Third Party Presidential Campaign Fan Fiction is only slightly more tiresome than Brokered Convention Fan Fiction.
— Wyeth Ruthven (@wyethwire) May 7, 2016
You get a party, and you get a party — everybody gets a party of their own! One should never dismiss any possible development in the multi-ring circus of American politics, especially in this particular cycle. And surely every American is entitled to his or her very own political Theory of Everything, whereby the sufficient application of correct thought to the perfect handcrafted artisan unicorn candidate will CHANGE THE CONVERSATION such that everyone lives happily ever after. But the latest media proposals by the usual batch of Media Village Idiots, reliably wrong ‘pundits’, and ambitious careerists gunning for earned media don’t even rise to the dignity of a couple of tinfoil-hatted cranks taking up floor time at local meetings and wall space on public buildings (or Facebook) to promote the Independent Union of Patriotic National Americans for Responsible Freedom…
Let's say enough Repubs were ready to overturn Trump's nomination: who would be an improvement AND would accept the nomination?
— Dana Houle (@DanaHoule) May 9, 2016
Anti-Trump Republicans should start a new party on IndieGoGo. I would say Kickstarter, but the pitch would never pass believablity test.
— Mark Sumner (@Devilstower) May 9, 2016
There’s at least three strains of Third-Party Virus been rampant in the media since Trump clinched the Republican nomination. First, the evergreen Both Sides argument, where adult professionals revert to their Risk-and-fantasy-sports-playing adolescence. Jon Chait at NYMag explains to them that, “No, a Conservative Third-Party Candidate Can’t Steal the Electoral College“:
… [T]he plan would run like this: A right-wing third-party candidate would split the Electoral College, so no candidate reaches the 270-vote threshold. In that case, the House of Representatives would decide the winner, with each state’s delegation (regardless of population) casting two votes. Since Republicans control most state delegations, they would pick the winner, who would presumably be their right-winger, rather than Trump or (obviously) Hillary Clinton.
What gives the scenario the veneer of plausibility is that the last part of the plan is completely true. If the Electoral College deadlocked, then the House would really decide, and it really would give the presidency to the right-winger. The actual problem with the scenario is that the first part, where the independent somehow prevents anybody from gaining 270 electoral votes, is completely nuts.
Right now Clinton has the inside track to a majority of the Electoral College. Polls are a little dodgy at this early stage of the race, but most forecasters assume Clinton would win something like the states President Obama won in 2012, and perhaps some more if Trump fails to consolidate his party. That assumption isn’t terribly important. What’s important is that adding a right-wing splinter candidate would not reduce Clinton’s share of the Electoral College at all. It would increase it. Every state gives its electoral votes to the candidate who receives the most votes. If Clinton wins 51 percent of the vote in Florida, she gets all 29 electoral votes from Florida. Crucially, states do not require a candidate to have a majority in order to win the state. And a right-wing independent candidate will draw overwhelmingly from Trump’s support. So an independent would not take any states away from Clinton. Instead, that candidate would make it possible for Clinton to win a bunch of states without a majority. States where Clinton might otherwise fall a bit short of Trump would become blue states…
@jbouie Conservative 3rd party might reduce Clinton's popular vote % down to low 40s. But it would also increase her EC % to the high 300s
— Mike Duncan (@mikeduncan) May 7, 2016
A serious third-party run will not throw the election to the House. It will cause Hillary to win a landslide. https://t.co/txrL8hyaQG
— Josh Barro (@jbarro) May 6, 2016
***********
Bill Kristol wandering down Connecticut Avenue shoeless begging strangers to consider an independent run.
— Bob Schooley (@Rschooley) May 6, 2016
While the talking heads happily rules-lawyer together, the predictable right-wing idiots search for their lost dreams under the sputtering streetlights…
WELL ITS NOT PRIVATE ANYMORE IS IT??!! https://t.co/clLaroXXmx
— Daniel Drezner (@dandrezner) May 7, 2016
… William Kristol, the longtime editor of the Weekly Standard magazine and a leading voice on the right, met privately with the 2012 nominee on Thursday afternoon to discuss the possibility of launching an independent bid, potentially with Romney as its standard-bearer…
But knowing Romney’s reluctance, Kristol told Romney that if he remains unwilling to run, many top conservatives would appreciate having the former Massachusetts governor’s support for an independent candidate, should Kristol and other right-leaning figures enlist a willing contender…
If Romney runs on a third party ticket will he Etch-a-Sketch back to Moderate Massachusetts Mitt? I liked that guy.
— Matthew Yglesias (@mattyglesias) May 7, 2016
Acela cell service needs to be improved! Calls w Sasse, Coburn, & Romney kept cutting in & out. Conferencing them together even trickier…
— Bill Kristol (@BillKristol) May 8, 2016
.@BillKristol Landline service cutting out. Calls to Steiner, Jodl, Keitel keep cutting out. Total victory imminent. pic.twitter.com/mGITAMbzml
— Big Sexy Jeb! Lund (@Mobute) May 8, 2016
*************
But wherever could they find such a New Hope — a candidate of sterling conservative credentials, telegenic enough for the cruel media spotlight, someone who doesn’t mind risking the considerable chance of ending up as a nation-wide punchline? Cometh the hour, cometh the man:
Ben Sasse is so pissed about Washington just talking and doing nothing that he writes an open letter demanding someone do something
— Simon Maloy (@SimonMaloy) May 5, 2016
Hillary Clinton calls for Ben Sasse to grow up. https://t.co/B5zaeNt9YH
— Bob Schooley (@Rschooley) May 5, 2016
Mr. Pierce expands:
Just when you thought it was over, and the Republican Party was riding to its doom over a cliff of its own devising, there comes a voice from the west, a young man of strong convictions and principles as hard as the sod busted by the people who first settled the great state of Nebraska, a mighty wind blowing clear and strong and fearless against the foul gusts of Trumpian triumph that have enveloped entire cable television networks in their cyclonic embrace. Will a grateful nation raise its eyes to him and, girding its loins once again, follow into battle this gleaming paladin of the Plains…
He was the Tea Party darling elected to the Senate from Nebraska. His faith in the Constitution handed down to the Founders by Jesus His Own Self is firm and unshakable. Most recently, he showed up in Iowa prior to the caucuses in February and pronounced himself willing to campaign for any of the 16 other candidates against He, Trump. I have to admit, I rather liked that idea, although, in retrospect, it pretty much didn’t work, as the last two weeks have shown.
Now, though, young Ben has mounted the parapets of Facebook to defend America against the onslaught of drunken bros in fake Oakleys and the vulgar talking yam who leads them—oh, and also against Hillary Rodham Clinton, who scares all the moms at Walmart…
Go read the whole thing, which pretty much puts the cherry on this year’s Third Party sundae.
Speaking of dessert, here’s Ed Kilgore’s “Open Letter to Senator Ben Sasse”:
Thanks for taking the time from your not-so-busy Senate schedule to let us know via Facebook that you share our total disdain for the likely presidential choices that Beltway elements have foisted upon us, and that there’s still hope for what we actually want, which is a right-wing president who forces the squabbling parties in Congress to come together on right-wing policies…
And hey, thanks for being the only politician — or “citizen-politician,” or whatever you call yourself — to understand that our young people are searching for an alternative to the two corrupt liberal parties in Washington but are handicapped by their ignorance of “the meaning of America,” which you quite properly define as fighting terrorists, balancing the budget, and opposing political correctness. If we had better educated these young people, they’d realize we need to get rid of minimum-wage laws so they can earn the money to pay off their student loans instead of expecting Uncle Sugar to let them dodge their obligations.
In the meantime, there’s plenty of support out there for the clear path you identify: a “draft” of a candidate who will defy both parties by implementing a simple and totally noncontroversial agenda of more money for national security, less money for those godless entitlements like Social Security and Medicare, abolishing federal involvement in K-12 education, and ending “incumbency protections” like those that made Donald Trump, Ted Cruz, Ben Carson, and Carly Fiorina viable presidential candidates this time around. Who outside of Washington could possibly argue with any of that? Isn’t it obvious “limited government” is the one thing we can all agree on?…
Patricia Kayden
Nah. Republicans will, for the most part, rally around The Donald. He’s their man and exactly what they deserve. Plus, what would be the benefit of a 3rd Party candidate? He/she would probably end up drawing more voters away from Republicans which would ensure a bigger electoral college win for Secretary Clinton.
misterpuff
Unicorns and (Straight) Rainbows from the Right Wing…….if only the great Unwashed would listen to their preachers, We could have Nice Things like Plutocrats and Politicians who kneel in front of The Lord and Old Glory…….
Renie
Does this mean Baud still has a chance?
chris
I think Ted Cruz should run with a third party. Now there’s a man who knows what America needs, he just can’t see that it isn’t him.
Mike in NC
Back to watching House of Cards, where the tall blond Republican governor of New York talks about “cutting government, cutting taxes, and defeating terrorism” (or words to that effect) when he is elected president. Some odd priorities there, but typical of any real-life GOP candidate.
Schlemazel Khan
@Patricia Kayden:
Agreed, the goopers will fall in line, telling themselves they can control the Dumpsterfire & even profit from his administration. I posted this in an earlier thread and I am sticking with this as reflective of the GOP mindset”
“RELAX! He only appears insane to capture the votes needed. Once he is in office he will drop all this silly nonsense and he will play ball with us. Trust me, we can control this guy.”
– Albert Junker 1936, speaking at the Berlin Businessman’s Club
dr. bloor
Oh, but this will be quite enough for Senator Turtle and Ayn Ryan to stonewall for another four years because Madame President obvs has no mandate.
D58826
The next Obama/Clinton Benghazi outrage. And every one knows that by taking the death penalty off the table, Abu Khattala will now keep his mouth shut and not tell about the dinner party he attended at the Clinton residence to plan the attack or Obama’s promise to offer his daughters hand in marriage if the attack succeeded.
jl
I thought a brokered GOP convention equaled GOP train wreck. But looks like I was wrong, we can have a GOP train wreck without a brokered convention. I continue to hope for the worst for them, politically.
Not sure even a Mitt candidacy would do much to the Democrats. I can imagine a large number of Democrat-friendly Independents conservative Democrats going for a Bloomberg or some protest candidate. But Mitt? Mitt, a protest candidate? He would get almost all his votes from GOPers who can’t stomach Trump.
RK
MattF
The only way a third party candidate would throw the election into the House is if he/she/it took more votes away from Clinton than from Trump in some states. And those votes taken from Clinton would have to be more than Trump got in that state. And this would have to happen in several states. Therefore, Bill Kristol doesn’t actually understand how this ‘Electoral College’ thing works. And he’s innumerate.
jl
@Renie:
” Does this mean Baud still has a chance? ”
Where is Baud! 2016!? He needs to step up and save the country. Everyone remember to blame everything on Baud if something goes wrong.
Major Major Major Major
Rolling Along is going to be crushed.
eemom
@Mike in NC:
True, but I actually think that the real world republitards of 2016 would kill for a candidate that good. We’re lucky he’s fictional.
starscream
Trump will get at least 45% of the vote. Like I said, I wouldn’t be surprised if this looks just like 2012, with maybe Ohio flipping red.
Schlemazel Khan
@Major Major Major Major:
I assume it will have no more affect on the poor dupe that ’12 had on him and is UNLIMITED CORPORATE CRAP!
Sadly, the boy appears to be incapable of learning. I blame the boys parents
Villago Delenda Est
Not even a disaster of biblical proportions will cause idiots like Kristol to realize that they are in a very distinct minority that has no chance of ever returning to power, ever, under any circumstances.
Because Drumpf is that disaster of biblical proportions for the GOP. They are doomed.
Hungry Joe
We don’t need no third party in California, at least when it comes to the Senate. Our Official Voter Information Guide, issued by the Sec. of State, lists all the qualified candidates on the primary ballot. A sample from the Candidate Statements section (and here are some “sics”; you’re going to need them — sic, sic, sic, sic, sic, sic, sic, sic, sic):
Tim Gildersleeve, No Party Preference: “I am a follower of Jesus Christ. I stand for the poor, elderly, environmental issues, unions, small business, and represent the average citizen.”
President (sic) (SEE?) Cristina Grappo, Democratic: “My education & expertise merits this prolific occupation in order to represent California, as United Senator. I hold a Democratic Party Platform with key issues for gun control, human trafficking, balancing the national deficit, and foreign policy initiatives. I am mainstream Facebook in social media! My core values drive America!”
Massie Munroe, Democratic: “My candidacy represents the United States Constitution, the only contract between the people of America and America’s government ‘Of the people, By the people, For the people’ to be restored and strengthened in America and extended to the U.N. as a contract between all people of our world through US leadership and diplomacy … ”
Karen Roseberry, Republican: “S.A.V.E. the future!” [entire statement]
Jason Hanania, No Party Preference: “01100101.” [entire statement]
I was leaning Kamala Harris, but this Hanania guy intrigues me …
Villago Delenda Est
@Major Major Major Major: My Schadenfreude meter is going to be pegged, again, just like it was back during the Colorado primary in 2012 when one of Rolling Along’s previous avatars assured us that we could take an Rmoney victory there “to the bank.”
Ken
@MattF: Strangely, the resident troll made exactly the same mistake about a third-party run. I wonder – if we checked carefully, do you thing the troll’s often-changed “not Trump” picks would match Kristol’s too?
Villago Delenda Est
@Hungry Joe: The world, after all, is divided in to 10 kinds of people; those who understand binary, and those who do not.
feebog
@RK:
Your post is right out of “Concern Trolling for Dummies”.
Ain’t gunna happen. Clinton will get the same 95% of black American turnout and She will improve on Obama’s 71% of Hispanic voters to over 75%. She will also gain several points with Asian American voters.
WarMunchkin
@RK:
Looking into your link:
Are we in such a dumb world that fully 18 percent of voters look at these two and think “gee, I dunno”.
Major Major Major Major
Ugh, why am I arguing with an old co-worker on Facebook about Bernie. She seems to be impervious to links. She was never the sharpest knife in the drawer, but bless her heart…
(I’m not conflating the two)
The woo is strong out here. I think she posts anti-GMO stuff from time to time too. I’ll just walk away…
Schlemazel Khan
@Hungry Joe:
well, that is the letter ‘e’ in ascii for whatever that is worth. I believe that CA charges candidates by the word for this presentation so maybe that was all he could afford?
OFF TO THE GREAT GAGOOZAL!
AkaDad
That totally shocking and not flawed in any way Q-pac poll highly motivates me to donate money and help with GOTV efforts.
Agrippa
@Patricia Kayden:
I think that 90%+ of GOP voters will vote for Trump.
Maybe some centrists will reject Trump.
A Ghost To Most
While I think Hillary will roll, Maine and Nebraska have the possibility of split electoral counts:
270towin.com
Mike in NC
@Rolling Along: What is that low energy loser doing these days, aside from drinking tequila and crying on the phone to mommy? You remember, the whiner that Trump publicly humiliated and destroyed.
#RightToRisePullsNumbersFromHisDumbAss
Schlemazel Khan
@Schlemazel Khan:
Ah, that would be a bingo, Bob.
I knew they charged but had no clue it was $25 a WORD!
His web site seems pretty sane
SRW1
@Schlemazel Khan:
The year 1936 for that quote from Herr Junker is suspicious, given that Herr Hitler got into power in January of 1933. In 1936 Herr Hitler was well entrenched.
Mnemosyne
@RK:
Is there a reason you keep spamming every thread with the same bad poll no matter how many good responses you get?
JGabriel
BREAKING News! PPP: 27% Of Voters Have A Higher Opinion Of Lice Than Trump!
NotMax
Tiresome.
It’s getting like chewing the same bite over and over and over and over.
Swallow, already.
Agrippa
@starscream:
That is very close to what I figure.
I think that Trump will get 45/47% of the vote.
he will do about as well as Romney did.
Major Major Major Major
@JGabriel: There’s that number again.
Brachiator
@JGabriel: Head lice or body lice?
MattF
@Brachiator: That must be it. Without saying exactly what ‘it’ is.
A Ghost To Most
@Schlemazel Khan:
asciitable.com
NotMax
@Renie
Baud/Limberbutt McCubbins ’16
“A sunbeam in every window, a sardine in every bowl.”
Miss Bianca
@Major Major Major Major: I know. I keep getting mad at myself for getting mad at woo-meisters. It’s why I’m staying off FB these days. People whom I love dearly are revealing themsevles to be anti-vaxxers, or believe that GMOs are going to make us grow gills, or think that the Malheur loons are being railroaded. Is it a coincidence that many of them are Sanders fans? Government get off my back, but hail Socialist candidate? No, Jake, it’s Colorado. Colorado hipnecks, God love ’em.
Keith G
Some information platforms use 3rd party musings as click bait. Some pseudo-wonks and/or talking heads use this discussion to get an interview.
This too shall pass.
Miss Bianca
@NotMax: mm…sunbeams and sardines…
pseudonymous in nc
“Hey, Senator Sasse, aren’t you one of the most powerful elected politicians in America? You know, the whole ‘senator’ thing?”
RK
@Mnemosyne: Do you have fregoli syndrome?
NotMax
@Miss Bianca
But the gills will be appreciated as the sea levels rise.
;)
Roger Moore
@Hungry Joe:
I need to know if he’s big endian or little endian before I can even think about voting for him.
Chyron HR
@Mnemosyne:
They’re trying to get enough people to vote for Sanders in the few remaining primaries to swing the delegates in his favor. The underlying innumeracy of this plan suggests that it was orchestrated by the Sanders campaign itself.
NotMax
Soo-prize, soo-prize.
Miss Bianca
@NotMax: Says Our Man From Hawaii – we’ll be the last to enjoy beachfront property, thank you! ; )
Mike J
the Conster, la Citoyenne
@Major Major Major Major:
My last FB Bernfeeler poster just posted a pic of supposedly a CA rally for BS when it was really a May Day march in Havana from a few years ago, and she’s a lawyer. Sad!
NotMax
Panic setting in?
Prescott Cactus
Not too important but: Except for the electors in Maine and Nebraska, electors are elected on a “winner take all” basis.
These states allocate two Electoral Votes to the popular vote winner, and then one each to the popular vote winner in each Congressional district (2 in Maine, 3 in Nebraska) in their state.
Grumpy Code Monkey
@Patricia Kayden: I fully expect Republicans/conservatives with skin in the game to back Trump in the general, but I don’t know about the greater voting public.
The bigger threat is Chuckles Todd and the rest of the Sunday gasbags pimping Trump as a serious candidate for the next six months, with Bill Effing Kristol calling out Trump as the menace he is.
dmsilev
@Miss Bianca: One of the better moments of my professional life was somehow ending up in a conversation with a hard-core New-Age type, telling her that I study magnetic crystals, pausing for a beat, and then adding that the crystals were used by the defense industry.
I’m probably a bad person for enjoying that moment of mental whiplash.
(the crystals in question are used as the core element of certain types of lasers, including rangefinding devices on military aircraft and the like. That’s not what I study however; I’m interested in certain odd-ball quantum mechanical behavior that only shows up within a fraction of a degree above absolute zero. It is however true that we bought our samples from a subsidiary of Northrup-Grumann.)
Patricia Kayden
@dr. bloor: President Obama won with over 50% in 2008 and 2012 and yet the Republicans stonewalled and acted as if he didn’t have a mandate. Republicans stonewall and shut down the government when there is a Democratic President. That’s just how they roll.
JPL
@Patricia Kayden: Bush had a mandate though. A supreme court mandate.
Patricia Kayden
@NotMax: Not a surprising development.
Little Green Footballs has done a fabulous job reporting on how Trump routinely retweets White Supremacists. Trump hasn’t hidden the fact that he supports racists and doesn’t mind their support in return.
Major Major Major Major
@JPL: Well yeah, he was a Republican. Republicans get to have those.
NCSteve
It’s very disorienting. Between them, Trump and Bernie have created a rift in the political space-time continuum through which I have fallen into a parallel universe where I’m constantly whole-heartedly and enthusiastically agreeing with Anne Laurie on post after post.
Has anyone checked to see if Obama is suddenly sporting a Van Dyke?
Prescott Cactus
@dmsilev:
Amazon has free shipping over orders over $35.
On a more serious note, it sounds like you have a cool and fascinating job that you like. Good for you !
Miss Bianca
@dmsilev: you may be a bad person, but you are *my* kind of bad person. :)
@NCSteve: I see what you did there. (and fwiw, I think PBO would totally *rock* a Van Dyke).
JPL
@dmsilev: I hope that you are not writing notes while traveling on an airplane. That is no longer allowed in our free country.
Patricia Kayden
@jl:
How pathetic would Republicans have to be to run a 3rd Party with Romney as its candidate? Even I would weep for them.
Patricia Kayden
@JPL: Only Republican Presidents are allowed to have mandates in the alternative universe inhabited by Conservatives. And all Democratic Presidents are susceptible to impeachment, even if like President Obama, they have zero scandals under their belts.
Cacti
The No Labels Philosophy: Republicans and Democrats should unite to advance Republican policy goals, but without the coarse appeals to bigotry.
The Other Chuck
@Roger Moore: He deftly dodged the issue of endianness by issuing a byte-sized statement.
Mike J
@Prescott Cactus:
I thought I had read that Nebraska was getting rid of that because the Republicans that run the lege didn’t like Omaha going Dem.
Ahh, I did read it. They tried and failed.
Baud
The BJ Party!
“Get a load of our platform!”
NotMax
@Roger Moore
Does it matter which end so long as he pledges to wipe out the scourge of al-Bumen?
Baud
@Patricia Kayden:
From laughing so hard.
Baud
@Cacti:
Both sides give up something important to them.
Roger Moore
@The Other Chuck:
No, he didn’t. That statement could be either decimal 101 (big endian) or 166 (little endian), depending on endianness. I need to know which one he intends before I can interpret his statement. I guess he’s just a typical politician, trying to have it both ways so he doesn’t offend anyone.
Miss Bianca
@Baud: I *was* going to say that Patricia must be a much nicer person than I am but I think I’m gonna go with “what you said”.
Prescott Cactus
@Mike J: I wasn’t sure about Nebraska. I thought I remembered they initially did and vaguely thought they tried to get rid of it. Had to double / triple check. Maine was a surprise.
Repub’s have no problem gerrymandering states and their districts within, but I doubt we as a nation would allow our presidential process to be rigged. I can’t believe I just wrote that. Of course they would.
NonyNony
@RK: Do you even bother to read the link you’re posting? The article itself points out that qpacs methodology for this poll sucks and that it’s a severe outlier from other polls.
Also, qpac has Trump at 43, Clinton at 39 in Ohio. In 2012, Rmoney got 48% of the vote in Ohio. This number is actually BAD for Trump – he should be much closer to 45% now that he’s clinched the nom. Meanwhile Clinton is still in a contest – her numbers will tighten up once Sanders ends his campaign and Obama can start stumping for her – even here in Ohio.
I mean, I want to tamp down on the idea that Trump is going to lose big in Ohio – he won’t. It will be tight. But the idea that this poll means anything is stupid.
SiubhanDuinne
@Hungry Joe:
Dalmatians?
Major Major Major Major
@Roger Moore: @The Other Chuck: I’ll pull the lever for whoever will keep Trump away from the atomic units.
Schlemazel Khan
@SRW1:
WHAT?!?!?! You mean there is no “Berlin Businessman’s Club”
HA ha ha ha. It was actually me just being a smart ass trying to reflect the very real belief of German industrialists that they could control Herr Hitler. I’ll make a point to fix the date next time.
The Other Chuck
@Roger Moore: I ain’t never heard of a little-endian 8-bit machine though.
NotMax
@Major Major Major Major
Great title for a spoof of 50s SF films.
Attack of the Atomic Eunuchs
(Paging Tim Burton…)
lollipopguild
@NotMax: Exactly how limber is Limberbutt?
Villago Delenda Est
@NotMax: Punish the motherfuckers. Punish them HARD.
Villago Delenda Est
@JPL: 50% of the female vote, 100% of the African-American and Italian-American vote. Doesn’t get more mandate-y than that!
JaneE
Political parties have split and/or died in this country before, but if there is a third party movement to be had, it will be in 2020 or beyond. Even if there were a person who could unite the country behind their policies, both the policies and the person would need to be found. .
The Other Chuck
@JaneE:
they have, but has that ever happened while said party was overwhelmingly in control of Congress?
WarMunchkin
@NotMax: I’m always curious about the effectiveness of punitive withdrawal of federal funds. Does that actually have an effect on states?
It seems like the political incentive for Republicans is: double down, lose federal funding for education, accuse Democrats of taking away funding for children, run aggressively on that. I don’t really see it going any other way.
Schlemazel Khan
@The Other Chuck:
Well, the Whigs were nearly tied with the Dems in the late 1850s (something like 47% Whig to 48% Dem with the “free Soil” guys having 4%) and these were the days before the gerrymandering that the GOP has perfected was a common feature to ensure a minority party could hold a majority of the seats. The GOP did get something like 1.5 million FEWER votes for Congress than the Dems did in the last election so I am not sure you can use that as a yardstick for maintaining party unity.
NotMax
@WarMuchkin
Hit and miss (see: Medicaid/ACA coverage).
Withholding of highway funds goaded states into adopting the 55mph limit.
In this case, $4.5 billion ain’t chump change.
Germy
Has anyone compiled a list of all registered parties in the U.S.? Green, Libertarian, Working Families… I suspect there are more than a few I’ve never even heard of.
JaneE
@The Other Chuck: Not that I know of, but I can hope, can’t I?
SFAW
What worries me most is if someone declares as candidate from the People’s Front of Judea party. Then Hitlary’s cook will be goosed.
Origuy
@Germy: I think Wikipedia’s is complete, although they could have missed a few.
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_political_parties_in_the_United_States
SFAW
@The Other Chuck:
Trick question! They may have the bodies, but they sure as hell don’t have “control,” except in the loosest sense of the word.
Germy
@Origuy: thanks for the list… I didn’t know there was a Modern Whig Party! Or Peace And Freedom Party.
And a Transhumanist Party…
srv
If Trump doesn’t get the nomination, we may need to turn to the Oathkeepers. We’re probably headed to a coup anyway once hyper-inflation sets in.
BillinGlendaleCA
@Major Major Major Major:
Don’t walk, RUN!
scav
@srv: you do go for the classics. dog-eared fits the pet-friendly vibe.
joes527
like everyone noticed, a third party conservative wouldn’t snatch the presidency from Clinton, but having both an insane conservative, and an extra-spicy-insane conservative running would do a lot of damage downballot.
Roger Moore
@The Other Chuck:
You’ve never heard of an 8008 or a Z-80?
? Martin
@WarMunchkin:
Well, the most obvious result is that students in NC would lose their federal financial aid. That’s hitting the wrong target, but that pretty much puts everyone from NC State to Duke out of business. Title I funding would go as well, which is money for low-income districts. Special education and head start funding would also go. There are probably countless federal education grants that would be cut as well.
Depending on how they interpret things, they could also lose all federal grants for research from DOE, NSF, NIH, and so on. Not only would that shut down the majority of research done in the state, but it’d also seriously dent the university-operated hospitals in the state.
Now, none of these are targets the feds want to hit, but they would hurt hard and a determined administration should follow through. The confederacy likes to pretend they receive nothing from the feds and owe nothing back. A sturdy reminder might help them get their priorities right.
BillinGlendaleCA
@A Ghost To Most: Just your 2¢?
Frankensteinbeck
@Mnemosyne:
RK is a deliberate ratfucker. I do not throw that accusation around lightly or often, but RK does nothing but crap on Democrats while pretending to be one. Blatantly and persistently so, far beyond any believable honest motivation, like you just pointed out.
WaterGirl
@Baud:
I see what you did there.I can’t un-see what you did there.WaterGirl
@? Martin: Yep Hit ’em hard and make them repeal the law if they want all those free handouts from the government they hate so much. They’re basically acting like the white collar version of Bundy & company, and I didn’t like that they got away with it for so long, which just encouraged others to do more of the same. I’d like to see the feds nip this in the bud.
Just like with kids, you can’t threaten if you aren’t gonna follow through. If you do that one more time, followed by a threat, followed by absolutely nothing if they do the thing one more time. Sets a very bad precedent.
rikyrah
@feebog:
I believe that Hillary will get 80% of the Latino vote. Trump’s approval in the Latino community is lower double digits-under 15%.
Soylent Green
The anti-trumpers who are talking up a third party know perfectly well they can’t win this election with it. Their aim is to Feel Good About Themselves by establishing a new party that will nominate only True Conservatives (who are not tied to the eGOP) in some future political campaign that is self-funded by Jesus.
BillinGlendaleCA
@Baud: It’s only 10cc.
? Martin
In light of Lynch’s statement yesterday, I think they need to do it. Dems have always been varying degrees of wishy-washy on really defending civil rights as it should be. If you are going to stand up against discrimination as a moral position, and make genuinely clear that these individuals will be defended even if they are in the minority, then you need to be willing to hit the majority over their actions. It’s unfortunate that education be the target, but it’s a broad target and it asks NC to decide exactly how badly they want to discriminate against a pretty small community. More importantly it sends a message to a host of other groups that can sympathize with the LGBT community, that have been historically discriminated against.
The presence of Cruz and Trump as the top GOP candidates can’t be overlooked here. This could be as much about Obama laying down the stakes for this election. Every day Obama walks past a picture of black kids having to be escorted to school by the National Guard because some dipshit state insisted on discriminating against them. I doubt he sees any substantive difference between the need to win that fight and the need to win this one.
? Martin
@rikyrah: The turnout of latino voters will be the real driver. I’m hoping they can hit African American voting levels.
Would like to see women turn out in record numbers. I’m going to have to put my daughter into counseling just from the psychological damage of realizing that the majority of voters in this country want someone so obviously dismissive of women leading the most important nation on earth.
The Other Chuck
@Roger Moore: i don’t recall needing to bit-swap on a Z80 though – every op worked on whole bytes. maybe a different story for hardware hackers.
Lurking Canadian
@Roger Moore: You have an idiosyncratic definition of endianness. Most people use it to refer to the byte ordering of multi-byte quantities. You are using it to refer to bit ordering within a byte.
In principle, of course, somebody could design such a machine, that counted 0000 0000, 1000 0000, 0100 0000, 1100 0000, 0010 0000. For that matter, the magic of Boolean algebra means that a really dedicated nut could design a machine with random bit order, that counted 0000 0000, 0100 0000, 0000 0100, 0100 0100…
I am fairly confident, however, that nobody ever has.
Jeffro
@Soylent Green:
They should have done it a long, long time ago if they were going to have a chance of winning. Leave Trump the hollowed-out, completely unfunded shell of the Republican Party and slam it as the party of know-nothing racists while on their way out the door. Start a new ‘Freedom Party’ that leaves all the bigotry behind. Start focusing on pocketbook issues instead of bathroom/bedroom issues…
…and that’s where I stopped, because there already is a party that does all of that (albeit not all that well at times), and it’s called the Democratic Party. And most everyone knows it, and so there’s no room to rebrand here unless they’re going to argue of minutiae. Meanwhile, the Sanders wing is trying to pull the Dems even further left, (and not doing too bad a job of it with the young folks) and so the entire national conversation shifts…
Jeffro
@Jeffro: (whoops that was ‘argue about minutiae’)
Anyway, to my biased eyes, the Dems have shifted fully into a centrist, solutions-oriented, inclusive, strong AND smart on national security, right-side-of-history re: civil rights party. I don’t see how the GOP rebrands itself here to capture a national majority for a long, long while.
WarMunchkin
@WaterGirl:
“That argument is so easily dismissed that I’m puzzled why it’s even made”. Ok, ok, I know this isn’t foreign policy, couldn’t resist.
@? Martin: That “wrong target” thing is what interests me, though. Why should Republicans give two shits about punitive funding cuts that ultimately hurt Democratic constituencies and either depress Democratic turnout or break Democratic Party ID trends? In one sense, they hold more cards than we do, don’t they?
The Other Chuck
@Lurking Canadian: little-endian machines typically do store the bits in reverse order too, but that’s only something you’re going to maybe see at the RAM controller’s level, not assembly. ahh the wonderful tangents of BJ.
The Other Chuck
@WarMunchkin:
I think they’ll notice when Duke has to start cancelling programs.
The Lodger
@A Ghost To Most: He’s just an asciitable boy.
? Martin
@WarMunchkin:
Education cuts hurt everyone. Go check out Brownbacks approval rating. Democrats champion education in a social construct whereas Republicans do it in a family/community construct (hence the support for home schooling, shifting power from fed to local, etc.) It’s wrong to assume that Republicans don’t care about education, it’s more accurate to say they shift its value from society at large to individuals.
Their response could be ‘fine, we’ll fund it locally’, but we’re talking about 25% of the entire state budget here. This would destroy their higher education system including the privates like Duke. That simply won’t be tolerated.
So no, they don’t hold more cards. The key is to not focus on what each side gets but on what each side loses. Are North Carolinians so committed to this discrimination to give up $500 per resident? I don’t think they are. I don’t think most of them give a shit either way, to be honest.
The Lodger
@Roger Moore: Wasn’t Will Sampson a big-endian?
otto
It reminds me of Tobias Bluth suggesting an open marriage. He says when he was an analrapist that he would counsel couples to try it. They deluded themselves into believing it would, but it never did.
But, it might work for them.
JanieM
Chait: “Every state gives its electoral votes to the candidate who receives the most votes.”
I haven’t read the whole thread yet so maybe someone has noted this already, but it’s even more irritating than just any old non-entity being wrong on the internet when one of these know-it-all pundits gets the basic facts wrong.
WarMunchkin
@? Martin:
I don’t see this as mattering though? What matters is whether the Republican legislature – in particular their governor – is prepared to give up that much per resident. I think they are because their ideological loyalty trumps any financial incentives or disincentives the federal government could provide.
To me, this looks like a political question. We could blockade the state, ban medical supplies from entering, starve it and implement the Anaconda plan if we wanted to, but it’s not like they’ll repeal the bill – they have the votes to make it the law of the state. What matters is their voters changing their elected officials in November, and I don’t see them doing that if a Democratic administration is the one seen as doing harm to the North Carolinian electorate. Why should they vote for Democrats if that’s the case?
Lurking Canadian
@The Other Chuck: Really? I have worked with microcontrollers of both types. I have never seen a machine in which the bit labeled D0 had any place value other than 1.
Have you got an example? This is exactly the sort of weird shit I like to use to enliven lectures. I thought the (possibly legendary) prime-numbered word sizes of the USSR was the strangest thing I’d ever heard of, but a processor that actually manipulates data backwards would be even better.
Ben Cisco (onboard the Defiant)
@WarMunchkin: The people of this state will not let McCrory get away with this. There’s real anger here, and he was already in a bind. AG Cooper (running against him in the fall, btw) told him this was unconstitutional, and he won’t defend it in court. He’s going to get his ass handed to him.
J R in WV
@Ben Cisco (onboard the Defiant):
Even if the state’s edumacation dept is closed due to lack of federal funding?
Because I think the DOJ really needs to do that, if the state won’t at least suspend enforcement of their odious bathroom offensive act until after the courts have their swing at that shit-pinata.
As remarked above, you can’t tell someone you’re going to punish them if they do something, then not punish them, and then expect them to take you seriously ever again. And that governor needs punishment so badly….
billb
The Big Idea on the rethug side I heard, is to back Gary Johnson and split the Electoral College so that Hills can’t get to 270-land. In concept GJ could pull some middle vote from her.
garyjohnson2016.com/
THEN the House gets to vote in one of the 3, and picks GJ
BUT they force him to pick a rethug as VP, as voted in by the Senate/Mitch.
THEN the KochSuks come in and bribe/threaten GJ into resigning once sworn in, BOOM = rethuyglican prez.
The Other Chuck
@Lurking Canadian: I couldn’t begin to tell you about pinout compatibility. I was thinking of the Datapoint 2200, which had a completely serial memory access mechanism and accessed memory backwards, from least significant bit to most. I’m told it’s the reason little-endian exists in the first place.
Ian
@WarMunchkin:
As funding cuts wouldn’t take affect until 2017, it would not affect the election directly. Only the discussion of the upcoming cuts would affect the election.
WarMunchkin
@Ian: Aaand that’s the answer. Thanks. I guess I’ll just hope that Democrats win.
NotMax
@The Other Chuck et al.
Fairly certain the initial comment about big and little endian was a reference to the war between Lillliput and Blefuscu in “Gulliver’s Travels”
@evoteAmerica
@Roger Moore: If a majority of Californians support big endian, he’s big endian. If a majority of Californians support little endian, he’s little endian.