Via The Post:
Americans who are fully vaccinated can go without masks or physical distancing in most cases, even when they are indoors or in large groups, federal officials said Thursday, paving the way for a full reopening of society.
The change represents a huge shift symbolically and practically for pandemic-weary Americans, millions of whom have lived with the restrictions for more than a year. A growing number have complained they cannot do more even after being fully vaccinated and criticized the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention of being overly cautious. More than 117 million Americans are now fully vaccinated, or about 35 percent of the population.
CDC officials cited a growing body of real-world evidence demonstrating the efficacy of the coronavirus vaccines and noted the shots offer protection even against more contagious variants circulating in the United States. They said they also factored in the country’s declining cases, and the rarity of breakthrough infections in people who are fully vaccinated. Nonetheless, officials cautioned the guidelines could change again if the pandemic should worsen.
Hallelujah! I haven’t ever worn a mask outdoors except on the rare occasions I had to walk through a crowd of strangers, but I live in the boonies, so it hasn’t been a thing. That said, I’m looking forward to my next grocery trip without a mask for the first time in a year.
Honestly, I think this is an admission by the CDC that many of the unvaccinated just aren’t going to get vaccinated no matter what, so there’s no need for the rest of us to suffer to try to protect them. I’m fine with that. I do feel for folks who can’t get vaccinated for medical reasons though. It’s too bad so many of our fellow citizens are aggrieved, oppositional defiant-disordered babies, but here we are.
Anyhoo, now I can collect the masks hanging on the PRNDL sticks in our vehicles, launder them one last time and hopefully put them in a drawer forever. (“PRNDL stick” is what my kid calls the gear shift in a car; it’s pronounced “prindle.”)
Open thread!
Soprano2
I know a lot of you don’t agree, but it’s about time they did this! I had a co-worker today ask me why he has to wear a face mask when he’s vaccinated and in a vehicle with another person who’s also vaccinated, and I said that the CDC says you don’t have to but the city says you do. Maybe the city will change their guidelines now.
Patricia Kayden
Amen!!
Cheryl Rofer
Here’s the official CDC page, which might not have been up when you wrote this, Betty.
Of course, the maskholes who hate masks and don’t want to be vaccinated will be the first to doff their masks. You can’t tell if someone’s been vaccinated by looking at them.
I’m gonna guess that the CDC calculated that enough people are vaccinated or have had the virus and that infection rates are down enough that unmasking the potential carriers won’t be a disaster. Let them get sick. Or maybe vaccinated.
pacem appellant
I will continue wearing masks indoors for the foreseeable future. If anybody gives me grief over it (very unlikely in the Bay Area, but there are crazies everywhere), I will verbally harass them with violence and vituperation.
Cervantes
Well, the obvious problem is there’s no way to know who has been vaccinated, and presumably the wingnuts will just stop wearing masks even though they aren’t vaccinated. Doesn’t really put people at risk who are vaccinated, but it is a problem for people who haven’t been able to do it yet or have medical reasons not to. So a bit of a concern.
prostratedragon
I use taxis (Michael Cohen’s in-laws own many medallions in Chicago as I recall) and public transit services, so will have to wait on their rules, along with the various public places I use. I’ll bet the hospital where I go a couple of times a month will be one of the last to relax.
Four Seasons Total Landscaping mistermix
I’ll bet that we’ll be wearing masks indoors in businesses in New York for a long time because maskholes and anti-vaxnuts would be the most likely liars about vaccination status.
Shalimar
I still plan on wearing a mask except when i have my “I got vaccinated but I still want some of you to stay away from me” t-shirt on.
Kelly
I live in the woods on a dead end road where two rivers meet. Rarely masked outside. When walking at somewhat busy Silver Falls State Park I pulled my mask up whenever other hikers came into view. Most other hikers did the same. Last week after the CDC said vaccinated folk could be unmasked outside mask use dropped by half. I’m OK with that.
HinTN
Some of us olds may remember PNDLR sticks. The shifter on my father’s Super 88 had one like that.
What @Shalimar: said.
TaMara (HFG)
Here’s the deal – don’t shame people who still feel they need a mask. This has been a very traumatic time for all of us.
But for me, woo-hoo! I will wear one on the plane – mostly because I always seem to get sick when I fly. Remainder of the time, going without whenever possible.
MattF
Curious how it will go in my very-blue neighborhood. I was out this morning— most people outside and all people inside were masked.
FlyingToaster
I’ll have to keep masking indoors until July 4th (which is when we expect to have most of the 18+ vaccinated by). Massachusetts has very little vaccine hesitancy, but we do have an inordinate share of massholes…
Kay
@Cervantes:
It puts really Trumpy/anti-vacc areas at higher risk, though. It isn’t going to be consistent, because some places have a much higher vaccination rate than others.
I’m with Betty though- time to cut em loose and let them sink or swim. Schools almost out so there will fewer innocent victims, although not zero innocent victims.
TaMara (HFG)
@Cheryl Rofer: Never in my life would I believe I’d have these thoughts, but the last 12 years have changed me. I realize how many actual assholes are out there. The “no seatbelts, no helmets, no condom, no mask, no vaccine” crowd can all die off as far as I’m concerned.
Goku (aka Amerikan Baka)
@Soprano2:
The reason why is because nobody can know who is vaccinated and who is not. People can and do lie. All the time. I think it’s far too soon to be doing this. Summer or fall would’ve been the earliest if case rates continued falling and vaccination rates also stayed the same
?BillinGlendaleCA
My Jetta had a PN12345R stick.
dmsilev
Look, it’s easy. Just issue 5G scanners to everyone; that will identify the vaccinated among us.
sdhays
(Link)
Betty Cracker
@TaMara (HFG): I’ve never understood why people would do that anyway. Why would I give a damn if someone else wears a mask? I’m just happy I no longer feel obligated to do so!
Eljai
@TaMara (HFG): With you on wearing a mask on a plane. Who needs to pick up some cabin crud if you can avoid it? I’m going to wear a mask on a plane forever, even though it will get in the way of my enjoying a chardonnay in flight.
Jim, Foolish Literalist
@Cheryl Rofer:
I’d go one step further…
I still worry about variants, though. Is this a sign they’re confident in the ability of existing (injected) vaccines to handle variants?
Feathers
My neighborhood is still pretty masked, but it is a dense close in suburb with multi-family homes and apartment buildings on the main roads. I did put my mask under my chin while on a side street with no one else in view yesterday. The lilacs are in bloom and it was glorious.
I did slide my mask down to stick my face into blooming lilacs last spring, even during the worst of it.
I get my second Pfizer tomorrow. Am doing laundry and stocking fridge today in case I need to take the weekend off.
Goku (aka Amerikan Baka)
@Jim, Foolish Literalist:
That’s what I’m concerned about too, as good as the mrna vaccines have been so far. Plus people who can’t be vaccinated for medical reasons
Matt McIrvin
This is a disaster. The CDC apparently doesn’t realize that motherfuckers lie, and will aggressively defend those lies.
They basically just lifted every mask mandate in the country for everyone.
Cheryl Rofer
@Jim, Foolish Literalist: The current vaccines are effective against all current variants. And it’s easy to tweak the mRNA vaccines for new variants. That’s probably part of the calculation too.
Jean
I was planning to visit my mom this summer after this long COVID year. All the residents in her Assisted Living area are vaccinated. And finally, the residents could go to the dining room for meals (50% capacity) as well as enjoy other activities at the facility. Last night, a message was sent that a staff member had tested positive and Assisted Living is back in quarantine for at least 10 days.
I talked to the director this morning, expressing my grief that had I traveled 1000 miles to see my mom this week, I would not have been able to see her after all this time. The director said she understood my frustration, but they cannot mandate the vaccine (which I know), but then said that, while they highly encourage staff to get the vaccine, some refuse, sometimes for religious reasons. She added that the infected staff member was a very compassionate person. That’s when I angrily said, “She’s not compassionate if she’s willing to risk infecting the people she works with and those she tends to.” I could scream.
Jean
What does this news say about theaters?
Brachiator
I am one of those people who don’t think that wearing a mask is a big deal. And mask wearing and social distancing probably cut down on flu and other illnesses.
But I understand that there are people who need for the pandemic to be over, to also need to have some absolute physical symbol that indicates that we have magically returned to “normal.” And of course there are the crackpots who have a stick up their ass over their “freedoms” and who need to be able to declare victory over a government which tried to save their stupid asses.
Ultimately, you have to try to protect everybody. You cannot separate the worthy from the unworthy.
kindness
Does it say if we are allowed to demand proof of vaccination status? The town I live in has been really good with everyone wearing masks but last weekend when I visited a grocery store in a town about 10 miles away towards the sticks I was shocked that half the people had no masks on at all.
I’m being sarcastic but I’m also meaning we can’t just take people at their word.
Show Me Your Papers!!!
TaMara (HFG)
Biden is going to be speaking at 3:45 pm EDT – I’m sure on the mask stuff, but here he spoke on the pipeline hacking moment ago. I don’t want to put up another thread, it will probably be a short speech. I’ll post a link when it’s available in this thread.
Ken
Anticipating schadenfreude when Pelosi and Schumer announce that Congress will follow the new guidelines, and some GQP start getting angry calls from their districts when they reveal that they’re fully vaccinated.
darms
Pir-nin-dle
Jim, Foolish Literalist
@Jean: per this tweet from Laurie Garrett, movie theaters are okay for the be-shotted.
I checked her feed because she and Michael Osterholm have consistently been the most cautious/pessimistic of all talking heads on MSNBC. I said to myself last year, when these two say there’s good news, it’s gonna be good news.
Kay
To me, the masks were the best part of a bad situation. Something easy I can do, made sense intuitively, brought a kind of solidarity with the extremely nice people who made masks and gave them to me.
I will never, ever understand the level of resistance and complaining to masks. It was easy.
These people better hope there’s never anything actually hard we have to do as a group. We’ll all die.
JaySinWA
I´been trying to mask up when I mow or weed whack, since reading about people getting allergy relief as a mask side effect. It seems to help. I´ll try and mask up more outdoors this pollen season.
So no, don´t mask shame people or assume they are overcautious.
Jean
@Jim, Foolish Literalist: Excellent. I have had a years worth of Broadway tickets in Richmond, VA, and naturally, no play has been performed of that paid-for season yet.
Mike in NC
How many Idiot-Americans will refuse the vaccines? I’ll go with a minimum of 27%.
Benw
I’m fully vaxxed. If I’m around people I trust to be vaccinated, I’m down. The very low chance any of them are infectious x the very low chance they could infect me is about where I’m comfortable right now. Multiple low probability failure points. My wife and I went to our first dinner party since COVID times last week with people we trust to be vaxxed – some of them formed up a little team with me when NYers were frantically hunting appts back in February – and it was amazingly nice to sit around a table and eat and chat.
I’m still masking in stores because fuck standing next to some infectious asshole with even a very low probability of me getting it. I am NOT getting it now
Starfish
My younger sister was diagnosed with advanced cancer before the shots rolled out to her age group. We were supposed to get her first shot tomorrow, but they said a week after her chemo hey white blood cells are lowest so she waits another week.
catclub
Reminds me of the caller on Bob and Ray: “I live in the part of Nebraska(?) where no one ever goes.”
Jim, Foolish Literalist
@Kay:
they all think if they were part of the Greatest Generation, they’d have single-handedly taken out Nazi machine gun nests with a Bowie knife, not back home working in a factory with rationed meat and a victory garden. Just like nobody was ever a serf in a past life…
zeecube
@TaMara (HFG): Second your mask protocol. Covid not the only crud fellow travelers may carry with them when the board a plane. Also, don’t forget hand sanitizer. I can recall at least 2 occasions where the cold or flu I caught I could trace back to air travel. Now that I have a handy supply of N95 masks, might as well use them when warranted.
catclub
@Mike in NC:
That would be nice.
In my county it is the reverse. 27% have completed two doses.
Vaccinations are available in multiple sites with no appointment.
grrrr
Soprano2
As best as I can tell, it was people who are angry that a liberal government told them to do something they didn’t want to do, full stop. Just like your 5-year-old throws a tantrum when you say they can’t have dessert before dinner, they threw a fit. I think it’s just that simple. Liberals said they should wear them, so of course they don’t want to. It’s a great illustration of Cleek’s Law.
I’m wondering what this will do to my city’s plan to move from yellow to green. It might speed it up a little bit.
Kay
@Jim, Foolish Literalist:
It’s like “agency” and “free will” are wholly negative, like those words mean “resistance”. That’s not what they mean. They can mean “cooperation” or “taking one for the team” or “sacrifice”.
Such a dark, dark view. Such incredible cynicism.
meander
Some important caveats in the CDC announcement (my emphasis):
catclub
@Brachiator:
If things go as planned I will travel to South Korea for work this fall.
and someone on our team pointed out that mask wearing in that part of Asia is an all the time thing. mask wearing all the time during flu season cold become a thing. wearing seatbelts has become pretty common, and smoking is much less common than 30 years ago.
Kay
Anyway, good job all of you who pitched in and bad job to all the people who “refused” and insisted on dressing it up as some kind of civil rights issue instead of what it was, which was whining.
We’ll know who to turn to when things get bad- NOT any of the crybabies who behaved like wearing a mask was cutting off their head. Not reliable.
?BillinGlendaleCA
I’m getting a new stove today to replace the one that from what I can determine was installed during the Clinton administration. I’ve cleaned around it, it’s really gross.
Parfigliano
@Jim, Foolish Literalist: These mask fighting anti-vax assholes would have never planted a victory garden.
Betty Cracker
@Brachiator: We did try to protect everybody. The Biden administration did by surging hundreds of millions of vaccines at great expense so that everyone in the country could get one FOR FREE. The rest of us did our bit by wearing masks in public, even after we were personally safe via vaccination. I’m not sure what else we’re expected to do for people who are too goddamned stubborn to help themselves. Fuck ’em.
tinare
Crap. Now I have to pluck my chin hairs.
Aziz, light!
@dmsilev: Bill Gates has the master record. From time to time your nanobots will get firmware updates.
Brachiator
Putting going mask-free into context in Los Angeles County. I am hoping that the promise of being able to go without masks encourages more people to get vaccinated. From a recent news story.
Recently, the county decided to allow/encourage walk-in appointments. And so I got an email from Kaiser a couple of days ago saying that I could walk into a Kaiser health facility and get the shot. Fortunately, I am fully vaccinated.
I know that there will continue to be holdouts and some dopes who conclude, “well, masks are not required anymore, so I will just ignore anything related to the virus and assume that I am home free.” But some folks may do the right thing for themselves and their community.
Betty Cracker
@Jean: That is infuriating, and you’re right, there’s nothing at all compassionate about that selfish asshole. Anyone in that situation who won’t get vaccinated should find another line or work or be fired, IMO.
JDM
There are several personal habits I’m going to change permanently as a result of this pandemic. One is that I’m going to wear a mask on airplanes and during flu season when I’m amongst people. I don’t get flu that often but I’ve had two very annoying cases in the past two decades, both involving casinos and flu season.
The other is that when we travel, we’re going to spend more; for instance, Scandinavia is no longer “too expensive to visit”.
mrmoshpotato
@?BillinGlendaleCA: Ah, cleaning around the stove. Fun times.
Keith P.
Most of my friends refuse to get vaccinated. They’re also in their early 40s and in pretty good health, with one having gotten mild COVID. I have health issues and am terrified of having another hospital stay, so I got vaccinated. Everyone understood me getting vaccinated, and frankly, I understood where they’re coming from. The demand for vaccines is low enough to where anyone who is susceptible and has not vaccinated have to come to terms with whatever happens to them. As long as the hospitals aren’t being overrun, I’m over the COVID panic….being fully vaccinated, I am as protected as I can reasonably expected to be and assume a near statistical impossibility that I will catch a severe case of it. So yeah, I’m done with masks (except at my dialysis clinic, where it is still required, but I cut them slack on that stuff)
mrmoshpotato
@Aziz, light!:
What about our StoryBots? TAAAAAAHDAAAAA!!!!
Barbara
@Kay: This X1000. My dry cleaner made dozens of masks and gave them away when customers dropped off their clothes. She and her husband and all their kids eventually got Covid and their 18 year old son nearly died and faces long-term rehabilitation. I think about her, confronting incredible business hardship, trying to help her customers, and then being laid low by people who basically don’t give a flying fuck about anybody else. I am never going to feel the same about the soul of our nation again.
Mart
Vaccinated but I will keep masking inside. Still concerned about variants exposing our 2 yo grandchildren. Always have been OK with outside no mask and ten feet. Now trying to relax unmasked outside at three feet. It has been nice going 14 months without getting sick. Going to be hard for me to adjust. Hopefully going forward we just terrorist fist bump everyone at gatherings, and not have to shake men’s hands and hug the women. Yuck.
?BillinGlendaleCA
@mrmoshpotato: It’s much worse than that, cleaning under the old stove that hasn’t seen the light of day for 25 years.
Barbara
@Keith P.: The problem is that you get vaccinated not just for yourself but for those people for whom vaccination won’t work who remain vulnerable. I read an article about a guy with an immunological condition who has been vaccinated but who has been unable to form immunity to Covid. So no, I don’t understand your friends. I will never understand your friends. It’s free and it’s less of a risk than the disease itself. Why wouldn’t you want to protect other people?
rivers
A lot of small businesses near me (New York City adjacent) have been very careful throughout the pandemic – limited number of people allowed in, everyone must always be masked, and I have never seen anyone fail to comply. Does this mean these businesses are not allowed to require masks for customers? (Because how can they know whether customers are vaccinated or not?)
?BillinGlendaleCA
@Barbara:
Because they’re assholes.
ARoomWithAMoose
For everyone that says they are going to keep the masks and hand sanitizer for travel (good!), a short article with some graphs showing how effective the covid containment protocols where at controlling the spread of flu, the flu in the northern hemisphere disappeared early 2020 and didn’t return winter/spring 2021, and the 2020 flu season for the southern hemisphere never started;
https://www.scientificamerican.com/article/flu-has-disappeared-worldwide-during-the-covid-pandemic1/
mrmoshpotato
@?BillinGlendaleCA: That’s where steam mops are awesome. “Oh, the kitchen floor is that shade!”
Brachiator
@Betty Cracker:
I understand your frustration, and share it. But the virus don’t care who has it and who doesn’t. Infection doesn’t stop with the stupid.
Sasha
I desperately want a national vaccine passport so that the anti-vaxxers will suffer major FOMO.
citizen dave
Was at two different farmers markets in the last two weeks (Carmel and northside of Indianapolis)–I’d say 95% masking happened. Going to a different one this week, but now expecting 5% or less masking…
Also hitting an indoor master gardeners’ plant sale–can’t predict that one.
Not sure how to feel about it. Indiana’s numbers are falling, but slowly.
ChrisS
@Starfish: Best wishes to you, your sister, and your families
Cancer sucks.
TaMara (HFG)
Here is the Biden feed on his afternoon remarks:
Betty Cracker
@rivers: Nope — according to the CDC guidance Cheryl linked above, businesses, local governments, etc., are free to impose their own restrictions.
Bluegirlfromwyo
@Jean: My stepson does sound at theaters in Richmond. FWIW, he says those shows will start coming back in September.
Benw
@Starfish: sorry about your sis. Having family going through chemo is hard. Fuck cancer!
Steve in the ATL
@Cheryl Rofer: can you really trust anyone who’s based in Atlanta?
Benw
@Steve in the ATL: in OutKast we trust
Kay
@Barbara:
The whole “lock down” thing. We were never “locked down”. I’d see people at the drive thru at the McDonalds and they’d be “I hate being locked down”.
Oh, yeah, it’s brutal. Enjoy your milkshake.
Baud
Awesome. Next up: Depanting.
citizen dave
@Bluegirlfromwyo: On the web yesterday and saw some concerts being scheduled for the fall (on you tune watched a promo for a Genesis–of all things! tour this year in the U.S.).
88 year-old Willie Nelson again scheduling dates–some makeups from the Before Times (2 in my state I’m watching-no dates yet).
Ceci n est pas mon nym
The problem with maskholes is that they have a higher than average chance of being carriers, since you know they go to superspreader events and associate with other unmasked infectious idiots.
So I really don’t know about going completely unmasked in public when there are large numbers of strangers around. Not yet.
I reach full immunity in about 10 days. We go on our first trip more than 5 miles from home in three weeks. I guess I’ll wait and see what things look like then, both in terms of prevalence and in human behavior.
artem1s
Unfortunately this will be interpreted in the worst way possible by those who we most need to continue to adhere to masking protocols and who haven’t or won’t get vaccinated. I guess we’ll see after a summer of giant indoor and outdoor superspreading events if we end up like India.
Gravenstone
The smug gleam in the eyes and scowl on the faces of the anti-vaxxers might be somewhat of an indicator.
Betty Cracker
@Kay: Haha, that’s such a good point: lockdowns — with drive-thru service! I remember early on in the pandemic, some countries really did lock people down, as in establishing checkpoints where they’d look at your license to see if you were five miles away from home or whatever.
I also remember seeing a viral video of a TV address from a health official somewhere — from the accent, I’m guessing she was in the Caribbean — telling people you’re allowed to leave home to go to the store once a week to get groceries. And if you find you only have rolls and you’d rather have your sandwich on sliced bread, she said eat the damned rolls or something like that.
THAT was lockdown. The whiny babies of Red America would perish of spite and self pity in an actual lockdown.
Barbara
@Kay: Calling to mind the guy who howled about the hardship of not being able to get a free refill for his soda if he was forced to use the drive-through.
BruceFromOhio
@pacem appellant:
This. My county is still popping 20+ cases per 100k per day, only has 37% full vax rate, and ICU at +60% capacity. I welcome some maskhole making my day.
mrmoshpotato
@Kay:
That annoyed me too. Cops weren’t stopping people who were outside “Prove that you’re really going straight to the grocery store.” and arresting them otherwise.
Was the past year frustrating, anxiety-inducing? Yes. But I don’t know of any US city that imposed a year-long curfew.
JMG
My town still has its mask mandate for all indoor spaces and outdoors in the very very small downtown business area (it’s like five blocks of one street). As a summer tourist destination, the town fathers are likely to be reluctant to lift it.
BruceFromOhio
@Betty Cracker:
If only …
Jinchi
Just scheduled my middle schooler to get dose 1 next week!
I expect we’ll see a sharp jump in the number of vaccinations/day again.
BruceFromOhio
@citizen dave:
WOO HOO HELLA MEGA BABY! Also just scored 4 seats for Halestorm/Evanescence in DETROIT ROCK CITY BABY!
Can. Not. Wait.
hueyplong
Heh heh, now it the time to cash in on all those months of indoor shedding training from the Hillary Clinton Manual. The spousal unit and I, sleeper cell librulz planted in this red area 15 years ago, will now commence our wave of terror [rubs hands like Major Strasse]. No diner patron will be safe.
steve g
@Keith P.:
“They’re also in their early 40s and in pretty good health”
They will very likely have gotten a vaccine to a coronavirus by the time they are old and gray. The coronavirus category will be with us for quite a while. They no doubt have had a bunch of vaccines by now. Here is the list of required vaccines for Kindergarten, in Florida:
People are kidding themselves if they think they don’t need or depend on vaccines. It is how modern societies handle a range of public health issues, and they are here to stay.
Redshift
No offense, but I really don’t care for takes like this. I think the reason is accumulating evidence that the vaccines really do prevent people from spreading the virus (those neutralizing antibodies that were in a study in the morning covid thread recently, plus the general pattern of the unvaxed being nearly all the new cases.) That’s the thing we really didn’t know before, and it took time to find out.
And that’s why I also don’t think much of “this is what I’ve been saying for a while” or “more people would get vaxed if they said this.” So? It’s not about what you believe, or even if you were proven right when the evidence came in, it’s about whether the evidence is there when the decision was made, which it wasn’t.
I believe that when they’re not improperly pressured, the CDC follows the evidence and is cautious in the face of unknowns. To me, thinking the CDC is lying about their reasons and they’ve really just given up on the wingnut assholes is as bad as them just doing what TFG wanted when he was in charge.
MisterForkbeard
@Cheryl Rofer: I made buttons for just this occasion. “Who’s got two thumbs and a covid vaccine?”
Going to be wearing mine when I go out after my full vaccination kicks in. Might still wear a mask anyway when I’m indoors.
Leslie
I will continue to wear a mask in stores and other public indoor spaces, and when traveling. It’s easy to do, and will reduce my risk of flu and other respiratory ailments. Besides, Covid is unlikely to be the last pandemic in my lifetime (with apologies to those who don’t want to think about that), so normalizing mask use is an ongoing public good.
mrmoshpotato
@?BillinGlendaleCA: Multiple passes on the Scrub setting. :) What I’m saying is that steam mops rule.
geg6
@Patricia Kayden:
This dude is such a curious case to me. He was one of the biggest assholes of the Tea Party era and now is one of the most outspoken and, dare I say, woke people among the Never Trumpers. I still wonder what woke him up. Has he ever given an explanation?
MattF
OT. Fairly amazing NYT article about how James O’Keefe’s ‘Project Veritas’ attempted to discredit Trump administration officials who were deemed to be part of the deep state.
citizen dave
@BruceFromOhio: As Neil Young sang, I think it is called Union Man (on Hawks & Doves): Live Music is Better. Bumper Stickers Will Be Issued
Redshift
Oh, and in case anyone is wondering what the anti-mask open-the-schools freedumb bubble thinks about authorizing the vaccines for kids, based on the one wingnut account I monitor on twitter, it’s “this must be government corruption so Big Pharma can make more money, because all the evidence shows that kids can’t catch it and don’t spread it.”
I presume “all the evidence” means all that’s approved by the bubble, and they’re never told about covid being the number one cause of death in children, etc…
Jim, Foolish Literalist
@Leslie:
I think it was Sanjay Gupta who said the next pandemic will– not may, no ‘probably’– come from the meat industry. I think he was specific about waste lagoons associated with pork factories.
(and my apologies in turn…)
BruceFromOhio
@?BillinGlendaleCA:
Until I read this I could not for the life of me understand what the hell this was. “PRNDL? WTF is that?”
My 5-spd Fit doesn’t have the “P” or the “N”.
?BillinGlendaleCA
@mrmoshpotato: I actually have a steam mop, but it’s in the back of the closet and I ain’t going there. I’ll just use the regular mop and Pinesol.
Redshift
@Cheryl Rofer:
There was more detail about that in this morning’s COVID post. The thing to keep in mind is that even 50% protection, which doesn’t seem great, can be enough to take a variant down from “potential new wave” to “watch for local outbreaks and deal with them.” And there does seem to be a lot of evidence that existing vaccines provide at least that much protection. (Remembering, of course, that 50% means half the people who would have been infected aren’t, not that half the people got infected.)
?BillinGlendaleCA
@BruceFromOhio: Now, my Prius has the joystick shift, confuses Madame since it returns to center after you select your gear.
BruceFromOhio
@hueyplong:
This is great material! Masked, I can –
– Claim I’ve been darted, and calmly state that “I’m protecting everyone because I’m shedding proteins like crazy!”
– Claim “I ain’t gettin’ no shot, vaxxer, and YOU CAN’T MAKE ME!” while gesticulating wildly and bugging my eyes out.
– Mix and match according to the establishment and the accuser.
Leslie
@Jim, Foolish Literalist: Meat industry workers were certainly among those at highest risk this time around. I haven’t seen many data about pork specifically, but I know those lagoons are nasty. I thought of them as more of a threat to groundwater, though.
Keith P.
@Barbara: So what’s the long-term plan for these people who can’t get vaccinated? A year from now, and the pandemic is declared over, are we all supposed to wear masks so these people don’t get sick? Why not make everyone wear masks for all the other immuno-suppressed people running around?
janesays
@Cheryl Rofer: Right. And to be clear, the CDC isn’t saying it’s OK for unvaccinated people to go unmasked. They’re also saying that local ordinances and private business rules should still be observed. I’m guessing most grocery stores will continue to require masking for a little while longer, and as long as they do, you should continue to observe those rules. Vaccinated or not.
catclub
@BruceFromOhio:
my six speed has R 1 3 5
_ 2 4 6
janesays
@prostratedragon: The CDC is still advising that masks should be worn while riding public transportation and in public transportation hubs, even if you have been vaccinated. The easing up on restrictions did have several notable exceptions.
catclub
@janesays:
Singing in groups?
janesays
@TaMara (HFG): The CDC is still advising that masks be worn on all public transportation for now (including planes), regardless of vaccination status. I imagine most airlines won’t give you a choice about whether or not you have to wear a mask for now. And that’s fine.
Falling Diphthong
I feel like we’re down to
a) Masks off in the next few months (if you want) and go on with our lives, with a lot of sympathy for the immunocompromised.
b) Masks on until the MAGAts stop being assholes.
Since (b) isn’t happening, I say we go with (a). And some small number of the vaccine “hesitant” may find that if everyone is ignoring them, might as well get the shot so they can see a Mets game or whatever thing they want to do. It’s narcissistic, it’s oppositional defiance in very disordered thinking you don’t like to see in adults… but let’s make their latest pity party and conspiracy theory something the rest of us reliably ignore.
hueyplong
@janesays: Like many companies, their liability carriers probably make their rules.
janesays
@catclub: The CDC recommends continued masking requirements for everyone (including fully vaxxed people) in all healthcare facilities (doctors offices, clinics, hospitals), all nursing homes and assisted living facilities, all prisons, all homeless shelters, all public transportation hubs (airports, bus depots, train stations), and all public transportation vehicles.
geg6
@Betty Cracker: THIS.
Fuck ’em all. I have lost every bit of empathy or compassion for these people. I hope they all die.
catclub
@Keith P.:
,
95% immunity means 1 in 20 chance of non-immunity. People who buy lottery tickets don’t think a 1 in a million chance is statistical impossibility. good luck!
Obdurodon
@Redshift: Thank you. Well said.
I think we’ve reached the inflection point where the residual risk to or from people who are vaccinated but unmasked is dwarfed by the risk from people who were never going to mask properly – e.g. taking them down when nobody’s looking, wearing them below the nose, wearing fake masks that they know don’t filter squat – or get vaccinated anyway. Is that following the science? Yes, because human behavior has always been part of the science.
Personally, having reached “two doses plus two weeks” myself exactly today, I’m tempted to ditch the mask entirely. But mask wearing *has* become a political issue and a source of fear for many, so what I’ll do instead is reciprocal masking. I’ll bring one and if I see someone else with theirs up I’ll put mine up, but I won’t go first. I don’t know their reasons. I don’t *need* to know their reasons. Just like I try to respect others’ religious observances, I’ll try to respect their mask observances because it makes a difference to them and it costs me nothing. It’s a net win.
Origuy
Stupid criminal tricks.
Executive Summary: He parked his own truck in sight of a security camera.
Betty Cracker
@Redshift: I don’t think the CDC was lying before, but I do think their recommendations take human behavior and suppositions about how CDC recommendations affect people’s attitudes and behavior into account. How can they not? Human behavior and attitudes directly drive public health outcomes in this case.
So, if the CDC has determined that requiring masks indoors when it’s pretty damned safe NOT to wear a mask isn’t encouraging vaccine resisters to get vaccinated and is causing the already vaccinated to chafe at recommendations in general, they change the recommendation. That’s legit, IMO. It’s not in the same universe as Trump hacks downplaying risks to save their boss’s bacon.
Major Major Major Major
Saw that, great news for a few reasons. One, will probably lead to more vaccinations, which is good for everybody. Two, improves the lives of the responsibly vaccinated. Three, obviously this doesn’t stop anybody who wants to from continuing to wear a mask. I don’t know if I’ll ever go back to being maskless on transit. But I am looking forward to being maskless at the gym and in non-crowded stores.
Since I’m fully mRNA vaccinated and only 36, my odds of severe illness are vanishingly low–and that’s if somebody infectious sneezes on me. NYC is under 1000 cases a day now, so the odds of serious exposure are pretty low, and then you have to factor in the nearly-zero odds of developing a severe illness in the 5% of cases where I catch it. I’m not too concerned for my personal safety. Life has to carry on at some point. I’m sure I’ll get this disease before I die, but I keep up to date on all my shots so it won’t be that bad when I do.
Geminid
@geg6: What woke Joe Walsh up? Probably trump, and his cult. Self-described conservatives at the Virginia political journal Bearing Drift have drawn conclusions about the Republican Party similar to Walsh’s. The spineless acquiescence of most Virginia Republicans to their tinhorn leader has repulsed these people. At least one writer calls himself a Democrat now, and several others have said they will be voting for likely Democratic governor nominee Terry McAuliffe this coming state election.
Major Major Major Major
@Four Seasons Total Landscaping mistermix:
idk, I can see Cuomo lifting restrictions soon
geg6
@BruceFromOhio:
Similar here. This stupid county (Beaver County, PA) went for TFG and have been total assholes about masking, etc. We only have a 31% vaccine rate. And lots of new cases still. I will not be going into any restaurants for sit down service any time soon and will only be going to outside dining in our neighboring county (Allegheny County, which is the home of the city of Pittsburgh) because they have done a stellar job of mitigating and vaccinating. In fact, I had to get my vaccine jabs in Allegheny County.
Chris T.
Ah, the Prindler! (But I have D-N-R-P buttons in my EV. If we could come up with a word for “neutral” starting with “E” I could have DERP buttons!)
PaulWartenberg
I’m a librarian.
I’m going to keep wearing my masks.
I’m going to live forever.
Keith P
@catclub: protection of severe infection is more like 99%. The sky ain’t falling
J R in WV
And one of the biggest problems with the next pandemic will be all the current anti-vax, anti-mask Covid deniers telling us all how we can’t trust the CDC because their new advice for New-Plague-25 is totally not what we were told to do for Covid-19. Because Ebola was so much like Covid-19, right?!
They won’t quarantine when necessary and appropriate, they won’t wear masks, even if the gov’t sends them out in the US Mail for free, and they sure won’t put up with a actual shut-down to stop a more horrid plague like Ebola. Covid-19 was an easy plague compared to Ebola, which had something like a 95% rate of fatality, and horrible symptoms while you die.
Covid mostly is like a bad cold for a high percentage of victims, only horrible for the long-haul folks and people on a vent for months. Ebola is terrifying, and no more treatment options than we had for Covid in the beginning.
We will be wearing masks as much as possible for as long as possible, esp when out and about. At a show/movie/performance, etc, we WILL be wearing a mask unless actually putting food or beverage into my mouth.
Baud
@PaulWartenberg:
I’m going to learn how to fly.
karen marie
@TaMara (HFG): I intend to continue wearing a mask in stores. It’s been over a year since a stranger told me to smile, and I’m good with that.
Cheryl Rofer
Major Major Major Major
Another cool thing is that NYC opened up drop-in vaccination centers in Penn Station and Grand Central. Vaccinated about 1,100 people today. No residency requirement.
Ohio Mom
I don’t know what to make of this news.
I should feel safe, I guess — my family and I are fully vaccinated, as are our families and friends — but the numbers in my area still aren’t as low as they were last summer. And the exponential drop in cases isn’t happening here, we’ve been on a plateau for over two months.
It’s going to take me a while to digest this.
karen marie
@Keith P.: ICUs in Arizona are at 84% capacity. I don’t know what non-COVID ICU capacity is typically but that doesn’t seem like a “take your mask off and party” number.
debbie
I have no plans to stop masking when I’m shopping, etc. Screw the assholes.
Mary G
Since the latest study says my RA med makes the vaccines 30 times less effective I’m going to be in a mask for a very long time when I’m out and about. It’s not likely anyone will give me grief over it since I don’t frequent Huntington Beach and in a wheelchair. Happy for America, now we have to get the rest of the world taken care of. Especially India.
Jinchi
@Keith P.:
The pandemic will not be declared over if significant numbers of people like your friends refuse to get vaccinated.
This is what has exasperated the rest of us. If they really want life to return to normal, they need to not be a petri dish for the pandemic to breed in. Otherwise, we’ll be in a continuous cycle of outbreaks.
If they want to know what it looks like to go from a self-congratulatory We defeated the virus! to bodies stacked up like cordwood a month later, have them read the news out of India.
BruceFromOhio
@geg6:
I met MrsFromOhio at school in Pittsburgh. We celebrate 35 years next week. Love the people, love the city, despise the football team. One of our first trips “after” will be an overnight so we can walk around Point Park and other old haunts.
I hope you can find a nice patio with good service, good company and a nice view, it sure seems pretty out there in Beaver.
Major Major Major Major
@karen marie:
About 80%.
Jim, Foolish Literalist
@Mary G:
I had the thought this may be on step toward loosening up those AstraZeneca vaccines we own but almost certainly won’t use.
Bill Arnold
@kindness:
Can always make them lie. Enthusiastically ask “where did you get vaccinated?”
A large fraction of those who lie will feel guilty about it.
phein62
@Eljai: Back when I use to travel for work two or three weeks a month, we would pick up some sort of respiratory disease we called the “ECAS Crud,” after the program we were working. Funny how it went away when a different organization took over that program.
tandem
Has anyone read anything useful on the Yankees situation — half a dozen fully vaccinated people testing positive? It seems like a big cluster, given how few breakthrough infections have been reported. But maybe other breakthrough infections didn’t happen in situations with such meticulous testing and contact tracing (which would mean more breakthrough infections than we think).
Ceci n est pas mon nym
@Bill Arnold: Especially if you make them get detailed about their story. “Did you have worse side effects on the second shot? Did you notice any weird headaches?”
Speaking of side effects, I’m having a very weird positive one. The immune system boost seems to have chased my chronic sinus infection (that I’ve had for over a year now) away. Not totally, but I can breathe through my nose, and I can’t remember the last time that was true.
Ben Cisco
@Kay:
Kay, you’re the greatest!
hueyplong
@tandem: I’d wait on that Yankees story for a few days.
Obdurodon
@tandem: Apparently it was J&J. I don’t want to cast aspersions on J&J in general, but they have had some production problems so maybe the Yankees all got a bad batch? If so, that would fall within expected cases from accident or human error and not reflect on the vaccines themselves.
Matt McIrvin
@J R in WV: An Ebola outbreak here would probably be easier to contain because there’s no long period of asymptomatic transmission.
Matt McIrvin
@Obdurodon: My impression is that it’s a pretty expected level just from the regular operation of the J&J. Most of them had no symptoms.
phein62
@Redshift: If anyone wants to know what CDC is thinking, you can subscribe to Morbidity And Mortality Weekly, CDC’s in-house publication, and see all their COVID-19 reports: https://www.cdc.gov/mmwr/Novel_Coronavirus_Reports.html
Ken
@Bill Arnold: “Moderna or Pfizer?” is also popular. We’ve all become vaccine connoisseurs.
Fair Economist
I have mixed feelings. Were this strictly enforced, fine, but as several have pointed out it effectively means the end of mask mandates since you can’t know if somebody walking by is vaxxed. Dropping the mask mandates makes sense to me once everybody who’s going to be vaxxed is, *but* I think it’s a bit early because there are still a lot of procrastinators/teens/wobblies who would be vaxxed in a month or so. Our case rate is not yet low enough that we can live with a bump while vaccinations get finished, either.
I think California’s plan to lift mandates in mid-June worked out to be about the right time. Kinda wish this announcement had been delayed a month
For me, I’ve found my nose appreciates me wearing a mask.
Bill Arnold
@Keith P.:
They do not know the long term negative sequelae(consequences) of COVID-19, or their probabilities.. Nobody really knows, yet. (There’s also the low probability of death.) This and SARS-1 are the only respiratory viruses spreading among humans which use ACE2. (SARS-1 much less so.)
They are fools. IMO. This disease can affect much of the body, including the brain.
catclub
@Chris T.:
Equivocating
Steve in the ATL
@phein62:
Sounds like a fun beach read!
Steve in the ATL
@Ken: at our first dinner party when things open up, we’ll serve grand cru to the Pfizer people and boxed white zin to the Moderna ones!
catclub
@Ben Cisco:
Who chats with other people at a McDonalds drive thru? Does she work there?
I haz qwestiuns.
lamh36
I am an essential worker and I know folks who have had COVID and who have died from COVID and I’m not “celebrating” the mask thing.
But I understand folks being wary, but honestly I think It’s pretty obvious that most people don’t understand how vaccines work or primary transmission of respiratory viruses and that is why you have so much pushback when it comes to any regulations about mask on/off. ??♀️
As a Microbiologist if you knew how many deadly infectious diseases you come into contact with on a daily basis, you may NEVER go without a mask or PPE (personal protective equipment) COVID or no-COVID. The fear of disease would keep ya inside ya house.
But the knowledge I have as a experienced person on transmission and infectious disease cycles and efficacy of vaccine and the like, compared to a layman who doesn’t have the same experience, allows me to understand and feel a bit more freedom and comfort with the mask stuff.
I don’t expect a layman to have the same understanding as I do. So I’m of the school wear a mask or don’t, but the fear of COVID non-vaxxers is not the primary reason I will choose to wear/not wear a mask in certain situations
NotMax
@Ken
Red wine with Moderna, white wine with Pfizer.
;)
Redshift
@Betty Cracker: Fair enough. I’d be interested to know if there’s something in the details of the report implying that. I could see them taking that into account, since the goal of the recommendations is to keep the most people safe, but if so, I wouldn’t think they would fail to mention it. (Though they might couch it in less obvious terms than “since we can’t count on you idiots to do what’s actually best for you and everyone else…”)
trollhattan
@sdhays:
A major? Dang.
Steve in the ATL
@lamh36: how much overlap in the Venn diagram of anti-vaxxers and gun nuts? They have more than one way of killing you.
NotMax
@trollhattan
Magic 8-ball sez: “Ain’t gonna be a major for long.”
Captain C
@Jim, Foolish Literalist:
FTFY
Mudbrush
@citizen dave: Awful hard to find a job; on one side the government, the other, the mob !
burnspbesq
I’m still old and with multiple co-morbidities, and Texas is never going to get out of the woods, so I will be masking and distancing for the foreseeable future.
Kay
The people who were truly locked down, in a way that made me sad, were people in nursing homes and also kids , although not “locked down”, sacrificed a ton -their lives were turned upside down.
So we had two stoic, resilient groups in this country who didn’t whine incessantly about what really were profound disruptions in their lives and they were… the very old and the very young.
burnspbesq
@Chris T.:
‘Don’t you have a “B” setting (for regenerative braking engaged)?
My VW id4 has P, N, R, D, B
germy
My son had his first Moderna shot but isn’t due for his second until the beginning of June.
He works in a restaurant where customers have spent the past year trying to enter without masks and trying to start fights about it.
I assume all sorts of unvaccinated people will be sauntering into his place of business.
This new unmask mandate; I wish the CDC had waited until the middle of June. I worry about him
lamh36
@Steve in the ATL: true dat
Barbara
@Keith P.: Of course not. My guess is that he is always going to be cautious, but it does mean that to the extent that people can get vaccinated people like him will be less likely to be made sick by casual exposure. I am just saying that most vaccines, including childhood vaccines for measles or chicken pox, are intended most to help outliers — those who can’t make immunities, those who have underlying health conditions, and the random people who are at the tail end of the spectrum of disease severity. This isn’t new. I had chicken pox and mumps and measles, and I am not going around harumphing that because I survived vaccines for my children are a waste of time.
David ? ☘The Establishment☘? Koch
@mrmoshpotato: Which steam mop do you use? And do you only use water or do you mix it with shimmer?
germy
David ? ☘The Establishment☘? Koch
@tandem:
The Yankees situation is beyond shocking! I can’t believe they’ve been able to rehabilitate Corey Kluber. I thought he was done.
Chris T.
@burnspbesq:
No, that’s a separate setting. (It’s in a settings menu, kind of a pain to adjust, but I like it on “high” all the time.)
Sister Machine Gun of Quiet Harmony
There will be wavelets in areas where most people refused vaccination. That was probably going to happen anyway. I believe this decision is going to speed up the timeframe for that to happen because the maskholes are going to exercise even less caution. And yes, some of them were being kind of careful sometimes because of peer pressure. On the plus side, every time there is a local COVID wavelet, demand for vaccines will go up.
TriassicSands
Betty, why do you even care? Wearing a mask is no big deal.
When flu season arrives, the obvious responsible thing to do will be to wear masks (and social distance), thus saving thousands of lives. But people have made such a big deal out of wearing a mask that, in all likelihood, we will accept thousands of unnecessary deaths rather than wear masks. I just don’t get it.
Sister Machine Gun of Quiet Harmony
@germy: On the plus side, even with one Moderna shot his immunity will be close to 80% after two weeks. That’s not nothing.
rivers
@Betty Cracker: Thanks, Betty. I should have read that before asking.
WhatsMyNym
@Keith P.:
We just had a 40ish year old guy die in my county. He was dead within in a week, barely made it into the hospital. He was the 3rd death in my county.
ETA: He had no other reported health issues.
the pollyanna from hell
@TriassicSands: She has said before that florida heat and humidity make a difference to masking comfort.
Steeplejack (phone)
@Keith P.:
Where are they coming from? What are their reasons for not getting vaccinated?
VeniceRiley
In healthcare, so will continue to mask at work. Boss sent me a handy “Vaccinated at ________” pin I can wear out to places. Still will likely wear one in stores, Rite Aid, etc. As time goes on, I’ll likely be guided by what the clerks and servers are doing. They have to be there; and if they’re masking, then so am I out of respect for them.
Miss Bianca
@BruceFromOhio: Whoa, Halestorm and Evanescence? Together? Don’t tell my Pal D!
(I’m going to prod him into getting his shot(s) by saying, “concerts! Concerts, baby!”)
Jean
@Betty Cracker: Thank you! The interim director kept repeating that they cannot mandate the vaccine until it’s legally no longer “for emergency use.” As you say, I wondered when she said they “highly encourage” people to get vaccinated, why they can’t “highly encourage” staff to find another line of work where their views aren’t a direct threat to the people whose care they’re entrusted with. They aren’t then firing them, just highly encouraging them to leave.
BruceFromOhio
@Miss Bianca: yes together!! So pumped for this!
https://www.rollingstone.com/music/music-news/evanescence-halestorm-fall-2021-u-s-arena-tour-1167282/
Karen
@steve g:
I got the vaccine that I still have a mark on my shoulder. I’m 55. Was that a polio shot?
Jean
@Bluegirlfromwyo: Thank you. I keep watching the news from Altria Theater in VA.
Soprano2
@Karen: Probably something to do with TB.
geg6
@BruceFromOhio:
Where did you guys (yinz!) go to school? Please tell me Pitt and we can be alumni buddies!
phein62
@burnspbesq: I can’t disagree with you (62, diabetes, heart patient, etc) for one major reason: There was no flu season this year. Literally, no spike in influenza. And all we had to do was wear masks. I’m down for next fall/winter, for sure.
phein62
@Karen: I have that scar, and we got the sugar pills for polio in the early 60’s (born in 1959), so it must have been for something else.
steve g
@Karen: A scar was left by the smallpox vaccine. It was injected shallow into the skin, not deeper into the muscle.
geg6
@Karen:
Smallpox.
ETA: And I see steve g got there first.
phein62
@Steve in the ATL: They’ve really upgraded it since 1995. I think they could publish it and make a buck, but I’m glad they don’t.
And yeah, it is good reading (said the guy married to a physical anthropologist specializing in paleoosteology).
Barbara
@WhatsMyNym: My dry cleaner’s teen-aged son was in the hospital with multiple organ infections as a result of Covid. His heart was infected, along with liver and pancreas. He faces months in a rehab hospital. The idea that your risk as a healthy 40 something is de minimis is not grounded in any known reality. It may be less than if you were older and your chances of death might be very low, but the risk of serious complications is not nearly low enough to blow off a vaccine.
Uncle Cosmo
@catclub: About a dozen years back, I rented a Renault station wagon in Prague with a 6-speed manual floor shift to tool around the Czech Republic. IIRC top gears were 1 – 3 – 5, bottom R – 2 – 4 – 6. First, OK, second, OK, third – I’d shove the shift up & think, OK, am I in 3rd or 5th? Let’s let out the clutch and find out! Pull it back down, is this 4th or 6th?. Adventures in shifting! (You laugh, but that sucker got 36 mpg [yes I did the math!] mostly on regional routes with 4 passengers plus luggage.)
Miss Bianca
@lamh36: You’re back! Yay! And thanks for the professional’s perspective.
Princess
@Betty Cracker: Besides, I could wear ten masks and it wouldn’t stop a vaccine-refuser from getting sick. I’m not the one who is going to infect them — it’s the other maskless vaxx refusers who endanger him, and him them.
Miss Bianca
@BruceFromOhio: Went on the Evanescence website, closest place they are playing to us is Phoenix! D’s family lives there, so we may make that an excuse to go visit.
Original Lee
@phein62: In the Before Times, MMWR was one of my favorite publications. Weird, I know, but I can’t think of very many scientific journals that had such a regular occurrence of descriptions of really unusual ways to die. My two favorites are 1) the bargeman and his buddy, who would perform alchemical experiments when the barge was in dry dock; and 2) the couple who were striving for the ultimate orgasm using Variacs.
frosty
@BruceFromOhio: Halestorm and Evanescence! Two of my favorites. And coming to Pittsburgh, only 225 miles from home. I wish I knew someone else who’d like to see them. ?
Raven
I was on a ten hour offshore trip (and caught a 60lb Wahoo). All the other folks were from Texas and Oklahoma. Not a mask, a word about a mask or politics all day. I’ll take it.
chopper
@Karen:
either smallpox or BCG.
GoBlueInOak
@Keith P.: Your friends are awful citizens. Get new friends.
GoBlueInOak
@lamh36: I’d have settled for coming out of this thing, America adopting the cultural practices of several East Asian nations (and frankly your average American Chinatown if one has ever lived near or in one) where people wear masks in public when they are sick to help from spreading it to each other in public spaces. Cuz its just fricking polite and orderly.
But noooooo…Americans are dumber than a sack of turnips and more selfish than a 3 year old, so 6 months from now its back to winter flu & cold season being as bad as it ever was.
Ian R
@catclub: Anyone who’s ever played D&D knows how often they roll a 1 on a d20. 5% doesn’t sound like a lot, but it’s a lot.
Bart
They just cancelled this week’s episode of Real Time because fully vaccinated Bill Maher has contracted COVID-19. So perhaps… keep your mask on and remain careful even if you are vaccinated? If only to not spread the disease to others in case you are an asymptomatic spreader?