Come for the politics, stay for the snark.

You cannot love your country only when you win.

“What are Republicans afraid of?” Everything.

if you can’t see it, then you are useless in the fight to stop it.

They want us to be overwhelmed and exhausted. Focus. Resist. Oppose.

Let’s bury these fuckers at the polls 2 years from now.

Wake up. Grow up. Get in the fight.

They are not red states to be hated; they are voter suppression states to be fixed.

People really shouldn’t expect the government to help after they watched the GOP drown it in a bathtub.

Fundamental belief of white supremacy: white people are presumed innocent, minorities are presumed guilty.

They traffic in fear. it is their only currency. if we are fearful, they are winning.

We cannot abandon the truth and remain a free nation.

White supremacy is terrorism.

Well, whatever it is, it’s better than being a Republican.

I really should read my own blog.

“Jesus paying for the sins of everyone is an insult to those who paid for their own sins.”

Every one of the “Roberts Six” lied to get on the court.

There are some who say that there are too many strawmen arguments on this blog.

They punch you in the face and then start crying because their fist hurts.

“I was told there would be no fact checking.”

But frankly mr. cole, I’ll be happier when you get back to telling us to go fuck ourselves.

T R E 4 5 O N

Let me file that under fuck it.

Dear media: perhaps we ought to let Donald Trump speak for himself!

“Can i answer the question? No you can not!”

You are here: Home / Open Threads / Schadenfreude Open Thread: Angrily Defending the Indefensible

Schadenfreude Open Thread: Angrily Defending the Indefensible

by | 202 Comments

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The day will come when we’ll be ready to talk about other things, but clearly today is not that day.

Among the angry on-line mob…Hugh Hewitt



Rich Lowry:

Angry baseball Dan McLaughlin:

Also at the National Review:

Senior Editor at Reason:

Jonathan Turley, because of course:

The Dersh, per Charlie ‘Diaper Boy’ Kirk…

The Free Beacon:

Aaand… the Horseshoe is REAL! — Michael Tracey:

Reader Interactions

202Comments

  1. 1.

    trnc

    Is there any chance whatsoever that DT would be handed a gag order, given the threats he makes and the obvious incitement of his unhinged base?

  2. 2.

    lowtechcyclist

    I just finished reading the indictment. It’s like The Final Days on steroids.

    Hoping and praying that they turn out to be final.

  3. 3.

    dmsilev

    @trnc: That’d be hilarious. His legal team would have to fit him with an electric shock collar to keep him quiet.

  5. 5.

    Mike S

    Trump’s lawyer was on npr today saying the trial should be moved to West Virginia to get an impartial jury.

  6. 6.

    piratedan

    ty RW punditry, you’ve successfully personified the Montoya method of arguments regarding the political process….

    they keep using these words, but I don’t think it means what they think they mean…..

  7. 7.

    Lapassionara

    Thanks, AL, again for culling all of this from the website X, formerly known as Twitter. You are a genius!

  9. 9.

    Dangerman

    It’s gotta be televised; we have to see the look on his face when Rudy, et al, underbus him, throw it in reverse, and do it again. Make it PPV and retire the debt.

  10. 10.

    Librarian

    It seems to be the talking point that Trump is being indicted for exercising “free speech.” “The indictment is a violation of the First Amendment.” With the right, it’s always “we’re being persecuted” and they’re always the victim.

  11. 11.

    Jackie

    @trnc: If only he didn’t have the gall to rerun for office… TIFG can’t be denied his rights to political speeches  – which is protected by the 1st Amendment. Even if he’s lying through his teeth.

    Unless he yells FIRE!!! in a crowd and causes a deadly stampede, of course.

  13. 13.

    Dangerman

    I wonder if I try robbing a bank tomorrow*, saying “Gimme all the money”, I can claim First Amendment?

    *Yo, FBI, not really

  14. 14.

    David 🌈 ☘The Establishment☘🌈 Koch

    indictment has several examples alleging Trump admitted he knew he lost

    Not only this but they have no rebuttal evidence. Not even Dump will take to the stand.

  19. 19.

    NorthLeft

    The Dersh saying that any conviction of Donald Trump will be overturned by the Supreme Court, is not the “win” that most right wingers think it is.

    That would be the absolute death of the US system of justice and the final nail in any moral authority or shred of respect that the Supreme Court had.

  22. 22.

    Hoodie

    @David 🌈 ☘The Establishment☘🌈 Koch:   It really doesn’t matter what he believed or whether it was reasonable.   The intent required is whether you and your conspirators had the specific intent to take the actions that were illegal, e.g., creating slates of fake electors, threatening Pence, etc.   It doesn’t matter why you took those actions.  If you thought the election was rigged, you file lawsuits to challenge the results.  If you lose, tough luck.  You can’t go beyond that into committing illegal acts. You can believe that the cashier at the 7/11 is a human-eating alien but you still can’t shoot him in the head if the cops won’t take him into custody.  Smith is not depending on what Trump believed about the election.

  24. 24.

    different-church-lady

    We’re repeating all these dumb hot takes from the dumb hot take now-owned-by-a-Nazi toy why?

  25. 25.

    Ken

    BTW, from Andrew Weissmann’s nitter feed, I see that Bill Barr was on CNN explaining that the first amendment argument, among others, is not a defense against the crimes charged. This is probably just Barr trying to polish his image, not part of some wider movement by the Republican establishment to jettison Trump.

  29. 29.

    Mike in NC

    Lowry. Hewitt. Dershowitz. Kirk. A who’s who of pathetic wingnut losers. Time for a nightcap.

  31. 31.

    Dangerman

    @Jackie: What if Melania bypassed the switch “accidentally” and there was an “oopsie” (said in Eastern European accent?)

  32. 32.

    different-church-lady

    @Ken: You do realize that’s going to give the ad trackers some strange ideas about my purchasing habits, yes?

  34. 34.

    different-church-lady

    @Librarian: ​
      Eventually it might dawn on them that he’s being charged not with just talking about it, but with actually trying to go through with it.

  35. 35.

    Kent

    @Mike S: Trump’s lawyer was on npr today saying the trial should be moved to West Virginia to get an impartial jury.

    Trump’s attorney needs to read the actual constitution. Both Article 3 Section 2 and the 8th Amendment mandate that trials occur in jurisdiction where the crime occurred.

    don’t want to face a DC jury?   Don’t do crimes in DC!!

  36. 36.

    Bill Arnold

    @Mike S:

    Trump’s lawyer was on npr today saying the trial should be moved to West Virginia to get an impartial jury.

    Lawyers among us, how would that align with Amendment VI of the US Constitution?

    In all criminal prosecutions, the accused shall enjoy the right to a speedy and public trial, by an impartial jury of the state and district wherein the crime shall have been committed, …

    Is the argument that DC is not a state, mumble mumble therefor cases cannot be tried there? (Hi, SCOTUS!)

  39. 39.

    Kent

    @Bill Arnold: Also Article 3 Section 2 states

    The Trial of all Crimes, except in Cases of Impeachment, shall be by Jury; and such Trial shall be held in the State where the said Crimes shall have been committed;

  40. 40.

    Bill Arnold

    @NotMax:

    Such a deal! Now you can shell out eight bucks a month for no discernible benefit!

    You still get a huge amplification boost, to the top pages of replies when replying, and also in other feeds.
    Twitter blue is mostly about paid amplification by Twitter’s algorithm. Increasingly expensive tiers of amplification might be next. (Or even on a per-tweet basis, using the credit card on file.)

  41. 41.

    SiubhanDuinne

    @rikyrah:

    Such a great DVD episode. A real classic!! I’ve seen it at least a dozen time over the past (yikes!!) 60 years, and even though I know what’s coming, it’s never not funny 😄

  42. 42.

    Brachiator

    @hughhewitt
    Jack Smith, an American Javert, should be obliged to prosecute this case outside of the Beltway. Former President Trump deserves a fair trial on these unprecedented charges which will strike tens of millions of Americans as a political witch hunt.

    You commit unprecedented crimes, you get unprecedented charges. Seems about right to me.

    And “outside the Beltway.” Might Hewitt be looking for a majority white jury?

    Trump’s lawyer was on npr today saying the trial should be moved to West Virginia to get an impartial jury.

    Well, golly! Would you look at that!

  43. 43.

    RedDirtGirl

    @rikyrah: Thank you for that. Very interesting. I was only aware of the fact that DVD was a big drinker, but happy to have a much more pleasant association with the show.

  44. 44.

    SpaceUnit

    I’m glad I wasn’t drinking anything when I read Rich ‘Starbursts’ Lowry’s claim of trump’s apparent passionate sincerity.  Otherwise I’d be wiping down my computer screen right now.  An awful lot is hanging on the word apparent.

    And if I understand correctly Smith has a whole boxful of receipts that detail these bozos making plans to overturn a lost election well before the election ever took place.  A jury is going to decide what’s apparent and what isn’t.

  46. 46.

    marklar

    @Ken: There’s no redeeming of Bill Barr. I had to turn off the channel after his very first comments; he talked about the damage that would be done to the country in pursuing these charges when the DOJ “dropped the ball” on the Hunter Biden charges.  At that point, if I were the interviewer I would have ended the interview, saying “at this point you have lost all credibility, so there’s no point in hearing anything more that you might have to say.”  Then again, I’m no Kaitlan Collins.

  49. 49.

    Goku (aka Amerikan Baka)

    OT:

    What do you guys think of Fitch downgrading the US’ credit rating?

    The last time this happened in 2011, the S&P 500 declined by 14% before finishing out the year flat

  53. 53.

    mrmoshpotato

    @Dangerman:

    I wonder if I try robbing a bank tomorrow*, saying “Gimme all the money”, I can claim First Amendment?

    *Yo, FBI, not really

    We shall call it The Dump Defense.

  54. 54.

    Alison Rose

    Calling Jack Smith an “American Javert” tells me Hughie has never read Les Miz, and if he saw it performed, probably slept through 90% of it. Because I’m pretty sure “staging a coup to destroy democracy and install yourself as dictator” and “five-finger-discounting a loaf of bread to feed your starving children” are not synonymous crimes.

    And I am so fucking sick of this “but Trump didn’t even know he was doing something wrong!!!” bullshit. If you misread a 35 speed limit sign as 55 and a cop pulls you over, you ain’t getting out of the ticket by whining “but office, my glasses were smudged” or whatever.

  55. 55.

    Lacuna Synecdoche

    Hugh Hewitt via Anne Laurie@Top:

    Jack Smith, an American Javert, should be obliged to prosecute this case outside of the Beltway. Former President Trump deserves a fair trial on these unprecedented charges which will strike tens of millions of Americans as a political witch hunt.

    Reminder: Hewitt is a lawyer, and knows that the crimes are supposed to be tried where they’re committed.

    Which is why Trump is being tried outside the Beltway, for keeping and trying to hide national defense documents in red Florida.

    In other words, Hewitt, go fuck yourself you bad faith performative grievance monger.

  58. 58.

    SpaceUnit

    @Alison Rose:

    Yeah.  And if you commit crimes to compensate yourself for somehow being a victim you’re still guilty of those crimes, even if you really really feel that you’re a victim.

    Also, he knows he’s not a victim.

  59. 59.

    Tony G

    @Librarian: Well, that’s a brilliant legal analysis.  So if (for example) I were to tell my friend Vito that I’ll give him $50,000 if he kills my neighbor Sal, that would be protected speech!

  61. 61.

    Alison Rose

    @rikyrah: That was fanfuckingtastic. I think I’ve maybe seen a few episodes of the show, probably on Nick at Nite or something when I was a kid. No idea they’d been so ahead of their time! And I love how she notes that the Black couple weren’t the butt of the joke — they were basically the ones making it!

  64. 64.

    dmsilev

    @Alison Rose: Nah, there’s a simpler explanation. Hewitt is simply a shameless partisan hack who doesn’t care about his analogies not making sense.

  65. 65.

    Tony G

    @SpaceUnit: I’m no film critic, but I really thought that Rick Lowry’s cameo appearance in “Who’s Nailin’ Paylin?” was the low point of that otherwise fine film.

  66. 66.

    Alison Rose

    @BeautifulPlumage: Best God damn play I ever saw live. My Mom and I went together and we were both sobbing by the end, as was almost everyone else in the audience. The most powerful performances I’d ever witnessed. The book is fantastic too, if you can make the commitment :P

  67. 67.

    Lacuna Synecdoche

    Chuck Ross via Anned Laurie @ Top:

    The Trump case aside, it’s kind of insane that amid all the discussion about criminal justice reform, there’s no concern that all these political cases are tried in a jurisdiction where 90% of the jury pool leans in one direction.

    Sooo… when the facts are on your side, argue the facts; when the law is on your side, argue the law; and when neither are on your side, blame the jury pool?

  69. 69.

    Danielx

    @trnc:

    like there’s any possibility that TFG would comply with a gag order. He couldn’t keep his mouth shut if his life depended on it.

  71. 71.

    dmsilev

    Actually, by the Constitutional philosophy beloved by conservatives, originalism, it’s clear that the Florida trial should be moved out of there to someplace further north. Florida, of course, is never mentioned in the Constitution and didn’t become a state until 1845, long after any Founder could have expressed any intent in favor of such a thing. DC, on the other hand, was 1790, right in sync with the adoption of the Constitution. Therefore, logically and originally, the classified-documents case should be removed from Judge Loose Cannon and transferred to someone in DC.

    Look, it makes about as much sense as most of Alito’s opinions.

  72. 72.

    sdhays

    Does anyone know how we should expect the J6 trial’s schedule to affect or be affected by the scheduling of the documents trial in Florida? Is there a valid scheduling argument that Trump’s lawyers need to be allowed to deal with one case at a time and the Florida case takes precedence because it was filed first?

  73. 73.

    HumboldtBlue

    @Tony G: ​ 

    Why you going’ after Sal like that? Sal’s a good guy. Always brings good wine, even though he knows I don’t drink wine.

  75. 75.

    Lacuna Synecdoche

    Charlie Kirk via Anne Laurie @ Top:

    Alan Dershowitz says conviction of Trump would be overturned by Supreme Court

    Probably not, but, if they do, it won’t exonerate Trump – it’ll just confirm SCOTUS’s corruption.

    Also, that headline could just as easily read:

    Alan Dershowitz Admits Trump Will Be Convicted At Every Level Until He Gets To The Supreme Court.

  76. 76.

    Brachiator

    @rikyrah:

    I remember seeing the episode as a kid. It was so funny.

    Here is the full episode. Season 3 Episode 1, That’s My Boy.

    ETA. Rose Marie, who played the TV writer Sally, was so famous as a child radio star that she was known by her first and middle name, as Baby Rose Marie. This became her stage name. Her full name was Rose Marie Mazzetta.

  79. 79.

    smith

    @Lacuna Synecdoche: Actually, it was one of the few heartening things about the whole J6 nightmare — SCOTUS made clear it wouldn’t go along with any of the crackpot lawsuits. It makes me hopeful they won’t go along with any crackpot appeals from these cases.

  80. 80.

    Goku (aka Amerikan Baka)

    The reason I brought Fitch’s decision up at #48 is because I’ve read speculation that it was arbitrary/had odd timing

  82. 82.

    tokyokie

    Rob Reiner FTW. Great, informative video. Ty for sharing!

    @BeautifulPlumage: CARL Reiner. Rob is his son. Carl and Mel Brooks were best buddies from their time working on Your Show of Shows.

  83. 83.

    Wapiti

    @sdhays: IANAL, but it looks like there’s a lot of empty calendar time. We can’t expect TFG to be at two courthouses at once, but not sure why his legal team can’t handle 2 TFG cases when they say they can handle 7 clients in the documents case.

  84. 84.

    Lacuna Synecdoche

    @smith:

    Actually, it was one of the few heartening things about the whole J6 nightmare — SCOTUS made clear it wouldn’t go along with any of the crackpot lawsuits. It makes me hopeful they won’t go along with any crackpot appeals from these cases.

    I agree. I wouldn’t go quite so far as to call it heartening, but I don’t think SCOTUS will overturn a Trump conviction either – though Alito and Thomas would certainly vote to do so. Which means Trump would only need to find three more right-wing party over country votes on the court to win an appeal. And that’s sadly within the range of possibility, albeit not likely.

  88. 88.

    Goku (aka Amerikan Baka)

    Do replies to tweets not appear anymore to anyone else when not logged in to X/Twitter?

  89. 89.

    sdhays

    @Lacuna Synecdoche: The thing is, “party over country” doesn’t necessarily mean “Trump over country”. They certainly didn’t see it in their interest to put their thumb on the scale with the rulings in the documents case earlier. They can easily interpret the party becoming consumed and dominated by Trump as bad for the party, even if they love them some Trumpy-poo.

    If they overruled his conviction, they’d need to be pretty darn certain that he was going to win and not have to face a “supremely” pissed off Democratic trifecta. For those conservative justices with some semblance of sanity, it will be much easier/safer to simply let justice take its course and hope the party gets itself together quickly enough to preserve all the gifts they’re giving it and allow them to weather the building to fury (over their decisions and corruption).

  90. 90.

    sdhays

    @Wapiti: Yeah, this is my question. There’s all this time on the calendar, but how much does the court need to allow the defendant and his lawyers to deal with his other trials? For non-rich people, it would seem to be an unreasonable burden to have to fight multiple trials at the same time.

    On the other hand, lawyers do this all the time for different clients, so… Maybe it all doesn’t matter that much.

  92. 92.

    smith

    @Lacuna Synecdoche: In my opinion, the RW justices are loyal to the mobster-oligarchs who own them, more than to the Republican party. The GQP is just the instrument used to put them there. Now that they are in place, all comfy in their lifetime appointments, they don’t have any huge compulsion accept marching orders from the party unless it fits their underlying agenda.

  95. 95.

    Kent

    @Steve in the ATL: @Kent: ¡need some Chile travel tips, por favor!

    What do you want to know?   My Chile expertise is somewhat stunted because it always involves family obligations.  So we usually spend a week or so in Santiago in the Vitacura and Los Condes areas (very upscale suburbs) where my wife’s family lives.  And then we decamp for the coast where they have family homes in Renaca and Santo Domingo.  My mother-in-law is relentless with the scheduling of family obligations.  Once the last kid is in college and we can take longer trips I’ll have the chance to explore more of the country.

    I can tell you about beach towns on the central coast, the Elqui Valley, the rich parts of Santiago, and that is about it

    Take a 150 mile wide slice of the Pacific Coast from Juneau Alaska to Cabo San Lucas, flip it upside down so that north is deserts (Baja) the south is mountains, fjords, and glaciers (SE Alaska) and the central part is California wine country and you basically have Chile.  Except that the Andes are vastly bigger than the Cascades and Sierra.

    Chile is also very middle income and Euro feeling.  So not at all like Guatemala, Costa Rica, or Bolivia.  It is very modern full of basically modern people.  It is also wealthier than the published GDP stats would suggest.  There is a LOT of hidden wealth there that never really gets declared and so doesn’t make it into national stats.

  97. 97.

    mvr

    @Rekoob: I was hoping for “Guilty! Guilty! Guilty!” Quoting Marc Slackameier if I recall the strip correctly. (But I knew it would be something else.)

  99. 99.

    mvr

    @sdhays: Short answer is no. The one case at a time argument is fair enough so far as it goes. But the MAL case is so far in the future you could finish the J6 case and they would still have plenty of time to prepare for the MAL case.  Many cases go to trial in a few months and this one isn’t all that complicated.

  104. 104.

    Goku (aka Amerikan Baka)

    @Rob in CT:

    Yeah, I never had an account. On the one hand, it was interesting reading replies, but OTOH, there was a lot of BS to sift through

    @Jackie:

    Twitter/X deserves to die at this point. How many eyeballs did Twitter attract from lurkers browsing

    @NotMax:

    Your link says there wasn’t dramatic harm to the domestic US economy in 2011. Hopefully that’s true this time as well

  105. 105.

    Roberto el oso

    @Steve in the ATL: My familiarity with Chile is primarily in the desert North, but I would recommend both Antofagasta and Valparaiso —- beautiful cities, fairly laidback, with Valparaiso still very much a working class city because of the fishing industry (sort of like Veracruz, Mexico, if you’re familiar with it). Also, and you might be able to get some info from NASA —- there is an internationally run observation camp outside of Antofagasta where one can see the incredible night skies in almost complete darkness, remembering that there are something like 4 or 5 times as many stars visible in the southern hemisphere as there are up here … anyway, once upon a time there were informal tours available, but things may have changed … if stars are your thing definitely worth making further inquiries)

    Oh, and hope you like seafood. Chile’s is the best in the world, in my very prejudiced opinion.

  107. 107.

    Enhanced Voting Techniques

    After the letdown of the lack of a smoking gun in the Russia investigation, it’s wild to see them in both the docs case and January 6th.

    Trump’s utter dumbassry were he facing, what 450 felony charges and counting, and the lack of clear evidence of Russian collusion isn’t mutually exclusive. What I got out of the Muller report was Trump wanted to collude but the Russians though Trump was to pathetically easy to manipulate to be worth the bother of conspiring with.

  112. 112.

    Lyrebird

    @rikyrah: I did NOT SEE that coming, even from DeathSantis.

    Thank you for shining a light on his scuttling roachy behavior.  That might be giving a bad name to roaches, who usually just want to take some of our food, not kill innocent civil servants.

    His unpleasant chat with children I could understand as social awkwardness.  Told a kid at a fair, isn’t that slushee a lot of sugar? or something.  But WTAF.

     

    Didn’t Maya Angelou talk about believing who people are the first time?  How can anyone imagine voting for this creep?

  114. 114.

    Burnspbesq

    @dmsilev:

    There was a time, not too long ago, when Chapman Law students got to choose between Hewitt and Eastman for Con Law.

    just think about that for a second.

  115. 115.

    piratedan

    @Jackie: perhaps I’ve watched too much TV…

    I could see it this way…. he unloads all the dirt, shows where the bodies are buried, keeps the 2B and Daddy’s little girl and walks away.

  117. 117.

    Elizabelle

    You shameful poltroon.

    Love this diss.  Stealing it.

    And, given that it’s aimed at Hugh Hewitt, it is even true.  Shameless poltroon works for him, as well.

  118. 118.

    Jackie

    @HumboldtBlue: My dad owned a bowling alley. The sounds of the ball knocking down the pins and the cheers bring back a lot of good memories! The one frame when the “5 pin” wobbled before toppling… been there. But not on the way to the perfect 300!

    Thanks for the memories!

  119. 119.

    Goku (aka Amerikan Baka)

    @Burnspbesq:

    Made me look at the Chapman University wiki page:

    Main article: Chapman University School of Law
     

    The Chapman University School of Law is located in Kennedy Hall. Law degrees offered include the Juris Doctor (J.D.) and Master of Laws (LL.M.) degrees in various specialties. In 2022, John Eastman retired as Dean after more than 160 faculty members signed a letter calling for the university to take action against him for concocting a baseless theory and made false claims of fraud in an attempt to overturn the 2020 election. Eastman is currently (June 2023) undergoing a hearing of disbarment in the State of California.

    Didn’t know Eastman’s was in the process of being disbarred in California

  122. 122.

    Carlo Graziani

    @different-church-lady:

    @NotMax: “For $16 a month we won’t give you the blue check to begin with.”

    Yes! That was exactly Sylvester McMonkey McBean’s business model! He charged the Plain-Belly Sneetches to put stars on their bellies, then charged the Star-Bellied Sneetches even more to remove their belly stars, so they wouldn’t resemble the newly-starred Sneetches!

    Life really does imitate art.

  123. 123.

    Jackie

    @Goku (aka Amerikan Baka): Eastman, Guiliani… and Lin Wood of Georgia chose to “retire” before he was disbarred. I think Sydney Powell is also in danger of being disbarred. Being a lawyer for TIFG is bad for your financial future.

  124. 124.

    Mr. Bemused Senior

    @Jackie: many have observed that everyone associated with Trump comes away tarnished at best. Eastman, though, disbarment is too good for him. Force him to listen to Vogon poetry and then eject him into the vacuum of space.

  134. 134.

    Jerzy Russian

    Can’t somebody take a bat and hit that stupid baseball guy out of the park?  A home run is always nice, but a foul ball out of play is acceptable.

  135. 135.

    Hkedi [Kang T.Q.]

    @Jackie: We’re literally living in a Trump soap opera.

     

    *Screams in horror and starts sobbing uncontrollably

  136. 136.

    Jackie

    Only posting this because it makes me happy – especially since another indictment is coming via Fulton County within days or weeks!!!

    ““Former President Donald Trump is expected to appear at 4 p.m. on Thursday in the U.S. federal courthouse at the foot of Capitol Hill, the site of a yearslong government effort to hold accountable those who tried to subvert democracy,” the New York Times reports.”

    “The U.S. Marshals Service, which is responsible for security inside federal courthouses, will escort him to an area where he will be booked for a third time this year.””

    Looking forward to the 4th!😂😁

  137. 137.

    mrmoshpotato

    @Jerzy Russian:

    Can’t somebody take a bat and hit that stupid baseball guy out of the park? A home run is always nice, but a foul ball out of play is acceptable. 

    Got a preference on which park?  I’m a fan of Pittsburgh and Arizona because you can hit balls into water.  At least, I think you still can in Pittsburgh.

  142. 142.

    Jerzy Russian

    @mrmoshpotato:   Yes, either Pittsburgh or San Francisco.  He could land on the water in either place.  I think Kyle Schwarber hit a ball onto the river in Pittsburgh on the fly back into the day.

  146. 146.

    Chris T.

    @Goku (aka Amerikan Baka):

    What do you guys think of Fitch downgrading the US’ credit rating?

    Their “reasons” are nonsense, or at least, show awful internal inconsistency: if they applied them logically they would have done this downgrade under Trump several years ago.

    They have not gotten anything this big right in 20+ years—they missed the entire real estate / CDO bubble, for instance.

  147. 147.

    prostratedragon

    To see replies and complete threads on twitter without signing in, the nitter.net workaround is pretty good. Replace twitter.com with nitter.net in the urlbar.

  149. 149.

    Kathleen

    @rikyrah: That was one of the very few TV shows my mother liked. We watched it regularly and I remember that episode when it first aired.

  153. 153.

    Maxim

    @rikyrah: I don’t understand why he’s not doing better in the polls. What’s a little raging sociopathy in a would-be president?

  155. 155.

    JWR

    @rikyrah:

    Great story, and one that I haven’t heard before! Thank you! I’ve long known that The Dick Van Dyke show was truly groundbreaking, and having enjoyed probably every episode, there are a few real clunkers in there. Like the one where Laura manages to save a few hundred dollars to some day buy Rob a new “FJX-JFK”* sports car, but when Rob and neighbor Jerry come across Laura’s “personal” bank book, he angrily confronts her and asks what’s wrong with their joint bank account and why are you hiding this from me?! I’m not describing it very well, but the patriarchy runs really thick in that episode, as well as in a few others. It’s cringeworthy, but still way ahead of the times.

    *I don’t remember the model number exactly, but it does end in JFK.

  156. 156.

    satby

    @JWR: The show was filmed in the early 1960s. It wasn’t until 1974, when the Equal Credit Opportunity Act passed, that women in the U.S. were granted the right to open a bank account on their own. Technically, women won the right to open a bank account in the 1960s, but many banks still refused to let women do so without a signature from their husbands. It’s only cringeworthy if you expect historical stuff to reflect today’s ethos. BTW, I was already out of high school then, and remember it well.

  157. 157.

    lowtechcyclist

    @rikyrah: ​
     

    Ron DeSantis, in New Hampshire, discusses his plans for the federal workforce:

    “We are going to start slitting throats on Day One.”

    So if a Federal employee in Florida “felt fear” on hearing DeSantis say this, with Florida being a SYG state and all…

  158. 158.

    Kay

    “Trump election charges set up clash of lies versus free speech”

    That’s a Magggie Haberman story in today’s NYTimes.

    It’s literally the GOP frame and argument. She’s enthusiastically arguing the Trump case on his exact terms, down to word choice.

    Horrible newspaper. Just garbage. But watch the rest all follow the NYTimes lead and narrative.

  160. 160.

    Soprano2

    @Goku (aka Amerikan Baka): It was stupid and there’s no good reason for it. I’m really starting to believe that there are powerful people who want a recession, and will do almost anything to try to make it happen. Nothing material has changed to justify it.

  162. 162.

    Kay

    @Baud:

    Did she read the indictment? This “story” (sloppy, half assed legal argument) seems to be based on whatever she heard from Trump loyalists on cable tv. They could not have paid for a more favorable spin – they’re on the side of ‘free speech’ and the scolding, probably woke prosecutor wants to silence them.

  163. 163.

    mrmoshpotato

    @Kay:

    “Trump election charges set up clash of lies versus free speech”

    That’s a Magggie Haberman story in today’s NYTimes.

    It’s literally the GOP frame and argument. She’s enthusiastically arguing the Trump case on his exact terms, down to word choice.

    Horrible newspaper. Just garbage. But watch the rest all follow the NYTimes lead and narrative.

    I’ve come to expect no better from the GOP’s stenographer.

    Habs is trash.

  166. 166.

    JWR

    @satby:

    It’s only cringeworthy if you expect historical stuff to reflect today’s ethos.

    Oh, I really don’t expect the show to live up to the standards of today, but just watching it in the here and now can be discomfiting, because, well, today is today and then was then, which fact I really do appreciate.

    ETA:

    It wasn’t until 1974, when the Equal Credit Opportunity Act passed, that women in the U.S. were granted the right to open a bank account on their own.

    Wow! I didn’t know that. TY.

  167. 167.

    Kay

    @Baud:

    It’ll be like catnip to a certain segment of the Left and Center. There is nothing the anti woke ninnies like better than the idea that some all-powerful cabal of wokesters is silencing them.

    It reminds me of how they spun the Bush v Gore count in Florida as a clash between good people (Republicans) who wanted to count military votes and bad people (Al Gore, et al) who didn’t want to count them.

  169. 169.

    Baud

    @Kay:

    I think there’s a large segment of society, not just on the right, who simply can’t get their heads around the legitimacy of Democrats exercising governmental authority without needing their approval.

  170. 170.

    satby

    Man, times like this week I really miss Stephen Colbert. Just imagine the monologues he’d do. Because nothing cuts through bullshit like mockery.

  173. 173.

    Kay

    Our local coalition of Democrats is Right leaning, I think, in terms of the national larger group of Democrats and one of the nice things about Right leaning Democrats is they seem to resist (or maybe not fall victim) to this media-generated bullshit framing. I only see this ninny behavior – where they are so sort of weak and easily influenced by attacks like ‘cancel culture’- on the Center and Left of the Party.

  174. 174.

    Ceci n est pas mon nym

    @satby:

    It’s only cringeworthy if you expect historical stuff to reflect today’s ethos.

    I grew up on 60s TV, and it did give a weird picture of marriage that doesn’t age well, but you were completely unaware of at the time.

    For some reason we once watched an episode of “The Jetsons” with our kids sometime in the 90s, and we were shocked and appalled at the level of patriarchy. Example: “George, I want to take driving lessons.” “No, I do not permit it. I will not be responsible for another woman driver on the streets.”

    You’d expect people from The Future to be more enlightened about this stuff.

    My wife as a child was a huge fan of The Man from UNCLE, and I felt the same way about Get Smart. We’ve tried to watch episodes of both of those to share each other’s childhoods and they’re almost unwatchable. This stuff just pervaded everything.

  175. 175.

    Kay

    @Baud:

    Maybe that’s it. It’s this kind of profound lack of confidence in their own (supposed) beliefs. One influential person tells them they mildly disapprove and they’ll fold on the whole liberal project.

    I also sometimes think they don’t much like or respect our base and are a little embarrassed of us – would prefer a different group to ally with.

  177. 177.

    mrmoshpotato

    @satby:

    Man, times like this week I really miss Stephen Colbert. Just imagine the monologues he’d do. Because nothing cuts through bullshit like mockery.

    And Seth’s A Closer Look segments would be awesome as usual.

  178. 178.

    mrmoshpotato

    @Ceci n est pas mon nym:

    “George, I want to take driving lessons.” “No, I do not permit it. I will not be responsible for another woman driver on the streets.” 

    Wow.

    Also, “George, you bonehead.  What streets?  We have flying cars now in case you somehow didn’t notice.”

  179. 179.

    Ceci n est pas mon nym

    @JWR: My Mom ran into some of this in the 70s. I remember she was appalled to discover she didn’t have a credit rating, and was still getting that stuff about having difficulty opening up a checking account in her own name.

    We were still concerned enough about that kind of thing when we married in 1980 that we’d do things like list her as the person getting the electricity bill.

    My wife worked for a production company in the late 90s where due to their natural talents and interests, the husband was the technical guy and the wife was president of the company and did all the customer stuff. The bank refused to deal with her on a loan and refused to believe she was running the company. They insisted on meeting with her husband.

  181. 181.

    The Thin Black Duke

    @Ceci n est pas mon nym: I remember an episode of The Andy Griffith Show where it introduced a new girl who moved into the neighborhood that was shunned by the other boys because she was better at doing stuff than them. Worse, this crisis was resolved when the girl’s mother told her daughter that she would have to pretend to be helpless so the boys would like her.

  184. 184.

    Kay

    Issue 1 will appear on the August 8, 2023 ballot. It will ask voters to change current law so that Amendments to the Ohio Constitution will be required to be approved by voters by a 60% supermajority of voters, rather than simple majority that has been Ohio law for over 100 years.

    Next Tuesday! Vote No on 1.
    I’m helping with this and it just flew by. I am optimistic (but I always think I will win- warning) even though my 75% Trumpy county has the fundie religious out campaigning for “yes”. We think centrist independents will swing “no” because it’s another authoritarian over reach by fundie religious and Republicans. I think the wild card is how many conservative Catholics and evangelical protestants the Right can get to come out. I don’t know and I don’t think anyone else does either.

  188. 188.

    Princess

    I hope no wins. I think it’s easier to persuade people to come out to preserve their rights than to vote to remove their own power. But I’m always wrong about how people will vote.

  189. 189.

    mrmoshpotato

    @geg6:

    You can, but good luck with that. Doesn’t happen much.

    I’ve seen videos.  Wasn’t sure if they’d put up a bunch of billboards that would make it harder like at Wrigley.

  191. 191.

    Anyway

    @Kay:

    I also sometimes think they don’t much like or respect our base and are a little embarrassed of us – would prefer a different group to ally with.

    It’s all the middle-aged women – they’re so uncool! They have no respect for NancySmash and all the D women in the House and Senate.

    Wasn’t it MoDo who coined the Mommy Party? They’re stuck in that framing.

  192. 192.

    AM in NC

    @JWR:  I have two teenagers, and when I told them that, within the span of my lifetime, there was no legal right for their grandmas to be able to take out a loan or have a credit card without either a father’s or husbands signature, their minds were blown.

    They really have no idea how recently women have won the right to be treated as adult human beings.  Although that might be good because now they see what (in their minds) should be inherent rights being taken away, and they are freaked out.

  194. 194.

    Another Scott

    @AM in NC: When my parents divorced in the mid-60s, my mom somehow found my dad’s Sears card and charged some stuff before he realized it.  It was her small way of striking back at the patriarchy.

    ;-)

    Cheers,
    Scott.

  196. 196.

    trnc

    @Danielx: ​
     

    like there’s any possibility that TFG would comply with a gag order. He couldn’t keep his mouth shut if his life depended on it.

    That’s fine, too, because we know what happens when you refuse to comply with a judge’s order.

  197. 197.

    jimmiraybob

    “They have literally charged Trump under the Civil Rights Act of 1866.”

    If Trump’s conviction(s) ever makes it to the Supreme Court I’m covering bets on Alito finding an obscure 17th century European monk’s scribblings to overturn the precedent of established federal statutes still on the books.

    Medieval State’s Rights!

  198. 198.

    Miss Bianca

    @rikyrah: That was fascinating! I remember watching the Dick Van Dyke Show – it was one of my favorites as a kid – but strangely, I don’t remember seeing that episode. Thanks for the link!

  199. 199.

    Miss Bianca

    @rikyrah: “slitting throats”?

    Jesus, if he weren’t such a weenie, I would suspect Ron DeSantis of wanting to take a personal hand in such activities. I mean, why NOT add “blood-gargling psychopath” to burnish his long list of right-wing-street-cred-worthy accomplishments?

  200. 200.

    RaflW

    @Kay: And obviously Mags has editors who signed off on her claptrap, so the NYT really has become the house organ of Trumpism, minus the bleached-blond TV-ness of Fox.

  202. 202.

    Chief Oshkosh

    @Kay: Yeah, but ABC News beat them to it last night at 7 pm eastern.

    Jonathan Karl needs the DeSantis Fed employee treatment.

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