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You are here: Home / Open Threads / Excellent Links / Excellent Read: “Deep in Clinton country, voters stand by their candidate”

Excellent Read: “Deep in Clinton country, voters stand by their candidate”

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The Washington Post is straight-up trolling the NYTimes here, and it is hilarious:

The pilings of long-gone piers still jut out of the murky Hudson River in New York County, N.Y., reminders of a shipping industry that’s all-but-vanished from the region. There’s almost no manufacturing left in the towering buildings at the southern end of the county where it once thrived. Throughout the area, large warehouses once used for trade have been torn down or repurposed.

You’d be forgiven for assuming that this is the sort of place where Donald Trump would have been successful in the 2016 election. Unless, that is, you know that shipping and manufacturing left New York County a very long time ago. New York County is Manhattan; the warehouses are now art galleries and the skyscrapers where piecemeal manufacturing once took place are now offices and expensive apartments.

Far from backing Trump, Manhattan was one of the most heavily pro-Hillary Clinton counties in the country in 2016, supporting her by a 77-point margin. (In his home county, Trump won only 9.7 percent of the vote; for every 2.6 votes he got, a third-party candidate got one.) We don’t hear much about how Manhattanites have responded to the first year of Trump’s presidency, though, despite how much we’ve heard about how regions central to Trump’s candidacy are still home to people who stand by their choice. There are a lot of reasons for not focusing on the views of people in Manhattan, including that the city is not without a voice in the media and that how it voted was not particularly surprising (compared to the fervent support Trump enjoyed in the Rust Belt).

Nonetheless, we decided to see if voters in Clinton country stood by their candidate one year into Trump’s tenure. We know Trump’s supporters are sticking with him, but are Clinton’s sticking with her? Is Trump convincing any opponents to rally to his cause?

Six of the eight counties that voted the most overwhelmingly for Clinton run in a line from The Bronx to Petersburg, Va. (The other two counties are San Francisco and Oglala Lakota County, S.D.) On Wednesday of this week, I visited five of those counties and spoke with two dozen people who told me they’d voted for Hillary Clinton in 2016. I asked them how they felt about Trump and if they stood by their 2016 vote.

With only one exception, they did…

As Trump prepares for his first State of the Union address, the state of Clinton country can be summarized in one word: Hostile.

Finding Clinton voters at each stop was trivial, as you’d expect, but the similarity of the complaints — regardless of race, gender or socioeconomic status — was remarkable. Trump’s policy positions were consistently critiqued — immigration and the tax bill in particular — but his temperament and personality (and his perceived biases) were often mentioned first and more forcefully.

Trump theorized that he would be able to bridge partisan gaps in the country by taking an outsider’s, businessman’s approach to governance. Whether or not voters in the places that voted most heavily for Clinton were ever likely to be swayed is a fair question. Over the course of his first year, Trump hasn’t helped himself at all in that goal…

Reader Interactions

112Comments

  3. 3.

    Corner Stone

    Trump theorized that he would be able to bridge partisan gaps in the country by taking an outsider’s, businessman’s approach to governance.

    Umm, he rightly theorized that a racist bent would get him enough votes in previous nominal D areas.

  4. 4.

    SiubhanDuinne

    Not really on topic to this thread, but I just got out of the opera and saw a news alert on my phone that Steve Wynn resigned today as the RNC’s finance chair.

    So much Wynning.

  5. 5.

    Ruckus

    @Jeffro:
    No one from any news outlet has asked me. Maybe they knew that they’d have to use a lot of underscores or asterisks in my answer if they actually wanted to print it.

  6. 6.

    Frankensteinbeck

    While I hope this is an unrepresentative sample, this article signals strongly to me how successful Sanders was in spreading and validating Republican memes to ratfuck Democrats. The ratfuck squad – not including him, I think Sanders was merely useful to them – are pushing #DemExit on twitter now. I think they’re terrified by the motivation of women and minorities we’ve seen over the last year’s special elections.

  7. 7.

    Corner Stone

    When are these fucking web content providers going to stop embedding bullshit video into every god damned article?

  8. 8.

    Mnemosyne

    I am so happy to live in deep blue Southern California, where even the old white guys hate Trump and are happy to stand up in public to say so.

  9. 9.

    Corner Stone

    He did, however, give credit to Trump in one way.

    “His slogan is make America great again, and I feel like everybody is kind of, like, connected now,” he said. “Everybody’s all against Trump. People are more united because everybody just doesn’t like the president right now.”

    That certainly took a nice turn.

  10. 10.

    1000 flouncing lurkers (was fidelio)

    @schrodingers_cat: I wish it was likely you’re exaggerating.
    Alas, that will be a series spread over four days with a special Sunday photo section.

  12. 12.

    Corner Stone

    “It broke my heart that I didn’t go and vote, but I just couldn’t switch to Hillary’s side from Bernie’s side,” she said.

    Who brought the kerosene? Can we meet up at the diner where this lady is eating?

  17. 17.

    Corner Stone

    After chewing through the article thanks to video embed slowdown, It seems we do indeed have a Bernie infestation problem. One we need to eradicate well before 2020 so it does not reproduce through another cycle.

  18. 18.

    Dorothy A. Winsor (formerly Iowa Old Lady)

    @Corner Stone: I posted this earlier but I’ll repeat it here, given what a pain that autoplay is:

    Google is releasing a new version of Chrome this week and it includes a number of new features, such as an improved ad blocker and Spectre mitigations. The best new feature in Chrome 64 is the ability to permanently mute websites that autoplay videos. This feature was teased for several months, but now it’s finally here. The Independent reports:
    To mute a site that automatically plays videos, users will need click the View Site Information symbol, which may look like a green padlock, on the left-hand edge of the omnibar — the address bar combined with the Google search box. Then they will need to select Sound. Once the website is muted, it will not automatically play videos with sound again until you unmute it.

  19. 19.

    Corner Stone

    @schrodingers_cat:

    Also Ruth Marcus has an op-ed castigating HRC.

    I saw the headline for it earlier and just thought that it simply didn’t matter what HRC had or had not done, Ruth was going to tag her ass to the wall over it, either way.
    I love it how a man harassed a woman and it is somehow HRC’s fault.

  21. 21.

    Baud

    @Frankensteinbeck:

    While I hope this is an unrepresentative sample, this article signals strongly to me how successful Sanders was in spreading and validating Republican memes to ratfuck Democrats.

    The sad part is that in a better timeline, the Wilmer movement could have chosen to play the role of kingmaker (or queenmaker) and progressives would have enjoyed more national power than they have had since the 60s, if not the 40s. Now we’re condemned to schism politics.

  25. 25.

    Corner Stone

    @schrodingers_cat:

    No FP thread about the administration’s ransom note which puts the gun to the head of citizens who may want to sponsor their parents or siblings?

    I have seen and heard repeatedly that it’s DOA. If you agree with that assessment, do the terms really matter at this point? We know they are racist xenophobes who want to kill all immigration.

  29. 29.

    schrodingers_cat

    @Corner Stone: As the Rs get crazier, who knows what is possible. I mean the MSM is already calling family reunification, chain migration.
    @WaterGirl: Yes that’s what has been proposed by WH and an end to the diversity lottery, you know because majority of the recipients of DL are from Africa ( I personally know two, one from Nepal and the other from Mali, both had Phds btw)

  30. 30.

    WaterGirl

    @Dorothy A. Winsor (formerly Iowa Old Lady): Last month, I was charged an extra $20, twice, because of the fucking autoplay ads on BJ while I was traveling and using my iPad with my cell service and not wireless. That never used to be a problem, but the fucking BJ autoplay ads are a big problem. I am pretty cranky about $40 in charges because Cole wants to run the fucking autoplay ads. This isn’t CNN. We deserve better.

  32. 32.

    Bobby Thomson

    @Frankensteinbeck:

    The ratfuck squad – not including him, I think Sanders was merely useful to them

    You are more generous than I am. I think he intentionally helped Trump build the latter’s brand as friend of the forgotten white working class. I think his undisclosed tax returns would be very revealing. The only question is whether the LLCs were set up by Trump, the RNC, or Russia, but in the end it’s all the same.

  34. 34.

    WaterGirl

    @Baud: Do you use an adblocker on your iPad? I do on my laptop, but not on my phone and iPad. If you use one for the iPad, do you have a recommendation?

  40. 40.

    japa21

    @Bobby Thomson: The ultimate take away from 2016 will be just how gullible American voters are. Obviously an extremely large number got taken in by Trump’s con. But enough also got conned by Sanders to have a real impact on the election.

  43. 43.

    Felanius Kootea

    A+ on the trolling, WaPo. I was struck by how none of the people interviewed (even the ones who were reluctant Hillary voters) had anything good to say about Trump. The most complimentary thing was how he’s united people in opposition to him. In the comments, a few people were asking the reporter to come out to Red States and interview Hillary supporters in those states because they exist. Mentioned 14000 people showing up for the Women’s March in Knoxville, TN. I wonder where Trump’s family will move to after his presidency. It will be difficult for them to stay on in New York.

  44. 44.

    Jeffro

    @Corner Stone:

    “It broke my heart that I didn’t go and vote, but I just couldn’t switch to Hillary’s side from Bernie’s side,” she said.

    Who brought the kerosene? Can we meet up at the diner where this lady is eating?

    Tempting…

    Also, let’s all keep in mind that the Republicans’ and Russians’ #1 priority in 2018 and 2020 will be instigating between the various factions of the left. I think it’s going to be a majority of their messaging and active measures, respectively.

  46. 46.

    Steeplejack (phone)

    Uh-oh. Amir’s Liverpool side are getting waxed 3-1 (after 77 minutes) by West Bromwich Albion in the F.A. Cup.

    Hold up! Liverpool just scored to make it 3-2.

  48. 48.

    B.B.A.

    @Felanius Kootea: I know from personal experience that it’s very easy to live in New York and never interact with anybody. Especially if you’re rich enough to get everything delivered.

  50. 50.

    HeleninEire

    Binging “The Crown” Starting series 2 show 4?? I am LOVING THE HELL out of how they portray Princess Margaret as opposed to Elizabeth. Now bare with me. I love Liz. For real. But goddamn ain’t Margaret gorgeous?

  52. 52.

    Steeplejack (phone)

    @Baud:

    If the mobile version works the same on the iPad as it does on Android, you will get an autoplay ad about every third or fourth page refresh, but it doesn’t have any audio. It shows up between the main post and the “You May Like” fake news stories. And it’s a goddamn nuisance, because it slows down the page functionality a perceptible amount.

  54. 54.

    ? Martin

    @Felanius Kootea:

    It will be difficult for them to stay on in New York.

    Everyone in NYC hated the Trumps before they got into politics. They made NY look bad from the outset.

  55. 55.

    JDM

    @WaterGirl: I use the mobile site on my iPad too, and no auto play ads. I have noticed that when we’re in the RV and use cellular internet, our useage is up about 50% over last year (Flipboard seems to be a big reason, but general bloat at web sites, calling up other sites and such, probably accounts for most of it).

  56. 56.

    Frankensteinbeck

    @Jeffro:

    I think it’s going to be a majority of their messaging and active measures, respectively.

    I know lefties. It already is. As I commented in previous threads, they’re currently pushing #DemExit to get Lefties to encourage each other to swear off the Democratic party forever.

  58. 58.

    JDM

    @JPL: Trump’s family came in that way too. As did Stephen Miller’s, escaping the Holocaust due to the USA’s chain migration policy.

  60. 60.

    Steeplejack (phone)

    @WaterGirl:

    Be aware that if you switch Balloon Juice versions it might be a one-way trip. I can’t remember which direction is the one-way gate, and maybe it has been fixed, but the last time I checked there was one version that did not have a button to switch back to the other version. You’d have to kill cookies or flush your buffer or something to get back.

  61. 61.

    Millard Filmore

    @Yutsano:

    I will also say the latest adblock built into Firefox is amazing at blocking just about everything.

    I never had a problem with ads, but letting all those freaking JavaScriptlets run will run my Firefox into the ground. When the Firefox upgrade came out that needed a new NoScript, it took nearly 30 minutes to close enough tabs so that I could get to the NoScript controls. I do not care about ads, except when they want to load me up with scripts.

  63. 63.

    Steeplejack (phone)

    @JDM:

    See my comment above.

    @Baud:

    You won’t notice it if you’re down in the comments, but it’s up there offstage chuffing away. And, like I said, it doesn’t show up on every page refresh. About one out of four, in my experience, although even that varies.

  65. 65.

    Incitatus for Senate

    @WaterGirl: iOS does let you run an adblocker, if you wish. The one I use is an app called Block Ad by NeverAds. There are a variety of these on the app store.

  66. 66.

    Kay

    @Corner Stone:

    I love it how a man harassed a woman and it is somehow HRC’s fault.

    I love how we get the weekly demands for Clinton to “address this issue!” when they know damn well nothing she says has any effect AT ALL on what they write about her. Address, don’t address, the “questions” and “concerns” will continue exactly as long as they feel like talking about them and will have NO connection to her relative guilt or innocence or level of responsibility.

    In fact, isn’t it time for Step Two of the Hillary Clinton narrative? Immediately after she “addresses” the concern they then move to criticizing HOW she addressed the concern, and we already know the result of that too- she will have handled “the controversy” badly.

    She should do what Trump does. Tell them to fuck off and denigrate their whole profession. That seems to work like a charm. That they respect.

  69. 69.

    WaterGirl

    @HeleninEire:

    Now bare with me

    If you had written that comment to Baud, I would assume that you were issuing an invitation. But it was not, so I think the phrase you were looking for was “bear with me”. :-)

  71. 71.

    Frankensteinbeck

    @Kay:
    Step three is ‘Why won’t Hillary shut up?’

    @Baud:
    While I don’t feel it as powerfully as how Obama owes us nothing and we have no right to ask anything of him anymore, I agree. Hillary gave us her service. She fought the good fight, and got only ingratitude.

  72. 72.

    Steeplejack (phone)

    @WaterGirl:

    I mentioned “no audio” as a possible reason someone wouldn’t notice the ad, especially if they had already scrolled down into the comments.

  73. 73.

    Incitatus for Senate

    @WaterGirl: You can also disable LTE in Settings/Cellular Data Options/Enable LTE. 3G is generally fast enough for web browsing.

  75. 75.

    Kay

    @Baud:

    If I’m bored with this game imagine how bored she is. Because it is a game. Step One: report concern. Step Two: demand she address Step Three: insist her response isn’t sufficient and go back to Step Two. Once the thing is set in motion nothing changes the set trajectory which means it doesn’t matter what she says. That all these feminists somehow miss that with Hillary Clinton it doesn’t matter what she says and never wonder about why that is, well, that’s amazing.

    She’s an unreliable witness to her own fucking life. Apparently she can’t speak credibly to her own actions. What’s THAT about, I wonder?

  76. 76.

    Corner Stone

    @James E. Powell: Sorry. Step Two is:
    “She fucked this up no matter how she handled it.”
    “Why won’t she just admit an error?”
    “Secretive and secret, she secretly kept this story from everyone because she’s very secretive.”
    “Shows a lack of her ability to lead.”
    “The hypocrisy of her trying to lead on this issue is astounding.”
    “Maybe she should just retreat to the woods and stop trying to falsely lead on this issue.”
    “Where was this Hillary during the campaign? Why won’t she step up and lead?”

  79. 79.

    Kay

    @Corner Stone:

    They key factor being Hillary Clinton cannot speak credibly as the actions of Hillary Clinton. Donald Trump can (!) but Hillary Clinton cannot. Instead, other people will speak for her. If she says “I did this because..” that’s immediately not credible and instead Marc Halperin will tell us why. What this means as a practical matter is she may as well not speak at all.

  80. 80.

    Raoul

    The NYT article-tweet for the Cecile Richards retirement is enough to make me think there is no amount of trolling that the Times doesn’t deserve. But the Times will blunder on. Can they drop back to 2M subscribers (Baquet had been bragging about 2.25M recently, have they lost 250,000 yet?). Less than 2M? Sheesh.

  85. 85.

    Aleta

    @Kay: Tell them to fuck off and denigrate their whole profession. That seems to work like a charm. That they respect.

    Then they run with “Clinton failed to overcome her distrust of the press.”

  86. 86.

    Felanius Kootea

    @schrodingers_cat: I think it holds interest for more people than you realize. It took me 13 years on a green card to decide to naturalize. Part of it was wrestling with a feeling of being “disloyal” to Nigeria, which gave me an excellent primary and secondary education. Part of it was how humiliating I found the whole process of moving from J to H visa to green card and not wanting to deal with “INS” (now ICE) again for as long as I could help it. It’s very hard to explain. I think you’d do a great job given your recent experience with naturalization. I know this administration would love to revoke the citizenship of people like you and me and that’s where they’ll go next if they win on DACA.

  89. 89.

    Duane

    I just heard Ronna Romney’s admonition to the DNC regarding the Steve Wynn scandal,to know what the DNC was going to do about it. Here’s some free advice lady. Take care of your crooked, corrupt bunch of sleazebags, assorted perverts and con men, and STFU.

  90. 90.

    frosty

    @Felanius Kootea:

    I know this administration would love to revoke the citizenship of people like you and me and that’s where they’ll go next if they win on DACA.

    And after that will they go after the naturalized citizens from international adoptions? I suppose the Russian kids will be all right, but what about Asia and South America?

  93. 93.

    Dmbeaster

    @Frankensteinbeck: And I thought their message was that Trump would be good cause things would get better if they first got worse. I guess getting worse first will take another 10+ years before nirvana can be reached. Therefore, maintain the sabotage to make sure to keep the Dems out of power.

    This is intended as satire, but what you intend as satire today becomes reality tomorrow. Kind of like the right wing nut jobs, who quickly become crazier than the nuttiest satire you can imagine.

    Its as if after writing a Modest Proposal, Swift discovered rich people actually force feeding babies corn meal in order to make liver pate.

  96. 96.

    J R in WV

    @Felanius Kootea:

    ” I wonder where Trump’s family will move to after his presidency. It will be difficult for them to stay on in New York.”

    Is there any chance Donald J Trump is aware that people have been known to spit in the food of people they especially despise? Could Trump even eat food he didn’t watch being prepared?

    Maybe that would be a good thing – he would get down to the BMI he claims to have already.

  98. 98.

    Boatboy_srq

    @Duane: Wait. The REPUBLICAN official is a sexist sexual-assaulting pr!ck made to resign for that, and Romney wants to know what the DEMS will do about it?

  99. 99.

    J R in WV

    @schrodingers_cat:

    “I am way too emotional and angry about this issue. And I am not sure it holds much interest for the jackal audience.”

    No one is too emotional and angry about immigration. We all have parents, or grandparents, or Great-grandparents, GGG-parents, etc, etc who immigrated in our family history, if we didn’t just get here ourselves.

    Some Americans are too dense or stupid to remember their family history, or so lack empathy that they can’t relate their own family history to the current events with people moving here to improve their lives, just like their ancestors did. Screw those idiots. My most recently arrived ancestors were my paternal great-grandparents. My father’s father’s parents, who were dairy farmers in the old country and in NE Ohio.

    The software team I worked with for the last 20 years of my career brought a number of people across into America, and hired others who needed a new position to help build a system. I care very much about the people making it here and now whoa re being threatened by the racists and fascists, and I expect the vast majority of commenters and readers here do to.

    And you have opinions on other lighter topics, like music and film and food, no one NO ONE here likes that stuff at all!!

  100. 100.

    1000 flouncing lurkers (was fidelio)

    @schrodingers_cat: I am boycotting newspapers right now out of respect for my blood pressure, so I was just imagining the sort of big-coverage series papers do. How depressing that it’s real.

    Ruth Marcus can go graze in the fields like Nebuchadnezzar, although he only thought he was an ass.

  103. 103.

    Matt

    @Corner Stone:

    I love it how a man harassed a woman and it is somehow HRC’s fault.

    Yeah, because *that’s* what people are upset about, not the whole “let’s cover this up like the fucking Papists” routine. Whine harder, Hillbot.

  105. 105.

    Mnemosyne

    @Matt:

    So you missed the part where he was fined and sent to retraining.

    Yep, that’s exactly like Steve Wynn forcing employees to give him handjobs. Good call there.

  106. 106.

    Peale

    @Duane: huh? Now the DNC has to do something about the finance chair at the RNC? Ok. He’s fired. What more does she expect the DNC to do?

  107. 107.

    Peale

    @Matt: wank more, dudebro. Or get an actual job. I mean, one of the benefits of being a corporatist Democrat is that I’m employed by a corporation, so I can say that what happened in the outcome isn’t way out of line what happens in the private sector. Funny you should compare it to priests molesting children, though. Haven’t heard that one. Was the story not lurid enough for you, little boy? Does the pleasure of your outrage increase when you imagine that?

  109. 109.

    Yutsano

    @Matt: Oh look! Another name I’ve never seen before commenting on a 10 year old matter to which no answer will satisfy? Begone foul spirit!

  110. 110.

    mainmata

    @SiubhanDuinne: Yep, another disgusting-looking old white billionaire gets nailed for consistent sexual harassment. They really feel it is their “droit de seigneur”.

  111. 111.

    AnneWith

    @WaterGirl:
    I use Ad Buster on my iPad. It works a little too well: it treats embedded tweets as ads so if the tweet has an image, I have to click on its link so I can see it on Twitter. OTOH, I don’t get hijacked to pages which tell me I’ve won a gift card anymore.

  112. 112.

    Mike in Pasadena

    @Mnemosyne: A few days ago I stood near outdoor seating for a restaurant waiting for the traffic light to change? I overheard this exchange:
    First old guy: What are we going to do about Trump?
    Second old guy: First, we’re gonna get the sonofabitch out of office!

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