quite literally a “FLASH: President wears sneakers….and <several paragraphs down> also the other guy calls for political executions” piece https://t.co/MNNAhFdsYA
— Patrick Dillon (@mpdillon) September 26, 2023
Bottom of the story:
“Beyond Trump's legal issues, his erratic behavior…has raised concerns about (his) mental state…this past week Trump accused exiting Joint Chiefs Chairman…of a "treasonous act" & suggested he could be executed.”
No ?? ?? or ALL CAPS for that part I guess https://t.co/ke3ffbP1XJ
— TJ Ducklo (@TDucklo) September 26, 2023
The reason the Biden team is so worried about him tripping isn’t because of the threat falling might pose to an 80-year old, it’s because of the threat news outlets like Axios would pose to democracy if Biden fell. The news would run “Biden fell” above “Trump guilty.” https://t.co/DAGYRZ4E66
— Craig Harrington (@Craigipedia) September 26, 2023
Are there any non-persuadable-Republican voters not drawing Social Security who actually care that sneakers are ‘not formal enough for the President to wear to a picket line?… ‘
???? The entire press office is incredibly old
How did we get so old
Matlock is streaming on a loop
What have we done https://t.co/WR1YoRYsYE pic.twitter.com/PLh1D8BCYt
— Andrew Bates (@AndrewJBates46) September 26, 2023
Alright, here is my opinion on the whole John Fetterman, Senate dress code thing. Fetterman should wear a suit bc we keep talking about his clothes, not his policies. But we should also stop thinking wearing a suit automatically makes you respectable.https://t.co/zwEnXOjnXy
— derek guy (@dieworkwear) September 23, 2023
Politico actually commissioned an article from Derek Guy, the premier social-media ‘Men, Stop Dressing Like Slobs‘ expert… although I don’t think they knew what they’d be getting:
… In arguing in favor of the dress code, I seem to be in the company of Fetterman’s many conservative critics. But I’m not. Their comments — and the glut of conversation both online and in the news — suggest they fundamentally misunderstand the purpose of putting on a nice suit. Clothing is a poor proxy for a person’s more important inner qualities, such as character, capability and intelligence. Respectability can be more directly measured by a person’s actions. The reason the Senate should maintain the dress code is precisely because clothing is not all that important — next to debates over who gets welfare and who goes to war, fashion is simply not a serious concern. The dress code is about something deeper than that. The point of wearing a suit to Congress is to give physical form to the genuine ideals in your heart: your dedication to upholding your oath of office, your devotion to the institution of democracy, your unshakable commitment to the constituents you serve. If you don’t demonstrate these ideals through your behavior, a suit won’t make up for it. By focusing too much on the mere appearance of respectability, Fetterman’s critics lose sight of the deeper, more meaningful aspects of what it means to serve honorably.
There’s no better example of this misunderstanding than Roger Stone — a longtime supporter of former President Donald Trump. Stone complained to Newsmax this week that Fetterman’s casual style is an “insult to the Senate” and yet it is Stone who stands by a president who attacked more governmental institutions than any president in modern history. Stone has shown more outrage over sweatshirts than over Trump’s interference in Justice Department investigations, his coarsening of the public discourse, his sexual assault allegations or even his attempt to overturn the results of an election he unambiguously lost. In the Danish documentary A Storm Foretold, Stone can be heard laying out plans to help Trump cling to power after his electoral loss. “Fuck the voting,” he said. “Let’s get right to the violence. Shoot to kill.” He would later lobby Trump for a pardon for his role in the Jan. 6 assault on the Capitol. Forget hoodies — this was the real “insult to the Senate.”
One of the interesting things about the Fetterman dress scandal is that the suit itself was once the gym shorts and hoodie of its day.
This part got cut from my Politico op-ed (for good reason; it was getting long and tangential). But when Keir Hardie—a Scottish union leader… pic.twitter.com/YSDrxb86rF
— derek guy (@dieworkwear) September 23, 2023
Same as it ever was…
This part got cut from my Politico op-ed (for good reason; it was getting long and tangential). But when Keir Hardie—a Scottish union leader and co-founder of what would later become the Labour Party—was first elected to Parliament in 1892, he wore a tweed suit, a red necktie, and a deerstalking cap to his first day of work.
Today, we think of the suit as a formal garment, the very glass of respectability. But as I’ve mentioned here before, this was not always so. In the late 19th century, men in high positions—such as those in banking and law—wore the more formal frock coat. Working-class clerks and administrators wore the fustian lounge suit.
When Hardie was elected, the proper Parliamentary uniform was a black frock coat, a starched wing collar, and a black silk top hat. Hardie, who was elected to represent the people of West Ham South—a working-class seat in Essex, now Greater London—rejected this uniform because he felt it was the symbol of capital. Instead, he opted to dress like his constituents.
Polite society was scandalized. The press was so offended that he wore a deerstalking cap—a flat cap style associated with members of the working class, rather than the silk top hat worn by MPs—one paper wrote: “A cloth cap in Parliament!”
I’m not convinced Fetterman is dressing to signal anything (if he was, he would be more vocal about it). As I mentioned in my op-ed, I think he should not only wear a suit in the Senate chamber but even when walking through Congressional halls. Not doing so creates a distraction from more meaningful matters. But being “respectful” of our political system is much more than dressing up. It’s about how you serve honorably. You can signal this through your clothes, but someone not wearing those clothes does not necessarily mean they are not fulfilling the more important duties. We should focus more attention on actions, not clothes.
But it’s an interesting historical point that the suit was, at one point, causing a very similar controversy.
Hoppie
Just because I’m in a strange mood tonight:
Just about a year ago
I set out in the air
Seekin’ my fame and fortune
Lookin’ for a pot of gold
Things got bad and things got worse
I guess you all know the tune
Oh Lord, stuck on the red-eye again.
Rode in on the airport bus
I’ll be walkin’ out if I go
I was just passin’ through
Must be seven months or more
Ran out of miles and money
Looks like they took my friends
Oh Lord, I’m stuck on the red-eye again.
The man from the on-line website
Said I was on my way
Somewhere I lost connections
I ran out of flights to take.
I came into town, a one night stand
Looks like my plans fell through
Oh Lord, stuck on the red-eye again
If I only had a dollar
For ev’ry flight I’ve flown
Ev’ry time I’ve had to sit
While people sat there drunk
You know, I’d catch the next plane
Back to where I live
Oh Lord, I’m stuck on the red-eye again;
Oh Lord, I’m stuck on the red-eye again.
If you fly a lot, you’ve been there…
Alison Rose
Fuckin a. You know what. I want Biden to go everywhere in bunny slippers and a Snuggie and Fetterman to show up for work in a wrestling singlet and brass knuckles.
Fuck the fucking media who are incapable of understanding what it’s actually important to care about.
Odie Hugh Manatee
TFG could dress as The Joker and the press would excuse it.
piratedan
if you feel that Bluesky would help you fill a niche in your online life, hit me up for an invite, I have two.
Edmund dantes
How did not one single senator on the Dem side come out and put a hold/filibuster threat on the stupidity that is this dress code? We’re going to make military personnel wait months on end for promotions, but the GOP and Manchin get to pass this stupidity by unanimous consent?
NotMax
Peripheral but interesting. From 1951, Silk top hat making in London. And a bit of trivia:
;)
piratedan
@Edmund dantes: I’m guessing that there are better “issues” to die on and my guess is that Fetterman himself probably doesn’t have too much of an issue with it else he could have made that stand himself. It is just a further illustration on the extent of the pettiness in the upper chamber.
Tony Jay
@NotMax:
Outside of formal wear for the maturing leeches of Eton and Harrow, the top hat is unlikely to make a comeback on our High Streets.
The gentleman’s walking cane, OTOH, totally should. Helpful, practical, multi-purpose, it’s a fabulous piece of kit that makes any walk feel like a swagger. Plus, you can beat cornered enemies into a coma with one! Why is this not on the Milan catwalks?
Citizen Alan
It would be hilarious to me if Fetterman started wearing a frock coat and a silk top hat (and maybe a monocle or something) and then started mocking all the Republicans for dressing like middle class tradesmen.
Hoppie
@Tony Jay: um, the top ditty was sort of aimed at you.
NotMax
@Tony Jay
London fashion extravaganzas too busy with folderol like showcasing pregnant male models?
Also too, from the same Wikipedia link as above,
Chetan Murthy
@Alison Rose: An overweening interest in the symbols of our institutions goes hand-in-hand with the destruction of those institutions. I read that back in the 80s. The issue then was flag-burning, and it happened at the same time that RaYgUn’s boys were breaking the law, selling weapons to Iran and using the money to fund the Contras.
Origuy
It’s reported to be a warehouse used by Uzbekistan Customs. Something on its way to Russia? Smoking is bad for your health.
Leto
The panel on MSNBC was talking about this, how the press will cover tennis shoes versus Trumov’s calling for Milley’s execution. Joy Reid was excoriating them for it. I didn’t know it was an actual piece till now. I thought it was simply an example of silliness. JFC. They’re worse than useless.
gene108
@Odie Hugh Manatee:
The Joker always wore a suit, a garish purple suit, but a suit nonetheless.
NotMax
Telling that the debate was relegated to the Fox Business Network, the red-headed stepchild of the Murdoch empire.
Not at all unusual for FBN’s ratings to be too meager for Nielsen to measure, earning them an asterisk in place of a number. Remembering one point several years ago when FBN’s national audience – national, mind you – was estimated by industry insiders to total 13,000.
Gretchen
Why has nobody considered that Fetterman may have trouble doing buttons and zippers after his stroke and finds it easier to pull on shorts and sweatshirts so he doesn’t have to endure the indignity of having someone else help him dress? He testified in the disability accommodation hearing that he still uses assisted communication technology, and that it embarrasses him and he’s attacked as being unfit by Republicans for doing so. Schumer has stood by the rules forever and suddenly gave way. Maybe because he knew that there was a more serious reason than Fetterman’s desire to dress casually?
Gretchen
And the last thing Fetterman would want is to publicly say that he has trouble getting into a suit without help and wants the rules changed to accommodate his disability. He’d rather have everybody up in arms that he wants to dress like a teenager.
eversor
@Odie Hugh Manatee:
The Joker uses less makeup though…
Villago Delenda Est
Allen and VandeHei (the founders of both POLITICO and Axios) are on the tumbrel manifest. Vile Broderist scum, both of them.
Odie Hugh Manatee
@gene108:
True, but the makeup change from orange would send the presstitutes swooning while they note that Biden is too old to be daring and change things up like their favorite criminal.
@eversor:
Covered above but good point. :)
Bruce K in ATH-GR
I keep coming back to a point that doesn’t seem to come up much: a politician-grade suit that’ll fit a man roughly the size of the Chrysler Building is probably not cheap. John Fetterman’s bio doesn’t give the impression that he’s made of money, and it’s doubtful he has Bob Menendez’s sort of talent for acquiring it.
Ksmiami
If the so called political media cannot be reasoned with… then they should be destroyed. It can’t come soon enough.
Gretchen
@Villago Delenda Est: Charlie Pierce has given Politico the apt name of Tiger Beat on the Potomac.
Chetan Murthy
@Bruce K in ATH-GR: IIUC his parents aren’t wealthy, but certainly well-off. They apparently subsidized his lifestyle while he was mayor. Father was (is?) partner at an insurance company. I’m sure he can afford the suits.
moops
A formal dress code for elected officials should be accompanied by a clothing budget and tailoring.
If there are doing this, then they need to do it right. Also, no more “so cute” outfits for the ladies. suits for them too. Further, the terrible fashion choices of some of the men on either side of the aisle should clearly be within scope.
montanareddog
There, Axios, ftfy
geg6
@Gretchen:
He does not have any problems dressing himself because he would say so if that was the case. This is how he dresses and has dressed in all the years I’ve been aware of him, which goes back to his first run as mayor of Braddock. He isn’t going to hide that, just as he was open about his stroke and then about his depression. He’s just not that kind of guy. And if he didn’t talk about, Giselle, his lovely wife, would because she is the most open book I’ve ever seen. And as a constituent, I couldn’t give a shit what he wears while doing the people’s business. I leave that to people like Manchin, who dress in suits while fucking us all over.
Betty Cracker
I’m amused that Suit Guy’s essay wasn’t what Politico thought it was getting too, but it was still a load of hooey. If wearing a suit is truly important, it shouldn’t be so hard to articulate why that is so. But the suit advocates can’t, so we get bullshit like this:
So what’s the fucking point again? Circular reasoning is circular.
Jeffg166
If Biden and TFG have a debate I would like Joe to come out take his jacket off, drop and do some push-ups, stand and do a bit of stretching, then put his jacket back on and say, “I’m good to go.”
eversor
@Betty Cracker:
It’s about enforcing bullshit concepts of status.
A suit is a signifier of social status and class status. That’s why dress codes exist. This has been perverted into dressing for the job means you respect the job. It’s absurd, and it’s stupid, but it is what it is.
A lot of these fuckers are insanely status concious. Which translates into if we all stop doing this phoney bullshit kabuki dance around respectability and various norms the entire system will come crashing down and they won’t be above the plebes.
Dress codes are just peacocking for the fucking boss to uphold bullshit systems. Everyone knows this. But if you speak about it you lose your phony balloney job in this phony ass farce.
I hate all of it. I always get a chuckle that I have to wear a suit and Rolex to job interviews. Then I wear jeans, boots, polos, and a gshock on the job. Wearing a tux to formal work functions where everyone gets shit faced and you get to watch the dry humping and tits spilling out, but hey, we look classy, is also always fun. Now let’s all watch the partner dance on the table!
Dress codes play out in other ways. A while back I caught a charge for being in a bar brawl. I showed up to court in a suit and most people thought I was a lawyer. The whole thing was very funny. My lawyer commented that I looked like one of them and not only were the charges bullshit but he was sure it would get tossed also because of how I dressed. It got tossed.
I fucking hate dress codes.
Gretchen
@geg6: I disagree. He spent weeks in a psych ward dealing with his new situation. He said in the hearing that he’s struggling with his deficits. He’s embarrassed, and Republicans are taking every opportunity to say he’s too impaired to do the job. He’s not going to stand up in front of the Senate and say “hey, everybody, I’m having trouble dressing myself. Can you cut me some slack?” Yes, he’s dressed this way in casual situations forever, and has worn suits when required. Now the suits are difficult, and his loving wife, while admirably frank, is protective of him.
Ramalama
Letterman could wear a suit with most ridiculous tie. Or a suit and a cape. Suit, cape, walking stick, top hat.
lowtechcyclist
@Villago Delenda Est:
I’m all for nuking Axios from space as a warning to the others that they’d better shape up.
Central Planning
@eversor: I once had to go to court for a traffic ticket. I was the only person there in a suit besides the lawyers.
They lost their copy of my ticket. When they called my name, the judge said they would postpone my appearance and then said loudly for everyone in the court to hear: “I will note that YOU SHOWED UP IN A SUIT”
It didn’t get me anything, but got the speeding ticket reduced to failure to obey a traffic control device.
Ramalama
@Gretchen:
But what if he had a couple suits made like breakaway basketball pants that, once pulled, turn into shorts?
Betty
I looked up the phrase “business attire” they used in the dress code. Apparently there are strict limits on colors, including the tie. No patterns. I wonder how enforcement will work.
JML
Dress code just came up in my office, it was imposed by the senior management team without consulting the staff essentially on the direction of the VP. It’s caused grumbling among the staff and one of the senior managers complained to me (we’re friends and until recently were peers before her promotion) about the snotty comments another staff member had been making in front of her, and I’m like “what did you expect?” She thought that the management team represented staff viewpoints to the VP that it replaced staff actually getting to voice their opinion before the decision was made. She even started the question the professionalism of a colleagues piercings, and I’m like you don’t want to go there (this is a staff member who had these when they were hired and has been here 10 years). I work at a public university, so dress code is extra stupid when you look at what our faculty wear.
But people (especially managers) always overestimate the importance of a dress code. It’s a tool to keep people in place, it’s a way to see who will comply and obey and who will push back so you can find out who “isn’t on the team”, and it almost never actually improves the performance of an office. It’s always done to suit the preferences of management, and that’s the kind of thing that drives people crazy: having to do this thing and/or make this change to make management happy over making the staff comfortable and happy, when it has nothing to do with performance.
Soprano2
That Axios piece is such bullshit, but they’re going to continue to cover it like that because evidently they can’t help themselves. At this point they have to know what they’re doing.
As for the issue at hand, two things can be true at the same time – A) what you wear on your body has nothing to do with your intelligence, character, competence, or any of the other qualities that make you who you are, and B) people will absolutely make judgments about you based on your appearance, and part of that is the clothes you put on your body. One person on the other thread where this was discussed said that they believe a person in a suit is a crook who is out to take their money. What’s that, if not making a snap judgment about a person based solely on what they’re wearing? Then, on this thread, we have two examples of how wearing appropriate clothing to a court helped the person either get out of the charges entirely or get a ticket reduced in severity. In many situations, what you wear on your body does matter; you can deny that all you want, and say it’s bullshit, but it’s still true. Furthermore, none of this “it’s OK to be casual in all situations” stuff applies to women or people of color in our society; just imagine if Rev. Warnock wanted to dress the way Fetterman does. I agree that he should be able to do that, but he never will, because he knows how that would be regarded if he did it. Same way with women, no woman in Congress could dress that way and expect to have anyone take them seriously. It shouldn’t be like that, but it is. I think this is part of our innate tribalism, where we try to figure out whether someone is part of our “tribe” or not. We do it both consciously and subconsciously. How many of you cringe every time you see someone wearing a red hat, before you even see if there is anything on it? (It’s hard on us Cardinal fans. LOL) When I see someone wearing a TFG shirt or hat, I think to myself “It’s good when the morons label themselves like that”. And so on.
There is a reason there are dress codes in the workplace. As long as they’re reasonable, I think they’re a good idea (dictating whether men wear patterned ties is stupid, though – that’s way too much.) Expecting a clean, neat, professional appearance in the workplace is reasonable IMHO. It all depends on the job – I don’t expect the guys who work in the sewer to wear suits, but I do expect that they will wear a clean uniform or T-shirt and jeans every day. An employer has a right to want their employees to make a certain impression on customers, especially the people who interact with the public. Even at the bar we have standards; one server wanted to wear her “belly shirts”, our manager said absolutely not because that’s not the impression we want to make on customers. My new managers want to require the cooks to dress less sloppily, because they believe it makes a bad impression on the customers when they see them, and I agree with that. Also, the person who sits at the front desk of an office should not dress like an unmade bed – I will die on that hill!!! LOL
Another Scott
@Gretchen:
Fetterman doesn’t seem to have any difficulty wearing suits.
I agree with Betty C. – this is nonsense and a distraction.
Cheers,
Scott.
Quiltingfool
@Soprano2: My husband has two tattoos, one on each of his biceps. When he was installing boat lifts, he would never wear a tank top or sleeveless t-shirt, always shirts with short sleeves. I asked him why, and he said so the customers would not see his tattoos (one aCeltic design, the other an eagle motif). He knew some of the older folks have a dim view of tattoos, and he didn’t want to disrespect them.
Now, he doesn’t own a suit, nor dress slacks. But he does wear dark jeans and a nice collared shirt for important occasions, like funerals or graduations. Around here, that kind of attire is akin to wearing a tux at the Met. You cannot believe the things people here wear to serious functions (“Hey! I just finished slopping the hogs, I think I’ll go to my nephew’s graduation wearing the same clothes!”)
Raoul Paste
This Politico author who wants well-dressed men doesn’t have a clue.
Here’s what happens when you destroy the middle class through Conservative policies.: People who used to shop at Macy’s now buy cheap hoodies at Walmart.
Idiot.
T-Bone
I posted this in an open thread yesterday but, again, struggling into an unaccustomed, uncomfortable form of dress that is a signal of conformity can be soul-crushing. And being forced to start off your day with that kind of bullshit can negatively affect your attitude and performance. Here is a good description of how that can go:
https://johnpavlovitz.com/2021/04/23/if-you-dont-have-mental-illness-heres-what-its-like/
Peke Daddy
@Betty Cracker: It’s not Fetterman’s dress, it’s the prissy reaction from the GOP’s nice polite extremists. They are rewarded for learning on sores, acting out. Like, if Democrats just caved and accepted the Republican program wholesale, the GOP wouldn’t have to block them. Normalizing crazy.
StringOnAStick
@Hoppie:
If you fly a lot, you’ve been there.
Yep. I flew recently for the first time since Covid, and got stuck on a red eye going; running through O’Hare on the way back to avoid doing it again on the way home and having just 2 minutes to spare. I can’t say that I missed flying before this recent experience, and now it has to be for a damned good reason or forget it.
StringOnAStick
@Central Planning: I suspect a lot of judges get tired and annoyed at dealing with low level offenders who show up dressed as the personification of Oppositional Defiance Disorder.
StringOnAStick
There’s certainly interpretations of what dressing for the occasion means. We were just at a wedding of well off, late 20’s individuals and the invitation had asked for “formal but fun” attire. A couple of the extremely large breasted women wore dresses that made my eyes, and their breasts, pop out. It was one more of those “I guess I’m an old fart now” moments; I’ll wear right exercise attire but there’s no way is have left the dressing room in these dresses.
Bill Arnold
@Gretchen:
Do you have any evidence at all that Fetterman has stroke-caused deficits that would hamper complex dressing? As far as I can tell, he continues to have trouble understanding spoken (definitely not written) speech and maybe (from reports) reacting quickly. Cognition seems to be otherwise unimpaired,, though he personally (or an unbiased close observer) would be able to assess that better. No obvious one-sided movement difficulties, which are what usually cause trouble dressing. Seems to be slowly repairing/reorganizing.
Tony Jay
@Hoppie:
Sorry! I gave it a lot of non-verbal appreciation but didn’t want to jump on it like ‘that’s my thing, dude!’
Chris T.
Dead thread, but: I wish the Senate would establish a new dress code, that everyone must either wear a jumpsuit with the names of their chief donors, or if they don’t like that, swimwear. Let’s see who’s actually in shape and who is paying for whom….