from undeserved name recognition, plus being a robotic mouthpiece for the worst of the repub caucus. Who could believe that we’d miss Aaron Schock for anything but comic relief?
Tazj
@The Moar You Know: It’s amazing how a visit from a dog can just change your whole outlook and brighten your day. I don’t have a dog (husband works mainly nights-he may have a point) and miss having one, though I have two wonderful cats. Last week, 2 of my neighbor’s dogs wandered over while I was taking my Christmas decorations down. Not wanting them to get lost, I accompanied them home. It was a short visit but it took my mind off my worries for a time.
? ?? Goku (aka The Hope of the Universe) ? ?
@The Moar You Know:
“Idiotic hill to die on”? Try telling that to a dreamer, asshole. 800,000 of them are going to get deported to countries they have no real connection to and likely no way to survive in. This is an impending humanitarian disaster that will be remembered as a human rights violation, no matter what the GOP fucks say or do. The rest of the world will see this for what it is.
That being said, the Sophie’s choice between DACA and CHIP was probably going to kill us if we didn’t cut a deal and take CHIP of the table. Now the GOP won’t be able to use that negotiations anymore.
Fair Economist
@The Moar You Know: Schumer is the first Congressional leader in years to get something from a shutdown.Why are so many saying he failed. (That’s a rhetorical question.)
LAO
@Fair Economist: The idea that the democrats caved kills me — CHIP is funded for 6 years and the Republicans got a 3 week funding of government. How is this a loss?
Gin & Tonic
@Immanentize: Thanks. I do recall one other commenter expressed interest,but I can’t recall who it was.
WaterGirl
@Jewish Steel: I have an Un-Seat Rodney Davis magnet on my car, and I see a lot of them around town. I loathe the man; we really need to get rid of him.
Mnemosyne
@The Moar You Know:
We got 6 more years of CHIP and another shutdown in 2 weeks if there’s no DACA bill.
I’ll take it, especially since all the kids currently on CHIP get cut off 8 days from now if nothing is done.
Amir Khalid
@Ruviana:
Remember Dakota Johnson, star of 50 Shades of Gray? Her grandmother used to believe that lions and tigers made good house pets.
normal liberal
@WaterGirl:
I’ve had a few direct exchanges with him (work-related) and he couldn’t formulate a straight answer to save his life. There does seem to be some money behind the Dirksen-Whatever campaign, at least for now. I haven’t seen any polling.
Barbara
@The Moar You Know: More ponies on Aisle 9. Seriously, If I thought Schumer did something wrong I would call him out on it. He didn’t. Sure, Pelosi and Harris expressed disappointment. I am okay with that too. The only way to better outcomes is more elected officials. I have every reason to think that Schumer did what he needed to get to that goal. I am not interested in flyspecking every tactical decision.
Mnemosyne
@The Moar You Know:
And we got CHIP extended for 6 years. Why are you pretending otherwise?
BluegirlFromWyo
@bemused: Agreed. Have a conservative acquaintance who’s constantly trying to impress me and my spouse with his depth of thought obtained by watching “both Fox News and MSNBC.” When we’re not appropriately impressed, out comes the “I know you don’t believe me” sighs of oppression. Insecure and tiresome.
Barbara
@The Moar You Know: Just to follow up, in reality there were three hostages and Dems are the only party that cares about any of them. Normally, shutting the government down is what the Republicans do to extract concessions from Dems. Republicans don’t care if Dems shut things down. That’s what too many people seem to be missing. Shutting things down is a shrug your shoulder moment for Republicans so there is no real reason they would give things up in exchange for opening things back up. Schumer probably knows this and was probably persuaded by others to try it out anyway. And in this case, as others have said, getting CHIP extended and living to fight another day is a decent outcome.
coin operated
@Barbara:
Bingo. I was about to type this very reply. Republicans shutting down government has become a feature of that party…not a bug. Shock Doctrine as a policy tool.
Mart
@Jewish Steel: The Lonnie Brooks Band, and later on with his son Ronnie, played several Thursday nights at the annual Woodridge Jubilee. Thursday was the designated night for blues – never went to the sucky cover bands on Friday and Saturday. One year it was cold as hell for June, and the Bulls were playing in game five or six of the NBA Championship. The crowd maxed out at maybe two dozen. They played like it was packed. Lonnie came offstage and my very young daughter in a hoodie got to strum his guitar for a few cords. Her timing was good. Papa was so proud. We went to his coach after the show for an autograph. When she dropped her hood, he said she’s a girl? I never pick girls to play, they are too shy. She did great!
Couple years later at the Jubilee Lonnie and his extended family were on stage for the final song with a packed house. My buddy and I were filling our beer cups when I looked to my wife for a refill. She was gone. The kids were gone. I look up at the stage and there they are, dancing with Lonnie’s grand-kids.
Saw him on a SWA flight to Dallas many years later packing his guitar overhead, well after I moved out of Illinois. Walked up and talked about my daughter, he seemed to remember… Maybe not. Asked for his autograph and he shyly said nobody recognizes me like this. Another extremely kind man.
Sorry, I got a lot of blues stories. Obsession started with my beer drinking buddy on a porch in Westmont.
catclub
@? ?? Goku (aka The Hope of the Universe) ? ?:
An Interesting calculation is to compare the cost of deporting n people with the budget appropriated for that purpose. My rough guess was $10k/per person
– experts could possibly tell me if that is low – so you get to $8B. which is think is a large number compared with the amount spent today on deportations.
Anybody have better estimates of either the cost or the budget.
This cost is why DACA – DEFERRED ACTION – exists. It is not worth the cost (and it costs a lot) for those deportations of useful near-citizens.
Frankensteinbeck
@Mnemosyne:
The liberal pushback on this deal is bizarre. It’s all framed as if we got nothing and the budget deal is over and done. We got something huge and get to start again immediately pushing for more. McConnell folded, here.
Jewish Steel
@Mart: That is just awesome. He seemed like a super nice dude from what I can remember.
catclub
@coin operated:
This is only half true. On this latest shutdown, the administration tried to cover up as many aspects of the shutdown as they could – which says they were worried about the shutdown. On the previous shutdown, remember when air traffic control was shut down for about a day? That got fixed double quick by BOTH sides. I wish the Democrats had kept it shut down until the rest of the shutdown was fixed.
So it is more like: either side can stand a shutdown if the other side is taking the blame for the worst parts of it.
Frankensteinbeck
@catclub:
I don’t much care, either way. I mean, it’s less than two weeks. The whole thing is right back on anyway. All that’s changed is we took CHIP away from McConnell. I have no idea why he even agreed to that.
catclub
@Frankensteinbeck:
I think we will not know until much later what really has happened. I think in 2013 it looked like Obama had caved a lot to the GOP vandals, but it turned out in the details of the actual agreement that all the consequences came 5 years later – which kind of meant never. Of course that five years later is – now!
OTOH: Five years ago I was reading here that Obama has hornswoggled the vandals in just the way described, so it wasn’t that secret.
Alex
@trollhattan: You could always get the pointer a basenji buddy. Our basenji trained our pointer to flush game for her and knock the squirrels off the fence so she could scoop them up. He loved it even though she never shared. He helped her eat a wider variety of mammals, reptiles,amphibians, birds, and insects than I ever believed our city backyard could contain.
waspuppet
Welcome! I HIGHLY approve of your caption game. Cole used to be a master of the alt-text, but he doesn’t seem to bother anymore.
Sab
@The Moar You Know: Very late to your comment. Me ex-husband had a small aggressive golden retriever who mudered another dog ( a tiny terrier) for no particular reason right in front of its owner on the beach in Malibu.
Not all dogs from good breeds are good.
My German Shepherd never got into a fight with any dog, and broke up many fights in the dog park. She was huge and calm. She would just go over, stare down at the combatants, and they would look up at her and slink off to their owners.
She also tamed the aforementioned evil golden matriarch.
J R in WV
@The Moar You Know:
So you think Freddie fabricated a story about being hospitalized and having to work with his shrink to get his medications balanced? It rang true to me, having witnessed that meds balanced kind of thing …
J R in WV
@The Moar You Know:
You’re pretending there is only one hand dealt in a poker tournament. Sen. Schumer and our Democrats won this hand, and ensured that there will be another hand dealt right away. At which point they will have exactly as much power as they had last weekend.
You need to know more.