Come for the politics, stay for the snark.

Lick the third rail, it tastes like chocolate!

Let there be snark.

Republicans don’t lie to be believed, they lie to be repeated.

The gop is a fucking disgrace.

The republican ‘Pastor’ of the House is an odious authoritarian little creep.

The snowflake in chief appeared visibly frustrated when questioned by a reporter about egg prices.

Why is it so hard for them to condemn hate?

Republicans want to make it harder to vote and easier for them to cheat.

The line between political reporting and fan fiction continues to blur.

Republicans cannot even be trusted with their own money.

We will not go quietly into the night; we will not vanish without a fight.

Hi god, it’s us. Thanks a heap, you’re having a great week and it’s only Thursday!

Michigan is a great lesson for Dems everywhere: when you have power…use it!

We know you aren’t a Democrat but since you seem confused let me help you.

Shallow, uninformed, and lacking identity

This year has been the longest three days of putin’s life.

So fucking stupid, and still doing a tremendous amount of damage.

The press swings at every pitch, we don’t have to.

The words do not have to be perfect.

Since when do we limit our critiques to things we could do better ourselves?

T R E 4 5 O N

When you’re in more danger from the IDF than from Russian shelling, that’s really bad.

Thanks to your bullshit, we are now under siege.

There are some who say that there are too many strawmen arguments on this blog.

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Saturday Morning Open Thread: We Cherish Our Wins

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Saturday Morning Open Thread: Cherish Our Wins 2

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Saturday Morning Open Thread: Cherish Our Wins 1

Saturday Morning Open Thread: Cherish Our Wins

(Ann Telnaes via Washington Post)

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279Comments

  3. 3.

    NotMax

    Noting that the rarely on the roster Shoah airs today at noon Eastern time on TCM N.B.: It’s four and a half hours long so if at all interested may want to DVR it for viewing in smaller chunks over time.

  4. 4.

    p.a.

    Death by 83 million cuts.

    W didn’t elicit the same worship as the Orange Shitstain, but only in degree, not type.  He too was thought to be Jeebus’ agent on earth.  So I think the O.S’s support will chip away with each loss.  Higher floor than W, but the mentality of his followers is “make us feel like winners, no matter how much shit we have to swallow”.  And his losing will affect some of them.  And if Haley’s $$$ holds up as she sets up for ’28 by attacking him, even better.

  7. 7.

    TBone

    The really important thing is, he’s been forced to face consequences by a WOMAN and a JURY of regular Americans. The Find Out stage has only just begun!

  8. 8.

    The Thin Black Duke

    Maybe this is OT, but I wish some folks would stop talking about leaving the US if Trump wins steals the presidency. Some of us don’t have that option.

  9. 9.

    TBone

    @NotMax: my name used to be Cwik before stepdad formally adopted me.

    lidsky.org/

    “The Nazis issued a document, called a “shine”, to those who worked. Owners of shines would not be taken away in “actions” and sent to camps. If a man had a shine, he was allowed to write his wife’s name on it, and she would be safe from deportation as well. Even though the twins were single, at various times they “married” women in the ghetto to protect them. In one instance, the 21 year old Alexander “married” a 70 year old woman.”

  11. 11.

    Ohio Mom

    @NotMax: There are many parts of that movie I still remember clearly, or clearly enough.

    The one I refer back to the most is the train conductor who rode with trains full of cargo before the Shoah, then with trains full of people headed to concentration camps, then back to trains full of cargo after the war ended. Didn’t matter to him what was in the train, he put in his day’s work, went home to his family, and was satisfied with that. Just a shrug of his shoulders for the time spent transporting humans.

    And the scenes of the Poles who had nothing but taunts and distain for their former Jewish neighbors. So much casual antisemitism.

    Anyway, I can only agree, it is a movie worth seeing.

  12. 12.

    Princess

    @The Thin Black Duke: And a lot of people who think they have that option, don’t. Unless you already have another passport, immigration is getting harder not easier. And most people aren’t very good at being immigrants. It’s tougher than people think. Americans would do better to think about how to collectively save their country rather than on finding individual escape paths.

  15. 15.

    Scout211

    The truth social post that was posted to his account yesterday and this one an hour later,

    There is no longer Justice in America. Our Judicial System is Broken and Unfair!

    were most likely not authored by Trump. They are not angry screeds and are oddly quite sedate. Giving Trump credit for not angrily going after E. Jean Carroll in his truth social last night is ridiculous. If Maggie was honest, she would write that his social media team is not attacking  her.  But the media wants to give Trump the credit for not immediately acting out his rage.

    ETA:  Someone stopped him from posting his rage.  He doesn’t have that kind of control over his reactions. He does not deserve the credit, IMHO.

  21. 21.

    comrade scotts agenda of rage

    @Ohio Mom:

    And the scenes of the Poles who had nothing but taunts and distain for their former Jewish neighbors. So much casual antisemitism.

    Those scenes were absolutely chilling.

    When we subsequently moved to our tiny town in Central Misery, we had a neighbor with that same kind of mindset (had nothing to do with antisemitism tho).  I always said that she was the kind of person that if we were Jews in a Ukrainian village in 1942, she’d turn us into the Germans in a nano-second.

  26. 26.

    TS

    @Scout211:

    There is no longer Justice in America. Our Judicial System is Broken and Unfair!

    Imagine if SCOTUS wasn’t bending over backwards to help him – we really might see some justice for those who have been impacted by trump. How many can take every last whinge to the SCOTUS and have their crying heard?

  31. 31.

    Ken

    Oh, great. The tweet by Keith Boykin (“Trump now has: 91 felony counts 11 aides convicted… And is on trial for fraud.”) has re-inserted the “Twelve Days of Christmas” earworm in my skull. And I only just recovered from the holidays.

  32. 32.

    schrodingers_cat

    @The Thin Black Duke: Agreed completely. Not everyone can leave or wants to leave. If the US goes to hell in a handbasket, every part of the world will feel those tremors. The post war architecture of world, the UN, NATO, different treaties about trade etc depend on the US. If that stability is upended, it will be felt EU,  Canada or other anglophone countries. No part of the world will be immune.

  33. 33.

    Uncle Cosmo

    @TBone: “Shine” in English sounds like the German Schein, which might have been short for Fahrschein, “ticket,” which seems to make sense, particularly if the holder was allowed to put other names on it, as in “write one’s own ticket.”

  38. 38.

    mrmoshpotato

    Hahaha!  Look at that tiny-handed manbaby!

    Donnie, can you hold your own bottle, or are your hands too tiny?

  41. 41.

    BC in Illinois

    When the movie Shoah came out, I was unable to se it. I bought the book. 1985. It has the complete words and subtitles of the film, in under 200 pages.

    It had an impact that endures to this day. Like the movie, the book is especially good to give to people who don’t want to see the pictures of the Holocaust, but want to understand. It is chilling — and, today, too familiar — to read.

    You can get the 1995 edition from Amazon and others. I recommend Thriftbooks.

  45. 45.

    Another Scott

    @Princess:

    It’s tougher than people think.

    +1

    Trouble is, of course, people (and the press) often don’t think about it.

    Anyone who has had to move across town knows what a hassle it is. The idea that it is somehow easy, or even fun, to pack up, leave everything behind, and start over in a new country is nonsensical.

    People who are willing to move to a new country are highly motivated and driven. They have to be to put in the work to make it happen.

    “Yeah, I’ll move to, say, Costa Rica, and everything will be easy and great! No problems!”

    U.S. citizens don’t need a tourist visa to enter Costa Rica. U.S. citizens can stay in Costa Rica for 90 days without any permit. And if you want to stay longer? You can do something called “perpetual tourism.” For one day, you can leave Costa Rica for any neighboring country and come back and be able to stay another 90 days in the country legally. While this is a cheap and easy option, this entry type does not grant you residency or rights to work in Costa Rica.

    Without the residency status in Costa Rica, you can still own property and enjoy profit from it, or you can own a business – but you can’t work in it. If you would like to get a work visa in Costa Rica, you may find that a bit challenging. In order to get a work visa, you have to fill a position that a native Costa Rican cannot do, and this is always a hard step to tackle.

    There is a 3rd option: retirement visas. Costa Rica grants a temporary residency visa under the category of “pensionado” to foreign nationals willing to immigrate to the country who can demonstrate to have a lifetime pension, such as social security, annuities, retirement funds, military pensions, or other guaranteed retirement benefits.

    For those without a steady retirement income, there is a 4th option: the “rentista” visa. The Rentista Program is for people without a fixed retirement income. It requires proof of $2,500 monthly income for at least two years or a $60,000 deposit in a Costa Rican bank approved by immigration authorities.

    […]

    Costa Rica allows foreigners to buy real estate there, which is a rarity. Since property prices in the country are lower than in the US, many expats who plan to move to Costa Rica long-term chose to purchase a place of their own. Another reason for buying a property in Costa Rica is that it is pretty challenging to find a suitable long-term deal for rent. This is because local landlords, especially in expat and/or tourist locations, make more money with short-term rentals.

    I think “temporary” is doing lots of heavy lifting above. I’m sure lots of us are wanting to move to a foreign land and have perpetual “temporary” status.

    “But, but, officer, you can’t arrest me!! I wasn’t working, I’m a tourist! And my retirement paperwork is delayed! And …!!1”

    :-/

    Yeah, buying foreign property is easy and risk-free, also too! And who doesn’t love moving to a foreign land and having to frequently move between rentals because one can’t get a long-term lease??!

    No thanks.

    The monsters aren’t going to drive me away. This is my homeland.

    Cheers,
    Scott.

  48. 48.

    Ken

    @Another Scott: In order to get a work visa, you have to fill a position that a native Costa Rican cannot do, and this is always a hard step to tackle.

    That’s pretty close to US law, although some employers (*cough* Mar-a-Lago *cough*) have been known to abuse it to hire housecleaners and groundskeepers.

  49. 49.

    eclare

    @Another Scott:

    I’m staying, too.  I don’t have it confirmed, but my guess is that my friend who moved to Canada inherited a large sum from her dad.  I’ll go visit, but I’ll come back.

  53. 53.

    eclare

    @schrodingers_cat:

    I moved to London for work while I was in my 20’s, I can’t imagine doing that now.  The hoops I had to go through to get a work permit were extremely high.

  54. 54.

    Brachiator

    CNN: A person close to Trump says that he is rattled by President Biden and his campaign’s efforts to get under his skin. Biden campaign aides have said the taunting will keep up

    I think that Biden also did this effectively in the 2020 campaign. He has more ammunition now.

    ETA. The guy with the beard in the CNN clip was the asswipe who did the fawning interview with Joe Manchin. It was practically a political ad for Manchin, praising his wisdom as a supposed political moderate who was the only person who could work with Congress.

  58. 58.

    schrodingers_cat

    @eclare: There was a time when my GC application was stuck in a morass, I was seriously considering Canada. This was during W’s admin. On paper their process for getting an immigrant visa (similar to GC) is easier but by then I was so assimilated over here that it was hard to pull up the stakes and leave.

    I love this country. This is home. I cemented that by becoming a citizen. I am here to stay.

  59. 59.

    Dorothy A. Winsor

    @eclare: That’s what I read too, but someone else said he could post only a percentage. I think that’s the normal process for someone posting bail. They have the guarantee of a bail-bondsman behind them. I don’t know if that works here.

  64. 64.

    Another Scott

    @eclare: Yeah, things are different for (say) the 0.1% and up, but almost none of us are in that group.

    I know a brilliant guy who emigrated to Canada from Poland and is a Canadian citizen now.  He worked in a big-company research facility in Ottawa for a decade or two, then moved to a university when his lab was shut down.

    He’s going to have to work into his 70s because of the way the pension system there works in his situation.  :-/

    Even people with in-demand knowledge and skills can have a hard time when they have to start over.  And things can always change (new management, new government policies, etc.)…

    As with most of life, there is no One Weird Trick that will save us if the monsters take over.  The rest of us are going to have to put in the work to make the future we want.

    Thanks.

    Cheers,
    Scott.

  66. 66.

    comrade scotts agenda of rage

    @Frankensteinbeck: ​
     

    Does anyone know about the money or the process involved?

    From yesterday’s thread:

    Next steps: he can either pay the judgement after it goes into effect within a time window (like in the next month and a half), refuse to pay, or appeal.

    I think we can all agree he is not going to pay the judgement. Though if he went this route his lawyers could negotiate a settlement with say a lesser amount or payment schedule. I think this would be how most defamation cases that the plaintiffs win would end (e.g. Johnny Depp).

    If he chooses to refuse to pay, they will have to go after that money civilly. I’m not sure the details but it’s be like getting the system to garnish wages, getting liens against his properties etc. Given the amount and who is bankrolled the suit I’d imagine they’d get the amount plus expenses somehow and it would not be pleasant. I don’t think this is a likely possibility given Trumps public image/goal of winning the POTUS and pardoning himself.

    If he chooses to appeal, he would not to have to pay immediately. However he would have to post bond for the full amount plus interests (there are laws that can get that amount reduced and I believe this is the discretion of the courts the actual bond amount). Keep in mind the purpose of the bond is to ensure that the defendant doesn’t avoid payment by abusing the appeals system (because they are out the money), ensure the money is paid if the decision is overturned, and protect them if they do prevail (since they didn’t hand over the money and then the onus is on them to get that money back). So the bond functions as an escrow account.

    IANAL but I imagine because he has claimed he is worth billions and because he has engaged in fraud, nobody will guarantee the bond so he’ll have to post about $90m in assets that he owns directly or can direct as a bond. It’s actually a huge hit. He can probably do it with this but despite his claims I doubt he’ll be able to do this with the other judgement since that will be at least almost a half billion.

  70. 70.

    lowtechcyclist

    I’ll add my name to the ‘staying’ list. This is the country I love.  They’re not going to chase me out.

  71. 71.

    NotMax

    Aw. What goes around comes around.

    Gen Zers are worried they’re getting old and out of touch after realizing they don’t understand Gen Alpha’s memes
    [snip]
    Many Gen Zers appear confused about the memes, which have become associated with Gen Alpha.

    One Twitter user who said they’re 15 tweeted that they’d overheard their sister who was born in 2013 calling Gen Z “old and stupid.”

    “Please help me,” they wrote, begging for an explanation of “Skibidi Toilet” before adding: “I feel old.” Source

  73. 73.

    Omnes Omnibus

    @Frankensteinbeck: @eclare: He doesn’t necessarily have to put up the whole amount in cash.  He needs a bond for, IIRC, 110% of the amount.  If some bank or other entity is willing to stand surety for him (don’t laugh, it took me ages to be able type that due to the giggles) or he places assets in escrow, he is … fine.  Also, fwiw, there are no grounds for appeal due to ineffective assistance of counsel in a civil case.

  75. 75.

    comrade scotts agenda of rage

    Leaving?  When we were looking to finally leave Central Misery, we considered Italy.  We’d been considering Italy for years, did tons of research, etc.  We could have made it happen.

    But it was gonna be a shitload of work and we would once again be moving to a place with no *social* support, not unlike what we did when we moved to Central Misery in 96.

    Moving sucks and it sucks the more you age, we learned that coming back to Denver.  We’ll die here.

    Let the RWNJs move.  I haven’t spent 40+ years fighting those assholes to walk away now.

  76. 76.

    Chris Johnson

    I’ve been all over the internet this morning trying to get a picture of the ‘Putin says Alaska actually belongs to Russia’ story and people’s takes on it. Full ‘what the actual F’ mode.

    I mean, on one hand, of course that’s where the guy goes when his failure in Ukraine slows its catastrophic plummet. Especially since his people in the Republican Party are finding ways to block US support of Ukraine. Of course if it looks like all his schemes are maybe gonna work, he’s emboldened. Putin might as well have ’emboldened’ tattooed on his face, his only purpose in life is to be ’emboldened’, damn the consequences.

    On the OTHER hand, how does this not damage those same schemes? How the actual fuck is this an appropriate time to go ‘oh, just one more thing’ like Steve Jobs but from hell?

    How is it not necessary to maintain the pretense that Russia would not happily also invade the USA and anywhere else? How is this not a time to do all the schemes to FIRST ‘win’ in Ukraine, never mind how well that would work in the long run, and to absolutely not make noises about how they should also take Alaska?

    Does this demented spook think he has the US so fractured, on the back of what he’s able to get Texas do to migrants or whatever, that this is the time he can strike fucking Alaska and it will not serve as a bit of a wake-up call to Americans about what has been happening this entire time? How addled does this fool think we actually are?

    I don’t buy it. I would not have called that one. If you asked me, with all my suspicion of Russian nonsense, whether I thought Putin was going to turn around and go after Alaska PUBLICALLY with the initial steps toward obvious land-conquest, I would have said you were crazy because nobody is that much of a fool.

    Guess not only orange men get dementia and lose all grip on themselves.

  79. 79.

    NotMax

    @eclare

    IANAL but pretty sure it doesn’t have to be all in cash, can also pledge assets to the escrow account.

    However, with his penchant for inflating the value of assets, some kind of independent arbiter/appraiser would almost certainly be appointed by the court.

  81. 81.

    Geminid

    @Brachiator: Manchin had better get his time in on national TV while he can. Next January, MSNBC and the rest of them will be lavishing their attention on Senator Jim Justice. They won’t have time for a has-been like Joe Manchin.

  83. 83.

    Asparagus Aspersions

    @eclare: ​
      I moved to France 17 years ago as a student and didn’t intend to stay for more than a year or two, but plans change. Before arriving, I had no idea how much work it would be to legally live here. Over the course of my first 10 years, I filed literally thousands of pages of paperwork, made dozens of visits to the police prefecture and various other immigration authorities, and spent hundreds of dollars for each renewal for translations of various documents. (Finally after 11 years, I got my long-term residence card. Now I’m a citizen, thank goodness, and never have to pay another visit to the immigration office).

    All that to say, carving out a life in another country is a lot of work.

  86. 86.

    kalakal

    @schrodingers_cat: Also having done it I couldn’t agree more. And  for me it was relatively easy compared to a lot of people. It took over 2 years, a fair amount of money, a lot of work. It also means leaving an awful lot behind, some of which I miss terribly, some not so much. And of course the place is foreign ( in the alternate meaning of the word). There are still times when it all seems alien and strange. And given the relative closeness of the UK and US, for me it was/is, as I said, relatively easy.

    I’ve never met a non-immigrant who has a clue about it

  87. 87.

    Omnes Omnibus

    Living is a foreign country isn’t all Parisian cafes and Thai beaches. The semester you spent in Rome or the vacations you spent some place “exotic,” are very different to life in a foreign country when it is your reality. What seemed like charming customs can become irritants. You’ll miss things, good Mexican food, proper apple pie, or something that you didn’t realize that you valued.

  89. 89.

    Frankensteinbeck

    @eclare:

    All the more reason for him to appeal, since he also has a habit of thinking he can find a dumbass This One Trick to escape consequences.  I’m betting $85 million will HURT, though.  He’s been pouring cash into these suits.  Does he even have $85 million of other people’s money left?  If he tries to use property liens, they’ll be at actual value, which will drive him crazy.

  90. 90.

    Nelle

    @NotMax: I also recommend US and the Holocaust ,  PBS and Ken Burns.  A good look at America First in the 30s and turning away immigrants, particularly Jewish ones.  It is streaming on PBS Passport.

  91. 91.

    NotMax

    @WaterGirl

    Trailer is linked above at #3.

    @above

    Yup Part two follows directly afterward. Thought mentioning the opus is some nine hours might prove too intimidating.

  92. 92.

    Ramalama

    @The Thin Black Duke:

    I wish some folks would stop talking about leaving the US if Trump wins steals the presidency.

    It is very difficult for anyone to leave the US for another country on a permanent basis.

    Travel to a different country? Yes.

    Stay? Get ready to spend a couple of years filling out paperwork in triplicate, know exactly every address you’ve lived at, get an FBI background check, and so on.

    My parents took a course held by their Catholic Church to put themselves in the shoes of others. One section had them going through the process of applying for residency to Canada.  My mom said, “I don’t think I’d qualify, that Canada would accept me after all that paperwork.”

    It surprised the heck out of them.

    Had they wanted to really relocate they could have come in with me under the family plan. The keep-families-together plan. But on their own? Maybe not. They didn’t have the current skills in need for immigrants. Mom didn’t have a college degree.

  97. 97.

    Omnes Omnibus

    @kalakal: Sometimes I find that the closeness of the UK/USA makes the differences more jarring.  You can forget for a moment.  And then you step into the street and a car hits you from the direction you weren’t looking.

  105. 105.

    Omnes Omnibus

    @RevRick: Yeah, ten years of French in school and the ability to write a good paper on Francophone African literature, but you still sound like a schoolboy on the streets.

  107. 107.

    Chris Johnson

    @TBone: I don’t even remember where I saw that ‘Putin claims Russia owns Alaska, historically’ thing. Maybe Bluesky?

    I would absolutely have noticed it because it is in line with all my darkest suspicions about what Russia’s been trying to do, this whole time, but it seems like a HUGE mistake.

    For now the only thing I can game out that’s remotely plausible is, this is the moment where Putin thinks he can get his people in the US to pull the trigger on a ‘civil war’ (long been a plan of Russia’s to goad this on) and then he can get Alaska and the US will be too busy fighting with itself? Or he thinks he owns them so completely that the Southern states doing this will simply become Russia? I get that he’s been trying to win those idiots over with macho Russian military recruitment videos and propaganda, but surely they would want to become their own country and call that ‘America’ rather than go off and become a Russian colony, subservient to a dying demented spook?

    I don’t think we can count on rational evil from these people anymore, and that’s a wrench because I like to run my paranoia on lower octane fuel :D

  109. 109.

    Ken

    @NotMax: Isn’t there already such an independent arbiter in place, for the Trump Organization trial? Mostly to make sure they don’t transfer assets out of the corporation before the fraud trial finishes.

  110. 110.

    JMG

    My daughter lives in France in Bordeaux and has for almost eight years. She has permanent work status and is en route to citizenship. Like any American, she is alternately amused and irritated at the French passion for paperwork and bureaucracy, and just plain irritated at the country’s disregard for customer service. But she’s not moving. She loves it there, and she has invested a great deal of time and energy making sure she can live there.

    I couldn’t hack it. Too set in my USA ways.

  111. 111.

    TBone

    @Chris Johnson: I texted my brother on Feb. 24, 2022 similar thoughts.  Pay attention so we don’t get sucker punched is my motto.  At the same time, de-escalating as a first move (hoping it works) is my mantra.

  113. 113.

    NotMax

    @comrade scotts agenda of rage

    One scene which stuck with me all these years is the interview with a chunky Polish farmer. Going on about his disgust for Jews he confides that he “can smell them” if any come near.

    Filmmaker Lanzmann and many of the film crew, standing right there, were Jewish.

  117. 117.

    NotMax

    @Ken

    Yes but that emanates from a state court. This latest is federal court and I doubt a federal judge will not put in place additional safeguards.

  118. 118.

    citizen dave

    @Chris Johnson: I read about this Putin-Alaska thing a year or two ago.  I’m not remotely worried about it.  Putin is in a weak state, will never subjugate the Ukrainians, and doesn’t have the resources to open a second war (just shooting from the hip here though–as an internet expert :)  ).  It works both ways.  When he attacked Ukraine, I thought, this is the perfect time for Japan to attack Russia and get some of those islands back.  Also, if a nation decided to invade Putin/Russia on the Far East, how would they be able to defend?  Russia is still far far too large, with so many nations within it.  I expect its disintegration in the future.

  120. 120.

    Another Scott

    @TBone: Yay!!

    Early in the reddit comments someone mentioned that it came from a Harmontown podcast.  I searched for “Harmontown podcast fascism” and it was at the top.

    :-)

    Cheers,
    Scott.

  122. 122.

    Mike in NC

    Given the choice of nominating a brown woman or a convicted rapist, we all know how the Republican Party will roll.

  126. 126.

    schrodingers_cat

    @MagdaInBlack: You have to keep tasting it because the potency of the dates and tamarind and ginger varies wildly, use my measurements as a guideline. If you have fresh mint you can add a few sprigs of that.

    ETA: Instead of making a separate green chutney and a tamarind+ date chutney. I make one chutney by combining all the ingredients for both.

  130. 130.

    Another Scott

    @Chris Johnson:

    Last week I found this Atlantic Council blog post that explained a lot for me. (Previously posted here.)

    To understand Russia’s current obsession with Ukraine, it is important to recognize that Russia was never a state in the common usage of the term. Unlike the modern Turkish state that emerged from the Ottoman Empire, or Great Britain, which acquired and lost an empire, Russia never had an identity separate from empire. As British historian Geoffrey Hosking observed, “Britain had an empire, but Russia was an empire.”

    The Kremlin’s preferred narrative of Russia rising from present-day Ukraine (“Kyivan Rus”) is a Moscow-concocted fairy tale. The officially endorsed 1000-year history of Russia is a self-created and self-perpetuated myth that generations of Russian dictators have promoted to justify their external expansion and internal repression.

    […]

    tl;dr – russia is still an empire. The rest of the world exists to be conquered by them. Except for a few years under Gorbachev and Yeltsin, they have been this way for a very long time.

    Breaking the fever and joining the modern rules-based order is going to be difficult and costly, but VVP is well on his way to making it happen via his failures.

    Slava Ukraini!!

    Cheers,
    Scott.

  131. 131.

    trollhattan

    Is the Jersey gal Dark Brandon brought on board still running things, because his on-line presence became a lot sharper after she arrived.

    “Be Best” has me thinking yes. Frickin’ shiv action.

  133. 133.

    prostratedragon

    @sab:  I read somewhere recently (wish I could remember) that he  has already taken actions that amount to dipping into their trust funds. They have no control over this, making it less likely that they’d actively seek to help him. King Lear without even a Cordelia that I can see, unless it’s niece Mary, who we know will keep a safe distance.

  135. 135.

    MagdaInBlack

    @schrodingers_cat: To be honest I first bought it just because it sounded good. I have used it a a bbq coating on chicken, to dip…and on ice cream..🤗

    Eta: Most of the grocery stores here have large ethnic sections and I am always exploring those aisles.

  140. 140.

    A Man for All Seasonings (formerly Geeno)

    @Uncle Cosmo: see also “Blau Schein” – the “Blue Card” that was given to essential workers in Schindler’s List.

  143. 143.

    UncleEbeneezer

    Houston Earth, we have a problem…

    In countries on every continent, an ideological gap has opened up between young men and women. Tens of millions of people who occupy the same cities, workplaces, classrooms and even homes no longer see eye-to-eye. In the US, Gallup data shows that after decades where the sexes were each spread roughly equally across liberal and conservative world views, women aged 18 to 30 are now 30 percentage points more liberal than their male contemporaries. That gap took just six years to open up.

    …

    Seven years on from the initial #MeToo explosion, the gender divergence in attitudes has become self-sustaining. Survey data show that in many countries the ideological differences now extend beyond this issue. The clear progressive-vs-conservative divide on sexual harassment appears to have caused — or at least is part of — a broader realignment of young men and women into conservative and liberal camps respectively on other issues. In the US, UK and Germany, young women now take far more liberal positions on immigration and racial justice than young men, while older age groups remain evenly matched. The trend in most countries has been one of women shifting left while men stand still, but there are signs that young men are actively moving to the right in Germany, where today’s under-30s are more opposed to immigration than their elders, and have shifted towards the far-right AfD in recent years.

    My concern is that things like Social Media and online Gaming are allowing boys to silo themselves off in spaces with few/no girls present, effectively creating boys clubs where misogyny (and LGBTQphobia and or bigotry) will never get any push back and they grow up with zero understanding or respect for girls/women, and believing the myth that boys/men are under attack from Feminism. I see examples of this sort of thing all the time with my tennis students and it worries me.

  147. 147.

    Jackie

    @TBone:

    a JURY of regular Americans.

    E. Jean Carroll’s jury included SEVEN men, several w/o college degrees… TIFG’s voter base. He’s so busy throwing fits about losing in a NY court (elitist) he’s overlooking WHO voted him guilty.

    He’s (imo) disenchanting the very voters he’s counting on in the General Election.

  148. 148.

    Harrison Wesley

    @TBone: By the time the Tea Party arrived, that phrase had changed to “wrapped in excess body fat and carrying a misspelled sign.”

  150. 150.

    H.E.Wolf

    @TBone: ​
     Thank you for posting that scene from “Casablanca” – where the Nazis who are pridefully singing their own anthem are drowned out by the French national anthem sung by the employees and customers of Rick’s Café Americain.

    For those who might not have known: some of the actors in the scene are people who fled the Nazis… including Conrad Veidt, who played the Nazi commandant.

  151. 151.

    TBone

    @UncleEbeneezer: valid concern in all respects.  My parents used to mock cell phone users mercilessly and I didn’t get one until 2014.  I sometimes wish we had guardrails on these crazy contraptions but I know better, I guess …

  156. 156.

    Jackie

    @mrmoshpotato:

    Donnie, can you hold your own bottle, or are your hands too tiny?

    During the ‘20 campaign, he was shown needing both hands to awkwardly bring a glass of water to his mouth.  A lot of media mirth ensued.

  158. 158.

    Omnes Omnibus

    @schrodingers_cat: Sometimes I get the feeling (from some commenters) that they would be quite happy if I were to stop commenting.

    A lot of us have been on the receiving end of that feeling.  Hell, I have had commenters more or less say it about me.  They can pie me.

  159. 159.

    kalakal

    @Omnes Omnibus:

    That’s a really good point. I’ll be going along feeling quite at home and then something, usually something minor, will knock me straight into 10,000 light years from home territory.

    And I still have trouble with your wretched way of writing dates 😀

  162. 162.

    trollhattan

    @Jackie: The accessibility ramps have always been a downside to certain of Donny’s photo-ops. I’m waiting for him to arrive on a Scamp.

  166. 166.

    prostratedragon

    @prostratedragon: This is from 5 years ago. I’ve seen more recent, in reference to the effects of the NYS fraud suit, but of a similar gist. It’s not that DIE’s trust funds have been broken, it’s not clear that they ever had them. Basically, much (all?) of their putative inheritance is exposed, with allaowance for the possibility of secret assets.

  167. 167.

    eclare

    @Jackie:

    I remember that, he looked like a toddler with a sippy-cup.  Now the rumor is out that he wears Depends, more toddler activity.

  171. 171.

    eclare

    @Barry:

    Good point.  In 1996 I got a temporary leave to remain that lasted for five years, with the opportunity to apply for a permanent one after ten.  I have no idea what the time frames are now.

  174. 174.

    Baud

    @UncleEbeneezer:

    Boys are going to backlash from advancing sex equality just like white people did from racial equality. The misogyny of the GOP and its allies is attractive.

    Whatever means feminists are on the Internet, I don’t see many state legislators treating men’s bodies like cattle. We’ll just have to accept we’ll lose some people to the dark side in our fight.

  175. 175.

    kalakal

    It’s a very odd feeling when you do visit where you left, parts are very familiar, parts seem very strange. It’s not just you that’s changed

  179. 179.

    Almost Retired

    I second (or 11th) the observation that Americans are generally naive about the rigors of the immigration process around the world. I think we’re stuck in an Ellis Island fantasy where after a quick de-lousing and the assignment of an anglicized surname …. Poof… you’ve completed the process.

    I am watching both a long time friend and my new daughter in law each apply for Portuguese citizenship.  It’s easier for my DIL because her mother is Portuguese but Iberian bureaucracy is driving them both to unleashing torrents of obscenities (in Portuguese).

    Both have also been disabused of the notion that Lisbon is some sort of affordable version of Los Angeles.

  180. 180.

    Miss Bianca

    @NotMax: I seem to recall that Shoah was where Meryl Streep first rocketed into public acclaim. Do I remember wrongly? That first pubic airing was back in the 70s, if I recall correctly, and that was a *lot* of brain cells ago…

  181. 181.

    RaflW

    I am challenged by the question of emigration. Gay men (and other HIV at-risk people) have already been functionally genocided in my lifetime by Regan’s hostility to us. I know how deadly homophobia can be, and now transphobia is. In this current era, it is already manifestly unsafe for trans and gender expansive people to live in 2/3ds of the US.

    Mutual aid communities, LGBTQ state groups, some foundations, and not-specifically-queer human rights orgs are already working hard to assist trans and gender expansive people to move to safer states, knowing that many can’t afford it and won’t have existing social networks in the receiving states. It’s hard to leave one’s home!

    Leaving the US entirely would not be easy, and even with us who have more means assisting others, a full evacuation wouldn’t be possible (and some may never choose to go. We have good friends with a trans child in Idaho who are, for now, not budging).

    But the queer community may face existential threats and I don’t believe it’s wrong to consider fleeing if it comes to that. (Canada did in the past grant admission to gay friends when the US was in a previous hostile phase towards LGBTQ ppl. We can hope that door opens again if urgently needed).

    Cis straight white people leaving because a Trump takeover would suck, I have far less openness to.

  183. 183.

    Miss Bianca

    @The Thin Black Duke:

    Maybe this is OT, but I wish some folks would stop talking about leaving the US if Trump wins steals the presidency. Some of us don’t have that option.

    Yep, I’m with you on this one. And it’s not like I don’t get the impulse to cut and run – have felt it myself. But ultimately, my only place is here, and my only option is to fight for our country, however feeble a warrior I may prove to be.

  188. 188.

    TBone

    @Miss Bianca: I was torn when the Independent State Legislature theory went before the Supremacist Court.  That might have done me in as far as staying.  But emigrating is just not for me, I’ve lived in too many different places already.  So stay and fight and cheer for morale it is.

  196. 196.

    kalakal

    @NotMax: It’s been a very weird and long month but definitely getting there.

    The biggest pain has been a new phone system. Some genius decided the entire city had to run on MS teams, which is bad enough for the 5% of the workforce who do 9-5 office jobs and a disaster for everyone else. 80% of my stress comes when I’m on a ref desk, can’t use the app, have to use an MS approved phone. They’re f***ing appalling.

    The patrons are so glad we’re back, it’s great. I did a couple of my history lectures for the first time in months and practically got mobbed they were so happy

  198. 198.

    Jackie

    Joyce Vance has an article out on her opinion re Judge Kaplan’s instructions to the jury before sending them off to deliberate:

    Jury Instructions

    Judge Kaplan had an unusual inclusion in his jury instructions, something I’ve never heard a judge do before. He read from the Constitution. He talked about “we the people” and the establishment of a justice system. And he referred to the history of the Southern District of New York, where federal courts have been in existence since 1789.

    Donald Trump was arguing for “jury nullification,” that no matter what the judge instructed them, the jury should reject the finding in the earlier trial—that Trump had sexually assaulted Carroll and lied about it—and that they should refuse to grant her damages in a significant amount. So the Judge, in a low-key way that certainly doesn’t rise to the level of reversible error but is nonetheless out of the ordinary, reinforced the importance of the court system and its integrity in the minds of the jurors before they deliberated. That is a reasonable counterbalance to the chaos Trump tries to insert into judicial proceedings and was perhaps the final element of Judge Kaplan’s careful control of his courtroom, which prevented a dissent into theatrics and prevented the trial from becoming just another campaign venue.

    joycevance.substack.com/p/833-million?utm_campaign=email-half-post&r=403d0&utm_source=subs…

    This is just one subject of many Vance discussed in her observations; worth the read.

  206. 206.

    Bill Arnold

    @comrade scotts agenda of rage:

    And when did “streisand” become a verb?

    Earliest instance recorded by Urban Dictionary is 2020. But really, any noun can be verbed. (The urban dictionary has some pretty toxic stuff for streisand, so not linking.)
    There’s the “streisand effect” and also the “reverse streisand effect”, which is intentional (but not overt) use of the “streisand effect” for publicity purposes.

  210. 210.

    kindness

    Funny.  Well, not really.  Just last week I said Republicans are going to start a meme mirroring Trump’s legal losses and Biden’s request to take impounded Russian assets and give them to Ukraine.  The meme will be ‘Biden and the Democrats want to seize your home and stuff and give it to Ukraine!’.  On queue, right wing talking heads start saying something real close to that.

  211. 211.

    Nukular Biskits

    @NotMax:

    Aloha! I crashed shortly after I asked upon which island you were nesting so I didn’t see your answer until this morning.

    Not sure I’ll have the opportunity or time for whale watching … this trip is all work with the added hazard of getting underway. Again. <sigh>

  212. 212.

    Bill Arnold

    @Scout211:

    It’s obviously a meme, but what does it mean?

    It’s the verb form of the Streisand effect

    The Streisand effect is an unintended consequence of attempts to hide, remove, or censor information, where the effort instead backfires by increasing awareness of that information.

  213. 213.

    lowtechcyclist

    @schrodingers_cat:

    Sometimes I get the feeling (from some commenters) that they would be quite happy if I were to stop commenting.

    Speaking only for myself, if I wanted you to stop commenting, I’d just pie you.  I haven’t so much as considered doing so, nor am I likely to.  I may get irritated with you at times, but you belong in this community, and I hope you continue to be a part of it.

  215. 215.

    JoyceH

    Just skimmed this thread but wanted to mention something. In the Post article about the Carroll verdict, they mentioned the NY civil fraud trial and said that Engoran expects to have a verdict by Wednesday. We know it’s going to be a dollar amount, only question is how much. So – that will be interesting…

  216. 216.

    UncleEbeneezer

    @Baud: It’s just depressing because I have such high hopes for younger generations.  I truly believe that diversity in our schools, friend groups etc., makes us better people and more empathetic and generally more open-minded, liberal etc.  Kids today have much better access to having friends from different races, ethnicities etc., than when I was a kid.  But the tendency to self-segregate by gender is still so damn common and a huge component in our societal misogyny that it just makes me sad that boys are still effectively creating “he-man woman-haters” clubs at every opportunity.

  218. 218.

    Jackie

    @Nukular Biskits: And, this is the SECOND 100+ morning thread! Sometimes we in the PT zone just don’t have much chance to participate! The world’s order has already been decided before our first cuppa ☕️

  219. 219.

    Miss Bianca

    @schrodingers_cat: Oh – as to that, I am notorious (at least in my own mind) for either coming into and commenting on threads way late, or wandering off into meatspace in the middle of a thread that I’ve been participating in. Nothing personal in the world intended, I assure you!

  221. 221.

    Jackie

    @JoyceH: Wednesday!?!! I sure hope popcorn supplies have been restocked by then!

    I want a trifecta; the Immunity Decision announcement by Friday 🤞🏻🤞🏻

  225. 225.

    Kirk

    @Another Scott:

     “Britain had an empire, but Russia was an empire.”

    Agreed. 350 years of Rus empire, then a couple of hundred years as part of the Golden Horde, overlapped and followed by over half a millenia as the Tsardom, followed by a mere 3/4 century as the not-an-empire-empire called the USSR.

    History of that size has an impact.

  228. 228.

    Brachiator

    @The Thin Black Duke:

    Maybe this is OT, but I wish some folks would stop talking about leaving the US if Trump wins steals the presidency. Some of us don’t have that option.

    My sister has semi-seriously talked about moving to Canada a couple of times. This reflects both her frustration and increasing anger at what is happening in this country.

    I will suggest that my niece and nephew think about leaving the country if it continues to lurch towards authoritarian bigotry. They have skills and talents that could be used elsewhere. My nephew has a facility for learning foreign languages and could prosper in a number of countries.

    I will stay and fight, but I don’t believe that younger members of my family need to submit to the madness that might consume this nation.

    I also note that we have a family history of fighting tyranny. I would also be happy if my niece and nephew chose that option if necessary. But that is a hard decision. The only option they don’t have, if it gets bad, is doing nothing.

  232. 232.

    Denali5

    I don’t want to move out of this country, and probably can’t because I am too old, but the thought of being here for four more year of TIFG makes me nauseous.

  234. 234.

    Frankensteinbeck

    @UncleEbeneezer:

    allowing boys to silo themselves off in spaces with few/no girls present, effectively creating boys clubs where misogyny (and LGBTQphobia and or bigotry) will never get any push back

    So, the pre-internet experience.  Every time anyone talks about the internet’s echo chamber effect, I remember the change over to an internet world.  It took place right when I entered college, and I grew up in the conservative South.  The freedom from a locked in social environment that brutally policed conformity was life-changing.

  235. 235.

    The Kropenhagen Interpretation

    @The Thin Black Duke: Maybe this is OT, but I wish some folks would stop talking about leaving the US if Trump wins steals the presidency. Some of us don’t have that option.

    My plan? Hunger strike…til the end.

  236. 236.

    trollhattan

    New this a.m. nitter.net Twitter redirect throws an error in both Firefox and Chrome, each refuses to proceed.

    Anybody else having this issue? Is this an Elmo attack on Nitter? Door #3?

  237. 237.

    Frankensteinbeck

    @schrodingers_cat:

    they would be quite happy if I were to stop commenting.

    I have been wondering where you were, since people have made comments on Indian politics and I wasn’t seeing your name.  I have little to say about this topic I know so little about, but that is exactly why I treasure your updates.

    In general, you have been a fine member of the snarling jackal community, no matter how it feels when the snarling is going on.  I am sure 99% of the commenters would miss you if you left.

  238. 238.

    trollhattan

    So, Kings get to play the Mavs right after Doncic drops 73 frickin’ points. Pray for exhaustion?

    Bet the Kings are pleased with their ’18 draft choice of Marvin Bagley III at #2. Doncic went #3.

  239. 239.

    Brachiator

    @UncleEbeneezer:

     In the US, UK and Germany, young women now take far more liberal positions on immigration and racial justice than young men, while older age groups remain evenly matched.

    A British political activist mentioned this on his YouTube channel. I was surprised because previous surveys suggested that the younger generation was more liberal, but these surveys didn’t look at gender differences.

    I think that in the past, especially when women didn’t have the vote, it was harder for them to express any political position.

    And I know some men who prefer that women in their lives be silent.

  240. 240.

    prostratedragon

    @trollhattan:  There have been a lot of problems with the nitter.net redirect all week. Workarounds:

    If you have firefox, there’s an addon that does a pretty good job of finding a working instance for you when redirecting from Xitter.

    Otherwise, or if you want to refresh a nitter page, you can enter a working instance address manually. This status table shows continually updated working instances; right now e.g., nitter.rawbit.ninja is one that seems to be working and has for a couple of days. To find the table, use the “?” link on any nitter page anf follow “instances” etc.

  246. 246.

    Uncle Cosmo

    @Frankensteinbeck: Trump will certainly try to get a stay pending appeal. Delay is one of his deepest ingrained habits.​

    It’s a winning tactic when you have deeper pockets than your opponent. That’s how Trumplthinskin squeezed his creditors to accept pennies on the dollar: “I can string this out so long that you’ll be bankrupt long before you see a penny of what I owe you, so settle.”

    Now he’s up against institutions with waaaaaay deeper pockets that him but he doesn’t know any other way to respond. Sux 2B Orangecandyass!

  248. 248.

    wjca

    @schrodingers_cat: I love this country. This is home. I cemented that by becoming a citizen. I am here to stay.

    Good.  And an (extremely belated) welcome.

    Because immigrants are what made, and make, this country great.

    It’s not just us either.  Thanks to a recommendation here, I’ve been reading Mary Beard’s SPQR.  She makes the point that one of the things that distinguished Rome was that, unlile the cities/countries around it, people from elsewhere could not just move to Roman territory (or live in conquered territory) but become full Roman citizens, with all the rights of any other citizen.

    Countries which resist, or even successfully block, immigration tend to lose out.  And not just because their most valuable residents decamp to greener pastures.  Not that this detail (even assuming that they are aware of it) slows the xenophobes appreciably.

  253. 253.

    Another Scott

    Meanwhile, yet more indications that everything in the world is not all about the all-powerful [ sic! ] USA… DW.com:

    China had long tried to come to terms with the Houthi rebel group. But Beijing is now apparently losing patience with the Iran-backed Shiite Muslim militia, which has fought a civil war in Yemen since 2014 and controls large swaths of the conflict-ridden country.

    The Houthis have been launching attacks on cargo ships affiliated with Israel in the Red Sea over the past few weeks.

    Chinese officials have asked their Iranian counterparts to help rein in attacks on ships in the crucial waterway, or risk harming business ties with Beijing, Reuters reported, citing Iranian sources.

    “Basically, China says: ‘If our interests are harmed in any way, it will impact our business with Tehran. So tell the Houthis to show restraint,'” one Iranian official briefed on the talks, who asked not to be named, told the news agency.

    […]

    The Houthi actions have an enormous economic impact on China, said Johann Fuhrmann, head of the Konrad Adenauer Foundation’s office in Beijing.

    “In terms of supply chains and global trade, Beijing is facing enormous challenges. Not only is the route around the Cape of Good Hope longer and more expensive, it is also rapidly increasing container prices,” he told DW.

    “All of this comes at a time when China is focusing heavily on boosting exports — as the real estate crisis in the country has shown that property-based economic boom is no longer going to happen,” Fuhrmann added.

    [ video – US, UK launch fresh strikes on Houthis in Yemen 01:42 ]

    Nora Kürzdörfer, China expert at the German Institute for Global and Area Studies in Hamburg, also pointed to China’s high reliance on energy supplies from the Middle East and Africa.

    “Despite the fact that Chinese ships have not yet been attacked, Chinese exporters are facing increased transportation costs and insurance premiums.”

    According to several estimates, the cost of shipping a container to Europe has more than doubled, to around $7,000 (€6,443), since the Houthis began attacking cargo ships in December.

    […]

    I wonder if Biden’s advance warning to Iran about the ISIS bombings is yet another indication of his attempts to move forward with Iran where we can.

    Biden understands that working with people means accepting that there are common interests and differing interests and progress means compromise and moving things forward incrementally. Those bomb-throwers demanding instant success on “The Border” or “Ceasefire” or whatever have to be worked around to get to that incremental progress.

    As OO says above, things don’t change until they do…

    Cheers,
    Scott.

  257. 257.

    The Kropenhagen Interpretation

    I’m not looking to leave either, though I am increasingly concerned about political violence, including and beyond terrorism.

    So I want to become proficient in firearms. I don’t want to own one, but I want to be able to safely handle, assemble, and operate one. But all the gun clubs I encounter have parking lots full of thin blue lines and misappropriated Punisher logos.

    I’m wondering how to go about finding a gun club or training service with a good culture.

  260. 260.

    Brachiator

    @The Kropenhagen Interpretation:

    I’m wondering how to go about finding a gun club or training service with a good culture.

    I don’t know anything about guns and would like to see what kind of responses you might get.

    But wouldn’t you want a club that offered expertise in using a gun and gun safety? I don’t know how hard it would be to ignore the extraneous nonsense.

  262. 262.

    munira

    @schrodingers_cat: I’ve also done it and you are so right. I moved to Canada and I am now a dual citizen but it was a major hassle. And moving back to the US, which I did four years ago, was also a major hassle. Don’t really want to do that again.

  263. 263.

    The Kropenhagen Interpretation

    @Brachiator: But wouldn’t you want a club that offered expertise in using a gun and gun safety? I don’t know how hard it would be to ignore the extraneous nonsense.

    Yes, learning is my primary objective. Perhaps I could avoid unsavory types while I was there. My concern is they’d, at a minimum, be a distraction. No matter what efforts I make to avoid them, MAGA types have a tendency to evangelize. I need my head on the task of learning.

  264. 264.

    wjca

    @The Kropenhagen Interpretation: I want to become proficient in firearms. I don’t want to own one, but I want to be able to safely handle, assemble, and operate one.

    I’ve been thinking I didn’t need to do that.  After all, when I was in the Air Force, officers on active duty were required to qualify annually.  And I did.  So I’ve got the basics.

    But it occurs to me, that was a loooong time ago.  Perhaps a refresher would not be out of order.

  267. 267.

    The Kropenhagen Interpretation

    @TBone: There are three bluebirds here at my window

    🎶…and they told me I don’t need to worry….🎶

  268. 268.

    Quadrillipede

    Trying to do less of posting to the end of an expiring thread, but in this case I’ll make an exception.

    “Consequences? For us? Actual monetary consequences?!”

    Feels like we might be starting to turn a corner here…

  270. 270.

    Citizen Alan

    @Ohio Mom:  I remember that what was, to me, the single most chilling moment in Schindler’s List: when one of the female protagonists is looking through the slats in her cattle car on her way to the camps and she sees an adorable little girl watching the train go by who grins as she drags her finger across her own throat in a slashing gesture.

  271. 271.

    Origuy

    I looked into the Italian retirement visa. With Social Security and my 401(k), I could manage the financial requirement easily. I’ve been studying Italian for two years now, I need a lot more practice to have real conversations, though. But when I was in Italy, I thought about how I would manage in a few years. I’m 67 now, but could I get around in a wheelchair at 85? Most of the interesting areas to live would not be ADA compliant. Plus I hate moving. I can’t even get enough stuff into storage to prepare to re-carpet!

    My ancestors nearly all came here before the Revolution. This is where I’m rooted.

  272. 272.

    Citizen Alan

    @Dorothy A. Winsor: I would imagine it’s a matter of drafting an opinion, circulating it to all the judges on the Circuit, getting their feedback, waiting for any concurrences and/or dissents (which must also circulated), rewrites of any/all of the above and circulation  of same. Given the nature of the issues presented and the  importance of the case (and the desire to not leave anything for SCOTUS to pick at), I am expecting a 50+ page opinion, which is not something that can be done quickly.

  273. 273.

    Citizen Alan

    @schrodingers_cat:  Yeah. I could have gotten into Canada in 2005 (and would have if my elderly parents were already deceased at that point). No chance now unless I win the lottery. Of course, if I win the lottery, I’ll be going a lot farther than Canada. (Narrator: He doesn’t play the lottery.)

  279. 279.

    Kayla Rudbek

    @wjca: as Eric Flint had one of his characters say in the Belisarius series, Rome and its thousand years (setting is 5 CE Constantinople) were because the Romans took whatever was good and discarded whatever didn’t work.

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