I usually accept that. I understand that giving military aid to Israel at a level that is pretty close to aid to the whole rest of the region is something I can’t really stop. Never mind that Israel in my lifetime, and particularly under Likud, has consistently worked at cross purposes to US national security goals and perogatives in the region. That’s a fight I’m never going to win. Hell, I’m not even going to be allowed in the ring for it. There are weapons programs that I think should be cancelled, and I’m not a fan at all of subsidies for ethanol, among various things I would refuse to fund. I understand that I don’t get to pick and choose.
But there are some fights that are worth fighting. When I was in the Army in Europe, the first hour of the Rush Limbaugh show was on Armed Forces Radio for an hour every day. That’s still the case today. Back then, he was a LOT more popular than he is today, and whether I liked it or not, there was something to the point that, due to his popularity stateside, the Armed Forces Radio and TV Service had an obligation to play his show if they were to maintain their standard of popularity without respect to political viewpoint. Particularly after a bunch of whackjob Republicans (there used to be other kinds, I swear) in the House of Representatives made a stink about how our troops were being denied the right to listen to him. Leaving aside the fact that no one I knew except a couple of right-winger Medical Officers were fans, there was a point. Kind of. Just to make sure we’re all clear, very few people I know listened to AF Radio over there at all. Today, with eight channels on Armed Forces TV (there was one when I was in Germany) there’s even less reason to listen to the radio. That’s just the way the world is for everything. I listened to NPR when I was over there, but when I was in Afghanistan the last time, I streamed NPR over the internet when I could do so. To my knowledge, Limbaugh’s TV show was never on Armed Forces Television.
But today, there is no point to maintaining his show on AFRTS. He is nowhere near as popular as he used to be. His market penetration is but a fraction of its former level. His show has always been a showcase of racism, bigotry, and misogyny. Additionally, it’s an element of a climate that conservatives, both in and out of the military use to prop up the claim that the military is conservative or has conservative leanings. Now that the last trappings of popularity have fallen away from him, that is the last vestige of reason for his continued presence on AFRTS. It’s past time that we got rid of this hour of denigrating the women and minorities who serve honorably by a man who dodged the draft and is a convicted felon and drug addict. You all need to write and call your Congresspeople and Senators. This is one of those things that we can actually win. We should not be using taxpayer money to support hate speech, and certainly not to the military.
EDIT: H/T to commenters Svensker and JGabriel in thread–HERE is the Whitehouse.gov petition to SECDEF Panetta to remove the Rush Limbaugh show from AFRTS. I’ll note that petitions are great, but you should also call your Congresscritters and it wouldn’t hurt to call the White House comment line at (202) 456-1111 and leave a message.
Svensker
You can definitely call/write your congresscritter. Here’s also too a petition that’s up at Whitehouse.gov that’s all convenient and stuff. :)
Because, yeah, why should we pay to have this crap piped to our men and women in uniform? It’s against my religion fer sher.
ETA: Also, also, too, too, when I signed it a bit ago it had 200 sigs, now it’s over 1400, so let’s rock this sucker.
The Dangerman
Rush has gone and shit the bed twice; first with his comments and then with his apology (that has pleased exactly no one). That fucker has exposed his (massive) soft underbelly; time to gut him.
As for that which is against my Religion/Morals, I’m offended that people that get tax breaks (Churches) feel so welcomed in expressing their political positions. Time to tax them.
c u n d gulag
The military has, in the last 60+ years, increased the scope and responsibility of women in the US Armed Forces.
DADT has been finally been repealed, and gays are accepted.
So, why the f*ck is a misogynistic, homophobic, old limp-dicked, hate-filled geezer, like “The Round Mound of Sound” still given air time to spew his vicious and vile venom, and Conservative propaganda on military radio stations?
And, why should my taxes pay for it?
JoyfulA
And isn’t his popularity, such as it is, like that of Fox, with the age group that is retired military, rather than active duty?
Tonal Crow
Very good point, SG. I’ll call my congresscritters tomorrow!
West of the Cascades
I’m woefully uninformed on this subject, Soonergrunt, so forgive if this is an ignorant question — could President Obama order AF Radio to drop the Limbaugh show? I.e. is it within his power as Commander in Chief? Leaving aside whether it would be a good idea politically either in the short term because of all the butthurt it would cause on the right or as a long term precedent for Presidential micromanagement of what the troops get to listen to?
lamh35
@West of the Cascades: That was gonna be exactly my question
David Koch
Limbaugh is worse than Tokyo Rose.
I’m not joking.
Soonergrunt
@West of the Cascades: I suppose he could, but the political firestorm would almost certainly be very costly.
To be sure, I have seen nothing to indicate that the Commander in Chief couldn’t order AFRTS to cease broadcasting something. I do know that whenever there will be something that could potentially offend the host nation, that AFN TV will pre-empt that show in certain locales.
As far as Presidential ‘micro-management’ of AFN, the AFRTS mission is to disseminate Command Information to military personnel and their families. The TV shows and such (for which AFN does NOT pay, btw) are the proverbial spoonful of sugar to help the medicine of messages about doing your PT, not driving drunk or abusing your kids, not engaging in black market activities, what movies are showing on base and when the base library is open go down.
JGabriel
Soonergrunt:
You may want to add this link up top to:
The White House Petition to remove Limbaugh’s show from Armed Forces Radio.
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BO_Bill
YOU DON’T BRING YOUR MISOGYNY INTO MY THREAD.
salacious crumb
I read an article in FP magazine by Daniel Levy that basically says Israel is the one bluffing when it comes to attacking Iran. Israel knows that Iran most probably wont develop one and is years away from having the capability to do so. All this talk of war is to distract the world from the REAL ISSUE at hand which is the Palestinians and the settlements. Since the talk of Iran has been dominating the media, not a single line has been written on the ramping up of settlement activity and basically land grabbing by the Israelis in West Bank. Netanyahu knows this is the real war that Israelis want to win.
Neil
I could be wrong, but I’m pretty sure ethanol subsidies died this session, so you’re not paying for that anymore.
Amir Khalid
@West of the Cascades:
Even if it were in the President’s power to have Limbaugh removed from Armed Forces Radio, it wouldn’t look good if Obama gave the order. He would be going down many levels in the chain of command, possibly overriding people much closer to the situation; interfering with Limbaugh’s freedom of speech, which could be painted as a partisan act; and for no reason that directly impacts his own job as Commander in Chief. All that would amount to an unforced error.
MikeJ
@West of the Cascades: I think he probably could, if he wanted to make Limbaugh a martyr. Publicly agitating to silence[1] somebody nobody gives a shit about is the easiest way to make him a hero.
[1] Yes, I know he won’t really be “silenced” but that won’t make any difference to NPR when they start comparing Obama to Stalin airbrushing photos.
JGabriel
@BO_Bill:
Yes, Rush provokes thoughts of rage and murder — and that’s in his fans!
Are you saying Rush is ENTITLED to be heard on Armed Forces Radio and TV? Isn’t that kind of hypocritical, given Conservatives usual distaste for entitlements?
I’m thinking women will do just fine without help Rush’s help. But thanks for bringin’ the crazy.
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Ben Franklin
The Devil you know….The vacuum would not exist for long. There is too much audience out there for a practical businessman to ignore. We’re better off
educating ourselves on the Iran war drums and their beaters. For instance, to the last poster’s point, did anyone notice the trope has evolved to Iranian ‘capability’, now?
middlewest
Mobile version buggy today. Maybe this will help.
Soonergrunt
@Amir Khalid: While you are mostly operationally correct, and certainly philosophically correct, I hasten to point out that there is NO freedom of speech on a Military Installation.
There’s a metric fuckton of things one CANNOT say and I never understood why Limbaugh’s show was allowed to continue for years denigrating the Commander in Chief, members of Congress, the service secretaries, and even General Officers, when such activity is a court martial offense for service personnel, and a Disciplinary Action against civilian employees.
Emdee
Soonergrunt, I share senators with you and possibly a congresscritter. Are you of the belief that calling any of those three would accomplish anything other than maybe get me put on a monitoring list?
JGabriel
@Amir Khalid:
Leon Panetta, the Secretary of Defense, could order Limbaugh’s show removed from Armed Forces Radio — either on the basis of its sexist content being in contradiction of the values American soldiers are expected to uphold and conduct themselves by, or , as Soonergrunt suggests up top, because Limbaugh’s decreasing audience means it is no longer commands a large enough audience to warrant its continuation on AFRTS.
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Soonergrunt
@salacious crumb:
@Neil:
The point’s over here, guys.
Schlemizel
cue the “those nasty libs are trying to take poor little Rushies 1st amendment rights away from him” and “Libs can’t stand Rush telling the truth about them” whining in 3 . . . 2 . . . 1 . . .
MikeJ
@JGabriel:
The Leon Panette who serves at the pleasure of the president? Anything he does will be (rightly) viewed as Obama doing it. Which means it will be viewed as a political act.
samara morgan
Bravo sooner.
you and Cole have both graduated from cudlip to sentient being today.
Soonergrunt
@Emdee: Oh, no. Senator Inhofe is corrupt as they come, Congressman Cole is goofy as hell and votes party line. He’s scheduled to be replaced by a push button in John Boehner’s office soon, and Senator Coburn is crazier than a shit-house rat.
BO_Bill
I am not a misogynist. In fact, I have a new girlfriend and am very fond of her.
samara morgan
@Amir Khalid: dude.
i had a clearance where i gave them permission to tap my phones and i was forbidden to criticize a sitting president.
Svensker
@Ben Franklin:
Yup. And since everybody pretty much has “capability” that means bombs away!
Bastids.
Mr Stagger Lee
I resent that my taxes are being used to subsidize the oil industry that continues to make record profits and even finds ways not to pay their taxes. As for Limbaugh, he is way past his shelf date. He won’t be taken off the AFRTS, because the administration is just too cowardly to confront
him just as they kowtowed to Glenn Beck and Andrew Breitbart when he did a hatchet job on ACORN and Shirley Sharrod.
nellcote
Thanks for this post, Soonergrunt. Rush being on AFR has bothered me for years. I’m glad to hear he isn’t universaly beloved by the military. Would it be possible to do a Neilson type survey and drop programs based on their (lack of) listenership numbers?
Villago Delenda Est
@Soonergrunt:
For example, the South Korean government, at least when I was in Korea, objected to MASH, so AFN didn’t broadcast that. They also were upset with the feeds of the news shows from the US that ran footage of the various clashes between students and police in Korea when I was there. These were not shown on Korean TV, but did get shown on AFN, which Koreans in Seoul, at an rate, could pick up, as AFN and South Korean TV were on the same broadcast standard at the time.
Maude
I bet Rush wouldn’t say what he said about Ms. Fluke in person to a woman with a gun. If he did, he wouldn’t need those little blue pills.
Emdee
@Soonergrunt: Well, as it turns out, we don’t share a congresscritter. I’ve got Lucas, but as milquetoast as he seems, he votes party line on everything, and has proof gays are trying to destroy the world since one of them ran against him. TWICE. What more evidence do you need?
West of the Cascades
@Soonergrunt: Thanks, and to the other folks who replied on this. I agree generally that Limbaugh would become a martyr, and there would be a shitstorm if the President/Sec. of Defense ordered AFR to can the Limbaugh program.
It just occurred to me that Limbaugh may be at a tipping point here, with advertisers fleeing him and the right issuing tepid calls for him to make apologetic noises (and then Limbaugh making such noises which were non-apologies). The President started to push him when he called Ms. Fluke last week.
The Adminstration saying “we no longer think it is appropriate that our troops be forced to listen to someone who calls a woman a ‘slut’ for taking the brave step of testifying before Congress and exercising her free speech rights” would pretty much force the Republicans (as they currently seem to react) to line up in a Wall of Outrage behind Limbaugh — painting them farther into their corner of the War on Women.
Or the Republicans kick Limbaugh out the door and look weak doing so. Limbaugh seems worth marginalizing because he does command a lot of attention and has been (in practice) one of the ideological leaders of the current GOP.
But I agree with others that this may not be worth the political firestorm (but it would be a hell of a distraction from Super Tuesday’s GOP primaries in that news cycle, wouldn’t it??).
Martin
Oh noes! Ohio must have run out of black people!
You know the GOP has overreached when their policies affect good, hard working white people and not just the Cadillac queens’ ability to buy t-bones.
Jenn
Honestly, I’m not comfortable with this at all. Let those who want to listen to him, listen. Let’s pick our battles here. I know I would be furious if the president we were talking about was Bush, and the radio host was a liberal. There are a lot of fights we _need_ to have – let’s save our energy and (rhetorical) ammo for those.
General Stuck (Bravo Nope Zero)
We’re evolving, every day, maybe some days not all, and even a minor step back, but the promise of equality under the law, and all the rest of the masterpiece short story the founders gave us, keeps on ticking. In the end, it has won, every single time. When it was time. We fought a bloody civil war, had a crushing depression, and 100 years of Jim Crow in the south, and just ended DADT.
There are many more battles to be fought for the first second third last time before there is final victory. And we, being human beings bedeviled by our ambitions and fears, will likely never have that one last battle. Unless it is to extinguish ourselves from the universe. But if not, we get up and do it again, every day, because that is all there is. The lost, looking for Door Number Three
Smoke em if you got em.
Linda Featheringill
@JGabriel:
Yes, it could be done. But why? What would be the benefit?
Yeah, I know. This is Rush we’re talking about here.
grandpa john
@Martin: yeah ain’t it amazing how all these repubs believe the shit the politicians put out about balancing budgets and cutting taxes and peoples pay, and government services, but somehow they individually won’t be affected by these cuts. red state fantasy land.
Maude
@Linda Featheringill:
And then Noot could keep those women out of the foxholes and stuff.
Mr Stagger Lee
@Martin: Clarmont County Ohio,
west of Cincinnati was just hit hard by the tornado, and the guy they elected to governorship John Kasich thanked them by saying they don’t need no stinkin disaster declaration. Thus no federal aid to clean up the mess and thus no tax exemption for rebuilding. I wish I lived across the river in Kentucky and make that point clear. Laughing at those dumb Buckeyes.
Tonal Crow
@Amir Khalid:
Wait a cotton-picking second. Yeah, Republicans would portray it as “interfering with Limbaugh’s freedom of speech”, but the 1st Amendment does not give anyone the right to a broadcast slot on AFN. Also AFN has editorial discretion, which is itself a 1st Amendment right.
Tonal Crow
Broken blockquote above. I can haz edit button?
Maude
@Mr Stagger Lee:
He’ll back down off that high horse. Disasters have a way of making people desperate and they won’t stand for Mr. Fox TV preventing them from getting help. He is evil.
Soonergrunt
@Tonal Crow: fixed
Skippy-san
@c u n d gulag: That may be-but don’t kid yourself, Rush is VERY popular and there would be a backlash if AFN took him off.
Plus-there will be a counter boycott against both CNN and MSNBC program.
Don’t underestimate the amount of closet Teabag support in the military, and don’t underestimate the amount of continued opposition to the Democratic party too.
I hate just about all AFN programming-which is why I listen to German radio to and from work. Fortunately I speak passable German. It’s a two fold blessing because I don’t get so worked up over politics as I did stateside-and I don’t have to hear about Rush Limbaugh.
Frank
Ooooh do a followup on whether you like the video game they produced as a marketing tool. Your tax dollars remember.
Maybe a post on short term memory loss where you need to be reminded of recruiters on campus who really don’t give a toss whether you like it or not.
Pococurante
Incorrect:
There are plenty of valid reasons to criticise the current Israeli government. This is not one of them.
JGabriel
@Linda Featheringill: I was quoting BOB, from a post that was subsequently over-written by an admonishment from Soonergrunt.
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