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You are here: Home / Absent Friends / Absent Friends: Rest in Peace, Rosalynn Carter

Absent Friends: Rest in Peace, Rosalynn Carter

by Anne Laurie|  November 27, 20235:49 pm| 85 Comments

This post is in: Absent Friends, Excellent Links

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Hey ?@JasonIsbell? you may not have known it, but you wrote this about my grandparents. Jimmy and Rosalynn. From a small town in Georgia. They were the flagship of the fleet for sure. https://t.co/4VPuG0QqcJ

— Jason Carter (@SenatorCarter) November 22, 2023

Jason we all grieve for your grandmother and your beautiful family. I truly wish there were more Carters in the world. My love to y’all. https://t.co/FOS1ljTlMf

— Jason Isbell (@JasonIsbell) November 22, 2023

The Carter presidency, and its ending, has a particular resonance as one of those historical turning points… where the quiet courage of building a better world was crushed by a revanchist I got mine, Jack! autocracy with a grinning ‘optimistic’ figurehead to assure us that all was for the best (white, particularly white male, people) in this best of all possible worlds. We did not (and I have to include myself — I voted for John Anderson, which cured me of third-party candidates forever) choose wisely, that year.

All the living First Ladies will attend Rosalynn Carter’s memorial service: Jill Biden, Melania Trump, Michelle Obama, Hillary Clinton, and Laura Bush. pic.twitter.com/VB0VCqhwCG

— Mike Sington (@MikeSington) November 27, 2023


Repost, per People Magazine:

… On Monday, Nov. 27, ceremonies will begin with a wreath-laying at Georgia Southwestern State University’s Rosalynn Carter Health and Human Sciences Complex. The former first lady will then be taken to the Jimmy Carter Presidential Library and Museum in Atlanta, where members of the public are invited to pay respects while she lies in repose from 6 to 10 p.m.

On Tuesday, Nov. 28, the Carter motorcade will move to Emory University’s Glenn Memorial Church for a private tribute service, and on Wednesday, Nov. 28, a formal funeral service for family and friends will take place at Maranatha Baptist Church in Plains.

The public is welcomed to line the family’s motorcade route after the funeral service before she is privately interred at the Carter family’s residence, near the home she and President Carter built more than 60 years ago…

 

As Rosalynn Carter’s health steadily faded Saturday night, her husband, Jimmy Carter, sat beside her bed in his wheelchair. The 96-year-old former first lady’s journey from the tiny farming town of Plains, Ga., to the White House ended where it began. https://t.co/TPuxIRcq6S

— The Washington Post (@washingtonpost) November 23, 2023


Gift link, with a trigger warning:

As Rosalynn Carter’s health steadily faded Saturday night, her husband, Jimmy Carter, sat beside her bed in his wheelchair.

At 96, she had an infection that had not improved with antibiotics. The day before, she had entered hospice in her home, and her caregivers shifted from trying to prolong life to making her last days more comfortable.

“My Dad told her he loved her and thanked her for all the wonderful things she had done,” said James E. “Chip” Carter III, who was in his parents’ bedroom with other family members. “Then he asked us to leave so he could be alone with her.”

The 99-year-old former president sat holding the hand of the former first lady, his wife of 77 years, for about half an hour. “I’m sure he was praying,” Chip Carter said.

Then, late Saturday, aides helped Jimmy into his own hospital bed. It had been placed feet-to-feet with his wife’s hospital bed, so the Carters could be propped up and face each other and talk.

But when the sun rose, Rosalynn was no longer able to speak. At 2:10 p.m. Sunday, with Jimmy looking at her from his bed, Rosalynn’s journey from the tiny farming town of Plains, Ga., to the White House and national fame ended where it began…

Jimmy Carter was never one to sugarcoat difficulties. His unvarnished talk as president about the challenges the United States faced was often cited as a reason he lost his bid for a second term to Republican nominee Ronald Reagan in 1980. When it came to mental health issues, Rosalynn was an early advocate for more frank public discussion.

It was no different with aging; family members said the Carters also felt no need to hide the effects of growing old. Earlier this year, Jimmy Carter decided to publicly disclose his wife’s dementia diagnosis.

While many famous people guard their image and hide frailty, the Carters did not. Two months ago, they rode through crowds gathered at Plains’ biggest festival, making no effort to hide their declining health. It was a urinary tract infection, a health problem that is particularly common among older women, which her body ultimately could not fight off…

Former President Jimmy Carter, who has been in hospice care since February, is expected to attend his wife Rosalynn Carter’s memorial service in Atlanta on Tuesday. pic.twitter.com/DHYAGw3qA2

— The Recount (@therecount) November 27, 2023

Gift article. No paywall.

How Rosalynn Carter broke the mold and made her place in history https://t.co/ATldozE2ef

— Cuppa Joe (@jbattTX) November 21, 2023

From Karen Tumulty at the Washington Post, “How Rosalynn Carter broke the mold and made her place in history”;

Rosalynn Carter began her tenure as the nation’s first lady with a radical act.

Instead of swanning into the 1977 inaugural balls wrapped in a showstopping couture confection, she opted for the dated ice-blue chiffon gown she had worn for her husband’s gubernatorial inauguration six years before, and at least once since then. It was designed by someone no one had ever heard of and bought in a medium-priced store in Americus, Ga.

The media did not treat her selection kindly, and as the New York Times noted: “Mutters were then heard from members of the fashion industry who felt a First Lady could ill afford such a sentimental gesture.”

This was, to be sure, a reflection of Carter’s modesty, frugality and practicality. (She also let it be known that she had brought her sewing machine to the White House.) But how she dressed was also a statement of how little interest she had in serving as a mere ornament to her husband’s presidency…

… Rosalynn Carter arrived at a time when women’s roles were changing at every level of society. And, according to Paul Costello, who was her assistant press secretary, the new first lady took to heart a bit of counsel from her own outspoken predecessor. “Betty Ford gave her wise advice: Do what you want to do because no matter what you do, you will be criticized,” Costello told me.

Still, the first lady was taken aback by the stir she created when, in the second year of the Carter presidency, she began showing up at Cabinet meetings and quietly taking notes…

… Less than a month after the inauguration, she held her first solo news conference to announce the formation of a presidential commission on mental health — an issue that would become her biggest cause.

“The next morning when I picked up the Washington Post to read about it I found not one word about the commission or the press conference,” she recalled. This newspaper instead ran a story about how the Carters had established a policy against serving hard liquor at White House functions.

But the first lady continued to press against the constraints, and in breaking her own path, she would make it easier for those who followed — including Hillary Clinton…

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Reader Interactions

85Comments

  1. 1.

    cain

    November 27, 2023 at 6:04 pm

    The press are really a bunch of fuckers aren’t they?

  2. 2.

    H.E.Wolf

    November 27, 2023 at 6:08 pm

    @cain: ​
     Not all of them, thank god.

    Some good examples in this post; and another here: James Fallows.
    https://fallows.substack.com/p/rosalynn-carter-made-a-difference

  3. 3.

    chrisanthemama

    November 27, 2023 at 6:09 pm

    I’m not proud to say that I believe Melania Trump will defile the proceedings with her presence.  But, her superficiality will be on full display in comparison to the current First Lady and other former First Ladies.

  4. 4.

    gene108

    November 27, 2023 at 6:14 pm

    @chrisanthemama:

    I think Mel is doing this to irritate Donnie.

    Theres no way Don wants to show sympathy of any kind to the Carters, and have to be in the same place as Michelle Obama or Hillary Clinton.

  5. 5.

    Anne Laurie

    November 27, 2023 at 6:19 pm

    @gene108: Doubt it’s even that complicated.

    All the classy people will be there, and Melania only married TFG in the first place so she could hang with the classy people.

    Heck, TFG himself would be there, except his Secret Service agents told him they’re not gonna get into a gun battle with the various First Ladies’ Secret Service protection… and that’s what it would take for him to get through the cordon.

  6. 6.

    sab

    November 27, 2023 at 6:20 pm

    I know that all marriages end in either death or divorce, and that we all die. Those two had a very long happy marriage.

    But as a happily married person, I cannot imagine Jimmy Carter’s grief at this loss. I have been married for a fraction as long as they were. But I do send my condolenses,  and fear sharing a fraction of his pain someday.

  7. 7.

    Phylllis

    November 27, 2023 at 6:32 pm

    I remember the press clutching their pearls at the time regarding her gown and thought it was all nonsense. The Smithsonian had the inaugural gowns on display a few years ago, and her dress was lovely and elegant. Another example of the DC ‘they’re not from here’ snobbery.

  8. 8.

    Larch

    November 27, 2023 at 6:34 pm

    I voted for John Anderson, too. Like you, I learned my lesson regarding third-party candidates. Frustrating that so many refuse to learn from our mistakes.

  9. 9.

    zhena gogolia

    November 27, 2023 at 6:39 pm

    @chrisanthemama: She’ll behave herself.

  10. 10.

    Ohio Mom

    November 27, 2023 at 6:47 pm

    @Larch: Ohio Dad and his parents were also John Anderson voters (this was long before I met Ohio Dad). As they remember it, they were mad at Carter for something to do with Israel. Maybe they thought the peace deal with Egypt was too generous to Egypt?

    Never having been particularly enamored of Israel, and a congenital Democrat, I was happy to cast my first ever vote for Carter.

  11. 11.

    Marcopolo

    November 27, 2023 at 6:49 pm

    Hah, I worked (volunteered) in an Anderson campaign office for a couple weeks!  Dunno if I would have actually voted for him.  First off, that two weeks opened my eyes a bit; second, I was two weeks shy of being able to vote that November.  Since then I’ve voted in every Prez election (and pretty much every election period) and always for the D prez nominee.  Do have family members who voted for Nader though, justifying it based on living in MA & Gore wouldn’t miss their vote.

  12. 12.

    Citizen Alan

    November 27, 2023 at 6:50 pm

    @Larch: I campaigned for John Anderson … in my Fifth Grade class.

  13. 13.

    Ohio Mom

    November 27, 2023 at 6:51 pm

    @zhena gogolia: The other former First Ladies will behave themselves too, because that’s what they do. But I bet inside they will be seething that their lovely little reunion has been crashed by Melania.

  14. 14.

    eclare

    November 27, 2023 at 6:54 pm

    AL, thank you for the tweets.  What a gorgeous song, and it absolutely describes the Carters.

  15. 15.

    Almost Retired

    November 27, 2023 at 6:56 pm

    I find it kind of touching that Melania will be there, as much as I loathe her.  That’s what Rosalyn would have wanted, regardless of Melania’s motive for attendance.   If I end up burning in hell it will be because my 18 year old self voted for Anderson.  Although to be fair, it was instead of Reagan.  Which doesn’t make my  18 year old self look any better.

  16. 16.

    eclare

    November 27, 2023 at 6:57 pm

    @Citizen Alan:

    We had to split up into campaigns in my fifth or sixth grade class too!  I can’t remember whose campaign I was on, but I still remember my classmate who took an empty box of All powder detergent and turned it into an “All for Anderson” poster.

  17. 17.

    David 🌈 ☘The Establishment☘🌈 Koch

    November 27, 2023 at 6:57 pm

    I voted for John Anderson

    I voted for Kang and Kodos

  18. 18.

    Ohio Mom

    November 27, 2023 at 6:59 pm

    @Phylllis: All the First Ladies’ gowns on display end up looking dated to contemporary eyes because, well, they are dated. Fashion styles move on.

    If there really was a moment Rosalyn’s gown looked passe, that moment (no pun intended) passed long ago. Her wisdom in wearing an older dress is now obvious.

  19. 19.

    CaseyL

    November 27, 2023 at 7:01 pm

    where the quiet courage of building a better world was crushed by a revanchist I got mine, Jack! autocracy with a grinning ‘optimistic’ figurehead to assure us that all was for the best

    A crack in time, a rift in the universe, sending us down the wrong pantleg.  And those fuckers won again in 1984 and 1988 – 12 solid goddamn years of GOP governance, 12 years cementing their dead-end ideas of economic, energy, and environmental policies.   That’s the framing we can’t seem to escape.

    When I think of where we were, versus where we are….

  20. 20.

    eclare

    November 27, 2023 at 7:02 pm

    For those interested, the service tomorrow is at 1:00 EST.  I assume it will be televised on the cable news channels.

  21. 21.

    Anne Laurie

    November 27, 2023 at 7:03 pm

    (It probably says something about us jackals that so many of us were Anderson voters!

    In my case, it was because my 18-year-old self was furious about Carter’s ‘life isn’t fair’ comment about his anti-abortion compromises.)

  22. 22.

    Almost Retired

    November 27, 2023 at 7:06 pm

    @Anne Laurie:   I think a lot of what it says about us jackals is that we are largely late-boomers/early X-ers.  But I take your point.

  23. 23.

    Jeffro

    November 27, 2023 at 7:09 pm

    This is why, in my advancing middle age, I try not to paint with too broad a brush when talking about the South.  The Carters, and Jason Isbell, and people like them…they’re everywhere, if you look.

  24. 24.

    SpaceUnit

    November 27, 2023 at 7:10 pm

    I always thought it be cool if one day a Democratic president created a new branch of service in which decommissioned naval vessels, aircraft carriers and the like, were refurbished into an emergency response fleet that could respond to disasters such as earthquakes and floods all over the world.  It would also be cool to name that branch of service the Carter Group.

    Anyone got Joe Biden’s phone number?

  25. 25.

    Baud

    November 27, 2023 at 7:11 pm

    @SpaceUnit:

    1-800-Brandon

  26. 26.

    Betty

    November 27, 2023 at 7:13 pm

    Another John Anderson voter here. I did some calling and was a poll watcher. My dad tried to tell me it was stupid because it would only help Reagan. Not the only time I ignored his wise advice to my regret.

  27. 27.

    SiubhanDuinne

    November 27, 2023 at 7:13 pm

    I have no problem at all with Melania’s being there. One of the few moments during her own First Ladyhood when she actually seemed like a normal human being was at one of the Bush funerals (probably GHW’s) when she was seated next to President Obama and he made her laugh. Or smile, anyhow.

  28. 28.

    Baud

    November 27, 2023 at 7:15 pm

    @Larch:

    It’s the inalienable right of every generation of liberals to crush the hopes and dreams of the generation of liberals that came before them.

  29. 29.

    SpaceUnit

    November 27, 2023 at 7:15 pm

    @Baud:

    Dammit, I got put on hold.  Wait time is approximately 120 days.

  30. 30.

    WaterGirl

    November 27, 2023 at 7:18 pm

    @SiubhanDuinne:

    I bet she HATES the other first ladies, though.

    I bet she thinks THEY think they are too good for her.  But really, it’s that SHE KNOWS they are too good for her.

  31. 31.

    SiubhanDuinne

    November 27, 2023 at 7:19 pm

    Rosalynn is lying in repose at The Carter Center right now. It’s currently being show on the Georgia Public Broadcasting web page. Not sure for how much longer, but check it out at gpb.org. It’s very peaceful and beautiful.

  32. 32.

    twbrandt

    November 27, 2023 at 7:20 pm

    I’m embarrassed to admit that I too voted for John Anderson. My reasons (from what I recall 45 years later) was that Carter was too ineffective and Reagan too scary. I never made the mistake of voting for 3rd-party candidate after that.

  33. 33.

    eclare

    November 27, 2023 at 7:21 pm

    @SiubhanDuinne:

    She seems to have a much more relaxed and better time when she is without TIFG.

  34. 34.

    SiubhanDuinne

    November 27, 2023 at 7:28 pm

    @eclare:

    I’ve noticed that too! (I expect she has, as well.)

  35. 35.

    Alison Rose

    November 27, 2023 at 7:30 pm

    @Ohio Mom: I admit, I’m hoping that at the end of the event, the rest of them are all in a group talking and Melania walks up to join them and they tell her “Bye Felicia” and walk away.

    But they are all classier than I am. Which is a low bar.

  36. 36.

    David 🌈 ☘The Establishment☘🌈 Koch

    November 27, 2023 at 7:31 pm

    All the living First Ladies will attend… Third Lady Melania Trump will also be in attendance.

    /fixed

  37. 37.

    sab

    November 27, 2023 at 7:33 pm

    @Baud: Yep. Every generarion has its idiotic naive newbies. Like tiny tadpoles hoping to go out into the world without being eaten by big fish. Or baby frogs hoping not to be eaten by seagulls. Life is tough.

    I eat baby Republicans every chance I get. They taste awful, like bitter wasted tears.

  38. 38.

    jackmac

    November 27, 2023 at 7:38 pm

    I cast my first and only Republican presidential primary vote in 1980 for John B. Anderson (who was also my congressman at the time plus I lived in a Republican county). But my support didn’t go beyond that. In November, my vote was for Carter.

  39. 39.

    Delk

    November 27, 2023 at 7:39 pm

    I voted for Carter. It was my first presidential election and I grew up with old man Daley’s machine. Been a good democrat all my life.

  40. 40.

    zhena gogolia

    November 27, 2023 at 7:40 pm

    @Alison Rose: Didn’t something like that happen to Ivana at some G7 or whatever number meeting? There were some high-powered women talking and she came up, and they looked at her as if she were some dog doo on their heels.

  41. 41.

    zhena gogolia

    November 27, 2023 at 7:41 pm

    @Alison Rose:

    Check this out, it might scratch that itch for you:
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=073hfPueac0

  42. 42.

    raven

    November 27, 2023 at 7:41 pm

    “medium-priced store in Americus, Ga”

     

    Like there is any other kind of store there!!!

  43. 43.

    gwangung

    November 27, 2023 at 7:42 pm

    @eclare: Yeah, I’ve seen that, too.

    Not a great person, but she manages it better than with TFG around (he brings out the worst in anyone around him).

  44. 44.

    Delk

    November 27, 2023 at 7:43 pm

    The other First Ladies should tell her that they thought she would be wearing stripes.

  45. 45.

    Jackie

    November 27, 2023 at 7:45 pm

    @SiubhanDuinne: It was Barbara Bush’s service.

    GHW Bush specifically requested no Trumps at his service.

  46. 46.

    skerry

    November 27, 2023 at 7:46 pm

    I voted for Carter in 1980 in my first presidential election. I was in Indiana at the time so my vote didn’t do much good.

  47. 47.

    Baud

    November 27, 2023 at 7:47 pm

    @Jackie:

    GHW Bush specifically requested no Trumps at his service.

     
    He said it wouldn’t be prudent.

  48. 48.

    swiftfox

    November 27, 2023 at 7:53 pm

    Barry Commoner.

  49. 49.

    Jackie

    November 27, 2023 at 7:53 pm

    @Baud: 😂

  50. 50.

    Alison Rose

    November 27, 2023 at 7:56 pm

    @zhena gogolia: Lord, how awkward for her.

    I love it.

  51. 51.

    lowtechcyclist

    November 27, 2023 at 8:01 pm

    I still don’t get why I should be embarrassed to have voted for Anderson. I was one of many who left the Republican Party with Anderson, but who weren’t ready to move over to the other side. Should we all have stayed Republicans and voted for Reagan? How would that have been preferable?

    The consensus in the years immediately following was that Anderson had taken roughly equal numbers of voters from both sides. but if every last single one of us had voted for Carter, he would still have lost the popular vote by more than 3%, and lost the Electoral College by 311-227.

    No regrets, no apologies.

  52. 52.

    japa21

    November 27, 2023 at 8:18 pm

    @lowtechcyclist: Mrs. Japa and I both voted for Anderson.  Can’t remember the reasons but part of it was that we didn’t see Reagan as that much of a threat (little did we know).  I am not ashamed of the vote but it taught us both a lesson.  We have never, and will never vote for a 3rd party candidate again.

  53. 53.

    Gretchen

    November 27, 2023 at 8:25 pm

    @Anne Laurie: i voted for Anderson that year too, in Illinois, where it may have mattered. I learned my lesson about third parties. I hope younger people don’t have to learn the hard way like we did.

  54. 54.

    zhena gogolia

    November 27, 2023 at 8:30 pm

    I think I toyed with the idea of Anderson, but I’m pretty sure I didn’t do that.

  55. 55.

    Another Scott

    November 27, 2023 at 8:33 pm

    I voted for Anderson, also too. My first presidential vote. I liked his $0.50/gallon gas tax idea (over 5 years?). Gas was too cheap for too long, and we’re still paying the price for it.

    I also was naïve and unwilling to actually make a choice on which party I should align with at the time. I grew out of that. ;-)

    RIP, Rosalynn. Condolences to Jimmy and to all who knew and loved her.

    Cheers,
    Scott.

  56. 56.

    Steeplejack

    November 27, 2023 at 8:41 pm

    @SiubhanDuinne:

    This is an occasion when I can feel (a little) sorry for Melania. She probably knows that nobody wants her to attend, but if she doesn’t it will be portrayed as another classless move by the Trumps.

  57. 57.

    Alison Rose

    November 27, 2023 at 8:44 pm

    I guess I should just be glad that I was only 3.75 months old at the time of the 1980 election. I didn’t vote for any of ’em!

  58. 58.

    Gretchen

    November 27, 2023 at 8:46 pm

    @sab: their son Chip said that Carter told him many times that he thought he would outlive his wife and protect her to the end, and that he went into hospice he was afraid he wouldn’t be able to do that. So I think some of his sorrow may be mixed with relief that he didn’t have to leave her alone.

  59. 59.

    steppy

    November 27, 2023 at 8:48 pm

    I will confess to being an Anderson voter as well. I turned 18 in October 1980 just in time to vote in November. I felt at the time that Carter did a poor job as President, but I could not possibly support Reagan. I had to learn the lesson that third-party candidates are a waste of time.

    Mondale, Dukakis, B. Clinton, B. Clinton, Gore, Kerry, Obama, Obama, H. Clinton, Biden.

  60. 60.

    persistentilluion

    November 27, 2023 at 8:48 pm

    @Delk: Me too.  Us (in my case former) Chicago Dems gotta stick together.  Otherwise, how will we get ward chairmen to instruct the voters?

  61. 61.

    Jay

    November 27, 2023 at 8:49 pm

    It’s different here, we don’t vote for the Prime Minister.

    We vote for our local MP.

    Since Joe Clark, I have always voted ABC.

    Anybody But the Conservative.

    Whom ever has the best chance of defeating the Con, be they Liberal, NDP or Green, get’s my vote.

  62. 62.

    Steeplejack

    November 27, 2023 at 8:53 pm

    @SiubhanDuinne:

    Thanks for that link. I watched for a few minutes and saw a changing of the honor guard. Very solemn and touching.

  63. 63.

    p.a.

    November 27, 2023 at 8:56 pm

    My first Pres vote was for Anderson, but only because RI was safe for Carter.

    I remember in ’75 or ’76 the Allman Bros Band touring, promoting Carter and donating some of the proceeds to Carter’s primary campaign.  Showing my usual political genius, I told a friend that “they’re giving money to some pol who has no chance.”

  64. 64.

    Ella in New Mexico

    November 27, 2023 at 9:03 pm

    In an advanced Political Science class in 1987 called “The Presidency”, we were assigned to pick our most admired modern President and give a presentation on them to the class. Given other’s picked FDR, TR and Eisenhower, I chose Jimmy Carter.

    When my teacher announced my turn to present “Jimmy Carter” several students in class openly laughed, as if I was going to present a parody topic.

    I went on to talk about the complex US, both our economy and our international relations he inherited, the political backstabbing he got from both Reagan and his own D’s in Congress, his success, albeit temporay with middle East peace negotiations and yet his incredible integrity and communitiy service both in and, at that time, out of office. Not just of President Carter but his wife.

    By the end of the presenation, every one in class applauded.

    I hold my position. On both of them.

  65. 65.

    raven

    November 27, 2023 at 9:05 pm

    @Ella in New Mexico: Did you explain that if the idiots in the Pentagon hadn’t insisted on a combined operation to try to rescue the hostages in Iran Carter would have won?

  66. 66.

    Gretchen

    November 27, 2023 at 9:06 pm

    @Anne Laurie: I can’t even remember why I chose Anderson over Carter, to my eternal shame. It is interesting how many Anderson voters are here. I am ashamed to admit that part of it may have been how uncool he was…the sweaters, the praying, the earnestness. As if his earnestness and thoughtfulness and strong desire to do the right thing wasn’t the best thing about him. Just the thought of him putting solar panels on the White House and Reagan gleefully ripping them off make me sick in retrospect.

  67. 67.

    raven

    November 27, 2023 at 9:10 pm

    @raven:

    Retired Chief of Naval Operations Admiral James L. Holloway III led the official investigation in 1980 into the causes of the operation’s failure on behalf of the Joint Chiefs of Staff. The Holloway Report primarily cited deficiencies in mission planning, command and control, and inter-service operability, and provided a catalyst to reorganize the Department of Defense. One mistake in mission planning was the selecting of the RH-53D helicopter over the better suited HH-53 helicopter.[63]

    The various services’ failure to cohesively work together prompted the establishment of a new multi-service organization several years later. The United States Special Operations Command (USSOCOM) became operational on 16 April 1987. Each service now has its own special operations forces under USSOCOM’s overall control.[63][Note 10]

    The lack of well-trained Army helicopter pilots who were capable of the low-level night flying needed for modern special operations missions prompted the creation of the 160th Special Operations Aviation Regiment (SOAR) (Night Stalkers). In addition to the 160th SOAR’s creation, the US Defense Department now trains many military helicopter pilots in low-level penetration, aerial refueling and use of night-vision goggles.

    In addition to the formal report, various reasons for the mission failure have been argued, with most analysts agreeing that an excessively complex plan, poor operational planning, flawed command structure, lack of adequate pilot training and poor weather conditions were all contributing factors and combined to the failure of the operation.

  68. 68.

    raven

    November 27, 2023 at 9:11 pm

    Retired Chief of Naval Operations Admiral James L. Holloway III led the official investigation in 1980 into the causes of the operation’s failure on behalf of the Joint Chiefs of Staff. The Holloway Report primarily cited deficiencies in mission planning, command and control, and inter-service operability, and provided a catalyst to reorganize the Department of Defense. One mistake in mission planning was the selecting of the RH-53D helicopter over the better suited HH-53 helicopter.[63]

    The various services’ failure to cohesively work together prompted the establishment of a new multi-service organization several years later. The United States Special Operations Command (USSOCOM) became operational on 16 April 1987. Each service now has its own special operations forces under USSOCOM’s overall control.[63][Note 10]

    The lack of well-trained Army helicopter pilots who were capable of the low-level night flying needed for modern special operations missions prompted the creation of the 160th Special Operations Aviation Regiment (SOAR) (Night Stalkers). In addition to the 160th SOAR’s creation, the US Defense Department now trains many military helicopter pilots in low-level penetration, aerial refueling and use of night-vision goggles.

    In addition to the formal report, various reasons for the mission failure have been argued, with most analysts agreeing that an excessively complex plan, poor operational planning, flawed command structure, lack of adequate pilot training and poor weather conditions were all contributing factors and combined to the failure of the operation.

  69. 69.

    Gvg

    November 27, 2023 at 9:12 pm

    I wasn’t old enough in that election.

    My third party enlightenment was Perot who always seemed like a kook to me. I was not tempted to vote for him, I think I was already solidly democrat, though for environmental and educational policy reasons then. I had no idea republicans were going to get so barbarically backwards on womens rights. I guess I should have seen it.

    I had not even taken any economics courses yet so i didn’t know how stupidly anti business the pro business party’s policies were, yet. Follow that with Nader who also came across to me as sort of a kook…I wasn’t even thinking of strategy, I just did not like them. I had watched Clinton veto things I desperately wanted him to, and get over ridden when he didn’t have the votes, that is not even all democrats supported keeping Glass Steagall. Party matters, so do individuals elected, but never forget the public matters too and if the public forgets why certain laws got made, they won’t get enforced and then they will get repealed because the ones that resist, don’t get re-elected. We can’t have a democracy if the voters don’t get to say and sometimes that means they are ignorant. It can’t be an excuse to put in a wise tyrant. We have to let ourselves learn by mistakes.

  70. 70.

    Gretchen

    November 27, 2023 at 9:13 pm

    @raven: also that Reagan interfered in the hostage situation and promised that they’d get a better deal if they held off on release until he was in office?

  71. 71.

    Suzanne

    November 27, 2023 at 9:15 pm

    I was, uhhhh, born in 1980. So my first presidential vote was for Gore. So that’s been awesome ever since.

    I’ve voted for president six times. Two of those times, so 33% of those elections, the winner of the popular vote lost the electoral college vote. Not awesome.

  72. 72.

    raven

    November 27, 2023 at 9:16 pm

    @Gretchen: He learned from the best but that had nothing to do with the stupidity of the rescue operation. Who knew a helicopter might suck sand into the engine???

  73. 73.

    Alison Rose

    November 27, 2023 at 9:18 pm

    @Suzanne: Yeah, I was so excited to finally get to vote for president. For that first experience to go the way it did was…not fun. And then I was convinced that with as awful as Bush was, of course Kerry would win. Nope.

  74. 74.

    Gretchen

    November 27, 2023 at 9:22 pm

    @Gretchen: https://newrepublic.com/article/172324/its-settled-reagan-campaign-delayed-release-iranian-hostages: it was later that Connolly and Casey were negotiating with Iranians. Reagan may not have known – he was pretty hands-off – but other people who were around at the time think that his campaign was negotiating to delay the release.

  75. 75.

    SpaceUnit

    November 27, 2023 at 9:26 pm

    @raven:

    I don’t want to go all JFK here, but do you think there were people involved who didn’t want that mission to succeed?

     

    ETA:  I once did a job in collaboration with a crew that included a guy who’d been on that helicopter mission.  I was told that he’d been pretty badly wounded.  I wanted to talk him about it but didn’t.  Sometimes discretion is more important than curiosity.

  76. 76.

    Ella in New Mexico

    November 27, 2023 at 9:29 pm

    @raven: yes, I did. He was fucked.

  77. 77.

    frosty

    November 27, 2023 at 9:34 pm

    Anne Laurie, I was also one of those John Anderson voters. It was a huge mistake and I’ve been a Yellow Dog Democrat ever since.

  78. 78.

    Suzanne

    November 27, 2023 at 9:34 pm

    @Alison Rose: Because I lived in Arizona for five of those six elections, I got used to disappointment.

  79. 79.

    chrisanthemama

    November 27, 2023 at 10:25 pm

    @gene108: If so, Melania’s a master in trolling.

  80. 80.

    chrisanthemama

    November 27, 2023 at 10:26 pm

    @zhena gogolia: Melania doesn’t have to *do* anything tacky.  She’ll just *be* tacky.

  81. 81.

    tybee

    November 27, 2023 at 10:30 pm

    I voted for Jimmy on November 2nd 1976, early that afternoon.

    That evening I had my first date with a woman who became Mrs Tybee in August 1978.

  82. 82.

    Rudi666

    November 28, 2023 at 1:26 am

    Ralph Nader swung the election in 2000.
    From Wiki:
    Nominee George W. Bush Al Gore
    Party Republican Democratic
    Home state Texas Tennessee
    Running mate Dick Cheney Joe Lieberman
    Electoral vote 271 266[b]
    States carried 30 20 + DC
    Popular vote 50,456,002 50,999,897
    Percentage 47.9% 48.4%

    Reagan stomped Carter with T Kennedy’s help. I hated the Kennedy family after his snub of Carter.

  83. 83.

    sab

    November 28, 2023 at 2:14 am

    @Gretchen: Thank you for mentioning that. It does make me feel better.

  84. 84.

    David 🌈 ☘The Establishment☘🌈 Koch

    November 28, 2023 at 6:47 am

    @raven: Yup.  Here’s a segment on how everyone wanting to get in on glory screwed it up (video)

  85. 85.

    David 🌈 ☘The Establishment☘🌈 Koch

    November 28, 2023 at 6:52 am

    @SpaceUnit:  If this is the pilot (link) you’re speaking of, he was badly burned.

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