How I'm showing up to the polls in 2024 to vote for @POTUS & @KamalaHarris pic.twitter.com/JZl0UnnvAG
— Tai Babilonia ?? (@taiskates) September 18, 2023
There was a thread interwoven across the twitter accounts I read, using gifs to convey the users’ 2024 intentions. Tai Babilonia‘s tweet best conveyed my own feelings!
President Biden addressed questions about his age at a fundraiser on Broadway: “A lot of people seem focused on my age. I get it. Believe me, I know it more than anyone.” But said democracy is at stake and “I will not walk away now.”
— Steve Holland (@steveholland1) September 19, 2023
“Because in 2024 democracy’s on the ballot once again, & let there be no question: Donald Trump and his MAGA Republicans are determined to destroy American democracy. And I will always defend, protect and fight for our democracy. That’s why I’m running,” Biden said at fundraiser.
— Jennifer Jacobs (@JenniferJJacobs) September 19, 2023
“I’m running because — hear this — I want the entire nation to join me in sending the strongest, clearest, most powerful message possible that political violence in America is never, never, never acceptable,” Biden said at Broadway fundraiser in NYC. pic.twitter.com/zpji7lubqW
— Jennifer Jacobs (@JenniferJJacobs) September 19, 2023
Elsewhere, Our Failed Major Media:
"Bring the boys home……but not like that" https://t.co/26tqDqRZCe
— Ragnarok Lobster (@eclecticbrotha) September 19, 2023
OP-VIDEO: Is the deal to free American hostages Biden's 9/11, or Biden's 9/11? We have a bipartisan roundtable discussion with Bret Stephens, Henry Olsen, and Ross Douthat, moderated by Maureen Dowd
— The okayest poster there is (@ok_post_guy) September 19, 2023
Repubs in disarray!
1st DEM ad for 2024 Congress https://t.co/XEhsOjjkpL
— Jennifer Now at Threads Rubin (@JRubinBlogger) September 18, 2023
this is, for the record, exactly what Pelosi and Biden mean when they say there needs to be a strong Republican Party https://t.co/Su5Btm0nO9
— the abbot of unreason (an archaeologist) (@merovingians) September 15, 2023
Then it wouldn’t be the Republican party. “We need respectable and calm fascists in control to rein in the brazen psychos” is not a winning idea
— Christian (@getheode) September 15, 2023
the collapse of the New Deal Coalition didn't lead to a different Democratic Party, it led to a different Republican Party
— the abbot of unreason (an archaeologist) (@merovingians) September 15, 2023
On The Road – Winter Wren – Orlando Wetlands – Winter into Spring
Baud
Agree.
Baud
Also too, unfair to T-Rex.
hueyplong
@Baud: Agree. T-Rex had a good run. Focusing on its Trump-McCarthy stage is just mean-spirited.
Don’t know why Lukovich omitted the creature’s oddly colored weave/implant/comb-over top.
mrmoshpotato
@Baud: Very unfair to T-Rex. We need to go back further – beyond the dinosaurs.
Also, the GrOPers would be racist assholes about anyone banging a gong, and as for anyone getting it on…
mrmoshpotato
@hueyplong:
It’s glued-on, horrible-looking cotton candy.
gene108
I think the reason the media focuses on Biden’s age and not Trump’s is that the media, like they did in 2016, does not think Trump can win, whether by losing the election again or because he will be convicted on a few of his 91 indictments.
hueyplong
@mrmoshpotato: Well, Boebert tried her best on the “dirty sweet” part, but made a mangled mess of it in a way that likely caused a short term dip in the national birth rate. From what I read in accounts of right wing internet chatter, that’s a sufficient reason to non-person her.
Princess
@gene108: That’s possible. I think reporters focus on his age because they want a horse race. I think their bosses encourage it because they want Trump to win. Either way they want to control the narrative and outcome themselves and they’re angry when we resist.
OzarkHillbilly
@Princess: I think reporters focus on his age because it’s the only thing they can find fault with.
satby
@OzarkHillbilly: pretty much. And because I suspect a lot of them know they won’t be aging like this so they’re jealous.
Dangerman
It’s about time Red States start getting it good and hard; Alabama has 5 major military bases. KMA; move them to a Blue State.
Baud
@Princess:
We are uppity.
Anyway
@OzarkHillbilly:
Yes, its an easy hook and they don’t have to delve into POLICY details. Oh, the horror.
hueyplong
They also uniformly spin any non-Ukraine foreign policy news in a negative way. Kicked off his presidency with the most intellectually dishonest coverage possible of Biden’s execution of Trump’s Afghan withdrawal agreement.
eclare
@satby:
Wow! That is some top shelf balancing!
Baud
@satby:
I wasn’t that fit when I was young.
Jeffro
If anyone needs me, I’ll be busy attempting to burn down CNN HQ.
The “terrible optics” of President Biden bringing home Americans who languished in a foreign jail during the trumpov administration. Just unbelievable.
I never want to hear one. fucking. word. about the ‘liberal media’ ever again. Ye gods.
Baud
@Jeffro:
Optics is such a cop out critique too. “It’s not me, it’s other people.”
Matt McIrvin
I think there needs to be a strong opposition party. It doesn’t have to be the Republicans or to be anything like the Republicans.
But the basic problem here is the electorate itself–there’s a large bigot constituency in the US that may be shrinking but is too tempting for a major party to ignore. It’s not going away any time soon and in a democracy, they can vote. In a good situation for our party system, the parties would ignore their bigot concerns and try to get their votes in other ways. But the reward for revving up that klaxon is too great.
Shalimar
Ok, I just read the dumbest Twitter story I have seen so far. Elon’s latest solution to his revenue problem is proposing that every X user start paying a fee. This will supposedly help them with advertisers. Is he really so stupid he doesn’t realize that the Musk fans paying the monthly fee now are the horrible people advertisers are avoiding?
Baud
@Matt McIrvin:
Agree. The other half of the problem is the portion of the electorate that doesn’t like the bigots, but not enough to motivate them to vote for the non-bigot party.
Another Scott
@Anyway: @hueyplong:
+1
Plus, age is a number and numbers are always objective. Can’t accuse me of being slanted or unfair or part of the liberal media when I’m just talking about numbers!!
Similarly, the breathless coverage of the proposal out of the House for a “compromise” CR to prevent a government shutdown. Hey, it’s a “compromise” and compromise is always good! Who cares if it’s an 8% cut in just about everything except Defense? It’s a compromise! Yes, it doesn’t have the votes in the Senate or even the House. That doesn’t matter. What matters is that it’s a compromise!! Why won’t Democrats and Biden compromise!!??!1
//
Don’t get me started on the 1% cut that is supposed to happen in January if a budget isn’t passed – it gives more power to the bomb-throwers when they have made it clear that they think the McCarthy-Biden agreement on spending levels is not binding on them.
Grr…,
Scott.
Matt McIrvin
@gene108: Or they think Trump will win and are trying to curry favor with him in the dictatorship to come.
Baud
@Another Scott:
The media also like to talk about the Republican abortion compromise that isn’t a compromise, since they only propose a ceiling and not a floor.
OzarkHillbilly
@Shalimar: Butbutbut he’s a GEEENIOUS who has all the GREATEST IDEAS!!!!
Matt McIrvin
@Shalimar: If he takes post-Twitter to a pay service, that will be the thing that finally eliminates any pull it ever had as a platform. I don’t have anything against pay services; the bills have to be paid somehow, but it’s not the model that currently wins for social media.
mrmoshpotato
But Ozark, he! is!
one of the best Presidents this country has ever seenso! OOOOOOOOLLLLLLLLLLLDDDD!Time Rock And Roll
hueyplong
@Shalimar: Musk has caused me to adjust upward my opinion of the customer-friendliness of Comcast.
mrmoshpotato
@satby: Fuck! I don’t think my knees can bend that well, and I was born during St. Shitass’s first term!
ETA – yes, also Uncle Joe’s balance! FTW!
Betty Cracker
The FL GOP has created a multiracial right-wing authoritarian political movement. I don’t know if it could be replicated nationwide; it has features that might be unique to the state. But that’s one of the reasons I’m so happy to see DeSantis flaming out on the national stage.
mrmoshpotato
@Baud: Baud 20XX! Uppity With Pants! Wait! No! Down With Pants!
Ocotillo
@mrmoshpotato: It’s early so at first I was like, what, but, I get it.
mrmoshpotato
@Jeffro: Happy Tuesday, Jeffro! Carry On Arson!
mrmoshpotato
@Ocotillo: 😁 Sometimes the muse hits me – upside the head.
Baud
While I don’t want a media that lies to us the way Fox lies to it’s viewers, I wish we had a liberal media outlet that could influence the topics of political conversation. MSNBC is mostly reactive.
ETA: It’s hard when you don’t have a top-down hierarchical party.
satby
@Baud: When I was young, maybe; but not for quite a while and I’m 12 years younger than the President.
He’s handsome, fit, sharp as a tack, ethical, and unbreakable in spite of repeated personal tragedies, in which his personal faith helps him cope. He could walk away to enjoy retirement and his grandchildren and no one would blame him, but he has been called to serve. The nation and the world is lucky to have him.
Jeffro
They (the national GOP) are certainly trying their best, unfortunately.
It’s like they put out a casting call to every non-white person willing to publicly get behind white supremacy. (I am, in fact, 99% certain that there’s an RNC memo to this effect)
It’s like the paid crowd members of “Blacks for trump”, writ large.
Baud
@satby:
I wish that wasn’t too long for the rotating tag. But I’m going to nominate it anyway.
Matt McIrvin
@Betty Cracker: I think the model of the Florida right is too inherently unstable to be nationalized in 2023. Outside of a state that has many immigrants with right-wing inclinations, the racial animosities are too strong for it to hang together on religion, sexual bigotry and Commie-baiting.
But there are other regions where a version of it might work, like South Texas. To some extent it’s the play that Reagan used to get a big chunk of the immigrant vote in the 1980s, but that depended on the Soviet Bloc being a going concern.
Jeffro
@mrmoshpotato: thanks!
I finished “The Great Transition” by Nick Fuller Goggins last night and so I woke up in a pissy, pessimistic mood, and now this shit from CNN…
…Tuesdays have always sucked.
(but thanks again!)
Now then…where did I put those matches…
Baud
@Jeffro:
Why isn’t Whites for Biden a thing? I mean, Biden is white even.
satby
@Baud: please don’t. Most of them are stupid. But I appreciate the sentiment.
zhena gogolia
@OzarkHillbilly: Bingo.
zhena gogolia
@satby: Excellent comment!
Baud
@satby:
I withdraw my nomination.
Baud
I support both parties having a racial makeup that looks like America. We’d be a better country if more white people voted blue.
SteverinoCT
Today’s Calvin and Hobbes is one of those that are relevant to almost any thread:
calvinandhobbes/2023/09/19
(personal bugaboo: note the date format– it’s an ISO! And sorts properly, which is why YYYY-MM-DD is ideal for use in filenames)
Baud
@SteverinoCT:
Haha. Yes, universally apt.
Scout211
Michigan State gave Mel Tucker’s attorney notice that they are in the process of firing him. Apparently, the “sure I did it, but it was consensual” defense doesn’t work when your contract forbids that exact behavior.
. . .
. . .
Dorothy A. Winsor
@Shalimar: I’m still on twitter because my editor says I have to be. But if there’s a charge to post, I’m gone, unless my editor pays the charge, which she won’t. Musk has to be breaking twitter deliberately. He can’t be this bad by accident.
Shameless Self Promotion, look away now: Amazon has the ppb of a couple of my books marked down. The Wysman ($6.38), The Wind Reader ($7.25), and Glass Girl ($11.12). All of them are usually $14.99. E-book $3.99.
rikyrah
Good Morning Everyone 😊😊😊
Baud
@Scout211:
I’m confused. You can’t masturbate if you work for Michigan State? Or is it a Boebert situation where it didn’t occur entirely in private?
Jeffro
@SteverinoCT: that is really excellent
I’m going to try and remember Calvin’s last couple of lines as well as Hobbes’ last line, for future use (depending on which side of the situation I’m on. =)
Baud
@rikyrah:
Good morning.
Baud
@Dorothy A. Winsor:
I’d rather him break Twitter than see him use it to try to influence the election.
Dorothy A. Winsor
@Baud: Good point. Let the site turn into another Truth Social where the fascists can talk to one another.
eclare
@SteverinoCT:
Brilliant
Ken
I would also accept a defunct Republican Party, followed some years later by a strong Whig party assembled out of the wreckage.
Ken
I wonder if her name is going to become a noun. “She got caught giving her boyfriend a Boebert,” something along those lines. How did they do that with Santorum?
Soprano2
@Jeffro: I want to ask all the critics if they would be willing to say to the faces of these people’s families that they would rather those people were still in an Iranian prison.
lowtechcyclist
@Another Scott:
In the immortal words of Satchel Paige, “how old would you be if you didn’t know how old you were?”
hueyplong
@Ken: The “some years later” part is appealing.
Soprano2
@Shalimar: That would be the end of my account. Doesn’t he realize that everyone except the Nazis and Nazi-adjacent would dump his stupid web site if he did that? He really does suffer from not having anyone who will tell him the truth about things.
NotMax
Hyperloopiness.
;)
lowtechcyclist
@mrmoshpotato:
The secret to Baud 20XX! is that if you don’t have pants to begin with, they don’t have to be up or down!
The Kropenhagen Interpretation
She has the right idea, bring a friend and make it fun.
Another Scott
@satby: Nice plaque, also too.
Cheers,
Scott.
Soprano2
@Another Scott: I wonder what these people would have made of my mother. Up until her last few years, she was still vigorous and healthy. I got the gene from her side that keeps women’s hair from going gray; I was talking to the nurses about a week after she went into the hospital before she died. I told them her brunette hair was her natural color. They didn’t believe me, so I said “She’s been in here a week, do you see any gray roots?” They were incredulous, but it was true. I’ve got the same thing – at age 62 I have about 3 gray hairs in my dirty blonde hair. The only reason I know they’re there is because of how weird they are compared to the rest of my hair. If you saw me you’d probably think I am in my mid-40’s. ETA – I always say my body knows every year old I am, though.
Another Scott
@SteverinoCT: “Ignorance is precious. Once you lose it, it’s gone forever.” – My favorite uncle.
Cheers,
Scott.
Baud
@Soprano2:
In the olden days, they’d think you and your mom were witches.
Soprano2
@Baud: They might have, that’s true. My grandmother had it, too. Unfortunately, I also got their bad eyesight. You can’t have everything….
gvg
@Soprano2: Would even the Nazi’s stay? Do they have to pay to be on the sites they already have like TruthSocial? I think they might leave too. Especially if there was no one left to talk to.
The Kropenhagen Interpretation
Not being new here, I knew immediately Republicans were taking serious liberties with the truth. We’re never “paying” Iran in any of these deals. It’s their assets we froze as an act of war that we are making available to them.
But apparently the bullshit runs deeper this time. As I recently heard Beau of the Fifth Column explain it, we’re releasing the funds to Qatar as part of some multilateral agreement to provide aid Iran legitimately needs.
I’m tired of ill-informed Republican pant-wetting being used to justify war and cruelty.
Baud
@gvg:
Nazis don’t want to talk amongst themselves. They want to harangue decent people. They wouldn’t stay.
RevRick
@Matt McIrvin: The narrative that we need a strong opposition party wasn’t true in the US for the first two decades of the 19th century, when the Federalists collapsed and the Democratic-Republicans were in charge. I, for one, would be quite happy with the Democrats having a twenty game winning streak.
The Kropenhagen Interpretation
Speaking as a white man who supports Biden, white is a made up category with a flexible definition that only exists to have other oppositional groupings.
Whiteness is the end of culture. It took the connection black people have to their culture by force and now it’s trying to flatten the culture of all white people into something with no firm defined feature except that it’s meant to be on top.
ETA: Biden shouldn’t say any of that, it would be politically incorrect.
Baud
@RevRick:
We could use an Era of Good Feelings 2.0. Without the slavery this time.
Geminid
Some news concerning the Armenian enclave of Artsakh: reports are that Azerbaijan’s forces have opened fire on the territory that is home to 120,000 people. Azerbaijan claims it is attacking Armenian military positions. Armenia denies that it has any troops there, and Armenian PM Pashninyan has called for an emergency meeting of the UN Security Council. Armenia has also called on Russian peacekeeping forces step in to halt the attacks.
In 2020, Armenia and Azerbaijan fought a bloody 44-day war in which Azerbaijan reclaimed territory around Artsakh it had lost in the 1993 war between the two countries. The 2020 war ended with Russian troops enforcing a ceasefire, and protecting the Lachin Corridor connecting Artsakh with Armenia. Azerbaijan blocked the Corridor last December, depriving Artsakh of food and other neccesities. Tensions have risen since then.
lowtechcyclist
@gvg:
If they can’t at least have the illusion that they’re pwning the libs, few of them will pay. If they want to talk to each other, there’s always TruthSocial, as you note.
Baud
@Geminid:
Most ironic phrase ever.
That said, I get that they can’t get help anywhere else.
The Kropenhagen Interpretation
Age is objective, old is a judgment.
tobie
If the media is committed to the line, “We don’t negotiate with terrorists,” and criticizing Biden for the deal to bring American prisoners home from Iran, they should at least mention that Reagan sold arms to Iran–in contravention of the US’s own embargo–to fund terrorist contras in Nicaragua. Reagan did this AFTER Iran helped plan the bombing of the US Marine barracks in Beirut. Trump made a deal with the terrorist Taliban that was quite advantageous to the Taliban. US foreign policy is littered with contradictions. Nothing about the prisoner swap is remotely as bad as Iran-Contra.
sab
@hueyplong: Because it’s not just Trump. For all his faults, Matt Gaetz has perfectly respectable hair.
Gin & Tonic
@Geminid: I may have mentioned, some 10 or more years ago, my son traveled, via that land corridor, to Artsakh/Nagorno-Karabakh. He had to get a separate visa, and it was understood that with that in his passport he would be denied entry to Azerbaijan. Lots of bad blood there.
The Kropenhagen Interpretation
@sab: If Flat Top from Dick Tracy is your thing…
MisterDancer
I still submit this is all in his head. He never had a plan for Twitter, sued to get out of the deal when he realized his mouth had written a real check this time, and now is clearly sucked into a vortex of the demons in his own head.
This is the man who’s car company is being sued for multiple cases of racial and sexual discrimination. The is the man who’s first solo Tesla idea, the Cybertruck, cannot get built. The is the man who’s driverless cars are under investigation for falsifying data.
Musk has always been this way, it turns out. The man who got drummed out of PayPal for shit ideas never grew up, never really learned anything, never got a sense of responsibility.
Of course he sees a sea of sycophants and boot-lickers on Twitter now, a group the app is clearly (re)programmed to self-select for, to boost his followers and engagement against, and thinks he can monetize them to success.
MisterDancer
@tobie: It is not to their advantage to have a memory, in this moment.
The Kropenhagen Interpretation
Responsibility is for people
in the emerald mineson the factory floor, not management.Gin & Tonic
Latvia has begun the process of deporting/expelling 4,000 russian citizens resident in Latvia who have not taken the now-mandatory Latvian language proficiency exam.
Suzanne
@OzarkHillbilly:
I think that the media has a really fucked-up bias toward D R A M AAAAAAA! They need to make it where none exists. Like, all of these reporters have massive main-character syndrome that they channel via their work.
I see it with non-partisan things all the time. Like, I go to nbcnews.com and “Breaking News”. They are putting the latest developments in Alex Murtaugh’s stupid trial in red chyrons, as if it is CRITICAL FOR ME TO KNOW NOW, and not a prurient curiosity.
lowtechcyclist
…I don’t want to be part of your revolution!
-attributed to Emma Goldman
The Kropenhagen Interpretation
@Suzanne: Who put the dram in the drama llama ding dongs?
tobie
@MisterDancer: Yup. The RNC feeds the media a talking point and the media leads with the line, “People are saying…” which legitimizes the talking point and turns it into a popular critique.
I really try to avoid responding to stories by saying, “Imagine, if a Democrat had done that,” but l’affaire Boebert broke me. I read Charlotte Clymer’s piece and she’s right. The hue and cry if AOC engaged in any of the behavior Boebert did would be deafening.
hueyplong
It’s tough when a powerful, constitutionally protected segment of the polity determines that destabilizing the country is its most profitable path.
The Kropenhagen Interpretation
@hueyplong: I thought I was Constitutionally protected, then this Supreme Court came along.
Geminid
@Baud: Armenia is member of the CSTOL security framework that Russia leads. Several other former Soviet Republics including Kasakhstan and Uzbekistan are also members.
The Russian peacekeepers were badly needed at the time, and they kept the area fairly quiet while maintaining the Lachin Corridor up until last December. But recently, Armenian PM Pashninyan told a Politico-EU interviwer that, “As a result of events in Ukraine, Russian capabilities have changed,” and that “Russian peacekeepers have failed in their mission.”
Most countries including Armenia recognize that the self-proclaimed Republic of Artsakh is part of Azerbaijan’s territory, but it cannot be safely brought under that nation’s governance without guarentees including a substantial and effective peacekeeping force to protect the enclave’s 120,000 residents.
Soprano2
@The Kropenhagen Interpretation: Oh I know they’re lying. I just want some reporter to put them on the spot like that, preferably while playing footage of them being reunited with their families.
The Kropenhagen Interpretation
@Soprano2: Can’t say I blame you. It’s like cruelty layered on top of lies on top of hatred. I didn’t expect the compromise between Italian food and tire rams/anthrax to be an evil lasagna.
But then, what else could it have been.
Subsole
@gvg:
They would bail and head over to wherever the Libs are now.
Bullying is no run without someone to bully, and that’s what all of their complaints about free speech come down to.
hueyplong
@The Kropenhagen Interpretation: You must be woke. It’s the media’s job to spin anthrax/tire rims as the compromise.
Bupalos
I’d liken it to the one of the ways sports announcers shape their commentary when they see insurmountable odds develop for one team during a game. And I’d say in both sports entertainment and political entertainment media just reacts to their perception of what makes their work most economically valuable.
What is interesting to think about is that there are a variety of ways they’ll shape commentary in that situation, it’s not always to boost the underdog’s performance or emphasize the favored team’s vulnerability.
The other thing to think about is that the commentary doesn’t actually affect the outcome of the game. Clearly political entertainment can, but we probably overestimate the degree pretty badly.
Subsole
@The Kropenhagen Interpretation:
Thank you for so succinctly articulating a concept I have been grappling with for a while now.
The only reason we don’t talk much (nationally, at least) about how godawful white supremacy is for white people is that it’s so much worse for everyone else.
The Kropenhagen Interpretation
@Subsole: Two of my favorite YouTubers, F.D. Signifier and Foreign Man in a Foreign Land have spoken about whiteness in these terms.
I first heard them actually not long after I made this determination myself. I don’t know if I absorbed it one of the myriad times I fell asleep with Youtube running or if, by following,.I reached the same conclusion.
Point is they put up good essays. F.D. Signifier tends to be long, though.
Bupalos
@tobie: This is the advantage of being of that chaotic nihilist revenge faction which Boobert represents. Literally anything can be spun, as long as it is destabilizing. Boobert antagonized arts patrons, flouted the rules of civil society, and made a big stinky in a public space. It’s not like it was some kind of targeted attack, that’s just who she is. But mission accomplished.
Bupalos
@Gin & Tonic: Wow I think that is a a really bad idea. I mean, I get seeing Russian-only speakers presence as a kind of vulnerability Putin could try to play on. But this is exactly the wrong way to address that IMO, it verges on lending these Russian tropes power.
lowtechcyclist
@Bupalos:
I think it’s hard to overestimate its effect, when four out of the last six Presidential elections have turned on less than 120,000 votes in one state or a combination of key states.
What Have the Romans Ever Done for Us?
@Baud: It’s a semi-Boebert situation. He confessed to masturbating on a phone call (not clear if it was a video or just voice call as far as I know) with the woman in question.
I went to MSU for grad school and grew up in Michigan, so to the extent that I follow college football Michigan State is the program I follow, though I’m far more into college basketball than football so I’m not obsessive about the football program.
That said, here is a succinct summary of the situation:
Roughly 1.5 years ago the football team had a really good year thanks mostly to a star running back. It generated some interest from other programs in our head coach and so the AD panicked and gave him Nick Saban money – a contract extension of $95 million over 10 years. Then we had a disappointing year last year and were expecting marginal improvement this year but then this controversy hit.
The controversy is this: The AD hired an outside consultant – a rape survivor – to train the football program on sexual assault and harassment. The head football coach took a shine to her and engaged in a series of phone calls and other communication with her culminating in the phone call aforementioned. After which phone call she filed a sexual harassment claim against him which just became public a couple weeks back.
He released a statement saying this was all consensual…but a lot of these guys say that and may even believe it, but the woman has another perspective. I mean, even Garrison Keillor, when me-tooed, tried the I thought she was into me excuse.
To me, the alternate explanation that could fit the case is she took his phone calls because he was a past and potentially future client and she didn’t want to alienate him and lose business, so she humored most of it until it passed some creepiness threshold that was a bridge too far. So it may have seemed and even been consensual up to a point – i.e. something she put up with for a potential client so long as there wasn’t a line crossed – until it wasn’t, but he can’t grasp that she was just humoring a client and he crossed a line. I don’t know, maybe it was all entirely consensual but then why the harassment claim?
Anyway he’s confessed to the masturbation on the phone with her and other aspects of his relationship. Honestly it’s the dumbest thing he could have done. I mean, start a relationship with a woman who does business with the AD and your program training staff and players on sexual harassment and assault. Like, there are so many other fish in the sea with no connection to the university, and hence no sexual harassment claim, for a guy pulling $10 million a year, in East Lansing, MI, that to pick her is just stupid beyond belief.
Because…his contract does have that moral turpitude clause and is one of the few outs the university has to fire him without being on the hook for the remainder of his contract. Like, he could half ass the job for the next 8 years and lose every game and they would just have to keep paying him. IANAL so I can’t say for sure what constitutes a slam dunk violation of that clause, but this seems to be pretty much it from where I sit. By my calcs he still has about $80 million coming to him on the contract that is probably not going to be his because of this. The charitable explanation, given that he’s a former football player, is CTE. Whatever the case though, it sucks for him.
Baud
@What Have the Romans Ever Done for Us?:
Thanks for the detailed summary.
Ken
@What Have the Romans Ever Done for Us?: Every year my company makes everyone take anti-harassment training, which has a lot of “In this situation what is the correct thing to do” questions. I am usually bemused by these, since I don’t see how anyone could get the wrong answer.
I thank you for the example that yes, there are people who would get the wrong answer to “Your organization has hired a rape survivor to do anti-harassment training. Is it appropriate to stalk her and masturbate during phone conversations?”
Kayla Rudbek
@satby: yes, I hope that I can do stretches like that when I’m in my 80s. And that I will still be riding the tandem.
Bupalos
@lowtechcyclist: that doesn’t speak to the affective power of the commentary, it speaks to the stakes involved in any potential effect.
What Have the Romans Ever Done for Us?
@Ken: I know, it’s not that hard to figure what the smart play was in this situation, or most similar situations. I mean, assuming she was really into him and he wasn’t misinterpreting good customer service as interest, the correct response is “I’m flattered but I have too much riding on it to become involved with anyone doing business with my program.” A polite no thanks woulda saved the guy upwards of $80 million.
Gin & Tonic
@Bupalos: Well, it has been Latvian law for probably two years now, so they have given ample notice.
mrmoshpotato
@Kayla Rudbek:
You stoker or captain?
rikyrah
@Baud:
ROE was the compromise.
rikyrah
@Betty Cracker:
it’s the type of immigrants that you get. Other places with Hispanic/Latino immigrants don’t have the issues of the ones in Florida.
rikyrah
@Scout211:
Blew a $95 million dollar bag.
That is the pure definition of an idiot
Maxim
@What Have the Romans Ever Done for Us?: FYI, “something she put up with for a potential client” does not in any way equal consent. You are, unintentionally I’m sure, using the language of rape culture there — the assumption that this is just how men behave, and it’s normal and therefore to be expected, and a woman’s job is just to put up with it until “a line is crossed.”
No. To all of that. Yes, it’s common, and it has been normalized by decades (not to say centuries, nay millennia) of misogyny, but it is not okay.
eversor
@OzarkHillbilly:
This is true. It’s also an easy way to juice a poll. Most people think Biden is too old to be president. Most people already think most of our political leaders are too old to be in office. Then you have Feinstein and McConnell who are in obvious rapid decline having constant moments on camera.
Do I think Biden is to old to be president? In general yes. He’s in that age range where at any moment something can happen. Is that going to affect my vote? No. He’s pretty spry for some his age.
Paul in KY
@satby: I think alot of the hand wringing has to do with VP Harris. Either they are aghast that Pres. Biden might have to resign and then ‘that woman’ would be POTUS, or they don’t think VP Harris could win the race in 2024 as POTUS and are hoping he does resign (cause he’s been so effective and great) and she ascends to the Presidency.
The Kropenhagen Interpretation
I’m still tryna figure out how you can masturbate on a phone conversation not explicitly dedicated to that purpose. First of all, it’s repugnant. I also can’t begin to conceptualize how one could achieve arousal during any form of therapy. People are so weird.
Soprano2
@Suzanne: I think you’re right about that. I keep telling conservatives that if there were any real evidence that Joe Biden took a bribe, the press would drop the “he’s too old” stories in a heartbeat to cover it.
Geminid
@Geminid: More on the Artsakh fighting, from Middle East Eye correspondent Rafip Soylu:
This is evidently a limited offensive intended to increase pressure on the Republic of Artsakh to assent to control by the Azerbaijan government.
Soprano2
@The Kropenhagen Interpretation: I read a book back in the ’80’s, I can’t remember who wrote it, where the author talked about whiteness as a flexible concept. He said the only people who would never be able to become “white” were black people. He said he thought the next people who would become “white” were Asians, but that was a long time ago.
Soprano2
@What Have the Romans Ever Done for Us?: Sometimes for guys like that the forbidden aspect is why they’re attracted to the woman in the first place. It makes it even more exciting to them. I agree, it was boneheaded.
Paul in KY
@Scout211: Good lawyer point on the poor lady being a Vendor.
Soprano2
@eversor: Here’s how I think about this. My sister was killed in a small plane crash when she was 46. This was in no way foreseeable. Otherwise, based on our family’s genetics she probably would have lived into her 80’s. My point is, you never know what is going to happen. ETA – all this stuff about “The Supreme Court is going to have the Clerical 6 for the next 25 years” is based on the idea that nothing will happen to any of these people until they’re in their 80’s. You never know what will happen.
Soprano2
@Paul in KY: I think 99% of it is about their fear that a black woman will become president. They all act like TFG will become president if something happens to Biden.
EarthWindFire
When my normie friends bring this up, I ask them who’s compromising with who. Gets them thinking, at least.
Paul in KY
@The Kropenhagen Interpretation: I think that if somehow no one knew how old they were (and we still had ‘modern’ healthcare/science), they would probably live a bit longer. How that could possibly happen (not knowing your age), I do not know.
rikyrah
@Soprano2:
99.5% is about this
rikyrah
@satby:
preach
Geminid
@Soprano2: I have also noticed people on the “Left” who worry that Vice President Harris would have the inside track in the 2028 nomination race, and that this would foreclose the possibility of a more “Progressive” nominee.
I certainly don’t share this view, but it’s a real one among a small but noisy group of soreheads.
Paul in KY
@What Have the Romans Ever Done for Us?: Excellent recap.
Paul in KY
@What Have the Romans Ever Done for Us?: True. It seems he was the pursuer, though.
Paul in KY
@The Kropenhagen Interpretation: I think he was trying to ‘sweet talk’ her on that call. May have been video. Ick.
Subsole
@The Kropenhagen Interpretation:
Will check them out. Thanks.
Paul in KY
@Soprano2: Assuming on Nov 3 or whatever in 2024 that Pres. Biden is the same Biden that he is today, I think he’s a stronger candidate than a Pres. Harris.
Mostly because there is a portion of the electorate that seemingly will not vote for any woman as Pres. (including a cohort who would happily vote for Pres. Biden). Voting for Cheetolini over a Pres. Harris, just because she has womany parts, is the absolute definition of feeding your dick into the woodchipper (IMO), but sadly they are out there.
Paul in KY
@Geminid: Just laugh and tell them they ain’t getting their President West!!
dirge
What’s the point of being rich if you still have to go around worrying about informed consent all the time?
What Have The Romans Ever Done for Us?
@Maxim: I’m aware of that but that was, I’m assuming, why she may have waited and kept taking his calls despite not being interested. It’s the explanation for why he may have thought it was consensual when it wasn’t. I’m not condoning his behavior but am not sure what the proper terminology is but at some point he moved beyond what she thought was appropriate or allowable.
eversor
@Soprano2:
True. The way I see it is there are some old people who should(‘ve) go(ne) but didn’t. RGB, DiFi, and Mitch being the mostly glaring ones recently. Then there are others like Biden or even Grassley who are going strong despite their age.
FWIW I think the GOP is smart enough to realize that the best possible thing for them if Trump loses is for Biden to die in office and Harris to become POTUS. There’s going to be a lot of drama around it, time spent on things like a new VP, and the process is going to bog things down. Which gives the GOP a chance to make sandbagging and grandstanding over nothing even more effective. Also screws up all the current democratic political manuevering for 2028. Also endless news cycles of “we said Biden would die, democrats why didn’t he step down and why didn’t you primary him”.
Matt McIrvin
@Geminid: Agreed. If Kamala Harris is not the incumbent President in 2028 (which of course is a distinct possibility), she’ll be one competitor in the primary among many, and I don’t think she’ll have any particular inside track. Neither party has a particular tradition of automatically crowning Vice-Presidents as heirs apparent. They often get the nomination but they have to win it.
Geminid
@Matt McIrvin: This is true. But some of these soreheads promote (or swallow) the narrative that the DNC can rig the nomination in favor of Harris, and would. This is not a rational view, but these folks are holding a deep grudge, and some of them promote a dishonest narrative that their credulous followers will believe.
I do not think their numbers are significant, so this is more an observation than a warning.
Steeplejack
@What Have the Romans Ever Done for Us?:
I followed this somewhat because my RWNJ brother is an MSU alumnus. You gave a good recap of the situation. Brother is delighted, not because of social justice but because of getting rid of an expensive boat-anchor coach.
Steeplejack
@What Have the Romans Ever Done for Us?:
The panel would also accept “Is your sister hot?” Eh, probably not.
Kathleen
@satby: Beautifully stated, satby.
Kathleen
@tobie: I’m sorry but that would require “contetxt” plus they can’t copy and paste it from the Republican Party’s email. If a Republican didn’t source it it wouldn’t get printed.
Scout211
@What Have the Romans Ever Done for Us?: Just to add one more piece to your great wrap-up, the call in question was made from a hotel where he was staying for university related business. A fact that he first denied.
Added: Here is the original story that broke first last week on September 10th in USA Today.
Maxim
@What Have The Romans Ever Done for Us?:
This assumes that he wasn’t beyond that point from the very beginning. (Hint: he was.) Given that the woman trains people about this stuff for a living, it is more likely that she began documenting his behavior from the get-go, and let it continue long enough to establish a pattern of behavior that would stand up in court (and other legal contexts).
Emmyelle
Tai Babalonia reminding my cold shriveled geriatric Gen X heart of her existance and radient presence, is a wonderful thing.
Kathleen
@Paul in KY: That’s exactly what it is. Hence the obsession with “Biden old” and what VP Harris is supposedly not doing when I’ve gone decades without hearing what any vice president has done much less criticism of what he hadn’t done. Also to me it explains the visceral, vile personal attacks. Media hate him for choosing VP Harris. Hate him.
wjca
A better approach would be the one the Ukrainians have taken. Even after being attacked (again!) by Russia, nobody is required to learn Ukrainian instead. But the native Russian speakers (including Zelenskyy) are doing so.
Not suggesting Latvia should get itself invaded. But just looking at Ukraine should be a sufficient motivator.
Kayla Rudbek
@mrmoshpotato: stoker although I have started working with a book on yoga for cyclists and I need to get Mr. Rudbek to start as well.
Soprano2
@eversor: All of that would be so stupid, though. The reply to “why didn’t you primary him” is “because incumbency is powerful, and that’s why we have a vice-president”. Period.
lowtechcyclist
@Bupalos:
The ‘affective power of the commentary’ doesn’t have to be very great, was the point I was making: that ‘affective power’ only had to move the needle the tiniest bit in order to stick us with GWB, 9/11, and Iraq instead of Al Gore and a first cut at addressing climate change. It only had to move it a tiny bit in order to give us four years of TFG instead of Hillary Clinton. It would have had to move it only a little bit in order to give us a second term of TFG, which might well have marked the end of our democracy.
You don’t have to be strong at all to push something over if it’s balanced on a knife-edge.
lowtechcyclist
@Matt McIrvin:
Your last sentence is correct, but the Vice-Presidency is a huge leg up. Let’s look at what’s happened when the veep of a retiring President has run for the nomination.
On the GOP side, in 1988, GHWB’s strongest opponent was right-wing pundit Pat Buchanan. While Richard Nixon drew a stronger opponent in 1960 in Nelson Rockefeller, Rocky never got as much as 7% of the vote in any primary.
On the Dem side, there’s just Al Gore, who had to fend off Bill Bradley’s challenge in 2000. But Gore had the upper hand throughout in what would have been a much more even race if they’d both been Senators at the time.
And needless to say, if Biden had run in 2016 (as he’d planned to do and would have done if Beau Biden hadn’t died), he and Hillary would been on a fairly even footing, but only because Biden had been veep. If he’d still been in the Senate, he wouldn’t have stood a chance.
So in 2028, if Biden serves his full second term, Harris won’t be just one of many. At a minimum, she’ll be in the top tier, slugging it out with Whitmer and Newsom.
Bupalos
@Paul in KY: I think that’s way overestimated. Hillary beat Trump in the popular vote and she had serious electoral baggage and her campaign really wasn’t strategic or well run.
Bupalos
@lowtechcyclist: That’s fine, I get that. But what I’m saying is that you can point to maybe dozens of factors of that kind of magnitude, and I think we overemphasize that particular one. Fixate on it really.
It’s like a game where the ref keeps spotting the ball three inches back. It matters. But potentially the way it matters the most is how distracted the players get with the idea that the ref is throwing the game.
artem1s
@Shalimar:
OK, I’m absolutely convinced now that he’s helping Russian oligarchs lauder money. thousands of Russian bot accounts ‘paying’ a monthly subscription fee.
Paul in KY
@Bupalos: I sure hope you are right, Bupalos!