First things first, thanks to everyone who contributed by clicking the paypal link the past two weeks, the server is paid up to June 1st, so we got that going for us.
Second, the pet calendar will be here shortly. I swear.
Third, I went out to an early dinner tonight. To spare you all the energy of having to make age related early-bird special jokes, I was there BEFORE the early birds. I had a late breakfast and skipped lunch and was hungry and wanted to get out of the house. And off I went.
Dinner was fine, but what I want to talk about was the salad. It was fucking horrible. One of my biggest peeves about dining in the US, and I am sure it is worse here in the Ohio Valley, is the sad state of salads at restaurants. Most establishments just do not give a shit, and even though they are on the menu, you get this sad fucking melange of lettuce (worst case scenario browned iceberg) and uninspiring vegetables and then they give you a tiny container of some shit they invariably call a vinaigrette (unless, of course, they hand you fucking Ranch).
It’s awful. It’s upsetting. I really like a good salad, and I am not very good at making them myself, so I would really like to be able to get one now and again. BFF Tammy and my father are both EXCEPTIONALLY skilled at making good salads, so they occasionally spoil me.
But many if not most restaurants simply fail to execute or simply do not even try. My lemon “vinaigrette” this evening was tart, flat, one dimensional, and wholly uninspiring. It just made me angry. This was not my experience in Europe. I still remember the insalata italiana from a small greek/mediterranean place in downtown Fulda, and that has been over thirty years since I had it. God, it was so good.
That is all. Also, check out this ANGEL:
I feel better now.
Baud
Who’s a good puppy?!
Baud
Agree regarding salad.
cain
I agree. But I’ve had some good ones in Portland. We take our vegetarian stuff serious here :-)
CliosFanBoy
awwww, we need more of Cole’s puppy pics..
schrodingers_cat
Thanks JGC! Lily is lovely.
Gin & Tonic, Duke of Tanqueray
Good doggie.
jeffreyw
I really like a wilted lettuce salad with the bacon grease/vinegar dressing but the other kinds I can live without. My mom really loved to make a Waldorf salad with apples and mayo but I would never eat it, much to her disappointment.
Garbo
Dammit man, you scared the hell out of me with that headline and photo. All my love to Lily.
Jager
That’s a very nice dog.
I just fed mine, Anze is sprawled on the kitchen floor. Happy, contented and positioned perfectly to be in my god damn way.
JPL
Let me chime in and mention that in GA the salad is just fine. Politics.. maybe not but the food is okay.
Edited to mention that it is probably not safe in Deliverance country to order un-sweet tea.
zhena gogolia
I would send a check if that’s appropriate. I have an address from a while back if that’s still good.
zhena gogolia
We have better salads than that in our restaurants, but I still never really like restaurant salad. I prefer it at home. The lettuce is never fresh enough in restaurants and the dressing usually is blah.
zhena gogolia
Nobody could do noir dame like Mary Astor.
p.a.
I don’t like to hack up my salad. I want it delivered bite-sized. I love red onions, and almost every f*#@^~! place that doesn’t have items and cooking methods I have to google, serves onions in rings that are impossible to eat without cutting if you don’t want to look ridiculous. 1st world issue, I know.
Mike in DC
Is there a green leafy vegetable that really punches up a salad? I mostly can’t stand other veggies so I mostly just eat greens–iceberg, romaine, kale, spinach or swiss chard. Throw in some cheese and dressing and I’m good to go.
Kent
@cain: Yes, I’ve not had trouble finding good salads in Portland. But the my wife is vegan so we mostly hunt down vegan restaurants which generally do good salads.
Raven
Come to the Grit in Athens
http://www.thegrit.com
Roger Moore
If you want a good salad, you need to go to a place where they grow lots of lettuce. People here in California take salads seriously. Right now may not be the best time of year for them, though; I don’t think it’s peak harvest for fresh lettuce.
schrodingers_cat
@Mike in DC:
Arugula.
jl
I also agree with Cole on the US grub house salad problem. Whenever possible I avoid salads in all but the finest restaurants, and I don’t get out to the finest restaurants much. If stuff looks sketchy, go with soup. If you get signs the soup is sketchy (usually from my experience because way too much salt) ask for a substitution, like another serving of cooked veggies they give you on the side.
Problem solved, and Cole is welcome.
thanks for cute doggypic.
robmassing
There are good salads to be had in SoCal. Not all of them, but a substantial number. But I think the almost universal rule, unless you are in a super fancy joint, is “dressing on the side.”
JPL
@Mike in DC: Add an apple or a pear, to arugula or kale and enjoy.
donnah
My gosh, Lily is radiant. Her sweet face, her big brown eyes, it just makes me so happy to see her looking so good. She’s an angel.
jl
@Roger Moore: The way California lettuce is going, with all the contamination problems, best to only eat salad when the restaurant can source it for you. And if they can’t source it, salad in such a joint probably best avoided.
Sourcing everything around SF Bay Area is common. I don’t know about other places. Problem for US is that most of the lettuce comes from California, which is having a problem keeping animal poop out of the irrigation water.
Felanius Kootea
You need to visit Los Angeles. We have phenomenal salads!
jl
@robmassing: Some places, if you allow them to put dressing on the salad, you don’t get a salad with dressing on it, you get a dump of dressing with some crunchy ingredients.
Eric U.
I went to France this summer, and I think the worst restaurant there would be embarrassed by what gets served in restaurants here. I was there when tomatoes were in season, and I got a salad with 5 varieties of tomato on it. I’m not sure I was aware there were that many different kinds. It was amazing. It would be incredibly rare to get something that fresh in the states. This was at a little bar beside the road too, not anything special.
lamh36
oooh… the best salad I’ve ever had was this Ceasar Salad at the local Cheesecake Factory here in NOLA. I don’t know if they make their own dressing or just make sure they have the freshest romaine, but each time I have had it, it has been better than even the entree’ I ordered. And it’s just a plan ceasar salad, no chicken or anything else.
Just… chef’s kiss perfect, each time I’ve gotten it.
JPL
Remember that you can make salad with other greens besides lettuce e.g. cabbage, broccoli and carrots are an interesting combination.
Brachiator
Let Us Talk. Very good.
And so, speaking of lettuce talk,
Yeah. I agree. There are a couple of local places I go to specifically because they still serve up a nice salad.
Unfortunately, in some parts of Southern California, a number of “family style” restaurants are closing or being retired, and the replacement eateries often do not feature salads at all.
But also these days, you got to watch out for Romaine served with a side of Salmonella.
ETA: Great photo of Lily!
Dorothy A. Winsor
Lily looks like the sweetheart she is.
emjayay
@cain: Portland: Not located in the Ohio Valley. I’m guessing that even in the Ohio Valley, wherever that is, there are reasonably priced restaurants of the natural-organic food/people’s gourmet sort that understand salads. Maybe.
Omnes Omnibus
Sometimes I would swear that Cole is an old codger. I guess codgerness is ageless.
emjayay
@jeffreyw: You should maybe open your mind and be an adult about food.
Roger Moore
@jl:
From what I’ve read, the big problem is not necessarily keeping animal poop out of the water. The big problem is they don’t really understand exactly where the contamination is coming from, so they don’t know how to stop it. They’ve tried a bunch of different things to prevent it without success. The last I heard, they thought it might be carried on dust rather than through the water.
emjayay
@schrodingers_cat: Rocket.
joel hanes
In my small Iowa hometown, a big slice of the restaurant business has long been owned by families of Greek heritage, and if you want something good you order the “Greek salad”
Decent lettuces, plenty of mild onion and cucumber, kalamata olives and feta, and if you go to the right place, a couple dolma. And plenty of a good, strong-flavored dressing.
Used to see a Unix fortune that said
“garlic is to salad as insanity is to art”
zhena gogolia
This is quite a beautiful Fred Zinnemann movie I never saw, Act of Violence.
Barbara
I have had decent salads in restaurants but it’s luck of the draw. I joke sometimes that you know you are in the Midwest when you order a salad and it is 90% cheese by weight. Yes, pathetic.
Mnemosyne
@p.a.:
Yes. This. I don’t know who decided that we all want to have salads made of whole lettuce leaves barely torn in half, but it’s annoying as hell to have to cut up my own salad at a restaurant.
dww44
I’m with you, John, on the generally pitiful restaurant salad offerings. I’m so put off by bottled and packaged dressings that I now make all my own at home: blue cheese, thousand island, and Ranch. The latter is particularly good for being such a no-brainer of a recipe.
I still remember a salad I had in Savannah in the 1980’s. The restaurant is probably long gone, but they brought the mixings to the table and the waiter tossed it on the spot. What was particularly good were the croutons, which had to be homemade.
jl
@Roger Moore: IIRC, problems in Salinas and Monterey counties eventually have been traced to animal poop in the water. Might be different in Imperial Valley.
Edit: probably not much good in Salton Sea dust!, so you might have a point about our southern grown lettuce.
hells littlest angel
@Mike in DC: Radicchio, which is technically a green, despite its reddish purple color. Endive. And, of course, arugula, which no true elitist liberal pansy can live without.
cain
@Eric U.:
The U.S. has never culturally cared about freshness. I think we’ve all grown up in the “Chef Boyadee” life and we’ve never developed that love of very fresh food that other cultures have.
We are now in the foodie life so now that stuff is more important than it was back when.
wvng
Lilly is sure looking radiant. Probably cause she didn’t eat that salad.
Christina’s in Strasburg, VA used to have wonderful salads, but has a new owner and now not so much. Disappointing. I agree most places can’t make a decent salad, and many don’t even know what that means.
joel hanes
@lamh36:
Proper Caesar dressing has anchovy.
If it was delicious, that was probably a contributing factor.
Original Caesar dressing also has raw egg; nowadays restaurants must use pasteurized replacment, or just hard-boiled eggs in a blender.
The quality of the Parmesan is another important factor.
Goku (aka Amerikan Baka)
Lily is a good girl!
jeffreyw
@emjayay: Did I mention the fucking walnuts? There were also walnuts in it. I rest my case.
emjayay
@Eric U.: I was just on a 15 person gay/academic tour of Greece mainland and two islands plus Delos, plus I went to Crete myself. Lunch was included plus hotel breakfast. OK, I don’t ever stay in hotels of that class, but even the one I chose myself in Crete (50 € cheaper than the recommended one) had totally awesome breakfasts. Lunches were usually at some normal restaurant and a couple of times at restaurants that mainly do groups like big bus/cruise ship tours. All were from pretty good to really good. Always of course with cucumber and tomato heavy Greek salads with the slab of feta. A couple of times some other salad as well. And usually a choice of entree, including “rooster”. I have no idea what the cost of the lunches (which everyone always agreed were about 5x what they normally ate for lunch) actually was.
hells littlest angel
@jeffreyw: Did I mention the fucking walnuts? There were also walnuts in it.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sEeF_SsgLUA
Kathleen
@lamh36: I love Cheesecake Factory salads!
Goku (aka Amerikan Baka)
So Dr. Drew has been making noises recently about running against Adam Schiff:
“I am constantly morally mobilized because of the condition of what’s going on here in California.”
“Morally mobilized”
Yeah, I don’t think this dweeb is going to ever run, but if he did, Schiff would wipe the floor with him
emjayay
@jeffreyw: Walnuts are part of a classic Waldorf salad. Also celery and raisins or grapes. Grow up.
Gravenstone
@jeffreyw: Because of an incident in college involving a class for non-science majors filling the floor of the science building with the stench of hot acetic acid, I cringe every time I think of wilted lettuce. Which is unfortunate, because I fondly remember my mom making it when I was younger.
Kent
@Kathleen: Never thought of trying the salads at Cheesecake Factory. I’ll have to try them next time I’m forced to eat there when chaperoning a gaggle of HS girls for whom Cheesecake Factory is the idea of fine dining.
Every time I take one of my daughters and a group of their friends out for a birthday dinner or something we always seem to end up there after all my eclectic and ethnic restaurant suggestions are vehemently vetoed! It is designed to be Peak Restaurant for teenage girls I think.
Princess
The key to a good homemade vinaigrette is a higher proportion of vinegar to oil than you have been told, and more salt than you expect.
Amir Khalid
Lily is adorable.
Try Jamie Oliver’s YouTube channel; I think he has at least one video on salads.
jeffreyw
@emjayay: I am so growed up that I don’t have to eat that walnutty mayo shit and you can’t make me. So there!
Kent
@Princess: My wife is from Chile where they really don’t do salad dressing at all. Just separate olive oil and balsamic vinegar flasks served with salt and pepper. After years of doing that I can’t really abide most salad dressings anymore.
NYCMT
John Cole – German salads competently dressed are wonderful. There’s a yoghurt vinaigrette (salt, sugar, yoghurt, vinegar, touch of oil, fresh dill, shaken up) which was a fixture of my childhood and which I make regularly for the green lettuce purchased from our local farmers market. I do a lot of fresh boiled beet salads and shredded root vegetable salads, and cabbage slaws, and fattoush, and the red kidney bean salad they used to have at Bernie’s Holiday Lodge in Rock Hill, but winter is the vale of the shadow of death for decent lettuce.
(My grandmother was from Fulda, born in a baker’s house in a room with a gilded N on the ceiling because Napoleon slept there.)
jeffreyw
@Gravenstone: Not going to to be all judgemental about the quality of cooking classes at that college but they were probably not making that salad dressing correctly.
toine
Americans eat vegetables?!? Who knew…
I thought they were only dressing for your burgers…
Gravenstone
@Goku (aka Amerikan Baka): Like most TV “doctors”, Pinsky is a self-aggrandizing attention whore.
Mary G
Always happy to see Lily angel.
Gravenstone
@emjayay: I know you’re not new here as I’ve seen your nym. But you seem unaware that jeffreyw has rather a reputation in these parts for sharing his cooking exploits. So lighten the fuck up, Francis!
SiubhanDuinne
John, for heaven’s sake! Just head for the nearest Applebee’s and do the salad bar. You’re still an American, aren’t you?
Also, Lily is just beautiful. I’m glad she’s cancer-free, naturally, but I think you and she need to call on the nurses at the chemo place so she can get a new bow.
toine
@Felanius Kootea: just bring your own avocado… :-)
Juice Box
I picked two tomatoes yesterday. They still need to ripen for a few more days, though. Life’s hard here in SoCal.
SiubhanDuinne
@Goku (aka Amerikan Baka):
The first few times I heard his name, years ago, I thought the announcer was saying “Dr. Droop Insky.” On the (extremely rare) occasions I think of him at all these days, he is “Dr. Droop” to me.
Martin
A) Cole complaining about ranch dressing, aka, the official West Virginia state vegetable, is amusing.
B) If you want a good salad, go to a place that doesn’t care about meat. I’m not saying they can’t serve meat, but it at least has to be a place where people who want a dinner of not-meat might suggest going.
One of the upsides of California, which I think is increasingly true of a decent bit of the country, is that vegans and people with dietary restrictions or cultural food preferences that deviate from that of Donald Trump are enough of the population for restaurants to take them seriously and have a menu that isn’t ‘burgers and a bunch of other garbage’. (California is quite good at burgers, I’ll add.)
Plus I’ll reiterate the benefits of local produce. California corn is at best marginal, but every component of a salad (including fruit salad) is grown here, usually year-round.
Mnemosyne
@toine:
I’m so out of the loop — what’s the deal with the avocado jokes? I can’t figure out what I missed.
Martin
@Mnemosyne: It could be worse – could be a ¼ head of lettuce plopped in a bowl served at a Trump property.
kindness
I make a giant container of salad and eat off it for the week. It’s a round cake Tupperware thingy so it keeps the salads fresh & crisp. Over a week and the lettuce starts getting limpy. I like Butter lettuce too so I just buy a couple of the ‘live’ containers of it, chop up green onions, a head of broccoli, radishes, a package of mushrooms, a package of those mulitcolored/type mini tomatoes. I take a bunch of snow peas and pull the hard cord going down both sides out, take those baby carrots and cut them in half. Then it’s either Newman’s Balsamic Vinaigrette or Marie’s Blue Cheese dressing. Too easy. Fits in one of my vegetable drawers and really does last a week. – dressing added when I eat it not when I make it.
Martin
Imma gonna stop you right there. Not saying they didn’t have a good salad, but that’s a bit like Trump having a good idea. I’m sure it happens, but not really by design.
Kathleen
@Kent: I have to admit I love Cheesecake, Panera, and Chipotle.
At Cheesecake I usually have an Asian salad. Servings are generous and the bread is yummy. Haven’t been there in forever.
I also like Panera’s Green Goddess Avocado Cobb Salad With Chicken (no bacon, no dressing).
Downpuppy
In 2018 the big salad at the kennel was romaine/apple/walnut
In 2019 it shifted to a shredded cabbage thing
Going out, either a spinach bacon or a mandarin chicken
Still, the best was a 1990s main dish salad at the old John Harvard made with salmon & green beans. Every time that place changed, the food got worse.
MomSense
If you like salads you have to visit Maine. We have so many farm to table restaurants with amazing salads and produce generally. Of course the offerings change with the seasons, but that just means they are fresher and tastier.
jeffreyw
@Gravenstone: Wait.. he was serious?
MomSense
@Kathleen:
I like the Panera green goddess, too. The spicy Thai and Mexican salads are also yummy.
moops
You can get good salads in California. Just saying.
Like most cuisine you can’t get where you live, you are going to have to step up and learn how to make a good salad. Nobody is just born knowing how to make good salads. It is not genetic. You even had a father that was amazing at it. An advantage almost none of us had. You have likely gotten to the point of figuring out it is harder than it looks. It is hard. It is perhaps even harder than you think it is. It is also important to you, and you now have an awesome garden.
I mean, you figured out canning and landscaping. Making good salads is only about twice as hard as those things. You can do it.
Ksmiami
@cain: yeah but as someone who’s worked as a Chef etc don’t go out to restaurants for a salad- honestly by the time the line cook has dumped salt and stuff even in the good places it’s not worth paying for / just make your salads at home and go out for the Foods restaurants excel at like steaks, fish, or ethnic foods.
Roger Moore
@Kathleen:
I think it’s OK to love them for what they are: places that provide a predictably good meal without a lot of fuss. None of them are going to set the world on fire with their brilliance and creativity, but they manage to maintain reasonably high standards for a nationwide chain, which is impressive in its own way.
Steeplejack
@zhena gogolia:
Dang. Saw that was on but gave it a miss. I’ll catch it next time.
Ksmiami
Ps John, I have a metric ton of great salad recipes like pears with field greens, spiced walnuts and bleu cheese, or Mediterranean red quinoa with beets, radish, tomatoes and cucumbers topped with feta and lemon vin.
Another Scott
@hells littlest angel: The CC text is hilarious, also too.
Cheers,
Scott.
sab
Akron OH may be a hick city, but Mustard Seed ( health food restaurant with attached grocery store) has a small but really nice salad bar in the grocery store, and some wonderful salads upstairs.
Downstairs at the bar, you build your own salad and then get it weighed at checkout. Three kinds of salad greens, also green onions, red onions, green olives, black olives, lentils, pumpkin seeds, quinoa, chickpeas, cheeses from parmessan, cheddar to cottage, chopped fruits, and also various other things like potato salad, fried rice and asian noodles.
My favorite upstairs is something called the Antioxidant Salad, that has all kinds of greens, with some nuts and dried cranberries, with a really delicious tangy citrus dressing, all really fresh.
Mustard Seed started about the same time and with similar concept as Whole Foods, but they kept it small, family owned and local. Three locations, all within half an hour of Ohio River tributaries.
Another Scott
@jeffreyw: rofl. :-)
Cheers,
Scott.
mousebumples
I generally avoid salads at restaurants, largely for the reasons that Cole describes above.
If I can order a spinach salad (or even Caprese salad), I’ll do that. Those tend to be wilted iceberg lettuce free.
I most commonly have salad when there’s a quiche special at the cafe near my work – comes with a spinach salad with fresh fruit (typically strawberries, maybe blueberries) and a tangy vinagrette. I’d order that by itself, but with the quiche, it just makes my day.
Auntie Anne
@jeffreyw: my mother was from WV, so she called it killed lettuce salad. I agree – it is simply the best.
feebog
It can’t be tart and flat at the same time. That is all.
moops
@Ksmiami: Disagree. A fine salad at a restaurant is a delight and most good places will have a few signature salads.
Eunicecycle
@Goku (aka Amerikan Baka): he just realized he is in Schiff’s district? Sounds like he’s really politically involved. (Eyeroll)
surfk9
@Ksmiami: As a former chef I agree wholeheartedly. There is nothing I can get at most restaurants that I cannot make better at home. The only thing we go out for any more is for ethnic food and pub food (just for the atmosphere usually)
MomSense
@sab:
My mom loves mustard seed and the candy shop – Demos?
Gravenstone
@jeffreyw: *shrug* I read it as such. Maybe I need the snarkometer balanced and rotated.
Keith P
My brother makes a surprisingly good quick salad…he takes some lettuce and just tops it with California olives, toasted almonds, some tomatoes, and Cardini’s Caesar dressing. First time I had it I was somewhat mortified since my grandfather taught us to stratch-make Caesar dressing (I still do), but it *is* a delicious salad, like what a restaurant *should* server as a house salad
chris
@Gravenstone: You weren’t alone.
It’s just a click away, a click away, a click away…
jl
@Goku (aka Amerikan Baka): Sounds like Dr. Drew should run for seat in CA state legislature. Or is that beneath him.
He talks like he doesn’t understand that Schiff can legislate all he wants 24/7 for California, but ain’t nothing constructive going to get by McConnell.
joel hanes
@Downpuppy:
salmon & green beans
For a while I worked next door to a lunch place that had a great Nicoise, and had that as part of lunch several times a week.
Baud
Holy shit. Rachel calls out the NYT on EMAILS!
Calls them garbage. (Not really about the garbage)
sab
@MomSense: I am not much for candy ( no sweet tooth ) but my husband loves Demos. Maple and Exchange Streets? Near our original Krispy Creme ( first one outside of the South).
LeftCoastYankee
My not 100% accurate rule is if there’s a salad section in the menu, you’ve got a chance.
If it’s only on the menu as an “or” side, like “… or salad or fries”, it’s a pass.
That could just be my subliminal brain justifying the fries though….
Ksmiami
@moops: depends on where u live and also how often u go out. For me personally, I wouldn’t go out to eat a salad I’d rather have more complex fare…
chris
LOL.
Ksmiami
@surfk9: Rt and making fries at home isn’t worth it omfg
Baud
@Baud:
I hope Anne Laurie posts the clip later. Rachel is an honorary jackel tonight.
Goku (aka Amerikan Baka)
@Baud:
As in Hitlery’s emails from her server in Ukraine?
JMG
Here in Boston, you have a chance, a better than fair chance, of getting a good salad. But you have to pick your spots.
eclare
Best salad I ever had was in a small town in Croatia: feta, cucumbers, and tomatoes. And I don’t even like cucumbers or tomatoes, but it was that good! Friend I was with who knows me well was amazed I ordered it.
And Lily is precious.
taras
a salad spinner is a must. and brianna’s salad dressing.
sab
@Ksmiami: We buy salads at Mustard Seed because we can build a really nice one with a variety of ingredients. With just the two of us at home, otherwise we could be throwing out lots of food since we couldn’t possibly eat all of the ingredients without acquiring a pet goat to help.
I don’t just want lettuce, spinch and a tomato. I want lettuce, spinach, arugula, kale, cabbage, green and red peppers, multiple onions and maybe some other stuff besides, but I don’t want to eat only that for the next week.
Ksmiami
@sab: salad bars are perfect for getting just enough of what you need esp for 2 ppl. I just do t order restaurant salads because I don’t eat out often and I want to be more adventurous
Barbara
@NYCMT: German salad (though I think it’s also called Lyonnaise): you cook bacon in the pan and pour off most of the grease. Then, you saute some onions and add flour (just a bit) and finally, add red wine vinegar. Add dressing to a lot of frisee lettuce, and then finish with a poached egg and the bacon. To eat the salad, you break the egg and coat the frisee thoroughly. You can find the proper proportions somewhere, but that’s the gist of it.
FelonyGovt
@Goku (aka Amerikan Baka): Dr. Drew is California’s version of Trump- a reality personality who suddenly thinks he knows all the answers. I don’t think Schiff has anything to worry about.
And
@Felanius Kootea: is right- we do have phenomenal salads in Los Angeles!
sab
@eclare: We have a restaurant by Macedonian immigrants that has my favorite meal, Chicken Vlaka. It’s a really good chicken salad with sauteed onions, tomatoes and romaine lettuce on a pita bread with feta cheese and an oil and vinegar dressing.
eclare
@sab: That does sound good!
Baud
@Goku (aka Amerikan Baka):
No, the NYT’s coverage in 2016. It was great.
Dan B
@sab: Born at Akron General Hospital and raised in Akron and Wadsworth in the 50’s and 60’s. Everytime I hear good things about Akron food I’m amazed. There was one Chinese restaurant in Akron and that was it, not even Greek, overcooked pasta Italian doesn’t count.
My brother blurted out, at a moment of silence of course, “Daddy is this chicken made of rubber?” At a dinner for the Rubber Group* at Brown Derby**.
*Non Acorns will find this hilarious.
**Not remotely related to the fabled LA dining spot.
sab
@Ksmiami: That makes sense. Restaurants should be where you eat stuff that is too hard to make at home.
lamh36
@Martin: I mean I know it’s a franchise, but I mentioned locality, cause NOLA has a way of making even the most franchised things seem better. Something bout the way we add NOLA flavor, might make it different than other franchise offering?
HinTN
@Raven:
mmmmhumm
moops
@Ksmiami: I used to reserve my eating out to just the hefty on-topic dishes, but I’ve since come to be willing to pay real money, on par with the entre, for an awesome salad. Most restaurants in my area (SF Bay area) compete in this category. When I visit other regions I only occasionally risk it.
opiejeanne
@Goku (aka Amerikan Baka): He only just realized that he lives in Schiff’s district? Really engaged voter there.
russell
back in my youth, when the ground was still soft and dinosaurs roamed the earth, I worked for a while waiting tables. I once waited on a party of French Canadians. They asked for vinaigrette, we did not have it. The asked for (a) olive oil, (b) vinegar, (c) a monkey dish, and then proceeded to make their own vinaigrette in the monkey dish. Oil, vinegar, salt, pepper. If we had a decent mustard on hand, they might have added that.
Sometimes I think Americans don’t actually know what food is.
sab
@Dan B: We have gotten a lot more diverse. I still hate Luigi’s (fifteen shapes of pasta baked in the same sauce, like Chef Boyardi, only slightly burned.) I hate having it represent our food. We have some good Italian restaurants. We have Nepalis. We have Indians. We have Yugoslavs. We have a big Arabic population, and we have always had Greeks, and Polish, and German. Lately we have some Mexican, but sadly, they don’t do tamales. We have had some good Thai restaurants for years
Also, Calvin Trillin loved our two drive in burger joints ( Swensons and Skyway)
zhena gogolia
@Steeplejack:
I only caught the last half hour.
But then we got to wallow in Written on the Wind. Perfection!
Barbara
@russell: I don’t buy dressing. I make my own dressing in the bottom of the salad plate, mixing vinegar, oil and seasonings to match the ingredients: cider vinegar plus olive oil plus maple syrup for kale, apples and walnuts.
zhena gogolia
@moops:
I had a great salad at a place in Berkeley.
Martin
@lamh36: I’d accept that. I mean, there are always exceptional chefs at uninspiring places. I was fortunate to go to college at a place where the head chef of the commons was really damn good. He worked there because he was taking care of his older mom, and there was only one restaurant in town, or the college to cook at. He loved the college theme weeks/months because it was an excuse for him to dig up traditional dishes from those cultures and cook them, and do them service. He loved that.
But I’ve eaten at Cheesecake Factory a few times and I’ll agree with above comments that for a national chain, it’s pretty decent, but that’s a fairly low bar to begin with.
sab
@Dan B: Brown Derby at Highland Square was my husband’s favorite bar before he quit drinking 35 years ago. He didn’t go there for the food.
Highland Square now is a very gay friendly neighborhood. Lots of gay residents, and also bars and restaurants. Lots of gays work and shop at at Mustard Seed.
moops
@zhena gogolia: Thankfully “I had a great salad in Berkeley” is not nearly enough information to narrow it down to even a dozen restaurants :-)
sab
@zhena gogolia: Berkeley has lots of wonderful food. I think all they do there is eat or think about eating.
Kattails
@joel hanes: An online food blog (littlespicejar if recollect rightly) suggested using a splash of nam pla if one did not care for using anchovies (or keeping them around) for caesar salad. That made sense to me, it would have the right bit of fishiness and would keep more or less forever in the fridge.
sab
@Barbara: I have a strawberrry pot that I plant with mixed herbs every year. I make my salad dressing from that, with vinegar, oil and mustard.
Comrade Colette Collaboratrice
@Martin:
Our contracted college dining service was dreadful during my first two years, and then the college fired the contractor and started their own. (ETA: it was so bad I lost the Freshman 15 instead of gaining it.) The manager of the dining hall in my dorm was a young guy fresh out of hotel school. He fell hopelessly, one-sidedly in love with a student in the year ahead of me (she was always kind to him but never led him on). Every meal he oversaw was a labor of love for Sarah. We ate amazingly well that year.
I make my own salad dressing and haven’t bought a bottle in years. It’s really easy and always better than anything you can buy.
zhena gogolia
@moops:
Right near the BART station, if that narrows it down. I can’t remember the name.
Looked it up — Gather.
Betsy
@Mike in DC: baby arugula, which is the closest thing a store has to arugula that you grow yourself, which is sublimity of sweetness and pepperiness in the same bite
love it with a grated lemon-rind vinaigrette: just olive oil, white wine vinegar, salt, pepper, and lemon zest
Dan B
@sab: In the mid 70’s a friend from Seattle was in Akron visiting family for Xmas, like me. We tried to find a gay bar. We tried a cabbie and asked at a dirty bookstore. We ended up at a brightly fluorescent lit bar that Damron’s guide said was gay, Saturday night, 7 sad looking people just drinking. We fled because a blizzard was forecast.
Jim, Foolish Literalist
@Martin:
I used to watch Chopped a lot– food network game show where professional chefs would try to make tasty dishes with a fixed and weird basket of ingredients, unusual meats like tongue or trotters or fish heads or whatever, a random spice or vegetable, a ringer like “cheese flavored crunchy snack food” (cause they couldn’t say Cheetos), “watermelon flavored hard candies” (cause they couldn’t say Jolly Ranchers). Nothing threw the pros or inspired such disdain as “ranch dressing”
evodevo
@jeffreyw: Yes. It must have been a midwestern mother thing, because my mother served it regularly. I remained unimpressed, and have never had it again after leaving home. by the way, have you ever seen the Fawlty Towers episode featuring Waldorf Salad? It was hilarious….
Never mind – I see someone beat me to it lol
Betsy
@Mike in DC: I can’t eat many raw veggies, so I’m kinda in a similar boat (maybe) but here are some salad add-ons that I’ve found: marinated artichoke hearts, segments of a good navel orange such as cara caras, canned cannellini beans or chickpeas, castelvetrano olives (from a jar), shredded red cabbage, microwaved frozen edamame, diced avocado, sliced pears with dabs of soft blue cheese.
Quick-pickled red onions also *seriously* perk up a lot of things, from salad to avocado toast. Just thinly slice a red onion and cut into 1” strips, put in a jar or glass fridge bowl and barely cover with red wine vinegar. They will be ready to use in an hour, but last weeks in the fridge. Just fork out a few whenever a flavor punch is needed.
prostratedragon
@zhena gogolia:
Yes, great movie. When you mentioned Mary Astor above, it’s the one I thought of.
Lily looks terrific!
zhena gogolia
@prostratedragon:
I hope I can see it from the beginning some time.
Betsy
@emjayay: YES, thank you. It has a perfectly good English name!
sab
@Dan B: That was a long time ago. I was still in college. My high school boyfriend was gay, and he found Akron beyond frustrating, so he moved to SF. Nowadays he might have stayed
I think he was much much happier in SF, except he died of AIDS. He could have got that here, and maybe he did. What a waste of lovely people.
?BillinGlendaleCA
@SiubhanDuinne:
Cole’s afraid he’ll end up talking to David Brooks.
?BillinGlendaleCA
@Eunicecycle: Yeah, Schiff’s only been the Congresscritter for that district for 20 years.
Comrade Colette Collaboratrice
I just want to say randomly that the new web site is SO MUCH BETTER than the old one. Thanks, Cole and jackals.
?BillinGlendaleCA
@Comrade Colette Collaboratrice: Make sure you thank WaterGirl, she’s been coordinating everything.
Barbara
@Mike in DC: Radicchio, endive or frisee all have a sharp taste. The first two go really well with blue cheeses and balsamic vinaigrette. Pears or figs would lend some sweetness.
TomatoQueen
Lilygirl, are you sitting on John’s overalls? You look mawvelous.
Somebody upthread mentioned a salad with five kinds of tomatoes. I like that kind. There’s a little Italian place on Whitney Avenue next to the vet’s office that does a lovely caprese, altho’ the mozz’ may not be derived from buffalo milk. And for some reason the arugula in the supermarket this week tasted as advertised instead of resembling shredded paper.
TCS
@sab: My favorite Trillin quote…”Never eat anything undelicious”
Jay Noble
I’m amused. Nothing considered or even approaching the status of “green leafy vegetable” other than by accident has made it into my digestive system. For me even fruit salads were looked at with extreme suspicion. I think they once got me to eat lime jello with shredded carrots but that’s it. Just could never swallow the stuff without gagging. I’ve cooked for friends and family but almost always let them do the salads or at least tell me what premade fixin’s to buy. I nearly had a meltdown when I went on my own to get dressing. Luckily one choice was easy being in Nebraska – Dorothy Lynch.
As long as no one was trying to force me to eat them I have some fond memories of salads. Salads came in laminated wooden bowls with Club crackers on the side which Mom or Dad would let us kids have. A peach or pear half filled with cottage cheese on a lettuce leaf. The various jello salads which did a greaat disservice to the jello . . .
joel hanes
@SiubhanDuinne:
the nearest Applebee’s and do the salad bar
The classics really never go out of style.
Cowgirl in the Sandi
@Martin:
Whoa! I live in Brentwood (East Bay) and our corn is certainly NOT marginal!! It is sublime. Brentwood corn is famous!!
SectionH
Just got home from (a very belated) family “Christmas” dinner with the kids, and there are too many things I could reply at too much length to. So I’ll just say, first, I’m not a fan of most lettuce salads, but I do like a good caesar salad. Kudos to the commenters pointing out you need anchovy flavor at least for a good caesar.
I’m fine with many veggies, and love some of the veggies like green or yellow/orange cauliflower that’s in season here right now. That stuff has actual flavor. Yes, good flavor.
@TomatoQueen: I hear you about arugula. Mr S loves it, and I used to try to like it, but it mostly tastes like mud to me. I mean, actual mud. The one memorable occasion was years ago in Monterey, inna salad of greens sourced from Salinas. It was everything, nutty, wonderful, I’d read the hype about. Never again, Tried the same salad at the same place a few years later: mud. It’s me, but I can’t help it. There’s def. some receptors I’m missing. Can’t smell Lonicera fragrantissima, ffs. (That’s winter honeysuckle and name means extremely fragrant honeysuckle…) It’s a bit like the poor sods who think cilantro tastes like soap. Now, I feel bad for them. ;->
NotMax
Haven’t perused the entire thread so apologies if this it repetitious.
Any half decent restaurant will bring you oil and vinegar upon request.
Jim
I live in the UK and when I make salads (for myself) I use `English` Chinese Leaves . Delightful . And when you`ve cut the salad , put on what essence you prefer .
tinare
I’m not a fan of iceberg, but one of the best salads I ever had was a wedge salad in New Orleans. I still think about that salad and salivate. It may have helped that it was eaten late in the evening after spending sometime in the French Quarter and accompanied by grilled oysters.
ABMcC
Ridiculously easy home salad:
Boston Bibb lettuce or Romaine
Crumbled goat cheese
Slightly browned pine nuts or almond slivers
Briannas blush wine vinaigrette dressing, with a big ole strawberry on the label.
laura
https://cooking.nytimes.com/recipes/1020223-via-carotas-insalata-verde
This recipe is so very incredibly delicious. It is a pain in the behind what with all the washing, but the dressing is steller.
I love salad but we are a house divided – spouse buys and eats the bagged mixed greens and I hunt for fixings at the Sunday farmer’s market. The Capay Valley hasn’t had any of the runoff-related issues that have become more frequent in the Salinas Valley fortunately.
If you find yourself in San Francisco treat yourself to the Tadich Grill’s green goddess or crab louie. House of Prime Rib makes a gigantic salad tableside that cannot be beat! Hint, there’s beets in it. Here in Sacramento, our local makes. House salad so fresh with lettuces, roasted beet chunks tomato chunks and chunks of cucumber that we dont even ask for plates but share the bowl with a pair of forks.
Sandy is right about Brentwood corn! We’ve got a rival in Davis Ranch. Big bags of ears yellow or white and so milk squirtingly fresh and sweet.
Tom
You didn’t say where you dined, but if you want a decent salad avoid the restaurant that offers ‘early bird’ specials.