Come for the politics, stay for the snark.

Let’s not be the monsters we hate.

Our job is not to persuade republicans but to defeat them.

Usually wrong but never in doubt

Perhaps you mistook them for somebody who gives a damn.

Why did Dr. Oz lose? well, according to the exit polls, it’s because Fetterman won.

I’d like to think you all would remain faithful to me if i ever tried to have some of you killed.

T R E 4 5 O N

If senate republicans had any shame, they’d die of it.

Schmidt just says fuck it, opens a tea shop.

We’ve had enough carrots to last a lifetime. break out the sticks.

The republican caucus is already covering themselves with something, and it’s not glory.

I like you, you’re my kind of trouble.

Red lights blinking on democracy’s dashboard

If you are still in the GOP, you are an extremist.

Give the craziest people you know everything they want and hope they don’t ask for more? Great plan.

But frankly mr. cole, I’ll be happier when you get back to telling us to go fuck ourselves.

Come for the politics, stay for the snark.

Since when do we limit our critiques to things we could do better ourselves?

John Fetterman: Too Manly for Pennsylvania.  Paid for by the Oz for Senator campaign.

Thanks to your bullshit, we are now under siege.

It’s always darkest before the other shoe drops.

We are aware of all internet traditions.

Some judge needs to shut this circus down soon.

Jesus, Mary, & Joseph how is that election even close?

You are here: Home / Economics / C.R.E.A.M. / Tuesday Evening Open Thread: SBF, So Busted Fraud

Tuesday Evening Open Thread: SBF, So Busted Fraud

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To be honest, my first thought was that SBF was being given over to US custody as a protective measure, not least for the Bahamas — unpleasant as being questioned by federal authorities might prove, it’s nowhere near the risk of being ‘disappeared’ at the hands of people who’ve had their billions in money-laundered funds vanish. And having newsworthy individuals snatched by mysterious figures, not a good look for any tourist destination!

Friday the 13th fell on a Tuesday this month…

Look at what they took from us!

Reader Interactions

81Comments

  4. 4.

    Scout211

    Here’s the list of charges in addition to the SEC fraud charges: Link

     

    Sam Bankman-Fried, the founder and former CEO of FTX and Alameda Research, could face up to 115 years in prison if convicted on all eight counts against him in a federal indictment unsealed Tuesday morning, according to congressional statutory maximum sentencing guidelines.

    The charges against him including wire fraud, wire fraud conspiracy, and conspiracy to commit money laundering, each carry a maximum prison sentence of 20 years, according to a press release from the US Attorney’s Office for the Southern District of New York.

    The crypto-trading platform founder could also see up to five years in prison for each count of conspiracy to commit commodities fraud and securities fraud, and conspiracy to defraud the United States and commit campaign finance violations, if convicted.

  7. 7.

    scav

    The cheerful guy yesterday seemed most surprised by the lack of documentation and not the unconventionality of the practices.

  8. 8.

    Nicole

    “Wirefraud”?  You know, I am again reminded that when you come down to it, most folk just aren’t very smart.

  10. 10.

    David ⛄ 🎅The Establishment🎄 🦌 🕎 Koch

    RIP Angel

    Stuart Margolin, who won back-to-back Emmys for his recurring role as Evelyn “Angel” Martin in The Rockford Files and racked up more than 120 career screen credits, died today, his stepson Max Martini said on social media. He was 82.

    Margolin won two Primetime Emmys for Outstanding Supporting Actor (in 1979 and 1980) for playing Rockford‘s Angel, a role he later reprised in a series of made-for-TV movies. His lengthy TV resumé includes roles on countless iconic TV shows, including The Fugitive, The Monkees, Bewitched, That Girl, The Partridge Family, The Mary Tyler Moore Show, Gunsmoke, M*A*S*H, Rhoda, Magnum P.I., NCIS and The X-Files.

    Great character actor, spanning “Kelly’s Heroes” to “Love, American Style” to “Death Wish” to “X-Files”.

  13. 13.

    sanjeevs

    BERLIN — The German prince accused of organizing a plot to overthrow the German government met at least once with Russian diplomats at a consulate in Germany, according to two people familiar with the investigation into the conspiracy, a meeting that investigators are examining to determine how aggressively the prince tried to involve Moscow in the plot.
    The two people also described striking new details about the plot, offering a dramatic portrait of how much planning the network had invested in its effort.
    Investigators told lawmakers that in the course of raids against the group, which targeted 150 locations across the country, they confiscated around 40 firearms. But they also found thousands of bullets for other weapons they have yet to locate, leaving police on the hunt for hidden caches of weapons.
    Three people familiar with the investigation — a lawmaker, a top aide to another lawmaker, and another German official — discussed details of the investigation on condition of anonymity because they were not authorized to speak about the case publicly. Lawmakers on certain parliamentary committees were briefed on the investigation Monday night.
    Prince Heinrich XIII of Reuss, identified as the designated leader of a shadow government the plotters had formed, had twice visited the Russian consulate in Leipzig, where he was said to have met with Russian diplomats, the people familiar with the investigation said. One of the visits occurred on Russia’s National Day in June, a lawmaker said.

    Prince Accused of Plot in Germany Is Said to Have Visited Russian Diplomats – The New York Times (nytimes.com)

    An actual coup investigation.

    Clear signalling to the public that this was serious criminality. Setting the narrative instead of allowing the criminals to do it.

    Homes searched and electronic devices seized and read within days. Mass arrests made and suspects held in custody.

    Not sure about the significance of the plotters visiting the Russian consulate on Russia day though. Does that mean the German plotters are more owned than the GOP July 4 crew or less.

  14. 14.

    JGreen

    @David ⛄ 🎅The Establishment🎄 🦌 🕎 Koch:

    Just saw the M*A*S*H episode he was on the other day (for the 100th time probably–the reruns will never go away).  He was a great example of what most actors are looking for–a regular chance to act, no matter what it was (TV, movies, etc.).  He may never have been a superstar, but he always seemed to be working and that’s what you want in that business.

  15. 15.

    Parfigliano

    Arrested?  But didnt this grifter just tell us he didnt intend any fraud.  Bad luck.

    Seems his Law Prof parents may have hit a bad patch at Stanford too.

  16. 16.

    Roger Moore

    The key thing about cryptocurrency is that it was invented to avoid government regulation. It should come as absolutely zero surprise that crypto as a whole is infested with criminals.  On the one hand, you have people who wanted to commit ordinary crimes and thought crypto would be a good way to hide their misdeeds.  On the other hand, you have con men who saw the lack of regulation as a perfect opportunity to commit all the kinds of financial crime we’ve been trying to squeeze out of the system since the invention of modern banking in the early 18th Century.  The only reason for anyone with any awareness to get involved is because they hoped to be the perpetrator rather than the victim.

  18. 18.

    Aussie Sheila

    @sanjeevs:

    Since the Russian invasion of UKR, I have often turned my mind to the links between Russia and German politicians and other right wing activists. While Russian interference in US elections is undeniable at this point, I suspect that the links between Russian revanchism and right wing European politics goes a lot further, deeper and to a far more dangerous level.

    I firmly believe that Putin money and influence played a large part in the Brexit vote, which has managed to knock back UK medium terms gdp growth back by 4 percentage points. Not a bad effort for a few hundred thousand pounds worth of roubles.

  21. 21.

    MattF

    My guess is that most US regulators were OK with just waiting for crypto to fail. This meant that some fools would lose their shirts, and some con artists would get away with various misdeeds, but that’s life.

  22. 22.

    Jim, Foolish Literalist

    Looks like TPM has dropped another tranche of the Meadows text collection …

    Josh Marshall @joshtpm. 30m

    Just amazing to me that first person to mention Jan 6 and key outlines of the plan in any of these texts was none other than Don Jr

    ETA: from the TPM story

    “The state legislature can take over the electoral process. Could you call Dick Morris … so he can explain how the problem could be solved by State legislators,” Meadows wrote.

    Until these stories started dropping, I thought Dick Morris had gone to his reward

  27. 27.

    MattF

    @Jim, Foolish Literalist: Dick Morris reappeared briefly, before the mid-terms, predicting that the coming Red Wave would be a cataclysmic, ‘extinction-level’ event for Democrats. Haven’t seen any post-election commentary from him.

  28. 28.

    sanjeevs

    @Aussie Sheila: Yeah Carole Cadwalladr did a lot of work on the Brexit Russia links before she was silenced by UK’s libel laws.

    Russia seems to have penetrated both the right and left in Germany.

  29. 29.

    Jeffro

    OT but had to share: Fro Jr just received his early decision college acceptance notice this evening!  He’s in!

    (me, I liked getting a letter in the mail back in the good ol bad ol days.  But an e-notification works too!)

    WHEW

  30. 30.

    trollhattan

    Did the “smartest guy in the room” check extradition laws before picking Bahamas for his Billionaire Dude Lair and Criming HQ?

    Just curious.

  31. 31.

    Scout211

    @Jim, Foolish Literalist: I loved that plan to spin the infamous call to Raffensperger as a Trump set-up to test Raffensperger to see if he would leak the call. Ha ha! I can see it now.  The “I meant to do that!” defense.  Yeah, that will fly.

  32. 32.

    schrodingers_cat

    I have a question for the hive mind. What is your opinion about airfryers? And which one would you recommend.

    Looking at Instant Pot’s vortex 5.7qt.

    and

    this 10 qt model

    I already have a fairly decent Black and Decker toaster oven that I use almost everyday (for toast, toasting spices and reheating the stuff that doesn’t reheat well in a microwave

    I am leaning towards the 5.9 qt model.

  34. 34.

    Miki

    Now & Then podcast has a great episode today – FTX, Con Men, & the Power of Grift.

    Here – hold my watch.

  36. 36.

    Aussie Sheila

    @sanjeevs:

    I suspect that the Russians have also penetrated deep into what passes for the left in the US. See the US Greens, the Grayzone f wits and various so called ‘lefty’ ytubers.

    Dems need to watch carefully in the next President election for voter suppression/discouragement efforts from these sources imo.

  38. 38.

    Roger Moore

    @Dorothy A. Winsor:

    Between Musk and Trump and this guy, I’m thinking rich people money isn’t like normal money. It’s partly just imaginary

    That’s exactly right.  We talk about “net worth” all the time, but the richer you are the less well defined that is.  I could probably sell all my stock and other negotiable commodities and convert it all into an amount of US currency small enough to carry on my person.  Even then, the actual value of my house is somewhat speculative until I actually sell the place.  The richer you are, the harder it is to do that kind of thing.

    For a billionaire, it’s pretty much impossible.  They can’t sell what they own without it changing the price drastically, and it’s hard for them to convert that much money into actual currency they could spend on stuff, or even into cash equivalents like a checking account.  It’s even harder for someone like Musk or Trump, where the value of their business is tied closely to their personal brand, so selling has an even bigger effect on the value of the business.

  39. 39.

    BruceFromOhio

    Sam Bankman-Fried planned to spend much of his time in front of Congress blaming others for the implosion of FTX, and the situation he now finds himself in.

    it’s always someone else. Always.

    I watched the indictment presser, what struck me is that it’s an indictment on taking the money and doing bad things. Nowhere is there an indictment of cryptocurrency itself. If you didn’t know what FTX was, you could’ve been watching an oil exec, a manufacturer or a retailer taking the money and doing bad things. Crypto was not in the indictment.

  40. 40.

    Splitting Image

    @David ⛄ 🎅The Establishment🎄 🦌 🕎 Koch:

    Stuart Margolin, who won back-to-back Emmys for his recurring role as Evelyn “Angel” Martin in The Rockford Files and racked up more than 120 career screen credits, died today, his stepson Max Martini said on social media. He was 82.

    I’ve been watching some of the first-season episodes of The Rockford Files recently. Margolin was excellent in them. That show in general has held up very well.

  42. 42.

    Barbara

    @sanjeevs: ​ This article . . .

    The raids also found more than 100 nondisclosure agreements, two of those people said, swearing signees to secrecy over the group’s plans, which involved storming the German Parliament and arresting its members, as well as killing the chancellor.

    They had an NDA. So while the German State isn’t “real” apparently it was real enough to enforce an NDA. I don’t know whether to laugh or cry.​​ I mean, how do you enforce an NDA about your plot to overthrow the state? “Well, your honor, I have been irreparably harmed because the secrecy of my plot was key to making it work.”

  43. 43.

    Ruckus

    @Dorothy A. Winsor:

    It’s between imaginary and actual cash.

    With effort (and sometimes a bit/lot of actual money) it can be converted into some form of actual money that those outside the imaginary money business will accept. It’s how SFB II is worth supposedly $251billion yet has to take out a sizable loan to spend $44billion. We all say it’s money but few will take it even as collateral unless the amount of imaginary money is enough to make up for the cost to convert it to actual money. Which is somewhat of an explanation of why it cost him $44billion rather than the $22billion original asking price. All that and the fact that he thinks a lot more of himself than many others do.

  45. 45.

    Barbara

    @MattF: And ask the judge just to ignore that his name appeared on a hit list of officials first to be taken out.

    Actually, they agreed that “enforcement” would be by assassination. There also apparently “were ongoing disputes among leading conspirators over cabinet positions in the shadow government they aspired to set up, the lawmakers said.” I mean, I think I can laugh at this one.

  46. 46.

    Ohio Mom

    I tried reading the NYT article on SBF’s parents but I couldn’t make myself care enough to finish it. They seem to be example number one of “they should have known better.”

  48. 48.

    Barbara

    @Ohio Mom: ​From what I understand, they have made a lot of money from his enterprise and at least some of it has been invested in property in Caribbean locations.

  49. 49.

    Barbara

    @trollhattan: My understanding is that the U.S. has applied a fair amount of pressure to get Caribbean nations to give up some of their non-extradition practices.  It’s much harder to pull of a Robert Vesco style escape these days, or so I have been led to believe.

  51. 51.

    KrackenJack

    @Barbara: That’s hysterical. “Consciousness of Guilt” anyone? Insert <taking notes on a criminal fucking conspiracy.gif>.

    The various flavors of Sovereign Citizens spend a huge amount of time constructing legal proofs that the state is illegitimate and arguing that in court. I guess if some court agrees, the Executive and Legislative branches will just vanish in a puff of judicial logic.

  52. 52.

    p.a.

    @Jim, Foolish Literalist:

    “The state legislature can take over the electoral process. Could you call Dick Morris … so he can explain how the problem could be solved by State legislators,” Meadows wrote.

     

    Someone write this in blood and send it to the 6 SCOTUS fascists, there’s a case in the pipeline claiming state legislatures can nullify elections.  Put the fear of dog in those scumbags.

  54. 54.

    Citizen_X

    some crypto billionaires get murdered by organized crime for losing their money

    Would it be in bad taste if I set gruesome police pics of the murder scenes to the piano part from Layla, and would that stop me anyway?

  56. 56.

    David ⛄ 🎅The Establishment🎄 🦌 🕎 Koch

    @MattF: ​

    Dick Morris, ‘The Worst Pundit of 2012’

    By DYLAN BYERS

    02/06/2013 11:38 AM EST

    With Dick Morris out at Fox News, it’s worth taking a look at the old pollster’s track record.

    Morris, who predicted until the end that Mitt Romney would win in a landslide, was the punch line of the 2012 presidential election. Slate’s Dave Weigel posits that “no single human made as many wrong, botched, bogus, and stupid predictions about the 2012 election as Dick Morris.”

  59. 59.

    gene108

    @Math Guy:

    Investing in crypto is betting on the future value of entropy. That is a losing bet.

    Being a crypto exchange wasn’t the biggest problem with FTX. It’s the ridiculous amount of self-dealing that went on that’d tank any business in any more established industry that caused its demise.

  60. 60.

    lowtechcyclist

    @schrodingers_cat: ​
     

    We’ve got an Ultrean (sounds like the name of an alien race from a 1960s SF novel, doesn’t it) which we’re happy with. We use it for air-frying stuff like tater tots and chicken nuggets, neither of which I normally like, but they actually taste good coming out of the air fryer.

  62. 62.

    Ohio Mom

    @Barbara: Yes and they are attorneys! I expect attorneys to be both skeptical and connoisseurs of worst case scenarios. That is how they protect their clients, by considering everything that could go wrong before it can and structuring things to prevent harm.

    Whether by greed or narcissism or self-entitlement or naïveté or some combination — the parents walked right into this. They should have known better.

  64. 64.

    VOR

    @schrodingers_cat: I have a Breville SmartOven with convection which also works as an air fryer. I don’t do a lot of air frying, but I have successfully fried home-made french fries in it. It works very well as just plain oven and is large enough to handle sizable dishes, not just frozen pizza. Mine is a few years old, but the current version is Consumer Reports top rated toaster oven. Not cheap – around $400.

  65. 65.

    gene108

    @BruceFromOhio:

    I watched the indictment presser, what struck me is that it’s an indictment on taking the money and doing bad things. Nowhere is there an indictment of cryptocurrency itself.

    FTX didn’t go belly up because it was a crypto exchange. It was a poorly run business. It was stupid Enron. Instead of using shell companies to mask his self-dealing, Blankman-Fried used FTX as collateral to borrow money for another business he owned right out in the open. He didn’t come close to even try to keep the two businesses as distinct legal entities. Then there’s the company money blown by Sam and top FTX executives on luxury homes in the Bahamas, ostensibly to have housing to move the work there.

    I know almost everyone on Balloon-Juice hates crypto, I don’t much care for it, but FTX was just an unbelievably poorly run business. An oil company, retailer, or any other traditional business that did what FTX did would go belly up sooner or later and the management and ownership would be facing criminal liability.

  66. 66.

    Barbara

    @schrodingers_cat: I have a small air fryer that my husband bought on impulse.  It does some things really well, and it’s easier to clean than the toaster oven.  But the air fryer itself isn’t terribly complicated, so I am not sure how they differ.  If you plan to use it for just daily cooking for your own household, it might not have to be so big.  Things I really like in the air fryer are eggplant, tofu, “fried” potatoes, hamburgers, chicken drumsticks, and roasted squash.

  69. 69.

    Steeplejack

    @schrodingers_cat:

    I have a friend who got an air fryer as a gift from her family. She was initially skeptical but now loves it. America’s Test Kitchen has a couple of very good air-fryer books, according to her.

  70. 70.

    Steeplejack

    @schrodingers_cat:

    Oops, didn’t see this when I answered your previous. In my experience, I’ve never gone wrong with an ATK recommendation. Even when I don’t take their recommendation, they provide good info that helps with my decision.

    I will reiterate that my skeptical friend really likes her air fryer now and uses it a lot.

  72. 72.

    jonas

    @Jim, Foolish Literalist: Unlike the Twitter Files, this shit is real! Not sure yet if it exposes any serious legal jeopardy, but damn, it sure has exposed the fact that a lot of Republican politicians, staffers, and consultants were straight up bugfuck insane. These are not normal people. I mean, Hunter Biden is the goddamn Dalai Lama compared to these cooks.

  73. 73.

    jonas

    @schrodingers_cat: ​
      We have a Ninja airfryer and are really happy with it. The only drawback is it’s one of those appliances you have to find storage space for and then haul out and make counterspace for when you need to fry something. But it does a great job on just about everything we’ve tried from french fries to fish sticks to calamari to roast cauliflower. It’s nice not to have to heat up the whole oven to make some roast cauliflower.

  74. 74.

    jonas

    @gene108: ​
      Shorter SBF: “Hey free money! Let’s dive into it and play like it was Uncle Scrooge’s money bin!”

    Except in, like, real life, it’s actually OPM and you can’t really do that. *Womp womp

  77. 77.

    trnc

    @Roger Moore: ​
     

    We talk about “net worth” all the time, but the richer you are the less well defined that is. 

    Yup. Required financial statements of many of our congress peeps show a net worth between “X million and XX million.” Having so much money you don’t even need to know that you’re within $50 million is way up on my list of anger triggers for tax cuts for the wealthy.

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