I hesitate to pay any attention to relentless self-promoter Omarosa Manigault Newman, but her latest broadside against Trump is something. She appeared on the Today show this morning and released a recording of a conversation she had with Trump the day after Kelly fired her, in which Trump acts like he didn’t know about the firing.
“There’s a lot of very corrupt things that are happening in the White House, and I am going to blow the whistle on a lot of this.”
Watch @OMAROSA’s full interview with @savannahguthrie pic.twitter.com/9R2nnDXnIy
— TODAY (@TODAYshow) August 13, 2018
This sent Twitler into a Twitter tizzy, as you can imagine. He called “Wacky Omarosa” a loser and shares that everyone in the White House hated her guts but he hired her because she “begged me for a job, tears in her eyes, I said Ok.”
Trump also says, “When Gen. Kelly came on board he told me she was a loser & nothing but problems. I told him to try working it out, if possible, because she only said GREAT things about me – until she got fired!”
This is confirmation that, as we suspected, the only criteria for working for Trump is to kiss his ass. Trump goes on to say, “While I know it’s ‘not presidential’ to take on a lowlife like Omarosa, and while I would rather not be doing so, this is a modern day form of communication and I know the Fake News Media will be working overtime to make even Wacky Omarosa look legitimate as possible. Sorry!”
Christ on a pony. For her part, Manigault Newman claims Trump is unfit to hold office and that John Kelly is actually running the White House, and hence the country:
“I don’t think he’s fit. He doesn’t even know what’s happening in his White House. General Kelly — John Kelly is running this White House, and Donald Trump has no clue what’s going on. He’s being puppeted, and that’s very dangerous for this nation.”
So, when a pair of notorious liars trade accusations, how can we know who’s telling the truth? Filtering their words through their documented behavior makes sense to me.
I suspect Trump DID know that Kelly canned Manigault Newman — he’s a chickenshit who doesn’t confront people to their faces, so it makes sense that he would outsource the firing to Kelly or at least okay the termination on Kelly’s say-so and then wimp out and plead ignorance when he talked to Manigault Newman.
I also suspect Trump doesn’t really run the country, per se. If he did, he’d be too busy to live-tweet Fox & Friends, engage in petty vendettas on Twitter, etc.
As our first retiree president, Trump plays golf every four days and watches Fox News. He gets trotted out for ceremonial purposes, and there are probably a few people whose job it is to give him things to do, like handing out medals, meeting Bikers for Trump and attending campaign rallies. But Kelly likely does a lot of the actual work, perhaps with the assistance of Pence and others in the West Wing.
And yes, that’s “very dangerous for this nation” as Manigault Newman says, but probably no more so than if Trump were actually running things. It remains surreal that these battling reality TV villains are/were in charge of anything important, let alone the goddamned U.S. government.
schrodingers_cat
I beg to differ. Given his documented hatred of the minorities including immigrants, and his abilities that made him a general. Kelly is far more dangerous than the Orange One in my opinion.
Kelly’s achievements so far:
1. He was the one that kicked the deportation machine into high gear as the head of the DHS.
2. Last year he stopped the DACA compromise cold.
3. It was his idea to separate children at the border from their parents as a deterrent against asylum seekers.
He is more dangerous not less than T.
waspuppet
The problem with saying “These revelation about Trump are worthless because they come from a garbage person” is that anyone who spends more than 24 hours in the Trump orbit is a garbage person. You have to take what you can get.
And yes, everyone knows Trump’s a racist, but revelations that he literally doesn’t know what he’s doing will hurt, at least a bit.
And not only is Trump a chickenshit about firing people himself, but he doesn’t really fire people at all. He’s in regular contact with Lewandowski et al. He’ll be on the phone with her in a month tops.
Baud
You can either have white identity or you can have competence. The well-located minority has chosen.
MattF
I think the most likely WH situation is that no one’s in charge.
Just to take a dumb example, in a normal administration, the repeated declarations of ‘Infrastructure Week’ would have some effect. But in this administration, it’s zero effect, and there is zero prospect that there will ever be an effect.
Gin & Tonic
I just loved that Reuters, in its story on her last night/this morning, referred to her as “former White House aide and reality television participant.” Not “reality television star” nor even “performer” or “actress”, just “participant”. That’s some fine, fine shade right there.
But as Adam pointed out yesterday or the day before, the White House has a huge, gaping opsec problem here, and with every stupid talking head focusing on the gossip aspect of the recordings, nobody (well, nobody with a major national audience) is asking WHO THE FUCK ELSE IS RECORDING IN THERE if they can’t block her cell phone?
hells littlest angel
Congratulations, Savannah Guthrie, for making me feel sympathetic toward Omarosa. Sheesh, what a jerk.
schrodingers_cat
@Baud: The deportation machine is well oiled and running competently.
Gin & Tonic
The right gets another ceremonial scalp, as the FBI fires Peter Strzok.
J.A.F. Rusty Shackleford
@waspuppet: The question to these admin flacks should be, “In light of Omarosa being a garbage person who was hired because she begged Trump personally for a job, are there any other garbage people in the administration we should be aware of who may have secured their employment by sucking off the boss?” They can paraphrase if they want.
germy
“It’s not about my appearances on the Apprentice or about the time I served Mr. Trump in the White House. It’s about the friends I made along the way.”
If she hadn’t been fired; if PEETUS had tweeted some nice things about her, she’d still be out there telling us all to bow down before him.
The Midnight Lurker
I couldn’t be happier that these snakes are turning on each other, but I don’t think we should lend too much credence to what comes out of this woman’s mouth. She pushing a book. If she had been alarmed at all these things she saw, heard, and recorded, then why didn’t she come out and say so right after she got fired? (oh, right… book deal). And by a number of accounts inside the WH (again suspect, but…) Ms. Newman was far too busy planning her wedding on the taxpayer dime to pay any attention to what the hell Trump, Gen. Kelly, et. al. were doing to the country.
She’s just another grifter in a sea of grifters. She is Trump.
Aleta
Yesterday I talked to an AirB vacationer renting the house down the road, only because she was with a miniature Boston terrier puppy and I have breed expertise thanks to Badger. He was not too far removed from the womb and his name was Frederick Law Olmsted, which is funny. She offered I could hold Freddie. He was so warm and malleable that after a few minutes I forgot I would be giving him back.
Le Comte de Monte Cristo, fka Edmund Dantes
@Gin & Tonic:
My thing is this – you’ve got a shitty employee you’re giving a pink slip to. Why not meet her in her working space or yours to discuss how the termination is going to play out? Why use a national security clean space to do it?
Also, Hillary’s server never got hacked.
Mary G
Between Twitler, Kelly, and Omarosa, I just root for injuries. @schrodingers_cat: is right that Kelly is dangerous because he’s marginally more competent and immigration is the major priority that they spend the most time fucking with.
@Gin & Tonic: I imagine that every other country in the world, plus every staffer, plus the National Enquirer, are recording in the White House.
The major plus is that it helps Dems in November to have all this drama going on. Even Republicans that hate Hillary complain about the chaos.
The Moar You Know
She, like the rest of them, is a goddamned liar who I wouldn’t trust to go get me coffee with a five-dollar bill and written instructions, but I still find this believable.
Steeplejack
Someone on MSNBC likened the situation to a criminal trial in which you might have drug dealers testifying against other drug dealers or gangsters ratting out bigger gangsters. The idea that “testimony” is credible only from those who are as pure as the driven snow is idiotic.
I think Omarosa is a complete grifter, and I could well believe every awful thing said about her. But I watched her with Chuck Todd on Meet the Press yesterday, and, regarding Trump and the White House staff, she seemed mostly credible—obnoxious, yes, but credible. She is putting the most exaggerated, headline-grabbing spin on every little detail, it’s true, but there definitely is fire beneath the smoke. And how thoughtful of her to make recordings to illustrate her points! I have no doubt that she has many more and that many people in the White House are sweating bullets.
Seems like a classic “root for injuries” situation. I’m okay with that.
germy
hells littlest angel
@The Midnight Lurker: Omarosa is definitely an exception to the “enemy of my enemy is my friend” rule. Still, I’m grateful for any damage she does to The Orange Better One.
Patricia Kayden
Omarosa shouldn’t make a penny from her decision to work for an avowed racist. Unless she has tapes which actually harm or expose Trump, we really don’t need to hear from her.
Tbh, she sounds bitter that Trump fires her from a high paying job which required her to do nothing of substance except kiss his butt.
Betty Cracker
@MattF: Good point. Maybe the higher level West Wing employees have their little fiefdoms but there’s no coherent leadership. It makes sense that Kelly would focus on immigration since he ran DHS previously and his protege now heads that agency. As a former general, he is likely competent enough to make the trains run on time, which explains why DHS is charging forward on deportations, child-snatching, etc. That’s a contrast with economic policy, which has been incoherent as competing sycophants attempt to take the reins.
Yarrow
@hells littlest angel: I watched some of the interview and noticed that Savannah Guthrie had one of her arms across her torso most of the time. It looked odd and kind of like she was trying to protect herself from Omarosa.
OzarkHillbilly
@Le Comte de Monte Cristo, fka Edmund Dantes:
So nobody will witness the firing.
zhena gogolia
Strzok has been fired.
schrodingers_cat
@zhena gogolia: Seems politically motivated. We are a banana republic, now.
germy
@OzarkHillbilly: Lawyers were in the room.
If they’re anything like Cohen, maybe they were taping, too!
Betty Cracker
@Aleta: Love that name! Will try to get some pet photos up later. Focusing on the political omnishambles is too depressing.
MattF
@Yarrow: I’d bet that, in real life, Omarosa comes across as physically aggressive.
Another Scott
@zhena gogolia: Kinda happened long ago, I assume this was just the final act.
Reuters:
Cheers,
Scott.
Immanentize
Recordings = Receipts.
@OzarkHillbilly: Exaciticatackily — and so threats can be made.
MagdaInBlack
Yes, she’s a liar/obnoxious/overbearing and an obvious grifter. She’s also validating what we already know :
These people could’t run a lemonade stand.
The Midnight Lurker
@zhena gogolia: Great. Another book that I won’t read.
LAO
@Mary G:
Yes, yes and yes.
Platonailedit
In this case, I believe her. The traitorous thug makes it so easy.
germy
Matt Lauer watched that interview and said “That shoulda been me! I would’ve made her cry! I would’ve done a good job for Mister Trump!”
randy khan
@Gin & Tonic:
This is absolutely the big story here. I’ve been in much less secure government facilities where they practically patted me down to make sure I’d surrendered my electronic devices. (I remember the wry jokes about how we didn’t need to worry about our phones and laptops being stolen given that everyone who had access to the lockers was an FBI agent.)
It is mind-boggling that she thought it wouldn’t be a problem to get a recording device (presumably her smart phone) into the Situation Room AND THAT SHE WAS RIGHT. In any normal administration, someone like her wouldn’t have had routine access to that room, and would have had to go through security to get into it in the first place. But it sounds like she was just waved in. I’ve been joking with colleagues today that she probably put the phone on the table in the room to make sure she got a good recording, but the more I think about it, the more I wonder if that might be true.
And for that matter, what possible reason was there to have the meeting to fire her in the Situation Room in the first place? There are conference rooms in the West Wing; she had her office there, and so did Kelly, and all of those were more logical places than the Situation Room. It’s just bizarre beyond words.
LAO
Well, well, well:
I think, maybe, somebody is listening to his lawyers. What’s the over/under on how long it will last? 12 hours?
MomSense
@The Midnight Lurker:
Well at least it will make for an entertaining Meet the GOP Face the Sunday Nation.
Elizabelle
Just sick about the Strzok and McCabe firings. I hope they take a Howitzer to the FBI New York Field Office.
It’s all so political. I just have to hope that Trump and his confederates’ eventual comeuppance is even uglier.
They took both FBI career professionals’ pensions and benefits.
I don’t want Trump and his criminal ass cabinet to get any pension. Or it can go directly to the federal prisons, where they serve lengthy, lengthy sentences.
Don’t even want to think how the traitors at Fox News are celebrating this news.
Litlebritdifrnt
While this is all very salacious I think the more important story out today is that Twitler keeps calling world leaders when they are asleep because he has no concept of international time differences. I should imagine that is royally pisses world leaders off seeing as they will assume that there is some crisis going on to be woken by the President* of the US in the middle of the night, only to discover that Twitler just can’t tell the fucking time.
JPL
@zhena gogolia: The Washington Post article mentioned they are reviewing the texts of others who expressed doubt about the current president. Imagine if you will a purge of all government departments.
I’d refuse to kiss the creeps in chief fucking ring and hope to be deported to Canada.
Yarrow
@MattF: The size difference between them alone was noticeable.
randy khan
The tapes greatly increase the odds that she’s telling the truth in general. She may not release all of them (indeed, it’s smart not to if she wants to sell more books), but she obviously used them as key source material when she was writing it.
Of course, the other thing about her stories is that they are completely consistent with everything else we hear about the Administration. Maybe she’s a really sophisticated liar, and knows to tell stories that are consistent with what we already know, but it’s more likely she’s telling the truth.
Patricia Kayden
@schrodingers_cat: And Kelly has no problem with lying as evidenced by his attack on Rep Fredricka Wilson. He also ludicrously claimed that a compromise could have been reached to avoid the Civil war.
MattF
@LAO: It was in a statement to the WaPo, so it got lawyered. But the next tweet will probably be back to the usual. We shall see…
Steeplejack
As for “John Kelly is running the country,” that was Omarosa’s exaggerated spin from her (recorded) exit interview (?) with Kelly in which he said the White House staff works for him, not the president. That’s standard biz-speak—after all, what does a chief of staff do?—made awful only because of the terrible people involved.
And, yes, I agree that Kelly is responsible for a lot of the terrible policies of this administration, but I don’t buy him as the éminence grise running everything.
There are people behind the scenes “running the country” besides just Kelly: Republican apparatchiks and embedded industry plants. Can’t remember the guy’s name, and I can’t search right now, but there is a lawyer in the White House legal office whose main job, despite his title, seems to be coördinating with the Federalist Society to shepherd the parade of awful right-wing nominees into federal judgeships as quickly as possible. Trump probably doesn’t even know who he is, and Kelly probably doesn’t care. But it’s furthering the broader GOP agenda.
The same situation is probably replicated throughout the executive branch. Every day we see some “minor” news story like “EPA to ease restrictions on asbestos in day-care construction.” Does Trump know, or care, about that? Probably not, except as a talking point for “Slashing crippling regulations!” It originates with some assistant undersecretary who is a former lobbyist for the Toxic Building Materials Council. Repeat ad infinitum.
The Midnight Lurker
@randy khan: I’m with you on this. I can remember when having a tattoo was enough to deny someone a security clearance. This administration has no NatSec. I’m surprised that haven’t let our adversaries mount satellite dishes on the roof.
Unfortunately, security only becomes a hot topic when a democrat is in the WH. Until then, the tawdry details of Trump’s reality show presidency will suck up all the available airspace and ink.
germy
@Yarrow: I think Melania is taller, but okay.
Yarrow
@randy khan: I’m curious why we believe her that she was in the Situation Room. Is there more corroborating evidence that she was in the Situation Room or is it just her word on that matter?
schrodingers_cat
@Patricia Kayden: And yet he seems to get good press and still be seen as the last sane person in WH by many.
LAO
@MattF: So, you’re going with the under?
Felony Govt
Omarosa obviously doesn’t think she will be able to get in on the right wing gravy train (and she’s probably right), so she’s pitching this book that I can’t imagine a lot of people will buy. Rooting for injuries indeed!
I think the significant stories here are (1) the appalling security breaches; (2) confirmation that no one is really running the White House, or the country, except possibly Kelly who is being left to impose his horrible anti-brown people policies at will, and (3) confirmation of the fact that the White House resembles the movie Mean Girls
JPL
@Patricia Kayden: Kelly lied to protect Porter also, because he only abused his wives.
nasruddin
The world seems to be full of people who think they can ride this tiger.
Omarosa and Kelly happen to be two of them
MattF
@LAO: I’d guess so. The whole concept of ‘remembering’ what his lawyers are saying is un-Trumpian.
Smedley Darlington Prunebanks (formerly Mumphrey, et al.)
This is like watching the Red Sox and the Yankees play. You root against both sides. The good news is that, unlike baseball, in this fight both sides can lose. It’s going to be fun seeing both of them leave the field on stretchers.
schrodingers_cat
@Steeplejack: I don’t think Kelly is running everything either, but I do think that he is more dangerous than T, because he is more capable and disciplined.
Elizabelle
@Aleta:
LOL. Love your story about Freddie.
schrodingers_cat
@JPL: Racist, xenophobic and a misogynist. Win, win, win for T and his base.
Adam L Silverman
@Another Scott: It wasn’t finalized. FBI regulations for disciplining Strzok for what he did – misusing his government supplied, unclassified work cell phone for significant personal business (the texts with Lisa Page) – is a demotion in rank from being a director back to being a supervisory special agent in charge and a 60 day suspension. This is what was actually recommended by the FBI IG. He was fired over the recommendation. Basically, someone issued an exemption to policy to fire him in contravention to both FBI disciplinary regs and the actual disciplinary recommendation. He will, like McCabe, take this to court. My prediction is that in both cases the FBI will ultimately settle rather than have to submit to discovery. The DOJ isn’t going to want Strzok and/or McCabe’s attorneys crawling around, under the color of law and supervision of a Federal court, all the communications between the President and AG Sessions. Either direct communications or through deputies like White House Counsel Don McGahn.
JPL
@LAO: His son ate his homework is a new excuse for me. He tossed jr. under the bus.
Yarrow
@germy: Melania?
different-church-lady
Take away the quotes and this statement would be entirely true.
Betty Cracker
@Steeplejack: That sounds plausible to me. Also, the story about the three Mar-a-lago club members running the VA for a year or so fits that scenario.
Aleta
Anyone who wants to?
Why did they have to go in there for their talk? He couldn’t trust his office or conference room would be private?
So he was concerned enough to go somewhere with maximum soundproofing so no one could evesdrop (or he knew there are recording devices in the other rooms?), but he decided not to ask her to be searched.
If he was afraid beforehand that firing her could cause a scene, maybe he was afraid to trigger her mistrust from the start ? Or he underestimated her, thinking himself smarter or able to control her. Now he looks less intelligent, cowardly, and incompetant with personnel.
JPL
@Smedley Darlington Prunebanks (formerly Mumphrey, et al.): Leave the Red Sox out of this discussion.
different-church-lady
@randy khan:
KELLY: “It was a situation! Why wouldn’t I use the situation room?”
Adam L Silverman
@Steeplejack:
This is Don McGahn, the White House Counsel. It is the reason he took the position of White House Counsel. He has a small team of Federalist approved attorneys working on the judicial nominations under his supervision. This includes the KKK curious, ghost hunting nominee that failed to get past Senator Kennedy (R-LA). He went back to the White House Counsel’s Office, which is where his wife also works.
MattF
@different-church-lady: One supposes he could have used the WAR room.
The Midnight Lurker
When is the MSM going to report on the agents in the FBI’s NY office who are at the center of this mess??? The ones who Comey said were the reason he did what he did. The ones that the AG report said were the impitus for this whole mess. The ones who were obsessed with getting Clinton. The ones who had dogeared copies of ‘Clinton Cash’ in their desks. The ones who were leaking info to Giuliani (I thought leakers were worse than Satan)? The ones that took a look at a dedicated server in Trump tower between a Russian bank and a company owned by the DeVos, and said, “Nothing to see here, folks!” You know… Devin Nunes ‘good FBI agents‘. When are they going to fire those assholes?!!
Martin
@Yarrow: There’s been no denying that by the WH, and it was reported at the time that’s where Kelly was doing the firings. My guess is that he was doing them there with the expectation that those conversations couldn’t be recorded.
What’s so difficult here for the public is that the assertions against Trump are coming from Cohen and Manigault Newman and while they are more credible than Trump, that is literally the lowest possible bar that could be set for them.
At the same time, I don’t see how anyone can be surprised by any of this. The WH didn’t bother with background checks for anyone. They’ve knowingly brought in individuals that were security risks and PR risks. Of course security into the Situation Room is lax. Trump extends an impromptu invitation to Russians into the Oval with all of their electronic gear and kicks all the Americans out. And White Houses always have political undercurrents through them – it’s a high stakes stage filled with people that love politics. That said, it’s also obvious that Trump and everyone around him don’t give a shit because they keep inviting people into positions that no manager would tolerate. Who the fuck would hire the guy that covered up the Fox News sexual harassment predators? That’s toxic to any workplace. The manager of your local Taco Bell is smart enough to not do that.
Mary G
Stephen Miller’s maternal uncle, David Glosser, has a lovely piece up in Politico Magazine about his nephew’s immigration policies. His great grandfather arrived in 1903 with $8 and no English and went from peddling on street corners to chains of stores in just a couple of generations. The uncle volunteers with an immigrant relief organization and uses the story of one of his clients to illustrate his theory that Stephen is a big fat hypocrite:
It’s beautifully written and makes the case for not closing the country off:
ETA: added link I forgot, I hope.
gvg
@Gin & Tonic: All of the news stories I saw on TV yesterday made the point that this is a huge security breach. This is not being ignored from what I saw.
Aleta
@MagdaInBlack: They’d rather rob one.
Immanentize
@Yarrow: Why do I believe her version that the firing was in the situation room?
1) She said it was, putting that rather amazing and significant fact front and center in her narrative
2) It is such a significant fact that if it were not true, then the White House would be using every means to sink that fact, which would do amazing damage to her whole narrative
3) The White House could just lie about this like they lie about so much and say Omarosa is lying when she says it was in the situation room, but because there has been no push back at all on this point, I expect she has receipts — maybe she asked Kelly why they were in the situation room on her recording, and they know it. Or another witness? She said, “My husband was sitting right outside the door….”
The Midnight Lurker
@Betty Cracker: And when is the media going to start obsessing about a trio of rich guys who were NOT elected and are NOT accountable to anyone, running one of our most important admins?
Steeplejack
@Yarrow:
Well, Jethrene issued a statement criticizing Omarosa for taking a recording device into the Situation Room, which you would think she wouldn’t do if Omarosa hadn’t actually been in the Situation Room.
Yarrow
@Martin: Thanks. I didn’t remember it was reported that that was where Kelly did the firings. I don’t trust what this WH says or doesn’t say but since they haven’t denied it I guess that’s something.
Adam L Silverman
@The Midnight Lurker: Venona.
Kay
I sort of love that she’s like “fuck you- I won’t pretend this is a normal presidency- deal with me”
They’re all fucking ridiculous, clownish hacks. She’s just less of a phony than the rest of them.
They sure wanted to shut her up, too. They were paying yet another person to keep quiet. Can we get some arrests, please, before this becomes even more of a joke than it already is? Get them out of there.
Martin
I mean, if we needed any further evidence of how poor a witness Manigault Newman is to any of this:
Shit, that was obvious to anyone, anywhere for the last 4 decades had they bothered to take 30 seconds and evaluate that. And that’s coming from the most average white dude of all time. I would assume that a person of color would be at least a bit more attuned to pick up on that, particularly one who was on his show, what, 3 times?
hueyplong
@LAO: Any utterance from Trump that includes the phrase “to the best of my knowledge” is lawyered.
Those of us who remember Watergate know that, at some point, every sentence begins with, “To the best of my recollection…”
Yarrow
@Immanentize: @Steeplejack: Thanks for your comments. Good points. I just don’t trust any of the players and haven’t paid much attention to this latest Omarosa stuff so I’d missed it.
Cheryl Rofer
@The Midnight Lurker:
After we vote in a Democratic Congress to clean house.
The Midnight Lurker
@Adam L Silverman: Dr. Silverman, your mind never ceases to amaze me. I haven’t thought about the Venona Project in years.
Cheryl Rofer
Here’s Popehat’s analysis of Peter Strzok’s situation. Click for the whole thread.
Yarrow
@Kay:
I kind of agree.
She’s not less of a phony; she’s a different type of phony.
Cheryl Rofer
@Adam L Silverman: Could you explain what you mean by this? I don’t see the parallel to Venona.
Platonailedit
@Kay: At this point, she is more credible than anyone of the lying pos in his regime.
Kay
There’s that professionalism we;ve all come to expect from Team Trump. There are 20-year-old fast food shift managers with more dignity and seriousness.
They’re low quality hires. All of them. The bottom of the barrel.
JPL
@The Midnight Lurker: As soon as the investigation is finished. I suspect that it will be in seven or eight years.
schrodingers_cat
Last summer when Kelly fired Omarosa and Scaramucci, he was hailed as a hero and his DHS tenure was swept under a rug by the media.
Martin
@Kay: Funny that Trump notes that she was fired 3 times. After firing her once, he put her on two more times. Further, he developed a show with Omarosa that had her on for an entire season. The only reason anyone knows of Omarosa post-2004 is because Trump kept hiring her, and then hired her on again to the WH.
It speaks WAY more about Trump than Omarosa.
Brachiator
I don’t care about Omarosa. I wouldn’t care about her even if she had video of Trump peeing on the furniture in the Lincoln bedroom. She joined the White House knowing what Trump was. She thought she could benefit from associating with him. And she was never more than a glorified flunky. To hell with her, and to the other lameass scum who have quit or been fired. And to hell with the people still working there.
I wish I didn’t have to care about Trump. But he is president even if he is just the caretaker-in-chief. Bills don’t sign themselves, and even rubber-stamped appointees must meet his approval. Immigrants don’t get scapegoated and abused automatically. It happens because of Trump.
There was one small part of this bullshit that confirmed what we already knew.
To be one of Trump’s best people, you had to want to kiss his ass, or hate Obama, or both. Just another confirmation of what was apparent by Trump’s behavior.
Kay
Also- forget the whole “self promoting, self interested” analysis. The only way we will ever get anything out of any of these people is if they see some profit or personal gain in revealing it.
They’re all self promoting and self interested. That’s a given. Has nothing to do with the truth of their claims.
Platonailedit
eric
@Adam L Silverman: first subpoena will be to Sean Hannity for his communications with the administration ;)
Shana
@MagdaInBlack: But could they run a banana stand?
tobie
The Washington Post just reported that Peter Strzok has been fired, even though the office that normally handles these matters didn’t recommend this punishment. Here’s a link to his GoFundMe page if anyone is interested.
ETA: I see others already mentioned this news. Apologies for the repeat!
boatboy_srq
@Felony Govt: Seems more like Heathers to me, with the intel community as the Heathers: not likeable but not exactly worthy of the end they are meeting either.
Kay
@Martin:
The biggest lie to me is this delusion that once the Trump sleaze clears the building The Presidency will somehow NOT sustain damage.
It will be damaged. It is sustaining damage every single day he’;s in office. The credibility bank account isn’t bottomless. They’re making withdrawals with no deposits. They’ll leave it weaker and worse and someone else will have to build it back up.
Adam L Silverman
@The Midnight Lurker: The NY Field Office meshugas, including the seeming leaks to Kallstrom (who, you may have noticed, has been completely silent for a long time) and Giuliani (who, as everyone has noticed, can’t shut up), are part of the counterintelligence investigation that Special Counsel Mueller inherited. Comey told the Senate, in answer to a direct question, that he opened an investigation into the NY Field Office and the leaks. Venona took almost 50 years to wind all the way down. And the vast majority of the suspects, even though their involvement was confirmed by the counterintelligence investigation, were never prosecuted. Counterintelligence investigations take as long as they take. And done well, like Venona and like the Special Counsel’s investigation, they don’t leak.
JPL
@LAO: Just tweeted no collusion.
Ruckus
@randy khan:
Well, let’s look at it from the direction of a tyrant, Kelly. He certainly does not seem afraid of the power, he’s not shy, and someone is getting shit (literally) done. As much as anyone is running the WH, it’s Kelly. He has to walk somewhat of a line with actually being in charge, consider his “boss.”
IOW the situation room is a power play. Either he knows the place is no longer secure or he’s not nearly as smart as he thinks he is. I’m leaning with number two btw. But that doesn’t change the fact that this is a power play. She, at least we believe so, has no normal access to the situation room. In any other administration we know that she would never have access. Her “job” didn’t require it, there’d be no reason to have her there. But she recorded on her cell phone. That’s not something that anyone would normally even think to try. That’s not normally something that even could happen. Either she knew there was no security or knew everything is so lax that she could risk it.
That’s how bad this WH is, a third rate grifter knows more than the guy in charge or is so unafraid of being caught that she knows she can risk it.
schrodingers_cat
Omarosa may well be a low life but she doesn’t keep getting a pass for behavior unlike the general who advocates for human rights abuses of children. Between her and Kelly she is a far lesser evil.
Adam L Silverman
@Cheryl Rofer: The investigation into the NY Field Office’s leaks to Kallstrom and Giuliani and Erik Prince is a counterintelligence investigation. Comey, in his testimony to the Senate, indicated that he’d opened an investigation into what the NY Field Office did regarding leaks about Secretary Clinton. Special Counsel Mueller inherited this along with the rest of the counterintelligence task force when he was appointed in the wake of Comey’s firing. Counterintelligence investigations take as long as they take. Very little of what was discovered and who was involved are ever made public until well after the fact. And, when done well, like Venona and the counterintelligence investigation inherited by Special Counsel Mueller, they don’t leak.
Joyce Harmon
My question: did Omarosa have a security clearance? If not, she shouldn’t even have been allowed to enter the Situation Room. And if she did – why? Her job title was something about “minority outreach”, which scarcely requires access to classified information. But I suspect that in this administration, clearances aren’t based on need to know, but on status – all the cool kids have one so give me one too.
MattF
@JPL: Quote:
Adam L Silverman
@eric: Those are just the final piece of Hannity’s communications they’re looking at.
Quaker in a Basement
That’s how you get “all the best people.” Or so I surmise.
The Midnight Lurker
@JPL: I’m trying to calculate the damage that these traitors could do to ongoing investigations resulting from this treason in that span of time. Impossible.
Raoul
@Mary G: That cafeteria paragraph had me hooting out loud on the couch a few minutes ago. Popped over here to see if folks had read it.
This level of shaming by an uncle is a thing to behold. Miller really is the lowest of the low.
Martin
@Kay: True. But I’m hoping there is a silver lining here. 99% of what we regard as checks and balances against the executive were nothing but conventions and theoretical threats of inter-branch interactions (impeachment, oversight hearings, etc.) I think we’re all fully realizing what a fucking house of cards that was, and can start to maybe find our way back to something functional. That may be my determined optimism speaking, but it also speaks to why I tolerate further norm-busting. The WH is broken, but amazingly it’s still not sufficiently badly broken for action to happen. If we want anything to change, we actually have to ask for things to get worse.
LAO
@JPL: lol. Somebody tell MattF he’s a winner.
Adam L Silverman
@Joyce Harmon: People without appropriate clearance can be escorted – cleared into – secured spaces as necessary/needed. This is why every SCIF has a sign in sheet. All it means is that all material that the person isn’t cleared to access must be secured prior to the person’s entry.
The Moar You Know
@Joyce Harmon: It’s not just this admin. Most people with clearances, at least the lower-level clearances, really don’t need them. I suspect they get issued anyway because it’s a great tool for firing people. Can’t be challenged or reviewed, unless you want to get a very expensive lawyer and spend millions that you probably don’t have fighting the US Government.
Kay
@Martin:
They’ve done this with all of them- the Stomry Daniels and the sleazy corrupt Manaforts and the Cohens.
Just pay them off and send them packing and we can all go back to pretending ANY of these people are serious about any of this. But they won’t go away! They won’t go away because they ARE Trump. They’re the face of the Trump Administration.
So let’s see it, in all its glory. Bring out every carnival barker and small time crook and put them in the same group with Kelly and Sessions and the rest. They’re the same.
Omorosa and Aventti are more authentically the Trump Administration than anyone.
Mary G
@Ruckus: Yes, it looks like General Kelly’s rep as the adult in the room and a good administrator has been thoroughly debunked. He’s just another barely competent wingnut bigot. Anyone with a brain would have known that the Situation Room wouldn’t intimidate Omarosa.
Ruckus
@Steeplejack:
What makes you seemingly think that Kelly doesn’t know about all the people and approve of them doing their republican jobs – Fucking up the country? He’s proven he’s way out there, rightwing on every subject, this is who he really is. When he was an active general he had a lot of scrutiny and guidelines on how he did his job, even the top guy does. Now he’s the top dog and the only thing he has to do to pacify the “boss” is to not get in the shitgibbon’s way. Which requires not much, as long as one is a far right goon with no scruples. Which Kelly is.
Adam L Silverman
@Raoul: He’s been speaking out about his nephew for a while now. Apparently only one member of the family, other than Miller’s parents, is pleased.
From February 2017:
https://www.buzzfeednews.com/article/ellievhall/stephen-millers-liberal-family-members-have-some
JPL
@MattF: I would have included the tweet, but you can’t copy and paste from real press secretary who posts his tweet. I thought the one on redo of the Clinton investigation was interesting, because no way that would be a witch hunt.
Congrats btw
MattF
@Joyce Harmon: Someone with a lower clearance may be escorted into a more-classified area, if necessary. Supposing that Kelly brought Omarosa into the room to fire her, I’d guess that was allowed, even by the usual rules.
However, it seems that the usual rules just don’t apply in Trump’s White House, so who knows?
??? Goku (aka Amerikan Baka) ??
@Adam L Silverman:
I think McCabe and Strzok shouldn’t settle and should fight this thing to the bitter end to discovery. Can legal teams except donations for cases like these?
Martin
@Raoul: And yet, the uncle again missed stating the obvious, that the reason why Miller can reconcile his own family story with his actions is that he was white and deserving of all of those benefits and these other people aren’t white and aren’t deserving of anything.
Kay
Omarosa is as qualified to lead a “mideast peace process” as Kushner. They could swap in Cohen for Kelly and it would still suck. Doesn’t matter. They’re ALL low quality hires. Some are just more embarrassing and public than others.
The Mooch would actually be better at Huckabee’s job than she is, and we wouldn’t have to listen to the scolding she does. Avenetti would be better as an AG than that little racist weasel Sessions. At least Avenetti can talk.
Let’s have a real reality show and just drop the pretense. It’s more honest.
Another Scott
@Adam L Silverman: Thanks.
Cheers,
Scott.
??? Goku (aka Amerikan Baka) ??
@Martin:
I’m surprised our presidential system has been as stable as it been for so long. Many similar systems have devolved into dictatorships much sooner.
germy
Towards the end of the interview, when Omarosa is eager to wrap things up, she responds to the interviewer’s questions with “It’s in the book. It’s all in the book.”
But the recent news that Guthrie and the others are most interested in came out after the book went to press.
She sort of talks like Trump. They both know how to play the media.
schrodingers_cat
@Mary G: He probably sees all women as inferior specimens of the human species, he favored the wife beater Porter and didn’t believe the wives.
Platonailedit
@Kay: Avenetti is not a part of this turd’s regime. No need to drag him into this.
germy
@Martin:
Exactly.
Same reason “chain migration” from Slovenia is fine.
Adam L Silverman
@Martin: You missed his uncle’s point: Jews aren’t white. Despite Judaism being a religion and not an ethno-nationality, Jews have been treated in the US like other ethnic Americans who immigrated here. Jews became white on sufferance around the same time as Italian-Americans, Greek-Americans, Portuguese-Americans, and Spanish-Americans – the late 1960s/early 1970s. In some parts of the US, Jews, like many members of these other demographics, aren’t considered to be white or fully white. Hence the remarks about the neo-NAZIs turning on Miller.
Platonailedit
germy
@Kay:
I think his presidential aspirations are silly, but I wonder if his idea is to run, lose his primary to a more experienced Democrat, and then accept a position as Attorney General.
Ryan
““begged me for a job, tears in her eyes, I said Ok.””
No doubt she said she’d “Do Anything” for a job… or was she bleeding up the joint?
Steeplejack
@??? Goku (aka Amerikan Baka) ??:
There is already a GoFundMe page for Strzok.
Immanentize
@Adam L Silverman: I think the Harry Potter term is “Mudblood.”
Kay
@Platonailedit:
Oh, it’s the ridiculous sniffing and snobbery around these people. Really? They’re not classy enough to be involved in this clusterfuck? Compared to what? Trump and his sleazy family?
Trump lies to media every day, but Omorosa is not credible? “Credible” doesn’t even mean anything anymore. Is she more or less credible than Cohen and Manafort and Don Jr, all of whom lied their asses off.
Cheryl Rofer
@Adam L Silverman: Venona was complicated by the need for decrypting messages in Russian, which took a lot longer back in those days. It was pretty much figured out by the 1990s – which, yes, 50 years. As in many counterintelligence investigations, there were few prosecutions because of the problem of leaking gummint secrets, which made sense in the 1950s, but less as time went on. The material continued to be classified because of gummint inertia, but Daniel Moynahan, with the help of a Library of Congress historian, managed to blast it out. It’s all declassified now, and John Earl Haynes and Harvey Klehr have written several books on the material, supplemented by material Alexander Vassiliev pulled from the KGB archives during the 1990s.
I agree that counterintelligence operations take as long as they need, but untangling the dishonesty of the New York FBI office will not be comparable in difficulty to Venona. The documents and people are readily available to qualified investigators. What is likely to be needed is to blast the material out the way Moynahan did.
randy khan
@Ruckus:
From Omarosa’s point of view, bringing the phone with her was no risk at all – either they’d make her surrender it before going into the Situation Room or she’d get to bring it in. It turns out it was (b).
Josie
@Adam L Silverman:
What might such a settlement look like?
Adam L Silverman
@Immanentize: I wouldn’t know, never read any of the books, never seen any of the movies.
Kay
@Platonailedit:
Trump says she’s stupid but she was apparently smart enough to record all these fucking big mouths while they babbled on and on. She’s right, too. No one WOULD believe it unless she taped it. Because they’re ALL liars. Everyone should record everything they say. None of them can be trusted.
Imagine working in that place. A huge bunch of nasty, mean-spirited incompetents plotting against one another.
Jeffro
@Mary G: That’s awesome! How much of a jackass does a person have to be to get his uncle to publish a piece on what a jackass he is? (Answer: a Stephen Miller-level of a jackass)
Speaking of folks slamming their relatives publicly (even if not directly): retiring GOP rep Crazy Bob Goodlatte’s son has endorsed the Democrat running for Goodlatte’s seat
LOLOL
Adam L Silverman
@Josie: Their retirements and pensions back. Plus damages.
The Midnight Lurker
@Cheryl Rofer: Re: Verona. Dr. Silverman already answered this, but as it pertains to me, I believe he was telling me, “Patience, jackass. Patience.”
Ruckus
@Kay:
They turned the barrel over and are scraping the scum and worms off the bottom. This scum is so bad the barrel wouldn’t have it inside.
Elizabelle
That’s such an inappropriate dress Omarosa was wearing in the Today show interview. What, was she off to a mid-morning cocktail party?
Platonailedit
@Kay: It’s worse than a farce, it’s the reality. With the rest of the world watching it in real time, unlike nixon’s era.
MattF
@Jeffro: I have a strong suspicion that VA Republicans are going to get slaughtered in Nov. But, needless to say, we shall see…
Platonailedit
@Ruckus:
LOL. So true.
Calouste
@Mary G: It’s rather scary that Kelly, Flynn, Petraeus, the Admiral whatever his name was who proclaimed the shitgibbon to weigh 239 pounds, and however many others manage to climb through the ranks for decades and get to flag officer. The military doesn’t do a good job of weeding those folks out in the 30-40 years they have.
schrodingers_cat
@Calouste: The military is a part of the society why would they be better than the society they serve.
Jeffro
@Jeffro: Also excited to see that my soon-to-be congressional district just lost its long-time GOP rep and is barely ‘leaning Republican’ heading into November. I think between helping toss Barbara Comstock out of office in the 10th and getting Leslie Cockburn elected in the 5th, it should be a fun and rewarding fall!
Elizabelle
@schrodingers_cat: In his post-slandering Frederica Wilson press conference, General Kelly told us that the best Americans are dead Americans. From the transcript (Politico link):
So. If all the finest men and women are dead and buried, why have ANY standards for the White House staff? All they’re going for is a pulse and, hopefully, no projectile vomiting when Trump or Stephen Miller enters the room.
Platonailedit
@Calouste:
There was a reason the military hated Obama who was much smarter than them and wasn’t willing to be their puppet.
Elizabelle
@Jeffro: Dave Brat gotta go too. Outta here, Tea Partier and Freedumb Caucus professor.
MagdaInBlack
@Aleta:
They’d fupp that up too
Elizabelle
@schrodingers_cat: The military (as a whole) is actually somewhat different than the society it serves, as are the police (and FBI, etc.), and that should change, to make us safer among them.
Platonailedit
How is this nutjob narcissist any different than that NK nutjob narcissist?
raven
@Ruckus: See my note on the lawn chairs?
TenguPhule
@Baud:
With Kelly, we have apparently stumbled on the trifecta.
MomSense
Bobby Goodlatte has endorsed and donated the maximum to Jennifer Lewis who is running for his father’s seat in Congress.
That is an impressive thing for Bobby to do. I think we should show some love to candidate Lewis.
MagdaInBlack
@Elizabelle:
Is there ever anything “appropriate” about these people?
Ya, it sure was an odd choice
TenguPhule
@Gin & Tonic:
All of em, Katie!
No, seriously, I expect an investigation will find that every fucking participant, including Trump himself, have been making illegal recordings and most if not all of it is already in the hands of our worst enemies, our allies, and Turkey.
Ruckus
@randy khan:
Oh yes, exactly.
In a “normal” WH there are known limits. In this one there are none. No one seems to know or be in charge. It’s a second grade class and the teacher said fuck it and went home.
This isn’t a small country with no military or power. And it’s not being run as one as much as spit balls, pulling of hair and eating of paste. OK and the occasional egregious breach of the constitution.
Platonailedit
Wonder what all those ‘we can’t take any more Clinton drama’ loony left wackos feel now.
TenguPhule
@schrodingers_cat:
Has this been removed from the official gloom pron list then?
TenguPhule
@Platonailedit:
But her Goldman Sach Speeches!
/No really, some of them are STILL saying that.
TenguPhule
@Ruckus:
Occasional?
Booger
@Jeffro: Special bonus, if we elect Leslie Cockburn, we also get her daughter Olivia Wilde!
TenguPhule
@Platonailedit:
Kim Jong Un is a smart and dangerous man.
Trump is just dangerous.
TenguPhule
@Booger:
Her parents must be real jerks to inflict that name on her.
TenguPhule
@schrodingers_cat:
Because unlike society in general, the military is expected to weed out the worst ones and screen those who get promoted to positions of authority.
Steeplejack
@Platonailedit:
Well, as yet this nutjob narcissist has not assassinated any odious relatives.
Hmm . . .
TenguPhule
@Kay:
I nominate the rack and wheel to extract it from them. And yes, I say this knowing full well just how horrifying both of them are. These assholes forfeited their human rights 18 months ago.
Fuck em.
Platonailedit
@Steeplejack: Oh, if only he could, he would.
Amir Khalid
@??? Goku (aka Amerikan Baka) ??:
McCabe and Strzok would first have to decide they do want to fight all the way to trial. The cost-benefit calculation would not necessarily favour that option. If they choose not to proceed, or if they can’t/won’t accept crowdfunding to pay their legal counsel, counsel cannot continue pursuing the case against their wishes no matter how many of the rest of us would like them to.
Ruckus
@Calouste:
@schrodingers_cat:
The military has strict guidelines. These are a bit loser for the upper end but they exist. Breaking them is career ending. Getting out of line is career ending. And the higher one gets the fewer competition there is and the brighter the light can shine on one person. The limits are not only known, they are reenforced on a regular basis. It hides the flaws, which the military does well, partially because with limited competition it’s even more important that everyone plays the same game or they stand out like the preverbal sore thumb.
IOW you don’t get high up by not playing the game and playing it well. That’s why Kelly looked good initially, he worked at fitting in to a rigid system. He’s now the system, he simply has to be himself to fit in to shitgibbon’s world.
Mary G
Yet another for fuck’s sake, GOP:
It is, of course, getting ratio-ed with “I’m losing hope that you will be convicted at the Hague” and “you made sure that plenty of our troops and innocent Iraqis didn’t get to 83” replies.
TenguPhule
@schrodingers_cat:
To be fair, this bar is so low that merely not being caught on camera saying incredibly stupid and incriminating things is enough for him to ooze over it.
TenguPhule
@Steeplejack:
Yet.
Ruckus
@raven:
Yes, answered you on one thread yesterday eve. I have no idea which one it was.
I figured they had to bring them over, and a navy warship would not have any place to hide them. Every space is for the ship, the crew bunks around the equipment. In my berthing area we had an operating table and steam sterilizer, it was the back up operating area for wounded. As well we had half the guided missile magazine taking up space. Every area was like this. You live and work inside a big killing machine and very little to nothing is done to hide that fact. All the wiring, plumbing, air supply is out in the open, it ain’t no cruse ship.
Amir Khalid
@TenguPhule:
You should be aware that the surname is pronounced “Coburn”. And that in the US it is often spelled that way.
The Midnight Lurker
@Mary G: All fuckin’ Rumsfeld should ever live to see is a stiff rope and a short drop.
TenguPhule
@Martin:
It reeks of them both. He was fucking her. She probably has receipts about it.
Ruckus
@Mary G:
Another shithead Donald heard from.
Seeing him laid out flat would be nice. Is that bad of me to wish that he suffer as many of his ideas/skills have made others?
Who’s going to name their kid Donald from here on out?
The Midnight Lurker
@TenguPhule: Or… (gags)… a tape recording!!!
TenguPhule
@Amir Khalid: How in the world is the “ck” silent?
Elizabelle
@MagdaInBlack: I think she looks like a madam.
The bimbos on Fox (and Andrea Mitchell!) wear cocktail dresses that are merely sleeveless.
TenguPhule
@Adam L Silverman:
I predict that if they do go to discovery, Trump’s people will A) Judge shop for a compliant judge B) violate discovery rules and regulations so hard and blatantly that most people will not believe they’re doing it.
MagdaInBlack
@TenguPhule:
It has to do with the cold stare you get when you pronounce the “ck.”
Jeffro
@Elizabelle: oh most definitely…I’d hate for him to have to suffer through constituents staying “up in his grill” any longer than they have to…
Enhanced Voting Techniques
@Martin:
To be fair to Trump, Omarosa wore a different wig to each interview and that’s why Trump didn’t recognize her. After all were are talking about someone so cunning she was able to break the security of the White House situation room itself!
Jeffro
@Booger: What? No way! That’s awesome!!
Jeffro
@Mary G: How is it possible that someone could live for 83 years and the thing they’re really looking forward to before they depart this mortal coil is…the enactment of a flat tax?!?
Other than Charles Koch and Darth Cheney, that is.
TenguPhule
@MagdaInBlack: Well played.
Steeplejack
@Mary G:
He is getting dragged hard in the comments:
“[Rumsfeld] is 83 and this is the kind of shit he’s concerned about? What about eternal damnation?”
“Being old makes you less of a war criminal?”
ETA: That second one probably came from Henry Kissinger.
Amir Khalid
@TenguPhule:
Shrug. It happens. There’s also an English surname, Featherstonehaugh, which is pronounced “Fenshaw”.
Shell
Charlie Pierce had the same reaction (reluctant to chime in on Omarosa) but Im glad he did.The man can definitely turn a phrase. On the reaction to the news that she taped someone in the Situation Room, “Various conservative suck-fish are in high dudgeon.”
ruemara
@The Midnight Lurker: Sit by me.
I think whoever wants to be in charge of something is in charge until the Toddler feels emasculated and remembers HE’S THE KING, YOU CAN’T TELL ME WHAT TO DO and goes off on Twitter about bullshit. This administration is only bound together by hatred of the other, then hatred of each other. That’s why it seems like there’s crazy whiplash policy going on. First to have a plan gets to implement it.
Omnes Omnibus
@TenguPhule: How would someone “judge shop?”
MattF
@Steeplejack: “Asking for a friend.”
Elizabelle
Just watched the full 10 minute clip. Savannah Guthrie is an AWFUL interviewer. Truly. Awful.
She has a law degree. You’d think she’d be smart enough to ask one question, maybe two, and sit back and let the person answer (and maybe hang herself). Omarosa controlled that interview. If that’s Guthrie’s interviewing style, it is ADD-inducing and doesn’t elicit much information.
It’s like Guthrie is Tweety, with more caffeine.
Adam L Silverman
@The Midnight Lurker: Adam is fine.
Shana
@Josie: I would hope such a settlement would include restoration of pension at least.
TenguPhule
@Omnes Omnibus:
Look for a hack judge appointed by a Republican hack. Arrange to get into their venue.
The Midnight Lurker
@Adam L Silverman: Dad was a Professor. I grew up around the boffins. He wouldn’t approve, Adam.
Brachiator
@ruemara:
Great description. Sad, but true.
ETA: It’s like a real-life version of the Start Trek “mirror” universe.
Trump should have an orange beard.
Omnes Omnibus
@TenguPhule: That is not how it works.
Enhanced Voting Techniques
@Mary G: I am losing hope Rummy will ever explain what the hell he though he was doing with that screwed up occupation of Iraq, but flat tax believer sounds like Rummy is just another Flat Earther.
artem1s
Forget who it was that observed after the Nixon resignation that there were no tanks on the White House lawn; that we still had an orderly transfer of power in the country. Looks like we are going to lose that very precious thing too now. We are essentially in the middle of a military coupe and so many people in the country are terrified of the lunatic in the WH, they have accepted it as the norm, because it beats drinking irradiated Kool-Aid. No way is this going to be orderly, even if this asshole makes it to 2020. No one gets out of this without having shit smeared all over them.
Calouste
@Amir Khalid: It’s not like English is a real language that has pronunciation rules and stuff.
Calouste
@Elizabelle: “She has a law degree”
So does Orly Taitz. And Michael Cohen. And Neil Gorsuch. And Mike Pence.
TenguPhule
@Omnes Omnibus:
You know that and I know that. But nobody bothers to tell these guys.
They don’t follow the rules and procedures. And yet somehow they’re still there.
raVEN
@Ruckus: It was a cargo ship.
Martin
@Adam L Silverman: I get that, but it’s too subtle a point. Every reader splits those hairs in different places. I know this because I grew up in NYC in an Irish family. Sometimes we were part of the white class, but sometimes we were Irish and sometimes we were Catholics, and sometimes were were poor or whatever. Whether we were included in the pure aspirations of society was very situational. So long as there were blacks out there, we were in. The moment the blacks were out of the picture, we were out.
The point being, racists always grade on a curve, and so it’s never clear whether Jews (particularly western European Jews) are acceptable or not for a given reader. That’s why it needs to be called out clearly.
Amir Khalid
@Adam L Silverman:
I’m aware that there are Jewish people of colour, like the late Sammy Davis Jr. I wonder where they stand in America’s race/religion-based class system.
Adam L Silverman
@Amir Khalid: I know where he’d fit in in Israel. Somewhere around the Ethopian Jews, which are above the Arab Israelis and the Palestinians and below the Mizrahi (Arab/Persian/Middle Eastern/Maghrebi) Jews.
randy khan
@TenguPhule:
When you’re the one being sued, it’s not that easy to judge shop. It works better when you’re the one doing the suing.
randy khan
@artem1s:
The military and the Secret Service (particularly the Secret Service) have a strong, ingrained ethic of doing what the law requires. The law says that the new President becomes President at noon on Inauguration Day, and if Congress has certified the electoral votes, I don’t think there’s any meaningful chance the Secret Service or the military would go along with Trump trying to stay in office.
randy khan
@TenguPhule:
It’s not how it works for the reason that I noted – the party suing picks the initial venue and the case only gets moved if there’s some reason that the other party can’t be sued there. (That’s pretty rare when the U.S. government is the party being sued, for obvious reasons.) You only change judges if the judge is barred for legal ethics reasons from taking it, which is unlikely to say the least, and you don’t get to pick the judge to whom the case is reassigned even when that happens.