I don’t know what the House GOP morons will do next. Their current flailing is damaging to the country and must end. But how? Now, in the one chamber they control, Repubs are suffer the consequences of the radical minoritarian rule they’ve imposed on the rest of the country.
Thanks to them, we can’t have nice things, like sensible gun control, bodily autonomy, representation and a more equitable society. Now they can’t have nice things either, like an unindicted presidential primary frontrunner or a functioning majority conference in the U.S. House of Representatives. They stopped respecting our votes a long time ago, and now they don’t respect each other’s either.
***
This is interesting (WaPo gift link):
President Biden’s reelection effort will launch a pilot test of its 2024 organizing strategy in Wisconsin and Arizona next month, hiring about two dozen staffers and opening a Milwaukee office with a new focus on digital and in-person outreach that aims to directly leverage the personal relationships of volunteers.
The moves come as the Democratic National Committee has redirected its organizing efforts to a new smartphone app that encourages supporters to communicate with people in their own friend, family and community circles and then report those contacts back to the party’s voter file.
This “relational organizing” has become a growing part of Democratic campaigns for several cycles, outperforming traditional door-knocking and call sheet lists that volunteers have long used to contact strangers during campaigns. But the scale of what the Biden campaign, in concert with the national party, is planning for next year has not been attempted before.
Swing state voters will be the focus of the strategy next year, according to the article. The campaign is taking a belt-and-suspenders approach and will launch traditional door-knocking and phone canvassing too. I hope it works!
***
As I mentioned Sunday, my sister, niece and I attended a football game at the University of Florida last Saturday. The game started at 4 PM, but we got there early to tailgate. I was only vaguely aware of what was happening in Israel before we left and didn’t pay any attention to the news that day.
The game ended after the sun set. While we were sitting in the post-game traffic jam in the neighborhood just north of the stadium, near where I lived when I was a student there, I noticed a lot of Orthodox guys on the street, not walking among the throngs of people leaving the game but just hanging around.
It didn’t seem odd to me at the time. UF Hillel is nearby, and it was homecoming weekend, so I thought maybe they were having an event. UF has one of the largest populations of Jewish students in the country.
A few days ago, I read an article about an incident Monday night at an on-campus vigil to remember the victims in Israel. Someone fainted, and when a bystander shouted “call 911,” it sparked a panic. Several people were hurt, though thankfully all injuries were minor.
When I read about that, I thought about the guys I saw on the street on the day of the massacre, and it occurred to me that they might have been outside because they were worried about potential violence here and wanted to protect their community. They aren’t overly paranoid to worry. According to the ADL, antisemitic incidents have more than doubled in Florida since 2020.
There have been some high profile Nazi marches in the state, and instead of denouncing them like a normal politician, the governor and his staffers react defensively, as if it’s a false-flag operation to make him look bad. (Like his erstwhile mentor Trump, DeSantis makes everything about DeSantis.) Then there’s the 2024 DeSantis campaign staffer who was fired after tweeting a grotesque meme featuring Nazi symbolism.
Anyway, the whole thing makes me sad. They shouldn’t have to worry about such things here.
Open thread.
Baud
Pretty tech savvy for an old guy.
ETA:makes me wish I had good relations with people.
MattF
Psyche mission is near takeoff atop a Falcon Heavy.
WaterGirl
FYI, Relational organizing is what Voces de la Frontera and Four Directions do. It certainly works for them. My question is will the connections work as well when it’s white people :-) who may not have the deep cultural ties that the other populations have.
But this can’t be a bad thing, for sure!
rikyrah
Me too. I am glad that they are thinking about GOTV from different angles.
satby
WTF
OzarkHillbilly
Somebody needs to explain to DeSantis that nobody needs to do anything to make him look bad.
japa21
@Baud:
I have been told that it is supposed to be a good thing. But I don’t know if I trust the people that have said that to me.
kindness
President Uncle Joe has been getting some really good press this week. Of course, I’m not watching Fox to see what those DebbieDowners are saying. I think it’s important for the ’24 elections that our side has concrete responses to the ‘progressives’ that seem to hate Joe Biden. The MSM whips their views out of proportion and we all saw how that worked out with Hillary. Never again.
oldster
“They shouldn’t have to worry about such things here.”
Why should we worry? It can’t happen here.
Tinare
Unfortunately most of my relatives who are my closest connections are republicans. I am happy that we got to the point where we just don’t discuss politics around each other.
Betty Cracker
@oldster: That’s not what I was trying to say.
Ramalama
I was in Brookline, MA early days of Trump, walking around near Harvard Street, trying to find where exactly JP Licks ice cream shop was. Always confused about the direction of shops on Harvard Street even when I lived nearby. I stopped a woman and asked her which way and she took special care to explain to me in detail how to get to JP Licks. She was a young Asian woman, I’m guessing Chinese background. I mentioned this to my uncle later that day and wondered why she was so outgoing and careful with me, white lady in my 50s. He said, she and every other Chinese person are under attack by the President. He’s marked them, giving permission for someone with a grudge to go after someone like her.
Maybe Taylor Swift gets her army of fans to surround targetted people like Jewish people, People of the Trans, African-Americans (throwback comment from an earlier comment in the last post)
jonas
It’s been interesting to watch Trump’s primary rivals try to make (a very small amount of) hay out of the insane comments he made the other day about Israel, particularly because in any other context, and especially if it was a Democrat who had said those things, they’d be completely losing their shit over it. As usual, Chris Christie was the most blunt, and DeSantis offered up a tweet or something saying the comments were out of line, and Haley — who, it should be noted, served as Trump’s own fucking UN ambassador — called them “dangerous.” Oooh! Take that!
The guy makes what in any other Republican primary would be a nearly campaign-ending gaffe and these knuckleheads are tut-tutting him as though all he did was wear white after Labor Day. What a world.
Peale
I’m finding it horrifyingly amusing that out of 221 GOP congressmen, there’s not one in the group that stands out as being unobjectionable even to themselves. At this point they should be going through the list alphabetically and going “how about him? how about her?” and find that one person who either no one has ever heard of or who just is a wallflower at all the parties. Not a wet blanket who’ll actively interfere with anyone’s fun, so he gives off the impression of being cool, even though he’s really just boring.
Geminid
I trust one of the swing states being worked on is North Carolina. Joe Biden can win that stare next year, I think.
WereBear
@Baud: I do think he listens to the youts.
WereBear
@WaterGirl: Jello salad runs deep.
jonas
I don’t watch Fox (no cable), but I do see the NY Post at the supermarket or gas station regularly and what’s usually splayed across their front page is that Biden is so old that he’s actually in a secret White House ICU unit on life support after having 11 strokes at the age of 126 and the guy running around giving speeches is a body double and even *he’s* too old to do anything. Well, maybe I exaggerate. But that’s about the jist of their coverage, which I assume is pretty much what’s also on Fox. In between stories of the Great Brown Horde coming after your daughters.
Ken
Mass resignation is too much to hope for, but I’d be satisfied with about a dozen walking away.
Cheryl from Maryland
Based on my experiences in phone banking, I am enthused by the Biden campaign’s addition of relational organizing. While it saddens me that many people have had to shrink their circle of close connections, so many times during phone banking in the evening I interrupted people at work or while they were putting their kids to bed. Even when I changed my script to ask early on if this was a good time to speak, I could tell people were irritated. Addressing one’s friends and family could insure a greater sensitivity to the rhythms of people’s lives.
Ben Cisco
@jonas: That train is NEVER LATE
Nelle
My daughter’s antenna is finely tuned to the rising antisemitism. While I’m not Jewish, her father’s whole family is and she apparently looks the part, as she has been approached by strangers and asked if she is. She has relocated to near the northern US border, for, among other reasons, a quick escape. (We have Canadian relatives.)
WaterGirl
@OzarkHillbilly: I just added that as a rotating tag.
Betty Cracker
@Geminid: It is one of the states mentioned in the article. North Carolina is a great example of how quickly political shifts can happen, mostly due to population changes, maybe. Ten years ago, I would not have guessed NC and GA would be swing states and FL would be redder than a baboon’s butt.
Betty
@jonas: There was a clip yesterday of the NY Post reporter challenging Biden’s Press Secretary for not calling on him. She continued to ignore him. Good for her. With the nasty stuff they print about Biden, their reporter doesn’t deserve much respect.
WaterGirl
@WereBear: I suppose gelatin could even be considered binding!
Sure Lurkalot
At this point, if I met someone who in conversation volunteered that they are a Republican or a conservative, I would wince and say “I’m so sorry”, with the same sincere sympathy as if their pet died.
Nelle
@Cheryl from Maryland: Do any of you live where you have a Neighbor to Neighbor program? That is what is being run in my suburb of Des Moines by a couple who absolutely dedicate their lives, full time, to getting the vote out. They have voter registration drives nearly every weekend to get more Iowans registered. If you think that your local D parties could use more info on this, email me and I’ll get you the info. They are on the road to promote this both in Iowa and Wisconsin.
I have a turf, an assigned neighborhood (and it is my neighborhood) where I know most of the Dems and have them identified by address.. I chat with them when out on walks, I invite them to my porch for porch wine (and gripe) sessions. Two days ago, I took a card over to my Palestinian neighbor. I took a supper to the family who had just had twins, a year after having a daughter. It is all the good neighbor stuff that I saw my mother doing. It isn’t just in pursuit of votes; it is in pursuit of building a community among this small neighborhood (one way in and out, so it is distinct). During voting season, with the aid of the couple running the program, I know who has asked for absentee ballots, who has turned them in. I’ll know who has voted early, so I can focus my contacts on those who have not yet voted. I already have a good idea of who plans to vote on Election Day. I’ve also talked to most of the younger, newly registered voters about what their priorities are. A number of them are the only registered D’s in their household. We are also talking to more and more who are registered NP (No Party).
eclare
@rikyrah:
Yes! And less money spent on consultants, more boots on the ground.
Geminid
@Betty Cracker: Demographic changes in North Carolina seem to be progressing like those in Virginia. Economic growth is attracting college grads and 1st snd 2nd generation immigrants, and both groups tend to vote Democratic now.
I run I-85 to Atlanta some and it’s obvious that the North Carolina Piedmont is booming. Not just Charlotte, but cities like Greensboro, Raleigh and the smaller ones. If I were younger and looking for a place to live I could see picking the “North State.”
eclare
@WereBear:
Hahaha…gawd, my grandmother’s Jell-O “salad.” Also don’t discount the familial ties of casseroles with a crust of crushed potato chips.
Betty Cracker
Repub rep Ann Wagner (R-MO) recounts a convo between Jordan and Scalise (Politico):
LOL!
Ohio Mom
@Nelle: It’s hard to tell sometimes how seriously to take random comments. Once when I was walking in downtown Cincinnati, a Black guy asked me, “Are you Jewish?” And I shot back, “Are you Black?” And he laughed, and all was fine.
At one of Ohio Dad’s jobs, he was the only Jew, surrounded by right-wing Christains fundamentalists. There were very subtle reminders that he was different and that difference was not appreciated. But he got paid and was able to stay there until he got a better job.
I sometimes very sarcastically say, what makes America a good place for Jews is that there are so many groups ahead of us on the to-be-hated line: Black people, of course, Native Americans, LGBT+, Latinos, the list goes on.
As we all already know, Jewish institutions are periodically attacked (Pittsburgh, etc.) and I think there is a sense of, This shouldn’t happen here!
Which I think is different than the public reaction to when other attacks on other groups. We can agree that it is wrong that Black people are periodically killed by cops but no one thinks, That shouldn’t happen here! Because we accept that it does happen here, even when we are we are in despair that it does.
Finally, is antisemitism rising in the U.S., I don’t know how you measure that. I think for most young Jews, realizing that there is indeed antisemitism is something of a developmental stage.
Mai Naem mobile
@Peale: not just that, but they know their majority is very narrow and they still can’t suck it up and be okay with somebody they agree with on 95 percent of issues. It’s all about marketing and feelings.
eclare
@Geminid:
I have visited my cousin and her family who live in Greensboro, it’s really nice. They have kids (not college age yet) and mentioned the last time I was there that they’re glad that they live in a state with good universities.
Ken
Finish the sentence, Jim. America wants you to do what?
Shalimar
Fun Fact for the day: Some House Republican will need over 98% of their caucus to vote for them to become Speaker. Even dictatorships rigging fake elections to pretend their leader is enormously popular usually don’t get higher than 95%.
Thomas Massie had a Twitter poll of his followers yesterday asking them to choose between Jordan and Scalise, and Jordan only got 93%.
SteveinPHX
@WaterGirl: Just read that WAPO article. I agree with you that this could be a little tougher with “white people” than other cultural groups, especially amongst my oldies. But younger portions of the population should be much easier to reach. I think of all those Swifties out there. Boy is that a digitally-relating hunk of the populace! Smart phones and apps. It’s how they ride!
Be eager to see how it flies in AZ.
eclare
@Nelle:
That sounds like a great program! Everyone that I know in my neighborhood is already a committed voter.
Mai Naem mobile
@Betty Cracker: Jordan reminds me of a car salesman who thinks he’s already scammed you by assuming he’s sold you the clunker on the lot when you haven’t agreed to anything..
Sure Lurkalot
Josh Marshall:
The Deeper Meaning of Scalise’s One Day Speakership (No Really…) – TPM – Talking Points Memo
Ken
@Shalimar: In the next thread down, Suzanne linked to Republican Chaos Has Conservative Media Fuming. It’s Their Fault It Happened. It reports some Fox host yelling at one of the “muntineers” (their word), saying “Speaker McCarthy had 96 percent approval rating.” I was puzzled since most polls show him hovering in the mid-20s, until I realized he meant that 96% of the Republican caucus had voted to keep McCarthy. So yeah, they’re in a very difficult situation, entirely of their own making.
Betty Cracker
@Ohio Mom: Maybe I’m an outlier, but “it shouldn’t happen here” is what I think when cops kill unarmed black people (or anyone else). It shouldn’t happen anywhere, of course, but in a multicultural country that makes so much noise about equality before the law, religious freedom, blah blah blah, extrajudicial killings, ethnic-based violence, etc., seems like an injustice and a violation of the national creed.
Fake Irishman
@Geminid:
This influx into urban and suburban areas you note in NC and GA is offset a bit more in NC by pockets of rural whites who are traditionally Dem slipping or the GOP because the center of gravity of the Atlanta metro is just so large.
Another State where this is playing out is Texas. The last of the big five urban counties (Tarrant, Fort Worth) is pretty much 50-50 on the statewide elections, and will soon follow with local offices. Three fairly large suburban counties: Hayes, Williamson (Austin) and Fort Bend (Houston) vote Democratic at the state level and are starting to flip local offices. The two gigantic suburban counties north of Dallas, Collin and Denton have gone from voting 65 percent GOP in 2012 to slightly over 50 in 2020 and 2022. When they flip over, Texas politics is suddenly going to get a LOT more fun, even with a bit of erosion in the Rio Grande Valley.
Soprano2
@jonas: I listened to some of that babbling and wondered once again how it is that the press doesn’t seem to notice any of it. They clean it up for him! People need to know how insane and out of it he sounds.
MisterDancer
Are you…are you being rhetorical? I’m honestly confused — and concerned — as to your point with this.
OzarkHillbilly
@Ken: Finish the sentence, Jim. America wants you
to do whatdead?WaterGirl
@Betty Cracker:
America wants me! Followed by an aggressive storming out of the room strikes me as similar to the attitude held by rapists.
MattF
@Ken: Good link. People like Levin and Limbaugh are getting what they deserve, finally.
ETA: One assumes Limbaugh has found the appropriate circle of Hell.
Nelle
@Ohio Mom: My daughter seems to have been born with a sense of impending doom. She gets it from both sides as I too have the attitude of a migratory people. Having a father who grew up where the Russian Revolution lasted the longest, only to be followed by the 1921 famine and then immigrating first to Canada and then the US, I thought that home was a temporary thing. We could lose it all again and again. (Mennonites used to be migratory, too, as persecution followed them around. Move to keep your faith was the lesson of family history.)
rikyrah
This is truly an end of an era.
As long as I’ve been watching tv, Tom Skilling has been doing the weather. He’s like a Chicago Institution.
I trust what he says. Have trusted him about the weather for decades.
https://www.chicagotribune.com/business/ct-biz-tom-skilling-wgn-tv-weathercaster-retiring-20231012-zk66bnynqrdxhju7wb4zngwzai-story.html?lctg=F5D37479F5E0448F5572B5347B&utm_source=newsletter&utm_medium=email&utm_term=https%3a%2f%2fwww.chicagotribune.com%2fbusiness%2fct-biz-tom-skilling-wgn-tv-weathercaster-retiring-20231012-zk66bnynqrdxhju7wb4zngwzai-story.html&utm_campaign=Dont-Miss-News-Business&utm_content=alert
sheila in nc
@Betty Cracker: “America wants me”
@Betty Cracker: Or it could be more like “Indiana wants me…”
eclare
@Ohio Mom:
I don’t understand why someone would ask that. Good comeback!
Jim, Foolish Literalist
I had kind of forgotten David Gregory existed, because I never watch CNN
MMFA gives a bit more context, but it’s still not clear how this odd little man got to “identity politics”. Just a bat knocking around in his particular and peculiar “How’s your faith?” belfry, I suppose.
Baud
@Jim, Foolish Literalist:
Until six Republicans put country over party, David.
Madeleine
@WaterGirl: If I remember correctly Chuck Newsom in Michigan (I may misremember his last name, maybe you remember) was associated with a relational organizing group.
Madeleine
@Madeleine: I just heard the phrase “relational organizing” Weds evening at a Four Directions meet-&-greet in NYC. Barb and OJ Seamans along with Lewis Cohen were there with others from the organization. I learned a lot of their history and plans for the 2024 election. They talked alot about the importance of early money.
BTW I have a photo with OJ and Lewis as proof of life.
Geminid
@Fake Irishman: I think the party realignment that started in the South 50-some years ago is pretty much complete, so those pockets of rural white people in North Carolina have already shifted into the R column and will no longer offset Democratic gains.
Although maybe some of them will still vote for a Democratic Governor. In 2020, Roy Cooper ran over 200,000 votes ahead of Joe Biden. I haven’t seen a breKdown of who those ticket-splitters are but I’m guessing some were former Democrats who have not gone totally over to the Dark side.
A similar set of voters may have made the difference in Kentucky Governor Beshear’s 2019 win in a state that went for Trump by 20 points the next year..
kindness
Unspoken but a possible consideration: Maybe the Freedom Caucus nuts want Congress to be broken? Maybe these same people think not funding Israel or Ukraine helps their cause? And maybe they think that pushing the US into insolvency in 30 more days is their keys to electoral success?
Doorknobs are smarter than some of these folk but honestly I think some in the Republican conference are doing it on purpose.
Ruckus
@WaterGirl:
Many white people have deep cultural ties, they just aren’t good ones. Hate is a very deep cultural tie, especially in this country, but it can and is evident in a lot of countries and cultures. This country made decisions a while back – in the lifetime of many still alive – that we should/would get along and work together as a unified country. It’s taking a lot longer and a lot more effort than was considered it would. Stupidity and hate are two very strong human traits and it seems that it can take lifetimes to even move the concepts. Fortunately we have a president who thinks that it is way past time to get this done. He’s right of course but that still doesn’t make the clock move faster. The difference in this country in my lifetime is actually pretty amazing and moving faster than it seems possible but may it’s like the tide coming in, it’s coming in even if one is standing in the way or even if a lot are. And it has made this a far better nation, even while it has a ways to go. The haters, while they are and will continue be a hinderance, are losing strength and numbers. I saw and listened on The Late Show to a young man named Maxwell Frost, a representative from FL and Betty and the rest of FL are very lucky to have him in office. Very smart, very well spoken and very much wanting to make this a better place for all.
SiubhanDuinne
@Madeleine:
Please send that photo to WaterGirl so she can frontpage it! I for one would love to see it.
Ruckus
@kindness:
I think some in the Republican conference are doing it on purpose.
Some? How about a large percentage. Not all for sure, but not an insignificant number. They want a world that we fought a civil war to change, that still has a way to go, because hate is a very strong emotion. It seems a lot of their political party has adopted it as their absolute direction this country should be heading. The only thing hindering them is that hate is an overriding emotion, once it’s on the loose it overpowers pretty much every thing in a human except for eating and the results of that. Hate is there for it’s own sake, not to help with any other process.
Matt McIrvin
@Geminid: I think there are still a few pockets of old-style Southern Democratic politics on the local level in Appalachia. They are rare and do not account for a lot in overall numbers.
It’s been interesting to see the Democrats moving back into the South with a completely different coalition from the old one.
Matt McIrvin
@kindness: At the very least, it’s like George W. Bush and terrorism: 9/11 wasn’t an inside job, but Bush didn’t have any very strong political incentive to stop it from happening (quite the reverse in fact, as it turned out), so he wasn’t going to be all that vigilant.
jimmiraybob
On another front in the war on America. First sentence of article at Raw Story:
“Former President Donald Trump is arguing to a judge in Colorado that he was not required to “support” the Constitution as president, reported Brandi Buchman from Law & Crime.”
…
“But Trump’s lawyers are arguing that the specific language of the Constitution argues that this requirement only applies to people in offices who are bound to “support” the Constitution — and the presidency is not one of those offices.”
WaterGirl
@Madeleine: I do remember Chuck, agree that that might not be the exact last name. I did not remember that they did relation organizing..
trollhattan
@jimmiraybob:
Hmm, wonder if this would be enough for John Roberts to consider not supporting a Republican president. What were those oath of office words, again?
WaterGirl
@Baud: I am hearing that in the “I’m sorry Dave, I can’t do that.” voice.
WaterGirl
@Madeleine: Nice! I didn’t know you were going to that! Did you fly out to NYC just for that?
Ken
@trollhattan: The oath says “preserve, protect and defend”. Nothing in there about supporting it.
MisterForkbeard
@Ken: I get visions of creepy dudes in bars telling women that they really want him and not to play hard to get.
Jordan is a deeply weird creep.
Paul in KY
@jimmiraybob: Work such as ‘supporting the constitution’ is for little people…
jimmiraybob
@Ken:
Weirdest agrument I’ve heard so far.
cain
@Geminid: NC is a lovely place. But those Republicans are really crazy. I mean they literally are fascists.
They are going to try to hold on to power as much as they can including using every tool in the book.
They will not win.
cain
@Betty Cracker: America wants him like a bad tooth ache.
WaterGirl
@MisterForkbeard: Did you see my similar response at #48.
My radar went off (screaming) when I read when he had said
It also makes me wonder if Gym Jordan thought those boys in the locker room wanted it too.
Madeleine
@WaterGirl: I live in NYC now.
FastEdD
@sheila in nc: Lord, I can’t go back there …
Uncle Cosmo
In support of my Leesburg famiglia (niece, nephew, grandniece & grandnephew), $50 kicked in. If
firstyforstyfrosty’s still got $$$ in the kitteh, I spoze that makes $75 toward theghoulgholagoal.cain
@Soprano2: They are saving it for their books.
WaterGirl
@Madeleine: oh, i had no idea!
Old School
@Jim, Foolish Literalist:
One of the problems with this is that if the Democrats picked out a Republican to serve as speaker, the Republicans would then decide they couldn’t allow that person to be speaker.
jonas
@Soprano2: There was actually quite extensive coverage of it in the MSM, along with the baffled/outraged response to it among Trump’s erstwhile supporters in the conservative Jewish/Israeli community. Of course *now* they’re through with him, after Charlottesville, after the Jan 6 rioters running around in “Six Million Was Not Enough” t-shirts, etc. My point was that this would be a career-ending thing for any normal US politician. And yet his own opponents in the GOP primary — and not even all of them — are still too scared to come right out and say he *was*, and *is*, completely unfit for office and needs to drop out right now.
And that’s not even getting to the fact that he faces some 90 felony indictments. JFC.
cain
@Jim, Foolish Literalist: lol – as usual, only Dems have agency.
Sorry Gregory – it’s a GOP problem and they don’t want Dems involving themselves. If you can’t fucking a speaker with what you have – that’s not on the Dem party.
Also, Dem help comes with strings.
jonas
@Old School: Only Democrats Have Agency, Part infinity.
Madeleine
@WaterGirl: His name is Chuck Newman. I dug up an email from March 2022 to you and the others overseeing the states pilot study that I’d written summarizing information I’d received from him. He did mention a voter expansion organization.
Since others might be interested (I haven’t checked the organization’s website today), here’s what I sent:
Protectors of Equality in Government (PEG): https://equalityingov.org; non-partisan organization that endorses organizations (useful list available) that work for equality and fairness; publishes articles from trustworthy news sources; members share info, attend local meetings of activist groups, encourage reaching out to state and national legislators; Founder: Chuck Newman
This organization has a “tool” called WAVE (We All Vote Everytime) that helps volunteers to reach voters—in the case of the 2022 midterm elections—were Biden voters, are likely Dem voters, are mail-in voters. They use a list of voter info (I didn’t catch the source though he mentioned it). Volunteers identify people they know on this list (relatives, friends, co-workers) and get in touch with them. The idea is that communication from a known individual encourages voting. The tool is currently being modified.
MisterForkbeard
@WaterGirl: I hadn’t seen it. But you’re right: Jordan’s behaviors have always screamed gaslighting, abusive asshole. This is similar, I think. But more ‘rapey’ than his usual.
I have no doubt at all he knew about the abuse of those kids and just didn’t care because revealing it might negatively impact his career. He probably told himself whatever he needed in order to get a ‘justification’.
Ruckus
@jonas:
The guy makes what in any other Republican primary would be a nearly campaign-ending gaffe and these knuckleheads are tut-tutting him as though all he did was wear white after Labor Day. What a world.
SFB/TFG is their spiritual leader. He’s their preacher of hate. He hates like they do – for no rational reason, they hate for hate’s sake. He’s one of them, but with a bigger, bull horn mouth. There is zero logic for his or their existence but then humanity isn’t actually logical, it just exists. There is that old saying, “It takes all kinds.” I think it should be “It allows all kinds.” But ask yourself, would the opposite be any better?
cain
He’s been quite vocal against Israel’s use of force over the Palestinians.
Overall, I’m concerned that Biden has latched himself on to an Israel operation that is doing war crimes. Those folks have lost their damn mind.
trnc
I can’t say that the flailing is more damaging than it will be when they fall in line behind Jordan. I would say that calculus changes when the budget vote is due to be scheduled, but I’m not even sure about that.
MisterForkbeard
@Old School: Honestly, they should do something off the wall.
“We’re nominating Dan Quayle for Speaker. As a past vice president he’s got experience dealing with congress, he opposed Trump’s attempt to overthrow the government, and he can’t be worse than Kevin McCarthy.”
Matt McIrvin
@Ohio Mom:
The SPLC and the ADL are on it, using measures like hate-crime counts, hate-group counts and surveys, and, yes, it is. Or at least has been through the Trump era.
https://www.splcenter.org/fighting-hate/extremist-files/ideology/antisemitism
https://www.adl.org/resources/report/antisemitic-attitudes-america-topline-findings
Jim, Foolish Literalist
How is this real?
someone in the comments says he volunteered for the IDF “for a few weeks”.
Is that something you can do to compensate for being hung like a bumblebee?
cain
@Ruckus: that paragraph reads like the soliloquy that Khan said to Kirk in Star Trek 2: Wrath of Khan.
jimmiraybob
I still say that it would be fun to get Liz Cheney’s name thrown out there. That’s my story and I’m sticking with it.
MisterForkbeard
@cain: I think Biden’s trying to walk a fine line. He knows he can’t publicly oppose Israel because (unlike Trump) that’ll really hurt him. I don’t think he could STOP them, either.
But he can say he supports their need to protect themselves while being attacked (true), and also talk about how all innocent lives need to be protected. When the Israeli’s inevitably commit a bunch of (new) warcrimes, he’ll have to talk about it and take further action. But he can say he did the right thing at the time.
Madeleine
@cain: Julia Ioffe was on WNYC’s Brian Lehrer Show this morning to discuss the situation in Israel & Gaza. She gave a much more complex, well informed account of the history and current situation there than anything else I’ve come across. She recognizes the rights (and wrongs) on both sides. The people who called in added valuable information, as well.
Edited to add a phrase.
trnc
Cool! But if you move in, you should be aware it’s the “Old North State.” :-)
MisterDancer
Thanks, those were my go-to. I just wasn’t sure, based on the rest, if this bit was sarcastic or specifically about younger Jewish kids or something else I was missing, thus the questions on my end.
Mr. Bemused Senior
If they wouldn’t line up behind Scalise I doubt they will for Jordan. I expect a continued stalemate.
Hoodie
@Geminid: Roy Cooper is a bit sui generis, as he’s an older while male southerner who is a holdover from the prior Dem machine that was dominated by eastern NC dems like Marc Basnight, who held sway in the legislature until it was flipped by the GOP. In that way, the Beshear analogy is accurate. I don’t see NC tipping blue for the near future, as the GOP has a hammerlock on the legislature with supermajorities in both state houses and have gerrymandered the state to the nth degree. There was a brief glimmer when Dems gained a majority in the state supreme court, but we weren’t able to change the maps enough to break the GOP lock. Frankly, some of that was because of Dem legislators wanting to protect their own seats. The rural areas are losing relative to the urban areas in the way of population growth but, like Florida, we do have an influx of retirees that tend to be GOP-aligned, which you see down on the coast and in parts of western NC.
trnc
I see there’s a new “moderate” speaker candidate, Austin Scott of Ga. I could see dems making a deal to support him if it looks like Jordan gets too close with only repub votes, but I hope we can keep our powder dry until that time.
trnc
Scalise bowing out left Jordan as the only candidate, and I agree with Phillip Bump that it’s way more likely that 217 repubs would vote for Jordan rather than give up anything to the dems. However, a more moderate candidate like Austin Scott could help keep Jordan from grabbing the ring.
Ken
@jimmiraybob: It somewhat reminds me of a six-year-old playing rules lawyer, trying to convince their parent that they didn’t really disobey when they ate the cupcake. Except not at all cute.
Soprano2
@WaterGirl: We had a situation in the bar kind of like that. It was a first date, they met there and were having a good time, until after they’d been there about 3 hours she told him she wouldn’t go home with him. Suddenly he got angry, yelling at her, throwing a drink at her and calling her the “c” word. We threw him out and made sure she got home OK, she was pretty shaken up by the whole thing. Evidently he thought he bought himself some sex when he hadn’t. Gross…..
Soprano2
@cain: I don’t know how, it’s right out there in the open on the internet how he babbles incoherently at his rallies. They don’t talk about it when they talk about him except to maybe mention it in passing.
Mr. Bemused Senior
@Ken: Trump’s lawyers seem to keep making absurd arguments, even to the point of getting push back from judges.
[ETA: I’m not a lawyer. I don’t see the benefit of this; it looks to me like a problem, even for his publc image. Trump’s die-hard supporters don’t care, but he needs more than that.]
Soprano2
@jonas: Glad to know that, I don’t watch the TV news much these days but I know he’s been babbling like that at rallies for years now and they mostly ignore it in favor of talking about how old Biden is.
jimmiraybob
@Ken: “The president of the US is not required to perform the duties of the US presidency. Now, make me president.”
Yep, the cupcake argument is cuter. Also,that fate of the nation doesn’t hinge on the verdict.
Soprano2
@cain: Kind of like many here did after 9-11.
Madeleine
@SiubhanDuinne: I’ve sent the photo to WaterGirl.
Matt McIrvin
@MisterDancer: The ADL says a bit more than other organizations do about anti-Israel advocacy shading into antisemitism. It’s an inherently tricky subject and the ADL has of course historically been extremely pro-Israel, but I think they do at least make an effort to make the fine distinction here and tease out the types of criticism that are playing old antisemitic tunes.
Subsole
@MattF:
Hell doesn’t have enough rusty, sideways-oriented farming implements to give Limbaugh what he deserves.
Ken
I was thinking they might use this to torpedo the nomination of anyone they really didn’t want. It would have to be subtle, of course; even the Republicans would be suspicious of a “Squad” endorsement. A simple announcement by Jeffries or Pelosi that “X is a person we think we can work with” should be more than enough.
Matt McIrvin
@Jim, Foolish Literalist: “Why won’t the Democrats get past their shallow partisanship and help us elect a speaker who will get on with the job of punishing Democrats in as numerous and petty ways as possible?”
Thirty years of post-Gingrich Republicanism have left them with absolutely no claim on aid from Democrats, that’s the problem. We can be patriots and help them out in the name of the country but we know they’ll just fuck us again. So why do it unless we can be assured we can really extract something? They can always vote for a Democratic Speaker, but they won’t do that.
Eolirin
@Hoodie: Statewide margins are getting very very close though, for more than just the govenor, even if turning the state legislature blue will be impossible in the short term without federal intervention.
I could see Biden eeking out a narrow win this cycle. Though what we really need are the senate seats.
Geminid
@cain: I always thought that one of the factors that turned Virginia blue was tbe radicalism of the state’s Republican party. Twenty years ago, the Chamber of Commerce/Country Club crowd called rhe shots in tge Virginia GOP. Since the 2008 election, an alliance of Tea Party cranks and Bible thumpers has been ascendent and tge eztablishment has been playing defense with little success. A significant waypoint in the process was Dave Brat’s defeat of 7th District Rep. Eric Cantor in the 2014 primary.
In 2018, Abigail Spanberger knocked Brat out, and a seat that had been Republican since the realignment of the 1970s was in Democratic hands. There was some demographic change in the 7th, but Republican radicalism repelled some moderates and Independents as well.
japa21
@Mr. Bemused Senior:
Unless the judge’s last name is Cannon.
Dorothy A. Winsor
@japa21: What is she even talking about when she says Smith’s people are wasting her time in their arguments about conflict of interest?
japa21
@Matt McIrvin:
One can be very pro-Israel and still condemn some action’s taken by the leadership of Israel. There is no antisemitism in that.
There was an anti drunk driving commercial that stated “Friends don’t let friends drive drunk.”
Many of Israel’s allies, specially the US, have let Israel drive drunk for quite a while.
japa21
@Dorothy A. Winsor: I don’t speak Cannonese, so I am just lost in that. I know she was saying that they should have introduced an argument earlier in the process, even though they didn’t have the information available to advance that argument until recently.
rikyrah
@jimmiraybob:
The LITERAL OATH:
“I do solemnly swear (or affirm) that I will support and defend the Constitution of the United States against all enemies, foreign and domestic; that I will bear true faith and allegiance to the same; that I take this obligation freely, without any mental reservation or purpose of evasion; and that I will well and faithfully discharge the duties of the office on which I am about to enter: So help me God.”
smith
Oh, boy. The live blog over at Dkos is showing a number of previously-opposed Rs falling in line behind Jordan. If that’s what we get it’s going to be a wild ride until January 2025.
Geminid
@Geminid: This dynamic of Republican radicalism pushing people towards the Democrats contributed to Elaine Luria’s and Jennifer Wexton’s wins, I think. That was 3 women winning suburban dostricts in all three of Virginia’s major population centers. Most of the 37 other Dems who flipped districts in 2018 did so in mainly suburban districts, from New Jersey to Southern Californiar. It seems like regional differences matter less now, and the battleground suburban districts may be more similar to one another in terms of politics
CaseyL
@smith: I said it would be Jordan. There are no words for how fucked this country is and is going to be
ETA: Biden and Harris better make gd sure their security is tight. Speaker Jordan is 2nd in line for the Presidency. As others have said, this is the same coup, just different means.
Baud
@rikyrah:
That’s not the presidential oath.
ETA
“I do solemnly swear (or affirm) that I will faithfully execute the Office of President of the United States, and will to the best of my ability, preserve, protect and defend the Constitution of the United States”
Soprano2
@rikyrah: So if the oath literally says “support” how on Earth can his lawyers make the argument he wasn’t required to support the Contitution?
Alison Rose
@rikyrah: I believe that’s the oath for the Senate and House? The presidential oath, sayeth Wiki, is:
And then they usually add “So help me God”.
Geminid
@trnc: I’ve heard it both ways. But I bet North Carolinians don’t care as much as Virginians or South Carolinians would about such nomenclature.
I think North Carolina benefited from their decentralization. They’ve always had a number of medium sized cities instead of one big one like Richmond, which used to dominate the state. At least, they did until Charlotte took off.
cain
@Geminid:
The problem with radicalism is that you just can’t get anything done. It’s also exhausting dealing with those people. So in the end, they’ll just get kicked off – especially now with the GOP not having any moderates.
ETA
For a time there, NC was moving blue – but then something happened – maybe gerrymandering and they got control of the state govt again.
Eolirin
@CaseyL: It only takes a few to prevent him from getting to 217. Movement isn’t the same as success. We have to wait and see how the whole process plays out.
The appropriate time to freak out about a Jordan speakership is after he actually manages to get the votes, unless you’ve got a Republican rep that’s potentially squishy and then you should be calling their offices telling them Jordan is an unacceptable candidate.
CaseyL
@Eolirin: Happily, my Rep is Jayapal.
AlaskaReader
@trnc: If by ‘moderate’ they mean insurrectionist.
Scott was one of 126 Republican members of the House of Representatives to sign an amicus brief in support of Texas v. Pennsylvania, a lawsuit filed at the United States Supreme Court contesting the results of the 2020 presidential election
Ruckus
@Betty Cracker:
seems like an injustice and a violation of the national creed.
It is absolutely an injustice.
It depends on which part of the population you are talking to if it’s a violation of THEIR CREED. A way too large part of the overall population wants to go back in time to where they had meaning because of their hatred, rather than in spite of it.
Alison Rose
@Ruckus:
That’s a good way to put it.
Geminid
@cain: I think Joe Biden cut Hilary Clinton’s losing margin in half. Next year’s election will be very interesting.
The radical measures the Republican state legislature just passed may alienate voters more. These initiatives betray a lack of confidence, I think. Republicans may sense their hold on a majority slipping away. I wonder if this feeling underlies the strangely self-destructive behavior of their US House caucus.
Nelle
I have a freshman Republican rep. I call and write regularly, thinking it is important that somewhere, there is a register of people opposed to what they are doing. I just called to ask him to oppose someone who defied a Congressional subpoena and was involved in trying to overturn an election from beeing the speaker and second in line for the presidency. I don’t expect it to make a difference but still, I have to make my ripple in the pond.
trollhattan
From the Old Man Yells at Cloud file: No, my healthcare network, I do not wish to “rate” my Tuesday ultrasound experience. How, exactly, shall I describe having my guts shoved for one-half hour while being serially drenched in goop and holding intermittent shallow, medium and deep breaths? Do I compare it against other ultrasounds, against a nice dinner out, against the Netflix series “Sex Education”? Do I suggest a better way to shove an instrument into my gut for one-half hour? Do I request a standup comedian-ultrasound tech? Cherubs painted on the ceiling? The best of Muddy Waters piped in? Not every experience is a consumer experience and I frankly would have rather gone to breakfast.
That’s it.
Mr. Bemused Senior
@trollhattan: we value your opinion.
Geminid
Now I read that Rep. Vern Buchanon has joined the “Never Jordan” crew. And Georgia Rep. Austin Scott is reportly throwing his hat into the Speaker ring.
eversor
@Ruckus:
It’s not just the civil war they want to roll back a vast swath them wants to go before the enightement and turn the Church into a state power again. Monarchy and integeralism are making a comeback on the right.
cain
@Geminid: Would not surprise me. They turn to more authoritarian methods but as a whole yanks don’t like that kind of thing. Plus it’s not like they are improving things.
Of course, it always leads to in-fighting. Rigidity is always self destructive.
Gravenstone
@rikyrah: I first got introduced to him when I was in college in the early 80s and WGN was a common channel in the dorms. He really has been there forever.
trnc
It’s the Republicans’ ball game, so it’s a little early to determine that Democrats will not be part of any solution. How long will David Gregory go before he asks Republicans when they will consider asking Democrats for help?
evodevo
@Geminid: Yep…EVERYBODY on both sides hated Bevin…the man managed to alienate virtually every demographic in the state…no mean feat… I don’t know if Beshear can pull it off a second time…
Alison Rose
@trnc: So no matter who makes the mess, it’s the Democrats’ job to clean it up. Funny how the right always use to whine about the liberal nanny state, but now they’re literally demanding that the Dems play Mommy and Daddy. And not in a fun way.
Roger Moore
@rikyrah:
That is not the literal oath, which is Trumps’ lawyers’ point. The oath you’re quoting is the oath that other government officials and military officers take. The Presidential oath is spelled out precisely in the Constitution, and is different:
That’s at least potentially significant. There are two reasons the 14th Amendment might not apply to the President, both of which are based on a hyper-literal reading of the text. The first is that the presidential oath never says “support”, while the text of the 14th Amendment bans people “who, having previously taken an oath … to support the Constitution of the United States, shall have engaged in insurrection or rebellion against the same”. Since the president never swore to support the Constitution, that section theoretically shouldn’t apply to him.
The other is that the list of offices people are excluded from doesn’t explicitly include the presidency. It explicitly includes being a senator or representative or acting as a presidential elector, but then includes a general ban on holding “any office, civil or military, under the United States, or under any State”. It never explicitly lists the presidency, which is kind of surprising. My gut feeling is they were mostly worried about revanchists in former confederate states voting to send unreformed secessionists into Congress or their state legislatures. They just figured there would be no chance of the nation as a whole selecting one. That said, the presidency would certainly seem to qualify as an “office, civil or military, under the United States”, and thus would be covered by the catchall.
Geminid
@Geminid: This whole Republican Speaker saga brings to mind Casey Stengels’ question:
“Can’t anybody here play this game?”
trnc
I don’t care about it very much, but I can guarantee you that some born and raised here would smirk and probably correct you. And I’m not just talking about the wingnuts.
At any rate, if you do move here, welcome!
trnc
OK, that made me laugh.
ETA: I just realized your name links to GoodReads. Impressive!
Geminid
@evodevo: Beshear seems to be consistently running ahead of the challenger in polls. Most show him with around a 10 point lead.
I saw an interesting story about approval ratings for Governors around the country. Beshear was 4th or 5th overall, but first among Democratic Governors- in a state Trump won by over 15 points. Beshear’s aporoval rating among Republicans was 49%.
Al Nichols
Sure they will — it’s the social networks not the cultural ties that matter here, and white people exist in social networks just like everyone does.
It’s also a good thing that the DP is pumping out some of the money that will be rolling in here to the community, instead of spending it all on advertising. However, the standard procedure is to tear down everything that was built during the campaign the day after the votes are counted, and throw it all out with the unsold yard signs — I see no hint that that’s going to change and it’s a handicap the next time election time rolls around.
Geminid
@trnc: Thank you! But I’ll almost certainly stick sround Central Virginia.
I really like North Carolina though, especially the Highlands. There’s a nice campground about an hour into the state on the Blue Ridge Parkway that I want to camp at. Mt. Pisgah Campground, west of Asheville, is a wonderful place to camp but it’s just so doggone far away.
Roger Moore
@trollhattan:
I think you’re really supposed to be rating the performance of the staff. Did you get checked in promptly, or did you have to wait in a pointless line? Was the receptionist helpful, or did they leave you standing there while gossiping with a coworker? Was the ultrasound tech professional or creepy? That kind of thing.
That said, I agree with the general point that businesses these days are way too pushy when it comes to feedback. It’s fine to let people know they can provide feedback if they’re so inclined. Maybe you can even send me a survey, but no business is entitled to feedback for every interaction. I’m tired of companies sending me multiple emails with increasingly aggrieved tones wondering why I haven’t responded to their survey.
trnc
@Geminid: Yeah, I camped at Pisgah with some bandmates years ago. Pretty good trip, but the real fun started when 2 of them dropped acid and one of the other guys pulled out his tape recorder. Good times!
Alison Rose
@trnc: You’re welcome :P and thanks!
lowtechcyclist
@Geminid:
Josh Marshall: “I think the real breaking news is that there’s a rep from Georgia named Austin Scott.”
AlaskaReader
@trnc: You could see Dems supporting someone who signed onto challenging Biden’s election?
lowtechcyclist
@Roger Moore:
That’s such a nitpicky bullshit argument that I’d think even most lawyers would throw up their hands and say, “are you fucking kidding me?!”
I mean, “preserve, protect, and defend” somehow doesn’t include any aspect of “support”?? Ain’t enough rolleyes.
Gravenstone
@Jim, Foolish Literalist: Saw this on Reddit. He’s not even wearing the uniform, just the shirt.
Matt McIrvin
@Roger Moore: Quite remarkable that their argument is basically “the President is allowed to attempt to overthrow the government in an autogolpe because the card says Moops”.
Geminid
@trnc: I think Democrats should hang tough and make Republicans elect a Speaker on their own. If they can’t, the post will still be filled, and probably by a better choice than either Jordan or Scott.
And whether it’s Jordan or Scott, it will be the same stupid Circus, just with a different Ringleader.
rikyrah
@Geminid:
I agree. They need to elect their own Speaker.
trnc
@AlaskaReader:
Thanks. I didn’t know that. He apparently voted to certify the election, so that seems a bit schizophrenic.
eversor
@Roger Moore:
Feedback is evil. It’s used to control employees.
Being in a quasi management IT role I’ve seen the evil in this. If you create a survey nobody is going to answer it really. Most of the feedback you get is going to be from someone who is furious or just doesn’t like a paticular tech so they fill it out due to having a tantrum/Karen moment. It’s largely meaningless but it’s ammunition should you ever want to push someone out.
The flip side of that is there are people who always leave great feedback because they personally know someone or they know that most honest feedback is negative feedback and try to help skew the ratios.
Maybe it’s different in other industries but in IT nothing ever is changed because of feedback. EVER. We aren’t changing vendors, ISPs, cell providers, providing ipads for everyone, getting non standard laptop models or any of the other loopy shit that comes through from it. Rather all it does is rack up demerits against people to use when you want someone gone. Or give you utter bullshit good reviews to give someone you like a fat bonus.
Feedback items need to go away.
trnc
Nope. I had read that he had voted to certify the election results. I don’t know if that was incorrect or if he’s just whacked.
gwangung
HELL YES.
Jim, Foolish Literalist
@Gravenstone: I wondered about the whole get up. Looks like he was ready to go jogging from the waist down
Roger Moore
@eversor:
I think your complaints are actually exactly why companies keep pushing customers to fill out the customer service survey. They want to get a more accurate picture of what’s really going on with their company, so they try to get more customers, ideally everyone, to provide feedback. That way the handful of people with an ax to grind will get swamped by the majority who had OK experiences. What they should probably do instead is just assume some kind of normal baseline for interactions that don’t result in any kind of feedback.
JaySinWA
@trnc: No Scalise voted against certification. Not inconsistent on that issue.
https://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2021/01/07/us/elections/electoral-college-biden-objectors.html
AlaskaReader
@trnc: He’s a Republican, and as a Republican there is no conflict with him thinking he can have it both ways.
He’s obviously fooled plenty of people if he’s considered ‘moderate’.
He’s against abortion, he’s against civil rights, he’s hypocritical, he’s an awful person, …so he’s a standard Republican.
And like all Republicans, no redeeming value whatsoever.
Subsole
@eversor:
This.
These assholes think the Enlightenment was a grave mistake.
They want to go back to the Dark Ages.
And I mean the actual Dark Ages: the ones immediately following the Bronze Age Collapse.
No One You Know
@Roger Moore: They didn’t tell you that your input has replaced management performance reviews. Congratulations on your promotion!
Garbo
@Matt McIrvin: First, appreciate the Moops reference. Second, thank you for introducing me to autogolpe!
oldster
@Betty Cracker:
Oops — I apologize, Betty.
I was attempting to make a joke about this book:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/It_Can%27t_Happen_Here
Sinclair Lewis’ 1935 novel about the USA going Nazi.
I should have added the sarcasm tag to my original comment.