Come for the politics, stay for the snark.

I conferred with the team and they all agree – still not tired of winning!

Ah, the different things are different argument.

Bark louder, little dog.

It’s the corruption, stupid.

Battle won, war still ongoing.

Everything is totally normal and fine!!!

It’s a good piece. click on over. but then come back!!

Perhaps you mistook them for somebody who gives a damn.

Wow, I can’t imagine what it was like to comment in morse code.

“Joe Biden deserved better than he got from some folks in his own party.”

Come on, media. you have one job. start doing it.

Tide comes in. Tide goes out. You can’t explain that.

Second rate reporter says what?

So it was an October Surprise A Day, like an Advent calendar but for crime.

Tick tock motherfuckers!

Republicans in disarray!

They fucked up the fucking up of the fuckup!

We’ll be taking my thoughts and prayers to the ballot box.

You don’t get to peddle hatred on saturday and offer condolences on sunday.

I’ve spoken to my cat about this, but it doesn’t seem to do any good.

Accused of treason; bitches about the ratings. I am in awe.

I was promised a recession.

If you’re pissed about Biden’s speech, he was talking about you.

Peak wingnut was a lie.

You are here: Home / Open Threads / Sunday Morning Open Thread: Vacate the (Empty) Chair!…

Sunday Morning Open Thread: Vacate the (Empty) Chair!…

by | 180 Comments

This post is in: , , , ,

Per Reuters, “US Congress averts government shutdown, passing stopgap bill”:

The U.S. Congress passed a stopgap funding bill late on Saturday with overwhelming Democratic support after Republican House Speaker Kevin McCarthy backed down from an earlier demand by his party’s hardliners for a partisan bill.

The Democratic-majority Senate voted 88-9 to pass the measure to avoid the federal government’s fourth partial shutdown in a decade, sending the bill to President Joe Biden, who signed it into law before the 12:01 a.m. ET (0401 GMT) deadline.

McCarthy abandoned party hardliners’ insistence that any bill pass the House with only Republican votes, a change that could cause one of his far-right members to try to oust him from his leadership role.

The House voted 335-91 to fund the government through Nov. 17, with more Democrats than Republicans supporting it…


Per the Washington Post, “McCarthy, McConnell suffer setbacks over control of their caucuses” — [unpaywalled gift link]:

In the span of three hours, rank-and-file Republicans bucked House Speaker Kevin McCarthy and Senate Minority Leader Mitch McConnell, leaving both GOP leaders weakened Sunday heading into a critical legislative period.

First, after days of internal rebellion, McCarthy (R-Calif.) threw in the towel at a Saturday morning meeting. His leadership team had run the numbers, and at least six Republicans would oppose any plan to keep the government open by the midnight deadline.

With just four votes to spare on a GOP-only plan, McCarthy gave up and turned to Democrats to help pass a “clean” resolution to keep the government open at current levels into mid-November.

The only olive branch to staunch conservatives? No funding for Ukraine’s defense in the war against Russia.

Across the Capitol, McConnell had spent the month of September delivering floor speeches dedicated to the defense of Ukrainian President Volodymyr Zelensky, who visited the Capitol nine days earlier to rally support behind President Biden’s request for $24 billion in military and diplomatic support. He worked with Biden administration officials to pare back that request to $6 billion and ask for more funding later this year.

So when the Senate GOP gathered at lunchtime Saturday for a roughly 90-minute meeting, McConnell delivered a pitch to rally support for the original plan — a funding plan that included $6 billion for Ukraine.

His caucus overruled him. They preferred McCarthy’s plan to keep the government open by ditching the debate over Ukraine money until later this year…

In perhaps an unintentional slight, McCarthy told reporters he did not talk to McConnell to personally relay his decision to pursue a bipartisan plan with no money for Ukraine. Instead, the speaker dealt with Sens. Markwayne Mullin (R-Okla.), who previously served 10 years in the House, and John Thune (R-S.D.), the No. 2 GOP leader for the past five years.

But the House speaker faces a more immediate question about his long-term standing…

Sunday Morning Open Thread: <em>Vacate the (Empty) Chair!... </em>

Sunday Morning Open Thread: <em>Vacate the (Empty) Chair!... </em> 1

Mischief!

Reader Interactions

180Comments

  2. 2.

    Baud

    Washington Post, “McCarthy, McConnell suffer setbacks over control of their caucuses”

    Man, if Dems behaved like this, I can’t imagine the headline would be so blasé.

  4. 4.

    Van Buren

    So how would the crazies be acting differently if they weren’t actually doing the bidding of Putin?

  7. 7.

    Baud

    Politico Playbook: Nancy Pelosi has warned colleagues — including Hakeem Jeffries and some in his leadership team — against rushing to bail out Kevin McCarthy on a possible motion to vacate. Instead, she’s counseled, Dems should let Republicans deal with the drama themselves.

    So does that mean Dems abstain from voting or that they vote to remove McCarthy?

    ETA: If they abstain, the motion to vacate will easily fail.

  8. 8.

    hueyplong

    @Baud: It seems like “letting the Republicans deal with the drama themselves” precludes participating in their chair votes.

  10. 10.

    moops

    The threat to vacate was always just theater.  The GOP is not going to vacate because NOBODY could be elected Speaker.   If the idiots in the House do manage to vacate it will be MONTHS before a new Speaker is picked, and it might very well be McCarthy again.

     

    It should have been a clean funding bill AND continued support for Ukraine.

  12. 12.

    Suzanne

    I would say that McCathy deserves to lose his Speakership, and I would be correct. But LMAO there’s no one on that side who would do a better job.

    LAWL.

  13. 13.

    OzarkHillbilly

    Who else agrees it’s time to replace Kevin McCarthy with a REAL Speaker of the House

    It will take another election to manage that, one that gives DEMs a majority in the house..

  14. 14.

    Deputinize Eurasia from the Kuriles to St Petersburg

    @hueyplong:

    Be there to make the quorum, vote for Jeffries, and let the chips fall where they may.

  15. 15.

    Deputinize Eurasia from the Kuriles to St Petersburg

    @RedDirtGirl:

    As it turns out, he was rushing to vote, but a normally open door was closed and locked, so he pressed the only button in sight.

  16. 16.

    hueyplong

    The House is what you’d expect it to be when a gerrymandered majority is in thrall to that portion of their bloc that is comprised solely of internet trolls.  They are experienced and competent in nothing more than FoxNews segments and internet click-bait about how [insert troll name] DESTROYS [Biden or Libs].

    Every account I saw of Gaetz attempting to move to vacate described him as sitting alone on his cell phone just before attempting his gaveled-down motion.  I’m kind of curious to know who was on the other end of the call, but it seems like, instead, we’ll have hearings on the fire alarm being pulled.

  17. 17.

    Mousebumples

    Happy 99th birthday to Jimmy Carter! 🎂🎉

    Ahead of his time, as President. Glad he’s still with us.

  22. 22.

    NotMax

    @RedDirtGirl
    FYI.

    Congressional Republicans are calling for an investigation and expulsion of Progressive Rep. Jamaal Bowman (D-N.Y.), who set off a fire alarm in the Capitol Building ahead of a high-stakes House vote on a stopgap measure to temporarily keep the federal government funded and avert a dreaded shutdown, according to multiple reports…. Source

  24. 24.

    lowtechcyclist

    @rikyrah: ​
     

    Good Morning, Everyone😊😊😊

    Good morning to you!

    Looks like we’ve got a pleasant day on tap here in southern Maryland: sunny, highs in mid-70s, about as good as it gets at this time of year.

  30. 30.

    TS

    Too many attempts throughout the world to turn democracies into dictatorships supporting Putin.

    They don’t know what they wish for – but they sure aren’t going to get what they want.  They know not what they do, but no-one is going to forgive them.

  31. 31.

    lowtechcyclist

    @Baud:

    So does that mean Dems abstain from voting or that they vote to remove McCarthy?

    ETA: If they abstain, the motion to vacate will easily fail.

    Abstain, duh.

    If the motion to vacate were to succeed, there’s no telling how long the House would be without a Speaker this time, which leaves it unable to pass any legislation.  Aid to Ukraine needs to be passed as soon as possible, and of course the CR runs out in mid-November.

  33. 33.

    satby

    Good article here : ”
    Failing to Meet the Moment
    We live in dangerous times — when citizens need top quality information to make informed, wise choices. But the press is failing to meet the moment. This isn’t some cheap shot at “the media.” It’s a good faith critique of a key democratic institution that hasn’t adapted enough to a dangerous authoritarian threat.”

  34. 34.

    Geminid

    @RedDirtGirl: Bowman says he pulled the fire alarm and explained that he was trying to get past a locked door to cast a vote, He was not trying to delay a vote, Bowman emphasized.

    Former Rep. Peter Meijer posted some analysis describing the differences between weekday Capitol access and the more restricted access he found on weekends.

    Some have pointed out that as a former school principal, Bowman should have been especially aware of the seriousness of wrongly pulling a fire alarm. Were he a Republican, many Democrats would be calling for felony charges againt him.

    I guess we’ll have to find out if there will be criminal charges in this case. Republican will be calling for an Ethics Committee investigation, and probably for a vote to kick him off committees. At the least, I expect Democratic Caucus Chairman Pete Aguilar will take Bowman “to the woodshed” and chew him out.

  35. 35.

    Baud

    @Geminid:

    I’m curious whether the fire alarm in the Capitol looks different than the standard red fire alarm most people envision.  The stories keep describing it as a button, but a normal fire alarm isn’t a button.

    I agree it should be investigated.

  36. 36.

    sab

    Supposedly we are the bestest country and leader of the free world, and this clown car is our legislative body.

    The Founding Fathers were right to make us have a Senate. They knew democratic (sort of)  local government, so they understood stupid disfunction.

  40. 40.

    RevRick

    @Baud: Yes, I think it means that the Democrats abstain, but that will make it clear that McCarthy is a figurehead Speaker who wields the gavel at the sufferance of the Democrats, and that he will have to lead with their votes.
    The GOP will constantly be fractured, while the Democrats present a united front. Which means that policywise the GOP will get nothing out of being nominally in charge.
    I don’t think the Democrats will support a motion to vacate, because who knows how long it would take to choose a replacement, and the 45 day clock is ticking. I think the fantasy that the Democrats could persuade a “moderate “ Republican to take McCarthy’s place is just that— a fantasy. It would guarantee that Republican would get primaried, at the very least. Fascists have a low tolerance for heresy, and it’s clear that a not-inconsiderable number of GOP lawmakers are worried about an American version of The Night of the Long Knives.

  41. 41.

    OzarkHillbilly

    @Baud: ​ A monument to all the sperm sacrificed to the gods of masturbation would no doubt be as big as the planet Uranus.

  42. 42.

    Geminid

    @Baud: Someone posted pictures showing pictures atrributed to the Capitol. They showed a common type of fire alarm, with the customary distinctive red paint.

  44. 44.

    Scout211

    PSA:  The nationwide emergency alert test is coming this Wednesday to everyone’s phones.  Link

    Get ready to not freak out. On Wednesday, October 4 at 2:20 p.m. ET, every TV, radio and cellphone in the United States should blare out the distinctive, jarring electronic warning tone of an emergency alert.

    It’s a test – only a test.

    Officially, the trial is called the Nationwide Emergency Alert Test. You know it’s a test and not an actual emergency because it’s accompanied by an explanation of the test.

    No, it’s not a national conspiracy to infect people with nanoparticles.
    . . .
    The WEA will be directed to all cell phones, while the EAS will notify all radio and television broadcasters, cable systems, satellite radio and television providers and wireline video providers.

    The message will be heard and seen pretty much everywhere. It’s being conducted with the participation of radio and television broadcasters, cable systems, satellite radio companies and cell phones networks.

  45. 45.

    Baud

    @Geminid:

    If those pictures are accurate, then it’s very weird.  Anyway, there will be an investigation, and let the chips fall where they may.

  47. 47.

    RSA

    At the risk of making a political statement, I liked the GOP better when they were against murderous Russian dictators.

    I was looking up the origin of the phrase “fold like a cheap suit” and was directed to examples on Free Republic about Russia’s actions in 2008: “[Obama] will fold up like a cheap suit. Good bye Poland, Ukraine, Baltic States…” It’s as though conservatives have no memory, or even self-awareness.

  49. 49.

    Chief Oshkosh

    Shame on Lee Cowan and everyone at CBS Sunday Morning. They are saying that McCarthy saved the day and that Democrats are trying to cast blame.

    Jane Paulie, you and Lee know better, you fucking corporate suck-ups.

    Shame on you.

  54. 54.

    Scout211

    The judicial review of all the restrictive and horrendous abortion laws is so slow and so frustrating, but the these laws continue to be ruled against and blocked.  Yesterday, a federal judge in North Carolina blocked two provisions of North Carolina near-total ban on abortions after 12 weeks, ruling in favor of advocacy groups Link

    Small steps, slow progress, but progress is being made.

    In an order issued on Saturday, US District Judge Catherine Eagles halted the enforcement of a provision requiring surgical abortions administered after 12 weeks to exclusively take place in hospitals rather than abortion clinics. She said the plaintiffs showed the state legislature’s “absence of any rational medical basis” for the mandate, which was set to take effect on Sunday.

    “There is credible evidence, including at least one study, that second-trimester surgical abortions in outpatient facilities are safer than hospitals,” Eagles’ order states.

    The judge also blocked a provision that would require doctors to document the location of early pregnancies with ultrasound evidence before prescribing a medication abortion. In the injunction, her order says provision “does not provide a clear standard by which providers can make this determination” and is open to “differing interpretations.” Judge Eagles issued a two-week restraining order on that provision in July to allow for further review.

  55. 55.

    Baud

    @Chief Oshkosh:

    They are saying that McCarthy saved the day and that Democrats are trying to cast blame.

     
    I don’t mind the first part so much, even though it ignores that the day that needed saving was because of McCarthy. But anything that separates McCarthy from the influence of the Freedom Caucus is a good thing.

    The second is a lie.

  56. 56.

    lowtechcyclist

    @Geminid:

    Were he a Republican, many Democrats would be calling for felony charges againt him.

    Are you quoting someone here? Because I hardly think this would be true.

  57. 57.

    Baud

    @Scout211:

    The judge also blocked a provision that would require doctors to document the location of early pregnancies with ultrasound evidence before prescribing a medication abortion

     

    Are they expecting the fetus to be in the lungs?

  62. 62.

    Geminid

    @RevRick: There are Republican Representatives who don’t worry about a primary because they intend to retire. Then there are David Valadeo (CA) and Dan Newhouse (WA). They voted to impeach Trump and advanced from jungle primaries to win reelection. That was a more inflammatory issue than voting for a new Speaker, I think.

    Since only 5 Republican defectors are needed, plus a willing Democratic caucus, I don’t think this scenario is a fantasy, although I would not say it’s a likely one.

    If it comes to pass, I expect the new Speaker would not be a current Republican member but rather a retired one. That’s the scenario Republican Rep. Don Bacon (NE) floated at the beginning of this Congress as a way out of a deadlocked Speaker election (Bacon is one the probable retirees).

    Former Reps. Tom Reed of New York or Charlie Dent of Pennsylvania might be suitable for what I would call a “caretaker” Speakership.

  64. 64.

    lowtechcyclist

    @NotMax: ​

    Except it wasn’t in the Capitol, it was in the Cannon building.

    Also: was it clear that Bowman pulled a wall alarm, or did he go through an ’emergency exit – alarm will sound’ door? IIRC, he said he was trying to get through a door that was usually unlocked.​

  69. 69.

    Scout211

    @SiubhanDuinne: I have to say, your version is a lot more reassuring than the one @NotMax posted in comment #5.

    Ha ha.  I saw the comment at #5, but like many jackals here, I rarely click links that don’t at least give a clear explanation of what I will be seeing at the link.  I had no idea that it was regarding the emergency alert test.

    This is why I try to provide at least a snippet of the story or explanation of what will be shown at the link provided.  But that’s just me.  I don’t click on surprise links.

    But there will be conspiracy stories about this until after it happens on Wednesday, even though the feds have been talking about this for months.  It’s going to be like ”The War of the Worlds” radio broadcast for conspiracy enthusiasts.

  70. 70.

    Matt McIrvin

    @Geminid:

    Bowman says he pulled the fire alarm and explained that he was trying to get past a locked door to cast a vote, He was not trying to delay a vote, Bowman emphasized.

    If HAL had opened the frickin’ pod bay door all of this could have been avoided.

  72. 72.

    lowtechcyclist

    @WaterGirl: ​
     

    Why should Bowman be taken to the woodshed by Dems if he accidentally set off the fire alarm?

    If it was a wall alarm, that would have been hard to set off by accident. And it’s hard to see how it would have helped him get through a locked door. That’s why it doesn’t make sense to me, but if he did pull the wall alarm, he deserves a heavy dose of criticism. You don’t pull the fire alarm handle unless you think there’s a fire.

  73. 73.

    Geminid

     

    @lowtechcyclist:  I’m saying it. Obviously this is speculation because it was not a Republican who pulled the alarm.

    But I would further speculate that if it had been a Republican, there would likely be an entire post on this forum where people would be pelting the perp with figurative spoiled eggs and rotten tomatoes, instead of circling their wagons around Bowman.

  75. 75.

    Baud

    @Geminid:

    Eh, I have no problem being less trustful of Republican motives.

    But the stories that he did it on purpose to stop the vote seem to be exaggerated.

    I say let the House committee do its job.

  77. 77.

    oldgold

    Newsom said he would appoint an African-American to fill the next Senate vacancy.  Why he did so is probably how he ended up married to Kimberly Guilfoyle.  Now he has a problem.  Appointing Barbara Lee would be seen as manifestly unfair.  I read this and had to laugh – only in  the Golden State.

    https://www.rawstory.com/meghan-markle-2665775347/

  78. 78.

    WaterGirl

    @Geminid:

    I don’t get the distinction here between making a mistake and doing something by accident.

    Is spilling your milk a mistake or an accident?  Either way, there’s no intention involved, so why should Pete A. take him to the woodshed?

    The only way that makes sense to me is if you think he’s lying.

  80. 80.

    WaterGirl

    @Scout211:

    like many jackals here, I rarely click links that don’t at least give a clear explanation of what I will be seeing at the link.  I had no idea that it was regarding the emergency alert test.

    Me, too, on both counts.

  81. 81.

    moonbat

    @Geminid: Jesus, they have Putin-loving human traffickers on their side threatening to shut down the entire government out of pique. I’d be overjoyed if the only shenanigans they got up to was mistakenly setting off a fire alarm.

    The representative is an adult. I’m sure he knows he screwed up. Let’s keep things in proportion, why don’t we?

  84. 84.

    Geminid

    @WaterGirl: Bowman himself said he intended to pull that lever. I’m not sure he has admitted this was a mistake, but I also expect him to elaborate on tge comments he made last night.

    This matter will be intensively covered today in all kinds of media, especially because Sunday are usually slow news days. But I think this will prove to be a classic “Tempest in a Teapot.”

  85. 85.

    OzarkHillbilly

    On a scale of one to trump, I would put Senator Menendez’ bribes at a 7 or maybe 8.

    Representative Bowman’s apparent transgression would score a 2 or a 3. We can’t ignore it but expulsion is like a death sentence, for a misdemeanor.

  86. 86.

    lowtechcyclist

    @Geminid: ​
     

    But I would further speculate that if it had been a Republican, there would likely be an entire post on this forum where people would be pelting the perp with figurative spoiled eggs and rotten tomatoes, instead of circling their wagons around Bowman.

    My bad, I guess. I tend to translate “many Democrats” to something a bit more newsworthy due to sheer numbers, or prominence of some of the Democrats, than a few dozen commenters on Balloon Juice. I just didn’t see Dem Congresspersons or party officials calling for felony charges against a Rethug for inappropriately pulling a fire alarm.

    For that matter, I doubt that more than a few people here would call for felony charges, no matter how much criticism was aimed at the offender.

  87. 87.

    WaterGirl

    @schrodingers_cat: Thanks.  Then I’ll go with this is like spilling your milk.  Not intentional so no punishment.

    Are we being led around by the nose again by Republican made-up stories?  Unless it was a Democrat who first said it was on purpose to delay the vote, I just see this as one more disinformation campaign to take the story away from the Republicans in disarray.

  88. 88.

    Geminid

    @moonbat: I said something, someone answered and I answered back. Now you’re telling me to keep things in proportion and I’m telling you to get lost.

  89. 89.

    Edmund dantes

    Also remember the context, McCarthy went from no clean resolution to clean resolution.

    He needs to get from cannon building to house. Comes to a door not normally locked. His brain is preoccupied with thoughts about not being late and how might he vote on a bill that McCarthy just pulled out of nowhere.

    comes to an exit normally open but is locked. And his brain short circuits. I need to get through this door. Does what sign says. And remember Congress people movement around the House and other Capitol buildings often get to ignore signs and things that keep tourists out but not them.

  90. 90.

    NotMax

    @WaterGirl

    For comments without direct quotes I try to give obvious hints as a teaser of what type of content to expect without going into detail that gives away the plot wholesale.

  92. 92.

    satby

    @oldgold:

    1. The Daily Mail is a tabloid in Britain like the National Enquirer is here, and they go to great lengths to gin up outrage at Markle. I bet it’s being considered only in their fever dreams.
  95. 95.

    WaterGirl

    @Brit in Chicago: I suspect that Baud is aware of that.  But if medication abortion is effective for ectopic pregnancies then it seems to me that this is just one more made-up hurdle to women making their own choices.

  96. 96.

    Brit in Chicago

    @WaterGirl: Your spilling your milk is (in usual cases) and accident. Your drinking my milk because it was in a cup similar to the one your milk was in—that’s a mistake, not an accident. (H/t J. L. Austin.)

  97. 97.

    Chief Oshkosh

    @lowtechcyclist:

    If it was a wall alarm, that would have been hard to set off by accident. And it’s hard to see how it would have helped him get through a locked door. That’s why it doesn’t make sense to me, but if he did pull the wall alarm, he deserves a heavy dose of criticism. You don’t pull the fire alarm handle unless you think there’s a fire.

    I don’t know if this has been covered, but it’s a pretty normal thing to pull a fire alarm that’s next to a locked door if you want to get that door to unlock and open. Some facilities that I work in have these set-ups. I agree that in a perfect world, one should only sound a fire alarm if there is a fire. BUT, if you really want to go through a locked door to save your country…

    I did see that others have commented on the signage at the fire alarm. If that’s accurate, then the building’s owners are flat-out telling you “If you REALLY need to go through this door when it’s shut and locked, push the big red button and wait 30 seconds!”

  99. 99.

    A Man for All Seasonings (formerly Geeno)

    @RSA: When I was young (60’s & 70’s) it was “folded like a pleated skirt”

  101. 101.

    MomSense

    I remember when it was finally confirmed that Russia hacked the RNC and multiple elected republicans and GOP officials. The information was never released.  Makes you wonder what Putin knows about them that causes them to put the US government at risk to help Russia.

  102. 102.

    Eolirin

    @Baud: Forcing the doctors to document that means they can be more effectively prosecuted if it’s not an ectopic pregnancy and they prescribe abortion meds.

  103. 103.

    Jeffro

    @Van Buren:So how would the crazies be acting differently if they weren’t actually doing the bidding of Putin?

    THIS…is exactly the question.

    No matter what, trump and the House GOP always, always, ALWAYS try to do what is best for one Vladimir Putin.

  104. 104.

    Jeffro

    @MomSense: Makes you wonder what Putin knows about them that causes them to put the US government at risk to help Russia.

    At a minimum, he knows which US politicians have been receiving laundered Russian campaign contributions, and for how long.

    I have zero doubt he has blackmail material on dozens of them as well.

  105. 105.

    Baud

    @Eolirin:

    Thanks. The article said early pregnancies and I thought abortion was still legal in NC up to 12 or 15 weeks.  That confused me.

  106. 106.

    Geminid

    With the government funded for 45 days, the big fight will now be over the $6 billion dollar Ukraine aid package. Again, it will be most intense within the Republican House Majority.

    There, Foreign Relations Chairman McCaul will lead the pro-Ukraine side, and it looks like Gaetz and Greene will lead the isolationist (and effectively pro-Russian) side. The bulk of the caucus has taken a firm position- on the fence. Now they will have to take a side.

  110. 110.

    Frankensteinbeck

    The MConnell thing sounds more to me like his caucus saying “We’re not going through another F-ing round of this on a Saturday, Mitch.  Just pass what they sent us and we’ll worry about Ukraine later.”  We’ll see.

  111. 111.

    WaterGirl

    @MomSense: I continue to wonder about that, even after all these years.

    By “wonder about” I mean that I wonder about the details they found and are using to keep the Rs betraying their country.

    I do not wonder if the Rs are under the thumb of Putin / Russia.

    I mean, can there by an doubt anymore?

  112. 112.

    Scout211

    @NotMax: For comments without direct quotes I try to give obvious hints as a teaser of what type of content to expect without going into detail that gives away the plot wholesale.

    True. But just know that there are many of us who don’t want to be surprised by a blind link and won’t click over as a general rule.

    ETA:  I didn’t get the “obvious hints” in your comment. But again, that’s just me.  It was probably obvious to others.

  113. 113.

    Frankensteinbeck

    @WaterGirl:

    I mean, can there by an doubt anymore?

    We’ve passed a whole lot of Ukraine aid with bipartisan majorities so far, so clearly Putin holds less than total sway over the Republican Party.  The ‘better Russian than Democrat’ sentiment is longstanding and pervasive in their base, the Butina stuff showed Putin provides Republicans a lot of funding, and the question of Trump’s legitimacy is tied up in Putin support.  Between those three, I’m surprised he doesn’t have more control.

  114. 114.

    Geminid

    @WaterGirl: If he were under Putin’s thumb, McConnell would not have helped ensure that last December’s Omnibus bill included $44 billion for military aid to Ukraine. That was a heavy blow to Russia.

    Now, McConnell is trying to get $6 billion more approved. He seems to have a majority of his caucus on board, and an undetermined number of Republicans in the House are also. So I would say that some Republicans are under Putin’s thumb, and some are not.

  117. 117.

    Frankensteinbeck

    @eclare:

    I’m sure a number are straight up traitors bought by Putin.  They’re corrupt, bribe-taking assholes who look at his kleptocrat bigotocracy and see paradise.  He just doesn’t have monolithic control, merely a lot of influence.

  118. 118.

    MisterDancer

    @satby: @oldgold: Do NOT ever take the Daily Mail seriously when it comes to political matters. They are Fox News-level toxic, and I’m pissed as fuck that Raw Story decided to use that shit not worthy of fish wrap in this way. And in fact, I see that Fox News picked up on it and has a website article on this + Oprah Winfrey (?!?!!?) (no links!)

    Da fuq.

    The Duchess of Sussex has gotten 10 lifetimes’ worth of shit from that “paper” in the last few years. Don’t add to it.

    Also: mainstream reporting here in the US already has pointed out another name; there are more Black Woman politicoes in California than Lee, y’all:

    A potential replacement for Feinstein is California Secretary of State Shirley Weber, a 75-year-old Black woman who was formerly a member of the California State Assembly.

    .

  120. 120.

    Soprano2

    @Geminid: This is true, and that would be stupid. The whole freakout about it is stupid, which I guess matches our politics now. He fucked up trying to get through a door that’s normally open because he was in a hurry to vote, because they only have so much time to vote. That’s it. There was no malicious intent. I think these people calling for prosecution and expulsion over a mistake have no idea how crazy they sound to ordinary people.

  121. 121.

    mrmoshpotato

    So twice in 6 months House hardliners brought the country to the brink with a lot of threats and drama. Then at the last minute they bagged and agreed to get nothing. Same drill. Just folded like a cheap sack. Repeatedly getting owned like this almost violates the 13th amendment.

    “Just folded like a cheap sack.”

    Well, they are all sacks.  Nutsacks!

    Also too, never heard “Just folded like a cheap sack.” before.

  122. 122.

    Geminid

    @MisterDancer: Sounds like Secretary of State Weber would make a good Senator. I guess Governor Newsom might not make the appointment until after Senator Feinstein’s funeral.

  123. 123.

    Craig

    @Geminid: I’m still unclear how a fire alarm in a building that’s across the street and not even on The Capitol grounds is obstructing anything in the House Chamber, or The Capital in general.

  124. 124.

    SixStringFanatic

    So, a DEMOCRATIC Representative is accused of intentionally pulling a fire alarm in order to delay or stop a vote on the latest CR, thereby increasing the chances that the vote would fail and the government actually would shut down?

    This is the stupidest fucking thing I’ve heard since I got up this morning.

    Why the fuck are you all giving this any oxygen at all?  Slow news day for the Juicers, too?

  126. 126.

    Geminid

    @Soprano2: As far as I am concerned, this incident is a tempest in a teapot. If Republicans try to punish Bowman, I expect the Democratic Caucus will stand behind their colleague.

  129. 129.

    Jackie

    @oldgold: I can’t take that seriously – can you imagine the added security required if Meghan Markle even agreed?

    And, Oprah??? Is she even living in CA? 🙄

  130. 130.

    Juju

    @Eolirin: the way an ectopic pregnancy is diagnosed is with a scan, transvaginal ultrasound to be specific. That provision of the law is invasive hooey.

  131. 131.

    Geminid

    @Craig: People here often thrash out inconsequential issues, and someone- not me- brought this one up. When I said this matter is a tempest in a teapot, I could have added that this forum is in ways like a teapot, and often is a stormy one.

  132. 132.

    E.

    I walked through a fire door once and set off the alarm. It was OBVIOUSLY a fire door. But the last time I went through it, it had been the normal exit to a JC Penney. I wasn’t paying any attention at all, just on autopilot and busy with my thoughts. There was a great big handle, and a closed door, so I pushed the handle. It was so stupid and embarrassing!

  133. 133.

    Jim, Foolish Literalist

    @oldgold:

    Newsom said he would appoint an African-American to fill the next Senate vacancy.  Why he did so is probably how he ended up married to Kimberly Guilfoyle.

    What?

    Now he has a problem.  Appointing Barbara Lee would be seen as manifestly unfair.

    Yes, because she’s the only Black woman in all of California politics.

    My fantasy is that Maxine Waters chooses this path to retirement. I’m guessing that would finish off McConnell and maybe Lindsey Graham

  134. 134.

    Shana

    I’ve read through a lot but not all the comments and no one has addressed Josh Marshall’s tweet about the 13th Amendment. I looked it up and it deals with slavery and doesn’t make any sense to me. Anyone care to weigh in on which amendment he meant?

  136. 136.

    Craig

    @Geminid: Sure. I mean, what if he was taking a dump in the office building toilet cause he’d had a dodgey burrito the night before, wanted some privacy, and then he just couldn’t get of the pot right away-it happens. He lost track of time, and to save himself a little embarrassment he pulled the fire alarm as a distraction. That seems like a bad thing for Democrats.

  137. 137.

    Geminid

    @Jim, Foolish Literalist: It would be great to see Maxine Waters bring her remarkable Aikido skills to the Senate!

    But Rep. Waters may be looking forward to the next Congress, when she will likely chair the Financial Services Committee again. Then she could retire on a high note, in 2026.

  138. 138.

    Baud

    @Craig:

    He lost track of time, and to save himself a little embarrassment he pulled the fire alarm as a distraction.

     
    Are you just making stuff up, or is this based on something?

  142. 142.

    Geminid

    @Craig: It’s only a slightly bad thing for Democrats. I still think someone in Leadership is going to call Bowman in, ask him to explain himself and tell him, don’t do it again! I mentioned Pete Aguilar because he’s Caucus Chair and has a very convincing frown.

  143. 143.

    jonas

    @Jim, Foolish Literalist: Waters has a pretty senior position in the House and is one of the most powerful Democrats in Congress. I don’t think she’d be interested in trading that for a temporary gig as the most junior US Senator. I really wish Newsom had not backed himself into a corner by vowing to only appoint a Black woman, because now no matter who he appoints, it’s going to look like tokenism, and who wants to deal with that? I think at the time, he probably assumed Feinstein was going to resign sooner rather than later and whomever he appointed would be a viable candidate in the election to replace her, but then Lee, Schiff, and Porter all jumped in and things got a lot more complicated.

  144. 144.

    Baud

    @jonas:

    because now no matter who he appoints, it’s going to look like tokenism

     
    I don’t see why. Biden made the same promise when it came to the Supreme Court, and that seems to have worked out.

  145. 145.

    Scout211

    Most of the political reporters here in California think that Shirley Weber is the front-runner as the place-holder for Senator.  She has already served as an appointed place-holder (for the current office she holds) so they speculate that he would be comfortable appointing her again. As a California Democrat, I would be pleased if she is appointed.

    But I have no preference one way or the other for this appointment and will be fine with the governor’s choice.  It’s a place holder position after all, and he has a very competent group of advisers.

    Looking at this from within California, this is really not as complicated and dramatic as the national news wants it to be.  But whatever.

  146. 146.

    Frankensteinbeck

    @jonas:

    now no matter who he appoints, it’s going to look like tokenism

    To Republicans every minority appointment is tokenism, because they can’t imagine a minority deserving anything.

    To Democrats it’s about damn time.

    To normies… I’m not sure.  It seems to be “Aw, that’s nice, they’re trying.”

    So I’m not too worried about it.  I don’t think saying ahead of time you’re looking for a minority changes anything.

  147. 147.

    Frank Wilhoit

    @RSA: ​
     The most disgusting thing is the people invoking Reagan. Today, Reagan would be all in with Putin, because the church is all in with Putin, and Reagan knew that the church was all he had. (He may not have liked it, but he knew it.)

  148. 148.

    Shalimar

    @lowtechcyclist: iirc, it’s a misdemeanor, not a felony.  And if Bowman wanted to plead for a small fine and short probation, I think it would go a long way towards showing that Democrats take responsibility for their actions and Republicans do not for far worse actions.  He doesn’t have to.  I don’t think he should be charged.  But if he wanted to.

  149. 149.

    Shalimar

    @Geminid: If it’s true that the fire alarm wasn’t even in the same building as the official proceeding, then the obstruction claim by Marjorie Taylor Greene in the beginning was just stupid speculation that ended up being wrong.  There was no felony.

  150. 150.

    Shalimar

    @Frank Wilhoit: I do not think Reagan would have backed a Russian dictator ever under any circumstances given the world he grew up in.  But it is true that he backed a lot of dictatorships in Catholic Latin American countries.  He had no problem with dictators if they were anti-communist.

  151. 151.

    Geminid

    @Shalimar: Yes, there was no felony. I was just talking about claims that might have been made. My first comment recounted Rep. Bowman’s explaination: that he was in a hurry to participate in the proceedings and had no intent to obstruct them.

  153. 153.

    wjca

    @lowtechcyclist: If it was a wall alarm, that would have been hard to set off by accident. And it’s hard to see how it would have helped him get through a locked door.

    Around here, there are doors which open after you push a button on the wall.  They are intended, IIRC, to make access easier for folks in wheelchairs — who would have trouble reaching a handle on the door, or exerting sufficient force on a heavy door.   I haven’t looked at pictures of what the alarm looks like.  But it seems like a possible explanation. .

  156. 156.

    Geminid

    @wjca: We’ll all get a chance to see pictures of that alarm. It will likely end up being the most viewed fire alarm ever.

  157. 157.

    Geminid

    @Geminid: Senator Robert Menendez:

    “When I’m in that situation, I just smack the door with a sack of gold bars. Works like a charm!”

  158. 158.

    Shalimar

    @WaterGirl: As I said, I don’t think he should be charged.  But if he is charged, he has to think about his job and running for re-election, not just like an ordinary citizen who didn’t do anything intentionally wrong.  It is also possible that intent is irrelevant in the misdemeanor he violated. I haven’t read the statute.

    I do not know what the best political course of action is, but there is downside to dragging it out and letting it remain in the news by going to court.

  159. 159.

    ema

    @WaterGirl:

    While you can medically terminate both ectopics and IUPs, and an U/S is often performed, they’re not mandatory. ACOG recommends against mandatory U/Ss:

    ACOG calls for the cease and repeal of legislation that creates barriers to abortion access and interferes with the patient–clinician relationship and the practice of medicine, including, for example:

    • ultrasound requirements
  160. 160.

    opiejeanne

    @prostratedragon: Excellent article, and I think Trump had the significance of stopping at that gun shop explained to him by one of his handlers.

    The speculation about whether Trump could legally purchase a gun has nothing to with not being a resident of SC, but with his legal status and the court’s order that he is explicitly forbidden to buy a gun as a condition of his release while awaiting trial.

  162. 162.

    Bill Arnold

    @RSA:

    It’s as though conservatives have no memory, or even self-awareness.

    That sort of amnesia could be a sign of what Sociologists(anthropologists) have been calling “situational beliefs”.
    This example (claims to be the first; I’m not well-read in the area) is in the context of religion(Christianity), but on reflection it can be cleanly generalized to political cults.
    TOWARDS A SITUATIONAL THEORY OF BELIEF (MARTIN D. STRINGER, 1996, PDF)

    …’situational theory of belief’, i.e. that belief statements are used only in relation to specific situations, as and when they are needed, and are otherwise forgotten or dismissed.

    There is a bullet point summary at the end of the paper. The “The Economy of Logic” section is interesting.

  163. 163.

    Peke Daddy

    @Shana: I think it’s a pun about McCarthy being “owned” by the Democrats in that they made him pass a bill stripped of Republican priorities, because they control his fate as Speaker.

  164. 164.

    RaflW

    Maybe they’ll talk Emmer into being Speaker. He’s a difficult man, and certainly Trumpy, but likely more competent (few can be worse that Quevin). Or maybe they’ll try Gatez, and that’ll be a laugh-disaster of epic proportions.

    But whatever comes, Nancy is right. Let ’em squirm for now. No more help for now, with the CR in place.

  166. 166.

    Villago Delenda Est

    @Shalimar: Well, Putin is not communist any more, he’s just an organized crime boss.  With billions.  So one of Reagan’s people!

  167. 167.

    Geminid

    @RaflW: I think too many Republican Reps hate Matt Gaetz for him to be Speaker.

    They could really be in trouble if they dump McCarthy. The various factions within the caucus could barely agree on him. I guess they might get behind someone like Emmer or Tom Cole  but the uunderlying dysfunction would not be resolved.

  168. 168.

    Shalimar

    @Geminid: Emmer is the one Freedom Caucus nuts have been making noises about being willing to accept.  I think he could probably get 218 votes, but I don’t see any difference between him and McCarthy to make the change anything more than superficial.  The MAGA loons want to burn everything down.  As you strongly imply, they can’t coexist with any other faction.  That remains the problem.

  169. 169.

    Geminid

    @Shalimar: Ukraine funding will be the next stress test for House Republicans. Here, the Presidential race may play a part. The divisions in the House caucus reflect divisions generally in the party at large, and the Ukraine issue is a big one

  170. 170.

    Geminid

    @Geminid: I’d like to see Tom Cole as Speaker because he’s a member of the Chickasaw Nation. I can see him gaveling the House into order and then using some obscure rule to dissolve the USA and return it to its original owners. Interior Secretary Deb Haaland would be the new President.

  172. 172.

    Bobby Thomson

    I usually agree with Pelosi, but historically Republicans have never been published for government shutdowns.  Voters have the memory of a tsetse fly and forget all about in favor of the next shiny trans bathroom by the time elections roll around.

  174. 174.

    JoyceH

    Over on Twitter someone posted a picture of the sign that was on the door, that’s not there during normal working hours when the door is unlocked, so Bowman might never have seen it before. The sign does say to open the door pull the alarm. The sign was obviously written for people who were trying to exit in an emergency, not for people who were working after business hours and just wanted to get out. It looks to me like a honest mistake that is being spun as something else to distract from Republican incompetence and lunacy.

  175. 175.

    karen marie

    What a lost opportunity for Dems on messaging. Simply repeating “MAGA extremists” without any further info is a waste of time and just sounds like name calling.

    “Dems came to the rescue but the House is still on fire, because the best McCarthy could do was kick the can down the road for 45 days.” THAT’S the fucking story they’re failing to tell.

  176. 176.

    wjca

    @Villago Delenda Est: Well, Putin is not communist any more, he’s just an organized crime boss.

    Which is why he and Trump get along so well.  Birds of a feather and all that.

    And Trump acts servile around Putin because he is, by comparison, a penny-ante crime boss.

  177. 177.

    Another Scott

    @karen marie: It’s still early.

    What’s that expression?  “When your enemy is making mistakes, throw him an anvil??”

    ;-)

    Apparently Nancy SMASH said that Democrats shouldn’t be too eager to rescue Qevin when the MAGAts try to throw him out.  She’s probably right – it’s better to play it cool for now and preserve all options.  The GQP, ultimately, needs to fix itself.

    I mentioned before, there was a recent BBC news segment (on Saturday?) talking with former Rep Joe Walsh who said he sees no way for the House to actually pass a FY24 budget, so he expects at least one more 45-day CR after this one.  Nobody knows the future, but lots of unusual things seem to be happening…

    FWIW.

    Cheers,
    Scott.

Comments are closed.