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T R E 4 5 O N

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You are here: Home / Elections 2024 / 2024 Primaries / Because the Stakes Are So Low (Open Thread)

Because the Stakes Are So Low (Open Thread)

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The battle for runner up in the GOP primary is about to get uglier. The AP (and other outlets) are reporting on a huge outlay from the Nikki Haley campaign on ad buys for Iowa and New Hampshire.

Haley can see DeSantis is on the ropes, and she probably anticipates a bump from the recent debate, after she improbably channeled all of America by angrily calling Ramaswamy “scum.” From the AP article:

Nikki Haley ‘s presidential campaign will reserve $10 million in television, radio and digital advertising across Iowa and New Hampshire beginning in the first week of December, a massive investment designed to give the former United Nations ambassador an advantage over Florida Gov. Ron DeSantis at a critical moment in the GOP nomination fight…

Haley’s move comes as she fights to emerge as the clear alternative to former President Donald Trump to represent the GOP against President Joe Biden next fall. DeSantis stands as Haley’s strongest competition for her party’s second-place slot, although the Florida governor’s campaign has shown signs of financial strain following a tumultuous summer…

“Nikki Haley’s momentum and path to victory are clear,” [Haley campaign manager Betsy] Ankney said. “The same can’t be said for Ron DeSantis, who, even with a decent showing in Iowa, can’t afford a cup of coffee at the Red Arrow diner in New Hampshire and is a mere tourist in South Carolina.”

Ouch! But she’s not wrong — the article says the DeSantis campaign reported only $5M left at the end of the last quarter, and he and Tacky O probably already blew that on private jets. DeSantis and his spokesman, Andrew Romeo, claim he’s raised untold millions since then, but they lie a lot.

DeSantis has a deep-pocketed PAC that is running his campaign in a way that seems awfully close to if not over the legal line. Haley has her own PAC that the AP says has largely kept pace with the DeSantis PAC’s outlay. But can the DeSantis PAC afford to piss away even more now that Haley doubled down? Maybe!

“As Americans look behind the curtain, they will see (Haley) does not have the extensive record of conservative achievements that Ron DeSantis boasts,” Romeo said Monday in response to Haley’s advertising plans. “It’s clear there is no way Nikki Haley can beat Donald Trump, and every dollar spent on her candidacy is an in-kind to the Trump Campaign. … We are confident the Iowa voters will see who will best represent them and their values.”

“Conservative achievements” like a six-week abortion ban (a ticking time bomb for the DeSantis candidacy), a disastrous and corrupt hostile takeover of the Disney district, and culture war idiocy that has made a state that has long been the nation’s laughingstock an object of scorn outside MAGA chud circles.

I’m not sure who will come in second, and it probably doesn’t matter unless Trump chokes on an overcooked, ketchup-slathered steak before November 5, 2024. But I’m halfway rooting for Haley to overtake the lumpish DeSantis, just in case. She’s horrible — they’re all horrible! But he’s worse.

Open thread.

Reader Interactions

154Comments

  1. 1.

    MattM

    I’m not sure who will come in second, and it probably doesn’t matter unless Trump chokes on an overcooked, ketchup-slathered steak before November 5, 2024

    What is the actual…er…drop-dead date to replace someone on the ticket. I assume it varies by state…?

  3. 3.

    Old School

     “It’s clear there is no way Nikki Haley can beat Donald Trump,”

    That’s true.  How about the DeSantis campaign?

    “Look over there!” Romeo yelled before running away.

  4. 4.

    Anonymous At Work

    Anyone following the Trump trial in NYC?  Don Jr. testifying that his father is “an artist” at real estate.

    Any lawyers want to weigh in on what, if any, effect this would have on a bench trial?

  9. 9.

    Hoodie

    Haley v. DeSantis is the real struggle between the remnants of the Bush/Cheney wing and institutional Trumpism without Trump.   The fact that DeSantis is struggling could be an indication of the inherent weakness of Trumpism without the Dear Leader; DeSantis is an example of near 0 degrees Kelvin as far as charisma goes.

  10. 10.

    Scout211

    @Anonymous At Work: LOL! An artist and also a genius!  Junior wants a higher allowance, methinks.
    Here are the details:

    In Donald Trump Jr.’s narrative in court Monday, his father has taken over dilapidated buildings and properties and used his skills as a “visionary” to turn them all into one of the best in the city, the country and in some cases, the world.

    When the Trump Organization took over the Trump Park Avenue building, Donald Trump Jr. oversaw the renovation project and testified Trump Org. created a space with one of the highest prices per square foot in the city at the time, he said.

    Trump Jr. referred to the additions they added to the top of the Park Avenue building as being like the Louvre with glass cubes added to provide more light.
    The Trump International Golf Club in West Palm Beach, Florida, was swampland before his father took it over. “No one for decades had seen any value in it,” Trump Jr. said, and Donald Trump turned it into “one of the finest golf clubs in the world.”

    Trump Jr. said that when the Trump Org. developed the Trump National Golf Club Los Angeles, his father “noticed a crown jewel and had to have it and turn it into something special.”

    Trump attorney Cliff Robert has spent the morning walking Trump Jr. through nearly all of the Trump properties to help build the narrative, including some of the properties that the New York attorney general alleges were fraudulently inflated in value on Trump’s financial statements.

    During his questioning by the attorney general’s office earlier in the trial, Trump Jr. claimed he wasn’t familiar with the valuations of the properties included on the financial statements.

    The New York attorney general’s office will have the chance to cross-examine Trump Jr. again, and could raise his awareness of the value of the assets in question in this case.

     

    Judge Arthur Engoron allowed Donald Trump’s attorney Cliff Robert to submit into evidence a February 2022 valuation of Trump’s Doral Golf Resort & Spa that valued the property at $1.3 billion, over objections from the New York attorney general’s team.

    The judge allowed the document – a third party’s valuation of Trump’s Doral resort – to be used for a limited purpose even though it was dated outside the relevant time period in this case, telling Trump’s team he’s tried to give them “the benefit of the doubt.”

    The judge, nevertheless, noted, “I can’t see any relevance.”

  11. 11.

    Baud

    Absent newfound Ramaswamemtum, it does seem like it’s quickly become a two-person race for second place.

  12. 12.

    Wyatt Salamanca

    She’s horrible — they’re all horrible

    Having to choose between Trump, Haley, or DeSantis is like having to choose between arsenic, cyanide, or ricin.

  13. 13.

    wjca

    I’m halfway rooting for Haley to overtake the lumpish DeSantis, just in case. She’s horrible — they’re all horrible! But he’s worse.

    Well, that would be one way, should TIFG implode, to guarantee that the racists and misogynists stay home on Election Day.

  16. 16.

    mrmoshpotato

    The battle for runner up in the GOP primary is about to get uglier.

    I would order all the popcorn, but I would definitely throw it all up if I watched any of this continuing shitshow.  (And we aren’t even to the main, shitty, orange, disgusting, fascist feature yet!)

  17. 17.

    Alison Rose

    About fucking time:

    The Supreme Court announced on Monday that it had issued an ethics code for the justices after a series of revelations about undisclosed property deals and gifts intensified pressure on the court to adopt one.

    In a statement by the court, the justices said they had adopted the code of conduct “to set out succinctly and gather in one place the ethics rules and principles that guide the conduct of the members of the court.”

    “For the most part these rules and principles are not new,” the court said, adding that “the absence of a code, however, has led in recent years to the misunderstanding that the justices of this court, unlike all other jurists in this country, regard themselves as unrestricted by any ethics rules.”

    Left unclear was how the code will be enforced.

    LOL it probably won’t be

    ETA Link to the actual post on the SCOTUS site.

  18. 18.

    Baud

    @Wyatt Salamanca:

    For us, sure.  But we don’t have to make that choice.

    I kind of hope Haley is the nominee just so we don’t have to deal with all the pundits and free thinkers who will scold Dems about how they have a duty to vote for a woman president.

  19. 19.

    Brachiator

    @Hoodie:

    Haley v. DeSantis is the real struggle between the remnants of the Bush/Cheney wing and institutional Trumpism without Trump.   The fact that DeSantis is struggling could be an indication of the inherent weakness of Trumpism without the Dear Leader

    Very insightful observation. But as you also note, DeSantis is so lacking in charisma that it is hard to tease out the appeal of Trumpism from Florida Guy’s defects.

    Either way, moderate Republicans seem to have gone extinct.

  20. 20.

    oldgold

    If I was Haley, I would push in New Hampshire. Iowa could be tough for her.

    In the Iowa caucus organizational muscle is key. DeSantis, though Reynolds, is plugged into a strong organization. It will be hard to overcome in the contest for second. Not to mention the  Reformed Dutch in NW Iowa, who are huge in the GOP Iowa caucus, are going to be a damn tough sale for her.

  21. 21.

    Scout211

    Do we believe that this will really happen or is it just a messaging campaign?

    WASHINGTON (AP) — The Supreme Court is adopting its first code of ethics, in the face of sustained criticism over undisclosed trips and gifts from wealthy benefactors to some justices.

    The policy was issued by the court Monday. The justices, who have hinted at internal deliberations over an ethics code, last met Thursday in their private conference room at the court.

    The justices said in an unsigned statement that they have long adhered to ethics standards.

    The absence of a Code, however, has led in recent years to the misunderstanding that the Justices of this Court, unlike all other jurists in this country, regard themselves as unrestricted by any ethics rules,” the justices wrote. “To dispel this misunderstanding, we are issuing this Code, which largely represents a codification of principles that we have long regarded as governing our conduct.”

    SCOTUS ethics code .pdf

    ETA: Allison Rose got there first.

  23. 23.

    Betty Cracker

    @Hoodie: I think that’s right, and as horrid as the establishment Repubs have been for my entire life, I’d like to see them vanquish the Trumpites. If — dog forbid!!!! — Haley became POTUS, I’d be horrified. But I wouldn’t be afraid.

  24. 24.

    Turgidson

    I’m very much rooting for Haley in the primary, if only to force Hair Furor into a minimally competitive primary.

    She’d be an absolute disaster as president, but the union would probably survive it.  That’s more than I can say about Cheeto Benito or DeSatan.

  25. 25.

    mrmoshpotato

    I’m not sure who will come in second, and it probably doesn’t matter unless Trump chokes on an overcooked, ketchup-slathered steak before November 5, 2024.

    Or drops dead orange-face-first in a taco salad on Cinco de Mayo.

  27. 27.

    FastEdD

    The GOP He-Man Woman Haters Club wouldn’t vote for Haley anyway. If I can’t be number one then Number Two on you!

  30. 30.

    rikyrah

    I never thought anything could beat the Bonilla contract…but, here it is.

     

    Don’t hate the player…hate the game…

    BWA HA AHA HA HA HHHA HA HA HA AHA HA

    Andrew Brandt (@AndrewBrandt) posted at 10:44 AM on Mon, Nov 13, 2023:
    Still shaking my head that Jimbo Fisher has a $76M buyout, with $7M payments every year through 2031. Better than Bonilla.
    And no offset.
    NFL coaches have offset, meaning future football income – coaching, media – offsets against what’s owed. Not here.
    Jimmy Sexton, take a bow.
    (https://x.com/AndrewBrandt/status/1724106086112772527?t=aqAQyRjOZY-1Ow0pnzASTA&s=03)

  32. 32.

    steve g

    Is the runner-up a candidate for VP, or do they just get the fabulous consolation prize? If not, then who will be Trump’s VP?

  36. 36.

    lowtechcyclist

    “the absence of a code, however, has led in recent years to the misunderstanding that the justices of this court, unlike all other jurists in this country, regard themselves as unrestricted by any ethics rules.”

    The actual conduct of a number of Justices has done a wee bit to feed that ‘misunderstanding’ too.

    Misunderstanding? I think we understood all too well.

  39. 39.

    rikyrah

    He keeps on telling them what he intends to do……

    And, yet, we get the folks who are threatening not to vote or vote 3rd Party in 2024…

    Lips so pursed.

     

    Tim Miller (@Timodc) posted at 8:45 AM on Mon, Nov 13, 2023:
    “Trump…is preparing to round up people living in the United States without legal permission on a vast scale and detain them in sprawling camps while they wait to be expelled.”

    Camps.

    @SykesCharlie on the Trump plans. https://t.co/MvXRnAsnWB
    (https://x.com/Timodc/status/1724075976240271766?t=ewy1WZCAbEII8RLR52ZUlQ&s=03)

  40. 40.

    syphonblue

    First, Haley is brown, so she won’t be the GOP nominee

    Second, Haley is a woman, so she won’t be the GOP nominee

    Third, Haley is a brown woman, so she SUPER won’t be the GOP nominee

  41. 41.

    Major Major Major Major

    I honestly have a hard time caring about all this (not a criticism of you writing about it, BC). It just doesn’t matter. Their winner-take-all primary structure guarantees an early Trump sweep. And these people are all old-school GOP dinosaurs, except for for Vivek, who’s obviously not going to be VP. Maybe press secretary or something. It doesn’t matter, everybody like him is scum. Yes, such scum going to be staffing the entire government if Trump wins, but Vivek is just a (barely) prominent example of the 4channers we’ll be getting.

  42. 42.

    mrmoshpotato

    @rikyrah:

    @SykesCharlie on the Trump plans. 

    Are they, including the “Rush Limbaugh of Wisconsin” (Sykes) (h/t driftglass) finally realizing what a fascist pile of shit they built?

    Narrator: No.  They just want their orange god to stop screaming the horrible parts.

  43. 43.

    Chief Oshkosh

    @steve g: Is there an actual law that says he has to have a running mate? If not, I predict that Trump simply won’t have a VP candidate. Why should he? He’s proven he doesn’t need anyone to gain the support of the evangelical shitstains, and he’s not going to bother to try to appeal to any of the old-school GOP groups, so he doesn’t need a moderate on the ticket. Hell, maybe he’ll have one of his sons do it

    ETA: Ivanka is out because, first, she’ll turn it down, and second, she’s been mildly critical of the old man a couple of times.

  45. 45.

    rikyrah

     

     

    There is a reason to keep on coming back to Project 2025

     

    It is NOT a Trump Presidency Plan.

     

    It is a REPUBLICAN PRESIDENCY PLAN.

     

    NOT ONE REPUBLICAN CANDIDATE HAS REPUDIATED IT.

     

    Which means that they have absolutely no problem with it.

    Clay Cane (@claycane) posted at 11:08 AM on Mon, Nov 13, 2023:
    They aren’t playing… look up the Mississippi Plan of 1875, the White Supremacy Campaign (that was the actual name) in 1898 Wilmington, North Carolina… this is a federal replica of these plans.

    They are explicitly telling us their plan.
    (https://x.com/claycane/status/1724112099750637795?t=T7ofUmzT2hjFWwIV1vbqRg&s=03)

  48. 48.

    Hoodie

    @lowtechcyclist: Having briefly scanned the code and it’s incorporation of the existing judicial conduct rules, it looks to me that Thomas clearly violated the code in accepting loans and payments.   Alito might be able to skate pass with the “social hospitality” loophole, but Thomas, no.   Interesting that they claim they’ve been ruled by this all along and have done nothing about Thomas.

  49. 49.

    Major Major Major Major

    @Baud: People tend not to just drop dead, Trump isn’t going to die between now and the election. As for after the election, assuming the worst, I guess the VP would matter, but I’m not sure they’d even be picked from this bunch. At any rate we won’t know who that is for a long time! Can’t be DeSantis (Florida), which is nice.

  50. 50.

    matt

    I don’t like Nimrata, but take some consolation in knowing that even if she does come in second and get a bunch of media fluff for the future, she’ll never ever, ever be a Republican presidential candidate in the US.

  51. 51.

    Scout211

    @Hoodie: Interesting that they claim they’ve been ruled by this all along and have done nothing about Thomas.

    Well, they’re going to have to have a few more closed door meetings and many, many further consultations with themselves to consider actually adding enforcement to this code of conduct.

    That could take awhile, some say it could take forever.

  52. 52.

    Alison Rose

    @Chief Oshkosh: From what I understand, the Constitution and the US Code wouldn’t allow him to not select a VP, and if he refused to pick one, the delegates at the convention would probably do it for him, or maybe the EC. I’m no constitutional scholar, of course, but it seems highly unlikely.

  53. 53.

    Kosh III

    “vote 3rd Party in 2024”

    That would be me since my vote doesn’t matter, not in Tennessee  where Clinton and Biden got less than 40% and there’s a southern flag of Treason on every corner.
    At least I can have the satisfaction of voting for the Green platform that has positions I support.
    If someone can creditably show me how Biden can carry TN, I’ll vote for him.  I do vote D/Progressive in all other races.

    Also Biden may have lost Michigan already. 7% of the population speaks Arabic, there are lots of Iraqi immigrants almost all of whom oppose the Zionists and support the right to life for Palestinians.  My best friend here in TN is from Iraq.

  55. 55.

    Betty Cracker

    @Major Major Major Major: I think that’s right, but it sure is an unusual situation for a party to have a 77-year-old nominee who lives on junk food, avoids exercise (he allegedly believes humans are born with a finite amount of energy — like disposable batteries) and is under indictment for multiple serious felonies. I can see where an ambitious pol would take a gamble!

  58. 58.

    Baud

    @Kosh III:

    Biden can’t carry Tennessee, but the practice of voting third party is never confined to those states where it doesn’t matter.  Leading by example is important.

    ETA: in any event, the Greens are Russian assets, regardless of what they write in their platform.

  59. 59.

    AWOL

    @syphonblue: That’s like saying an adulterous vulgar rapist atheist conman from NYC with many gay associates could never garner evangelical support from the South to snare the presidency.

  60. 60.

    Hoodie

    @Betty Cracker: I think that’s definitely DeSantis’ play.  He polls favorably with Trumpers, so he stands to be the default if Trump croaks.  That said, I doubt he can generate the same enthusiasm, especially considering his weirdness is now widely known.

  65. 65.

    cmorenc

    @Betty Cracker:

    Haley can see DeSantis is on the ropes, and she probably anticipates a bump from the recent debate, after she improbably channeled all of America by angrily calling Ramaswamy “scum.” From the AP article:

    Don’t get me wrong, but if the US was to get stuck with one of the 2024 GOP contenders as our POTUS, either in 2024 or 2028, Haley and Christie are easily the least worst choices – neither appears to be in stealthy dark-money hock to Russian influence.  There would be plenty of their respective domestic policy choices that would be regressive and distasteful, but OTOH they both have the upside that neither is bug-fucking nuts and neither seems to regard Ayn Rand as a prophet.  Christie has pissed off the MAGA wingnuts, and has as much chance to win the nomination either cycle as a lead balloon has to fly, but Haley could realistically be their nominee if Trump crashes under the weight of adverse criminal cases in 2024, or at worst her current run sets her up in good position for 2028.

    I’ll never ever vote for Haley, but at least my nightmares should she be elected POTUS aren’t so existential as they would be with Trump II.

  67. 67.

    RaflW

    She’s unforgivable. I think Ron was always a winger, but Haley used to be at least somewhat normal. She’s made her pact with the devil and cannot be trusted.

    I mean, where the fuck did she think she’d “deport” Raphael Warnock to? His dad was a WWII veteran and his mom picked cotton in Georgia.

    To hell with Nikki. She’s a complete embarrassment to women, to second gen immigrants, and she smeared herself in slime by working for the Tr*mp Administration.

  68. 68.

    prostratedragon

    @rikyrah:
    Had to check: yes, Bonilla is still getting paid. Until 2035, so the payments are smaller but he dtill has the longest extension. Also has a $500,000/year payment from the Os. Link
    The origin of the Mets deal is interesting:

    After his subpar 1999 season, the Mets released Bonilla, but still owed him $5.9 million. Bonilla and his agent offered the Mets a deal: Bonilla would defer payment for a decade, and the Mets would pay him an annual paycheck of just over $1.19 million on July 1, starting in 2011 and ending in 2035, adding up to a total payout of $29.8 million.[20][21][22] Some fans refer to these payments on July 1 as “Bobby Bonilla Day”. Mets owner Fred Wilpon accepted the deal mostly because he was heavily invested with Ponzi scheme operator Bernie Madoff, and the 10 percent returns he thought he was getting on his investments with Madoff outweighed the eight percent interest the Mets would be paying on Bonilla’s initial $5.9 million.

    So much for investment forecasting.

  69. 69.

    Nelle

    I forgot that most of you aren’t wearing out the mute button on the tv machine.  We’ve been inundated by R campaign ads since last June.  Thankful now that we won’t have to see the horrible Tim Scott ones anymore, at least.  But Haley and DeSatan have been slinging it at each other and getting more intense.  But between those ads and the drug ads?  Not watching much tv anymore.

  70. 70.

    mrmoshpotato

    @RaflW:

    I mean, where the fuck did she think she’d “deport” Raphael Warnock to? His dad was a WWII veteran and his mom picked cotton in Georgia. 

    When did she spew up this fountain of crap?

  71. 71.

    Hoodie

    @Scout211: I doubt they could do anything about enforcement anyway, as they have no constitutional or statutory power to do anything.  This is just trying to pre-empt Congress from doing anything, as I guess Congress could enact penalties (e.g., fines) for violations.  You’d think those might be enforceable, assuming that justices can be prosecuted for things like murder or larceny.

  73. 73.

    SenyorDave

    @RaflW: To hell with Nikki. She’s a complete embarrassment to women, to second gen immigrants, and she smeared herself in slime by working for the Tr*mp Administration.

    Thank you!  What’s worse?  IMO there is nothing lower than the  scum who know better, and still cater to the lowest common denominator.  She is telling us to our face that she has no principles, if she thought she could get votes by promising to set up concentration camps for homosexuals she would be touting that plan tomorrow.

  75. 75.

    SenyorDave

    @mrmoshpotato: I found this from Nov 7, 2022:

    During a rally for Warnock’s Republican opponent, Herschel Walker, Haley talked about being the daughter of immigrants, telling the Georgia crowd, “Legal immigrants are more patriotic than the leftists these days. They worked to come into America and they love America. They want the laws followed in America. So the only person we need to make sure we deport is Warnock.” The crowd cheered.

  76. 76.

    Chris

    @cmorenc:

    The problem is that after Trump, the party has been so thoroughly radicalized that even Christie or Haley getting elected aren’t going to be able to put the genie back in the bottle.  They’ll have to go along with the cult on most things.

    It’s like McCain after eight years of Dubya; to the extent that he ever had any good ideas, he had to walk back most of them just to get the nomination.

  77. 77.

    Steve in the ATL

    @frosty: careful–“1-L” is how people refer to first year students, and any reminder of that might trigger PTSD episodes among the former 1-L’s who read this blog!

  78. 78.

    Hoodie

    @cmorenc: I doubt Haley would win if Trump is out of the picture.   DeSantis is more popular with Trump voters.   He’d probably be a weaker candidate than Trump because not all Trump voters are MAGA true believers and Ron won’t necessarily appeal to them.

  79. 79.

    RaflW

    @Kosh III: FWIW I feel like everyone possible should vote for Biden if they’re eligible to vote in ’24.

    I know the arcane EC is the arbiter, but we need millions of surplus votes to help bolster the case that is being built that the fucking EC is not just anachronistic, but actively anti-(small d) democratic.

  80. 80.

    Chris

    @Baud:

    Even more to the point, they’re Republican assets.

    The Green Party is a scam funded by Republicans to siphon votes away from Democrats; the Libertarian Party is a scam funded by Democrats to siphon votes away from Republicans.

  81. 81.

    Baud

    @Chris:

    Not sure I’ve seen evidence of Dems supporting Libertarians strategically.  Libertarians helped us in 2020, but may have cost us in 2016.

  83. 83.

    scribbler

    @mrmoshpotato:  So hard for me to accept the media white washing of Charlie Sykes.  He was a horrible influence, and did incredible damage,  on the state of Wisconsin.  Wisconsin’s Rush Limbaugh truly.

  84. 84.

    Scout211

    @frosty: Okay, but it took me quite some time to figure out what a “1-L Alison was.”  LOL.

    Sorry, Alison Rose!  I will endeavor to do better.

  85. 85.

    RaflW

    @mrmoshpotato: Late in the execrable and deeply problematic Hershel Walker run. Nikki was stumping for him (which in itself should be disqualifying of a normal politician, but a brain damaged man was her party’s nominee and she was being a loyal foot soldier. That still doesn’t excuse her nastiness towards a very American, very non-deportable sitting US senator).

  86. 86.

    West of the Rockies

    Don’t know if it’s been noted yet:  Trump’s sister passed away today at 83.  His younger brother died in ’20 at 71.  Donald is 77 and would appear to be in suboptimal health and in serious stress.

    Fingers crossed.

  89. 89.

    wjca

    @Chief Oshkosh: Is there an actual law that says he has to have a running mate? If not, I predict that Trump simply won’t have a VP candidate.

    Certainly he can do that.  But when the electors pledged to him vote, either a) they vote for somebody (pretty much anybody otherwise qualified) for VP or b) they don’t vote for anybody for VP.  At which point, the choice of the Biden electors gets elected VP.  Discovering his VP is Harris might give TIFG a stroke on the spot — one would hope.

    P.S. Actually, option b) could happen simply because the TIFG electors didn’t agree ahead of time on who they’d vote for.

  90. 90.

    hueyplong

    @West of the Rockies: There is a decent chance that Trump’s sister consumed a metric ton less Adderall than Donald, if you want to tweak your bookend sibling numbers a little bit for predictive value.  Just saying.

  91. 91.

    Chris T.

    @West of the Rockies:

    Don’t know if it’s been noted yet:  Trump’s sister passed away today at 83.  His younger brother died in ’20 at 71.  Donald is 77 and would appear to be in suboptimal health and in serious stress.

    Fingers crossed.

    Yes, noted here (though as H.E.Wolf added, it was 86.5). Also: on average, men die roughly 4 to 5 years before women, in the US, which suggests TIFG / SFB is about ready to go now. Fingers, toes, feet, arms, eyes, etc all crossed!

  92. 92.

    RaflW

    @RaflW: And to further expound on this, I think she was probably picturing deporting him back to “whatever” African country she imagines his forebears came from in the triangle trade days.

    I mean, did any Republican ever threaten to deport Sen. Daniel Moynihan or speaker Tip O’Neill back to the old country? No. Huh.

  94. 94.

    wjca

    @Alison Rose: From what I understand, the Constitution and the US Code wouldn’t allow him to not select a VP

    When the Constitution was written, they didn’t even envision parties, let alone party tickets.  So, no requirement there that he have a VP candidate on the ballot with him.  (Someone who’s a lawyer will have to weigh in on whether there’s a requirement there, but I’m guessing not.)

    Basically,  it’s a norm.  And we all know how much he cares about those.

  95. 95.

    rikyrah

    @RaflW:

    I mean, where the fuck did she think she’d “deport” Raphael Warnock to? His dad was a WWII veteran and his mom picked cotton in Georgia.

    To hell with Nikki. She’s a complete embarrassment to women, to second gen immigrants, and she smeared herself in slime by working for the Tr*mp Administration.

     

    Tell it

  97. 97.

    Mallard Filmore

    @cmorenc: neither seems to regard Ayn Rand as a prophet.

    Hey! I regard Ayn Rand as a prophet. Don’t you see how in her book Atlas Shrugged she has so closely pegged the GOP?

  98. 98.

    Alison Rose

    @West of the Rockies: From NYT:

    As tough as she was on the bench, Judge Barry suggested that women lighten up just a bit on the issue of sexual harassment.

    “I stand second to none in condemning sexual harassment of women,” she told the Interagency Committee on Women in Law Enforcement in 1992. “But what is happening is that every sexy joke of long ago, every flirtation, is being recalled by some women and revised and re-evaluated as sexual harassment. Many of these accusations are, in anybody’s book, frivolous.”

    She seemed nice. Yeah, you dumb old bat, sometimes women think back on things they teeth-grittingly endured as just “jokes” or “flirtation” and realize with hindsight that it was unwanted harassment. Fuck you for carrying water for sexist pigs.

  102. 102.

    Chris

    @Alison Rose:

    “I stand second to none in condemning sexual harassment of women,”

    Just once, I want somebody to follow up on this kind of proclamation with “really?  Can you name a few examples of times when you’ve, you know, condemned sexual harassment?  Not a general concept that you condemn in principle, but an actual instance of sexual harassment which you put a stop to or at least forcefully voiced an objection to?”

  105. 105.

    H.E.Wolf

    @RaflW:I mean, where the fuck did [Haley] think she’d “deport” Raphael Warnock to? His dad was a WWII veteran and his mom picked cotton in Georgia.
    @rikyrah:Tell it

     
    I will by golly roll *up* on anyone who tries to mess with Senator Reverend Bae.​​

  106. 106.

    wjca

    @West of the Rockies: Don’t know if it’s been noted yet:  Trump’s sister passed away today at 83.  His younger brother died in ’20 at 71.  Donald is 77 and would appear to be in suboptimal health and in serious stress.

    Fingers crossed.

    Let me take a minority position here.  I’d like Trump to hang on long enough to get formally convicted.

    Not long enough to take office, if (God forbid) he wins.  But long enough to see an orange jumpsuit in his future.  And, if he loses, I want him to see the inside of a jail.  Even if it’s some kind of special treatment deal, as long as he knows it’s jail.

  110. 110.

    Omnes Omnibus

    @matt: Why are you using Nimrata?  She gets to choose the name she uses just like anyone else.  Let’s not play Republican style games.

  111. 111.

    Bill Arnold

    @mrmoshpotato:
    If Donald Trump Were Actually a Battery (Alan Burdick, May 18, 2017)

    Donald Trump is a battery. This was first revealed last year, in “Trump Revealed,” a book by the Washington Post reporters Marc Fisher and Michael Kranish. “After Trump mostly gave up his personal athletic interests, he came to view time spent playing sports as time wasted,” they wrote. “Trump believed the human body was like a battery, with a finite amount of energy, which exercise only depleted. So he didn’t work out.”

    There’s also a story that D.J. Trump believes that a human body has a fixed number of heartbeats and that exercise that elevates the heart rate uses them up, but I didn’t find a source for that in a quick search. (Haven’t read the book referenced above, though.)

  112. 112.

    Bill Arnold

    @Baud:

    Greens are Russian assets

    Yup. The USA Greens are tools of a very wealthy amoral fossil fuel billionaire.
    Who controls nuclear weapons. Who believes that global heating is good (if it is real). Good for Russia.

  117. 117.

    Bill Arnold

    @SenyorDave:

    So the only person we need to make sure we deport is Warnock.

    I suspect she’d say she meant “deporting” Warnock from the Senate, where he was the incumbent, and facing an election challenge from Walker.
    But if so, anyone with language/metaphors that sloppy should not be in politics.

  118. 118.

    Jeffro

    @wjca:

    Discovering his VP is Harris might give TIFG a stroke on the spot — one would hope.

    P.S. Actually, option b) could happen simply because the TIFG electors didn’t agree ahead of time on who they’d vote for.

    There you go – a trump/Harris unity ticket!

    MAGAts, why are you upset?  Your 77-year-old virile eternally young orange god will rule forever, no need to stress!!  ;)

  119. 119.

    Miss Bianca

    @wjca: well, I dunno. Because if she makes it through the primaries, it will be because the racists and misogynists turned out for her. I would find her a far more worrisome candidate in the general  than either Trump or DeSantis, in that case.

  120. 120.

    Wapiti

    @wjca: If he’s convicted, I’d be happy if he passes before his lawyers can file an appeal. Ken Lay’s dying “innocent” because he was appealing his righteous conviction still pisses me off.

  121. 121.

    cain

    if their entire shtick is to run for VP – they are going to be in a position where Trump is doing some seriously anti-American shit – and some bad shit is going to go down. I would not want to be part of that shit show or end up in the history books and your name tainted.

    Only that asshole DeSantis would not give a shit about that and will happily be co-bootlicker

    It’s highly likely that he won’t choose any of them and will look for another low energy back bencher. Those other candidates are not going to bring anything to the table that Trump doesn’t already overwhelmingly bring.

  122. 122.

    prostratedragon

    @wjca:  “Let me take a minority position here.  I’d like Trump to hang on long enough to get formally convicted.”

    I’ll join you. I fervently wish that he not kick off or lapse into complete insanity before at least one verdict is rendered.

  123. 123.

    Sister Machine Gun of Quiet Harmony

    @Wyatt Salamanca:

    Having to choose between Trump, Haley, or DeSantis is like having to choose between arsenic, cyanide, or ricin.

    More like arsenic, salmonella, or ricin. Democracy could survive salmonella, but we’d all be really, really ill.

  124. 124.

    Another Scott

    @cmorenc: Meh.

    Christie should be serving time in federal prison for Bridgegate.  He would have a field day trying to crush his opponents with the power of the federal government, just like the orange guy, were he ever elected to the presidency.

    Haley is a dangerous, shape-shifting, GQP politician.  In 2016, first she supported Rubio (!!), then she supported Cruz (!!!).  She was more than happy to work for TIFG at the UN for all of 2 years.  She opposed his impeachment after he tried to overthrow the election.

    No thanks.

    There’s no even marginally good GQPers now.  Either they agree with TIFG, or say “sir yes sir” with tears in their eyes because they’re too afraid to actually do what they were elected to do and follow their sworn oaths.

    Grr…,
    Scott.

  125. 125.

    Geminid

    @Kosh III: I wonder where you got that figure that 7% Michigan’s Arab speaking population. World Population Review (worldpopulationreview.com) has an entry under “Arab population by state 2023” that shows Michigan with an Arab American population of 2.1%. That is the largest Arab American population of any state, followed by New Jersey at 1.2%

  128. 128.

    syphonblue

    @AWOL: That’s different. That’s hypocrisy, which talibangelicans have always had/been. Trump is white, and a man, and conservative so he can do whatever the fuck he wants. Brown women are held to different standards.

  129. 129.

    Betty Cracker

    @Miss Bianca: Me too — I’d worry more about Biden’s reelection chances if Haley were the nominee but less about the fate of American democracy. Also, Haley was elected governor twice in South Carolina, cradle of the Confederacy.

  131. 131.

    Kathleen

    @Baud: We’ll have to deal with them anyway. I’m eagerly awaiting NYT’s ritual Placing Of The Blame on Democrats when government defaults due to Rethuglican perfidy.

  135. 135.

    Mike in NC

    Nikki Haley is a terrible person who’d make a terrible president, but people are saying she wouldn’t try to stage a coup to become our fascist dictator. A low bar indeed.

  137. 137.

    Kay

    @Kosh III:

    Also Biden may have lost Michigan already. 7% of the population speaks Arabic, there are lots of Iraqi immigrants almost all of whom oppose the Zionists and support the right to life for Palestinians.

    It’s about 2.5 per cent and I don’t know that 100% of the 2.5 per cent “speak Arabic” – I doubt it.
    It’s about 80k potential Biden voters, max, and that’s if 100% follow you and vote for Jill Stein (that would be a lot, 100% persuaded)
    I completely understand them pushing to be heard and am quite sympathetic to them, but there probably won’t be enough of them to force a change by threatening not to back Biden.

  138. 138.

    Geminid

    @Miss Bianca: I have been following a Republican retired Army officer named Randy Mott on Twitter some, mainly because he is a strong advocate for military aid to Ukraine. He trashes Trump and pushes Nikki Haley for the nomination. There are some like-minded Republicans chiming in, but this seems like a relatively small group.

    The guy’s twitter profile cracks me up. His picture shows a square headed man in aviator glasses with a big cigar sticking out of his face. Mott says he’s an environmental businessman based in Warsaw, and vice president of the George Patton Society’s Poland chapter.

  140. 140.

    smith

    Given that a significant part of the reason the media wants us to know that Biden is OOOLLLLD stems from their terror at the possibility of a brown woman president, were Haley to become TFG’s running mate, would we suddenly learn that TFG is OOOLLLD?

  144. 144.

    AWOL

    @syphonblue: Nah. They’d vote for any psychotic entity that will deliver for them. They understand power, and power is having an (R) after the term “President of the United States.”

  147. 147.

    MomSense

    Ok, this is petty but WTF is wrong with Nimarata’s jaw?  It’s like she had her jaw wired partially shut??

    I don’t really have much to say about the Republican policy proposals or ideology because they are so wrong and pathetic.   I’m stuck at the superficial because there is no depth beyond their deplorable beliefs and statements.

  148. 148.

    Glidwrith

    @Kosh III: But who else is in your social circle? Everyone you talk to, buy from, shop with, party with, game with, all live in TN?

    None of us is an island. Who you support ripples out from you. We have as a hard line between good and evil as we have ever seen in my lifetime.

    Choose well.

  151. 151.

    trnc

    @Alison Rose:

    Left unclear was how the code will be enforced.

    …

    LOL it probably won’t be

    The lights come up on Chief Justice Roberts, seated in a 19th century highback chair.

    Interviewer: Justice Roberts, thank you for taking the time to answer questions about the recently introduced Code of Conduct.

    Roberts: Of course (coughs into silk handkerchief laced with gold)

    I: Those are very nice. (Looks more closely) Are those the same pattern.

    R: Yes. I was told they bring out the color of my eyes by the … (awkward silence follows).

    I: Oh. Were those given to you?

    R: Well, I’m really not at liberty to say …

    I: Surely, they aren’t from someone with a case before the court.

    R: (frowns, then smiles timidly) Did I mention we have a new Code of Conduct?

    Scene.

  152. 152.

    brantl

    I am really hoping these 2 can score simultaneous crotch-death-punches on each other and we’ll be rid of both of them. I don’t understand how anybody can make a shit-bag good enough to hold either of them together.

  153. 153.

    Aj

    No none of the debaters have repudiated the grand new master plan for dictatorship.

    None have repudiated the “execute Gen Milley”.

    But they want to deny free speech to any student a, academic or institution that dares to state that Palestinians(not Hamas) are human beings too. And have students expelled student aid canceled and persons deported So no they do not uphold the constitution.g

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