Make sure to check up on those you love, both family and friends
This time of year can be difficult for many people, especially those dealing with depression or anxiety.
You never know just how much a call or a text might mean to them.
Remember, you matter. ?? pic.twitter.com/TWozz5wH5c
— Muppet History ?? (@HistoryMuppet) November 5, 2023
News: President Joe Biden will meet w/ United Auto Workers President Shawn Fain during a visit to Illinois on Thursday to celebrate the restart of an idled Stellantis NV manufacturing plant and tout a historic agreement between the labor union and Detroit’s Big Three automakers
— Jordan Fabian (@Jordanfabian) November 7, 2023
"Seventy-one percent of Americans now approve of labor unions.
… the highest Gallup has recorded on this measure since 1965."https://t.co/p63VrcjkUH— Maddow Blog (@MaddowBlog) November 7, 2023
Exactly. Media widely reported that Trump's visit to autoworkers would spell trouble for Biden's reelect (w/some outlets falsely claiming Trump was appealing to strikers!). Now that UAW won after Biden aligned himself with the strike, there's been little followup analysis. Odd. https://t.co/xFxIxveo2z
— Greg Sargent (@ThePlumLineGS) November 5, 2023
How Biden navigated the perilous auto strike and lived, politically, to tell about ithttps://t.co/g4RqVynhgY
— Sam Stein (@samstein) November 6, 2023
Framed in the most ‘savvy’ Politico way possible, but still an interesting deep dive on the process — “What the UAW and Big 3 really thought of Biden’s picket line visit”:
Less than an hour before Joe Biden announced he’d join striking auto-workers on the picket line, one of his top aides broke the news to the car company executives being targeted.
Gene Sperling, the White House adviser who Biden had tapped to monitor the talks between United Auto Workers and the “Big Three” auto businesses, tried to be diplomatic. This was core to who Biden was, he explained. It didn’t mean the president was standing against the companies, he added, according to a person familiar with the discussions who was granted anonymity to reveal private talks. The CEOs weren’t happy.
A few days later, Biden became the first president in history to walk the picket line. A month after that, the UAW finalized tentative agreements with the Big Three that included historic raises for workers alongside extended benefits and other concessions.
Union officials say it was the striking workers, not the president, who were ultimately responsible for those record contracts. But several also credit Biden’s embrace — capped by his decision to stand with the strikers — for providing political cover that helped secure a deal.
That embrace was not without risk…
After UAW cut deals with Ford and Stellantis last month, White House aides were jubilant.
Within the West Wing, there was a sense that Biden’s approach had paid off and that the agreements would cement his legacy as a staunchly pro-labor president who is simultaneously committed to a green future with electric vehicles.
There was, however, one surprise left. The UAW announced that it was expanding its strike against GM — which momentarily caught the White House off guard. But then, Fain finalized a tentative agreement with the last of the Big Three companies on Monday.
Afterward, Biden spoke with him over the phone and congratulated him. The president also wished Fain a happy birthday.
Baud
Shawn Fain is apparently too dumb to realize that Biden is old.
rikyrah
Good Morning Everyone 😊😊😊
rikyrah
Biden is the most pro-labor POTUS in generations
Baud
@rikyrah:
Which is why he must lose.
Dorothy A. Winsor
@Baud: Every time I see Shawn Fain’s name, I initially misread it as Sinn Fein.
I know Biden has to consider the politics of joining the picket line, but I don’t think politics were what led him to do it. For him, it was the just thing to do.
Nukular Biskits
Good mornin, y’all, from beautiful San Diego.
OzarkHillbilly
Fuck ’em. They don’t want the serfs to get a cut of the spoils that resulted from the govt bailout of their industry. Next thing you know the autoworkers will be filing for unemployment when the inevitable layoff comes the next time the big 3 retool.
Yarrow
Hahahahahaha. Nope. That’s just a thing people say to make themselves feel better that they’ve “done something to help.”
This part:
Is too much work. Rare when it happens.
Another Scott
I don’t think there was much risk at all in doing what Biden did. The normies don’t pay much attention to this and figure a president doing something is part of her/his job or something that s/he thinks is a good idea. “Biden went to a picket line? Oh, Ok. What did we decide are we going to do about Junior’s teeth??”
This not-paying-much-attention gives a president a lot of leeway. The political junkies will argue about it and “what it means” but it’s background noise to most.
To be clear, it was good and right that Biden did that. It slowly changes the expectations of what’s “normal”. And it helps balance the power between labor and management, and that’s a long overdue thing.
Cheers,
Scott.
TeezySkeezy
@Yarrow: Are you gonna be that wellness check that sours a cop on the holidays and puts him back off the wagon? Geez.
Another Scott
Meanwhile, …
I don’t think Johnson’s brilliant idea of incremental CRs per department are going to work (as Jeffries says, the word for it is “shutdown”). But the MAGAts really, really don’t want to give up the hostage.
As many of us thought, putting some new fresh face with good hair at the top doesn’t change the dysfunction of the GQP in the House.
Qevin’s deal about a 1% cut every month come January if there isn’t a budget is still out there, officially, but since the GQP blew up the deal (by not keeping to the agreed top-line numbers), it’s not clear to me if it will actually happen that way. Dunno. Every new budget can modify previous terms and agreements.
Given all this, I expect a reasonably-clean CR next week to punt things into mid-January. I would like to think that Biden’s supplemental for Ukraine, Israel, Taiwan, etc., would happen soon as well, but it’s still early on that. There’s not a pressing deadline on that, yet…
The last scheduled day in the House this year is Thursday December 14. Lots may happen that last week.
We’ll see!
Cheers,
Scott.
p.a.
Massive generalization, but pretty accurate I think:
The American public: before the 1970’s, non-union worker would look at union workers and think, “they have what I don’t. I should get it too.”
Post-70’s: “they have what I don’t. Why should they have that!?!”
(Coincidence that the change came as industry moved South?)
About time that’s changing.
bbleh
@Yarrow: now now. It really CAN matter, speaking as someone who knows. Although it’s true a lot of people rarely think of it. Which leads me to: call me old-fashioned but I like holiday cards.
Scamp Dog
@Dorothy A. Winsor: You’re not the only one who does that!
bbleh
@Another Scott: Republicans keep saying they don’t want a shutdown …
They do indeed “keep saying” that. And yet somehow, somehow they never seem to manage to vote in any numbers against it. How could that possibly be? Truly a mystery for the ages …
And re Politico, srsly, for whom are these people writing? Yes access and in-group status are always factors, so there’s always going to be some writing for each other, but if it’s going to survive in the real world, there also has to be some writing for an outside audience, and … ??? Like pretty soon they’re going to suck entirely up into themselves, write only for “the trade” in gossip sheets like Punchbowl, and mass-market political journalism will simply disappear. Which … would be bad?
Scout211
And in other union news (reposted from last night) SAG-AFTRA has ended their strike with AMPTP. Link
Ceci n est pas mon nym
Compromise in MAGA world: “OK, instead of shooting the hostage with a full clip, how about only two bullets? And I’m willing to go down to one.”
Suzanne
@OzarkHillbilly:
Maybe I’m a bad American, but I hate these companies so much and I hate their cars and I don’t ever want to own one.
I have fire-breathing contempt for the Ford F series of trucks.
satby
@Yarrow: Ironically, one of my twin nieces just texted me to say she was thinking of me and my remaining sister on the first anniversary of her mother’s death today. And I replied, truthfully, that I think of her and her four siblings many days.
I’m sorry you have struggles and that you don’t seem to get the support you need. But you’ll get it here.
sdhays
@Another Scott: I’m assuming that we’re going to have a shutdown this time because Mike Johnson is a chucklefuck in over his head and is going to need to learn the hard way how weak his hand is.
Another Scott
There is great wisdom here!!
Cheers,
Scott.
sdhays
@Suzanne: I don’t hate them, but I don’t expect to ever own an American car. I know they’re better than they were when I was growing up, but I just don’t respect their engineering priorities. They always wait until it’s a crisis before doing the right thing. And they push the market in bad directions. Maybe I do hate them.
Japanese cars for me.
Betty Cracker
Our dogs cornered a raccoon in the yard yesterday evening and still seem freaked out about it. No one was bitten, thank FSM. The raccoon hissed and did mock-charges that scared Pete away, but Badger was being very terrier-like and stayed right on it. Bill sprayed it with a hose to try to drive it off. I think it wanted to go but was afraid to turn its back on Badger. I got my huge flashlight and lit it up, and that seemed to distract both combatants enough for the raccoon to make a hasty exit by leaping into the trees on the property line and dropping down on the other side of the fence. I hope it learned its lesson!
Nukular Biskits
@Suzanne:
May I ask why?
E.
I just applied for a horrible corporate baking job in TN and had to watch a video about how bad unions are for workers and what to do if approached by a union organizer. It was really awful. After the video I had to pass a test on it.
Nukular Biskits
@Betty Cracker:
Good thing y’all intervened.
Raccoons & dogs aren’t a good mix and seldom do combatants come out unscathed.
RandomMonster
Union work put me through college. I’m thrilled about that 71% approval for unions (if accurate)!
Eunicecycle
@E.: wow I suppose that’s allowed by the First Amendment or something (after all, corporations are people my friend) but that seems pretty shady.
Nukular Biskits
@Eunicecycle:
Was thinking the same thing.
narya
@rikyrah: And it makes me soooo happy to see it! I also think that both he and the unions have a really good frame for the whole thing: companies are making huge profits–the workers should get a piece of that. Throw in some exec compensation numbers, too. It’s clear, simple, and fair.
comrade scotts agenda of rage
@Dorothy A. Winsor:
Precisely my thoughts. I’ve always been a Biden supporter and in a lot of ways, I think waiting this long to get the job as been a huge advantage to him. In some ways he can say “I’m this old and have no more fucks to give” when somebody might try to talk to him about the “optics” of such a move. Moreover, he’s got *so* much experience, he knows the optics.
But ultimately, yeah, he does what he thinks is right, particularly when it comes to labor. My hope is that this represents a turning point and the next 20+ years are better for labor than the last 40+.
Betty Cracker
@Nukular Biskits: It was scary!
OzarkHillbilly
@Nukular Biskits:@Betty Cracker:
One time a fellow caver and I were crawling thru a human sized passage to rig a pit for a survey trip later that day. My buddy was in front and he kept hearing noises ahead of him. Eventually he realized there were coon tracks going into the cave in the mud ahead of him, but there weren’t any heading out.
I kept telling him, “Steve, it’s your call but remember, there are a lot of one eyed coon dogs in the world.”
We kept going for 3 or 4 hundred feet more and I must have repeated that sentiment at least once every 75′. Eventually we stopped to talk the situation thru, my face to his butt, there was no turning around right there.
And then, it happened. A raccoon jumped on my legs from behind me and I screamed like a little girl. Shit my pants something fierce and waited for the teeth to sink into my ass. And waited. I took my helmet off and was able to turn my head enough to see…
Snoop, a half weiner, half beagle dog belonging to another caver that had followed us in without our knowledge.
We were done after that and backed out leaving the rope and rigging for later that day.
Yarrow
@satby:
Not really. There are people in the valued commenter in-club here and people who are not. I am not. But I appreciate your kind thoughts.
OzarkHillbilly
@Eunicecycle:
@Nukular Biskits:
Just another day ending in “Y”.
Gin & Tonic
@sdhays: What is an American car? Is a Honda built in Tennessee by Americans an American car? Is a Ford built in Germany by Turks an American car?
laura
Labor’s demands for shared prosperity- especially after sacrifices to preserve their industries, is reasonable and easy for the public to understand. Voters want to vote for winners.
trnc
@p.a.:
Of course, the answer is that benefits obtained by strong unions work their way into non-union jobs.
Betty Cracker
@OzarkHillbilly: LOL!
Yarrow
@Betty Cracker: One night I was awakened at 2am by the next door neighbor dog absolutely losing his mind. Eventually he stopped barking. The following morning I checked with my neighbor. and it turned out there was a raccoon in his yard. He had put the dog out to do his business and didn’t know the raccoon was there. His dog cornered the raccoon. My neighbor did what you did – flashlight, hose – and eventually was able to get his dog away before they physically interacted. Thank goodness. His dog is sweet but goes absolutely crazy at the mailman, trucks and other dogs. And apparently raccoons.
3Sice
Toyota increased their wages by 9% last week.
lowtechcyclist
@Gin & Tonic:
You can train quality workers anywhere, and you can build the exact same factory anywhere. What’s important is the attitude of the people calling the shots. They’re the ones who will decide where the company comes down on tradeoffs between quality and short-term profits.
So my wife and I buy Hondas, and we don’t give a damn where they’re made.
cain
@OzarkHillbilly: What is there to be unhappy about? Their entire compensation package is miles ahead of any worker. Now that we are unstucking labor everywhere across the supply chain – it’s getting expensive – maybe they are unhappy they might have to lower their compensation to help pay for higher wages.
OzarkHillbilly
@Betty Cracker: I’ve been telling that story for almost 30 years. Dawg willing and the creek don’t rise, I’ll still be telling it 30 years from now.
cain
@Scout211: Yesterday, it seems that actor’s union also got a great deal according to Fran. A lot of major labor wins. I think that’s going to translate to votes. Funny how the white blue collar worker is still unhappy thanks to ‘wokeness’ – morons.
lowtechcyclist
@OzarkHillbilly: Other than bats (of course), I’ve never run into any animals underground. I’m quite happy for it to stay that way.
Never known of anyone bringing their pet into a cave, either.
OzarkHillbilly
@cain: It is lesson one in MBA class: Your employees are always over paid lazy fucks who are lucky to be working for the slave wages you are offering.
Kent
It is a complete scam. Here is how it works.
First you set your overall budget cap for the next fiscal year.
Then you implement rolling CRs that expire in the order you want them to from most critical (to Republicans) to least critical. With Defense and Agriculture coming first and the stuff you don’t want to fund coming last like the EPA, green energy, IRS, various social welfare programs.
Finally, you discover at the end of the process that you have run out of money for environmental protection and healthcare for children, or whatever. But hey, we already agreed to spending caps so it is out of our hands. Gotta put through massive cuts, whatcha gonna do? Pentagon is already funded so it all has to come out of the EPA and IRS budget.
narya
@Yarrow: I’m gonna push back a little. I can’t speak for others, but I know that there are commenters I like more (or less) than others, and I assume everyone has similar feelings–though likely their “lists” differ from mine. BUT! Part of what makes this my go-to place is that there is an amazing variety of opinion and experience, and that only happens if there are lot of people. I think of it as a stone-soup blog, and I’m glad there are so many folks, including you, who are bringing an onion or a clove of garlic or a carrot for the pot.
And I am sorry if you’re struggling; there is a lot going on, and probably some personal stuff as well. If I knew you in meatspace, I’d come out of my solitude to offer you a beverage or a walk.
smith
@OzarkHillbilly: Funny how employees are always a cost and never an asset. Unlike executives.
Betty Cracker
@Yarrow: Glad your neighbor was able to extricate the dog too!
We live in the woods and have seen our mutts react to a lot of different critters, including armadillos and possums, but I’ve never seen them go apeshit quite like that before. The ruff was standing up on their spines for hours.
OzarkHillbilly
@lowtechcyclist: Another time I was checking out a hole to see if it went anywhere. Belly crawled in, my back scraping the ceiling, when all of a sudden I was engulfed in a horde of creepy crawlies and, according to the guys I was with, I screamed like a little girl and set the land speed record for belly crawling in reverse.
Once I got out I could see that it was just a couple hundred cave crickets, not the much feared piranha salamanders that inhabit some Ozark caves.
eta, most folks don’t cave with their dogs but some dogs don’t understand that.
geg6
@Betty Cracker:
Badger and Bill, crime fighting duo!
Old Dan and Little Ann
@Betty Cracker: That’s where my handle comes from! Old Dan and Little Anne chasing raccoons in Where the Red Fern Grows. : )
Yarrow
@narya:
Thank you. That’s very kind. Yes, a lot going on and so much in my RL that if I mention any of it to anyone they usually start backing away slowly. Not making that up. It’s happened often enough that I expect it and have learned not to say anything.
Pretty much anyone who hears what I’m dealing with gets an utterly overwhelmed look on their face and can’t handle hearing about it. Not that they’ll offer to help in any way. Nooooo, couldn’t do that. They’ll either tell me I’m doing a great job, and apparently that’s them being supportive, or they’ll tell me how I’m doing it all wrong and I should do this or that. I’m not sure how they think that’s helping. But mostly no one is there or reaches out in any way. They don’t want to know.
That’s why I crack up at the “you matter” statements on social media. Hahahahaha. No. People don’t want to know. That’s a platitude designed to make the person who wrote it feel better about themselves because they “did something.”
Ken
Given the oddities of his banking, I’m curious about this trust arrangement. Is he allowed to use his brain, or is it wholly under control of the trustee?
Joking aside, I do wonder who’s in this brain trust.
Suzanne
@Nukular Biskits: I hate the F trucks because I associate them with the worst kind of assholes — because I frequently see them owned by the worst kind of assholes. The people who speed on the highway and act like owning a big vehicle gives them the right to cut people off and endanger pedestrians and cyclists. The people who park across multiple parking spaces to protect their paint job. The people who buy a truck because it “looks cool” but never use it for actual, you know, work. The people who will buy a vehicle that gets 10 mpg and then complain about gas prices. The kind of people who oppose quality public transit because they want to be in their own vehicle all the time. The people who spit chewing tobacco out the window.
And I hate that Ford decided that these trucks were pretty much the only things worth making and selling, and they stopped production of small cars.
Considering that trucks have gotten so large that pedestrians are now in increased danger (heavier, higher bumper heights, etc.)…. I basically consider it antisocial to own one of them. The smaller, older trucks…. awesome. One uses a big truck to haul your landscaping equipment? Great. One buys an extended cab monstrosity to work through your masculinity issues and class anxiety? Get fucked.
Baud
@Yarrow: FWIW, I’m with you. I don’t share my personal struggles here. Not because of anything in the way this community has responded to me or others, but because of my experience with people in real life. I hope whatever you’re going through is as transitory as possible.
Ken
XKCD offers a solution. (Be sure to read the title text.)
Mai Naem mobile
@Dorothy A. Winsor: i can’t believe his parents named him Shawn having Fain as a last name.
3Sice
@smith:
Has there been any benefit in dumping management training costs off on higher education for American institutions?
narya
@Yarrow:
That’s so hard. Sometimes I just want to say things out loud, to try to put it in words, so I can sort it out–I don’t want an evaluation of my performance. Sometimes I want an acknowledgement that this is a shit sandwich without the bread–a simple, “wow, that sounds really difficult” will suffice. Doesn’t fix anything, but makes me feel a tiny bit less alone. I wish I could offer something other than kind thoughts–and I will strenuously avoid suggestions.
TeezySkeezy
@Yarrow:
Seriously, I was a bit flip earlier, but it’s a “I get to make those jokes” situation, okay? Been there, several times, probably will be again, and for real reasons…so we get to make those jokes, right? Happy shiny people don’t get to.
trollhattan
@Suzanne:
Not everybody driving a truck is an asshole, but we’ve drifted to the point every asshole drives a truck and god, have they ever become ginormous. A Tacoma now seems the size of a standard truck of yore, while the Tundra has attained the size of an iceberg, ditto MARs, F-Num-fiddys and Silverados. Then, because stock is boring, time to jack that sucker up to cloud-scraping heights.
Ask me what I really think.
smith
Well, MBAs have become legendary for their astute reasoning and effective management, right? I’d say major league sports get a much better ROI on leeching off collegiate sports programs than the C suite does on business schools. Or maybe they are getting the results they actually want?
Citizen Alan
@RandomMonster: I wholly attribute the fact that I grew up in a 3BR house that was fully paid off and at one point had 4 paid-off cars in the front driveway, and also the fact that there was never any question of me going to college, to the fact that both my mother and father had good Union paying. Jobs.
The Very Reverend Crimson Fire of Compassion
@Yarrow: So how are you? It matters to me. I can’t give you a rational argument to support that perspective, but it’s what I got.
geg6
@Mai Naem mobile:
I was thinking it was on purpose. If my maternal grandmother had had the chance to do such a thing, she would have.
Frankensteinbeck
@trollhattan:
Somebody did research on this, and the vast majority of pickup trucks are never used to carry things. Conservatives use them as a cultural marker, I guess because they associate them with manly men doing physical labor in rural environments.
Suzanne
@trollhattan:
Right. I hate the F trucks especially hard because they semiotically encompass all of that bad behavior I just described. I try not to be judgy about their owners, until they reveal who they are.
But, like, I would never, ever, in a million years buy one. To me, they are the epitome of bad taste. They are, like, those Trump boat parades, but on the road. Tacky and try-hard-y and self-absorbed.
catclub
I can promise you that a nice looking, small station wagon (possibly clean diesel) built in Europe ain’t never coming to the US.
Immanentize
@Suzanne: Trucks are now just cars with useless beds so that the automakers can avoid CAFE standards.
I have this graphic I send friends I complain to about the F-150 ratios of cab to bed from 1961-2021. I’ll write the findings for y’all:
Years — cab% / bed %:
61-79 — 36/64
80-97 — 40/60
97-03 — 50/50
04-15 — 60-40
15-21 — 63/37
It is almost impossible to buy a two-door, front seat(s) only cab with a useful bed anymore. Most companies DO NOT make anything but four door cabs for retail. Only specialty “utility” trucks for fleet sales to DPWs etc. come with a two door option with a bed that might hold a sheet of ply flat.
I hate the truck frame everything that “car” manufacturers now rely on for profits and pollution.
Immanentize
@Mai Naem mobile: Have you never met any Irish people?
Matt McIrvin
@p.a.: The crises of the 60s-70s and the conservative movement that followed had everyone thinking as crabs in the bucket. Lost faith in public goods and collective action– if something was wrong it was because someone else was getting goodies they didn’t deserve.
BethanyAnne
I was lucky when I lived in Berkeley to go to a Unitarian church there. Mostly I went to a weekly night meeting called the Numinous Circle. It was a talking circle – we did an opening prayer, and then sat in silence until someone felt moved to speak. You took the time you needed, but were mindful of the time you took. When you were done, we moved around the circle. If you weren’t ready, we’d come back. But the crucial rules were, one, that there was no crosstalk. You listened in supportive silence, and didn’t use your time to address what anyone else had said. And two, you kept what was said in the circle confidential. The only exception we allowed was if you said you were going to hurt yourself.
It was amazing. You could talk without planning what you were going to say, and without preparing for the response to whatever response you would get. More than once, someone would say something along the lines of “and I’m gay”, and burst into tears, having never said it out loud before. Or never having admitted it to even themselves.
It taught me so many things. It taught me to actually really listen. It taught me to say I’m trans. It taught me to never trust the official figures on sexual violence. Even RAINN’s estimate of 1 in 4 people is way low.
I still miss it. If there was a Unitarian Church near me, I’d consider founding a local circle.
Gin & Tonic
@Frankensteinbeck: And now a $1,000 e-bike is an elitist toy, while a $50,000 pick-em-up is a working-class necessity.
surfk9
@trollhattan: I have a big ass Silverado that I use to pull my 3 1\2 ton trailer. It does great towing but I hate driving it otherwise so it sits in my driveway next to my trailer most of the time.
Suzanne
@Immanentize: So some of the municipalities in the Phoenix area actually require, by code, wider drive aisles in parking lots and oversized parking spaces (some as long as 24’) because so many people drive these utter douchemobiles. And they complained to the various city councils about it. It’s fucking terrible. When you multiply that increase across a whole parking lot, it makes more paved area to get hot and block plants, more cost to build every project, more distance for pedestrians to cross. And I’m talking retail parking lots, hospitals, schools, everywhere. I hate truck culture. Hate it.
BethanyAnne
I loved the size and look of the old Dodge Dakotas. They were damn near exactly what I’d want in a truck. My brother had a Dodge Rampage, which now seems just precious.
OzarkHillbilly
Heh. The only time I drive my truck is when I am hauling stuff, driving off road, thru snow and ice, or can’t use my wife’s car for one reason or another. I last had the oil changed in February, and just hit the 5,000 mile mark last week.
Gin & Tonic
@catclub: Some Ford models sold in the Us are manufactured in Germany, as for example the Focus (a small sedan.)
geg6
@Suzanne:
That’s how I feel about all trucks and SUVs. IMHO, they should all be outlawed unless you can show proof that you have a legitimate need for it.
Immanentize
@Yarrow: It is funny about who people think are “in” the valued commenter group. Funny because I have always valued what you brought and figured, therefore, you must be a valued commenter to most! I know, vain perspective, but I am telling it true!
Meanwhile, too much has gone on in the last few years for me, and just recently (as in the last few days) as well, for me to feel entirely stable. It seems you and I may be travelling similar, if completely unique and separate, paths. It is not a sunny way, but I know more than I did before that it is a fairly well travelled highway. And people shy away from me not because they dont want to help, but because my toils are just reminders of theirs and that they really can’t bear another grief upon their shoulders which is what my story would be to them. So, I look for those few — friends, relatives, even co-workers on occasion — who can maybe tolerate helping with some discreet aspect of my overall mire. And each one is a great relief to me.
And people here also do that, if only by telling me about the great weener dog racoon attack in the deep tight spot if ever there was one.
E.
@Immanentize: It’s not only trucks. Getting consumers to value form over function is critical to a healthy late capitalist system. It cannot grow by selling people what they need, only by selling what they don’t need. Eventually it becomes necessary to have and display and brag about and live among things we don’t need, and to feel terrible anxiety if we can’t accumulate enough of them.
The truck thing is a sublimely stark example of this principle.
catclub
@Immanentize: Of course it is more complicated when those terrible trucks are made by Unionized workers.
I suspect trucks are also the most profitable part of their lines.
Not to mention the CAFE standards loophole.
BethanyAnne
Oh, and I think pissing off the liberals is mostly the point of the current crop of bro-dozer monstrosities.
Immanentize
@OzarkHillbilly: I think I told the folks here once that my spite hobby is looking in the beds of these shiny trucks to see if they were ever used to “haul” anything other than groceries or air.
catclub
The next step is getting them to buy ‘experiences’ like Taylor Swift concert weekends. Nothing physical at all.
BethanyAnne
@catclub: They are. And the F250 has been the best selling vehicle in America for over 50 years at this point. The Chevy is right up there with it, if you add the Chevy and GMC models together.
Suzanne
@geg6: It blows my mind, how much people spend on these things, and then whine about gas. I drive a Honda CR-V, 4-cylinder, 2-wheel drive. I carry kids and dogs and groceries and the wagon and sports equipment and 99% of the time, it’s great. The other 1% of the time, I rent a U-Haul or 4-wheel drive or whatever.
Tim Ellis
@Mai Naem mobile: As an Irish American whose family is from the north, I extremely believe it and am in fact a bit jealous lol
OzarkHillbilly
@Immanentize: I am not a “car/truck” person, one who dotes on their precious, washing and waxing it once a week whether it has left the driveway or not. Which is not to say I can’t appreciate the beauty of a red ’68 2+2 Mustang or a canary yellow ’72 Camaro, it’s just not a thing I am going to spend any time on. If you saw my truck in a parking lot, you’d probably cross to the other side for fear of catching something if you got too close, never mind actually looking in the back.
And you are dead on about the full sized beds. This truck is my first with a 6′ bed and I hate it. If I ever buy another it will have an 8′ bed.
andy
@Suzanne: Yep. I can’t believe people are paying luxury car money for useless trucks. they’re too big, too high off the ground, and most of them have those ridiculous short boxes. I only see them doing all the terrible things you mentioned plus gunning their engines at pedestrians who aren’t crossing fast enough, rolling coal, and flying trump and parody “american” flags.
Immanentize
@Tim Ellis: what I cant believe is that they named him “Shawn” instead of “Sean.”
My cousin (who was best man at my wedding) and his wife had identical twin boys that they named “Sean” and “John” (who they call Jack.) How Irish is that? When talking to him about “SeanJohn” (which I called them until they were discernable) I mentioned that “Sean” and “John” were the same name…. He said, “Just dont tell my mother that, OK?”
geg6
@catclub:
As someone who does these sorts of things, gifting experiences, I am puzzled why it’s such a bad thing. I would think most people treasure experiences over material things. My nieces (22 and 30, respectively) treasure these experiences they have with me, sometimes doing things like going to a Taylor Swift or Green Day concert or an evening in the city to see a musical and have dinner. They much prefer those outings as gifts from me than the Amazon gift card they’d get otherwise. And it gives us something to look forward to doing and to time with each other. It’s one of the great things about being an aunt, as far as I’m concerned. I’ve been doing this for Christmas and birthdays ever since their mothers agreed to let me take them to such events (around ages 8 or 9). My nieces love it! People should do this more.
p.a.
With its usual glacial reflexes the US automakers are responding to a market need (ummm, or are they creating a new market for high-margin vehicles?) by reintroducing “smaller” trucks. Ford Ranger, Maverick, Chevy ¿? Colorado I think?
Still larger than the late lamented Rangers, S-10s, Dakotas that were nice for homeowner/DIYers, not professional tradesmen & contractors.
Immanentize
@p.a.: not one of those comes in a two door model.
They are still just big cars with open trunk space for luggage.
catclub
@geg6: I did not say it is a bad thing. If we are not going to burn up and consume all physical resources, then buying non-physical things is a good thing.
catclub
I, on the other hand, spent enough to buy a small mercedes every year ( or its equivalent) for four years of college for our child. That was my indulgence.
I am not going to force people who buy trucks to spend money on a college education _if they don’t want that_.
gvg
@Suzanne: I owned a truck and am thinking about one again. I am single, rarely have anyone in the car with me and I am serious about gardening. that means I want to bring home loads of fresh horse manure and cubic yards of mulch. Lots of plants. I also like furniture hunting and fixing up things and even though I have a minivan, there are limits to what I can fit through the doors. Right now I am couch hunting and it looks like I may have to rent a truck if I find one I like which runs to big modern room to sprawl out in it. I don’t go off road and I don’t want to tow something but I have helped build a shed and brought home large construction plywood sheets and lumber which involved relatives using their trucks and trailers. Most people I know with trucks so things with them, just not all the time. The past gas milage has sucked, but cars just can’t do some things too. I’d like something that could unfold like a transformer and be multitool vehicle, but we don’t have that.
Ford has a new small truck called the Maverick that sounds kind of like the old Ranger (which is now bigger). The Maverick has a hybrid variant with supposedly something like 50 mpg. I am interested. Rumors are there might be an EV version. The ones out now are selling so well the price is rising and other companies are bringing back small trucks (I have read) I have just heard about this so I am not really sure and safety record is going to matter to me also, plus repair record. But small trucks coming back is a good sign IMO.
gene108
@Yarrow:
I’ve had trouble with depression most of my life, including a suicide attempt and hospitalization.
I’ve been where you are. It’s next to impossible to get the people that care to be able to find ways to be emotionally supportive. For me, my family just hasn’t gone through the depths of depression I have. Some feel compelled to offer advice and others are in their own moment – how are their kids doing, what’s on the grocery list, am I ready for the presentation at work, etc. – and cannot disengage to give their full attention if I want to talk.
I’ve just come to accept there’s no one to talk to when I get really depressed and find my ways to trudge through.
It’s rough, because most people don’t understand chronic depression or major depressive episodes, and don’t know how to effectively help.
Things get better. The bad “weather” in your life doesn’t last forever and will pass. Just remember this and trudge through. Better days will come.
catclub
You may be referring to a trailer hitch and a trailer. Pulled by a Trabant,
Sure Lurkalot
Where were all you anti-truck peeps on yesterday’s late night thread where many folks were drooling over the $80-$100,000 Rivians? A “normal” sized truck whose grille comes up to my (average five-four) shoulder?
I admit to being out of touch with the zeitgeist but I do not understand the popularity of the pickup truck as a “regular” commuter vehicle.
Soprano2
@Yarrow: Unfortunately it is too rare. My therapist asked me last week how I felt with the holidays coming up. I told her mixed feelings, but mostly I just want them to be over because ever since my sister died I haven’t enjoyed them that much, and now it’s worse. She said she wants to do some grief work with me to help with it. I guess I’ll find out what that’s like today. I know you said you don’t have much time, but if there is any way at all you can access therapy I would encourage you do to it. The journey you’re on is a hard one, you need whatever support you can find.
Mr. Bemused Senior
@Yarrow: @Soprano2:
I’m grateful for the welcome I received from the community here. Also grief counseling helped me.
Yarrow
@TeezySkeezy: Nope. Because I would never call to bother anyone and no one will check on me. So no worries there. Your comment is the perfect illustration of why I won’t say anything to anyone. I’d just ruin their day.
Sorry to have said anything and bothered anyone.
Juju
@geg6: I do that kind of thing with my nieces as well. I went to NYC with one for her Christmas present, we went a week before Christmas and spent one night, we took the train from Albany to and from and we had the time of our lives together. She had been there a number of times with her parents, so she knew the ropes, and it was great. Aunties can be a lot more fun than parents. I spent more money in one day than I had on dental care or car repair and it was one of the best times I’ve ever had. I don’t regret a thing. We’re thinking of doing that again sometime but with more nieces and Aunties.
mrmoshpotato
@Another Scott: Yes.
mrmoshpotato
@Betty Cracker: Glad to hear all turned out well!
Ceci n est pas mon nym
@OzarkHillbilly:
First tickles of claustrophobia started about here…
Heart starting to pound… trouble breathing…
Full blown claustrophobia now kicking in. This story is going to haunt me for the rest of the day.
I’m only kidding a little. I can hardly stand even hearing descriptions of caving. There’s no way I would actually crawl through a space like that, especially without the ability to turn around.
I made the mistake a few months ago of clicking on a YouTube video about somebody who died in a narrow tunnel (he was not in the tunnel locally known as “the birth canal” but thought he was, and pressed on to the point of no return), and that story DOES haunt me.
SFBayAreaGal
@gvg: I loved my Mazda pickup truck. Small, great on gas, and was able to haul a lot of stuff.
Soprano2
@Yarrow: Please ignore that, most people here aren’t like that!
TeezySkeezy
@Yarrow: didnt bother me. Takes more than that.
Suzanne
@gvg: Mavericks aren’t new…. I had a friend in high school who had one. It was the late 90s and the car was probably 1975 model year? It was great for the kind of thing you’re talking about. It was definitely small in comparison to today’s vehicles. Not much bigger than a station wagon.
The Ford F series is for cosplaying as someone who does real work. Not for real work.
Paul in KY
@sdhays: Had a (Korean) 2016 Genesis 3.8. Really nice big car that looked like a pseudo-Bentley. Probably got out of some speeding tics due to cop thinking I was actually driving a Bentley & that if he/she ticketed me I’d just lawyer up. Anyhoo, it got up to about 85,000 miles and started having bad electrical problems. This thing has alot of electrical. Used the gigantic AGM battery, etc. I managed to get it running & then traded it in and got a 2019 Avalon. Has a ‘regular’ battery in engine bay & not in trunk. More my type of car. Probably Japanese for rest of my life.
Paul in KY
@OzarkHillbilly: That is a fine story!!! Jeezus!
Paul in KY
@Mai Naem mobile: Maybe they were/are partial to Sinn Fein?
Paul in KY
@Yarrow: I do hope things in general get better for you.
Paul in KY
@Ceci n est pas mon nym: I’m a bit claustrophobic myself (maybe not as bad as you are), but for me it was spaces I might think could collapse on me or I might run out of air, etc. When I was in a cave, I would just look at all that rock & think it was not going to collapse & I’d be fine.
Miss Bianca
@Suzanne: *looking at the F250 sitting in the driveway, peeling paint and mud-splashes and dings in the bed, sighs sadly, thinking, ‘and to think, when D wanted to buy it, all I cared about was, ‘can it pull a horse trailer?’*!
ETA: It can, btw. Which we haul primarily because the local recycling center uses them for can drop-off at the dog park. Yay for our TruckShip! :)
Soprano2
@Yarrow: I got mad the other day because when I took hubby to the hospital for the blood test the doctor was supposed to order, it hadn’t been ordered. When I called their office the next morning, I twice used the line “Yes, please do that, because I don’t want to waste my time again”. I get so, so, so tired of people not doing their jobs such that I have to check to make sure they did it. My life is scheduled to within an inch of its life most days, I don’t have time to try to do things I can’t do. Work is the only normal part of my life these days, so much so that I’m considering extending the time until I retire because at least that’s still normal.
Soprano2
@narya: I told someone who went through a similar experience with their mother and dementia about an experience I had with my husband that was upsetting; all I wanted was some sympathy or empathy, but instead I got lecturing (it’s just going to be like that from now on, you’d better get used to it) and all kinds of suggestions for things I already knew to do. Now I know not to ask her for any kind of sympathy, because she has none to give. Sometimes it’s about knowing who can give you what.
Mr. Bemused Senior
@Soprano2: Of course I know you only from what I read here, and your mother not at all. You are the best judge of what to expect from her. I offer my best wishes for you both.
BellyCat
@Baud:
@Yarrow:
What Baud said. My conclusion is that people generally would *like* to be supportive but lack the skills to actually be supportive. And the more drastic or dire the situation, the more terrified they are of engaging it.
It’s kind of a “social willful blindness” and it’s devastating and isolating to the person undergoing significant challenges. If you can find one or two people to just listen (paid or not) that can sometimes help. Adulting is hard, damnit.
Miss Bianca
@Soprano2: Not to make light of your situation, because it sounds horrendous, but it does remind me of my all-time favorite Peanuts cartoon – wish I could find it, I can only paraphrase:
Peppermint Patty is complaining about something to her best friend Marcie, who immediately begins giving her a list of suggestions to try to take care of the situation, until Peppermint Patty wheels on her and shouts, “Marcie, don’t you understand that when people complain about something, they don’t want SOLUTIONS, they want SYMPATHY!”
To which Marcie responds: “No, sir, I don’t understand that.” (And then the inevitable punchline: “Stop calling me ‘sir’!”)
Anyway, I think it’s stuck with me all these years because it revealed a fundamental truth about people and their responses to things in a way I hadn’t thought of before – as Charles Schultz so frequently managed to do.
Soprano2
@p.a.: We have a 1987 S-10 pickup that looks like hell. I’ve had several people try to buy it from me because they don’t make them like it anymore.