Come for the politics, stay for the snark.

Perhaps you mistook them for somebody who gives a damn.

When someone says they “love freedom”, rest assured they don’t mean yours.

fuckem (in honor of the late great efgoldman)

We still have time to mess this up!

Do not shrug your shoulders and accept the normalization of untruths.

People are complicated. Love is not.

Usually wrong but never in doubt

Pessimism assures that nothing of any importance will change.

A last alliance of elves and men. also pet photos.

Too often we confuse noise with substance. too often we confuse setbacks with defeat.

Historically it was a little unusual for the president to be an incoherent babbling moron.

Come for the politics, stay for the snark.

It may be funny to you motherfucker, but it’s not funny to me.

If senate republicans had any shame, they’d die of it.

This year has been the longest three days of putin’s life.

We’ve had enough carrots to last a lifetime. break out the sticks.

Despite his magical powers, I don’t think Trump is thinking this through, to be honest.

After roe, women are no longer free.

The republican caucus is already covering themselves with something, and it’s not glory.

Their freedom requires your slavery.

Take hopelessness and turn it into resilience.

Tick tock motherfuckers!

They love authoritarianism, but only when they get to be the authoritarians.

Fuck the extremist election deniers. What’s money for if not for keeping them out of office?

You are here: Home / Politics / Trumpery / Dolt 45 / Sunday Night Open Thread: That Helsinki-ng Feeling…

Sunday Night Open Thread: That Helsinki-ng Feeling…

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100Comments

  1. 1.

    Cheryl Rofer

    Trump’s one-on-one meeting with Putin starts at 6:20a ET

    Ugh. So it will be ending about the time I start looking at the internets in the morning.

  3. 3.

    terraformer

    It still amazes – and saddens – me that this meeting and everything about it doesn’t seem to worry a sizable portion of the US population, and too many media organizations. But maybe it’s cuz I grew up with Red Dawn.

  4. 4.

    Sister Golden Bear

    Reposting from the dead morning open thread downstairs (hey, it’s morning here in Thailand and I wasn’t awake when I posted…)

    Just wanted to thank everyone again for the well wishes.

    @Elizabelle: Yes, Mom died two weeks ago. I have had a lot my plate this past weeks, a lot. Silver-lining is that everything happened while I was still there. Mom had wanted me to go ahead with the surgery — the waiting list is more than a year-and-a-half — and my worst fear was that she would die while I was here and unable to return.

    @SiubhanDuinne: I’ll probably be commenting more than usual, since I live near San Francisco and my day job is really busy, so normally I only get a chance to comment on the late-night threads. Though there’s likely to be radio silence from the 20th-27th while I’m in the hospital, since I’ll be on some pretty heavy pain killers.

    Of course, I just realized with the time difference, I may end still only being open to comment on the morning threads and the late-night threads.

  6. 6.

    BC in Illinois

    I have sadly come to the conclusion that Jamison Foser spells out:

    Trump wants Russia to continue helping Republicans hold power

    Why won’t the man Russia attacked our elections to help try to stop Russia from attacking our elections again? I just can’t figure it out.

    The root of the word “collusion” is that people are “teaming up,” working together when they are supposedly on independent teams. Trump is not “teaming up” with the Russians. He is on their team.

    I dread the coming three months.

  7. 7.

    ? ?? Goku (aka Amerikan Baka) ? ?

    “Putin comes to Helsinki after a stellar World Cup, with strong cards to play on Syria, and growing clout. Trump arrives after a difficult NATO summit and British protests. He can not and will not negotiate from a position of strength…”

    Yeah, I’m sure this will fly when the petrol profits are down.

  9. 9.

    Elizabelle

    @Sister Golden Bear: We are so glad to have you. And do spill, about Thailand and whatever. What a wonderful place to recover. Got to be better than the US of A these days.

  11. 11.

    ? ?? Goku (aka Amerikan Baka) ? ?

    @JPL:
    Will it still work? In 2016, we didn’t know any better. The general public wasn’t aware of the ratfucking capabilities that were being trained on him. Has 2 years of coverage on this left us hypervigilant?

  12. 12.

    SiubhanDuinne

    Maybe their meeting is for a mundane reason, like maybe it’s time for Putin to replace the battery in the bug he implanted behind Trump’s ear when they met in the White House last year.

    What the hell is Dana Houle talking about? Putin hasn’t set foot in the White House since GWB was in office. I mean, I get the humour, such as it is, but he could have made his point without tossing in an untruthful and confusing assertion.

    (Yes, I know I’m overreacting to what is, after all, a throwaway line in a twitter. I’m a bit grumpy ?. )

  13. 13.

    JPL

    @? ?? Goku (aka Amerikan Baka) ? ?: Hope so. Every debate, the democratic candidate should avow not to use hacked materials, and call on their opponents to do the same. They need to keep the fact that russia interfered with our elections in the forefront. Will it work, I don’t know.

  16. 16.

    SiubhanDuinne

    @Sister Golden Bear:

    I’ll probably be commenting more than usual, since I live near San Francisco and my day job is really busy, so normally I only get a chance to comment on the late-night threads.

    I rarely have a chance to converse with you — in general I’m asleep during the liveliest overnight exchanges, though I do try to read everything I’ve missed the next day. Anyhow, will look forward to your comments whenever they happen. And again — thinking of you, wishing all success, and so glad you’re able to do something that will help you feel whole and happy and aligned.

  17. 17.

    chris

    Sounds like the last Russia hawk is gone from the National Security Council. Obviously John Bolton’s position on Russia has “evolved.”

    The circumstances of retired Army Colonel Richard Hooker’s departure from the National Security Council on June 29 are in dispute. It’s not clear whether Hooker was forced out or if his detail on the NSC came to its natural end. But what’s not in doubt is that for the past 15 months, Hooker was senior director for Russia, Europe and NATO.

  19. 19.

    Villago Delenda Est

    Pompeo is as incompetent as Donald. I’m still amazed Pompeo managed to graduate from Hudson High, first in his class, no less.

  21. 21.

    Mandarama

    Open thread? I just wanted to report that I’m in WV, purty near the Cole mansion (if I have the location right). Our family is on the first leg of a big college tour road trip for oldest kiddo. I’ve never been to this part of the country and it’s really beautiful.

    I posted about this trip a couple weeks ago—Immantize and Immp are heading south to see schools, and we’re heading north! Trading places. I thought of asking for recommendations, restaurants etc., but it feels like we will just be speeding from campus to campus, city to city.

    I hope we’ll still have some fun. Trying to ignore news of Trump kissing the ring tomorrow.

  22. 22.

    Smedley Darlington Prunebanks (formerly Mumphrey, et al.)

    There’s no way in hell this is going to end well. There’s no earthly innocent reason for this guy to speak to Putin alone. There just isn’t. And 35% of the United States will cheer him on. As long as Democrats are angry about it, that’s all they care about.

  23. 23.

    Adam L Silverman

    @chris: Nope, Fiona Hill is still the Senior Director dealing with Russia on the National Security Staff. Though my understanding is that the previous times that the President has met with Putin in 2017, he didn’t have Hill with him because they met one on one with no deputies. I’m also unclear from the reporting if she was actually in the Oval Office for his meeting with Kislyak and Lavrov in 2017. I know McMaster was there, but not sure if Hill was (she should’ve been, but given the way the President acts towards and around Russian officials, anything is possible).

  24. 24.

    oatler.

    Occam’s Razor? Can that razor gut, clean and spit-roast a useless, treasonous carcass?

  25. 25.

    Steeplejack

    . . . when DT asks for the tape, Putin should hand him a copy of “Goodbye Yellow Brick Road.”

    Autographed by Putin, not Elton John.

  26. 26.

    Spanky

    IN Finland’s Presidential palace? The Finn’s will have that bugged nine ways from Sunday, and of course Putin knows this. And doesn’t care.

    So our allies will have a pipeline to the private talks, so at least there’s that. And we’ll be the last to find out what happened, unfortunately.

  27. 27.

    Steeplejack

    I guess I will bestir myself to check in with Morning Joe to see their live(?) coverage.

  29. 29.

    The Ancient Randonneur

    Hillary Clinton
    @HillaryClinton
    Great World Cup. Question for President Trump as he meets Putin: Do you know which team you play for?
    8:15 PM · Jul 15, 2018

  30. 30.

    Major Major Major Major

    So all the takes will be good and hot by the time I wake up. Excellent. That’s the way I like my news.

  31. 31.

    different-church-lady

    TPM:

    Bolton: Trump’s One-On-One Talk With Putin Will Be ‘Basically Unstructured’

    TRUMP: I can still use the safe word, right?

    PUTIN: *snicker*

  32. 32.

    SiubhanDuinne

    @Mandarama:

    Will your family be able to meet up with the Imms? Do your paths cross? Because that would be a fine kind of BJ meet up!

    P.S. Agree totally about West Virginia. It’s a beautiful state, and I always love driving through on my way to or from Canada.

  33. 33.

    Sister Golden Bear

    @Elizabelle: Thanks. Just wrapped up a two day “vacation” in Bangkok itself. A friend who’s having her surgery the day before mine (happy accident), so we’re traveling together and decided to see a little of Bangkok, plus allowing a two-day buffer in case of any travel delays.

    Found a nice hotel — Riva Arun Bangkok, highly recommend — right by the river, within walking distance of several of the major sights, including the Grand Palace, which has a temple complex (Thailand’s holiest Buddhist site) within the grounds, as well as Wat Pho, which includes the Temple of Reclining Buddha (a 46-meter long statue). The latter is a working temple and not nearly as touristy, so you can find some tranquil spots there.

    We also spent part of yesterday afternoon wandering the Amulet Market, which is only about 5 minutes walk from the Grand Palace but surprisingly off the beaten path. J. and I were the only Westerns there, and definitely got some looks, although that may in part because J. has pink hair. OTOH, right next to the Amulet Market was a Western-style shopping plaza, complete with Dunkin’ Donuts, albeit with some ridiculously cute donuts — one was decorated to look similar to Hello Kitty, and another was the “Sandy Beach” donut, which looked just like you might think, complete with little starfishes.

    Today J. and I are packing up, and at noon we’ll met the driver who’ll take us to the clinic itself, which is in Chonburi, a beach town about 50 miles east of Bangkok. Unfortunately, it’s no Phuket, it’s more of an industrial town and unless you’re there on business or for medical tourism, non-Thai don’t really visit. That said, the surgeon has a “beach house” (more like a mini-mansion) and twice a month he offers field trips there to the patients who feel up to doing so. Supposed to be a nice afternoon, and way to break the monotony of recovery.

  36. 36.

    J R in WV

    @Sister Golden Bear:

    Best wishes from us here in WV as well. Hope everything goes smoothly and you recover rapidly and well, with everything you ever hoped for accomplished. We will think of you often as we wait to hear from you about your recovery.

  40. 40.

    PsiFighter37

    It bothers me that the polite people in DC think this is okay at all. If anything, I would not be surprised if this is an opportunity for Putin to record Trump and get him saying more idiotic stuff and using it as blackmail (on top of the pee tape).

  41. 41.

    Viva BrisVegas

    @Spanky:

    The Finn’s will have that bugged nine ways from Sunday

    Every button on Putin’s jacket will be a bug, with full 1080p video.

    If after the secret meeting Putin leaks that Trump was OK with Crimea and Ukraine (even if he wasn’t), how will Trump counter that? What could Trump say that would have any credibility?

    I think Trump would just shrug his shoulders and say “Sure, why not?”.

    Essentially, the outcomes of this meeting will be whatever Putin says they were.

  43. 43.

    Mandarama

    @SiubhanDuinne: it would be so cool! I’ll try to email, or maybe Immantize will check in here. Our kids are the same age and have similar interests. And we will be in Boston on Thursday (I think? I’m tired!)

  44. 44.

    Adam L Silverman

    @Cheryl Rofer: I know Fiona, not well, but I know her. She’s very, very sharp. Of course that doesn’t get you very far if the principal you directly report to on behalf of your actual principal ices you out.

  46. 46.

    oldgold

    What is the stated rationale for Trump and Putin meeting with only interpreters present?

    I cannot think of any legitimate reason for doing so.

  48. 48.

    ? ?? Goku (aka Amerikan Baka) ? ?

    @oldgold:
    Trump being Trump. That’s probably it. That, and since he’s the President, under his powers under the Constitution, he can meet with foreign leaders any way he wants. Nobody envisioned this could happen.

  49. 49.

    Barbara

    @Mandarama: Just adding re WV, if your drive from WV takes you in the direction of anywhere in Maryland, consider stopping for lunch or dinner or for any reason at all in Shepherdstown, WV, one of the “canal towns” along the Potomac that is very charming. It’s close by Harper’s Ferry, but Harper’s Ferry is hard to visit (almost no parking) and more of a monument to the Civil War than a true town.

  50. 50.

    danielx

    @oldgold:

    Well, see, there’s your problem right there. You’re using concepts like “rationale” and “legitimate” in connection to this whole goat rope.

  51. 51.

    Shell

    Question for President Trump as he meets Putin: Do you know which team you play for?

    Well seeing as Trump congratulated Putin on the World Cup after France won, Id say….

  52. 52.

    Viva BrisVegas

    @oldgold:

    Putin probably speaks better English than Trump. So the question probably should be, what is Putin’s interpreter actually meant to be doing during the meeting?

  53. 53.

    randy khan

    I’ve decided the way I’m going to deal with MAGAs who argue against the Russian indictments is to ask them if they’re on our side or the side of the foreign country that interfered with our elections. The latest one said he was in favor of “justice,” which was a hoot. I just told him he obviously wasn’t a patriot.

  54. 54.

    NotMax

    A few offbeat things which caught the eye.

    1) Northern north north Floriduh.

    Police say a man fell through the ceiling of a New Hampshire grocery store, twice. Source

    2) Snake on a plane brain.

    A central New York man got a rude awakening when a large snake fell from his bedroom ceiling and landed on him while he slept. Source

  56. 56.

    ? ?? Goku (aka Amerikan Baka) ? ?

    @randy khan:
    Yes! Flip the scrip! Put them on the defensive.

    How did the moron react to having his patriotism questioned?

  57. 57.

    NotMax

    @NotMax

    Code fail. Not fatal, just annoying. Awoke from a siesta only minutes beforehand. Ought to read:

    Snake on a plane brain.

  58. 58.

    Platonailedit

    Definitely, putin is coming off on a well run world cup high. Unlike, the traitorous thug’s NATO and UK disasters.

  60. 60.

    ? ?? Goku (aka Amerikan Baka) ? ?

    @Platonailedit:

    Someone should remind Putin that non-whites beat his superior Master Race Russians. That’ll wipe the smile off that sociopath’s face.

  61. 61.

    divF

    @oldgold:
    It was Putin’s idea, but he pitched it to Trump using the words Stalin spoke to Bukharin, 1928:

    You and I are the Himalayas—all the others are nonentities. Let’s reach an understanding.

  62. 62.

    NotMax

    From a WaPo story. Would bet the farm that’s not Dolt 45’s former lawyer whose name is being mentioned.

    A U.S.-based advocacy group splashed light messages on a wall at Finland’s presidential palace urging the U.S. and Russian presidents to help fight injustices against the LGBTQ community in Russia’s Chechnya region.

    Finnish police briefly questioned the projectionists but allowed the light show to continue.

    The string of messages included phrases like “Trump and Putin: Stop the Crimes against Humanity in Chechnya” and “Investigate LGBTQ persecution in Chechnya.”

    Ty Cobb, director of HRC Global that organized the show, said Putin should investigate and hold accountable those responsible for crimes against people who “are being rounded up, put in secret prisons, tortured, some killed — just because they’re gay.” Source

  63. 63.

    danielx

    @Adam L Silverman:

    I just know there’s a true concept* behind the idea of a 24/7 cable channel devoted to the exploits of Florida Man/Woman.

    *Hollywood buzzword. So they tell me.

  64. 64.

    JCJ

    @Sister Golden Bear: Best wishes for your surgery. About a dozen years ago I went to the Tiffany show in Pattaya. It was great. Might be worth a visit during your recovery. I hope you liked the Grand Palace. I was first there 30 years ago and have been there many times. 2 years ago we went there for the first time in a few years – the number of tourists was stunning. I always like the peacefulness of Wat Po. Enjoy some chicken fried with basil leaves – it is one of my favorites.

  65. 65.

    Adam L Silverman

    @NotMax: Here’s the bio:
    https://www.hrc.org/hrc-story/staff/ty-cobb

    Ty Cobb is a member of the senior management team at the Human Rights Campaign Foundation, the public education and outreach arm of the largest LGBTQ civil rights organization in the United States.

    Ty founded HRC’s global department and leads a team of experts who run groundbreaking programs and campaigns that advance and protect the human right of LGBTQ people around the world, including those who are immigrants and refugees. He ensures HRC is providing integral support to advocates and activists who are serving on the frontlines of their LGBTQ movements. He also pushes the U.S. government to fulfill its potential as a leader on human rights and partners with American multinational corporations on global equality efforts.

    Previously, Ty served as a lawyer and lobbyist at HRC, where he focused on federal advocacy initiatives, including the repeal of “Don’t Ask, Don’t Tell”, reauthorization of the Violence Against Women Act, immigration reform, and the appointment of equality-minded individuals to key positions in the executive branch and on the federal judiciary.

    Ty joined HRC after serving as counsel to Sen. Edward M. Kennedy, Chairman of the Senate Health, Education, Labor and Pensions Committee. During his time working for the committee, Ty played an integral role in passage of the Matthew Shepard and James Byrd, Jr. Hate Crimes Prevention Act, which became the first federal law to protect individuals from violent crimes based on gender, gender identity, sexual orientation, and disability.

    Ty began his professional career as an associate attorney at Bracewell & Giuliani in Dallas, TX and Sidley Austin in Washington, DC. He holds a B.A. in American Studies and a B.B.A. in Business Honors from the University of Texas at Austin and a J.D. from the University of Texas School of Law. Ty lives with his partner, Greg Fuller, in Washington, DC and is a proud supporter of Center Global, a direct services organization that provides much-needed assistance to local LGBTQ asylum seekers.

  66. 66.

    ? ?? Goku (aka Amerikan Baka) ? ?

    @NotMax:
    Umm… they do know who Putin is, right? Defender of Orthodox Christianity and white supremacy? He won’t do a fucking thing. Hell, he, along with lawmakers in the Duma, have made flying an LGBTQ flag an arresting offense.

  74. 74.

    ? ?? Goku (aka Amerikan Baka) ? ?

    @danielx:
    I saw a few months back a show that supposedly showed the exploits of police live, all across the country. I thought it was a stupid, insipid concept that could only tarnish the credibility and reputations of the participating police departments.

    Taped, like Cops, is one thing. Still bad. But live? How is any of it genuine? How do you get the alleged perps to sign off. And in real time?

  75. 75.

    NotMax

    @Adam L. Silverman

    One can but savor the thought of someone in the retinue whispering into an orange ear, “Thought you should know that Ty Cobb traveled to Finland to protest against you” and leave it at that.

  77. 77.

    SiubhanDuinne

    @Jay:

    “Floriduh man, Floriduh man,
    Whatcha gonna do?
    Whatcha gonna do when they come for you?”

  79. 79.

    Adam L Silverman

    @SiubhanDuinne: Usually it’s run, shoot at the cops, run while shooting at the cops, shooting at the cops while running, running while being shot at by the cops, being shot at by the cops while running, or some combination thereof.

  80. 80.

    Jay

    @Platonailedit:

    Different Ty Cobb, but it’s Treason Twitler Трамп,
    So he might think it’s his former lawyer,
    Or the dead baseball player,
    depends on the day and the fit of the Depends.

  82. 82.

    Aleta

    Guardian

    Russia must “account for its role” in the 2014 downing of Malaysia Airlines flight MH17 over Ukraine and cooperate with efforts to establish truth and justice, foreign ministers of the world’s industrial democracies said on Sunday.

    The statement by the G7 ministers came on the eve of a summit between Donald Trump and Vladimir Putin, but also just before the anniversary of the 17 July 2014 air disaster which killed all 298 crew and passengers when the airliner was shot down.

    G7 ministers said a joint investigation into the crash had yielded “compelling, significant and deeply disturbing” findings on Russia’s involvement.
    —
    A Dutch-led investigation concluded in May that the plane was struck by a Buk surface-to-air missile controlled by Russia’s 53rd Anti-Aircraft Rocket Brigade based in the city of Kursk. It said the missile had been brought from Russia into an area held by Moscow-backed rebels in eastern Ukraine and was filmed several times on 17 and 18 July in that area.

  84. 84.

    randy khan

    @? ?? Goku (aka Amerikan Baka) ? ?:

    He said it was “typical spin.” I told him I’d given him a choice, and he’d chosen the Russians over his own people, so he’d failed the test. No response to that so far. It’s possible he’s now realized it’s a losing game.

  88. 88.

    Aleta

    “We, the G7 foreign ministers, of Canada, France, Germany, Italy, Japan, the United Kingdom, the United States of America, and the High Representative of the European Union, are united in our condemnation, in the strongest possible terms, of the downing of Malaysia Airlines Flight MH17, a civilian aircraft flying from Amsterdam to Kuala Lumpur on July 17, 2014.

    “MH17 was carrying 298 crew and passengers, nationals of Australia, Belgium, Canada, Germany, Indonesia, Ireland, Israel, Italy, Malaysia, the Netherlands, New Zealand, the Philippines, Romania, South Africa, Vietnam, the United Kingdom and the United States of America.

    “We fully support the work of the Joint Investigation Team (JIT), an independent criminal investigation led by the Netherlands, Australia, Belgium, Malaysia and Ukraine. The JIT’s findings on Russia’s role in the downing of MH17 are compelling, significant and deeply disturbing. The G7 recalls that UN Security Council Resolution 2166 demands that all states cooperate fully with efforts to establish accountability.

    We are united in our support of Australia and the Netherlands as they call on Russia to account for its role in this incident and to cooperate fully with the process to establish the truth and achieve justice for the victims of MH17 and their next of kin.

    “In a rules-based international order, those responsible for unacceptable actions, such as the firing or launching of the BUK missile of Russian origin, which intercepted and downed a civilian aircraft, must be held accountable. To this end, we call on Russia to immediately engage with Australia and the Netherlands in good faith to explain and to address all relevant questions regarding any potential breaches of international law.

    “We express once again our deepest condolences to the families of the victims of MH17. We stand together against the impunity of those who engage in aggressive actions that threaten the rules-based international order, anywhere, anytime, and under any circumstances.”

    https://www.canada.ca/en/global-affairs/news/2018/07/g7-foreign-ministers-statement-on-mh17.html

  90. 90.

    Cheryl Rofer

    @Viva BrisVegas:

    Putin probably speaks better English than Trump. So the question probably should be, what is Putin’s interpreter actually meant to be doing during the meeting?

    As far as I’ve seen, Putin’s English is far from perfect. Even if it were, it would make sense to have an interpreter. Gives Putin more time to think about his answers and allows him to check with the interpreter to make sure he understands what Trump is saying.

    That makes me realize: I’ve seen comments from interpreters on how difficult it is to deal with Trump’s word salad. I can imagine.

  93. 93.

    Mandarama

    @Barbara: Thanks so much for this suggestion! It’s possible that our way back South will pass by that way, since we have to come home through Maryland. I’ll check the maps.

  94. 94.

    Captain C

    I wonder if any of Putin’s interpreters or retinue will be doctors or at least have medical training. I would imagine they’ll want to make an assessment of Trump’s mental and physical health.

  96. 96.

    Steeplejack

    @Mandarama:

    There are several great restaurants in Shepherdstown. I had an excellent lunch at the Bavarian Inn last year. Kind of a “we’re not trendy” vibe, but the food and service were excellent.

  97. 97.

    efgoldman

    @JPL:

    Every debate, the democratic candidate should avow not to use hacked materials, and call on their opponents to do the same

    In congressional and state elections, most people vote on local and personal issues. Dems should mention it, but not to the exclusion of local issues and personalities.

  98. 98.

    DissidentFish

    @Barbara: So, not to be disagreeable, but the Harper’s Ferry National Historical Park is worth the stop. Park at the top of the hill at the park headquarters, and take the NPS bus down to the town. The historical park commemorates John Brown’s Raid, spotlights a 19th century industrial town, and tells the story of African-Americans in the region post-civil war, as well as the founding of the NAACP. Oh, and the railroad too!

    Shepherdstown is the Paris of West Virginia, for sure, but there is a reason why Harpers Ferry is the national park.

    (And if it is Civil War tourism you’re after, you’re better off 15 miles up the road at Anteitam National Battlefield in Maryland).

  99. 99.

    karen marie

    @? ?? Goku (aka Amerikan Baka) ? ?: Amazing how a reality TV star who lies 24/7, has demonstrated he is completely ignorant about everything is given blanket benefit of the doubt where the black guy was questioned constantly. It’s obvious that much of the media believes the public to be stupid enough to not notice. Really mind blowing. You’d think they’d be concerned but apparently not.

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