Come for the politics, stay for the snark.

In my day, never was longer.

If you’re looking for someone who’s young and athletic, go watch a fucking movie.

Perhaps you mistook them for somebody who gives a damn.

Every one of the “Roberts Six” lied to get on the court.

Since when do we limit our critiques to things we could do better ourselves?

Joe Biden can go out like FDR, not by dying in office, but by crushing the fascists.

Let’s show the world that autocracy can be defeated.

It’s a good piece. click on over. but then come back!!

This has so much WTF written all over it that it is hard to comprehend.

Optimism opens the door to great things.

How any woman could possibly vote for this smug smarmy piece of misogynistic crap is beyond understanding.

“They not like us!” (that’s for sure!)

Shut up, hissy kitty!

Be a traveling stable for those who can’t find room at the inn.

Republicans: “Abortion is murder but you can take a bus to get one.” Easy peasy.

White supremacy is terrorism.

There are consequences to being an arrogant, sullen prick.

Happy indictment week to all who celebrate!

Bogus polls are all they’ve got left. Let’s bury these fuckers at the polls a year from now.

Dead end MAGA boomers crying about Talyor Swift being a Dem is my kind of music. Turn it up.

Dear media: perhaps we ought to let Donald Trump speak for himself!

Fuck that bum, let’s go Joe!

Schmidt just says fuck it, opens a tea shop.

Republicans are the party of chaos and catastrophe.

You are here: Home / Civil Rights / LGBTQ Rights / Gay Rights are Human Rights / Slammer Time

Slammer Time

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The Kentucky clerk who has been in the news for refusing to do her goddamn job issue marriage licenses because she’s convinced equal marriage makes Jeebus frown has been taken into custody for contempt of court. Serial wife and wholly unqualified dispenser of sanctimony on the topic of marriage Kim Davis will have plenty of uninterrupted time to peruse her Bible, so maybe she’ll discover the verses about judging not and rendering unto Caesar, etc. Praise the Lord!

Reader Interactions

247Comments

  4. 4.

    NonyNony

    Unless Kentucky law says that her being in jail means that someone else can sign off on marriage licenses, this changes nothing.

    Judge should have gone with fines instead of jail time – putting her in jail just means that she continues to get paid for not doing her job.

  7. 7.

    Booger

    Bunning use the same rationale our god friend Nico used way back in 1994 in “Employment Division V. Smith”…unfettered exercise of conscience leads to anarchy. Heh. That wacky Nico!

  8. 8.

    SiubhanDuinne

    @NonyNony:

    There is a provision that her deputies can issue licenses, and as I understand it, they have said that they will. (Saw some article a day or two ago that they are all in fear of Davis or they would have defied her already — but don’t know whether that story has much merit.)

  9. 9.

    trollhattan

    Ladies and gentlemen, we have our New Conservative Martyr. Let the demonstrations and fundraising begin!

    When SCOTUS handed down their decision I predicted Fox would fan the continent with reporters, looking for newly oppressed county recorders to champion nightly. If Kim Davis was the best they can do then they’ve either lost their corporate mojo or the whole ghey marriage issue is basically settled, politically.

    She’s as appealing as a dose of clap. I demand she go on a hunger strike.

  11. 11.

    oldster

    You see, I think this is a tactical error.

    The problem is not that this woman is loose on the streets; the problem is that her office is not issuing marriage licenses. Locking her up does not solve the real problem. Instead, the office should be enjoined to issue licenses to anyone entitled to them.

    And of course having her wind up in jail is exactly the kind of martyrdom that her right-wing legal team is trying to secure for her. It’s going to play right into the hands of Fox News.

    Maybe it was not legally possible. But I wish they had just ignored this woman, and found a way to issue the licenses. She is irrelevant, and making her the issue only helps the right-wingers.

  12. 12.

    scav

    @NonyNony: The brilliant strategist went out of her way to signal that fines would be ineffective: she crowd-sourced revenue for that. That was one fine red cape of judge-baiting because no mere judge (or law) is the boss of a Freedom-waving Jebus-enforcer.

  13. 13.

    dedc79

    Next they should hit the dumbasses at that nutty law firm that represented her with sanctions for filing so many frivolous motions and appeals.

  14. 14.

    Duke of Clay

    @SiubhanDuinne: Also, too. Romans 13:1. Let everyone be subject to the governing authorities, for there is no authority except that which God has established. The authorities that exist have been established by God.

  16. 16.

    shell

    Says her lawyers are preparing an emergency appeal. Being the Thursday before Labor Day Weekend and all, good luck with that.

  18. 18.

    FlyingToaster

    @SiubhanDuinne: If it was the article about the DA, and that people had taken leaves of absence rather than work in the building with that woman, I saw it too. And I tend to believe it; it sounds like she’d made the place into a circus.

    The jail time is probably the only way to keep her from intimidating everyone else.

  19. 19.

    MazeDancer

    These Kentucky Political Reporters @BGPolitics have on-the-scene details which they posted on Twitter https://twitter.com/BGPolitics

    Interesting read. Judge is Catholic and said law comes first. He also didn’t levy fines because of outside fund raising. The other clerks can issue licenses and are meeting with lawyers now.

    Davis can get out if she agrees to follow law. So RWNJ got their martyr now.

  22. 22.

    MazeDancer

    Other clerks were ordered to comply or join Davis in jail. They have to face the judge again at 1:45 EDT

  23. 23.

    Robin G.

    I was hoping for fines, but the judge makes a good point. She clearly loved the idea of being a martyr; let’s see how it works out for her in practice.

  24. 24.

    burnspbesq

    @oldster:

    Instead, the office should be enjoined to issue licenses to anyone entitled to them.

    That order was entered some time ago. That’s the order that she has been found in contempt for refusing to obey.

  25. 25.

    Patricia Kayden

    @oldster: Davis was the reason that marriage licenses were not being issued to anyone in Rowan County. She is exactly where she’s supposed to be as people who defy the law deserve to be in jail. I don’t care about her. I care about marriage equality. Her being in jail and out of her position furthers marriage equality.

  27. 27.

    a hip hop artist from Idaho (fka Bella Q)

    I just opened email to see the NYT headline and I now want to gay marry David Bunning.

  28. 28.

    trollhattan

    @MazeDancer:
    When you’ve lost the gargoyle twins, Dick and Liz Cheney, it’s time to STFU and find a new shiny thing.

    Liz and Dick Cheney agreed this week that Rowan County Clerk Kim Davis must begin issuing same-sex marriage licenses because it was the “law of the land.” In an interview with the conservative outlet Newsmax, the former vice president said that he had not studied the details of Davis’ case but it was “clear” to him that she had no choice. “It’s the law of the land and as a general proposition, it seems to me you’ve got to go forward with it,” Dick Cheney argued.

    Newsmax host Steve Malzberg suggested to the Cheneys that forcing Davis to serve LGBT people could be a “step” toward forcing churches and synagogues to perform same-sex weddings.

    But Liz Cheney shot down Malzberg’s logic.

    Newsmax “interviews” people? When did that start?

  29. 29.

    Elizabelle

    Hi ho, hi ho. It’s off to jail she goes….

    Friend put this up on Facebook: Judge, Clerk in Kentucky Marriage Case Dealt with Nepotism Charges

    FRANKFORT, Ky. — Kim Davis and the judge that will decide her fate have at least one thing in common: They both had to deal with questions of nepotism when they got their jobs.

    … Davis’ mother, Jean Bailey, was clerk for 36 years before retiring last year. Davis worked for her mother for 27 years before getting elected to replace her. Once elected, Davis hired her son to work for her.

    Bunning is the son of Jim Bunning, the Hall of Fame pitcher for the Detroit Tigers and Philadelphia Phillies who served two terms as Kentucky’s junior U.S. Senator. Former Republican President George W. Bush nominated David Bunning for a lifetime position as a federal judge in 2001 when he was just 35 years old, halfway through his dad’s first term in the Senate.

    Although one of these individuals is better at their job.

  31. 31.

    Bobby Thomson

    I was a little impatient with Bunning but I have to say, he did precisely the right thing for precisely the right reasons.

    Let them have their “martyr.” Had he failed to act or imposed some chickenshit daily fine that would have been paid under the table, a lot more idiots would have been “inspired” to break the law.

  32. 32.

    beltane

    On top of her bigotry, Kim Davis also sounds like the boss from hell, terrorizing her staff into obeying her own “conscience”.

  34. 34.

    oldster

    If jailing her was necessary for the issuance of the licenses, then I’m all for jailing her.

    I still think it’s a shame that she gets to play martyr, and that this gives her backers exactly what they wanted.

  35. 35.

    gelfling545

    @NonyNony: I read somewhere (TPM? can’t find it just now) that county judge will sign in her absence. After all she must have taken vacations & such in the past so there would be someone to do so when she’s away.

  36. 36.

    Hungry Joe

    I’m guessing it would be wrong to order up a slew of “FREE KIM!” bumper stickers and sell them on the internet.

    On the other hand, as Canada Bill Jones pointed out, “It’s immoral to let a sucker keep his money.”

  38. 38.

    germy shoemangler

    Hilarious twitter:

    sit next to kim davis

    by people who supposedly sit next to her at work

    “She’s not stopping gay marriage. She’s just stopping me from having a quiet fucking lunch.”

    “DID GOD ORDER YOU NOT TO REFILL THE XEROX TRAY, TOO? GODDAMN IT SOME OF US ARE TRYING TO GO HOME TO OUR FIRST HUSBAND”

  41. 41.

    SteveKnNKY

    KY being a Commonwealth has arcane local – county – state government rules & regs. The clerk staff were ordered / given thirty minutes to decide join her for the long holiday weekend or issue licenses. Only one person has to say yes in the office. If all say no, they join her and it falls to the judge executive of the county to issue licenses.
    There are two other county clerks refusing licenses too. They fall under Judge Bunning’s district I believe.

  42. 42.

    Belafon

    @oldster: As the judge said, fining her would do no good because others would just raise the money for her (he has obviously been paying attention to other cases involving gays).

    As for her becoming a martyr: If she decides she can sign the licenses, then she’s no longer a martyr. If she quits her job, she’s no longer a problem for us.

  43. 43.

    lgerard

    @NonyNony:

    How long do you think she will hold out before she resigns

    I give her a week or two, after she realizes she has been abandoned by the clowns who were “advising” her.

    I would love to see the Bar Association weigh in on the propriety of attorneys advising a client to ignore a court order and put herself at risk just so they can advance a personal agenda

  45. 45.

    MazeDancer

    Kim Davis vs Clerks Seeing Judge vs Donald Trump press conference.

    Twitter’s going with Marriage Equality right now. TV and MSM look to be going to offer the Donald his continued free publicity.

  48. 48.

    cmorenc

    Wow – I was not expecting that she’d get jail time the first round before the judge – I was expecting a fine somewhere in the $100 per day range first, and then the judge might give her a week to see if that induced an attitude adjustment. But he figured correctly that her cause supporters would just pay that for her and she’s learn or change absolutely nothing, and he’d only delay the day of reckoning for giving her jail time for contempt.

  49. 49.

    Mike J

    @oldster:

    this gives her backers exactly what they wanted.

    I actually heard people argue that the murderous cops in Baltimore shouldn’t be charged because it’s just giving in to rioters. Your argument seems to be about the same.

  51. 51.

    Laertes

    Where’s the sweet spot on the graph that shows the relationship of “time spent in the cooler” vs “size of her eventual book deal?”

  52. 52.

    germy shoemangler

    I wish they hadn’t ordered her to jail. She already thinks she’s Joan of Arc.

    Just fine her and fire her.

  53. 53.

    RareSanity

    @schrodinger’s cat:

    I am wondering how she got four men to marry her. I don’t see the appeal.

    I’m thinking that these three men weren’t exactly honorable mentions in People Magazine’s 50 most eligible bachelors before they married her…one of them twice!

  54. 54.

    Calouste

    @SteveinSC: I think one of our resident BJ lawyers said 6 months. And it could be extended after 6 months but would require a jury or something else which I can’t remember. Although it must be the something else in this case, as federal courts don’t have juries.

  57. 57.

    NonyNony

    @SteveKnNKY:

    The clerk staff were ordered / given thirty minutes to decide join her for the long holiday weekend or issue licenses. Only one person has to say yes in the office. If all say no, they join her and it falls to the judge executive of the county to issue licenses.

    Ah see, that changes things. If locking her up gets the law followed, then locking her up until she agrees to follow the law is the right thing to do.

    I was worried that locking her up might just mean she’s locked up with no resolution for the parties who need licenses. If this takes care of that then it’s all good. I wonder how long she’ll be willing to sit in jail.

  59. 59.

    Mike J

    @germy shoemangler: They can’t fire her. The lege has to do it. Fining her is pointless since her supporters will pick up the tab.

    With her in jail, marriage licenses will start being issued this afternoon. That’s the only part that really matters.

  60. 60.

    scav

    Seriously, let’s selectively enforce the law based upon the PR status and personal beliefs of the defendent? So long as there’s one good cop following the regulations, the others are irrelevant? et cetera. We sent a few kids to jail for jaywalking, but that kid over there with the hanging assault rap has a good lawyer and parents with connections to the local press: bit of a messy hairball, really irrelevant.

  62. 62.

    Calouste

    @germy shoemangler:

    I wish they hadn’t ordered her to jail. She already thinks she’s Joan of Arc.

    Just fine her and fire her.

    Not the best combination of words ;-)

    On topic: she’s elected, she can’t be fired. Maybe impeached, but the Kentucky legislature is out of session for the next few months.

  64. 64.

    NonyNony

    @lgerard:

    I would love to see the Bar Association weigh in on the propriety of attorneys advising a client to ignore a court order and put herself at risk just so they can advance a personal agenda

    I do wonder about that – is what they’ve been doing grounds for disbarment?

    @germy shoemangler:

    Just fine her and fire her.

    They can’t fire her – it’s an elected position. This is why she still has the job. Hell depending on how screwed up the county is, I suppose she might get re-elected from her jail cell.

  65. 65.

    Elizabelle

    @a hip hop artist from Idaho (fka Bella Q): Bunning seems like a pretty decent soul, despite having been nominated by GWBush and found unqualified by the ABA at the time (they wanted 12 years experience for a federal judgeship; he had ten). From the AP story on nepotism (above):

    Bunning has been anything but a sure thing for conservative causes. In 2007, he was part of a three judge panel on a federal appeals court that overturned Michigan’s ban on partial-birth abortion. The panel ruled the state’s law was too broad and would outlaw other legal forms of abortion.

    In 2003, Bunning ordered the Boyd County School District to allow the student club Gay-Straight Alliance to meet on campus. [That group was] concerned about an “aggressive environment” at the school … according to Sarah Alcorn, [a club founder, high school student, and party to the suit.]

    “From what we understood (Bunning) came from a conservative background,” Alcorn said. “We were really unsure about how he was going to view the case.”

    Alcorn said she was 16 years old when she had to testify in court. She remembers feeling nervous and emotionally exhausted “because there was so much hostility.” But in the courtroom, she said Bunning put her at ease.

    “We had dealt with people whose judgments were based on their own personal feelings,” Alcorn said. [She described Bunning as] an adult who was able to be completely objective.”

    As part of an eventual settlement … School District agreed to hold anti-gay harassment training sessions for school officials and students. The district penalized students with an unexcused absence if they skipped the training. A student and two sets of parents sued the school district, arguing the training violated their right to free speech because it forbade them from telling others that homosexuality was wrong.

    Bunning sided with the school district. His decision was later upheld by a federal appeals court.

  67. 67.

    scav

    @Calouste: Will having spent time in Federal Custody do anything to her basic eligability for office? I’m sure that’s been checked, I’ve bot been following obsessively in detail.

  70. 70.

    Bobby Thomson

    @Calouste: up to six months on the spot if the contempt occurs in the judge’s presence. For a longer sentence, you need a jury trial. Federal courts definitely have juries.

  71. 71.

    Jewish Steel

    @NonyNony:
    @oldster:

    Ever been in jail? I have. It is nothing like the jail in Mayberry. It’s a deeply humiliating process, the whole thing. Shaming. She deserves the personal anguish. It’s a good ruling.

  72. 72.

    Mike J

    @lgerard:

    I would love to see the Bar Association weigh in on the propriety of attorneys advising a client to ignore a court order and put herself at risk just so they can advance a personal agenda

    Without the victim filing a complaint, I can’t see the Bar doing anything.

  74. 74.

    germy shoemangler

    What is Trump announcing at today’s press conference? He will sign the loyalty oath?

    Imagine if the dems were circulating loyalty oaths? They’d be compared to Stalin by the village media

  75. 75.

    OldDave

    @schrodinger’s cat:

    I am wondering how she got four men to marry her.

    Three men. Husband #2 and #4 are one and the same. It gets even weirder when one learns about the father of her children.

  78. 78.

    Peale

    O.K. let’s say that while she is in jail, assistant clerks can issue licenses. It’s taken us about 2 months to get to this point. If the assistant clerks also refuse on religious grounds, would they each have to be tried separately? Would it take another two months to go through the same legal process or do they immediately go before this judge?

  79. 79.

    geg6

    @germy shoemangler:

    Apparently, the only way to remove her involuntarily is by action of the state legislature. Not sure how that would go in Kentucky. Not to mention, how many months might that take? And fining her would not hurt her at all since she’d already been soliciting donations to cover them.

    Jailing her and ordering the clerks to start issuing the licenses is the best option to get it going right now.

  81. 81.

    AnotherBruce

    @germy shoemangler: Over the course of several days, it’s been stated by many commentators that she cannot be fired because she’s an elected official. You might have missed that.

  82. 82.

    NonyNony

    @Jewish Steel:

    Ever been in jail? I have. It is nothing like the jail in Mayberry. It’s a deeply humiliating process, the whole thing. Shaming. She deserves the personal anguish. It’s a good ruling.

    Depending on her personality, this may not lead to the reaction you think. There’s a long unhealthy strand in Christianity of people degrading and debasing themselves in the name of their religion. She might very well think of the whole thing as a glorious exercise in showing everyone that she is so righteous that she can withstand the torments of the “Romans” who have locked her away.

    She might sit there for the whole six months, basking in her own righteousness, and thinking that every humiliating event she encounters is just one more example of how much she’s showing her devotion. One more thing that she can add to the story of how much of a better Christian she is than anyone who hasn’t had to endure all of that.

  84. 84.

    lgerard

    @Mike J:

    Without the victim filing a complaint, I can’t see the Bar doing anything.

    I am sure they won’t actually do anything, but I would love to hear some opinions expressed on the subject

  85. 85.

    trollhattan

    BTW, just how demented is Kentucky that Kim Davis is a “Democrat”? Did they drop the Overton Window down a mineshaft?

  88. 88.

    a hip hop artist from Idaho (fka Bella Q)

    @burnspbesq: I knew that, and it would be horrifying. When I asked a law school classmate when we were getting gay married, he advised that he believes both parties must be certified gay, but perhaps I can write my legislator.

    @Elizabelle: He’s not at all like his father. I had a couple of occasions to deal with him when he was an AUSA, and I was struck by the contrast with the parent. I found him one of the most reasonable federal prosecutors I’ve encountered. I know two others who fit that description.

  91. 91.

    redshirt

    I would LOVE to see a Muslim DMV worker stop issuing licenses to women because it’s against Islam.

    I’m sure Huckabee would defend that guy’s religious liberty to the hilt.

  93. 93.

    Poopyman

    @Laertes: Yeah, I’m thinking her agent (she surely must have one) is gleeful about this turn of events. Moar fodder for the rubes!

  95. 95.

    germy shoemangler

    @NonyNony: She won’t be treated like Kalief Browder, that’s for sure. I’m not saying she’ll have an easy time, but I’m sure Kentucky prison guards will be sympathetic.

  97. 97.

    beltane

    @trollhattan: When you see those polls showing that X% of Democrats believe Obama to be a Muslim, these are the type of Democrats we’re dealing with. They’ve been isolated down in the holler for so long they weren’t told that their type are supposed to be Republicans now.

  101. 101.

    Tracy Ratcliff

    @Peale: The judge called all the clerks in to court with Davis, and after sending her to jail gave them a half an hour to talk to their lawyers before coming back to court to tell the judge whether they’d start issuing licenses. Haven’t seen an update yet.

  103. 103.

    trollhattan

    @germy shoemangler:
    When they film her biopic I can assure the guards will all be giant meanie dykes straight (heh) from central casting. The role of Kim Davis goes to Patricia Heaton.

  104. 104.

    geg6

    @Peale:

    They are appearing in front of the judge, I expect, right about now. They are to issue the licenses or go to jail with her.

  106. 106.

    the Conster

    Did anyone see Lawrence O’Donnell’s interview with the hillbilly son last night? Ho.Lee.Shit. Inbred sphincter spouting contradictory big word salad nonsense and quoting from memory some document – sounded like articles of secession or something posse comitatus sells for $10.00 to rubes as the “real” constimalatution. Her son should be locked up with her, or maybe he’s her brother too. Fucking creepy ass backwoods Deliverance shit going on in that toilet of a town.

  107. 107.

    Gin & Tonic

    It being Thursday, The Economist is published. I love this line from the new issue:

    The remarkable thing is not that Mr Trump is not going to be president, but that such a thing should even need saying.

  108. 108.

    Tracy Ratcliff

    @trollhattan: The last few lingering counties of Dixiecrats, where being in the “Democratic” party lets you in to the good county jobs, like Davis taking over as clerk from her mother then hiring Davis’s son as assistant clerk.

  111. 111.

    Barry

    @Hungry Joe: “I’m guessing it would be wrong to order up a slew of “FREE KIM!” bumper stickers and sell them on the internet.”

    And it would be even more wrong to sell them as specially annointed :)

  114. 114.

    CONGRATULATIONS!

    Did anyone see Lawrence O’Donnell’s interview with the hillbilly son last night?

    @the Conster: No. The family is the Boss Hawg of the county, been running it as their personal fiefdom for the last 50-60 years or so. I’m sure they’re freaking out as their gravy train is about to implode.

  115. 115.

    a hip hop artist from Idaho (fka Bella Q)

    @trollhattan: KY Democrats would (mostly) be Republicans in lots of other places – the ones who actually get elected, that is. Rowan County is rural, and wee, and it was a usual gig for her clan – her election as clerk was the first contested one there in years. Her Republican opponent sounded much better.

  116. 116.

    catclub

    @MazeDancer:

    The other clerks can issue licenses and are meeting with lawyers now.

    I think this was the key point. All the sub-clerks were lined up to have their hearings this afternoon.

    I think they subclerks will issue marriage licenses but get fired whenever she gets out of jail. THEN it will get interesting.

  117. 117.

    Elizabelle

    Just clicked the TV off, cuz Trump was going on and on about how our infrastructure is falling apart.

    And it is the damned Republicans, to whom he just signed a loyalty pledge, who are responsible for that.

    On the bright side, he’s less word-salady than yesterday.

  118. 118.

    germy shoemangler

    Sitnexto Kim Davis ‏@nexttokimdavis 58m58 minutes ago

    COME ON DOWN TO THE ROWAN COUNTY CLERKS OFFICE AND ILL MARRY A FUCKING CHAIR TO A TIGER.

  119. 119.

    kindness

    Maybe after a prolonged jail stay Ms. Davis will find lucky #5. Let us hope it will be her cellmate as the schadenfreude would be too delicious.

  120. 120.

    trollhattan

    @germy shoemangler:
    ‘Yarr, meet my shears, breeder, I call them Martina’s Revenge!”

    Am so working up a treatment. Which lunatic studios should I pitch? Help us Roger Corman, you’re our only hope.

  121. 121.

    KithKanan

    @Bobby Thomson: I’m not totally clear if the six month rule applies in cases like this which are indefinite confinement for civil contempt in an attempt to coerce compliance with a court order — she can get out of jail any time she wants by agreeing to issue licenses. It seems to apply to criminal contempt (a defined jail term handed out by the judge as punishment for disobedience of a past court order) where any term longer than six months requires a trial.

  122. 122.

    Elizabelle

    OK. Turned the TV back on. He’s talking about his hair. He was supposed to be the fair haired one.

    Imagine him, as a presidential candidate. Him! The fair haired one.

  124. 124.

    shell

    @OldDave: But I think it was after all these musical husbands, was when she became ‘saved’. So I guess in her mind , all is forgiven.

  125. 125.

    Barry

    @NonyNony: “She might sit there for the whole six months, basking in her own righteousness, and thinking that every humiliating event she encounters is just one more example of how much she’s showing her devotion. One more thing that she can add to the story of how much of a better Christian she is than anyone who hasn’t had to endure all of that.”

    I’ll bet no. She’s pulling down $80K/year, which makes her one of the highest-paid people in the county.

    Her mother held the job for decades, and she hired her son.

    This is a local petty dictator and grifter, not a humble Christian willing to suffer.

  129. 129.

    catclub

    @germy shoemangler: What can they do if he breaks the pledge? Sue? What consequences
    are in the pledge if he breaks it? Given he has a stable of high priced lawyers, they probably wrote (or re-wrote) the pledge.

  130. 130.

    Mike J

    @Peale:

    If the assistant clerks also refuse on religious grounds, would they each have to be tried separately? Would it take another two months to go through the same legal process or do they immediately go before this judge?

    No trial needed for contempt. The judge is issuing an order to the clerks. They can obey or be in contempt.

    If they wind up in jail for 6 months, there will need to be a jury trial. It usually doesn’t take that long to get people to obey the law.

  132. 132.

    SiubhanDuinne

    @singfoom:

    “They’re taking rights away from Christians,” Danny Kinder, a 73-year-old retiree from Morehead, said of the courts. “They’ve overstepped their bounds.”

    Danny Kinder brings shame upon all us 73-year-old retirees.

  133. 133.

    burnspbesq

    The NYT notifications that hit my iPad just said that the prosecution is going to seek the death penalty for Dylann Roof.

  134. 134.

    rea

    @NonyNony: Yes, indeed, it does–the county executive or judge can sign in her absence (also her deputies are legally empowered to sign). I looked this up yesterday.

  135. 135.

    Elizabelle

    @germy shoemangler: The reporters are dubious. He’s been asked several times if he envisions breaking the oath …

    Back to the incarcerated Miss Davis:

    Do prisoners have to repay the county for the cost of their meals and keep? Doesn’t that happen in many localities? Thought it was part of our glorious prison industrial complex, although she has not specifically hit PRISON yet.

    (Dare we hope that upgrade comes after her trial for firing the subclerks who do issue the Tiger and Chair permits? Or just to loving gay couples?)

  136. 136.

    a hip hop artist from Idaho (fka Bella Q)

    @OldDave: I pieced this together from an NBC story, and added some [mile markers] for easier comprehension(?)/timeline following.

    She was first married in 1984 [1st husband, obviously], when she was 18, and divorced a decade later, court records show.

    Five months after the marriage dissolved, she gave birth to twins by another [3rd husband] man.

    In 1996, she married again, and her new [2nd husband] husband adopted the twins. They divorced in 2006.

    The following year, she married the father of her twins [3rd husband]. That third marriage lasted less than a year.

    In 2009, Davis remarried her second husband, Joe Davis. They remain wed. [4th marriage: to now 4th and previously 2nd husband]

  137. 137.

    Elizabelle

    Ha ha. Trump just namechecked Rand Paul as someone who should get kicked out of the next debate, cuz there are too many in it.

    He’s good with Carly Fiorina, though. She being another business (disaster) tycoon and all. Known quantity.

  139. 139.

    catclub

    Now is a good time to review the whole point of civil disobedience – doing the jail time to demonstrate that the law is unjust.

    It requires some large group outside the jail to be outraged by the jailing. At this point she is doing the time. I am not sure how big that outside group is.

  143. 143.

    cckids

    @Gin & Tonic:

    The remarkable thing is not that Mr Trump is not going to be president, but that such a thing should even need saying

    I saw a interview with Emma Thompson; she was asked about Trump’s candidacy & how Europeans felt about it. She said mainly they are viewing it as “a surreal bad reality show”, because, really, America, TRUMP?? He is so, so disliked in Scotland (where she lives). She said people just cannot believe he’s being taken as a serious candidate.

  146. 146.

    Emma

    @germy shoemangler: You CAN’T fire her. Kentucky Clerks are elected. The only way to deal with this kind of thing would be an impeachment.

    Ooops. Other people have mentioned it. Teach me not to read through the whole thread.

  147. 147.

    Elizabelle

    @burnspbesq: I saw that.

    I don’t agree with the death penalty for Roof. Seems like overreach, the victims and a lot of their families likely would not have sought it, and Roof was very, very young. Life in prison for his natural life would seem to be plenty.

    I hope we see the end of the death penalty in the next few years, although Texas and other Southern states may hold on longer …

    This is a federal prosecution, though, (is it?) so that death penalty might fall. I don’t see Roof or Tsarnaev being executed …

  148. 148.

    Brachiator

    Have any of the Presidentials weighed in on this turn of events?

    They need to get their sound bites in before people start getting the holiday weekend seriously started.

  149. 149.

    CONGRATULATIONS!

    I do wonder about that – is what they’ve been doing grounds for disbarment?

    @NonyNony: Short answer: no. Lawyers work for you. They’re supposed to tell you what can happen if you follow a certain course of action, even if it’s stupid, insane, or just plain illegal. I presume they did. I also presume they documented that quite thoroughly.

    If they didn’t, she can sue them, but still, they ain’t getting disbarred. You’ve got to be one hell of a fuckup/troublemaker, and be one multiple times, to get disbarred.

  150. 150.

    a hip hop artist from Idaho (fka Bella Q)

    @Elizabelle: My guess is that it was the (late) mama of 2 and 4 – who, faithful readers may recall, adopted the children of # 3. It’s why I made the scorecard to send to my pal in Idaho, who was confused.

  152. 152.

    Elizabelle

    @Elizabelle: From NY Times alert: it is state prosecutors.

    State prosecutors have said in court documents that they will seek the death penalty for Dylann S. Roof, who is charged with the racially motivated murders of nine people in a church in Charleston, S.C., The Associated Press reported Thursday.

  153. 153.

    scav

    Longer this goes on, the closer it gets to the election. Might prove rather interrrrresting for the “Tough on Crime!” “Rule of Law!” “Baaaaab Activist Judges!” “Reeeeeeligious Freedom!” crowd to successfully thread the needle and reconcile their various bases. (Witness behavior of Judge [hack, former VP] v. the JebusJuice R opresssed shouters). She will have a political best-by date stamped on her somewhere.

  154. 154.

    Paul in KY

    @Elizabelle: He blew away 7 citizens, for racial malice. Why should he get 3 hots & a cot for rest of his miserable life?

    How can that be a just punishment for what he did?

  156. 156.

    a hip hop artist from Idaho (fka Bella Q)

    @Brachiator: Huckabee and Baby Doc, of course. A small prize if you can guess where they stand.

    In response to Thursday’s decision to hold her in contempt of court, former Arkansas Gov. Mike Huckabee said, “Kim Davis in federal custody removes all doubts about the criminalization of Christianity in this country.”

    Sen. Rand Paul (R-KY) also rushed to Davis’ defense: “I think it’s absurd to put someone in jail for exercising their religious liberties,” he said on CNN.

    So says TPM.

  157. 157.

    Amir Khalid

    @Hungry Joe:
    Neither the Quran nor the Hadith (the collected sayings of the Prophet) actually forbids women from driving cars, or any sort of vehicle (animal-drawn chariots etc.) for that matter. That ban is a Saudi Arabian invention.

  158. 158.

    Elizabelle

    @Paul in KY: It’s not so much about him, as about us.

    Agree that what he did was heinous, and premeditated, and he sat with his victims for some length before shooting.

    Even so, extreme youth and immaturity. I am just tired of the death penalty. He won’t get out.

  159. 159.

    Haydnseek

    @NonyNony: Oh Please…….two days without her RC Cola, Little Debbie, and TV remote and she’ll be a gibbering mass of blubbering bigotflesh. She’ll be better dressed, so there is that.

  162. 162.

    Cervantes

    @Hungry Joe:

    I’m guessing it would be wrong to order up a slew of “FREE KIM!” bumper stickers and sell them on the internet.

    You, sir, have a keen business moral sense.

  163. 163.

    SiubhanDuinne

    @catclub:

    The moment I heard that he had signed the pledge was the moment I became convinced that the pledge is chock full of outs, loopholes, and escape clauses.

  165. 165.

    Elizabelle

    MSNBC and CNN all Trump and his pledge. Good to know there is so little else going on in the world.

    Fox “News” Channel had Gretchen Carlson or some other toxic blonde about to spill on a Hillary employee taking the fifth, again. Good of Fox, with their diversity of news topics.

    ETA: And we have another Trump thread up.

  167. 167.

    Brachiator

    @catclub:

    Now is a good time to review the whole point of civil disobedience – doing the jail time to demonstrate that the law is unjust.

    It requires some large group outside the jail to be outraged by the jailing.

    No it doesn’t. I think this woman is on the wrong side of history and justice, but her act of conscience and act of civil disobedience has been correctly done.

  168. 168.

    Bobby Thomson

    @KithKanan: it’s really designed for the Bobby Seale type of case where the defendant is throwing the f bomb at the judge in open court.

    It probably depends on the order and whether it’s enforcing compliance with the previous order or finding her in contempt for what she said in court today.

  169. 169.

    benw

    @Hungry Joe:

    Please tell me Kim signed the license.

    Kardashian, maybe? But it’s cool, Kanye can be your best man and scream “Kim Davis doesn’t care about gay people!” during the ceremony.

    Kentucky whiskey only. Thank you.

    No, thank you!

  170. 170.

    SteveKnNKY

    @trollhattan: That is another KY quirk. Rowan county is a particularly undeveloped/under-developed part of the state. The largest city is Morehead where Morehead State University resides. Otherwise, roughly 75% of the county is the Daniel Boone National Forest & state park and boarders Cave Run lake – state park. There is very little else.
    As mentioned, this person’s mother held the office for decades before she took over. Most clerks in KY hold the office for decades. Locally loyal voters.
    Voting at the state, county and local level is Democrat party affilation. If you are a Dem, you’re in. Very conservative, anywhere else republicans. Voting at the national office level; representative, senate and president is all republican. This is Hal Rogers – R, Ky-5 district. This district is like the third highest congressional district to receive federal aid, welfare benefits, housing assistance, etc… Hal keeps the dollars rolling in and people return him and rest to national office.

  171. 171.

    CONGRATULATIONS!

    How can that be a just punishment for what he did?

    @Paul in KY: Unless he can bring those folks back to life, I hate to tell you, there is no such thing as a “just punishment”. Just revenge.

    The state should not kill. Period.

  173. 173.

    FlyingToaster

    @trollhattan:

    Future Newsmax headline: Kim Davis’ jaw-dropping romance secrets to ensure you get your man. The last one will shock you.”

    Dude, I’m pretty sure the first one will shock me.

    The last one will likely send me to the ER.

  175. 175.

    Patricia Kayden

    @Elizabelle: I turned off MSNBC because of their Trump fascination. They should be talking about Kim Davis, which is a groundbreaking development.

  176. 176.

    Belafon

    @Amir Khalid: I saw this case earlier:

    A Muslim-American group plans Tuesday to file a discrimination complaint with the Equal Employment Opportunity Commission against ExpressJet Airlines for allegedly failing to accommodate a Metro Detroit-area Muslim flight attendant who objects to serving alcohol based on her religious beliefs.

    http://www.detroitnews.com/story/news/local/wayne-county/2015/08/31/group-expressjet-discriminated-muslim-flight-attendant/71490804/

  177. 177.

    Steve in the ATL

    @lgerard: There’s a big difference between advising a client to violate an order and advising a client of the consequences should she decide to violate an order.

  179. 179.

    burnspbesq

    @Elizabelle:

    trial for firing the subclerks who do issue the Tiger and Chair permits

    That wrongful-termination case, if it happens, would surely settle. The county would be massively stupid to risk an out-of-control jury awarding gazillions of dollars in damages.

  180. 180.

    boatboy_srq

    @NonyNony: Doesn’t Kentucky law provide that the Court can issue documents (including marriage licenses) if the county clerk is unable? IIRC the court declined previously because some prior condition had not been met; methinks this would suffice as a “prior condition” which “prevents or inhibits the county clerk from performing the duties of the office”.

  181. 181.

    KithKanan

    @Bobby Thomson: Pretty sure it’s enforcing compliance since the deputy clerks were then offered the same choice, and the reporting I’ve seen implies she can get out as soon as she agrees to issue the licenses, though relying on the accuracy of media reports is often a losing bet.

  183. 183.

    SteveKnNKY

    @Booger: Yes. She actually does not forego pay simply by being in contempt and jailed. That is my understanding. Pay does not go into escrow or some other deferment. She probably will get a nice cell, etc… Her big problem would be if she is housed in a cell not in that county. Many of the small counties, the jailers only job is shuttling inmates from police holding to a larger county for holding. That may change her mind.
    The KY legislature is quite conservative as I thought Judge Bunning was going to be. Like Scalia conservative. What’s conservative fluctuates with my personal beliefs. Gov. Beshear wanted the Fed court to handle because the process would be impeachment. That has/had a 70/30 shot of failing to impeach her from office. This absolves him and preserves his legacy.
    Northern KY is a different story. Urban/suburban and most Dem’s have switch to solid republican for state/federal voting. I actually read this blog specifically because I’m locked in KY with family all around like John Cole is locked in WV and Zandar is one county over from me based on what I can glean from his posts.

  185. 185.

    Iowa Old Lady

    I love the idea of her in jail until she agrees to follow the law.

    How would her supporters feel about Catholic judge who refused to issue divorces because his church says they’re immoral and he can’t be part of that?

  188. 188.

    MazeDancer

    Five of 6 deputy clerks agreed to issue licenses. Only hold out was Davis’s son. Judge will not hold him in contempt.

    Davis now will come back in court this afternoon to say whether or not she’ll allow clerks to do their jobs.

    Judge Bunning may have licenses issued tomorrow.

  192. 192.

    boatboy_srq

    @trollhattan: @schrodinger’s cat: Indeed. I do love how the same people who complain about Hollywood Elites™ and how much money performers make forget that it takes a lot of dough (or a seriously incompetent agent) to convince someone attractive to play the kinds of stooges Fox and TBN and the rest of the wingnutosphere studios need to make ignorance and insanity attractive.

  194. 194.

    Seanly

    @NonyNony:

    This. I’ve had some creepy things happen to me in my life. Hands down though the creepiest is when I went with my then-girlfriend to some Christian youth group meeting. The topic was something along the lines of suffering. One guy went into a long spiel about how he wasn’t suffering enough and needed to suffer more, blaa blaa blaa. Even at the tender age of 20, I knew that life is nothing but suffering with brief periods of fleeting happiness. And, never, never ask the universe for more suffering because it sure as sh1t can deliver it in spades. And I was already pretty much an atheist so the whole church thing wasn’t my scene. Probably a good thing that my relationship with that woman didn’t last the rest of the school year.

  196. 196.

    J R in WV

    @Calouste:

    You are so wrong about that. My wife got a jury summons for federal court just as she was hospitalized. I had to contact the clerk and send a note from her doctor that she was temporarily disabled (read: in a F’in coma).

    She got another one not too long ago… wasn’t called to serve yet.

    People can choose to have a judge do the work, which saves some cost of empaneling a jury. If you trust a judge more than a jury.

  197. 197.

    les

    @oldster:

    the office should be enjoined to issue licenses to anyone entitled to them.

    She’s in jail for refusing to obey the injunction. You’re a step behind–I get it, I’m old too.

  198. 198.

    Robert Sneddon

    @Omnes Omnibus: A total ban on the death penalty is part of the European Convention on Human Rights which all members of the European Union must adhere to on accession.

    Britain abandoned the death penalty for murder well before we joined the EU but it was still on the books between times for a few special criminal charges like Arson in a Naval Dockyard.

  199. 199.

    Frank

    @BGinCHI: Don’t just limit to KY. AL, MS, AR, LA, and TN outside of the Memphis city limits are all Y’allaban with deep support for Y’all Quida.

  200. 200.

    Sad_Dem

    @trollhattan: I checked out Fox so you don’t have to. Even there the comments are definitely not all in her favor. It’s hard to ignore Romans and the word of Jesus himself on matters such as this, after all. Not to mention that if it were a matter of conscience rather than bigoted petulance, the proper thing to do is resign.

  202. 202.

    sigaba

    @trollhattan:

    Am so working up a treatment. Which lunatic studios should I pitch? Help us Roger Corman, you’re our only hope.

    Fox Faith. Affirm Films (a Sony Pictures Entertainment company) — they released “War Room” last week.

  206. 206.

    Mnemosyne (iPhone)

    @Paul in KY:

    As others have said, killing Roof won’t bring his victims back to life, so one has to think about what “justice” means in a case like this. Speaking for myself, I like the justice of Roof sitting in a prison cell for the next 60 years watching as the world changes around him and the “cause” he thought he represented falls further by the wayside as the years advance.

    If he gets life without parole, Roof will live long enough to find that he’s become irrelevant. That seems like damnation enough for me, or at least as much as one can get in this mortal life.

  207. 207.

    MazeDancer

    Davis did not come back to court. She sent word through her attorney that she’s choosing jail, not going along with clerks issuing licenses.

    Cruz and Huckabee already whirling up the Martyr Merry-go-Round. Let the grifting begin.

  209. 209.

    Elizabelle

    @SteveKnNKY: Welcome! It’s great to see you here, for some on the ground insight.

    BJ can be a lifeline. With pet pics and music links. And its own vocabulary.

  210. 210.

    boatboy_srq

    @MazeDancer:

    she’s choosing jail

    She’s done that from the very outset of this little exercise.

    ETA: Come to think of it, there are few better ways to publicly announce “I want to go to jail” than what she’s done.

  211. 211.

    oldgold

    If a Quaker Sheriff refused to issue gun permIts, these faux conservatives would fully understand the legal principle involved in the instant case.

  213. 213.

    benw

    Hey, is what this lady is going to jail for enough of a crime to make it so that she can’t vote anymore? Probably not, but that would be sweet.

  214. 214.

    Omnes Omnibus

    @benw: No. She is in jail for civil contempt. The purpose of the incarceration is to compel her to obey the court’s order. No criminal charges, no criminal record.

  215. 215.

    gelfling545

    @NonyNony: I expect her lawyer has been weaseling around it saying things like “I can’t possibly advise you to disobey a court order but ….”

  216. 216.

    burnspbesq

    @Watchman:

    Where’s Zandar to tell us how this is all going to the Supreme Court?

    Would be foolish to rule that out. Are you foolish?

  217. 217.

    catclub

    @Omnes Omnibus:

    And I live in a state does not have the death penalty.

    Massachusetts does not either(I am assuming, here), but somehow Dzokar Tchernaev got the federal death penalty.
    I bet if they really wanted to, the feds could barge in on Roof’s case.

  219. 219.

    gelfling545

    @oldster: She was going to play the martyr no matter how this played out unless she got her own way, which clearly could not happen.

  220. 220.

    daverave

    From the NYT:
    “A defiant county clerk rejected a proposal that would have allowed her deputies to grant same-sex marriage licenses, hours after she was sent to jail by a federal judge for disobeying a court order. Through her lawyer, the clerk, Kim Davis of Rowan County, said she would not agree to allow the licenses to be issued under her authority as county clerk. Had she consented, the judge would have considered releasing her from custody.”

    So we’re back at the stalemate and she is, in effect, WINNING, from her jail cell.

  222. 222.

    feebog

    I’ve been in a couple federal prisons, including the Supermax in Florence Colorado. Anyone who thinks it’s “three hots and a cot” is very much mistaken. It is a miserable, horrible way to live out your life.

  223. 223.

    FlyingToaster

    @boatboy_srq:

    Isn’t one of them “prevent him from finding a husband”? Just askin’…

    Is that her Chreeeestian duty?

    I should note that we’ve had gay marriage in MA for 11+ years. No church or member of clergy has been required to marry anyone not conforming to their standards. And the half-dozen JPs who quit* were easily replaced.

    * Having made an oath unto Caesar not to discriminate, they quit, following their own consciences. Kim Davis could learn from them.

  226. 226.

    Robert Sneddon

    @Omnes Omnibus: The Federal government can still put people to death if convicted of a capital crime in a Federal court regardless of the death penalty status of a particular state. I think Timothy McVey was executed by the Feds, wasn’t he?

  229. 229.

    Omnes Omnibus

    @A Ghost To Most: They will be issued in compliance with state and federal in the unavoidable absence of the county clerk. If she were on vacation or ill, the clerk’s office could still issue the licenses.

  231. 231.

    daverave

    @Omnes Omnibus:

    Facts not in evidence. I assume if she was sick or on vacation she would give her blessing to lesser clerks issuing licenses in her name through her office. In this case she is not granting that her subordinates may act on her behalf. Bunning said that any couples that got marriages without her concurrence would be taking a risk:

    “Kim Davis’ lawyers also called into question whether any licenses issued in her absence would be legal. Bunning said couples will have to decide whether to take that risk on their own.”

  232. 232.

    Robert Sneddon

    @Omnes Omnibus: There’s no Federal override to the death penalty ban in Europe even for the most egregious cases like the Norwegian Nutter With No Name.

    There’s a problem extraditing people from Europe to the US if the crimes they’re accused of might garner them the death penalty, the same as we wouldn’t extradite people to North Korea or other countries which still execute criminals.

  233. 233.

    Omnes Omnibus

    @daverave: I am going to go out on a limb and say that I presume that Rowan County has a procedural manual for how the office is run. I would also presume that the deputy clerks will follow the dictates of the manual for operating in the absence of the Clerk. I would say that as long as those procedures are the licenses will be valid. Especially since the Clerk’s absence is do solely to her unwillingness to comply with a court order on this very topic.* YMMV.

    *I know, rural Kentucky, so who knows.

  236. 236.

    xenos

    @Robert Sneddon: there was a case of a nurse in Massachusetts who killed a patient in a VA hospital. Federal jurisdiction meant that the federal death penalty was pursued by the federal prosecutor.

  237. 237.

    rikyrah

    LOL at the rest of those clerks in Kentucky, who weren’t about to go to jail for that woman.

    A woman, who has a GOVERNMENT JOB.

    Like those pharmacists that don’t want to fill prescriptions because of their ‘ conscience’..

    get a new phucking job…there are more than enough people will to take that nice job with gold plated benefits.

    You can have all the ‘ principles’ you want…

    if your job clashes with your principles…get a new job.

  238. 238.

    Mnemosyne (iPhone)

    @daverave:

    Couples who are concerned about the legality can still get their license from one of the surrounding counties where the county clerks aren’t assholes. I think it’s fair for the judge to tell people that he can’t 100 percent guarantee that Davis won’t continue to be an intransigent asshole and insist on making their lives difficult.

  239. 239.

    Mnemosyne (iPhone)

    @daverave:

    Also, too, it’s not totally unheard of for clerks or other government officials to screw up and people find out after the fact that their marriages weren’t valid. Heck, Alfred Hitchcock did a comedy called “Mr. and Mrs. Smith” in 1941 based on that premise. Shit happens, you get a new license and get re-married, not really a huge deal unless it’s discovered during divorce proceedings or after one party dies or something.

  241. 241.

    Cervantes

    @rikyrah:

    if your job clashes with your principles…get a new job.

    I agree — but it seems this woman has felt entitled to this particular job, and still thinks she is.

  243. 243.

    boatboy_srq

    @xenos: “Innovation” has the connotation of “new” – and Wahhabism is demonstrably backward. OTOH “Invention” can have a very negative connotation…

  244. 244.

    boatboy_srq

    @daverave:

    Kim Davis’ lawyers also called into question whether any licenses issued in her absence would be legal.

    Translation: Davis and her attorneys are experiencing massive panty-bunching over having her name on Sinful Documents, and want to make recipients of those documents feel their discomfort.

  246. 246.

    Paul in KY

    @Mnemosyne (iPhone): Well, those convicts who can either get death penalty or LWOP sure do argue for the LWOP. I don’t think they think of it as quite the terrible punishment that you do.

Comments are closed.