Come for the politics, stay for the snark.

The Giant Orange Man Baby is having a bad day.

How any woman could possibly vote for this smug smarmy piece of misogynistic crap is beyond understanding.

One of our two political parties is a cult whose leader admires Vladimir Putin.

You know it’s bad when the Project 2025 people have to create training videos on “How To Be Normal”.

Everything is totally normal and fine!!!

Wow, you are pre-disappointed. How surprising.

The revolution will be supervised.

JFC, are there no editors left at that goddamn rag?

Trump makes a mockery of the legal system and cowardly judges just sit back and let him.

This must be what justice looks like, not vengeful, just peaceful exuberance.

“Let’s not pretend [Trump] wants to engage in high-minded discourse.”

Found liable for massive fraud, is required to post a massive bond, gets a break, then files a *fraudulent* bond!

I conferred with the team and they all agree – still not tired of winning!

There is no compromise when it comes to body autonomy. You either have it or you don’t.

Glad to see john eastman going through some things.

Why is it so hard for them to condemn hate?

I might just take the rest of the day off and do even more nothing than usual.

He seems like a smart guy, but JFC, what a dick!

Accused of treason; bitches about the ratings. I am in awe.

fuckem (in honor of the late great efgoldman)

Red lights blinking on democracy’s dashboard

These days, even the boring Republicans are nuts.

Dear media: perhaps we ought to let Donald Trump speak for himself!

Yeah, with this crowd one never knows.

You are here: Home / Elections 2024 / 2024 Primaries / Cold Grey Pre-Dawn Open Thread: The Not-Trump GOP Campaigns Follow Their Natural Arc

Cold Grey Pre-Dawn Open Thread: The Not-Trump GOP Campaigns Follow Their Natural Arc

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Cold Grey Pre-Dawn Open Thread: The Not-Trump GOP Campaigns Follow Their Natural Arc

(Jack Ohman via GoComics.com)


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“Nikki Haley’s moment of crisis”… “Nikki Haley’s moment of truth”…

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Reader Interactions

98Comments

  1. 1.

    Baud

    That clip of Ron DeSantis with the kid is worth watchin for the lulz.  He’s more awkward than I am.

  3. 3.

    Tony Jay

    IANAL but primary voters in the states should sue the MAGAlite Munchkins describing themselves as potential candidates for the Presidency for false advertising, because… there not, are they?

    Ramasmarmy is just activating the cash-out part of another financial grift, Haley is running solely to be 2028’s anti-Kamala, Christie is like a faded boxer who promised the promoters he had a knock-out in him but instead spends 10 rounds wearily shuffling around the centre of the ring throwing occasional weak jabs, while De Santis, I mean, what can I say about De Santis other than his entire campaign could have been pitched as ‘Meet Dave’ crossed with ‘The Office’ and walked off with at least a Palme d’Or by now.

    Of course, should America’s Squalid Sin get deep-sixed by the Courts or enjoy a well deserved cardiac incident, all of that changes, but not in a good way.

  8. 8.

    lowtechcyclist

    I don’t understand how someone who’s so plainly uncomfortable and weird when he interacts with strangers would ever have decided to go into politics.

    Maybe he thought, “if Richard Nixon could do it, then so can I.”

  12. 12.

    DMcK

    @Tony Jay: ​@Tony Jay: ​@Tony Jay: ​  All true! But to your last point, consider the Sea Monkey Effect (I just made that up right now). The average GOP voter, salivating over the lurid imagery in the ad in the back of the comic book, plunks down their electoral capital on an aquarium dominated by a raging aquatic monster gibbon! Imagine the disappointment (and resulting apathy at the polls) when all they get is this stupid plastic box full of brine shrimp.​
    ETA: TONY JAY! TONY JAY! TONY (etc., dunno why the “at” got repeated thrice…)​

  13. 13.

    Betty Cracker

    The DeSantis glitch reminds me of a Zoom meeting when a screen freezes and someone’s mouth is open and they have a weird expression that makes them look defective. Only it’s real life! I hope the serial humiliations continue until both DeSantii slink back to Florida, where they hide out in their opulent public housing, trade bitter recriminations and chuck the occasional vase at each other.

    @DMcK: The Sea Monkey Effect is brilliant, and I will be stealing that!

  14. 14.

    p.a.

    You’d think just being a human piece of shit who DOESN’T spray on bronzer and do a combover would have been pretty effective in Republican primaries!

    Who knew Big Makeup and Big Hairspray backing tRump would make such a difference.

  15. 15.

    lowtechcyclist

    @Betty Cracker:

    Nah, the vase-throwing would be strictly one-way.  She’s the boss of him, and he doesn’t have the guts to throw anything back at her.

  16. 16.

    Tony Jay

    @DMcK:

    Love it. Yes. They want Storm-King Blubberdonis of the Unstoppable Anger Wave, they’re not going to be at all satisfied with Puddlepoop the Drippy of Spit Shallows. So of course, the unwelcome understudy has to unleash a barrage of overacted narm in a vain attempt to win the MAGAts over, which is where the real election funtimes start.

    Reputationally it wouldn’t be good for the US, but as clickbait theatre, sorry, it would be unmissable.

  17. 17.

    Gvg

    People get more awkward when they are aware they have made mistakes or that they know they are losing and the audience is unfriendly. DeSantis had never been in this position before, of being behind this badly and the press pointing out so many things wrong. His prior campaign that I recall there were some criticisms of his opponent that landed which were minor compared to the things wrong with Trump.

    Really it’s hard to understand why Trump has not imploded and disappeared. Even other Republicans with less serious similar problems have been pushed out recently. Some of them have tried his technique of brazening it out and they have not managed to carry it off as well.

    i don’t know how anyone can handle the relentless attack politics at the very top really. Someone has to, but it’s not necessarily the best way to get the best leaders. It is the way it is, and it’s going to continue to surprise and embarrass other candidates that think they are ready.

    They split personality of Republican voter factions is also a problem. At some point no candidate will be able to keep enough of them to win in the general election.

  18. 18.

    OzarkHillbilly

    @Gvg: Really it’s hard to understand why Trump has not imploded and disappeared.

    Not really. He gives the base permission to hate and he tells them he will destroy all of their enemies.

  19. 19.

    lowtechcyclist

    Josh Barro, above:

    Honestly can’t believe the DNC is trying to kill the New Hampshire primary. This hazing is a treasured part of American democracy, and NH voters have trained for it from birth

    The DNC’s argument that a party as diverse as the Dems are shouldn’t have their nominee determined by a pair of very white states like Iowa and NH (the latter is 93% white) really doesn’t have a good response. It was time to move them back in the pecking order.

    I must admit that I like the idea of an early state that’s small enough for retail campaigning. If I were the god of the DNC, I’d choose Delaware as the, um, first state in the Dem primary calendar. Not only is it small enough for retail campaigning, but it’s ethnically diverse:

    The 2022 American Community Survey estimated the state had a racial and ethnic makeup of 60.6% non-Hispanic whites, 23.6% Black or African American, 0.7% American Indian or Alaska Native, 4.2% Asian, 0.1% Pacific Islander, 2.9% multiracial, and 10.1% Hispanic or Latin American of any race.

    Looks pretty representative of America to me. It’s also the sixth most densely populated state, appropriate for a party with a constituency that’s much more urban than rural. (Unlike South Carolina, I must point out.)

    Given that that’s Biden’s home state, it would have been overkill to have it lead off the 2024 Democratic primary season. But the DNC should really consider moving it to the top of the list for 2028 and beyond.

  24. 24.

    Betty Cracker

    @OzarkHillbilly: That is true, but I think there has to be more to it than that because any number of hateful Repub creeps could (and regularly do) tick those two boxes. Maybe Trump is unique because he has presented for years as a tacky rich showboat and leering womanizer, qualities the cretinous admire. Also — and I think this is crucial — he embodies his cult’s oppositional defiant disorder by arousing great loathing and disgust. We despise him because he’s repulsive on every level, and that compels our political opponents to embrace him.

  27. 27.

    Frankensteinbeck

    @Gvg:

    it’s hard to understand why Trump has not imploded and disappeared.

    Who else are they going to vote for?  They’ve got nobody who looks like a champion of white supremacy since DeSantis showed he’s weak.  Trump is running against a weakling and “Who?”  Of course he’s winning.

  28. 28.

    lowtechcyclist

    @Princess:

    Yeah, Barro strikes me as Yglesias’ lost twin. I’m sure he’s totally serious that New Hampshire should keep its role as screener of Dem Presidential candidates into the indefinite future.

  30. 30.

    What Have The Romans Ever Done for Us?

    When you’re accusing everyone that asks a question you flub the answer to a plant you’re not winning.

    The thing that gets me is the refusal to go after Trump for completely failing to deliver on a single one of the things he said he was going to do. I mean, it would be nice if these dips were willing to stand up for American democracy and the law, but failing that, why is it beyond the pale to point out that he didn’t build the wall or fix the border crisis or deliver on the economy or “strengthen Social Security” or replace Obamacare with something better and cheaper…I could go on but why bother. They don’t really have to wade into whether the election was stolen and adjacent BS to paint him as a complete loser and failure. Also they could point out that his financial empire is a fraudulent sham and he’d be flat broke if he weren’t running for President because the fundraising is the only thing keeping him solvent. IDK if any of that would have made a dent but seems like it would have been worth trying.

  32. 32.

    MomSense

    @DMcK:

    He did. And the drone operator is not human.  The alien life form pilot looked like it was considering whether or not to eat the child. So freaking creepy.

  33. 33.

    Chief Oshkosh

    @lowtechcyclist: I think it’s because “the people” are simply not a consideration for him. Look how he “runs” Florida, and look at his career in the military. He’s a stone-cold sociopath and a petty authoritarian.

  34. 34.

    montanareddog

    @Betty Cracker:

    …he embodies his cult’s oppositional defiant disorder by arousing great loathing and disgust. We despise him because he’s repulsive on every level, and that compels our political opponents to embrace him.

    They missed their chance to nominate Jabba the Hutt and settled for the available second-rate slug.

  36. 36.

    Barry

    @Gvg: Because he is The Cult Leader, no an ordinary politician.

    Also, the ‘liberal’ media likes him, and jumps up and down on the scales to help him.

  37. 37.

    Suzanne

    @Martin:

    Casey DeSantis should have just run herself. She’s clearly the one who wants the job. 

    I don’t get the sense that she wants the job, especially. I get the sense that she wants to be famous.

  39. 39.

    jimmiraybob

    This will probably be useful election year info.

    §2383. Rebellion or insurrection
    “Whoever incites, sets on foot, assists, or engages in any rebellion or insurrection against the authority of the United States or the laws thereof, or gives aid or comfort thereto, shall be fined under this title or imprisoned not more than ten years, or both; and shall be incapable of holding any office under the United States.”

    Incites. Check
    Sets on foot. Check
    Assists. Check
    Gives aid or comfort. Check

  41. 41.

    Ocotillo

    The part of the Desantis video I chuckle at is how the child goes on asking the question, you can see the forced smile ever so slowly begin to droop.

  42. 42.

    Anne Laurie

    @Betty Cracker: That is true, but I think there has to be more to it than that because any number of hateful Repub creeps could (and regularly do) tick those two boxes.

    He’s media-friendly, from his long NYC-adjacent career — even the media ‘pundits’ who claim to hate him were more than happy to keep the spotlight on him, for clicks.

    And he’s deeply compromised by foreign interests; even if you choose not to believe the nastiest Putin stories, it’s obvious his indebtedness to less-than-trustworthy Middle Eastern & Central European autocrats made him a valuable pawn to outsiders looking to compromise American interests.

  43. 43.

    Ksmiami

    @Gvg: my so and I had a realization last night as he mentioned that he finds Haley repulsive af. That the Republican candidates today are all just disgusting people that you wouldn’t even invite to dinner. They are all toxic and just gross so how is it that we are on a knifes edge in terms of having Trump once again?

  44. 44.

    Matt McIrvin

    @Gvg:

    Really it’s hard to understand why Trump has not imploded and disappeared. Even other Republicans with less serious similar problems have been pushed out recently. Some of them have tried his technique of brazening it out and they have not managed to carry it off as well.

    If you truly perceive the evil and cruelty in the hearts of human beings it is not hard to understand at all. Trump’s the guy who is twisted such that he intuitively understands how to appeal to it. It’s harder for me to understand why we ever get a leader who is not a Trump.

    There’s a dark part of me that just wants to give up and join the fun. Start calling for the extermination of our enemies like a screaming Dalek. The newspapers would be so excited! I guess that’s where Stalinist tankies are coming from. But in the end there would be no point to winning; no way for this to lead to a more just social order; the evil would consume us.

  45. 45.

    Kay

    @Ocotillo:

    The whole thing is forced though. The child is better at her role but they’re both playing roles. No child that age says “What should Congress, I mean, the House, do about the border”. I think it’s bizarre parents prep kids like this. What is she learning? How to parrot a line she was fed?

  49. 49.

    satby

    So this is interesting:

    NYT: Col Earl Matthews, the top lawyer for the DC National Guard on J6, has filed a whistleblower complaint, stating he was retaliated against b/c he testified that 2 top generals, Walter Piatt and Charles Flynn (brother of Mike) perjured themselves about the 4 hour delay on J6.

  50. 50.

    Elizabelle

    @satby: Very.

    And agree your “entropy” comment.

    Good morning jackals.  Breakfasting in NYC.  Came up to see some art, including Christmas decorations.  Not over them yet!

  51. 51.

    Ksmiami

    @Kay: but they all are bad and disgusting people in different ways – like as much as I disagree with Mitt Romney, I wouldn’t recoil from him: he’s a type I’m used to: preening business guy, but the others are deranged; mentally and physically disfigured from the hate, or from craven power lust and they reflect their horrible voter base as well.

  54. 54.

    Elizabelle

    @Ksmiami: re being on the “Knife’s edge”:

    it’s our Pravda quality mainstream media, taking up where rightwing propaganda left off.

    All the doomscrolling and repetition of Biden’s “unpopularity.”  Did you know he is old??

    They are deplorable.  Very few credits to the profession of accuracy.

  55. 55.

    Gvg

    @What Have The Romans Ever Done for Us?: they want to rip off the rubes themselves and none of them have any idea of how to accomplish what Trump failed to. Also they may know it would be a problem if they actually did catch the car on some of the problems like repealing Roe is and a lot of those problems are fake right wing media creations like immigration and don’t need solving.

    We should be increasing legal immigration to solve a lot of our real problems for instance.

    They can’t go after him for that without destroying a lot of the whole party apparatus and the rest would turn on anyone who tried.

  58. 58.

    Kay

    @Ksmiami:

    I agree on Romney. I watched the documentary on his campaign – done by a Romney family friend, sort of grossly fawning – but Romney’s watching Florida come in, looking at numbers, and he knows he will lose. The people around him are  fluffing it – “there’s still time” – but he knows and he accepts it immediately.

    But there won’t be any more Romneys. Republicans will attract low quality candidates because that’s what their voters want and reward. It will get worse every cycle unless something intervenes or someone faces it and arrests the decline. I live in a 75% Trump county and it’s happening here. There’s been a decline in quality across the board. One of our common pleas judges is retiring and he will be replaced by this person the county party picked – she is nuts. I’ll be no longer practicing by the time she takes the bench but she is a crazy person – I know her, her grown children, her husband and her father, all nutcases- and should not be a judge. She won’t even have a challenger.

  60. 60.

    Ksmiami

    @Kay: I just don’t think there’s any way we remain a country long term. We have too many people who live in fantasyland choosing destruction.

  62. 62.

    Ken

    @Suzanne: I don’t get the sense that she wants the job, especially. I get the sense that she wants to be famous.

    Good news, then — she’s had well more than the usual fifteen minutes of fame, and can go home with a sense of accomplishment.

  63. 63.

    Trivia Man

    @Martin: Plot twist: ron drips out if sight and the campaign claims he was brutally beaten by gay antifa abortionists. They show him heavily bandaged in a hospital bed.

    Casey takes his place on the trail! She is charming, funny, warm, and rockets the name DeSantis back into contention!

  65. 65.

    Soprano2

    @Ceci n est pas mon nym: “All the things he’s done for us” is do things that make liberals mad and allow them to openly hate people. It’s not actual accomplishments. You notice that they never say anything about the tax cut bill that was passed in 2017. They don’t think of that as something he did for them, they actually don’t care about it that much. They care about their grievances and how TFG expresses them.

  66. 66.

    Trivia Man

    @lowtechcyclist: thats worth pursuing – delaware is also conveniently located so candidates can drip by more frequently.

    Bonus: you can have an event in every county in one afternoon. 3 is less than 99 for sure.

  67. 67.

    Kay

    The NYTimes had SIX reporters covering Claudine Gay. Six.

    Absolute wackos. An obsessive, deranged witchhunt. Honestly their readers are as fucked up as they are- people pay for six NYTimes reporters to cover and amplify a Right wing attack on one individual.

  69. 69.

    Soprano2

    @Kay: I see that happening here too. Our reps are getting more and more MAGA. I didn’t like Billy Long, but at least he started out as a mostly normal Republican. The guy we have now, Eric Burlison, is a libertarian Republican who checks all of the MAGA boxes, including being an election denier. He’s part of the House Freedom Caucus. We’ve never had one that far right before. Mike Moon (R-Batshit Insane) is a state senator in MO now. It used to be that no Republican like him would be able to become a senator, now he got elected pretty easily.  I think that’s one reason we’ve gone from having one state Dem rep in SWMO to having three in six years – the Republicans are getting more extreme so Democrats can actually be competitive at least in Springfield and the metro area.

  70. 70.

    frosty

    @Kay: I live in a 67% Trump county. Our school board just went to the Moms for Liberty (we’re always behind the times). I think the Republicans on the Borough Council are still OK. For now.

  71. 71.

    Kay

    @Ksmiami:

    I wonder how many reporters NYTimes management assigned to the Gorsuch scandal:

    Supreme Court nominee Neil Gorsuch copied the structure and language used by several authors and failed to cite source material in his book and an academic article, according to documents provided to POLITICO.

    I follow news quite closely and I wasn’t even aware of it. Wonder why?

    This consistent difference between how similiar events and people are covered cannot be ignored by rational people. It’s jarring and obvious. It’s funny because it’s the opposite of “special treatment”. The NYTimes – bastion of rigidly conventional upper income people- has a much, much higher standard for women and POC than they do for white men.

  72. 72.

    Elizabelle

    @Kay:   We could add a few more Fs to the Fuck the Fucking NY Times.

    Two, for Fascist Fellating.

    Their newish editor, Joe Kahn, is hot garbage.  Makes one long for Dean Baquet.  And their nepo baby publisher, the leastest Sulzberger, is not up to his job, either.

    Tragic!

  73. 73.

    Soprano2

    @frosty: I’m concerned about our school board. We have another election in April, and a local businessman who has an advertising agency and owns a shit ton of billboards is already advertising for the three book-banning candidates who are running. They were fended off in the last election, I don’t know if we’ll be that lucky this time. I sure do hope so, the future of our schools depend on it. So far we haven’t had the worst of the craziness and book banning here yet.

  74. 74.

    Kay

    @frosty:

    Right? We have a lot of “quality of life” investments for a small town (7000 people, which in Ohio is a “city”). Great park system, tennis courts, two public pools, playgrounds that were upgraded ten years ago to be accessible to disabled kids. None of it would get done now. They have 6 month standoffs on whether to fund EMS. It’s a decline in quality.

  76. 76.

    Kay

    @Elizabelle:

    Their position seems to be that people were promoted strictly on merit in the United States up until about 1993, or roughly the time they all left college. I mean, WTF? Is anyone HOME? In what sense is this true about the United States, that it was a “meritocracy”? It was NEVER fucking true. It was LESS true in 1960 than it is now. Is this my US? The US that had Jim Crow and wouldn’t let women get a mortgage? The US that got rid of affirmative action at colleges just last year with much boasting and chest beating but kept legacy admissions? 

    I knew they would keep legacy admissions, BTW. I knew they would fucking renege on the reciprocal action of legacy admits, because it’s not about “fairness” it’s about maintaining a rigidly conventional view of who should be in power.

  78. 78.

    Geminid

    @lowtechcyclist: That story reminds me of another one: National Security advisor Robert O’Brian was out of town on January 6. My theory is that when O’Brian assessed the prospective threat environment, he saw a very dangerous threat- to his reputation. So O’Brian left his deputy in the hot seat.

  79. 79.

    Matt McIrvin

    @Kay:

    Their position seems to be that people were promoted strictly on merit in the United States up until about 1993, or roughly the time they all left college.

    And guess what! I was in college before that and I remember all the white people grousing about how white people couldn’t get into college any more with all the affirmative action. Usually they’d say it after looking over both shoulders.

  81. 81.

    Kay

    @Matt McIrvin:

    “Standards slipped the day after I received my legacy admit letter”

    It’s so weirdly self centered and narrow. Children believe this. Children believe the world started with them. Normal adults grow out of that belief. They learn something.

  83. 83.

    Mike in NC

    Ronnie D is such a hapless shitbag. His biggest shill is the right-wing dimwit hack Ingrid Jacques, who USA Today saw fit (!) to hire last year.

  86. 86.

    lowtechcyclist

    @Kay:

    The NYTimes had SIX reporters covering Claudine Gay. Six.

    Absolute wackos. An obsessive, deranged witchhunt. Honestly their readers are as fucked up as they are- people pay for six NYTimes reporters to cover and amplify a Right wing attack on one individual.

    One more reason to never ever again subscribe to the FTFNYT.

    [Puts on top of extremely large pile]

  88. 88.

    WaterGirl

    @Baud:  DeSantis trainer to DeSantis (obviously):

    “Tilt your head when someone is talking; that will make it appear that you are listening and are engaged with what they are saying.”

  89. 89.

    moonbat

    Maybe if Nikki added another K to the spelling of her name she could signal that she’s “safe” for all the racists to vote for while keeping her “moderate” Republican label in tact for the media.

  90. 90.

    Paul in KY

    @moonbat: I can damn well guarantee you that when Nikki was on the dating/marriage market, if your last name was ‘Dinklefonger’ or something weird/unusual like that, you need not apply…

  92. 92.

    3Sice

    @Kay:

    They certainly are making a great case for replacement theory.

    I saw a soc-med post that noted that the once mighty NYT and WaPo depend on the same click baity garbage as every other failing newspaper.

  93. 93.

    RevRick

    @OzarkHillbilly: Yes! We focus on the problems of the candidates opposing Trump, when the real problem is the GOP base. All the other campaigns were premised upon Trump’s collapse, and that they could acquire his supporters by playing nice to him. They were afraid to alienate his supporters, so they danced around every issue that might trigger a backlash. Hence Nikki Haley’s slavery gaffe.
    But it all comes back to the GOP base. They love Trump’s bullying. They crave a fascist strongman who will enable them to seize power. They live for their resentments and their fears.
    We need to come to terms with the reality that most of the white people in the United States are seriously fucked up.

  94. 94.

    3Sice

    Ron and Casey will drag this out if only to avoid going back to Tallahassee and dealing with their failed partnership.

  95. 95.

    Matt McIrvin

    @prostratedragon: And then, the second disillusionment: the realization that human bodies aren’t animated by some nonphysical vital force but run on our universe’s tendency to grind toward increasing entropy. There’s no way to be above it all by trying hard enough.

  96. 96.

    Matt McIrvin

    @Betty Cracker: All the other creeps tend to have this sanctimonious quality to them–they think they need that. Trump doesn’t–when he waxes moralistic it’s always obvious right on the surface that it’s an act. He’s winking when he says it. He’s more like the living embodiment of that billboard in Fight Club that says “Did you know? You can just dump your used motor oil in the street!” A walking grant of permission to be as much of a destructive asshole as you want.

  97. 97.

    RaflW

    I feel sorry for Nikki. She likely peaked in 2017. At age 45. I think her decision to work for Trump, even if she thought being at the UN and maybe kinda-sorta independent of his ETTD by dint of physical distance, will be seen as the crucial choice that tanked her career arc.

    Oh, and I am not serious about my pity for her. It’s schadenfreude.

  98. 98.

    RaflW

    @What Have The Romans Ever Done for Us?: “why is it beyond the pale to point out that he didn’t build the wall or fix the border crisis or deliver on the economy or “strengthen Social Security” or replace Obamacare with something better and cheaper…I could go on but why bother”

    It’s because these candidates (and the GOPs now in Congress) have no desire whatsoever to fix any of these things either. If they attack Trump on them, the implication is that if they win they’ll do something.

    Their entire M.O. is to do nothing except cut taxes, borrow money, and intrude on the private lives of women & non cis/het people.

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