Donald Trump in a speech last week:
“The bigotry of Hillary Clinton is amazing. She sees communities of color only as votes, and not as human beings. It is only votes that she sees.”
Donald Trump on Twitter this morning:
Dwyane Wade's cousin was just shot and killed walking her baby in Chicago. Just what I have been saying. African-Americans will VOTE TRUMP!
— Donald J. Trump (@realDonaldTrump) August 27, 2016
Holy fucking hell.
The Tangerine Turd must not be merely defeated; he must be annihilated at the polls so thoroughly that his family change their names and enter the Witless Protection Program, his campaign staff must find new work selling produce from the back of pickup trucks to generate income, politicians who endorsed him are permanently exiled to the howling political wilderness and the party that put forward an oaf of that caliber collapses utterly.
Only in this way can our national honor be redeemed. I’m chucking an additional $10 each into the tills of the Hillary campaign and the campaigns of Democratic Senate and House candidates. Who’s with me?
Major Major Major Major
Projection: it’s not just an operation in relational algebra!
Hal
Conservatives are obsessed with Chicago. I honestly think it’s partly because of Obama’s life there, and of course, Chicago’s guns control laws. It’s also prime fodder for the what about black on black crime obsessed folks.
rikyrah
Social media fires back at Trump for tweet about Dwyane Wade’s cousin
August 27, 2016, 10:13 am
Donald Trump is facing heavy criticism on social media for his response to reports that NBA star Dwyane Wade’s cousin was fatally shot in Chicago on Friday.
“Dwayne Wade’s cousin was just shot and killed walking her baby in Chicago. Just what I have been saying. African-Americans will VOTE TRUMP!,” he tweeted on Saturday morning.
The tweet is in line with Trump’s recent minority outreach attempts. He has specifically included rhetoric in his rally speeches that he hopes will appeal to black voters, including asking them “what do you have to lose” by voting for Trump.
“Look at how badly things are going under decades of Democratic leadership — look at the schools, look at the 58 percent of young African-Americans not working,” Trump said to black voters at a rally in North Carolina last week.
But many have pointed to Trump’s tweet as tone deaf and opportunistic in light of the tragic death, and criticized him for misspelling Dwyane Wade’s name in the tweet.
JR in WV
“Gaping Hole” where decency should live!
Well said. I’m already on a monthly repeating contribution to Hillary, but I am also doing regular $$ shots to Dem Senate campaigns to help turn that around. All we can afford!
So far Feingold and several of the women, Arizona, PA, etc.
Helen
Oh it gets “better.” He deleted the original tweet. In it Dwyane Wade’s name was spelled wrong as Dwayne. An hour ago he retweeted and the only thing he changed was Wade’s name to the correct spelling. He saw nothing else wrong with that tweet.
ETA: It’s the second iteration Betty has up here.
Amir Khalid
I can’t contribute money to Hillary, but I’m with you in spirit.
Betty Cracker
@Helen: That explains why my original post wouldn’t embed the tweet — he’d deleted and re-tweeted it. And that he thought the only thing that needed changing was the spelling of the name explains everything you need to know about Trump.
Betty Cracker
@Amir Khalid: Just as well, Amir. If you made a contribution to Clinton, the Republican House would open an investigation that would reveal your cat’s ties to the Muslim Brotherhood and examine the materials used in your kitchen counters.
Shell
And of course, the capitalization of VOTE TRUMP! Surprised he didn’t add extra exclamation marks.
rikyrah
mike freemanVerified account
@mikefreemanNFL
Texts coming in from coaches, players, front office execs from around league on Kap. So far every player backs him. No coach/exec does.
rikyrah
Richard Hine
@richardhine Richard Hine Retweeted NBC News
50 GOP #natsec experts say Trump is unfit to be put in charge of the nuclear codes. Or you can trust Trump’s doctor.
the Conster, la Citoyenne
@Helen:
It’s even better than that- Trump tweets on an Android and the 2nd tweet was from an iPhone, so some nice person on his staff corrected the spelling and retweeted, because the misspelling was the only problem with it/
trnc
This made my day.
https://twitter.com/Politicume/status/769553074536996864
Captain C
@Major Major Major Major: I first read that as ‘recreational algebra.’
And at this point I’m no longer surprised about Trump’s continuing descent into oblivious self-parody, just appalled, and amazed that it hasn’t broken the back of Broderism in the Village.
I’ll be donating to the candidates on my Act Blue list for sure!
scottinnj
Trump is what he is, but it’s more apalling that Paul Ryan et al continue to support this guy.
I called my GOP congressman and never got an answer to the ‘do you support Trump’. weasels
rikyrah
The TelegraphVerified account
@Telegraph
History was made as women led prayers at Denmark’s first female run mosque
Captain C
@rikyrah: Trump’s doctor looks like the Rob Ryan of medicine.
Schlemazel
@Captain C:
Nah, he looks like ‘the dude’ from The Big Labowski. Trumps rug brings the whole room together
Suzanne
I am financially screwed right now, but I am canvassing for Hillary, Ann Kirkpatrick, Kyrsten Sinema, and all the rest this evening.
Schlemazel
We have not put in as much as usual this season. Daughters wedding next Saturday has eaten most if not all of our spare change. WE have had to eliminate a couple of things we give money to, I need to chide her for picking an election year!
@Suzanne:
in some ways that is a better option anyway. I don’t think money is as big a problem this season as most & there is always a need for phone calls & door knocking that money can’t buy. Done the phone thing this year, will do more when we get back
Frank Wilhoit
“…his family…his campaign staff…politicians who endorsed him…the party…” You are not wrong; but after all that has happened, do you not realize that you are talking about half the country?
rikyrah
she is 84.
if, a policeman cannot disarm an 84 year old.
THEY SHOULD NOT HAVE THE JOB.
Watch: Did Okla. Police Go Too Far By Pepper Spraying an 84-Year Old Woman?
About 40 seconds elapsed before Muskogee, Okla., police pepper sprayed 84-year-old Geneva Smith.
BY: ANGELA BRONNER HELM
Posted: August 27, 2016
Muskogee, Okla. police are investigating a pepper-spray incident involving an 84-year-old woman in her home.
Fox 23 reports that officers were looking for Geneva Smith’s son last week when it occurred. He ran into his home where police used a Taser on him.
Smith then came out to see what was going on and one of about four to six officers asked her to turn around. The video shows that about 40 seconds elapsed before they sprayed Smith in the face after which she immediately went down.
NewsOn6 reports that family members said Smith had to go to the hospital. They’re demanding an apology from the police department.
Mnemosyne
@Frank Wilhoit:
According to recent polls, more like 40 percent of the country, at best.
Amir Khalid
@rikyrah:
A few days ago, I was worrying in these threads that the Donald’s constant parade of outrages might eventually numb people to their very outrageousness. I guess I needn’t have worried after all.
Ruckus
@Frank Wilhoit:
Do you have a point?
That half the country is racist?
That half the country hates the other half?
That the outreach by the racist rich has infected half the country?
Villago Delenda Est
This is who he is. Don’t doubt him when he shouts it from the rooftops. Look at the joy of emo-Nazis when he tweets this stuff.
Ken
@Helen: I’m surprised Trump didn’t blame Dwyane Wade for having an unusual name.
Anoniminous
This kind of thing has got to stop. Trump needs to be wrapped around every single GOP candidate in every election in the country.
@Villago Delenda Est:
Yup
Mike J
@rikyrah: As a Seahawks fan it pains me to say anything nice about a 49er. Kap isn’t the one who injected politics into football. Playing the national anthem is injecting politics, and the NFL has done it for over 50 years. They shouldn’t whine when people disagree with them.
Feebog
@Suzanne:
Canvassing and/or phone banking is more valuable than money at this point. Volunteers are where it’s at. Stay hydrated.
Brachiator
Yep. That’s the way to do it.
I think I can toss in a few bucks today.
ETA. This reminds me to mention journalism professor Jeff Jarvis, a Clinton supporter who talked about going to Philadelphia and helping with voter registration. He mentioned how enthusiastic everyone was, and how enthusiasm for Clinton is never mentioned in the press.
Ruckus
@Amir Khalid:
The problem in the past was that no one wanted to offend. Well no one on the left wanted to offend. So no one said anything, at least not in public. Has worked out well hasn’t it? If you leave the roaches alone and in the dark, they still multiply. You have to expose them before you can get rid of them or at least control them.
Mnemosyne
So here’s my question about Chicago: it sounds like what’s going on is that there’s a nasty gang war and a lot of innocent people are getting caught in the cross-fire because the gang members are shooting people who just happen to live in or near the same neighborhoods as rival gang members and counting that as a “win.” Yes/no?
If so, we had a similarly nasty situation here in the LA area (Monrovia) where black and Latino gangs decided to just kill random people of each race rather than, you know, go to all the trouble of finding the actual people they were mad at. Assholes.
RaflW
Anyone got a good list of Dems? I know there are lists of swing seats, but who is running in at least a competitive federal race who is actually proud of progressive, liberal policies and not in a crouch. That’s who I want to give to this time (I’ve given to HRC, Feingold (will give again), Angie Craig here in MN, a few others including very long shot Misty K Snow in UT).
Thx for any suggestions from the BJ commentariat.
BR
I have finally decided I need to find the time to go to Hillary phonebank events in my area. This is too important, and it’s becoming clear that the media has gotten the message that they need to revert to “both sides do it” reporting, so we need to win this one on the ground.
Go here to find a local campaign office, phone bank, find events, etc.. Who’ll sign up for something with me?
Ruckus
@Feebog:
Going tomorrow.
rikyrah
Keith Boykin
@keithboykin
That video montage of Trump’s racist comments over the years should be required viewing for all voters. #AMJoy #
hilts
Donald Trump is the lowest form of humanity to ever become the nominee of one of our major political parties. From now on, every dictionary published in the United States should add a cross reference to their entry for the word scum that reads “see also Trump, Donald”.
hovercraft
Reposted from dead thread downstairs.
Pastor Who Said Pulse Victims ‘Got What They Deserved’ Arrested For Child Molestation
bk
I was feeling, sorta bad. I asked my family gastroenterologist just what I had. I said Doctor (doctor) Windows XP (doctor) can you tell me what’s ailing me?
Suzanne
@Feebog: Thanks. Been feeling kind of bad about it but do not want to take my eye off the ball. Between my ex not paying child support, a bunch of unexpected medical bills, some home repairs we’re going to need, Mr. Suzanne’s grandfather passing away and going to the funeral, and the car accident this week that I am getting the blame for, there is just nothing left for donations to candidates this year.
Splitting Image
A perfect example of Trump saying in public what good Republicans are thinking in private, and ruining it for all of them.
pamelabrown53
I have a low $ level automatic contribution to Hillary. Plus we have an organizer living with us through the election. Today through Tuesday (our FL. primary), I’ve volunteered my house as a staging site for voter registration and phone banking. After Tuesday when Patrick Murphy kicks Grayson’s ass, I plan to scour my couch cushions, etc. for $ for Murphy. I just saw a poll citing Murphy only 3 points down from Rubio…which, if accurate, is definitely doable. Wish I could afford big donations to a slew of candidates.
debbie
@rikyrah:
Kap?
lamh36
WTF has happened to the AP ir has this just been a long time coming with the nature of news media lately.
this is the headline for the AP about Trump’s tweet. I refuse to link to the bastards
“speak out” as if Trumps tweet wasn’t self serving billshit that had anything to do with speaking out??
rikyrah
NYT PoliticsVerified account
@nytpolitics
“‘Put it in a drawer,’” a rental agent recalled Fred Trump saying in 1963 of an application from a black renter
mayyouliveininterestingtimes
I thought I would go on a sports site to see the reaction. Tried ESPN, read the comments, and then remembered why I don’t watch ESPN anymore. A near all-out attack on BLM by middle-aged white men. The paternalism, so strong!
RaflW
@Brachiator:
This is a story that the press cannot fathom. Eventually one or another contrarian site might do a short bit on it, but this is where the village conventional wisdom is sacrosanct. They can’t stand HRC, they know she is unpopular and grating and how could anyone feel enthusiastic? This colors a lot of their reporting, ‘analysis’, tweeting and headline writing.
Related to what I said in the earlier thread today, her speech in Reno actually has me enthusiastic. Yes I see her flaws, but she is putting together an excellent campaign and I think she will govern differently than she would have had she won 8 years ago. The press is completely blinkered and can only see her as she was in the Potus #42 years. It is an awful and damaging flaw of theirs.
Humdog
@pamelabrown53: you are doing huge donations by opening your house to volunteers! It is a very valuable effort that those with money cannot replicate. Suzanne as well, I am so thankful for the work you both are putting in to help make our country better. Please do not knock what you cannot do. You are really helping!!!
Helen
Trump just tweeted his condolences. Too late, asshole.
?BillinGlendaleCA
@Mnemosyne: OT: But speaking of Monrovia, I took the Gold LIne all the way out to Azusa yesterday.
Splitting Image
@debbie:
Colin Kaepernick sat out the national anthem at a football game to protest racial inequality. Kaepernick is quarterback for the San Francisco 49ers.
The usual suspects are hitting the fainting couch.
hovercraft
@rikyrah:
Joy was on fire this morning, she was just not having it from Trump supporters who came on to defend Trump by changing the subject to Hillary. She called bs on Alfonso Aguillar who tried to equate hiring Steve Bannon to Hillary having praised Margaret Sangor ( founder of PP and supporter of eugenics) and her support of planned parenthood. And a black pro-Trump pastor as brought on to defend Trump’s bigot comment, that’s where she deployed that montage, she was unrelenting in her focus on Trump.
Ruckus
@BR:
In 2008 I phone banked for Obama. There were about 50 volunteers, it took 2 retail stores to hold us all. I had forgotten my reading glasses so had to walk to a drugstore and passed the republican headquarters. There were 3 people inside and they weren’t doing anything. Now I don’t feel like I actually accomplished anything but it didn’t hurt and I heard a lot of enthusiasm. It’s worth it if you spend 3-4 hrs and move one person just to vote. If you can get them to vote for your candidate, that is huge. It seems like it wouldn’t be all that but there are a lot of callers and that one you convince may be worth 2 or 3 on election day. That’s 2 or 3 more than the opposition got in 2008 with their 3 person organization, if we all got that it would have been around another 150 votes.
James E Powell
To Trump’s supporters, his tweet makes perfect sense and seems like a right on target political remark. Thing that gets me is that neither the press/media nor the supposedly sane Republicans will ever acknowledge this.
raven
@Splitting Image: He’s a big evangelical too. All those tats are religious shit.
raven
@James E Powell: Everything he does makes sense to them. I have to laugh when people get all puffed up about it here. They don’t give a fuck.
hovercraft
@Brachiator:
It doesn’t fit the narrative, the enthusiasm has only been for the ‘outsiders’ Bernie and Trump this year. Clinton voters are simply eating their broccoli.
Nora
@hovercraft: That “Margaret Sanger was a eugenicist” line is one they use on feminists and have used for decades. I guess it’s too hard for them to realize that you can support one part of a person’s life — like Sanger’s support for contraception — without believing that everything the person said and did is sacrosanct. Sad!
laura
@Suzanne: people power-and the power of knocking doors, face to face contact is much more powerful than any campaign contribution.
Self governance isn’t a spectator sport.
You’re doing the good work and the hard work,so good on you.
Hugs and high 5’s
?BillinGlendaleCA
@hovercraft: Broccoli can be quite good if prepared well, I like a lemon and butter sauce.
Major Major Major Major
@hovercraft: I like broccoli! Done right, of course.
BR
@Ruckus:
I was really active in 2008 as well, but haven’t been since. I think it’s time to get back in the game — this election is way way too important, and the media’s interest in keeping it a horse race (e.g., the Associated Press) means we’ve got to make this like 2008.
lamh36
the amount of captain save a hoe going on with White media for Donald Trump says more about them than it does him
and BTW…notice original tweet came from Trump Android…and the 2nd and 3rd condolence tweet from staff iPhone!
UPDATE: Donald Trump tweets his ‘condolances to Dwyane Wade and his family,’ following backlash.
Anya
Actual Twitter headline from AP. Trump is a fucking vampire of decency.
ruemara
@Ruckus: I’m getting… I’m exhausted. I’m exhausted from watching good people deny that their friends, family, neighbors and colleagues are flat out racists. I’m exhausted from being chided when I point out racism or anyone is chided for saying hold people who support bigotry accountable. I’m sick, tired and depressed from seeing the ugly underbelly of this country for over 400 years turned loose into a raging monster that has even a slim chance at being elected, roaming with so much support. But I most despair and lose hope at motherfuckers like that guy, who show up.on these threads, on Twitter or Facebook or real life, to remind us to be gentle and loving and not call supporters of bigotry the racist ass motherfuckers they so richly deserve to clearly identified as. And I hope anyone saying that shit sits the fuck down and chokes on those words. Minorities cannot hold bigots accountable or shame them one ounce. Their relatives and designated peers can.
Ruckus
@?BillinGlendaleCA:
I’ve ridden all of the light rail lines in LA. It works pretty good. The trains run every few minutes and so it’s a good way to get around, if you are going close to one of the lines. The buses that connect to the stations usually run a lot less frequently than the trains so commuting this way is time consuming. That said I have to go to WLA regularly during the day and driving can take longer than the train/bus. I have to ride 3 different lines to get there but you walk off one and right on to another. It’s also cheap if you are a senior. Which somehow I’ve managed to be. OK it was a while ago but still.
Amir Khalid
@Major Major Major Major:
If I recall correctly, broccoli is George HW Bush’s least favourite vegetable.
Joel
@rikyrah: no surprises there. Fuck the NFL. Not watching anymore.
jacy
@Suzanne:
((((Suzanne))) Hang in there. It’s tough when so many things pile up that you feel completely overwhelmed. Hope things get better soon.
Ruckus
@Nora:
You don’t understand. RWNJ vote for perfection. The perfect racist, the perfect rich, the perfect whatever. It’s just that our idea of perfection isn’t the same as their idea. And we understand that perfection isn’t possible, we allow the concept of perfect enough.
piratedan
@RaflW: RalfW… we’ve got a real battleground here in AZ… Kirkpatrick has a 50/50 chance of unseating Johnny Mav Suzaane mentioned Sinema and here in AZ. we have Matt Heinz (a doc) going against McSally (who won by less than 2k here in AZ after a shitpotful of money came in on her end).
I imagine other places like Missouri and some of the CA congressional races (Issa), and North Carolina are also worthy of your time/cash.
Nom de Plume
@rikyrah:
Hell of an outreach. “LOL, face, black people, I told you this would happen. Now vote for me.”
? Martin
@Ruckus: Elections are won one vote at a time. There is no magical 1000 vote valu-pak out there you can buy.
hovercraft
@?BillinGlendaleCA:
It is one of my favorite vegetables, for some reason repubs don’t seem to like it. I’ll eat in any form except raw.
pamelabrown53
@Humdog:
Thank you. I’ve always railed against the republicans but this election I really see it as a battle for Decency vs. Trumpism. I’m also thrilled with the organizers I’ve met who are willing to leave their homes/states and live with strangers for more than 2.5 months! That’s commitment!
Roger Moore
@hovercraft:
Another “Christian” who needs to spend a bit more time reading the Bible. I suggest he start with Matthew 7:1-5.
Ruckus
@ruemara:
Amazing isn’t it, we have different perspectives, for obvious reasons, and yet we hold the same idea, turning out the lights and ignoring them doesn’t stop one roach. You have to turn on the lights and stomp them out, figuratively speaking of course. Otherwise those roaches just keep multiplying.
pamelabrown53
@hovercraft:
I wish we could clone Joy and place her in every media outlet, 24/7.
? Martin
@rikyrah: As Maddow noted I think when the UC Davis students were pepper-hosed – non-lethal weapons were justified as an alternative to shooting someone, so whenever you see an incident like this, when weighing whether it was appropriate or not, you should ask ‘Would it be acceptable to shoot that person instead?’ If the answer is ‘yes’ then its appropriate. If the answer is ‘no’ then the officer should be treated in the same manner as if they had shot the person.
?BillinGlendaleCA
@Ruckus: I’ve used the train/bus to get to UCLA(among other places in West LA). The Expo line is pretty slow in DTLA, but once you get passed that, it’s pretty quick. I think you’d mentioned getting to the VA in Westwood, you can take the Santa Monica Big Blue Bus to get there from the Expo line(either the Westwood or Sepulveda station) and they run pretty frequently.
I have a current love affair with the train/bus right now since: they lowered the Metrolink fare, and I found out you can use your Metrolink ticket to transfer to Metro(and other) buses and trains.
the Conster, la Citoyenne
@ruemara:
I’m making inroads into my white community of family and friends – my husband is starting to take on his brother after getting angry with me about pushing all the time, and I’ve noticed more bravery in a couple of my white friends’ FB posts and comments. There is less quiet in the face of racist shit, and more drawing of lines. Among my friends who know where I stand, they’d either better shut up around me, or ditch me, which is fine. I’m not having any. I’m aggressive in my own comments about defending Obama and posting things over and over. I always post examples of white people caping for white supremacy by ironically using “economic anxiety” when it clearly isn’t, because that’s what so many white people think – anything to avoid everything being about race. It’s white people work. My daughters, who are both married to black men, are reluctant to weigh into any of my discussions, but they live the experience and give my arguments online a certain urgent weight. It’s my job now, and if white men could pick up some of the burden of pushing back against their own tribe, it would really be helpful.
debbie
@Splitting Image:
Thanks. Nice that the 49ers supported him. Goddell must not be amused.
RaflW
@lamh36: I think the AP has been laboring along in bothsiderist/view from nowhere obscurity for a long time. Not obscuse in the sense that plenty of papers run their stories, but obscure in that we didn’t see the feed of bullshit in real time. AP having to have a twitter presence rips the mask off. They suck when it comes to politics. The worst of old-school ‘balance’ that has the distorting impact of very, very false equivalence.
hovercraft
@lamh36:
This is his Daily News Op Ed from 2014
As Jamil Smith says, this outreach is a fail from jump.
Ruckus
@? Martin:
Some people spend a lot of money thinking exactly that, 1000 vote valu-paks. And it works if you hit the right buzz words, fears and bigoted tendencies. We have to convince people, we have to let them think, marinate in the idea of not exactly what you want but in what works. That takes time and effort and works one person or small groups at a time.
the Conster, la Citoyenne
@the Conster, la Citoyenne:
Just to add, boy howdy, white people do NOT like to be called racists, especially the racist ones. So, that’s the work right there.
Ruckus
@?BillinGlendaleCA:
The Blue Bus only runs every half hour. The train runs every 7-10 minutes. You get to do a lot of scheduling or waiting. Same in Azusa, Foothill Transit runs every half hr.
Jeffro
OT but not really : you guys should read the “memo to the GOP: forget 2016, focus on 2018 and 2020” that is in the Washington post online right now .
It is written by two Republican underwear stains (but I repeat myself) Who are already encouraging the GOP house to hold weekly hearings into the Clinton administration . Already .
MattF
Narcissistic Sociopaths are offended.
RaflW
@Nora: St. Ronaldus of Hollywood signed three big tax increases. So they do understand how to separate some actions from others. They also will use everything they can lob at HRC b/c desperate.
?BillinGlendaleCA
@Ruckus: True, same with Metro to UCLA. I did the walk from the Azusa station to the Arboretum yesterday. Didn’t know they had a large number of Peafowl there.
mayyouliveininterestingtimes
@the Conster, la Citoyenne: I try, but for every one of me there seems to be twenty more. I went to school with a very bright kid who made passing racists remarks from time to time, as Florida crackers are known to do. He would eventually get a degree in criminology and become a cop. I’ll never forget what he told me as to why he wanted to be a cop: “I want to be legally able to shoot people.” And remember, he’s just a nice southern boy who happens to think minorities are inherently criminal. I wish I could make this up.
trollhattan
@Mnemosyne:
Twenty-seven, exactly. Whatever percentage of voters that may represent may differ, but twenty-seven percent prevails. And fuck them.
Brendancalling
Hey. I KNOW people who sell produce from the back of a truck. They are hard-working, low-income people, often immigrants, who had to fight for every scrap they have.
They don’t deserve to be lumped in with Trump.
Hal
@Nora:
This is the same tactic being used against Hillary right now. A photo of her embracing Robert Byrd proves she’s the real bigot because decades ago Byrd was a klansman. Never mind his renunciation of that life or support for civil rights, just his past affiliation matters. Oh, and just ignore Bannon’s alt-right bullshit.
? Martin
@the Conster, la Citoyenne: I think Trump is helping move this effort forward. It’s a lot easier to tolerate soft bigotry when you see no direct evidence that it hurts others (if my neighbor is a bigot but knows enough to keep that view to themselves, is it likely others would be affected by them?) but when that evidence surfaces, you feel a lot more compelled to act.
The GOP has done a good job of walking that line, that yeah, most of their voters are bigots, but we never directly connect it to policy, so no harm no foul. Trump is showing that there is definitely both a statistical effect of that (put enough bigots in one place and policies start changing) and an empowering effect from it (they stop keeping it to themselves). The takeaway isn’t that Americans are getting more racist, rather that it’s a problem we’ve refused to deal with and now we’re being forced to.
Had this conversation with my kids (15, 18) last night, that I was in some ways happy that Trump is out there. You’re seeing LePage’s racism surface. You’re seeing the sides form up within the GOP. It’s bringing this to the public consciousness (my wife is going a national phone poll right now and it sounds from her answers that race is a notable part of the poll) and if nothing else, if the GOP is defeated and if (and this is far from certain) that the Ryan wing of the party wins out, you’ll see them be forced to put a pretty strong lid on things that hint of racism. But I’m not convinced that wing will win. It seems to me that Trump has more support right now than Ryan does, at least nationally.
James E Powell
@RaflW:
I don’t recall the details and I’m too lazy to look them up right now, but it was during the Bush/Cheney Junta that there was a pronounced shift at the AP.
Ruckus
@?BillinGlendaleCA:
I grew up in Monrovia and we would have peacocks show up in our yard because they got to run wild at the Arboretum. We call and a truck would show up sometime in the future and give them a ride home.
You do know that there are closer stations than Azusa to the arboretum, don’t you? I do understand that you like to walk but that is a bit of a walk.
lamh36
@ruemara: Trumps embrace of racist and the GOP is nothing new to me. I’ve considered a large number of the folks who routinely vote straight GOP to not be on the side of racial equality…
Politics nowadays is too partisan for the “good for a Republican” moniker to stick to today’s members of the GOP, esp not under the leadership of Trump.
no…what I am enjoying is the struggle for white folks on “our side” with the fact that yes, ur mom/dad/great
uncle/granddad/grandma/cousin/whoever who STILL are considering Trump and the GOP as it stands today are racist as fuq…time for them folks to take off the blinders.
People of color already know the deal and its those folks who have to join us against their stupid relations that will beat GOP and Trump in November
AMinNC
@RaflW: Deborah Ross for Senate in N.C. to replace Richard Burr! Thanks for considering.
the Conster, la Citoyenne
@mayyouliveininterestingtimes:
Here in the northeast there’s a better understanding and acceptance of what’s allowed, since we’re way more liberal in politics than in FL for instance, but there’s a flavor of racism that prevails here which is more subtle, and harder to pick on. The hard core bigots are definitely here – sports talk radio is full of them – the hosts and the callers – but they’re careful for the most part because they’ll get fired or suspended for being out about it. I’m surrounded by them at work, and I won’t jeopardize my job, but I overhear them and it pisses me off that these white men don’t feel threatened with their jobs. Hillary’s election will throw them into a tizzy, and frankly, I can’t wait. She represents another ratchet in the opposite direction of their comfortable knowledge that we’re all still living in their world, which shifted under them with Obama’s re-election, which they still can’t quite get over.
? Martin
@Jeffro: And they completely miss the lesson. The whole reason Trump ascended is that back in the 90s the GOP went on this unhinged campaign against anything Clinton, against anything Democratic. They gave up all notions of governance and policy. They have a few overarching themes – everyone gets guns, nobody pays taxes, bomb anyone who side-eyes us, but there’s no detail, no nuance, no connection to reality. Instead everything is focused on being anti-Democratic – and they proudly admit this, even the so-called sensible ones. Cleeks Law is something they embrace.
What that means is that your leading voices, including Limbaugh, Hannity, etc. have no interest in advancing Republican ideas. Their entire electoral strategy is demonizing the opposition in the most extreme possible ways, and its inevitable that voters will demand a candidate that reflects that. That’s the greatest feature of Trump, that he’ll demonize Clinton like Limbaugh would. So the constant investigations of Clinton, and the constant escalation of charges (Clinton admits she fucked up with the emails, but there’s a huge gap between that and it being a hanging offense) is not going to get the GOP their next Reagan, it’s only going to get them their next Trump. They need to advance conservative ideas rather than attack Democratic individuals. It’s so obvious and they have 25 years of damage to undo, that it’s in some ways shocking that I can think of so few Republicans that realize it. I think Ryan does, actually. He just can’t do anything about it.
West of the Rockies (been a while)
Now I am become Trump, destroyer of worlds.
?BillinGlendaleCA
@Ruckus:
Gold line stations? Nope, I checked. I could have taken the Azusa Transit bus to the Arboretum or Foothill Transit would get me close. Walking seemed almost as fast per teh Google.
philadelphialawyer
@RaflW: Besides their other BS “reasons” for not liking Hillary, she is also just not good copy. Her supporters skew middle aged and older women, particularly minority women. Not photogenic and telegenic college kid supporters like Bernie and Barrack before him drew to their rallies. Nor the outrageous tea party ass heads who attend Trump rallies. In fact, her supporters tend to not do “rallies” at all. Partly because they are old and wise enough to know that campaign rallies don’t mean shit, partly because they have work and care giving responsibilities that preclude them from attending, and partly because the “bros” and other bullying men of the world seek to and often succeed at intimidating them from all forms of PDA for Hillary.
A “story” about, say, middle aged African American working class women who take care of their kids and their elderly parents and who, whenever they can, utilize mail in ballots to vote for Hillary, is not good press. There is nothing visual to cover, nothing click baity or “pictures at 11” worthy, and the story lacks sex appeal to the corporate media’s and even the left blogosphere’s primarily white, primarily hetero audience.
Plenty of people are enthusiastic about Hillary. Plenty of people were enthusiastic about her back in 2008, too. But not the right people, as far as the press is concerned.
Mnemosyne
@?BillinGlendaleCA:
I’m still waiting on the new date for 626 Golden Streets — it got canceled because of the wildfire out that way. I think they’re saying January.
? Martin
@James E Powell: Fournier was the Wash bureau chief at AP at that time. All you need to know.
Luthe
@Major Major Major Major: Or different ways of depicting a three-dimensional sphere onto two-dimensional maps! /GIS reference
James E Powell
@?BillinGlendaleCA:
This is so LA.
Keith P.
@Helen: He’s delivering the cousin’s eulogy at a white person’s funeral tomorrow. It will be tremendous, with people telling him it’s the best eulogy they ever heard, with the audience chanting “TRUMP! TRUMP! TRUMP!”
Betty Cracker
@Humdog: Co-signed — volunteering is more valuable, IMO.
?BillinGlendaleCA
@?BillinGlendaleCA: My bad, I meant Arcadia. I went on to the Azusa stop to see the Glendora bougainvilleas.
Roger Moore
@Ruckus:
Of if your employer subsidizes, which a lot of large employers do to try to meet targets for alternative commuting. My employer pays up to $100/month of the cost of a van pool, metro pass, etc. That’s great, because a standard A-TAP card is $110/month, so I wind up paying just $10/month for unlimited rides on almost all public transit in LA county.
Brachiator
@?BillinGlendaleCA: There should be a free shuttle to the Arboretum. From The Source, Metro transit online blog:
Arcadia: Metro Line 79, Metro Line 487, Foothill Transit 187 and Arcadia Transit, which will operate a free (until June) shuttle bus running between the Gold Line, Santa Anita Park, Methodist Hospital, Westfield Mall and the Los Angeles County Arboretum.
the Conster, la Citoyenne
@RaflW:
My enthusiasm for her stems from her embrace of Obama, whose popularity is high and steady – another story the press refuses to examine or positively cover in any way. In fact, Hillary’s popularity depends on her ignoring the media, as does Obama’s. The media seems to be stuck in a closed feedback loop of denial of their increasing irrelevancy, with no ability to self-correct.
?BillinGlendaleCA
@Brachiator: Yes, but it takes 20 minutes to get from the Gold Line station to the Arboretum; walking took 30 minutes.
Mnemosyne
@Hal:
I saw that from a Facebook acquaintance who is a purported Christian and wanted to say, So much for that Christian ideal of repentance and salvation, huh? A guy who vocally and publicly repudiated his racist past is exactly the same as David Duke because salvation isn’t real.
But I didn’t, because he’s just not important enough in my life — he’s my cousin’s husband and I see him once a year at best.
?BillinGlendaleCA
@Roger Moore: I waved as I went by on the train.
philadelphialawyer
@the Conster, la Citoyenne: This is so true. Obama is seen as a complete failure by the Trump/tea party assholes, and most Republicans in general. But NOT by the general public. And so, of course, the MSM highlights the former view, not the latter.
The MSM matters less and less by the minute. But they simply refuse to change their both sides do it, Broderist concept of political news coverage, even though its appropriateness died with Nixon, or with Reagan, or, at the latest, with Gingrich.
The Republican say that Obama sucks and is unpopular and that Hillary is guilty of a million crimes, and so they dutifully repeat it, even though reality says otherwise, on both issues.
mayyouliveininterestingtimes
@the Conster, la Citoyenne: Very well put with the shift. Us men take it for granted we live in a paternalistic society, see Trump’s remarks on sexual harassment in the workplace. I didn’t really become aware of it until I did a little studying in linguistics. The female gender is almost always the ‘marked’ gender, meaning ‘other’. That’s changing and for many it’s going to hurt, but the saddest part is that it doesn’t have to. Fuck complementarians.
RaflW
@Anya:
?BillinGlendaleCA
Glendora Bougainvilleas.
ThresherK
I’d like to say I woke up this morning considering myself inured to what Trump would do today. But he surprised me.
Also, it seems I’ve never typed “Dwyane Wade” before in my life, even though I know who he is. I would have spelled it wrong. Good thing the pros in PR have the best and yugest researchers to keep that from happening!
Ruckus
@?BillinGlendaleCA:
Monrovia and Arcadia both have stations. And that’s closer than Azusa. And once again it’s not a huge walk but the Arcadia station is less than a mile and a half from the Arboretum.
RaflW
@the Conster, la Citoyenne: I’ve been tilting at the windmill lately, with the idea that HRC refusing to do pressers says more about the litany of self-inflicted wounds by the press than it does about her.
Kai Ryssdal briefly engaged, then went to his expected trope-land of protecting the fellow press.
Roger Moore
@?BillinGlendaleCA:
ITYM the Arcadia station, which is the one closest to the Arboretum. And the peafowl are so popular and common they’re the symbol of Arcadia; they even have a little peacock logo on their street signs. Not that the peafowl are as appreciated by the people who live with them day in and day out; they also have signs reminding people that it’s illegal to feed them.
Mnemosyne
@ruemara:
This fake training video on white fragility in the workplace that lurker dan linked to in a previous thread may help a bit. It made me LOL, at least.
rikyrah
@debbie:
The Quarterback for the San Francisco 49ers.
ABC NewsVerified account
@ABC
MORE: Colin Kaepernick protests National Anthem over treatment of minorities:
rikyrah
Daniel DaleVerified account
@ddale8
Republicans are demanding an apology for this Tim Kaine line: “KKK values, David Duke values, Donald Trump values.”
?BillinGlendaleCA
@Ruckus:
@Roger Moore: I stopped at both Arcadia and Azuza. I haz confused. Roger, I noticed the signs and was a bit puzzled until I saw peafowl in peoples’ yards on my walk to the Arboretum.
Mnemosyne
@RaflW:
Kai has been slightly less likely to make me want to drive my car into a tree lately. “Marketplace” did a great piece with the author of the book Angry White Men and actually used the phrase “enraged entitlement” more than once.
Another Holocene Human
@Mike J: Let me see if I have this right: there’s a sports “hero” nicknamed “Kap” who took a political stance on live TV over the treatment of Black people by police?
Fanfiction and the real world have collided!
Ruckus
@?BillinGlendaleCA:
I wondered if that’s what happened. For you I didn’t think Azusa to the Arboretum was that long a walk so I half expected you to have done it for the photo opps.
Mnemosyne
@rikyrah:
I kinda want Kaine’s response to be, “Believe me, I’m sorry. Believe me!”
?BillinGlendaleCA
@Ruckus: The walks from the Arcadia station to the Arboretum and back AND the walk from Azuza to Glendora and back was quite enough(26K steps yesterday).
MattF
@rikyrah: We regret that you are upset about Tim being smarter than you. He says he didn’t set out to insult you.
Roger Moore
@Brachiator:
Yeah, but it’s only about a 30 minute walk, which means you’ll probably get there faster by walking than by waiting for the shuttle.
Mike in NC
@philadelphialawyer:
The media has talked about “the enthusiasm gap” for as long as I can remember, and it is always used to hammer Democrats, especially during midterm elections.
?BillinGlendaleCA
@Roger Moore: Exactly.
nanute
Betty,
Witless Protection Program! lol. Was that a typo or intentional? If it was a typo don’t change it, it’s perfect.
socraticsilence
@Betty Cracker:
It gets worse Trump tweeted the first one personally his staff pulled it down and reposted it the second time. (you can tellnits from different phones).
the Conster, la Citoyenne
@mayyouliveininterestingtimes:
As I’ve said and keep saying all the time, is that we’re 8 years into the real revolution of shifting the paradigm away from white supremacist patriarchy, not Bernie Sanders’ phony baloney revolution of privileged whites trying to re-install a white male to the center of power so that their demands be prioritized. Sanders is trying to mount a counter-revolution – his “Our Revolution”‘s board is all white men from Vermont, and apparently isn’t able to see any problem, or irony in that. Doomed to fail, and rightly so. Obama’s presidency is consequential in so many ways, but the most important way is that he forged a winning coalition that electorally sidelined white males as the primary political force in this country, and the press, mostly white and male chose to overlook this fact – by doing so, they’re responsible for creating an illusion of the country we live in and a false hope that it may change back. It won’t. They chose poorly.
philadelphialawyer
@Mike in NC: Yes and no.
Barrack and Bernie were not said to suffer from “enthusiasm gaps.” Both viz a viz Hillary, and the latter viz a viz McCain and Romney either. “Enthusiasm,” for Dems, seems to mean college kids coming out to rallies, and on line megaphoning.
But, sure, generally speaking, the Dems are said to suffer from a lack of enthusiasm, including when it is not true. Even in the midterms, it is more the effect of GOP gerrymandering and voter suppression that accounts for low Dem turnouts than it is lack of enthusiasm.
Roger Moore
@?BillinGlendaleCA:
They have been multiplying and spreading. They can apparently make it across some large streets but not others and not the freeway, so they’ve spread all the way to Monrovia and East Pasadena. We occasionally see strays all the way in Duarte.
mayyouliveininterestingtimes
@rikyrah: “I would apologize, but seeing as how I’m not sorry, issuing an apology would be PC, and I’ve been told that’s wrong. So no.” If only.
Roger Moore
@James E Powell:
This is very 2010s LA. It’s hard to imagine people 20 years ago discussing the best public transit routes, or at least imagine people doing it in English.
Ruckus
@mayyouliveininterestingtimes:
I grew up in the 50s with using the male form if in doubt of the gender or to make it male, as that was the dominate gender. We didn’t say her/him, we were told that is the proper english usage. But it seemed strange to me then and it was. It was wrong then and it’s wrong now. We grew up with certain people living on their side of the tracks, which of course I didn’t understand, what makes one side proper and the other not? The answer is racism. It was wrong 60 yrs ago, just like it was wrong 160 yrs ago and it’s just as wrong today. But in this country we have those centuries of wrongness to correct. Being human it isn’t easy but it is happening. Being human there will be pushback to change, just because change is seen as repudiating one’s beliefs. Which in this case is true. Those racist/misogynistic beliefs were wrong at the founding of the country and they have remained wrong ever since.
Elizabelle
@RaflW: WRT the AP’s fecklessness, the “view from nowhere” (the ridiculous “objective/both sides reporting”) and general timidity in the MSM: other Juicers have mentioned this James Fallow post, but it belongs here:
(And note: this excerpt is a reader comment.)
The (Intentional?) Silence of the Republicans
This seems true to me, and if so, it’s goddamned appalling. Because there is an objective truth out there. At some point, it does not matter what the GOP politicians say. Are Clinton’s remarks correct? Why is the alt-right supporting Donald Trump? Might this not be a real story, whether the GOP mouthpieces want to go with it or not?
Further, do you think the alt-right respects or cares about mainstream journalism? Do your effing jobs, professional journalists.
The “he said/she said” model of journalism, where one side is just spinning or bullshitting, is taking down the journalism profession too. Another gift from the GOP’s enablers. Devaluing the profession, making everyone a cynic as we drown in a torrent of lies and scam and non-news items.
I would think accuracy is a lot more important, and the press’s duty to ferret out, than is “balance.”
Jay Rosen has written a lot on this topic too.
Of course, the MSM is more about cash than accuracy. Sad!
philadelphialawyer
@the Conster, la Citoyenne: Yes, over and over again, I see and hear even more or less NOT idiotic MSMers, like Noah Millman , babbling on about the “crucial” white male voters, the “crucial” white working class, the “crucial” white male working class voters, etc. Well, they ain’t crucial anymore, at least in terms of presidential elections. The winning Democratic coalition in national elections consists of women of all ages, races and classes, POC generally, and white liberals. The latter including some white male liberals, of whom some are working class. Not the crucial piece. Not the central or back bone constituency.
Ruckus
@Roger Moore:
As I said I lived in Monrovia, on the north west side from 1960 till 73. We had them in our yard on a regular basis 55 yrs ago. Beautiful to look at, not so much fun if your chores were yard work. Those birds are large and messy. Almost as messy as geese.
mayyouliveininterestingtimes
@the Conster, la Citoyenne: We white men have had a good go at it and I’ve got not problem with someone else giving it a try. Unlike conservatives, I don’t have a fetish with status quo and atavistic social structures and have an irrational fear of all things new. Dolts, the whole lot of them.
SiubhanDuinne
@rikyrah:
because of course they are.
Roger Moore
@philadelphialawyer:
The media would talk less about white male voters if it were more diverse itself. It’s a lot harder to ignore women and minorities when you’re surrounded by them in your everyday life.
Keith P.
@lamh36: My guess is that Ron Fournier hired a bunch of like-minded thinkers while he was (inexplicably) the chief there.
mayyouliveininterestingtimes
@Ruckus: I found Struck and White’s “Elements of Style” in a Goodwill and it mentions this very thing, and it was very popular. It reminds me of the de Beauvoir story of the son and father getting into a crash. It’s good to test our preconceptions because otherwise entire groups get left out of the conversation, even when that wasn’t the intention.
Another Holocene Human
@the Conster, la Citoyenne: Wow, really? Even Michael freaking Moore wasn’t that tone deaf and that’s pretty tone deaf.
the Conster, la Citoyenne
@philadelphialawyer:
Propane Jane on twitter has a storify – I’d link it if I could – that examines the impact of media and polling, and how their lagging behind examining how quickly and irreversibly the country is changing is negatively affecting whites. Pollsters don’t adjust their sampling enough to reflect reality from election cycle to election cycle, which traps unwoke, uneducated, working and middle class whites in an unrealistic mindset that drives them into Fox/Tea Party/alt right arms about conspiracies, illegitimacy of elections, etc., and fuels drug use, suicide, alcoholism etc. because they’re losing their power and status every day. Whites see it and feel it, but the media keeps pretending that things haven’t changed as much as they really have, or plays along with the right wing delusions, to their audience’s detriment and the country’s. Fox, of course, having developed and monetized the model the best. Hence, Trump.
Ruckus
@philadelphialawyer:
You are asking people who have lived their entire lives as exclusionary people to change, to ignore their past and become enlightened. That you can even reasonably say enlightened in this case shows how strong this need for change is. But this is the difference in political views for the most part, exclusionary and inclusionary. Conservatives want to exclude anyone that isn’t their ideal, IOW, not them. Liberals say can’t we all just get along, sure we are superficially different, but so what.
?BillinGlendaleCA
@Roger Moore: Until this summer, the last time I was on a bus in LA was 1981. Paying $5 to get me pretty much anywhere I want to go is a real win. I takes a bit longer and there’s waiting for connections sometimes, but it beats paying for parking($15 at the Getty or $12 at UCLA).
philadelphialawyer
@Roger Moore: Yes, and this particularly true about women. White male reporters, like Chris Matthews, for example, who have already made it, and who have pretty much no contact with POC outside their workplace, can act magnanimously towards Barrack Obama. But such folks have wives, girlfriends, daughters, etc. in their private lives. And they like being the Big Cheese in their relationships with such women and girls. Also, in the liberal part of our society, MLK and Jackie Robinon are heroes. There is no equivalent on the feminist side. No Chris Matthews of the world wants to be lumped in with George Wallace or Bull Connors or “Dixie” Walker, but a soft, plausibly deniable male chauvanism is still acceptable.
Feminism, of the old school variety, and of which Hillary is the prime examplar, is contrary to their status. And so they discount it. None of them could see the sexism in Bernie Sanders’ conduct, even though it was obvious during the entire campaign with his finger wagging, shouting and interrupting, and all the more so when he, for weeks on end after he had fucking lost, refused to do the decent thing and concede, congratulate and endorse. Women being the peacemakers, being “the bigger person,” letting the asshole “man of the house” bluster and have his way, that’s their normal.
the Conster, la Citoyenne
@Another Holocene Human:
Jane Sanders was the chair of the board who wanted and got Weaver hired after Bernie promised everyone else he wouldn’t, which is why half the hired staff quit. Then, Jane resigned, leaving the rest of the board as still all white, and now all male too. It remains unclear who and why exactly they decided to form as a 501(c)(4) – it appears to be a Jane/Jeff decision because it’s dark money that comes from undisclosed donors, and can be disbursed without transparency, as long as Bernie isn’t involved. Of course, I don’t believe the regs say anything about wives, or maybe that’s why she resigned, which is why she wanted her buddy Jeff running the show. Do I sound cynical? Why yes, I believe I do.
Ruckus
@mayyouliveininterestingtimes:
I’m not sure it wasn’t the intention. It was fostered too heavily not to be.
Sort of like that casual racism, blacks are OK as long as they live somewhere else and I don’t have to see/hear/work with them racism. It was the norm, it was accepted, it was believed by large portions of the white population. And it has been handed down over the generations. But thankfully it is changing, too slowly but it is.
Mr.Mack
Meh. The national anthem has been a part of my life for a long time, I was an athlete from age 7 or so. I generally stand up because everyone else is doing so and I don’t necessarily mind a moment to bond with strangers over our love for this country. That said, I do not pledge allegiance to the flag. Something about has rubbed me the wrong way since childhood. It is a little like prayer….I generally hate to see it done in public. Once in awhile, someone will ask me why I don’t pledge, I always just say I served my country during Vietnam and I’ve earned the right to exercise my freedom. No one has argued beyond that.
Iowa Old Lady
The Washington Post evidently has a report on Trump’s debate prep that I can’t access, but some of it is quoted in Kos:
That’s almost too good to be true.
Ruckus
@philadelphialawyer:
QFT
A part of, sure but not THE part. This is supposed to be a country of the people, not the gentry. And yet we’ve excluded and/or devalued over half of the people for most of our history. It boggles the mind.
mayyouliveininterestingtimes
@Ruckus: I’m sure it was intentional by those who created it and those who want it continued. I just meant in the context of the laity so to speak; those who don’t think they’re racist, misogynist, etc. and don’t see anything wrong with the language. Their eyes need to be opened because otherwise they will continue to perpetuate it unknowingly.
Ruckus
@Mr.Mack:
One shouldn’t have to pledge allegiance, especially on a daily basis, to a country supposedly built on equality, when a large percentage of the people in that country don’t respect the ideal or the equality. One wouldn’t have to pledge allegiance to a country that did respect it’s own stated principals.
BTW I say the same thing as you when asked.
Mnemosyne
@Iowa Old Lady:
I still say that the Clinton campaign needs to get Alec Baldwin to be their Trump surrogate. They need a blowhard who can improvise and Gish Gallop in rehearsals so they can figure out strategies to deal with that.
? Martin
@Iowa Old Lady: I can just imagine them debating, over a cheeseburger, if ‘cunty’ is a word.
debbie
@Iowa Old Lady:
Speaking of, Christie seems to have disappeared.
Iowa Old Lady
@Mnemosyne: I heard someone–James Carville, maybe?–saying he’d advise her to figure out what she wants her points to be and stick to those because she can’t predict what Trump will do or say.
the Conster, la Citoyenne
@Iowa Old Lady:
That’s exactly right – let him rant, don’t respond at all except by looking at him with side eye, pretend he didn’t say anything then make her point – like you do with a tantruming toddler. He’ll torpedo himself.
dmsilev
@Iowa Old Lady: Story link, for anyone who hasn’t used up their quota of free Post stories. Another quote:
Identifying the contradiction between these two (adjacent) paragraphs is left as an exercise for the reader.
Iowa Old Lady
@? Martin: LOL. Maybe he could just slut “country” and wink.
@debbie: If I were Christie, I’d disappear too, but the man seems to have no shame. Supposedly he was one of the people Trump took along to his security briefing.
debbie
@the Conster, la Citoyenne:
She portends the coming white genocide.
Anoniminous
@debbie:
Somebody stuck a pin in him and he exploded?
debbie
@Iowa Old Lady:
I haven’t seen him lurking on the edges for a while. Rudi has been the lead spokesman, hasn’t he?
Iowa Old Lady
@debbie: Geez, you’re right. Imagine having the un-charming Rudi as your lead spokesman.
the Conster, la Citoyenne
@debbie:
That’s what the FEMA camps are for, obviously.
Peale
@rikyrah: the players are backing trump?
Mnemosyne
@lamh36:
I will make a positive report, though: I’m seeing white conservative relatives coming out against Trump that I never expected to see doing that. White people (like me) need to keep the conversation going, because we never know what’s finally going to cause those people to wake up.
And, yeah, some of them never will, but if my cousin the retired white evangelical cop in his 50s can post on Facebook that Trump is uniquely dangerous and we all need to vote for Hillary, there’s still hope.
Amir Khalid
@Iowa Old Lady:
Have you tried opening the WaPo link in a private window on Firefox? I’ve found that to be useful for circumventing the monthly limit on free stories.
KlareCole
@BR: On the day of her speech I re-volunteered & made a donation. I’m with her. Have been all along.
Mnemosyne
@Iowa Old Lady:
That’s probably going to be the strategy, but she still needs to practice it with someone who can be totally unpredictable.
Iowa Old Lady
@Amir Khalid: I’ll try that. Thanks.
Trump is babbling away in Iowa right now. He’s going to take the country back from “the death spiral we’re in.” God, I can’t stand it.
?BillinGlendaleCA
@Iowa Old Lady: I’m sure it sounded better in the original German.
hovercraft
@debbie: @Iowa Old Lady:
He popped out of hole long enough yesterday to say he was not consulted about the Trump campaigns newest hire Bill Stepien, who he fired over Bridgegate. Fat Boy as he is affectionately known here in Jersey is hunkering down waiting to see what shoes drop when the trial begins.
Doug R
@? Martin: She didn’t really have an option when it came to emails. Her State Department asked the NSA for a Blackberry like President Obama’s, but the NSA told them to pound sand. So she asked former SOS how they dealt with it, and did the same thing.
Where’s the fuckup?
SiubhanDuinne
@Iowa Old Lady:
I just heard the last couple of minutes of his Iowa speech. He was played off, again, by “You Can’t Always Get What You Want.” I truly don’t understand why they keep using that song.
Iowa Old Lady
@SiubhanDuinne: Maybe he’s never listened to the words.
Brachiator
@Iowa Old Lady:
A good chunk of Trump supporters will want to see gladiator style combat. They know where they stand on the issues and only want to see Trump swat Clinton the same way he thumped the GOP dimwits in the Republican debates.
We might see politics intersect with a Saturday Night Live Skit where Trump boldly acknowledges that he doesn’t know anything about the Middle East and just says, “but I know who my friends are, while crooked Hillary sells America out to whoever will send money to the Clinton Foundation. Where’s my cheeseburger?”
People who want to see Hillary dazzle Trump with her competence and mastery of detail are living in a whole different world from Trump supporters. And this means that for many viewers, conventional analyses about “who won the debate” will be irrelevant.
But the Clinton team understand what they’re up against. We’ll just have to wait to see how they handle this.
Zinsky
I’m with you always, Betty! You are hilarious! I almost think something bizarre is going to end this maniac election season like Trump stroking out on national TV or God forbid, an assassination of some sort. I get the distinct feeling this election is going to end in a bang, not a whimper!
The Very Reverend Crimson Fire of Compassion
@Frank Wilhoit: AND? Your point is . . . ?
Brachiator
@SiubhanDuinne:
He thinks he’s what America needs.
Mnemosyne
@hovercraft:
I’m guessing it’s like that episode of “The Simpsons” when the Krusty doll is switched to evil:
“Guess who, fat boy!”
Mnemosyne
@Brachiator:
That’s what I think, too.
KlareCole
@ruemara: Ruemara, I’ve been ruminating that ‘alt-right’ is much too benign a term. I think you have captured my feelings well. On a thread a couple days ago, Adam Silverman reminded us of the irony that NAZI did not seem strong enough. I think raging monster racist ass mf gets closer.
mike in dc
@Brachiator:
But a one on one presidential general election debate is far different from a multi-candidate primary debate. Audience participation is minimal, there are far fewer “X said Y about you; care to respond?” questions, more policy questions, longer response periods and the press has certain expectations, although they will of course also readily focus on trivialities like Gore sighing. I’m sure Clinton will have her own arsenal of zingers and retorts, and she will be much better prepared on every policy issue. “Let Trump be Trump” will basically expose the largest possible audience to what a huge asshole this guy is.
SiubhanDuinne
@Iowa Old Lady:
I’m sure he hasn’t. Any more than any of those politicians who used “Born in the U.S.A.” listened to those words. But wouldn’t you think there’d be somebody on staff who might suggest rethinking some of the music choices?
O/T, but related (true story, very short version): Years ago the famous Met Opera baritone Robert Merrill was guest artist for a symphony orchestra I was involved with (I interviewed him for the local NPR station). The night of dress rehearsal he propositioned me, and, as it transpired, every female in the orchestra. We all said no, compared notes, had some good laughs, and shrugged it off to his being a horny old guy on the road.
But our biggest laugh was when he rehearsed his encore number: “I’ve Got Plenty of Nothin’.”
Mnemosyne
@SiubhanDuinne:
At that point with Merrill, it’s almost not even anything personal, just a reflex!
Peale
@Brachiator: so which drug? Heroin? Las?
Brachiator
@mike in dc:
Obviously, not to Trump, if the stories about his lack of prep are true.
Nobody watching the debates will give a shit about press expectations.
This stuff is not as trivial as you might think. Gore’s performance was similar to Nixon’s in the Nixon-Kennedy debate. Radio listeners thought that Nixon won the debate; people watching on tv thought he looked shady. In 2000, Bush looked comfortable in his own skin. Gore came across as weird and robotic.
Trump’s supporters don’t care whether or not he’s an asshole. They care whether he’s an asshole who will fight for them.
Many Trump supporters have already adjusted their expectations. Early on, I would hear his people talk about how he was going to use his master business skills to fix America. Now I hear some of these same people say that the president is just a figurehead, and it doesn’t matter whether Trump is a dope because he will have “all the right people” around him to take care of things. This kind of thing informs what they want from the debates. And the main thing they will want to see is Hillary knocked around.
But again, I am confident that Clinton’s people are prepared for this. Viewers should be as well.
KlareCole
@Mnemosyne: Hmm, ‘enraged entitlement’. Adding that to my lexicon to flesh out the term alt right.
Amir Khalid
@SiubhanDuinne:
Probably a better choice than Sympathy For The Devil: The line “Please allow me to introduce myself, I’m a man of wealth and taste” definitely doesn’t apply to the Donald.
SiubhanDuinne
@Mnemosyne:
That’s the conclusion we all came to! (He had given each of us — by “us,” I mean the dozen or more women he hit on that night — the number of his room at the hotel, and I confess we did briefly consider having the lot of us all show up at his door simultaneously, around midnight — but decided against it. Have always wondered what would have happened if….)
SiubhanDuinne
@Amir Khalid:
Ha! I’d enjoy hearing that at a Trump rally though, just for the gigglz.
Nora
@Elizabelle: You’re so right. And the article on the front page of the New York Times this morning (above the fold, natch) was about the whole alt-right world, and you had to get to the bottom of the front page part of the article before you read about Hillary’s speech, and not until you got to the followup page did you see anything about what they’re about. Even then, the tone was “Hillary says they’re racist and xenophobic.” Not a word about whether her statement is true or not. I practically screamed at the paper (there in the coffee shop where I was reading it) for the stupid vapidity of the article.
trollhattan
@Amir Khalid:
“But what’s puzzling you
Is the nature of my game”
Would be pretty apt. Even better,
“Just call me Lucifer
‘Cause I’m in need of some restraint”
Some?
debbie
@the Conster, la Citoyenne:
Good to know. I’d hate to think they’d just be dismantled when Obama leaves office..
Villago Delenda Est
@rikyrah: Rethuglicans can go find a fire to die in.
Jeffro
@Mnemosyne:
Ay-men! My usually-R mom abhors Trump like no other politician I’ve ever heard her speak of (even Bill Clinton, even Jesse Jackson). She won’t vote for Clinton but she sure as heck isn’t going to vote for Trump…for now, I’ll take it!
JR in WV
@? Martin:
True, and that was bad. But worse was the sea change in top management. For over 100 years AP wire service was managed by AP staff who were promoted (sometimes above their capacity to manage, but that’s a different story) into COB (Chiefs of Bureau), then to VP slots, and then to CEO. The AP was a non-profit co-op allowing newspapers to share stories with each other, as well as a news org that generated its own stories, photos, etc.
But when Lou Boccardi retired, he was the last old line AP staffer who ran AP after spending a career working in wire service positions. Then the non-profit management committee hired executives from Gannett Media Corp, holder of many smaller newspapers and publisher of USA Today to replace Big Lou and all the old-line AP staff working for Big Lou (so called partly because he’s really small).
These boys didn’t know the first thing about running a wire service, also didn’t know anything about running a non-profit co-op. So they started trying to use their co-op to turn a profit at the same time the paper media membership stopped showing a 32% annual profit. While the members wanted their dues lowered, The AP needed more money to support the Gannett boys in the style they needed to be living in.
So Rob Fournier was sucking up to the new management, and stabbing co-workers in the back to get one of the top news jobs in The AP, which given his total and complete lack of ethics and morals, he succeeded in, after much back stabbing and boss sucking-up.
Note that he didn’t last in that job, and is now working for a no-name outfit in Chicago. What goes around, comes around, in this case.
tufdaawg
i gave $5 to hitlery and also to the democratic opponent of my local house rep. (jeff denham is my rep. and he his hideous.)
Scott Alloway
@Suzanne: Time is the most valuable currency for a political campaign. Money buys limited time. Your phone calls, home visits, voter contacts are worth so much more.
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