A familiar argument played out in comments under Doug’s “Trump Troubadour” post yesterday. It goes something like this:
1) Story shared about a knucklehead who voted for Trump who’s expressing regret after getting reamed by Trump’s policies.
2) Commenters express contempt for said knucklehead.
3) Other commenters scold contemptuous commenters, arguing that we need to capture the knucklehead vote / avoid becoming consumed with hatred like Trump knuckleheads.
A couple of things. First, I don’t think anyone is saying people who voted for Trump should be barred from ever voting for a Democrat for all eternity. A vote is a vote, even if it’s cast by a goddamn dumbass. And I don’t think anyone is saying Democratic Party messaging is 100% perfect and should not be tweaked to appeal to a theft-proof majority in swing states — as long as that doesn’t entail compromising our equality principles.
But, many of us are angry as hell and blame the morons who handed a racist, sexist, xenophobic demagogue the keys to the world’s most fearsome nuclear arsenal. There’s nothing unjust about our anger, if you believe Trump voters possess moral agency. Trump voters committed a terrible act — knowingly empowering a racist, sexist, xenophobic demagogue. They earned our contempt.
As for the notion that harboring ill-will toward shit-for-brains Trump voters makes us morally equivalent to hate-filled Trump assholes, that’s a steaming load of horseshit, IMO. A few troll exceptions aside, the folks who comment here overwhelmingly support public policies that benefit people like the idiot Trump Troubadour and his drug-addicted son, whereas Republicans would watch them die in the gutter rather than pay a nickel more in taxes. That’s the crucial difference between us and the idiots who voted for Trump, and it’s visible from space.
People who struggle to contain their contempt for Trump voters, as I do every single day, should probably not volunteer to conduct bipartisan outreach for the Democratic Party. However, if you’re the type who can rise above your anger and sympathize with people who fell for a bigoted con man’s shtick, good for you — give yourself an extra pat on the back, and feel free to make your case to those voters with our blessings.
But I don’t see a thing in the world wrong with ranting about stupid fucking Trump voters at Balloon Juice. It’s not like loads of them are reading this blog and getting scared away from the party because we say mean things about them. And honestly, I find it kinda therapeutic, seeing as how I have to spend so much time biting my tongue around Trump assholes in meat space. So let’s call this blog our designated safe space, okay? Rant away!
ETA: This is pretty funny:
The "Boy" from Mar-A-Lago. Tall and orange and rich and tubby . . . pic.twitter.com/fqKrD05Hkr
— RiotWomenn (@riotwomennn) March 19, 2017
PaulWartenberg
Seconded
PaulWartenberg
I just wanna ask everybody here to hug their pets today. I just tried to help a poor feral cat that got hit by a car to the vets and the poor thing died just as we got there.
Karen S.
Amen.
Baud
The best thing would be to stop sharing those stories here. It was fine for a while, but let’s move on.
WereBear
I don’t either. Especially since so many of us have few other places to do it in.
BubbaDave
@PaulWartenberg:
Sorry to hear that. Good on you for trying, though.
chopper
yeah, this.
japa21
That’s righteous, sister.
WereBear
We are all driving down the road together, and when someone nearly causes me to crash because they were trying to run over a dog, I can call them any bad names I have learned, and a few more I can make up on the spot.
TaMara (HFG)
I’m all for telling these morans whatever they need to hear to vote Democratic, they will clearly believe anything as along as it fits within their worldview (truth or fiction) and since it’s going to be up to us to save their asses along with healthcare, finances and the entire fucking atmosphere on the planet, whatever gets them their.
I don’t have time for contempt for them, but I also don’t have the patience to coddle them to get them to understand things that they clearly can’t or won’t believe despite overwhelming evidence. So I’m all for just patting their hands and outright lying the them as needed. Then sending them to the playroom while the adults get busy. /snark – kinda
Betty Cracker
@PaulWartenberg: Sorry to hear that. Good for you for trying to help, though.
MJS
Well said. Treating Trump voters with contempt is treating them as adults, subject to the consequences of their actions. Taking a “there, there, they didn’t know any better” approach is treating them as children, which is actually more insulting than contempt is.
WereBear
@PaulWartenberg: Thank you for trying.
When that happens to me, I remind myself that at least the poor thing didn’t die alone and utterly unloved.
Baud
I guess since we would like to maximize our vote, we should just stop complaining about everybody (at least domestically).
amk
the trumpanzees remind me of the story about the drowning man, god sending him a rescue boat and a helicopter and the stupid dead man blaming the god for not helping him.
TaMara (HFG)
@PaulWartenberg: I am so sorry and thank you for stopping. This just choked me up because of something that happened this week that I can’t even bear to relate to anyone. But virtual hugs from me to you.
Big Ole Hound
The big reason all these people voted for 45 is the hatred of the ACA mandate or fine for opting out of the insurance. If we can find a way to make that part of a tax credit or something else to offset that payment then part of this great divide could be closed and the animosity reduced.
Hunter Gathers
Give the Trump voters you work with constant, subtle shit over it.
Make sure to bring up All The Winning.
Gelfling 545
Sing it, Sister.
liberal
Publicly, right thing to do is attack their policies, and attack Republican officials, viciously if need be.
Blueskies
Where are you guys finding all of the repentant Trump voters? I have yet to meet one. The ones I’m forced to be around are tripling down on the stupid and crazy. Fuck ’em.
PaulWartenberg
The cat had a clipped ear, it was an outdoor feral as part of the TNR effort. One of my neighbors might have been feeding the poor thing. I gotta ask her to do a head count tonight… :(
He kinda died alone, we were inside the vet clinic begging for someone to help (they were telling us they were unable to take any emergencies at that moment and were trying to get us to drive over to Winter Haven (!) or Brandon (!!!!!!!!!) to help the thing). By the time someone volunteered to take a look, he’d stopped breathing.
TaMara (HFG)
this a thousand times. I’m also hanging out on twitter more where I feel I can therapeutically punch Cult45-ers with the orange ferret-head’s own words until they cry uncle in ways I cannot do to people I actually know.
Betty Cracker
@Big Ole Hound: Do you have any data to back up the claim that the ACA mandate is the primary reason people voted for Trump? It doesn’t track with anything I’ve read or what I’ve heard from the Trump voters I know.
PaulWartenberg
@Blueskies:
I have to agree. I’ve yet to meet someone who will admit they voted for trump and now regret it.
I live in Florida, so it’s mostly the elderly or the hardcore GOP’ers or the racists around me. The regretful may be the ones up north in Ohio and Wisconsin or something.
Justjames
http://www.thenarratologist.com/book-reviews/book-review-small-gods-1992-terry-pratchett/
Read down to the end.
The Pale Scot
Oh Frack, this is great..
THE DAILY WHITE HOUSE BRIEFING
MJS
@Betty Cracker: I took it as snark. It has to be, doesn’t it?
Betty Cracker
@PaulWartenberg: Man, that’s rough. I’m not sure where you live, but if you need emergency vet care in the future, I can highly recommend Blue Pearl in Brandon. They looked after my nutty boxer who badly tore a paw pad one weekend.
amk
@Big Ole Hound: Mandate was an original gopee romneycare plan. No, the reason they voted for the racist pos was pure racism and Ocare was about helping the others.
Adam L Silverman
@PaulWartenberg: The emergency vet on 19? They’re good folks. Took care of my blue tick when he had stomach bloat back late one night in 2006. Though Dr. Reifer at Countryside Animal Hospital is my go to when in FL visiting my family.
Sorry you had to got through that.
amk
@The Pale Scot: LOL. I somehow knew the woman was going to be kac
Teddys Person
The common thread through all these buyer’s remorse Trump voter stories is that the buyer’s remorse didn’t set in until something affected them personally. This is bog standard Republican behavior. So, I wish these stories would emphasize Republican voters rather than Trump voters. There were a number of similar stories about people who voted Republican during the Obama years that benefited from the ACA and had a “come to Jesus” moment.
lollipopguild
I see no reason to shed any tears over people who are getting or going to get what they asked for-in spades.
thalarctosMaritimus
@PaulWartenberg: Thank you so much for trying, Paul.
I’m sorry you couldn’t save it, but it had no chance at all without your trying. You gave it the best chance for survival it possibly could have had; so many other people would have just passed it by.
Yoda Dog
100% with you as always, Betty. Great post as usual.
ruemara
Trump voters put neo Nazis in the white house. These are people opposed to my very existence. Fuck anyone who tells me I need to be understanding and to be nicer to them. You want to do, good. Don’t you dare tell me how to feel about people whose hatred for others was so great they voted to destroy America.
I have a question about Philadelphia. I have to go there for a convention in May. Anyone know a good cheap hotel? I’m traveling for work but I have to book the flight and hotels for myself and pay for myself first and I don’t have much capital. I’ve looked but I don’t know anything a bout Philly besides cheese steak.
Amaranthine RBG
Elections are about winning, not feelings.
Grow the fuck up.
If being a smug condescending shit helps win elections, then by all means do it.
Otherwise, try something else.
Because ——–OBVIOUSLY——– whatever the democrat strategy was in the last election did —————- NOT ————- work.
John Weiss
Nailed it B.
Chris
Honestly, that ranting is the reason I got into the liberal blogosphere in the first place. To have a place where you can vent about this kind of idiot to people who understand why they’re idiots, without having to worry about their hurt fee fees. This is the very last place that should tone police people for raging that right wing idiots are right wing idiots.
Ruckus
If you can be constructive with stupid fucking assholes who voted for hate and death to thousands, good on you. You are a better person than some of the rest of us. But many of us are worried that our healthcare will be taken away and we desperately need that. The ACA is not perfect, but it is far better than what we had, in very many ways. I don’t get government mandated health care insurance from the ACA or Medicare. I get government healthcare, the people who provide my care are government employees, and get a paycheck from the US Treasury. Stupid fucking assholes who voted for drumpf, who elected the most irresponsible person to ever hold the title of president, did so out of hate and spite. Fuck them, fuck the horse they rode in on, fuck the people they elected because they elected them to kill thousands and inflict pain on thousands more, people like me, people like owlface, people like ArchTeryx. Just Fuck them. With rusty 6 ft chainsaws.
Ajabu
One of the most profound pleasures of Black culture is that I have yet to run into a Trump supporter. The very few Black folk who supported him (black republicans – an oxymoron if there ever was one) don’t tend to socialize within our own communities. Even their Mamas are ashamed of them.
amk
@Amaranthine RBG: yeah, I see the special snowflakes winning bigly right now.
lollipopguild
@Justjames: Thanks for that.
Barbara
@Baud: I agree with this.
Goku
@Amaranthine RBG: You should take your own advice
Edit: Ah there the tell is: “democrat” strategy. You might as well have said “demonrats”
amk
@Baud: doug gotta do what doug gotta do.
chris
Testify, Sister Betty!
Laughter, even the bitter cynical kind, is still the best medicine.
ruemara
@Amaranthine RBG: it did work to the tune of 3 mile votes. The fact that you can’t see the voter appeal.strategy was fine and the lack of focus on voter suppression in key areas was the failure… that’s your problem.
Baud
@Amaranthine RBG:
We have been moving left for 8 years and losing seats. Maybe the Harold Fords of the world are right and we should be more centrist.
NotMax
Whoops.Talk about having egg on their face.
MattF
I keep in mind that the people who are most likely to fall for a con are the ones trying to get a piece of the action. They’re not your pals and never will be.
Omnes Omnibus
@Amaranthine RBG: This blog is not a Democratic outreach organization
Tokyokie
Yesterday at the bank, I heard a white woman in a Golden Corral uniform telling the black security guard that Trump had been selected by God to lead the country. The security guard was doing his damnedest to express his disagreement without openly insulting the woman, which was mostly widening his eyes and asking how she knew this. I considered asking her why God would choose somebody as ungodly as Trump to lead the country but decided to leave it alone, because there’s not curing stupid.
Louise B.
Double, triple quadruple AMEN!
The Trump voters I know are country club republicans, who are pretty sure Trump will not hurt them personally – and they may be right, only time will tell. As of last week they were still in the “give him a chance, he might to something good” mode.
Betty Cracker
@Amaranthine RBG: Moronic comment that completely missed the fucking point as usual. Your streak remains unbroken! ?
Baud
@Tokyokie: “Why does God hate America?”
Capri
@ruemara: The last time I was in Philly I found a lot of great deals at the hotels around the airport.
I’ve seen surveys that indicate that the vast majority of Trump voters are still solidly in his court. The remorseful voter is newsworthy because there are so few of them. What pisses me off the most about the entire dynamic is that I’ve yet to hear to hear anybody call out conservatives for all the horrible things they say constantly about liberals. To suggest that liberals should watch what they say is all part of the huge double standard that exists between the two parties.
amk
@Amaranthine RBG:
says the stupid who couldn’t even clear the primaries.
Tom Paine
The Goldwater Gal lost to fucking Bozo the Clown. That doesn’t prove he was a great con man, it proves she was a shitty candidate.
A choice between Democrats & Republicans is basically a choice between covert assholes and overt assholes.
Choosing a cat-shit sandwich over a dog-shit sandwich doesn’t make one morally or intellectually superior. It just means that one is still willingly swallowing corporate shit sandwiches.
Baud
@Capri: Agreed.
Woodrow/Asim
As an African-American, I’m going to be on these people’s shit list for all my life, without parole.
So I get the gripin’. And I get those who feel unsafe handling these folks, or politics, ever again. Self Care really, really matters, and threads like this are important for that.
For me — and I don’t insist that others act this way — it’s that many of them, at one point, voted for someone who looked like me. As much as I can’t personally trust them — not anymore, not after voting for Trump and the resurrection of George Wallace he clearly stands for — if we’re going to have anything like a sane government, we gotta reel ’em back in, get them to agree on some guideposts for a civic society.
Otherwise, the GOP will dismantle damn near all of those guideposts and guardrails in order to enforce dystopia — and put people like me back in Reconstruction, if not just good ol’ Slavery, again. I’ll take “unenlightened self-interest”, “buyer’s remorse”, whatever the fuck it takes to move them into a space where voting for governance that’s not automatically about screwing over and Fuck You I Got Mine is possible, once again.
I can’t live life my Parents did — much less like my Grand and Great-Grands did. So I gotta both take care of self, and fight.
It’s unfair, but so is life.
Goku
@Betty Cracker: It’s almost like they ignored the parts of your post that contradicted their preconceived conclusions.
lollipopguild
@Tokyokie: If someone had told this woman in 2012 and 2016 that God had chosen Obama to lead the country I am sure that she would have disagreed quite strongly.
Amaranthine RBG
@ruemara:
Okay, your strategy is more of the same but work against suppression. Good luck with that.
@Betty Cracker:
At least you are coming to terms with he fact that your approach to politics favors feelings over results. I don’t think I’ve ever seen you admit that before. That’s a step in teh right direction.
Ajabu
re: The video
Merda Gibão de Mar-A Lago.
(In the original Portuguese)
Goku
@lollipopguild: Barack Hussein Osama is a radical jihadist Muslim who’s also the antichrist! Now Trump, he’s a real true Christian believer who’s been chosen by Gawd /s
Amaranthine RBG
@Omnes Omnibus:
Yes.
Goku
@Amaranthine RBG: You misspelled “the” as “teh”
Ruckus
@Betty Cracker:
It must be difficult for some to see the forest for the pine needles laying on the ground. This one is a case in point.
scav
@Amaranthine RBG: We get the message. our moods, feelings, insecurities, etc are not to be understood, accepted, cherished, cuddled, wooed, nourished unlike those of the oh! so prescious prescious willing and enthusiastic Trump voters who voted for shit done to others only to find themsleves in the crosshairs and now are playing the wide-eyed ingenues that insist on (and in your eyes merit) a few more mints on their pillow. We’re the ones that suddenly need a safe space, a free speech zone even within the unofficial space loosely connected to a party so many of us have been long-time supporters of. Dictate much?
schrodingers_cat
FWIW if T voters are recanting their support for the man and regret their vote, fine. I just don’t want to read the elebentieth iteration of that story. That’s all.
ruemara
@Amaranthine RBG: we’ve already had luck with that. Go bemoan lack civility to white bigot elsewhere.
@Tom Paine: and fuck off. All the way, with due haste.
Amaranthine RBG
@Baud:
Nah, we need to be rock-ribbed socialists, but with a SMILE !!!
Adam L Silverman
@NotMax: And the Dems seem to have gotten their act together on this:
schrodingers_cat
@PaulWartenberg: You are good man PaulW. BTW any updates about the library kitteh?
PaulWartenberg
@TaMara (HFG):
TaMara I’m so sorry, was it… I dunno if I should ask… a friend or family?
donnah
Since this is a designated safe space (Thanks, Betty!) I would also like to state that if I post something to the effect of how terrified I still am about this garbage administration and admit that I am not super positive about how things are being handled, don’t dismiss my opinions or tell me not to post negative thoughts.
I’m still heartsick and scared because things I believe in, like Americorps, NEA, PBS, fair housing, immigration, and many more, these are all still in the crosshairs. We will continue to fight, but allow me the right to feel depressed and worried when I’m up against it all.
Thanks!
debbie
Absolutely agree. And if anyone is tired of reading someone’s rant for the hundredth time, don’t object to it for the hundredth time. Just move on and let them get what they need to get out of their system.
Goku
@Amaranthine RBG: Thank you for that sober political analysis Scholar Amaranthine RBG
Tokyokie
@lollipopguild: I’m sure, had I bothered to do so, I could have proven her deep-seated racism for her, but what’s the point of doing so in somebody who will deny its existence? God didn’t select the church-attending black guy to lead the country, but did select the pathologically lying, serial sex abuser white guy to do so. If she were capable of retrospection, she wouldn’t have made such a horrifying statement to a black man in the first place.
Roger Moore
@Big Ole Hound:
That seems like a really good idea. Turning it into a reward/subsidy for getting coverage helps several ways. It disguises that it’s effectively a penalty, it could probably be turned into a progressive tax change, and it would be politically harder to avoid enforcement.
amk
@Adam L Silverman: Excellent. Keep the momentum going.
Baud
@Amaranthine RBG: You emphasize electoral results. Have smiling socialists achieved any?
Barbara
People are in different places. I can say pretty confidently that unless Trump burns the country down or kills the goose that lays the golden egg, I am probably okay. I actually am afraid that Trump will burn the country down, so I am scared for myself, in addition to being generally infuriated by his contempt for women and others, but I am much more worried for my kids, and really scared for certain members of my family just by what he has done so far. Plus, I grew up in the Rust Belt and many of these stories ring familiar to me, so I am perhaps not as shocked by the general obtuseness that seems to have been stoked to perfection by Trump. Anyway, I am not offended by the ranting, but I also think it’s worth it for some of us to work on more constructive responses. I actually think that a lot of the reflexive liberal commenters I have seen are more offensive than an honest rant — to treat them like children who are just ignorant about the chaos they have unleashed. They are not kids, they took a calculated risk and they really didn’t care what that risk meant for people who are culturally different from them. I just feel like I have moved on from a rage reaction, so I think from now on I am just not going to comment on these kinds of stories.
James E Powell
@Big Ole Hound:
This is just not true. The big reason all these people voted for trump is they are hateful bigots & misogynists who believe that they gain when people they don’t like suffer. The only part of Obamacare that trump voters objected to was Obama – more commonly known to them by various racist epithets. Numerous polls taken over the years have confirmed that these voters approve of every feature of the ACA, but change their opinions when they are told it is Obamacare.
It is important for the future that we not get caught up in the Michael Moore fantasy that otherwise decent people voted for trump out of frustration with the Democratic Party’s trade policies and ties to Wall Street and large corporations. It’s important for the future because unless and until we address the racism, sexism, and bigotry that control the trump voters’ political behavior they will continue voting the way they have since Reagan.
Amaranthine RBG
@ruemara:
Tell me more about this luck ,,, was capturing the Presidency, the House or the Senate? Or perhaps you refer to the many statehouse and governorships we’ve won.
What fucking planet are you living on?
Goku
@Baud: EV Debs maybe
PaulWartenberg
@schrodingers_cat:
Re: library kittehs. they were taken to the adoption SPCA place, to my knowledge they were being prepped for surgery and for the adoption rooms. I never saw any followup on their website for kittehs that looked like them. Either they went straight to an adoptee on a waiting list for CUTE ADORABLE FLUFFY FRIENDLY FURBALLS or they’re still in a quarantine for some reason.
schrodingers_cat
@Louise B.: The one T voter I know personally, is well off. WWC loves T is probably more of a MSM meme, I think.
Goku
@Amaranthine RBG: Not Russia
schrodingers_cat
@PaulWartenberg: I was rooting for your library to adopt them as mascots. May be you can find out and update us on their status.
Jim, Foolish Literalist
@Baud: when you hear God’s voice in your head, does he have a Russian accent?
Baud
@Goku: A quick scan of wikipedia says that he didn’t win after he became a socialist.
Amaranthine RBG
@Baud:
We’ve never tried it yet.
Louise B.
@ruemara: I haven’t been to the Philadelphia location, but if you’re looking for a hotel in the city center, you might try the Club Quarters hotel. They are designed for business travellers on budgets who need city center accommodations. No frills, but thoughtfully designed for business travel.
schrodingers_cat
@Amaranthine RBG:
That’s a tell, you are an R or at the very least sympathetic to them.
Jim, Foolish Literalist
@schrodingers_cat: my rich uncle and his two most financially comfortable (adult) children were trump voters, their three less well-off siblings are all pretty strong Dems
Baud
@Jim, Foolish Literalist: He’s actually speaking Russian. It’s why I can’t understand him. I think the last time, he either told me to get a haircuit or run for President. Not sure, so I went with the latter.
Jeffro
@Adam L Silverman: niiiiiiice! Go Ds in 2018!!
James E Powell
@Omnes Omnibus:
This cannot be said often enough.
Betty Cracker
@Amaranthine RBG: Nope, still missing the point. Maybe you could ask a brighter friend to explain it to you.
Baud
@Amaranthine RBG: So then why should we go that route? We know that Bill Clinton and Obama won, and that most of the Dems who win elected office are not socialist. A truly objective analysis would suggest we build off of that instead of trying something that has never even been attempted.
schrodingers_cat
@ruemara: Couple of times when I traveled to Philly, I booked in the hotels near the Reading Market. Its in the heart of town and easy to get to other places from there by public transport or by foot.
*Reading market is a great place to hangout with good food.
Iowa Old Lady
Joy Reid this morning cited a poll saying only 3% of Trump voters regret their vote, so I don’t them very comforting. I skipped that poor troubadour thread because I’ve already vented my spleen and am afraid of boring the rest of you.
Goku
Eh, that’s what I get for commenting half-cocked. Also, for not knowing enough about late 19th and early 20th century socialist politicians
ChrisGrrr
Betty – yes, yes, yes. Well-said. Hope-stoking.
I never thought (or said) the ACA or any Dems were without flaw. Haven’t excised all of the voters who got us into this disorienting “new” mess from my life. And yet I myself need to act, and keep acting, ’cause Step Zero has continually become more urgent – “This shit’s got to stop.”
Tnx.
Brachiator
@Betty Cracker:
This is very true. Very well said. And if it rallies Democrats, it is wonderful and politically astute.
But Trump voters don’t give a shit about your contempt. They want what they want. Their votes might change if they don’t get what they want from Trump. But as long as they believe that he will deliver on his promises, they will easily overlook his moral faults. They voted for a president, not a minister.
@Tokyokie:
I guess I should resist saying that since he was a security guard, he should have pulled out his gun and shot her. It’s a joke, people. I abhor violence.
But I don’t abhor an insult. I would have asked the woman why she believes that God is so stupid that he would want to see a moron run the country? Wouldn’t the God who chose David over Saul want a wise leader? Or does she think that God is gonna grab her pvssy when she dies and goes to heaven? Oh, yeh, did Jesus ever say, blessed are the pvssy grabbers?
Goku
@Iowa Old Lady: That number will grow in time, when cold hard reality slaps them. Trumpy isn’t smart or competent enough to make the trains run on time. He’s our Berscoloni (sp?)
Ruckus
I get the we have to be better ideal. We do. We fucking are.
But I’m not going to repress my feelings because it might hurt the feelings of some stupid, asshole douchebag who thinks anyone who doesn’t agree with them, that hate people based upon stupid fucking 3rd century bullshit should be shot, or not just allowed to die but wants to make it easy for them to do so.
I learned in therapy long ago that there are reasons to be angry and that repressing that anger hurts only one’s self. The same thing works the other way, being angry all the time for no good, valid reason is also self destructive. Problem is that being angry all the time for no good, valid reason also hurts others.
So as I said above, FUCK THEM AND THEIR FEELINGS. They are trying to kill us and no I’m not being melodramatic. They want anyone who isn’t like them to die. Of course they can’t understand that lots of people of color and the female persuasion, or both have done amazing things to help their health or wealth or provide them jobs. Because they don’t relate humanness to either of those “groups” of people. So FUCK THEM AND THEIR FEELINGS. This ain’t tiddlywinks, this ain’t bean bag, this is real life. Real life and death. So FUCK THEM AND THEIR FEELINGS.
Jim, Foolish Literalist
@schrodingers_cat: I believe Betty has ID’d this one as a long time troll named Steve. I can’t remember if it was “gun rights” Steve, or Steve who ran a really good job-creating small business on his Discover Card that was being crippled by O-Care, or if there is only one Steve
Louise B.
@schrodingers_cat: I think that’s true for city dwellers. I get the sense that WWC small town and rural voters did support Trump to a significant extent, although I have no personal experience with them.
lollipopguild
@Tokyokie: One way to talk to this woman and others like her would be to say that God has chosen trump as God’s instrument to destroy the Republican Party.
Jim Parene
For my entire life, I looked at both sides. I schooled myself on “trickledown economics” during the Regan years. I looked at Clinton’s Welfare “reform”. I watched and studied W’s abominations unfold. I read up on Obamacare and his approach to foreign policy. During this entire time I tried to give the issues a fair reading and approach them as valid policy positions. What did I get for my positions?
I during Regan I was told that I knew nothing about economics. During Clinton I was told that I was a bleeding heart. During W I was villified as being un-patriotic because I opposed to kleptocracy and imperialism. During President Obama’s 8 years, the jingoistic, racist opposition villified me as a one who is naive and who is a terrorist sympathizer .
Now, I am entirely fed up with giving racist, ruinous, traitorous policies the benefit of the doubt. I now call out 45’s supporters, both in online forums and in social situations.
I am done being nice to assholes. Also, the expression of shock on a trump supporter’s face, when a known Liberal fights back with facts and ridicule is priceless. It feels good to give those “simple people, the common clay… you know, Morons” a taste of their own medicine.
Omnes Omnibus
@Jim, Foolish Literalist: It’s gun rights Steve.
PsiFighter37
@ruemara: I’m not really a fan of the layout/design, but when I have stayed in Center City, Le Meridien has been pretty affordable (I think I stayed there for $110/night once). I would recommend staying right near/next to City Hall or just south of it on Broad Street for convenience’s sake.
If you have a specific neighborhood where your work stuff is happening, I can give you more pinpointed advice.
@Barbara: Most people I work with aren’t really necessarily Democratic at heart (and I am well-familiarized with that given I work in finance) – but almost no one I work with directly or touched base with on politics is a Trump supporter. I’m not talking about the assholes who grew up in Long Island and made it big; I’m talking about everyone else who has followed – who didn’t grow up with a silver spoon in their mouth, who didn’t live in LI or Westchester and for whom this was all second nature. For them, the whole idea of a meritocracy infused with diversity is all that they know, and to see someone who was so raw in their overt stupidity was quite offensive.
It is all quite depressing. Sure, the stock market is doing well, but I guarantee you that if tax ‘reform’ is anywhere near the shitshow that Paul Ryan’s barfbag of a death care plan was, the markets are heading down at least 10% from where they are now.
TriassicSands
I agree with your post, Betty. That said, if we subtracted every dumbass who votes for Democratic candidates, we’d never win an election — or precious few. The stupidity and ignorance that afflict the American electorate are not limited to Republicans. One big difference between the two groups of voters is that those who vote Democratic — dumb or not, ignorant or not — still have some basic human decency. they may oppose Obamacare because they think the individual mandate is a bad thing, but they so want people to have health insurance and to be able to be treated when they’re sick or injured. They aren’t intent on inflicting damage on our most vulnerable citizens like the Republicans are.
amk
@Brachiator: And that’s why we don’t give a shit about poor hurt feefees. You probably won’t get that.
PsiFighter37
Oh, and on the topic at hand – fuck this Troubadour WATB. I 100% agree with what MJS said above – he fully deserves the contempt because he is an adult and should have fucking known better.
neldob
Reality based, biting, cruel humor with razor sharp teeth and no collar has kept me moving since November. Thanks to all of you who have helped keep my nose above water.
Ridnik Chrome
@Tom Paine: Give Hillary a break. She was attempting to do something no Democratic politician has done since before the Civil War: being elected to succeed a sitting Democratic president. Nobody has been able to pull that off in over 150 years! Not for a century and a half! American voters, God help them, have this ridiculous notion that after eight years of one party, the other party deserves a turn. It’s just our bad luck that the other party has completely and totally lost the plot, as the saying goes. (And even with all that history in their favor, the Republicans still needed the EC and voter suppression to pull off that “win”.)
The Pale Scot
@Tokyokie:
Cousins (not Kelts. I’m a mongrel) have taken to a Cath offshoot church that has a literal Sola Scriptura doctrine. “What you think Jonah was actually swallowed by a whale?” said another cousin. We don’t talk anymore to these folk. Once you believe that the Book is the literal word of Jah anyone can twist you.
Tilda Swintons Bald Cap
@Tom Paine: Smoking hot take Boris.
Jim, Foolish Literalist
and won’t in any way be influenced by the snark on the 10,001th ranked political blog on the internet.
schrodingers_cat
@Louise B.: I live in a town that’s 80% farmland, Hildebeest got close to 70% T got slightly more than 25% vote. Rest of the idiots were for JS or the libertarian candidate.
ETA: The next town over, where I lived before Nov, is an ex-hippy crunchy haven, there were more BS yard signs than HRC or T. We are less than an hour away from Vt.
Jim, Foolish Literalist
@Tom Paine: veal pen under the bus sheeple monkey dishwasher!
Another Scott
I’ll leave this here…
Janell Ross at WaPo from 2015:
(Emphasis added.)
It’s a tough problem, but working harder on figuring out how to counter visceral reactions and the stirring up the lizard brains of our fellow citizens would seemingly pay big dividends.
Cheers,
Scott.
JMG
If a Trump voter expressed regret in my presence, I would offer sympathy. It’s hard, very hard, for people to admit a mistake and harder still to admit they were fooled.
If a Trump voter expresses pride in their choice in my presence, I wouldn’t even bother to be angry. I’d just laugh and tell them “you’ll be sorry, chump.”
Amaranthine RBG
@Ruckus:
So people who voted for Trump WANT TO SEE YOU DIE? Get a grip.
Your hysterical rantings remind me of the RWNJ’s who say that MUSLIMS WANT TO KILL ALL AMERICANS.
Just unbalanced drivel.
Frankensteinbeck
Implicit in all of these ‘Don’t be mean to Trump voters’ critiques is that Democrats should stop calling out bigotry. Fuck that.
Tilda Swintons Bald Cap
@Amaranthine RBG: You don’t say Ivan.
Ruckus
@Ajabu:
As they should be.
I’m not a minority, at least not in the usual sense, I’m an old white guy who is a liberal. But I do see drumpf supporters. We have at least one at work, who was loud and proud, out of 7. He is far more subdued now but the concept of a baseball bat and gray matter meeting was at least considered on Nov 9. Shames me that we are the same species.
gene108
@ruemara:
Do you need to be in Philadelphia or will you rent a car, and could stay in the suburbs?
TaMara (HFG)
@PaulWartenberg: Bystander…just felt helpless…and grieved like it was one of my own.
Kenneth Kohl
@Blueskies: sounds like you’re describing my brothers-in-law. Family get togethers are so much fun now… ;/
Chyron HR
@Amaranthine RBG:
* Does not apply to the 2,000-year-old man or the people who supported him in the Democratic primary.
Ridnik Chrome
@JMG: This. Both parts.
Amaranthine RBG
@Tilda Swintons Bald Cap:
Do you think the Russian paid me when I was going door to door working for Clinton and Cortez-Masto?
Tilda Swintons Bald Cap
@Amaranthine RBG: I don’t know Sergey, but you are kind of a dick.
schrodingers_cat
@Frankensteinbeck: Exactly, I have noticed that too. RWs are loud and obnoxious about their opinions, when they get no push back they think everyone supports their bigotry. I push back whenever I can, whether it T acolytes here or some crackpot relatives going on and on about their Hindu pride and Modi love.
Major Major Major Major
Of course the trolls are here.
Ruckus
@Betty Cracker:
Friends? Who needs stinking friends?
aimai
@Tom Paine: FOADIAF?
Baud
@Major Major Major Major: But so are you! So it’s all good.
amk
Now let’s all get back to the topic, fuck the trumpanzees.
Adam L Silverman
@amk: By the way, those adds are the result of Congresswoman Pelosi. The DCCC and its leadership reports to her as the Democratic Leader.
Louise B.
@Brachiator: the Trump voters I know do give a shit about our contempt. They have never experienced anything like it and they are very troubled by it. Of course, they were “Hillary is a MONSTER” voters with no particular liking for any part of Trump’s agenda other than lower taxes. But some of them can be turned. I think having conversations out in the open with like-minded Democrats, without trying to shield them from views they don’t agree with, can result in some progress, even if you can’t bring yourself to engage with them.
Omnes Omnibus
@Baud: M^4 really isn’t a troll.
Major Major Major Major
@Baud: yeah but they’ll be sticking around. I have better things to do.
ETA: @Omnes Omnibus: ‘really’?
??
Goku
@Amaranthine RBG: A not insignificant portion of them would love to see liberals either deported or killed. They’ve said so themselves. BTW, continue to be a coward and not respond to me
aimai
@James E Powell: Very true.
Omnes Omnibus
@Major Major Major Major:
Like what?
Baud
@Omnes Omnibus: Not at all. He’s an anti-troll.
@Major Major Major Major: If that’s what you need to tell yourself…
Jeffro
@PsiFighter37:
True! Catherine Rampell had a couple of good columns about how the TrumpCare bill was primarily intended to make it easier to make massive tax cuts for the wealthy down the road…Matt O’Brien follows up in a similar vein in today’s WaPo. It’s all about setting the baseline projections, so that when the time comes for tax cuts, they can say there’s no long-term impact to the deficit.
Now that Obamacare is still in place, big tax cuts for the wealthy will have to have a ‘sunset’ provision to expire after 10 years (just like W’s did), or they’ll have to be much smaller. Frankly, Ds should oppose any big tax cuts for anyone (as letting them ‘sunset’ will just get you painted as a “typical tax-increasing liberal”) but they can turn this around on Rs by proposing targeted tax cuts for middle-class workers, period.
Major Major Major Major
@Omnes Omnibus: I’m in Sonoma with eleven of my closest gays, I’m sure we can come up with something.
amk
speaking of trumpanzees, pizzagate!!!. you can catch the whole lot of them too.
TriassicSands
@schrodingers_cat:
Or maybe s/he is just a dumbass. They exist in both parties.
I was going to point out to Amaranthine RBG that “democrat” is a noun and “democratic” is an adjective. The Republicans, always on the lookout to score cheap points and pervert language to their own purposes, have apparently decided that to use “democratic” is to grant their enemies legitimacy as a democratic entity. Always petty, the Republicans have chosen to torture the language to make a point that isn’t a point.
I don’t know whether Amarantine RBG is a Republican, a sympathizer, or simply someone without rudimentary knowledge of grammar (something that has become the rule in the US in 2017), but using democrat as an adjective is a bad idea. If it doesn’t label her/him as a Republican, it certainly implicates her/him as a dumbass.
Goku
@Major Major Major Major: The best thing to do with trolls is troll them back
PsiFighter37
@JMG: I wouldn’t offer sympathy. I’d tell them they were fucking stupid and to fuck off.
No one who voted for that moronic cheetoface deserves a shred of sympathy. It’s also why I’m not a politician.
Betty Cracker
@donnah: Agreed. Down with tone policing! :)
amk
@Adam L Silverman: Go Nancy Smash.
Baud
@Betty Cracker: That’s a little harsh, Betty.
Major Major Major Major
@Goku: I used to really get into it with one of these ones. Over it.
Omnes Omnibus
That’s where I find myself. I also think that there is more to gain by reaching out to those who are on our side but could not or did not vote.
Omnes Omnibus
@Major Major Major Major: Have fun.
Ruckus
@Amaranthine RBG:
Have you been awake for the last month you fucking moron?
You know if you pull your head out of your ass what comes out of your mouth won’t have to be shit. Given who you are it most likely still will be but at least there would be the chance.
So if no one else will say it FOADIAF.
bemused
I’m still kind of surprised by poll this week showing only 17% of Republican voters approved of GOP/Ryan/Trumpcare bill because it takes them a very long time to start paying attention to real news if ever. They live in a rightwing media wind tunnel and rarely venture out. We know what rightwing media and all other media are reporting. They don’t by their own choice. A few do get out of the tunnel and don’t go back but I think most just venture out on one issue very personal to them and then go right back in. Sometimes I think they act like they are in a cult or that they just don’t want to put any mental effort into figuring things out for themselves, KISS, or they can’t see anything outside their prejudices or all of that. I don’t know if many are even reachable but it could be worth an effort to try to wake up a brain cell here and there. I’m just not going to waste time beating my head against a wall with the hardcore RWHJ.
Redshift
@Iowa Old Lady:
More comforting, there was also a Quinnipiac poll this week that for the first time showed Trump losing significant support of Republicans and white people. If other polls confirm it, this, along with the complete failure of his mythical deal-making skills, could be the beginning of the dam breaking. If he starts to look like a negative instead of a positive for congressional GOPers, risking their necks to provide cover on the Russia allegations may become less appealing.
Bonnie
Democrats/liberals have taken a load stuff from the other side. I cannot believe the horrible things I have been called for being a liberal. I cannot believe the horrible things Hillary has put up with all these years. I put the Trump voters on notice that if they have buyers’ remorse, don’t come to me for sympathy. I have no more patience for them. I do not have to forgive them for this. I won’t. Maybe in a year or two, I will feel different; but, not right now and not next week or next month. They gave us this atrocity and need to accept that it is their fault–not mine. They all swore that they would make Obama’s life a living hell; and, they did. I only plan to give back exactly what was given to me. No more Christian charity from me for morons.
Monala
@Big Ole Hound: in addition to what people have written about how the mandate and penalty aren’t the reasons people voted for Trump, your solution makes no sense. One reason Republicans love tax credits is because they lower taxes for the well-off. Credits reduce the taxes owed. If your income is too low to owe any taxes, or 100% of your taxes are paid by withholdings from your paycheck, credits help you not one bit. An ACA tax credit won’t help those economically anxious WWC voters.
It might help if it were a refundable credit like the Earned Income Credit, refundable meaning it gives you a refund over and above any taxes owed. But good luck getting that passed.
mohagan
Speaking of morons who voted for Trump, my feed this morning has the story of a woman who is married to an illegal Mexican immigrant (been here 20 years, successful restaurant owner who employs 20 citizen people, not even a traffic ticket), who believed T when he said he would only deport “bad hombres” and now is heartbroken her husband is being deported. Surprise! Turns out he meant being an illegal mean you are a bad hombre. Who knew? Her husband tried to warn her …
Goku
@Major Major Major Major: I remember calling NR a sell-out; great fun
PsiFighter37
@Jeffro: There shouldn’t be any more tax cuts, period. Probably worthwhile to have some tweaks in the lower brackets, but the government cannot keep being told to take in less and less money.
Amaranthine RBG
@Goku:
Okay, so you you’ve gone from Trump voters want to kill us …… to ….. a “not insignificant portion” of Trump voters want to see us killed. That is a tiny step towards sanity, I suppose.
I’ll be happy to respond to whatever you ask – go ahead.
Mobile
Ten minutes ago, before I read this thread, I fired my trump supporting realtor. I lack the stomach and stamina to deal with these people. I am too old to pretend civility to folks who would not grant me the same.
Amaranthine RBG
@TriassicSands:
Keeping your eye on teh important stuff, I see. Good for you Timmy, good for you.
Chet Murthy
@Justjames: Sincerely, I say, “you’re a better person than I”. I feel like Betty Cracker uttered what’s been in my heart, in this post. I’m GLAD that there are people who can empathize enough with Regretters to try to reach out to them, convert them, whatever. Really, I am. My sympathy extends only to advocating for the policies that will help them and their descendants, whether they like it, whether they want it, or not.
And yea, somebody votes to destroy my country, I have a *right* to be angry, to hold them in contempt. And if I could, I’d eject them from my country. B/c I know that if the shoe were on the other foot, they’d do the same. How do I know? B/c Bannonazi told me so, ffs.
Turning the other cheek to Nazis only gets you killed (sci-fi story by Turtledove hits it on the mark).
As someone else noted (riffing off BC), I treat them like adults, who knew what they were doing. I accord them moral agency. You don’t get to have moral agency without the ability to commit sins. And when somebody commits a sin, they need to atone. So yeah, I’ll empathize with these cretins. When one of them ges Rev. Barber to send me an email saying that “Tom is a really great guy, a pillar of our movement, and he asked me to write you to tell you so”.
I ain’t holdin’ my breath.
Johnnybuck
@Bonnie:
Throw in Johnson/Stein voters as far as I’m concerned. Proves there’s dumbassery throughout the political spectrum,
Ruckus
@bemused:
Well you of course hit upon it. Selfishness. It is one of the major constants of conservatism. Selfishness. It defines most everything they do or vote for. Even the racism, while about hate, is selfishness. It’s why many conservative voters can say, “I’m not a racist,” technically they may not be, but they are selfish. So I say some are selfish for racist reasons. (Now don’t get me wrong, many of them are out and out fucking bigots.)
different-church-lady
@Amaranthine RBG:
Remind me: who is president right now?
Goku
@Amaranthine RBG: When the ever loving fuck did I say “Okay, so you you’ve gone from Trump voters want to kill us…”. I never said that
Adam L Silverman
@Another Scott: As an Emory alum (who graduated well before Professor Westen joined the faculty), who has significant experience and expertise providing support to Military Support to Information Operations (what the Army now calls PSYOPS and Information Operations), I can tell you flat out that Professor Westen talks a good game, but while he has the education and academic/scholarly experience to do what he does as a scholar, he does not have the practical experience to speak credibly on this subject.
Redshift
@PsiFighter37:
It will be. The last time they tried it, they had a congressperson (Dave Camp) who was actually competent at policy, who worked on it for months and held hearings, and it was never brought to the floor because it couldn’t satisfy their idiotic “majority of the majority” support requirement. I’m pretty sure that was because of the same far-right wingnuts, but I don’t remember for certain.
Amaranthine RBG
@Goku: You’re right. Sorry about that. Some other unhinged whackadoo said that.
Amaranthine RBG
@different-church-lady:
I’m talking about the worker bees.
Chet Murthy
@Teddys Person: This reminds me: how long must we suffer with these stories about “random R legislator who had a come-to-jesus moment about policy Y {usu health-care related, but sometimes LGBT}” where EVERY FRICKEN TIME it’s b/c some family member was adversely affected?
These moral black holes daily show themselves -incapable- of practicing The Golden Rule. Daily. The ONLY time they do a decent thing, is when somebody they care about is affected. And even then, it’s ONLY on the ONE policy that affected that particular person.
It never extends to the next person, who might have a different problem, is affected adversely by some other law. B/c that next person ain’t one of their near-and-dear.
They’re all selfish evil despicable comtemptible moral imbeciles.
The Pale Scot
@Monala: Uh No
Tax deductions are the rich guber’s fodder, tax credits are applicable to those who didn’t make that kind of money
germy
@Goku:
Reminds me of the Joseph Heller “Catch-22” novel. “They’re trying to kill me!” “They’re not trying to kill you… they’re trying to kill everybody!”
Svensker
@PaulWartenberg:
They’re east, north, south and west of here.
The Pale Scot
@The Pale Scot: Sorry, I have no idea how i ficked that up, but what i said is irrelevant
Ruckus
@Goku:
This one can’t even keep his bullshit straight. I’m the one that said that dumpf voters were trying to kill people. Because they are. Even if they don’t know it. And many of them do know it.
I’d bet a lot of drumpf voters are not sorry they voted for him, it’s just that they are seeing that he wants to fuck them over, and kill them as well. The want him to be the kind bigots that they are. To only kill off the ones they don’t like. To lower their taxes. Why now he’s attacking them! That wasn’t supposed to be the way it is. They want peace and freedom (for them!) and are willing to kill off, in one way or another, anyone who doesn’t deserve it. They of course get to decide who deserves it.
Adam L Silverman
@PsiFighter37: Actually there need to be increases. The top income tax rate should go up 2 or 3% and apply after the first $300K of individual or $500K (this can be tweaked up or down a bit) of joint income. The cap on taxes for social security and medicare should be eliminated – full stop. The carried interest rate should either be eliminated completely or increased from 18% to at least 30%. The inheritance taxes caps need to be returned to what they were under President Reagan. I would be okay with lowering the official corporate tax rate if it was done by removing the loopholes that allow the effective rate to be no more than 20%. And finally, any package should strictly eliminate the ability of which companies may incorporate as limited liability and small “s” corporations. The guidelines for those, including the ability of corporate officers to ignore severe criminal activities at the former because they can’t be held liable, impose a cost on the American people that is unacceptable.
Ruckus
@Monala:
I spent enough in copayments last year to take the medical expense tax deduction. I did the math and it was still better for me to take the standard deduction. Tax credits and deductions work like you say, for many/most of us they really don’t help at all, even if we can take them.
Ruckus
@Adam L Silverman:
Every word, spot on.
Chet Murthy
@Woodrow/Asim: One of the great things about being a liberal, is that we can hold two (3!) thoughts in our heads and *still* chew gum, eh? So we can
(a) hold those mouth-breathing imbeciles in contempt for their traitorous racist idiocy
while (b) recognizing that they’re fellow citizens, and as such, deserve decent lives, not b/c they’re decent people, but simply b/c they’re fellow citizens. Just like felons deserve decent lives, not lives full of pain and despair
and (c) recognizing that we need to fund and support outreach to get those voters to change their votes.
I doubt anybody commenting here, any liberal, would object to (heck, they’d donate to) efforts to reach out to Trumpists in Hooter Holler. And sure, we’ll laugh up our sleeves at ’em, but only up our sleeves.
Amaranthine RBG
@Ruckus:
Actually, it’s that I couldn’t keep YOUR bullshit straight.
“I’m the one that said that dumpf voters were trying to kill people. Because they are”
Like I said, your inane rantings are no different than I see on RWNJ sites after a terrorist attack claiming that “Muslims want to kill Americans” or “Muslims hate the west.”
You are as unbalanced as they are. You’re a joke.
different-church-lady
@Amaranthine RBG: Never mind, I think I misinterpreted your initial comment, which means mine wouldn’t make any sense.
Monala
@The Pale Scot: no, back at you. I’m a tax professional. Deductions reduce taxable income. Credits reduce taxes owed. For people at the low and lower middle levels of income, deductions often reduce their taxable income to zero, or close. So when they file, they don’t owe any taxes. It’s only people who still owe taxes after deductions, who tend to be wealthier, who can make use of tax credits.
bemused
@Ruckus:
Selfishness is a lousy way to live too. No matter how much they get their way, they’re not happy in varying degrees. Rotten winners. Whiney. Bitch about everything. Oblivious to other’s misfortunes. And mean. Speaking from my own observations.
Amaranthine RBG
@Adam L Silverman:
Increasing the progressively of the tax rates makes sense, but does increasing the inheritance tax really capture anything? Most people I know with significant assets avoid any inheritance tax through trusts and other estate planning.
different-church-lady
@Amaranthine RBG: It might be too much to say Trump voters want people to die.
It’s probably not too much to say they wouldn’t care if the “right people” wound up dead as a result of Trump being president.
Ceci n est pas mon nym
Since it’s an open thread, I present for your amusement a mutated Nigerian Scam which I just received. Apparently the Nigerian Scam emails and IRS Is Going To Arrest You emails have started breeding in the wild, leading to this:
I’m Special Agent James Britt Johnson from the Federal Bureau of Investigation (FBI) Field Intelligence Groups (FIGs). We have just intercepted and confiscated two trunks at John F Kennedy International Airport in New York, NY 11430 coming from a foreign country.
We crosschecked the content of the boxes and found it contained a total sum of US$10,000,000.00 (Ten Million United States Dollars). Also with one of the trunks were documents with your name as the receiver of the money. As we progressed in our investigations of the Diplomat which accompanied the trunks into the United States we learned that he was to deliver these funds to your residence as payment of an inheritance/winning, which was due to you.
Further checks on the consignment, we found out that the consignment paperwork lacked the PROOF OF OWNERSHIP CERTIFICATE AND LEGAL DELIVERY PERMIT CLEARANCE CERTIFICATE forms. We then confiscated both trunks and released the Diplomat.
The trunks According to section 229 subsection 31 of the International, Commerce Regulators Code Enforcement Guidelines, your consignment lacks PROOF OF OWNERSHIP CERTIFICATE AND LEGAL DELIVERY PERMIT CLEARANCE CERTIFICATE from the joint team of Homeland Security and therefore you must contact us for direction on how to procure the two certificates, so that you can be relieved of the charges of evading tax which is a jail offense under section 12 subsection 441 of the Tax Code. We will also be asking the IRS to launch an investigation of money laundering if you do not follow our instructions.
You are therefore required to contact me within 72 hours on this email at that point I will walk you through the process of clearing and claiming the money.
Failure to comply may lead to your arrest, interrogation and/or you being prosecuted in the Court of Law for tax evasion and or money laundering. You are also advised not to contact any bank in Africa, Europe or banking institution. We sincerely apologized for sending you this sensitive information via e-mail instead of a certified mail, post-mail, phone or face to face conversation, it’s due to the urgency and importance of the security information of our citizens. Today, I issue you this code for communication (G11) which must be contained both in the subject and at the end of any of my email letter to you, This is for your own good.
Once I hear from you, I will instruct further.
Kind of like what we’ve been hearing about coyotes and wolves cross-breeding out there.
I usually pass by these things without reading but something made me read this one prior to zapping it.
Oh, and Special Agent “Britt” Johnson of the FBI has a Japanese return address: [email protected]
Another Scott
@Adam L Silverman: Sorry, I’m having trouble parsing your comment.
I thought it was relatively uncontroversial that (granting that the real world is much more complicated and nuanced than popular descriptions) fear clouds judgement.
I have no doubt that the situation in military conflicts, and “occupations”, and the like can different from people getting anxious about hypothetical threats people see on the news. Part of military training is to get our brains used to things that would make normal people run in terror, and figure out ways to do a job even with our brains lighting up our “Run Away!!” centers like New Year’s Eve. Voters don’t have that training. Maybe we need it! ;-)
My $0.02.
Cheers,
Scott.
Betty Cracker
@different-church-lady: Makes no difference — he doesn’t respond to what’s actually written anyway.
bemused
I would like to have seen anti-AHCA protestors ask their Republican reps why they would lose their healthcare coverage while the reps keep their own.
Sam
It is difficult to deal with the Trumpistas because sooner or later in the conversation they will say something so spectacularly stupid or racist that I just clam up.
The last conversation I had, at work: the dude explained to me that the cities, which went for Clinton everywhere with the exception of Tulsa, were full of takers. I suggested he could, in 5 minutes, download all the data he wanted on how the cities are responsible for the bulk of the GDP of the country. He wanted my theory on how that could be possible. Theory? WTF man, look at the data. I told him I didn’t need any stinking theory, all I needed was a 5 second Internet connection to get some numbers. End of conversation.
Chet Murthy
@Amaranthine RBG:
The one where you think what happened to Matthew Shepard and James Byrd was regrettable at worst.
Get it thru your thick head: we’re not going to kowtow to racists, homophobes, and misogynists. And if you don’t think they’re *that*, you’ve got a hole in your head.
ChrisGrrr
@Chet Murthy: I am reassured. Again. Those three simultaneous thoughts are in my liebral head too.
Van Buren
@Iowa Old Lady: He’s been in office 9 weeks. At this rate, he’ll have zero support in August 2019.
So there is hope.
bemused
@Chet Murthy:
Their thinking process is everything is either up or down, night or day, nothing in between. No nuances allowed. The zero sum game. They believe every dollar they pay in taxes is stolen or given to someone else. They don’t believe in taxes being investment in all we get in return.
The Pale Scot
@Monala: I have been a tax preparer, I am thinking of refundable tax credits, which are the only tax program that is available to the poor
debit
@PaulWartenberg: Thank you for trying to help the poor little thing.
Chet Murthy
@TriassicSands: @Amaranthine RBG: Heh, sure makes it difficult to believe that ARBG is anything but a troll. I mean, gotta believe they’d be schooled by a -real- Dem, that you don’t say “democrat strategy” amongst decent folk.
Debbie1
@Big Ole Hound: So it was the mandate that did it? That sounds a lot like economic insecurity. It’s not like people don’t know how insurance works. It must be paid for.
Chet Murthy
@mohagan:
Whoa …..whoa! I. Did. Not. Know. This. The father of her children, her lifemate, once (and maybe now) the love of her life, asked her not to vote for Dampnut, and she did it anyway? That’s -amazing-. I sure hope he’s a supergenius, so that the kids have a chance of being close to median IQ.
MomSense
I think I fall in a different category. I’m as disgusted as everyone else here by He people who voted for 45 (for varying reasons). I’m not persuaded that even if disillusioned by 45 or the GOP in general that they would ever become DNC voters. I do think that some of the profiles of 45 voters in Republican districts who were upset about the potential loss of ObamaCare helped us stop AHCA. That having been said, I don’t need to read about them here!
Vheidi
@Louise B.: second that, esp. for a weekend stay. We thought it was pretty nice
Debbie1
@Amaranthine RBG: You’re not transparent at all, are you? For your information, the “Democrat strategy” (subtle) was to run NATIONAL election, you know, nationally. Without assistance or hacking from Russia. But if you want to be Putin’s bitch, go ahead.
Ruckus
@Chet Murthy:
A troll. Been around a long time. Has used another name before that stick got old.
I violated one of my principles by engaging. But sometimes you just have to speak out against stupidity. And I got to say FOADIAF. That one never gets old.
Goku
@Amaranthine RBG: Some OTHER unhinged wacko?! Fuck you asshole. You contribute nothing to this place. Go over to AR-15.com where you belong you POS.
ruemara
@Amaranthine RBG: You’re as dumb as goddamned brick and that comes with an apology to bricks. When the voters are not suppressed, we win. Now if a fuckhead like you could turn your ire towards helping suppressed communities vote, then you’d be someone worth calling an ally. Berating Hillary as not being the lovable worthless, ill-clothed moppet pretend socialist with a track record of all talk, no action, that just makes you the mirror image of a dumbass conservative.
Amaranthine RBG
@different-church-lady:
I’m not sure what your point is here. I mean we all want to see the “right people” dead. We just have different ideas of who the right people are.
I was responding to the ludicrous assertion that Trump voters want to kill all of us, presumably meaning anyone who is not a Trump voter.
Amaranthine RBG
@Ruckus:
I’ll just quote your own words back to you, since there is not more succinct rebuttal to the idea that you are a rational, normal person:
So as I said above, FUCK THEM AND THEIR FEELINGS. They are trying to kill us and no I’m not being melodramatic. They want anyone who isn’t like them to die.
Amaranthine RBG
@ruemara:
Hey, you keep up your efforts to un-suppress the few tens of thousands of votes that were actually suppressed.
I’ll keep working to get the ten million people who voted for Obama in 2008 but did not show up to vote for Clinton in 2016 out to vote.
Every little bit helps.
Goku
“I’m not sure what your point is here. I mean we all want to see the “right people” dead. We just have different ideas of who the right people are.”
Speak for yourself dbag. I don’t want to see Trump voters dead. dcl’s point stands. Some extreme Trump voters would literally like to see the queers, negros, and pinko-commies put in their place: a mass grave. This is not controversial. It’s just a question of how many
Adam L Silverman
@Amaranthine RBG: That’s why you adjust the rules to prevent the gifting and the trusts used to shelter. Allow some of it, but cap it.
Debbie1
@Amaranthine RBG: In other words, pay no attention to the redistricting violations which were successfully challenged in court or the voting restrictions. Yeah, we gotcha. Sit down.
Adam L Silverman
@Another Scott: Yes, fear clouds judgement. Until Dr. Westen shows his work – actual empirical research with the data sets and a full description of the methods and operations, then he’s just talking.
TriassicSands
@bemused:
The 17% was for the nation as a whole. Republicans, true to form, supported the bill, but by an underwhelming 41-24. Still, for a bill that was as extraordinarily terrible as the AHCA, 41% is certainly appalling.
Geeno
I have to say, if this thread is a safe place, doesn’t that mean some people aren’t allowed in? i.e. they’re banned?
Mike in NC
@TriassicSands: Everybody we know who voted for Trump was over age 65 and they were conditioned for years to hate the ACA and anybody who benefited from it: IGMFY
Tripod
Monumentally bad day for Trump, and the trolls show up to tell us we must handcuff the party.
LULZ
That’s worked like a charm for UK Labor, and that play has done played out.
The next Democratic POTUS will win some combo of NC GA FL – not because the party has abandoned industrial labor (blah blah blah), but because that is where the voters are.
Ruckus
@Geeno:
John has a pretty tough ban policy. He comes to his liberalism the hard way, through being a republican, where differing opinions are not tolerated very well. So one has to be a pretty big douchebag to other commenters to be banned. It has happened, but it is rare. The safety is in numbers. Now in my case, in this thread as I said above, I violated my own rule, I engaged. That’s on me, not on the troll. Second if you are on a computer rather than a phone there is Cleek’s pie filter, which works great btw. It’s just the last few weeks have been bad for me personally as well as bad for all of us politically. So I’m a bit more willing presently to engage and/or tell a troll to FOADIAF. (I like typing that almost as much as FUCK Fucking Cancer or Fuck LBJ.)
J R in WV
@Goku:
I would have more respect for Scholar Amaranthine RBG if the scholar could spell the hard words, like “the” more often.
I mean, I make typos from time to time, but I try to correct them, and they usually aren’t teh same wrod ovre and ovre (sic)! /snark
Amaranthine RBG is not bright, has only a couple of scripts to follow, poorly, and shouldn’t be getting the top pay rate for trolling. Closer to 3rd Class, really.
J R in WV
@Amaranthine RBG:
Your communication skills exceed your logic, which still allows your logic to be below zero. Dimwit. Republican or Russian is the only question. I think if you were Russian you would use English better. So there it is, Republican troll.
Elizabelle
@ Betty: great blogpost. Look forward to reading the comments later.
Hear it smells like pie in here? Well, well.
Elizabelle
@PaulWartenberg: Rough day. Glad you tried to help, and perhaps for the best that the kitty passed so quickly. Sad experience.
bupalos
As one of the Kumbaya Caucus, I mostly applaud this post. At least it recognizes the anger and venting for what it is: pillow-scream therapy.
I still maintain it tends to be counter productive both for the individual indulging and for the movement generally. But people can go as far as they can go and no further. To me it would seem really hard to honestly want to help those people be better people, overcome their handicaps, and discover their better selves if I was constantly screaming “fuck you go die in a fire” behind their backs. But we’re all different.
PaulW
@schrodingers_cat:
thing is, the SPCA has a policy of privacy for pet adoptions. I could ask, but will likely not get a reply.
I will ask my co-worker who handled the drop-off. she’s something of a volunteer with their TNR program so they might let her know at least if the kittehs were adopted.
PaulW
@schrodingers_cat:
another thing, we can’t do indoor kittens at our library. at least one coworker is allergic and there is another who is deathly afraid (it is a legit phobia).
if anything they would have been made part of the outdoor colony my co-worker maintains, but they were too friendly, too CLEAN to have been outdoor kittehs in the first place, so that wasn’t a good idea.
If I hadn’t two cats already I would have taken them myself. :/
No One You Know
@WereBear: Seconded. Given I’m not signed up to walk then through the obvious cognitive dissonance…because I’m desperately angry over the risk their stupidity causes for me and mine.
No One You Know
@<a @Tokyokie: Sadly, God is well-known for choosing implausible representatives. OTOH, they achieve his purposes, I understand.
God is also renowned for a sense of humor.
No One You Know
@Amaranthine RBG: He’s right. They actually do. And your inability to either notice that possibility, or treat him with civility, says quite a bit about you. ESPECIALLY given the OP declared intention for the post and thread.
Sigh. Where did I put that pie filter?
No One You Know
@Goku:
Cosign. I like pie, and can’t tell if that one’s half-baked or overdone. Seems to be beyond its sell-by date, in any case.
BCHS Class of 1980
@PaulWartenberg: Just curious: are you in Polk? Just guessing from the exclamation point ratio.
BCHS Class of 1980
@Jim, Foolish Literalist: Or Cole’s Steve
BCHS Class of 1980
@Omnes Omnibus: Ah-fucking-men
BCHS Class of 1980
@Chet Murthy: I’m not asking them to be good; hell, I’m not close to that good. I’m certainly with Betty Cracker on this concerning T voters; I don’t think more than 3% to 5% of them are immediately reachable. OTOH, if affecting a near-and-dear is what it takes to bring them over, I’m OK with it. Grab ’em by the balls and their hearts and minds will follow.
BCHS Class of 1980
@Monala: And refundable vs non-refundable credits matter too, correct?
BCHS Class of 1980
@bupalos: Thanks! I had no idea what IAF meant.
Heywood J.
@Brachiator: @Tokyokie: I would have just pointed out to that dingbat that by her own logic, God had appointed her to work at the Golden Corral.
And it is a pure joy watching the entirely predictable spectacle of their Master Dealmaker step on his dick, over and over and over again. Many of my friends voted for Clownstick; occasionally I ask them if they’re tired of all that winning yet. They’re mostly still in “but her emails” mode, but soon as the winning hits them or someone they care about, they’ll change their tune, or at least the key.
TenguPhule
@Amaranthine RBG: We haven’t tried civil war either. Thanks to idiots like you, NOW WE GET TO FIND OUT!
I’m in the “do unto others before they get a chance to do unto you” camp. So forgive me if I don’t give a shit about Trump supporters.
akryan
I’m glad this is a safe space because I want to release my unbridled id. Fuck these guys. Fuck them and their late epiphanies. The guy is upset because he thought Trump would increase funding for opiate addiction? He’s full of shit. Hillary talked about it and actually had a spelled out plan about how to do it. He didn’t even bother to listen to her. He just listened to hate radio and Fox and made his vote because he loved to hate. The woman who’s husband is being deported? Cry me a fucking river. You voted for that to happen to other families with nothing but hate in your heart. Ban the Muslims. Build the wall. Lock her up. Those Trump voters wanted to cause people pain and that’s what drove them. Karma is bitch.
Sondra
Thank you for this. Yes I am mystified that so many ordinary people who are ordinarily misinformed about politics voted for such a doofus right along with other people who do know what is going but exist in an alternate reality than the one we live in. Like you I must continue to operate in a world in which they are very numerous.
They know I’m a Democrat and I know they are Republicans and we all know that it’s best to not discuss politics with each other. For the time being very few of them will confess their mistake like the poor guy with the sign that started this thread, but my hope is that sooner or later they will realize their mistake and a different political discussion will be possible.
It’s hard for me to look at them and not feel disdain so being here is a necessary outlet for my frustration and I appreciate having it.