The Washington Post broke the news yesterday:
Fox News announced guidelines Wednesday that will winnow the field of participants in the first Republican debate of the 2016 presidential campaign.
The network will require contenders to place in the top 10 in an average of the five most recent national polls in the run-up to the event, narrowing what is expected to be a field of 16 or more by the Aug. 6 event in Cleveland…
Meanwhile, CNN laid out a different approach for the second debate on Sept. 16, which will be split into two parts — one featuring the top 10 candidates in public polling and a second that will include lower-tiered candidates who garner at least 1 percent in polls. The forum, being held at the Ronald Reagan Presidential Library in Simi Valley, Calif., will also require participants to have at least one paid campaign worker in two of the four early voting states.
Determining which contenders will get to participate in the official forums sanctioned by the Republican National Committee has been a challenge for the cable news network and party officials. No GOP primary debate has ever featured more than 10 candidates…
The top 10 contenders in the five most recent national polls are former Florida governor Jeb Bush, Sen. Marco Rubio of Florida, Wisconsin Gov. Scott Walker, Sen. Rand Paul of Kentucky, Sen. Ted Cruz of Texas, former Arkansas governor Mike Huckabee, retired neurosurgeon Ben Carson, New Jersey Gov. Chris Christie, real estate tycoon Donald Trump and former Texas governor Rick Perry, according to a Washington Post analysis. Former U.S. senator Rick Santorum of Pennsylvania and Ohio Gov. John Kasich are a fraction of a point behind Perry…
Missing from the teevee, under this scenario, would be the only Vagina-American candidate (Fiorina), the Not-White Male Who’s Actually Been in Government (Jindal), and the GOP’s Face of Aggressive Foreign Policy (Graham); also, quite possibly, Last Cycle’s Runner-Up (Santorum) — under ‘normal’ Repub rules, 2016 should be “his turn”. But we would get to watch Trump steal time from the “serious” candidates, so there’s that!
Dave Weigel checks in with a couple of politicians who’ve lived this nightmare…
… In 2012, former New Mexico Governor Gary Johnson made it into a Republican debate in Greenville, S.C., then found himself shut out of almost every other televised contest. He remained irritated that the networks based their decision on polling that did not include him.
“It’s important to recognize that in these last few cycles, it was the media that was in charge, not the parties,” said Johnson. “If you get blackballed by one, you get blackballed by all of them. I pissed someone off in the board room–I don’t know who and why.”
Former Ohio Representative Dennis Kucinich, who ran for president in 2004 and 2008, found himself invited to the latter race’s initial debates and kept out of most of the key ones. Like Johnson, he assumed that the media was making calls to keep out certain voices, suggesting that at least one debate dis was tied to his support for universal health insurance.
“It’s very easy to use the media holdings to try to suppress points of view that go against the profits of larger corporations,” said Kucinich. “There are already a substantial number of people disgusted with the parties, and this adds to that.”….
Our Savvy Modrun Media Pundits might suggest that Weigel’s choices illustrate the correctness of the gatekeeping procedure — both Johnson and Kucinich were considered, by all Very Serious People, as sideshow novelties rather than actual candidates. Those outside the charmed circle of the Media Village would probably notice that both sides are still blaming The Media…
The political Twitterverse, of course, is full of helpful suggestions:
No. Debates. End. The. Farce.
— John Podhoretz (@jpodhoretz) May 20, 2015
This differs from the real debates how? RT @daveweigel 90 minutes of primal screaming instead. Loudest one wins. https://t.co/QnzKGgMiIX
— Daniel Drezner (@dandrezner) May 20, 2015
Instead of arbitrarily limiting to 10, FoxNews should have play-in debates for lower GOP seeds: i.e. Huck vs Cruz. Winner to big stage.
— Steve Schale (@steveschale) May 20, 2015
I was thinking Reince Priebus should just make the GOP primary a silent auction between the Kochs and Sheldon Adelson.
President Obama tells Neo-Cons and warmongers to go fuck themselves
Green Lantern theory of foreign policy strikes again. We could make Iraq into a peaceful, pluralistic, democratic state, if only the President had the will.
White Trash Liberal
Fuck you Podhoretz. This is your beast.
Karen in GA
To be fair, it Is a farce. But not for the reasons Podhoretz thinks.
Meanwhile, Iggy tries to help. And you’ll get to see what Phoebe looked like.
And because I’m married to a very nice man, I’ve submitted an application for a schnauzer mix at a local rescue. (Don’t tell Iggy.)
I think it should come down to a pie-eating contest. Or maybe hotdogs, like at the Nathan’s 4th of July contest. Very patriotic, and Republicans are so fond of the phrase, ‘being forced down our throats.’
So many rising stars in the Republican Party.
And God told each of them to run. He’s really mean to crush the hopes of so many of them.
The BENGHAZI! committee is leaking Hillary’s emails today. They’re doing so because people are traveling for the holiday and they want to bury the fact her emails exonerate her.
Sadly Sy Hersh has pushed the conspiracy theory that BENGHAZI was a arms deal gone bad. Predictably, Griftwald has been pushing the conspiracy theory that Hillary is covering up.
Well, here’s Hilary’s email:
I’m sure Hersh and Griftwald will retract their smears and issue an apology to save their reputations, right.
I.e. no people who just have a book to sell.
So the requirement is to have 2 (two) paid campaign workers approximately 4 months before the first primary. I guess most congress candidates is vaguely competitive seats beat that.
Have you seen the Iowa photos of candidates and corn dogs?
Loser to the guillotine? I’d watch that.
Whatever other issues Democrats will have with their primary, I’m pleased this won’t be one of them.
Voted off the private island!
That Drezner tweet is on the money. Also earlier today:
Also know as Deep Bench™
Heh. You speak Village.
@Karen in GA:
I’m sorry about Phoebe. 15 is a good long run for a cat, but I know that doesn’t make it hurt any less.
Fun story in the Guardian on the evolutionary relationship between humans and dogs.
And a bit of nuance
@Baud: The new tagline should read, “Stewardess, I speak Village”.
Big ole hound
I think they should have a “quote from the bible” playoff someplace in tornado alley and see who gets spared so we would know who really has been blessed.
@Karen in GA: Dogs are social creatures and like a companion.
@Karen in GA:
Just can’t keep the specks of dust out of my eyes.
I blame living in DC, I’ve suffered contagion by the VillageBorg through osmosis. But maybe it’s a marketable talent?
I left you hanging the other day on our Wolf Hall discussion because I had to run off, sorry!
@Big ole hound: That does give Huckster a bit of an advantage being that he’s a preacherman.
Also, too, you don’t know squat. “The truth about poo: we’re doing it wrong ”
Throwing a few things out there before I take off for the holidays. Everyone have a great time doing whatever you do.
OT, but the Duggar dude who works at the Famy Research Council confessed to abusing four of his sisters. Ma and Pa Duggar knew, and swept it under the rug. Sick.
Tree With Water
You’ve seen or heard the TV stations that broadcast 24 hours of yule logs burning in the fireplace at Christmastime?
If I owned a TV station, while the republican “debates” were being broadcast, I’d instead broadcast a pack of coyotes howling it up, for all those who can’t stomach the real thing, but want to stay informed. Because there wouldn’t be anything whatsoever to differentiate the two.. (I once thought I knew what a corkscrew-up-and-through-the-spine sensation felt like after hearing peacocks screetch, but nothing compares to coyotes howling for blood).
You could work as a flight attendant out of D.C. See @BillinGlendaleCA.
@Karen in GA: Aw, does that mean the Phoebe situation ended sadly? I’m sorry.
Wouldn’t the correct Conservative solution be to let the market decide? I propose that the candidates bid, with the 10 who are willing to pay the most given spaces at the debate.
Karen in GA
@Mnemosyne (iPhone): Thanks. She was a great little girl, and I’m glad I got to spend 15 years with her.
Karen in GA
@WereBear: It did, yesterday afternoon. She kneaded my arm one last time, then passed away before the vet came in with the injection. A good way to go.
I used to dream of being a stewardess when I was five. But then I wanted to be an archeologist!
@Shrillhouse: I am so completely unsurprised. That makes three for three with the Quiverfull being riddled with abusers; Gothard, that Vision Forum creep, and now the famous family.
Karen in GA
@Tree With Water: I was thinking coked-up howler monkeys, but your idea works too.
I swear, the Eurovision Song Contest this week will be less chaotic, despite taking place in multiple languages, over 3 nights, and with about 40 countries taking part and voting. And it will have more serious politics in it than the GOP Klown Parade.
Karen in GA
@Karen in GA: Karen, I missed the news of Phoebe’s passing. I’m so sorry to hear that. You gave her many wonderful years and tried to give her many more, but it wasn’t to be. She’s over the rainbow bridge with Smudge, and all the other Juicer pets that have gone before. RIP Phoebe.
No problems. I had to run myself. This has been a busy week, including evenings.
I never read the books, but just ordered the most recent. I was looking at a Guardian article noting that the author had won one book prize unanimously.
When I have more time, I want to throw some things up on a couple of other historicals, including a Japanese TV serial about the warring era, which paralleled the Tudor period.
I am also trying to catch up on the controversy on the latest episode of Game of Thrones, and how some are wrongly insisting on treating that show as an allegory about English history.
@Karen in GA: I guess she decided it was time. and fifteen is a very good run!
Kucinich got 1.42% of the vote in 2004 and 1.35% of the vote in 2008 in NH. Doesn’t the anemic results make him a novelty?
The little novelty was last seen 3 months ago on Fox News, where he works as a “Fox News Democrat” saying Hillary lied about…. wait for it…. BENGHAZI!
The GOP Masters Debate
Try saying that 10 times in a row, REINCE!
@Karen in GA:
Oh no. Did I miss some sad Phoebe news?
Ugh. I feel for you. We lost three beloved family pets in a short time. The worst.
I’m so sorry.
Relegation! Promotion to the big leagues!
Candidates from the modern Republican Party having a debate is like a tribe of pygmies having a basketball dunking contest. It will be utterly pointless.
@WereBear: It’s a creepy worldview that thinks women are to be used just for breeding anyway; they have no value other than that. So abusing younger ones is just training. And the Duggars had way too many kids to keep track of anyway, the oldest were parenting the youngest while dad was banging mom to produce the next victim.
This outrage by Fox News will not, and cannot stand.
All right thinking people (Democrats and BJ comenters) need to start a letter and social media campaign, demanding that Fox News quit trying to shut down free and open debate.
Fifty four GOPers, or fight, at the first debate!
No not hot dogs. I want some of those awesome Iowa State Fair corn(pr0n)dog candidate photos.
I also never read the books but hope to read them after my summer classes are over.
I will keep my eye out for the other historicals.
@Zinsky: Their real challenge is trying to differentiate. The whole crowd say the same things.
Beat me to it!
Karen, I’m so sorry about Phoebe. It’s always too soon.
She had a striking face!
How about having a deep fried butter eating contest? The last one with functioning coronary arteries is declared the winner.
ya know what. it should be bernie. it should.
now when johnnie admits it’s bernie, he will be, perfected.
@Roger Moore: The way things are going there’s going to be competition involving who can throw the most poor people into a pit full of hungry crocodiles.
@Little Boots: A debate with Bernie taking on the whole GOP field would be cool. Add some cooking show tournament death match drama and lighting and it would be compelling TV. Make Anthony Bourdain one of the moderators, and you would have an audience.
Kuchinich is nothing. Wait until Alan Grayson starts sucking up the air time with his antics. He’s the candidate for democrats who want their own version of the tea party and they’ll egg him on. Better to lose a senate seat with a blue dog who runs under the radar that lose it with Grayson who can’t stay away from a camera or a microphone.
that would be a thing. that would be awesome.
The conditions for the Faux News debate is laughable. I bet they will hire the Unskewers to help the determine which polls are legitimate to use in determining who makes the stage.
My guess: Jeb and anyone else the Koch Brothers and Sheldon Adelson says is okay to go on with him.
And women only make up 53% of the population!
In one article I read, Greenwald’s (only) counterargument against criticism was that Democrats don’t like him praising Rand Paul because we don’t want to admit we like killing babies. The words he used, no less.
EDIT – @jl:
I am reminded of when Obama was invited to the Republican Caucus Q&A. They apparently thought they could gang up on him verbally. He wiped the floor with them. All of them. Was that the one where he told McCain that he’s not president?
The Raven on the Hill
Useful information about getting insurance on the health insurance exchanges if you are self-employed and have a large drop in income: start the process early. In my state, you will need to prove that you have been abruptly impoverished to be eligible and it will take several weeks to process that proof.
The ACA tax credit was not made for self-employed people with uncertain incomes.
They also ran a story with video of police officers in Columbia saving a dog who was drowning. They ran into rushing water to save the little pup.
He came to this very site and claimed we all hate Muslims.
Liberals say people shouldn’t take Republicans seriously, but too many of us can’t quit GG.
@Karen in GA: Sorry to hear that Phoebe has passed. It sounds as though you did everything you could. My thoughts are with you.
EDIT – Removed, because life is too short to rant about Greenwald.
That was a healthcare forum that happened after the republican Q&A ( which was a thing of beauty). They haven’t invited him back.
Maybe some free association butter sculpting- wonder how many Reagan busts there would be??
oh seriously? really? goddammit. glenn!!!!!
Honestly, I am really not wild about the “Iraq is going to hell and it’s all because the darned Iraqis aren’t working hard enough!” narrative that’s been Conventional Wisdom among both parties and all assorted VSPs since 2004 (at the latest) either. But I understand it’s probably the closest thing to the truth that America’s delicate pride can stomach, so, eh. It’s certainly better than the crowd screaming “we totally CAN do it for them and if not at least kill em all!”
Actually a playoff system might work. Have head-to-head 30 minute debates. If there’s 16 candidates that’s 8 debates right there. Each debate uses the same questions and formats and are recorded during the afternoon. Grading shall be done by audience members and Toastmasters.
Eight winners proceed to the second round. This will be an open 45-minute melee where each debater presents his/her own question to the group and have the others answer (questioner asks person on his/her right if they’re Republican, to the left if it’s Democrat). The audience grades overall performance and the top four scorers move on to the third round.
Third Round involves Vulcan battle staffs in a Thunderdome. All contestants are suspended on bungee cords and are allowed to use the whole space. Survivor wins.
Every Republican voter can say the same thing.
And I would go with self-promoting prima donna. I will assume, however, that he actually believes in the things he advocates for.
@Karen in GA: So sorry to hear this. It sounds like Phoebe was much like my one and only cat as a child. Be well, and I hope you get your new dog friend soon.
Ugh. And now I can’t delete in response to your edit.
and in fairness the NSA is complete bullshit, also too.
And Kucinich got 1.35 with less than 1/3rd as many candidates in the race.
whatever happened to that glorious dwarf?
Master debaters, the lot of them.
@Karen in GA: Condolences on your loss. She had a fascinating face and a knowing look.
@Tree With Water: WPIX-TV FTW!
Those are lirpas, not “Vulcan battle staffs”. Turn in your nerd card immediately.
Ughughugh. Reading the coverage on Wonkette creeped me out, because Mom Duggar is all about “forgiveness.” LoveJoyFeminism has a lot of great coverage about how demanding “forgiveness” is used as a club against kids in fundie families to force them to associate with their abusers. It’s basically a “Get Out of Jail Free” card for abusers, and really sick.
@Karen in GA: Sorry you lost your good old cat.
@Little Boots: He wanted to run in WA, but the voters here wanted no part of him.
The GOP led House committee vindicated Clinton for Benghazi back in November last year. If Hersh/Griftwald has new information, why in the world aren’t they sharing it with the GOP?
Trump made the cut. Think about that for a second
I’d like to see them take the approach Monty Python did to determine the upper class twit of the year.
should we all close ranks around bernie? I don’t know. but I’m starting to think yes.
@Shrillhouse: He’s just researching his family.
@Little Boots: I’m voting in a Democratic primary, so I’m limiting myself to members of the Democratic party.
is he a democrat at this point? not sure.
@Karen in GA: I am very sorry. I lost my old cat in 2006, longtime dogfriend in 2013 and another, just a pup, this last January.
You never forget. Especially this last one, because he was so young, I suspect he’s going to be on my conscience for the rest of my life.
To be fair, they could well be “staffs” also, too. There are probably Vulcan limericks about various warriors’ staffs.
Doesn’t Foster Friess own a candidate as well?
I think that’s the more accurate description of the affair.
ya know what we need? we need steeplejack.
Karen in GA
Thanks for the kind words, everyone. Phoebe was a purring affection machine, and all she met are better for having encountered her.
@BillinGlendaleCA: I’m just wondering if Iggy figures we’re his companions, and if he’d view another dog as an interloper. We’ll see how he reacts when he meets his potential new friend, whoever that turns out to be.
he is evil/
because of love:
@Cacti: You win!!
Tree With Water
Driftglass writes: “But over in this universe, there is no downside to being Bill Kristol. He’s like a puppy who has been tossed a T-bone every time he shit the rug”.
Those words should be carved on Kristol’s gravestone, come his judgement day. I’ll only add the same inscription could fairly mark the inevitable gravestones of most of those you will see the very next time you turn to the People’s Airwaves for your information.
@Valdivia: @Valdivia: That’s so hilarious. Almost all Western countries have some form of two-tier or single-payer universal health care. How do Canada, England, France, Sweden and the rest manage to suppress the news stories of their doctors having their doors beaten down by police, being escorted away and forced to care for sick people? It must be the brutal iron fist of socialist censorship that keeps this quiet. Yep, that’s it.
Another Holocene Human
Sounds like my great grandparents in Kansas. The house of horrors. Girls got married took fast to get out.
Another Holocene Human
@SatanicPanic: Hey, somebody has to be the mark, and certain GOP voters are enthusiastic volumes.
Another Holocene Human
@Mnemosyne (iPhone): similar thing goes on in eastern cults, if you’re suffering (due to your abuse) it’s your fault because of your thoughts. Really scary when they say you were sexually abused by the guru because you wanted it to happen.
Another Holocene Human
@WereBear: everything about it screamed abuse
I’m getting a vivid mental picture of throwing all the GOP candidates into a pit of rabid wolverines. Whoever comes out alive first….
@Chris: well, what is the truth?
@Karen in GA: I’m so sorry. I hope your heart is doing OK.
Another Holocene Human
Remember, the child molester is a creature of opportunity. These crimes occur because someone has power over someone else and the sure knowledge they will never be punished. It’s not about a fetish or the person’s past. There are people with no criminal history who will rape anyone if they know they can get away with it. Even a child. Especially a child. Children aren’t in a position to engage in socially reciprocal relationships with the rapist so the rapist is not held back by instrumental concerns.
@Karen in GA: There would be an adjustment period while they sort out pecking order, but dogs hate to be alone.
Currently babysitting my seven-month-old niece. I’ll be back home later.
Until then, “Business Cat.”
I know right? My right to healthcare means slavery of doctors and nurses. Gah.
@jl: I saw what you did there
@Mike J: ironically he was the candidate of the 1%. Heh
@Gravenstone: remember my friend, corporations are people too! Welcome President Exxon Walton !
@Valdivia: I await the flood of cases arguing that the ACA violates the 13th Amendment.
I agree, then swallow the madness.
@Karen in GA: I am so sorry. She looks like a wise, knowing girl.
My own sweetheart Kitty (he would answer to nothing else, and God, we tried) left us last year. I still dream of him jumping on the bed and swatting the Kindle Fire to change the page. But he had a long life and we made his last twelve years happy. That’s all we can do.
I am sure there is at least one Conservative in the SC who will think it has standing/merit no?
When I hear Rand say stuff like that it really makes me wonder how people can even contemplate him as a credible Presidential candidate.
@Valdivia: Sadly, I am guessing that there are three.
@Mike J: Except you’re not voting for Bernie Sanders or Hilary Clinton or Jim Webb. You’ll be voting for a slate of delegates to go to convention and it is they who will nominate the candidate. Only those delegates have to be members of the Democratic Party, whatever that means anyway, since we don’t have party membership in this country.
That in itself is reason enough to lose faith in the SC.
Apropos of our Donne conversation the other day: yesterday I was looking for some books for my syllabus and found an old exhibit catalogue from the Folger Library of his marriage letters. Very very cool.
Try “after invading their country, we systematically dismantled all the last vestiges of a functioning state, replaced them with nothing, then sat there with our thumbs up our asses through the entire mid-2000s chaos, anarchy, gang war and eventual ethnic cleansing that resulted while the grinning monkeys in Washington reassured us that Freedom Is Messy, and we’re now doing what we do best, screaming at the people whose boots and bootstraps we just burned that they need to pull themselves up.”
Having a discussion on FB about the ACA right now with a not raving conservative friend. It’s not in the constitution!
Neither is an air force. Rebuttal is neither are horses and sabers. Of course we had those when the document was written but air planes? Not so much. His complaint is that is was listed as a tax so that it could be passed by congress, which of course is not the actual reason it was.
My last question to him was what exactly is your opposition to the ACA. No answer yet.
Just think of it, there will be at least 16 Republicans running for president and not a single one of them has the slightest regard for average Americans or the poor. All will primarily be dedicating themselves to further enriching the already filthy rich and making sure that corporations remain the “people” with the most rights and the fewest responsibilities of any Americans. Truly an appalling spectacle.
@Chris: those are all great points.
I would also add the Saudis didn’t want to accept a shia goverment, especially one that had ties with iran so they fostered a sunni insurgency the same way they and our old “friend” Prince Bandar have funded ISIS.
moreover, the sunni grunts dont want to fight and die for shia dominated government, so when isis shows up they say fuck it. Its no different then south vietnamese troops who weren’t crazy about fighting for corrupt puppets in saigon.
Hey, I’m just glad the Donald made the cut.
@TriassicSands: Exactly. All the Dem has to do is point out that there’s not a shred of difference between these clowns policy-wise. Not one.
@Cacti: I was thinking more like “The Voice.” Adelson, one of the Kochs, and some other Bush family kingmaker donor sit in chairs with their backs to the candidates, then turn around to “choose” candidates to join their team when they hear the sweet refrains that most turn them on. Then they have debate-like performance contests with candidates eliminated one by one until there’s three or four standing. Finally, they go to real debates, with the “judges” scoring the candidates to pick a winner. That person gets the GOP nomination. If they want to maintain at least a pretense of actual small “d” democracy happening, they’ll report the scores on FOX, and pretend to be surprised when the polling and actual primary results match their televised event results.
Wouldn’t it be more honest (and productive, in terms of getting the candidates with an actual chance) for Fox to announce that they’re limiting the debate to the 10 candidates who give them the most money?